Hex_Llama
Hex_Llama
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- Hex_Llama
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I confess that I just about never get any use out of this information, but I don't see a reason not to have it?
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I don't think it's a stupid idea. Personally, I would really like to not have Deathslinger in my game, and it would likely cut down on DCs as you say.
The problem I see is that people playing killer also have the right to expect that they're going to get the play the character they bought. If you allow people to opt out of playing with them, their queue time and potentially their matchmaking gets worse because of someone else's choice -- not theirs.
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@pseudechis said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1671104#Comment_1671104
I get the point you are making its a game its meant to be fun. But there is no agreement between parties that the game is friendly. Unless you are playing with you friends in a KYF custom then sadly you are playing with random people on the internet. Some of these people will be the kind of folk no-one would play with at anytime, we all know at least one person you don't want at game night. Those people are in abundance online. That said...
Some people might play to win, some might play to muck about, some might not care, some might care more than others. Any real pre-game agreement between parties is imagined. You place importance on everyone having a good time, that's great but its a competitive game some people play to win it.
Yes there are behaviours that are more obnoxious than others, but if the play is within the confines of the game rules (without abusing flawed mechanics) then its fair game.
The takeaway point here is that you can play the game anyway you like within the confines of the rules and you should expect people to play the game any way they like, because it's highly unlikely that everyone will play the game in the same manner that you choose to.
Getting upset at the game and crying toxic because of slugging is just silly, same as if you got flashlight blinded multiple times, or tunneled, or camped, or seriously looped, or 'Gen rushed', or body blocked on your way to the hook, or keyed out or 1 hook mori'd. All these things are in the game and you should expect them to happen.
I'm not saying people should do them but neither am I telling people that they shouldn't, I play in a way that I enjoy and hopefully isn't too obnoxious for the other players, but I'm not overly concerned about whether or not they find it "fun" because their definition of fun may be completely different from mine.
The main goal is if you understand how this game can be played and have realistic expectation of what can and might happen, then often you are more pleasantly surprised than annoyed at how things play out, at least I generally am.
Hence my statement that you are not responsible for anyone's fun and neither are they responsible for yours.
I agree with you that it's much harder to eject people from online communities, and that those practical difficulties enable toxic behaviour. But I don't think the answer is that we all have to resign ourselves to expecting the worst of people every time we load into a match. I also think that, in almost every situation, the list of behaviours that are socially appropriate to do is necessarily shorter than the list of behaviours that technically no one can stop you from doing.
I agree that reasonable people can have different ideas of what's socially appropriate and what's not. But I don't agree that, because there's no objective standard of how people should behave, that means no one's actions should ever be criticized. In order for DBD to even load, four strangers have to agree to play a video game with you -- how fun and cool and generous of them! Having no regard for their feelings at all seems callous to me.
@TheClownIsKing said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1671346#Comment_1671346
A strong team might not give a killer a choice.
Theoretical scenario: killer only manages their very first down after 3 gens have already been repaired, and is really feeling the pressure. They notice new scratchmarks and immediately investigate. It’s someone hoping to flashlight save. Killer downs them. Returns to first slug but catches someone else trying to revive them. Killer reaches them before the dying survivor can get on their feet, chases the survivor attempting to heal, downs them. Killer again tries to return to the first downed survivor but then notices the fourth survivor doing a desperate run to the survivor downed with the flashlight. Again killer chases to intervene, because the last thing the killer wants is the flashlight holder revived with other slugs to hook. Killer managed to successfully down 4th survivor before they’ve managed to help anyone up.
Sometimes the killer is not being in anyway toxic. Sometimes the game plays out in such a way where new chase opportunities present themselves in quick succession to a killer sensibly paying attention to environmental queues. Opportunities that would be foolish to ignore.
I agree. I think there are very few actions in DBD that are always toxic. In almost every case, it depends on the overall context of the match. That's part of the reason that BHVR can't ever apply a patch that's going to stop toxic behaviour -- the toxicity comes from the social element, and not the raw game mechanics. It's totally possible to slug in a way that's legitimate within the context of the match and not at all rude. It's also totally possible to do it in a hostile, anti-social way. And there's no piece of software I'm aware of that would be able to detect the difference.
@NekoGamerX said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1671104#Comment_1671104
being a 4v1 game it never friendly game survivor go out of they way bully the killer.
so yea no one agree to play a friendly game together(maybe the 4 survivors who are swf) make sure they have fun but most survivor don't care if the killer has fun,so why should the killer care if the survivors have fun?
