MrMori
MrMori
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@Peanits said:
Mori offerings no longer grant the ability to mori Survivors in the middle of a match, but Perks like Devour Hope or Rancor do still allow you to kill additional Survivors.
You should consider letting the green and iridescent Mori work as usual, but also give you a bonus if you Mori the last survivor. Most players think it's fun and goofy to watch another survivor get mori'd during a match. It makes for funny screenshots and clips, and is overall just a cool and unique thing in the game.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3801154#Comment_3801154
You, too, are completely missing the point.
Killer perks completely countering survivor perks is not a new or controversial thing.
But it is a problem when this killer perk gets reworked to hard-counter a trio of perks that just got buffed in order to bring them up to viability and pickrate.
This does not make sense from a design perspective. Why bring this perk up, only to immediately dunk it down again? And as I've mentioned before, it falls in line with what happened with chest perks: Give survivors perks that encourage them to do chests, and then give killers perks that punish exactly that.
The design of survivor perks is now corralling survivors into getting punished by the associated killer perks.
And it is that trend that is the issue.
If the developers do not want survivors to hide, make it clear and be decisive in the design, instead of leaving the option open but then punishing them for taking it. Because that's just bullying.
I'm not missing the point, I'm simply disagreeing with you. As long as perks are niche, they should feel like they have a strong effect. Perks can't be niche but also easy to counter, then they're useless. And if perks that counter each other are buffed or nerfed in order or close by to each other doesn't matter to me. The only trend I see is terrible perks being given usage, for both sides.
The pickrates for the perks on both sides will eventually stabilize. I could bring a full scream build and someone has Calm Spirit because they dislike going against Doctor. Or as a survivor, I bring a full chest build, but the killer decided to bring Human Greed and messes me up. There is no trend of killer perks punishing survivor perks, that's always been in the game as I already said.
The only issue I see with new Predator is Nurse breaking chase and blinking right on top of survivors. That's going to be painful, but that's a Nurse problem, not a problem with Predator. I actually think Nurse should have aura reading blindness while charging blink so she cant blink directly on top of survivors from a distance with aura reading perks quite as easily, but I digress.
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If the PTB goes through, Corrective Action will soon work on your own skillchecks. That means if you hit a few great skillchecks, you can "store" up to 5 greats for later.
If you bring Stake Out, Hyperfocus and Corrective Action, you can guarantee up to 9 Great skillchecks, realistically even more if you are able to hit a few greats as you go. It'll probably get nerfed, but I for sure wanna test it out.
Even if Corrective Action changes don't go through, if you get really good at Hyperfocus+Stake Out, you can absolutely shred gens, but you gotta not miss. Don't even need a toolbox if you can hit your greats.
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Predator is not going to be a meta perk, and in 95% of your matches you won't meet someone running it unless it's a Wraith going for adept. It's a perk to help newer players not lose chase as often. Killer perks completely countering survivor perks is not a new or controversial thing.
Also, Distortion hard counters Predator. Literally. Take chase, you get your Distortion back. Lose chase, the killer aura reads you, but your Distortion blocks it. What is the problem here exactly? The chances of running into Predator when you bring Deception or Dance With Me are statistically extremely low and to point it out as a serious issue feels disingenous to me. If you want a misdirection build to work, you can choose to bring Distortion now and it'll work perfectly. I wouldn't personally because again, I guarantee you won't run into many serious killers running predator.
If you think the Distortion nerf is unfair, you can say that. I personally think the nerf is very clever, and it won't affect players that take chase often as players that avoid taking chase the entire match. And you'll still be denying the killer lots of info with this new version, even if you can't be hidden from auras the entire match.
Neither the Predator rework nor the Distortion nerf are a problem, but I doubt anything anyone in this entire thread can change your mind on that. I'm curious, have you played killer with mainly aura reading against very good survivors? It doesn't help as much as you think compared to gen regression.
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Wholly agree. The bloodweb animations were created for a time when bloodwebs were much larger and getting to a new bloodweb level was a big deal. Now with P100 being the goal instead of P3, you'll go through about 5000 level up screens on your way there, each taking about 2-3 seconds from when you've bought the last node to when you can buy another node in the next bloodweb.
