Nicholas
Nicholas
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- Nicholas
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Killers camp and tunnel even before anything happens, so the excuse that it is a byproduct of gen rushing is hogwash. Tunneling is a core part of the Dead by Daylight Survivor experience. You are periodically guaranteed to get tunneled independent of what you do or what is happening. I've seen it all; The Killer tunnels after a DC and before the completion of a single generator.
@Tsulan said:
Both sides play like this.
You have a gen at 90% and regressing? Watch how survivors always come back to this gen to finish it off.
Of course, someone will finish that generator because the investment can regress to zero. If the generator stayed locked at 90%, people wouldn't rush to finish it. On the other hand, a killer's investment in that Survivor doesn't regress because they don't get hooked again fast enough.
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Nope, but I will access the Chapter via a friend who will buy it and unlock the six teachable perks.
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@NOEDENJOYER said:
How are you supposed to play killer and enjoy it? Every single game you're faced with a healing boon, four DH's and back to back safe pallets on large maps that make downing survivors an actual chore and miserable task.
You managed to injure a survivor, but make the wise choice to leave them because they're at a strong structure, or to defend a specific generator? Well, don't worry, for all your efforts that injured survivor will become healthy in less than 30 seconds, even though it probably took you that exact time to injure them. And the best part is, there's nothing you can do. Want to go break the boon? Enjoy sacrificing precious generator pressure to remove the boon for a mere 30 seconds before it's inevitably replaced and you've gained nothing as a result.
Did you manage to outplay a survivor? Well don't worry, they'll simply press E to the safe pallet and reset the entire chase. Don't forget that on any large map, you'll face survivors who will hold W for a solid minute before you can even think about getting past their DH and the countless safe pallets they have back to back.
Are you struggling to apply pressure because the survivors have an infinite pool of healing via the boon and their second chance perks? Well, suck it up, because that's fair. But don't even think about tunnelling, or camping, because you're scum if you do that.
Playing killer is so fundamentally unfun against these two perks. COH promotes a tunnelling, camping & nasty playstyle since you can no longer use hit & run tactics. DH makes every chase twice as longer as it should do because it practically grants a survivor with a third health state.
I've been a killer main since 2019, and I can firmly say the existence of COH & DH has tanked any enjoyment I have for the killer role. I've been playing survivor and been having a blast at how easy it is, even in solo queue.
Anyone else feel the same way?
Since the beginning, tunneling, camping, and nasty playstyles have been a thing. CoH changed nothing in this regard.
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It isn't very reassuring that Realm is dragging out with no new reveals. We used to get one map per chapter, and now it's a weird schedule that is inconsistent. In Y1, Bvhr introduced four maps, Y2 was three, Y3 had four, Y4 was three (now two bc ST removal), Y5 was down to two maps, and Y6 two maps again. I would LOVE maps for The Blight, The Trickster, and The Twins. When Bvhr cranked out the reworks, Realm Beyond was excellent, but when was the last map? It's taking too long, and some of the reworks are lackluster. I hope they are done and can resume new maps with every chapter in Y7. Total silence on the promised next-gen upgrades like RT and other enhancements. We never got the promised PS4 Pro and Xbox One X enhancements mentioned in 2017, either.
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@Aurelle said:
Decisive Strike has went through many changes and its most recent change is a step in the right direction. But there's a couple things that prevent it from being a true anti-tunnel perk. So what needs changed?
DS deactivates if:
- A survivor fully healed by another survivor.
- A survivor fully heals themselves (Whether it be with Inner Strength/Inner Healing, Second Wind/Renewal, etc.)
- A survivor searches a chest
lol those changes don't make it anymore anti-tunnel than it already is which is nothing. To truly make it anti-tunnel, some pain points should be considered. I'll list two:
- + Survivors can be tunneled two times.
- + Tunneling can exceed 60 seconds.
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@Pulsar said:
I would support this change.
Also, a QoL update to Dead Man's Switch. Have it block the gen only if all Survivors get off of it. Currently, if two people are repairing and one lets go, it's blocked. That's dumb.
Good point. Can you lock a gen with others still on it while using Repressed Alliance?
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They should deprecate them and dismantle them for 2-3x the original value in BPs.
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Iirc SG was nerfed from PTB, where it initially didn't put you into Deep Wound. DW means you need to mend within 20 seconds, or you drop. An example is that MoM provides Endurance, but you don't go into DW after a hit, whereas SG and BT put you in DW after a hit while under Endurance.
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What about limiting image posting to tenured users?