I care whether the people I play with have fun, no matter which side I'm playing. It hurts my feelings sometimes when it becomes clear that that care isn't returned, but I don't think the answer is that we should all act like psychopaths just because some people do. Every match we play is an interaction with new individuals, and I don't think it's right to punish the entire group because some of its members behaved poorly. If you see someone you recognize, and that person was mean to you, I'm not going to cry any tears over you being mean to them, too, but I don't think the general policy should be to assume that everyone's going to be mean.
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Could be some combination of aim dressing, lag, and the weird blind spots where killers lose sight of survivors who get super close to them.
Usually aim dressing is responsible for the thing where you chase around an object and you have a clear shot at the survivor but then your camera turns and you hit a barrel or something instead.
Lag speaks for itself, but there's a particular issue with Dead Hard where it looks like the survivor stops and you're right on top of them, but then they suddenly surge forward.
Survivors who are good at doing 360s don't obviously look like they're turning 360 degrees from the killer POV. They look like they suddenly break left or right and then disappear, before you find them running in some random direction. If that's what you're seeing (and I can't tell for sure if it is), the best tip is to tap your attack instead of lunging, and try to wait for a moment when you have a super clean shot. Sometimes, you can also get them during a 360 if you whip your camera to the side and spin as you lunge.
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@pseudechis said:
Not toxic at all, it's just another way to play the game. Remember you are not responsible for anyone's fun and neither are they responsible for yours.
This does not mean you go out of your way to grief and abuse but slugging is part of the game, I've layed there for 3 mins and bled out too and its nothing to get worked up about, if people get upset at you for doing it that's a them problem not a you problem.
I disagree. I think that, when five people agree to play a friendly game together -- meaning, a game that's not a professional sport or an organized competition -- the most important thing is that they all have a good time. So, if you play in a way that makes it miserable for everyone else because you're more concerned with winning than with the social interaction you're having with the other players, I think you've missed the point.
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@UMCorian said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1670132#Comment_1670132
From the Survivor perspective, I don't really see how this makes the game less fun - it just changes it. If someone wants to slug, they are trading a ton of BPs and making it effectively easier to pick people back up in hopes that they can just get 4 down at once.
If they down someone and camp, you just do gens.
If they down someone and roam, you just pick them up really easily... and they have no consequence.
I've honestly only remember losing to one fanatic slugger before (I don't run into them often), but the game took about as long as a late game win or loss would, and I got a ton of BP. I don't really see the problem.
I think it depends on how it goes. I've had some matches against low mobility killers who wanted to slug, and it went the way you're describing. We just kept picking up the slugs, and it was kind of tedious, especially if the killer had Knockout, but the game was basically normal outside of that.
But I also had a game against a Hillbilly on an open map, and he just zipped around and downed three people in the first 30 seconds. After that, it was a stupid, boring, protracted sequence where the fourth person would try to pick someone up, and then the chainsaw would come back and one of them would go down. Then the person who was still up would hide for a long time, then try to pick someone up, and the chainsaw would come back and one of them would go down. Just, over and over, until he had all four.
So, most of the game was not getting to do anything and just waiting to bleed out while somebody else played hide and seek, and it really wasn't fun.
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As killer, my feeling was always, "If you manage to unhook yourself and escape, good for you." I never stuck around to guard the hook when there was one person left -- and now, I'm not even sure if the game lets the last person try to unhook, if everyone else is gone?
I've only seen people self-unhook pretty rarely.
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@Mr_Madness said:
I usually just sit by gates so I can give a Killer one more hit for extra BP if they were not Toxic [aka head banging, camping, hitting hooked people.]
Would be funny if there was a hidden patch so that if you kept trying to T bag aka crouch non stop then Crouching would be disabled, That would be so funny as heck.
Or your lower body turns invisible. Teabag too much and your butt falls off.
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It's very disquieting to turn around and see someone in a mask staring at you, so either one.
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I think that, if you won, and it was a normal game, then it's actually more polite to say GG first. It's interesting to see that other people feel differently.
On the other hand, I think some people try to retroactively make whatever toxic, anti-social thing they just did okay by saying GG at the end, and they count on social pressure to make the other person go along with it. You don't want to look like a bad sport, so you have to forgive everything that happened, no matter how messed up it was. I think there are some cases where, if you have self-respect, you really shouldn't shake hands with someone, or say GG back. But them saying GG to you is not the main problem in that scenario, IMO.