The improvements haven't really improved how fast it is to spend bloodpoints at all. Sure Auto bloodweb helps a tiny bit, but then you'll be buying the cheapest nodes so it'll take longer to spend it all. And it doesn't help if you're trying to get higher rarity nodes.
Being able to spend X amount of bloodpoints to get a random amount of addons and levels and stuff would be nice. But I think a better option would just be to dramatically speed up the bloodweb animations and cut out the ones that waste the most time. It could be a setting, it doesn't have to be forced upon people if they don't want it.
When I buy the most expensive nodes and auto bloodweb the rest, it takes me nearly 10 minutes to spend 2m BP.
If all that is too much, at the very least make the auto bloodweb a toggle? So it just keeps spending points by itself until you toggle it off. Ideally with the ability to prioritize the stuff we want.
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@upsideinsanity said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3792000#Comment_3792000
I did understand the post.
The title is it "shouldn't not work" which is a double negative therefore you think it should work. Right?
I don't see how him making a syntax error is worth mocking.
As for OP, DS in lockers is annoying but it's a thing you simply have to deal with when playing against better players that are smart enough to bring DS. Eat the DS, leave them, or wait it out, you have to make a choice.
If you've chased them for a long time, it might be worth it to wait the 20 seconds or so they have left, but if they just straight into a locker after being unhooked I don't even hesitate, I just pull them out of locker and don't have to worry about DS on that surv for the rest of the trial.
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And they should also worship the ground I walk on and appease my every whim.
In all seriousness, they don't have to bring Lights Out back again. It was fun for a good 5 matches, but it's not a very good gamemode and I don't think any amount of tweaking can change that.
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SWF would abuse this to votekick the randoms 2 seconds before they escape to troll them.
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She has high killrate because the average survivor has zero idea how to deal with her power, and I don't blame them. But what I've noticed playing her is that while average survivors play against her and lose, good survivors that could probably defeat her immediately give up, thus inflating the killrate.
She is very confusing and unintuitive to understand for beginners and average survivors, and unless you've played as her, you'll miss a ton of important info.
- She has undetectable, old SM didn't. From the survivor perspective she just suddenly has it without rhyme or reason, plus she's completely silent.
- Stealth drones scan people and you have to "know" that they can scan you from the lights, there's no indication that they can. You also just have to "know" that you can stand still or crouch to avoid scanlines. White scanlines help a lot and was a good update, but it's still confusing when the drones start in stealth mode
- There's no indication that SM can track you on her radar, no beeping, no red light, nothing really. Unless you've played her, you may not even realize her radar exists. I purposefully hold my radar up when I find some locked on survivor hiding in a corner, to teach them that I can find them.
- There's no indication that SM has any kind of haste, and it's frustrating to get hit in places where you'd otherwise reach a pallet
I get why they're reworking her, but man they really didn't have to gut the entire power into oblivion. Why not add a custom movement animation when she's walking faster than 115%? Or make it so she only gets haste from survivors within 32m of her? And removing an entire scanline is absolute insanity. Her power will be totally useless.
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I love this game.
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No more oppressive cooldowns to balance perks. Downsides like that is the reason why some perks are never ever used. They're going away from the direction of giving everything terrible downsides. And like a few others mentioned, the perk used to have a 20s cooldown and it felt awful.
Look at the Teamwork perks, 140 second CD made them totally unusable, and those are being removed the next update, good riddance.
Reduce the range a bit on the perk, that would be fair.
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I don't know if them lowering the incentives on the regular game mode is enough to warrant feeling sick to your stomach to the point of throwing up, but I agree that it's frustrating to play without decent incentives in the regular mode. I don't like the Lights Out gamemode much either.
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@Langweilig said:
Why do you act like this is something new?
They do this all the time with perks on a regularly basis. Did you forget MFT, UW, Adre, Ruin, DH, STBFL,….
All those perks got nerfed too harsh and deserved better.