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@Mandy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2787590#Comment_2787590
Less abusable for sure. 33% of the current wiggle progress is a very healthy change - it means that in the most instances, the wiggle when the drop occurs will be a smaller amount. But you still have the other benefits of the perk as well...so definitely not a dead perk.
The benefits aren't worth the slot. There's a reason people didn't complain about the hook aura and struggle effects because both are meh. Maybe 33% of current progress or a minimum percentage if your progress is too low, whichever is greater. Even then, it's still mediocre. The Killer can easily counter by dropping asap, so you get 33% of 1%.
Speaking of hooks, the hook target radius is too large. The Killer can walk up to the side and click hook then it snaps them in position. It should require you to stand in front.
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@Sonzaishinai said:
And her Mori leaves statues of the survivors
That sounds like an excellent power for a new killer; instead of Cages of Atonement, they get turned into stone or glass, and Survivors can free them. However, the mori idea is great!
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It is pretty useless; it should not interrupt you with the perk, then it might be a little more useful. There are often so many hooks that it isn't clear which to sabo. Maybe a perk that temporarily blocks hooks within the radius of a completed gen could be interesting.
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2781554#Comment_2781554
It's always nice when the hijacker returns the car, but good. Let's talk about BO.
Deflect, but that's classic coming from the person with the most OT and lengthy replies in this thread.
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It needs to happen, I would rather have console-only CP.
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2781541#Comment_2781541
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXCPXYfcBzk
I was responding to someone else who brought up hexes, and someone else who brought up boons - in literally the same way I'm responding to you.
Sigh.
I realize that, but that doesn't insulate your post from replies. Going back to BO to avoid a hijack.
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2781519#Comment_2781519
Yes, it is. It's a perfect example of whataboutism.
You are using an irrelevant point as a red herring, to sidetrack the conversation into another concern. This is not a thread about hexes. This is a thread about Boil Over.
We aren't talking about hexes here. Hexes aren't even remotely analogous. I explained why. We are talking about Boil Over being the keys to the Trollmobile.
Slugging was rampant - and people hated it. I personally hate slugging as a killer, unless I'm trying to avoid killing someone.
Why do you want more slugging?
No, it isn't; you're still missing the point. YOU mentioned Boons, so I replied to your post about Boons and how that same complaint applies to Survivors. You're going off-topic and trying to sidetrack the thread. This topic isn't about Boons or Hexes, so focus on Boil Over.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2781058#Comment_2781058
Besides Kindred, Bond is a must for me. I really wish more solo players would use it. I don't see it a lot in end game screen. The amount of Dwights I have on my teams you'd think more people would use it and maybe they would stop running the killer to a gen I'm working on or where I'm trying to heal myself or someone else.
Not crazy about Bond, I wish you could opt-out of allowing randoms to see your Aura when it's clear they are trolls. It's always that Dwight hiding all game and as soon as he's in chase, he's using Bond to shake The Killer off onto someone with two hooks. Or a Claudette with Empathy.
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They already it do anyway. Idk why people are pretending slugging is a new thing due to BO.
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@zarr thanks will check it out.
@PleassBuiltInNoed not true but check out the thread zarr mentions to read up on it.
@Jetgrind I hope we do but maybe not bc people will start dodging high ping killers.
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2781475#Comment_2781475
'Lolwut' because 'did you actually think about this before posting?'. Evidently you didn't, because you don't even know what the issue is.
It's not that it's wrong, it's that there is nothing even slightly correct about it.
But okay.
...Who uses 4 regression perks? That would be silly. Usually, regression these days is either the standard meta (Ruin Undying or Pop) or something a bit more exotic (PR+Agitiation, Deadlock, DMS). Then the killer will generally have BBQ (for BP) and either some sort of info perk (Tink, Discordance) or something aggressive (STBFL, Devour).
If you are facing killers with 4 regression perks, you are facing killers who don't understand the game or are running a meme build.
The reason regression is meta is because it's what is needed to counter what survivors do. That's...what meta is.
I run Agitation on a lot of killers. It doesn't stop Boil Over from being abused on these maps, at all.
Honestly, what are you even talking about?
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2781493#Comment_2781493
No, not it doesn't. None of this applies to hex perks at all - this is, again, a textbook example of whataboutism.
Here's the difference.
- These are perks that have counterplay. The only counterplay to Boil Over on some maps is literally slugging and then camping the slugs to bleed them out. Do you want to encourage this sort of gameplay? Do you think it's engaging or fun for either side?