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I like this Wizard of Oz idea.
I could also go for a cool, punky post-apocalyptic collection.
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I wish Deathslinger wasn't in the game, for the purely selfish reason that shooting games make me anxious (not in a fun way).
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I agree. I think it's very fair of the devs to make it so you don't have to buy the pass until you know for sure whether you got to level 70, and so that you get your money back as store credit once you do reach level 70. Theoretically, you could drop $10 in the system and just keep feeding it through completed rifts forever.
(Of course, the business model is that not everyone does that -- either because they pay to finish the rift, or they buy a pass without finishing the rift, or, like me, they're super patient and frugal and then immediately say, "I have a $10 credit; what else can I buy???")
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I think it's super hostile to hit people while they're hooked. I wouldn't perceive it as someone joking around -- I'd think they had serious anger issues.
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There's an option on the end screen to report people for unsportsmanlike behaviour or whatever, but I have no info on what happens with those reports. My hope is that someone is collecting statistics to see how prevalent it is so, in that case, it's worth reporting -- but the report button could also do literally nothing. I don't know.
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If we're sincerely talking about "boring," as opposed to "hurtful" or "frustrating," I think it's the survivors who have the map memorized and run from pallet to pallet, camping each one, then throwing it, then running to the next one without trying to play around the pallet at all. If you get a whole team that plays that way, the chases are no fun.
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Games that feel evenly matched, where the other side makes roughly the same number of mistakes that I do, and there's lots of back and forth and opportunities for reversals and exciting plays. The kind of thing where, if you looked at a recording of it, you'd see that I played horribly at some points and really well at others, and the opponent(s) did, too.
Also, if I managed to do whatever challenge I'm trying to do at the same time, that's the cherry on top.
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Survivors who give up and stop playing as soon as they know we won't win, whether they DC or just hang around in the game not doing anything. If the other side's going to win, at least make them work for it, guys.
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This happened to me at rank 15, too -- I suddenly got fed to SWF groups who were 5+ ranks higher than me. I really wish I could tell you that there's something you can do to defend against that, but I think the truth is that the gap created by the matchmaking is too big to overcome when you're at an intermediate level.
The coping strategy that worked for me -- to deal with getting destroyed over and over again, not to avoid getting destroyed, which I'm not sure you can -- was changing my attitude from "I want to try to win" to "at least make them work for it." Which involved gravitating toward killers who have annoying abilities, like Doctor, or abilities that create an extra task for the survivors to do, like Pig. And also just being contrary and not doing what they wanted me to do, like chase that one Nea with Object.
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I moderately dislike them both, but I think the saloon can be a little more fun, depending how the match goes.
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I think a lot of these are really matchmaking/ranking issues, and I agree that SWF benefits the most from the current system, though I think solo queue and killers un-benefit about equally. I really hope we get a system that's able to differentiate skill level better and make closer matches for all five players.
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I agree -- voice comms are the thing that makes the game unbalanced. Having people silently play with their friends wouldn't be a big problem.
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I agree with @Lycidas that swapping it with Deja Vu would make it more accessible, and that would maybe improve it. Otherwise, I think it's really good the way it is. I run it whenever I don't feel like walking in a circle trying to find a gen, especially on indoor maps, and I like it for that purpose.
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I think it would be cool to have a killer whose power was sabotaging objects survivors interact with. In a context like that, where it's one killer's ability, I'd be cool with having something wild and chaotic happen when you open the gate.
In general, I don't really have a problem with 99ing the gates. On the killer side, you can open the gate yourself if you really want it to be open and, on the survivor side, it's debatable whether having it at 99 is better or worse than just opening it.
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I play solo queue, and I'd say there are so many maps with obvious totem spawns that it's rare for us to get through a whole game without finding Undying. In the rare event the killer gets good RNG and gets to keep their totems the whole match, they deserve it, IMO.
That's how a luck-based component of the game is supposed to work -- sometimes it breaks my way, sometimes it breaks the other side's way.
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I take a super long time to kill people when I play killer, so keys have never been a big issue for me. People are not dead soon enough for it to matter most of the time.
On the survivor side, I get annoyed when teammates ditch me through the hatch, but I understand that it's a game mechanic they're allowed ot use. I have, however, come around to the idea that keys should only work for the person holding them. I think that would be more fair.