Adren and DH are all perfectly viable after their nerfs, those were warranted. MFT is niche but I don't think it's "bad", just mediocre.
Ultimate Weapon needed a nerf too, but the current version is lackluster. Ruin is still usable. STBFL nerf was stupid and pretty much just made it unusable on a large portion of the roster while solving nothing that made the perk problematic on basic M1 killers.
But the Skull Merchant nerfs aren't just a toning her down a bit, they're effectively going to make her a bottom 3 killer. Against players that know how her power works she might be the worst killer in the game now. Maybe it's for the best, I don't know. I'll still play her after the nerfs. It'll be funny.
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No way, they're still the strongest item in the game, and they're very powerful when using a syringe. A lot of good players will run syringe + some skillcheck bonus addon like surgical suture to get a very strong and fast self heal, plus another syringe heal.
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@LadyOwO said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3798539#Comment_3798539
If you need to exploit a bug to get hits it says alot about your real skill level just saying.
I mean Hens and other very good content creators used the hugtech plenty when it was possible, I don't think using tech/glitch/exploits/bugs means you're a bad player. It just means you take advantage of everything within reason to gain an advantage. Also, I didn't use the hugtech myself. I think it's a good change, the current version is much healthier.
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I think this update is hype and overall pretty good, but the SM changes were insanely heavy handed and totally overkill, and I have no idea what changes they'll be making in the PTB or how she'll turn out after this.
I'm sure the most nasty perks or useless perks among the changed perks will be tweaked as people test them out in the PTB.
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@Grigerbest said:
Just test her out on PTB and make sure to leave a feedback for the developers. This is what PTB for.
This "panic" is unnecessary. Test her out and make sure to communicate.
I think the entire game is doomed, and will never recover from this developer update (not PTB or actual update, just the blogpost)
We'd better start packing up. It was a pretty good run so far.
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@ShadyC said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3796195#Comment_3796195
Very true, although I do use maps :S
Maybe they should just remove a lot of these yellow addons (or fuse them). They're the 2nd lowest rarity, yet they're the most rare in the game other than iri. (And for some items, I have more iri's than yellows.)I made a thread about that a long time ago lmao. Not exactly merging addons, but rather merging maps and keys into one item type, since they are both "aura reveal" kind of info items. Didn't get any traction, but I think it could revive the items somewhat.
@MrMori said:
Right now, Maps and Keys have fallen out of the meta completely. Especially after the hatch changes, Keys are extremely niche, and are pretty much exclusively run to track the killer with the Blood Amber addon, or perhaps if a player has an archive. Maps are also very rarely used, and are mainly used with Detective's Hunch, if at all.
Not only are these items very niche in general, but they both suffer from the same flaw of being almost entirely useless if you do not bring addons with them. Add on top of this the fact that they are also expensive, as they all have "Rare" rarity or higher, and you can see why players don't want to bring these items.
I've attempted to fix that.
Here's a large picture which displays the new, reworked and merged keys and maps. I'll explain the reasoning behind my changes underneath the picture.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/G9IRP4CTOCUC/maps-and-keys.png
Explanation for the changes
The first change you'll see is that there is now a brown and yellow version of the maps/keys, and the highest rarity you'll find are Very Rare, purple. This is because maps and keys are already a niche item. If they remain hard to obtain for newer players, and costly to use due to high rarity, this will make them too unattractive.
I've also changed the maps to track 3 generators by default, instead of 1 random object. This makes them far more attractive to slap on as a cheap item instead of nothing, as you'll at least get some decent info on gen location for free, no matter what map you choose. Maps with Keys can also track players you've met already in the trial within 16m, keeping this functionality from Keys, and without spending a whole addon slot too. Note that the green addon for tracking players within 48m from the start is still there and works the same as before.
Maps of Yellow rarity or higher have a key attached. This lets them open hatch just like before, turning them into a Brown Map if you do open hatch using the item. Obviously this is just a neat little detail, and we could make it so the maps just disappear if you unlock hatch using them. It could be changed so only green and purple maps have keys attached, if too many players start running maps to selfishly aim to get hatch.