- Hexes are easily dealt with on most maps without any perks. They have specific spots where they can spawn, and if you've been playing this game for any length of time, you should know roughly where to look.
- At best, hexes allow you to win. They don't allow you to stall a match out for 30 minutes because you thought it would be funny to.
- Devour is so incredibly telegraphed that it's barely used anymore.
- Ruin Undying has been meta for years now. There are at least 5 different ways to counter it, off the top of my head. What is the counter to Boil Over+RPD offering that doesn't involve spending 10 minutes camping slugs?
That's not what whataboutery is. I illustrated that the Survivor also experiences those pain points with an example. I never called you a hypocrite or said you were wrong. You missed that important distinction in your zeal to use the go-to term on these forums.
I also never said anything about Boil Over in the post you quote, so I am confused.
Slugging isn't fun, but it is rampant even before Boil Over, so I see little difference there. Your other points are subjective, yet you present your opinion as to if it were authoritative. The counter to a map offering is to use the Sacrificial Ward or cancel the match. You have to decide what to do.
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Upgrade them to The Triplets by introducing Victoria, the long lost sister. Put Victor on a hook, Victoria in the area of a nice three gen and then Charlotte can patrol.
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2781295#Comment_2781295
Yes, we get it. You don't play killer, so you don't actually know how this works from the killers' perspective.
Think of it this way.
- You are on RPD.
- You hear a boon and see people healing and being cloaked. You know it's a Shadowstep and CoH stack.
- Where is the boon? It could be in the office, it could be in fifteen different places where it'll still cover half the map.
- You guess that it's in the library, because survivors always put it there.
- You go to the library, which is a long route totally out of the way.
- Is it on top, or in one of the shelf locations, or in a corner?
Tell me, how much time have you just wasted?
Multiply it by 4.
If the number isn't below 15, you've just lost the game.
The same applies to hex perks, Ruin and especially Devour can devastate a trial and bring it to a swift conclusion. And then gg if they also have Undying. So survivors too can waste a lot of time looking for hex totems that provide tremendous value and fundamentally change mechanics. I've had it happen to me personally many times, no one can find the totems and the match comes to an end. However, no one wants to talk about those moments, it's always the moments where someone brings a boon totem that the killer can never find and that's supposed to be the end of the world.
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I tried it a few times but it's situational, and for it to be more effective you need to allocate additional perks. Oftentimes there's a hook right around the corner. It's the slow down meta so what have I done? Certainly not complain on the forums about it. I now equip Rookie Spirit, Blast Mine and Repressed Alliance. I've been having so much fun with this build by protecting generators. Do I always escape? No, but it's been fun to counter all the slowdown and regression perks in play. This one particular killer got so afraid of blast mine that he stopped kicking lol As killer I've been having a blast with Mad Grit, Iron Grasp and Agitation.
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I can't blame them, for the last few months it's been nothing but campers and tunnelers! So yes, it makes sense that people are going to respond to this behavior with perks that provide some degree of relief. The last two weeks have been especially weird, with killers frequently camping the first hook before anything is done.
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MoM should remove the condition that you have to be in the injured state, anytime an attack would put you into the dying stage should activate it.
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@Ripley said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2780700#Comment_2780700
I really hope so but I think they said they weren't going to reuse it. Such a waste. It was a fun map.
Oh they did? I had no idea. Did they ever address why they couldn't leave it in custom for people that own the DLC?
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@fulltonon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2780751#Comment_2780751
It's 100% of the time now though, you can see killers swinging and press E for free one more life.
Since dead hard started to work "correctly", it's broken nature showed up.
You don't know what you're talking about, it's not 100% of the time. What you're seeing is latency and the server rejecting the hit. There are many discussions about this, not going to rehash this. Just look it up if you're interested in learning about it.
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@fulltonon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2780743#Comment_2780743
There is a big gap between "almost guaranteed" and "guaranteed", there is a reason why "almost guaranteed" to get a hook when you down survivors.
Okay, I don't see how that changes anything. Nothing is guaranteed in the game until you actually perform it. So yes, you can power up the exit gates and at that point it's likely you will escape and you're close but it's not guaranteed.
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@fulltonon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2780746#Comment_2780746
Are you sure ability to dodge lunge 100% of times is fine perk?
It's like instadowning survivor every 60 seconds.
It's not 100% of the time, it's the server being the authority and making the decision. Other than DH and pallets, everything is still handled on the killers end. This provides an incredible advantage over survivors. So as things begin to shift to server authority, people who are accustomed to getting laggy hits will complain that it's not fair. They need to wean these people off of everything being managed on the killers end.