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Yeah. When Ghostface is described, I imagine him sneaking around the map, spying on people from behind an object, nobody knows where he is, so creepy, so mysterious. But, when I play against Ghostface, it's usually more like a super fast staring contest that happens right out in the open, while he's five feet away from me, and I lose because I don't know where the center of my screen is.
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I'm not sure whether there's truly something you can do in this game that helps your team but doesn't help you, because, most of the time, your chance of completing objectives and escaping goes up when you keep the rest of your team alive and healthy. The only thing I can think of is if you did a built that actively hurt you but still had modest benefit for someone else. So, like...
No Mither + Resilience + Babysitter + Mettle of Man and then, like, take protection hits and die.
But, even then, does it actually help your team for you to die, or are they one person short on objectives?
I think helping your team and helping yourself necessarily go together.
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I also love this perk. It's nice to have a healing boost that gets stronger the worse you're doing, and the unhook boost has helped me pull off really fun, exciting saves.
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I honestly had no problem with the way the game looked before, and I don't really care about changing the look, now. The only thing I'm worried about is the darkening of all the maps. I get that, from a design POV, the lighting is more dramatic/dynamic/realistic or whatever, but I would just rather be able to see where I'm going.
It also makes the design look kind of low budget, IMO. It's a well-known trick that, if you don't have money for your game, you make everything super dark to cover up where you're cutting corners. That's not what's happening here, but the visual effect is the same.
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I'm mostly okay with the rift. I went into it with a realistic idea of how a battlepass is used to make money, and I made a rule that I'd wait and see how far I got before I committed to buying anything, to see if I thought it was worth $10.
The one thing I wish is that the back catalogue of rift cosmetics would show up in the store -- especially the community skins from last year, which it seems kind of sad to hold back. I'm hoping that, now that it's been about a year since the first rift, we'll start to see stuff pop up.
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At this point, I have so much anticipation for everything I want to happen in this game for Halloween that there's no possible way reality can please me.
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@ChiSoxFan11 said:
Tonight, my friend and I played against a Spirit who refused to hook anyone until the very end of the match. Whenever they downed someone, they'd leave them slugged. No matter what the circumstance was, they refused to pick anyone up. We kept picking each other up and doing gens, but eventually the Feng and the Claudette both bled out from being on the ground so many times. I ended up going down, and the Spirit carried me to the hatch and dropped me on it. They found my friend, chased him down, and then finally hooked them just as I bled out on top of the hatch. One hook the entire game for this Spirit. One of the worst, if not the worst, experiences I've had in the game.
I'm sorry that happened to you. This is interesting to me, though, because I played a weird match a few days ago where a Blight kept slugging everyone exactly as you say, and then DCed when we got the last gen done. I was so confused about what he was trying to do, but maybe he was doing this thing where people die by bleeding out over multiple downs.
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The case I'd make for Descend Beyond is that both the killer and survivor have some good perks that can easily become part of your regular rotation and I have a feeling they'll pop into a rift at some point, whereas Jane has already had a turn, IIRC, and it remains to be seen if licensed characters get included.
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I said Mediocre, but rather than thinking 2/3 are good, I think all three of them are okay, but not super strong. Deliverance is situational, the pebble is useful depending on your play style, and Autodidact is a totally decent healing perk if you have the chance to get your stacks. They're not in my first string of choices, but they're not terrible, either.
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I also like solo queue (and hate playing any game on comms). I think it's kind of fun that everyone drops in with their own agenda and build and then you all just try to make it work.
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It doesn't hurt my feelings, but it can be frustrating. All I ever want when I load into a match is to play a normal game with four other people, and DCs, especially early ones, prevent that from happening.
If I'm playing killer, it's annoying because it can block me from doing my challenges, and, in the early game, it creates an awkward social situation where I'm like, "Well, your teammate just abandoned you, so..." I agree that getting a 3K when the fourth person disconnected right away doesn't feel like winning.
When I play survivor, early game survivor DCs are annoying because it means the rest of us are either going to die, or we're going to become the prisoners of a well-meaning killer who tries to farm with us. I've rarely had a killer DC in a game, but it's usually less annoying to me when that happens, because I have a good cushion of points, and get to keep my item and stuff.
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I hadn't thought about this before, but I think it might be cool if the add-on made it so your hatchets worked normally close up, but, if you nail a shot from far away, it's a one-shot down.
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I find the killer emblem/ranking system much less forgiving than the survivor system. It more or less demands that you play perfectly as you rank up -- "perfectly" meaning it's a total shutout where you dominate the match and the other team can't do any of their objectives. I think @Clevite is right that it encourages killers to try to stomp everyone, and I'd love to see a reworked system where the "balanced" outcome of getting two kills isn't treated as a failure.