As for the addons, I chose to take the most interesting addons from both the item types. I've also condensed all the "Allows you to track X" addons into a single one, the Black Silk Cord.
I personally think these changes would be really great for maps and keys, and would cause them to see far more use than they do now, with the added bonus of not clogging up the bloodweb with 18 different addons spread across 2 item types.
What do you all think? Anything you'd change? Something you miss from the old items? Please let me know.
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
If this goes live I am legit never touching this character ever, which is what Survivors and devs want I quess, so good job guys, you did well!
I'm going to play her after she's gutted. I think it will be funny to see how people react when they realize how weak she is.
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@GroßusSchmiedus said:
Problem is remember how often and for how long they delayed the twins rework only to release one of the biggest abominations that were ever in a PTB? I'm afraid of what will happen to Skull Merchant, and the worst thing is that the content creators and their mindless parrots will try to ruin it even if she would be objectively the most balanced and healthiest killer in the game.
From what I've seen, pretty much all content creators agree that this nerf is way too heavy handed, and the ones that don't like SM admit that the only reason they're fine with these changes is because they dislike the killer, not because the changes are reasonable. I don't think the majority of the community wants her to be totally and utterly useless, people are just fed up with the current version.
If they rework her, they need to do something to freshen people's view on her. New terror radius, new base skin, new trailer, new walk cycle, the more the better. Once they've made an actually decent power to play as and against they need to distance the new version from the old in more ways than just her power. Otherwise, her terrible reputation will remain and people will STILL be inclined to give up against her, even if she was genuinely fun now.
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I really hope they keep Ebony Mori the way it is at least, and just add a bonus for killing the last survivor without removing the ability to kill death hook survivors. It would be boring to lose that aspect of it.
As for the BP, all depends on how much. What if it gives 50000 BP for a mori? Problem is it'll heavily incentivize slugging just like someone mentioned. I don't know about this change. This won't improve the 2v1 experience at all.
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Totally agree. They could have just added the buff and kept the aura reading too. Why bring this perk over Iron Will now? On the topic of bad buffs, I don't like that they reduced the duration on Blood Echo. They even said that the hook requirement was a natural cooldown. Reminds me of when they buffed some aspects of Terrirotial Imperative only to further nerf the cooldown.
Other than that these perk changes are great though.
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Why is it a problem exactly? Old Blood Rush was way too situational to any useful. Now it's a fun and useful anti tunnel perk. Also, I think the description is still pretty fitting, pushing through exhaustion and pain after being unhooked to get away from the killer.
Let's at least see how it plays before we decide that it's bad. I think it'll be a fun perk.
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@Ethromel said:
Not sure why they keep making these bad decisions.
I keep trying to tell BHVR this game was designed incorrectly. Just bad. No amount of cameos can save it. It's destined to fail because of poor execution and the all inclusive approach to updating. I don't get paid to make this game better, and I never get notoriety for some of the ideas they got from me and put a different spin and moniker on it. I too tried to get two of my friends in to the game on the survivor side and within a week both of them stopped and said "It's okay, but nah, it's not for me". The games not even scary and it should be. How in the world do you have some of the most iconic killers in history all clustered under one title and the game is NOT scary? That makes no sense. It's just a cat and mouse fashion show game with little to offer in terms of depth and reward. My devotion is over 10 and I'm still grinding like I just started yesterday without any exclusivities being offered to me for laying so long. Devotion? Right. Now when I play as killer I refuse to chase survivors around a tree or the boring mundane one hundred pallet. It think it's insulting to Myers and Dracula and other legends like them to be caught doing so. I play like a boss and outsmart them when they let their guard down. I try to play killer the way BHVR should have designed the game from the start. Survivors should have had fighting mechanics and the room to implement them in their fight for survival, and killers should be able to use all their abilities under the premise that the fog will not allow any of them to overpower the rules of the realm. The last survivor should AUTOMATCALLY ESCAPE, and daylight should rise clearing the fog. That's how every match should have ended. Lights out should have been a 15 min timed event where while in complete black survivors have to stay alive until the doors release before the killer can kill them all. NO GENS, NO HOOKS, no light, no perks, no add-ons. Just sounds and the moonlight. Such a waste of potential.