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I'm surprised they just don't sell lullaby tracks for The Huntress, you can buy the various versions of the lullaby you like and equip them.
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The reason for the surge of complaints is because of validation, Killers don't like validation. They like being able to get laggy hits based on what they see. The killers have a tremendous advantage over survivors every single match in the form of latency. Survivors have to account for their own latency plus that of the killers with no way to see that information. So now that DH validates the hit, it's a big problem for killers that are accustomed to their hits always connecting.
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@fulltonon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2780704#Comment_2780704
every down should be pretty much guaranteed hook because otherwise game just doesn't work, and game doesn't really work with boil over abuse.
If that were the case, a down would just automatically teleport someone to a hook. There is a reason for the gap in steps. Nothing is guaranteed but some steps do increase the likelihood that you'll be successful at a task.
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@SomberNokk said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2780696#Comment_2780696
Neither of it is ok.
The Killer has an intrinsic stagger-free fall; imagine if The Killer staggered from great heights and there was a perk for that! People, are you complaining about a perk that adds a cost to dropping while carrying someone? It's about time there was such a thing.
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The real issue is entitlement. Killer players think a down is a hook, but you still need to hook that downed survivor. Killers are not owed a hook until you hook. Every streamer I see crying seems to think that a down should be a guaranteed hook. You're owed nothing in this game! Also, have to love the emotion about how unfair it is when a Survivor allocates 75-100% of their perks for one moment and gasp when they are in that situation; they excel! Every time a perk is introduced or reworked, the sky is falling, seen this with Ruin, DS, Soul Guard, Power Struggle, Stridor, etc. It's always the dramatic skewed videos showcasing the perfect moment for perks, never the countless times these things don't work.
And killers always slug so stop pretending slugging is new!
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They love recycling content so hopefully, this will relaunch as a "new" map in some future update. It's not like we've been getting much in the way of maps at this point anyway.
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Survivors have had to deal with dropping one step and getting staggered to the advantage of The Killer but that was of course alright.
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I agree with @solidhex the combo is useless, and even with friends, it requires a lot of coordination. Sure it can work but often requires too much effort and involvement at the expense of generators. If it's such a problem for you, bring Iron Grasp, Agitation, or even Mad Grit. Everyone has to adjust to meta and changes; BO is like SG and other new perks that seem strong but are more situational.
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This is the problem with many streamers, skewed videos with perfect conditions to prove how substantial or OP a perk is. I remember all of the cryings about Soul Guard being so broken and unfair and the videos depicting the most optimal conditions that rarely happen. Same with Break Out, 20%? No one will ever get hooked! Allocating all or most of your perks for one situation will naturally make you strong in those moments. Also, you're not denied a hook; nothing is promised or guaranteed in the game until you do it. You get the hook when you get it; a down isn't a hook. Like five gens done isn't an escape, you escape when you run out the doors. The 25% from dropping is how it should be; there should be a cost to fall while carrying someone trying to break free. The Killer already gets "free" unlimited stagger-free drops while typically carrying someone.
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Okay great thanks. I just got a cosmetic and I see there's an in-game tracker which is nice.
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@Exxodus21 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2765526#Comment_2765526
The devs have said the timer slows down specifically to give survivors more time to make interesting plays and escape.
And yes, 99% the gates so you can avoid 100% of the pressure from EGC is circumventing it. The only way for it to be fair is for it to start immediately and apply pressure to both sides equally.
It also gives the killer a lot of opportunities because sometimes survivors misread the timer and end up staying behind to be altruistic and ultimately die. The 100% pressure begins when the collapse starts, survivors can avoid initiating it but then the killer can start it. Your point still fails. If it did immediately start at the conclusion of the 5th generator, it would need to be longer and the killer would lose the ability to view both exit gate control panel auras in perpetuity. However, again, the collapse has a very specific and narrow purpose and it accomplishes that goal. You keep inventing and coming up with different scenarios that have nothing to do with the collapse which begins at the exact time it's supposed to begin, when either side initiates it.
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@Exxodus21 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2764534#Comment_2764534
EGC is far from perfect. It can be completely circumvented by survivors choosing to 99% the exit gates. The only counter is for a killer to do the survivor's job for them and allow them free escapes. Not to mention the killer has to go out of their way to open the gates.