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@OogieBoogie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1651520#Comment_1651520
If you need some tedious grind to keep you playing the game, you probably don't actually enjoy the game very much. The rift and shard cosmetics exist now if you really need something to work towards.
Seeing as the next update is assigning each perk tier its own rarity, I doubt they're getting rid of perk tiers any time soon. It'd be nice if they'd at least give every character tier 1 of all perks they have unlocked (universal perks and any teachables that have been unlocked). That way you'd at least have all perks available to try out, even if it's their weakest version.
I think this is a really good idea. The main frustration for me is that, when I have an idea for a build I want to try, I usually end up realizing that I don't have any single character who has all the perks available, and then I start to grind for it, but the perks don't come up in the blood web, and I lose interest and forget what I was doing.
A secondary frustration is that I grind for level 40 on some character so I can get the teachables, and then instead of feeling happy when I get them, it's like, "Now, an indeterminate, unknown amount of grind before they show up for anyone else."
This suggestion would solve both problems while still giving people a reason to earn blood points and level the perks up.
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Mad Hatter / Alice chapter. Gives them a chance to do more with madness; his mori is he scalds you with his tea.
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As killer, I don't like them, because it's just another task I have to do when I'm already pressed for time. I much prefer the map re-works where they just added extra holes in the wall to take away strong loops.
As survivor, I find that it creates annoying situations where I run into a bunch of dead ends, and I basically just get killed because I didn't know where the doors were. I kind of don't think there should be dead ends besides basement, and breakable walls create lots of them.
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I would say Quentin. I think the usefulness of some of these perks depends on your play style, but I can't think of a situation where I would burn a perk slot on guaranteeing myself a med kit, or opening the doors faster. Vigil can be useful, but not useful enough for me, personally.
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Crossplay greatly improved my queue times in both roles, especially when I want to play at off-peak hours.
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It depends. I guess my order of priority is:
- do my daily or my rift challenge, or set myself up to do it
- interact with whatever happened to spawn right in front of me (totem, chest, gen, other players, etc)
- look for a gen where it doesn't seem like I'll get murdered right away
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Killing yourself on hook is less anti-social than disconnecting, but it still leaves your team one player down. FWIW, I've had some games that seemed like total garbage, where I got hooked twice right away, or went into struggle on my first hook because everyone took too long to save me, but then they turned around and I was able to play and have fun before the match was over. It doesn't always happen, but it's possible.
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I think it would be really cool if the survivors each had a unique skill that only belonged to them, the same way killers have a unique power. At this stage, though, I feel like it's probably too late to lock perks to specific characters. Especially since, if you didn't own the character the perk is locked to, it would mean you'd never get to play with that perk again.
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Yeah, I feel like people have been disconnecting a lot the past few months. I feel like 1/5 of my survivor games and 1/4 of my killer games have somebody d/c. Today I played a killer game where two survivors disconnected when they went on death hook, which is just -- I guess -- an attempt to deprive me of getting my points or my rift challenge?
It was confusing, because it felt like a pretty well-balanced match where they were making steady progress on the gens and I was making steady progress hooking people.
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@noctis129 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1649036#Comment_1649036
Think in favor of the killer. What u are saying is just a survivor entitlement mentality.
How so?
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I kind of like the reward idea -- like maybe you get extra BP if an unhook happens far away from you. But I think different players have different motivations for what they do, and getting bloodpoints doesn't account for all of them.
We pretty much all agree that there are specific situations where it makes sense to camp, but if we're trying to discourage the habitual campers, or the players who camp as their main strategy and first resort, I think we also have to consider the reasons they camp that don't have anything to do with points. One reason would be that it's an easy way to get kills (and some players are more motivated by getting kills than BP), and another would be that it makes the people they camp feel bad (and some players are motivated by sadism more than BP).
In the second case, where the motivation is just bullying people, there's no amount of reward that will convince them to change.
In the first case, where the motivation is getting kills, you could try to make camping a less effective way to get kills (by switching to a cage system, as some people have suggested, or by having survivors play less altruistically and focus on getting the gens done while the killer camps) or you could try to buff the killers to make it easier for players to get kills without camping, but I'm not sure there's a threshold of bloodpoints you can give someone that will make them feel okay about a zero-kill game if, to them, that means they lost.