Why are you playing this game if you don't like the core gameplay?
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@Nun_So_Vile said:
Simple. AWOOO
Hot take but wolf form losing its hug tech changed nothing about it. The hug tech was a placebo effect, it was never needed for wolf form to perform well. Clever Drac players are unphased by the change and his entire kit feels so much smoother to use after the patch.
Nothing placebo about it. It was a useful tech that could give you hits you otherwise would have no way to get on certain straight tiles. Clear and straightforward.
But it needed to go, just like it needed to go on Blight. Getting hit by it, especially when you don't know about it just feels unfair and is definitely not a very beginner friendly thing. For sure his kit feels better after patch though, I like that they buffed bat form and that they're leaning into him transforming more in and out of his power during chase.
The only thing I wanna see now is remove the movement restrictions on wolf form so you can move backwards at full speed. That would make it really scary at mindgaming loops.
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@zimer said:
skull merchant should just be remade or removed, the killer is ugly (not in the horror sense), animations are a joke, killer power is boring for both survivors and killer
Good news is that she's actually getting another rework, later. They're just temporarily gutting her so people will stop complaining about her until then, which frankly they could have just written in the patch notes.
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If you actually take chase, this change won't affect you much. But I'll admit that BHVR have added an absolute ton of aura reading to the game, and there are plenty of top tier aura reading perks. Still a good change imo.
Off the Record gives aura reading immunity too, you know? But that aura reading immunity requires actually interacting with the killer to activate. Now Distortion will too, which is good.
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@Massquwatt said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3797596#Comment_3797596
I feel like they're gonna HAVE TO rework her completely now which I feel like is a waste of time and resources? She's pretty okay in her current state but now they gotta rework her again when there's other killers more deserving of it like Freddy.
If they do choose to rework her entire power, they should change the way her base skin looks to or something drastic like that. New little teaser video, new music. I don't know. They would absolutely have to differentiate this new theoretical version from the old one. The current one just carries too much of a bad reputation.
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@Massquwatt said:
The removal of one scan line? Wouldn't that make it twice as hard for a drone to scan a survivor during chase? I thought that was the whole point of reworking them into that way. That's pretty excessive and I feel like sets a pretty bad prescedent that they can just completely ######### on a killer and leave them like that for a future rework.
Yes. And also, no more stealth drones. 90% of what made her strong was beginners that don't understand stealth drones giving her free scans. She's done for if this goes through. People can celebrate all they want, I don't think it's a good thing to make a character completely unviable and the least popular killer in the game. If they don't have any bigger changes in mind, literally all they needed to do was this:
- Drones are now always active
- 5% Hindered instead of 10% Hindered
- Only survivors within 32m of Skull Merchant grant her bonus movespeed
There you go, no longer scans noobs, no longer hinders pros so she can brain off win loops, and survivors no longer get punished by their teammates being locked on. That's all they needed to do. Not THIS.
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@Royval said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3796919#Comment_3796919
it feels terrible feels like a waste of time.
Can confirm, what a shame. Survivor has zero incentive to carry the item, just drop it immediately or they get spotted by the killer from miles away. And once they drop it you can lose the killer in an instant. Plus the hiding. Not really that much better than the original it seems. Oh well.
Chaos Shuffle is coming back at least. Hope they randomize items and addons this time too, no map offerings.
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Before 8.2.0, Licker Tongue used to be 0.25s of 20% hindered, which was added on top of the basekit 0.25s of 20% hindered. So it basically did nothing.
Now it's 1s extra 20% hindered added to the basekit 2s of 20% hindered. Which is pretty significant. If it was kept at 3s it would be horribly overpowered, and also bad design because it would more than double the basekit slow duration, which would make the hindered impossible to balance.