It's also hypocritical to pretend EGC is neutral and say it isn't meant to help the killer get kills when it has built-in mechanics like slowing the timer down when a survivor is downed or hooked to give survivors more time to help others escape.
If BHVR wanted EGC to be truly neutral it would start as soon as the last gen popped and the timer would be constant regardless of survivor health states.
Your premise is wrong because 99ing the exit gate is part of the game, that's not a circumvention mechanic, just like 99ing a Survivor with Stalk or a generator is part of the game. Circumventing means bypassing, not merely avoiding its initiation. The EGC begins when it is supposed to start, not a second sooner. There is no way around the EGC. Nothing you say changes that fact.
Slowing the timer has several purposes; you should look at what the devs have stated about it rather than inventing your understanding and then attempting to imply your view is controlling. Again EGC has one purpose, and it accomplishes the stated goals. It will never be a killer tool, as much as you want it to be.
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@ThiccBudhha said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2764534#Comment_2764534
Perfect is a strong word when hackers literally prevent the game from ending because egc doesn't work.
Hackers circumventing a game mechanic is an issue but not an issue with the design goals and accomplishments of the mechanic. EGC perfectly fulfills the dev's stated goals has nothing to do with hackers.
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The EGC begins when The Killer or any Survivor opens the gate, not a second sooner. The EGC has a particular purpose; it perfectly achieves that goal, thus requiring no change. Some killer players want everything to benefit or become a tool for The Killer; EGC will never be that.
@Emeal tensions are high and the Survivors are pushed up as soon as the EGC begins, not any sooner.
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I'm not crazy about farming too often, but the periodic farm is a welcome change from this game's rampant camping and tunneling.
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I have stopped wasting time capturing clips, uploading them, filling out the report form, and submitting everything. I'm now under the impression that they don't action accounts. In January 2021, I filed a report with evidence, and the mods did nothing to that player. I know bc he was streaming daily from the offending account for weeks.
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@zarr , I was so excited about dedicated servers until it turned out to be a nothing burger. I thought they would continue to iterate on hit validation, but they haven't spoken about it in over a year or longer? The devs seem to be in bed with high latency killer players on this front. I remember how sympathetic they were about killers getting denied hits and how unfair that would feel. Yet no expressed sympathy about the survivor's perspective. It amazes me so many believe the devs favor survivors.
The topics about hit fairness go nowhere because killer players know they have an advantage, and the few who participate leave because they can't address the facts. They've become so delusional that their hits should always prevail. Many have no idea how latency works and are shocked and frustrated to see hits rejected. The devs need to incrementally increase the threshold for SSHV to kick in then switch to fully server authority; this will help wean killer players off of full hit authority.
I agree with your insightful post and hope things change. As a killer, it doesn't make sense to play on a good connection when inducing lag provides such an advantage.
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@SunsetSherbet said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2755468#Comment_2755468
The issue is that you don't need to lower the time to free from a hold in order to make this change to the system. The reason it's being called a buff is because it's faster and can be macroed. You can easily change it so neither of those are true while not sacrificing any of the accesibility.
I don't like the accessibility argument because it's sort of a way to shield the change from criticism, but it's also invalid because the issues people are having a problem with have nothing to do with the accessibility feature of the change. By all means, keep the skill checks for wiggle, I have no issue with them. But there is no reason wiggle should be shortened at all, and there's no reason the skill check great zones should be kept away from the edges, unlike every other great skill check zone. Keep the system, remove the unneeded buffs that are added with the system.
Yeah, that's fine, I just think accessibility options are a great thing because of my experience with my hand injury. I can understand and appreciate the desire to have it. Whether or not the small buff if you hit greats is fair, I have no idea.
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It's a great perk until you run into a very laggy killer that strikes the window you were at two seconds earlier and you go down. I think that's the problem with it. Maybe they need to add validation to Lithe. That's been my experience with it as much as I like it. Fast vault, get the speed boost for about 1.5 seconds and your exhausted The killer swings at the window and you're down lol
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If you know TS, jump into lockers during chase if he's close enough to choke you lol It can make things fun bc it forces The Shape to hook or slug but some will go to a corner and let you wiggle in the hopes they mori before you reach the locker. Had it happen once where he was after me all game and everyone did gens and escaped while I died on hook.
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2753119#Comment_2753119
You give your team mates a free 5th perk of infinite free and super fast heals that undo killers pressure in seconds
That is limited to a specific area and requires Survivors to disengage whatever they are doing to run over there to heal and then return to their original location to finish up. As a Survivor I don't like seeing them because they waste time a lot.