It's one of his best addons now, it's strong, and it is much stronger than 8.2.0-8.2.1 because the hindered was bugged those patches.
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The solution? Play killer.
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3796800#Comment_3796800
iridescent head hatches pls.
They should remove the cap on Iri Hatchets so she can have 7 instadown hatchets.
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I'll play and see for myself how it feels.
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They should remove the penalty for walking backwards in wolf form, so wolf form would be better at mindgaming loops.
The hugtech had to go though. It's not fair to only remove it on some killers and keep it on others.
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Wholeheartedly agree. I bought all the characters for 9000 shards except for a few ones that I snagged when they had special iri price sales, which were rare and far and few inbetween before the regular iri sales we see on characters during anniversary and halloween. And yet, I don't need any compensation. I'm just happy that the grind is being lowered, it makes sense when there's so much content in the game already.
These iri shard price reductions are great for new players, and a very welcome addition. I remember the biggest frustration I had with DBD when I started was how long it took to grind for a new character.
Keep it up!
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@Hex_Ignored said:
Ideally, lobbies would provide no info at all. Survivors would just be shown as black silhouettes named "player 1/2/3/4" and that'd be it.
But at that point, what exactly is the point of the lobby, at least for killer? Then we may as well just go straight into the game after matching 5 players together.
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Yeah, I agree.
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Part of the problem here is that Maps and Keys are generally except for a couple niches, and the items pollute the item and addon pool with useless items.
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I'd be okay with that. At least from a killer perspective, pregame lobby is useless to me because I just ready up no matter what and tab back in when the match starts. This would speed things up so much when trying to get into a match.
It would be a little sad from the survivor perspective though, no more silly pregame chats or talking about names, no more swapping to the same character with randoms.
At the same time, it would be a killer nerf too because the killer now won't know exactly who has what items.
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It's not about realism, it's about balance.
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Bring Corrupt Intervention, it is very good.
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@GonnaBlameTheMovies said:
It's never used except to group people, and its counterpart is contradictory on Killer Side. Flip what the two do. Or better yet just remove the shroud offerings from the Game, they're not useful.
I'd rather have them removed than flipped. If they were flipped you'd just see one map offering one shroud every match as killer and that would be terrible.
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That's a soloQ issue, once again. If you could show your perks to your teammates, you could show deliverance and maybe at least one player would stay so you could self unhook. But you can't, so you get shafted. It's a shame.
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@drsoontm said:
For this to happen, survivors have to massively throw (or royally f-up) or to be outmatched by the killer.
Maybe the game should end with four slugs with no hope of recovery but that's not supposed to happen often. (Although some survivor play style may encourage it.)
Any match that ended in a 4k, the killer can easily bleed the last survivor out if they want to with no way for the survivor to give up or make it stop. They just have to lie there for 4 minutes and wait. DBD really doesn't respect the players time. Bleedouts when the match is already decided is bad game design.
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This is gamebreaking. Pig needs to be killswitched until this is fixed.
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I think he'll be getting part of Blurry Photo basekit, and that's it. He's pretty decent as is and well liked on both sides, he's probably not getting too many changes.
12.5s weakened duration with 4s cooldown would be extremely oppressive, I don't like that idea. I do agree that the "counterplay" of running right into Unknowns face to dodge UVX because he can't aim down is dumb and being able to look straight down would be a very nice change.
But we'll see what they change in a little over a week.
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Pain Res doesn't need a buff, also this would make it even stronger when tunneling someone out. This would not be a healthy change.
And yes, people will dislike a net buff to the perk because even despite the downside of potentially hitting a gen that's low % with your pain res, it still provides really consistent value. Also, even right now it won't consume a stack if there aren't any gens to break now, so you already have some insurance against wasted pain res stacks.
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@CrypticGirl said:
The window already flashes orange when loading into a lobby or loading into a match. And do you have audio enabled, or does it mute when you tab out? The latter you can set by going into the Audio settings in the options and set "Mute Focus" to off.
I figured it was something like that. Mute focus is comfy, so I keep it on. I'll test this. Would be nice to have this with mute focus on as well though.