Devil_hit11
Devil_hit11
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@femme_fatal1 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3779992#Comment_3779992
i feel like thats missing the point running into a killer running stealth perks once in a blue moon doesnt change how i play suvivor every other match and barely changes how i play suvivor that match
It is not killer fault that the perks are barely serviceable. Maybe buff these perk up by a lot instead of constant safe changes.
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@Ayodam said:
You could run Whispers, Spies, or any other number of perks that detect immersed survivors. The response to survivors who face uncomfortable playstyle is always to “run X perk.” Apply that to your killer games as well. 🤷🏽♀️
the problem is same as skull merchant holding the game hostage. The player has to equip a perk in order counter situation that they are not preparing to counter. In other words, the problem exist and occurs because the other side does not have correct tool to deal with situation. The problem is too great but also rare enough for player to not use the perk.
That is why they need fix this base-kit so this gameplay strength is not so sharp for the killer. It is one of reasons why they can't buff stealth globally in the game because if they do, it makes this game more obnoxious in end game. 30+ minutes to search for survivor is not fun.
this is why i proposed that they buff base walking speed by +30% and Crouching speed by +30% but added some detection system where survivors are alive and no significant gen progression has occurred. a small decrease to champion of light from 50→30% walking speed to accommodate said change.
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Nurse is strongest killer according to most tier lists. She is 4th killer to be added. the first DLC. Power-creep Nurse. Good joke.
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don't think they'll remove map offering. more like balance over-performing survivor maps.
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Use trail of torment, Unforeseen, Hex:plaything, Tinkerer, Machine learning or other stealth perk equivalents. you can make every killer stealth. Beware for killer with lullaby.
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they gave hag a trap disabling mechanic because she was out of line compare to other trapping killers who had disable bear traps and disable drone mechanic in their kit since the start.
I think other aspect is to weaken hag's ability to proxy camp hooks by putting 10 traps near the hook. in practice, very few survivors use "Urban Evasion" and default crouch speed is unnaturally slow. Hag was designed there was only 6 survivors and Nea's Urban Evasion was very popular perk post its buffs. In today's day and age, nobody uses it so it made hag camping stronger over the years.
Items countering power was also outdated mechanic…. for same reason that they removed trapper's traps being sabotaged by toolbox, it was only natural course of action to remove light-burn for same reason making it easier to balance the killer.
today, hag exemplify that only proxy camping is ineffective strategy for killer because survivor can do generator before friends and hag cannot capitalize against aggressive gen-rushing. Her answer to aggressive gen-rushing is 3 gens but 3 gen mechanic has been nerfed/balanced out to not be so oppressive across the board. The result is that in order for proxy camping killer to be effective, they need to be aggressive powerful to take advantage for how survivor is playing. Unfortunately for hag, Hag cannot adapt to aggressive gameplay. She is one dimensional proxy camper relies on early altruism to succeed. this makes her predictable for any survivor to play against. As such, the way to defeat her is also one dimensional. This leaves hag to be a killer that is left-behind.
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@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3779937#Comment_3779937
I remember this video, he was excluding Survivor ragequits and DCs [see 6m in], but including them if the Killer quit [see 36:52], the former of which sadly are part and parcel of normal matches. Without the exact matches reviewed back to back, his claim was dubious at best. Nonetheless, for the sake of argument, let's assume it was true.
What is stopping his former teammates from dying in a 4K the very next match, negating his stats?
Why because 1 person can be above the stats, no one can be below the stats? They are all in the same MMR bracket, otherwise they wouldn't be matchmade together, so they can't simply be baby Survs inflating the stats.
In normal stats, you are bound to have a 40/50/60/70/80, and that averages out to 60. Heck, you can play a match right now and get a 4K, or a 4E. Does that mean the kill rate is 50%? We average the results over a long period of time.
He doesn't normally sweat for every single match, but you bet he is gunna sweat for content for a video. That level of sweat in unsustainable, otherwise he would still exclusively be playing that way.
If we take this Survivor 65% rate, couldn't we also take winstreaks on Killer? That simply means Blight has ~99.95% winrate, and Oni has ~99.85% winrate if the next match was a loss from this post. That's why this logic fails.
You say you can't base Killers off of average/new players. Then lets go back to the end of my previous post. Back when BHVR gave stats for all and top (5%) MMR, Killers had higher kill rates at both the low and high end of the kill rate spectrum under top MMR. That means that weaker Killers are dragging up the escape rates, not the other way around (or in other words weaker Survivors aren't dragging up kill rates at the same frequency).
The problem here is we both are likely at the higher end of the skill spectrum within top MMR, although it seems as though you assume everyone is as good as you. I get too frustrated with soloq because I see people clearly not as good as me making the same foolish mistakes over and over again. Even as Killer, I can predict some of the dumbest stuff with too great a frequency.
The matchmaking is too loose, because it is the top 25% of the playerbase within the highest end of the system. When you have a 75 Surv matched up with a 90 Killer and 3 95 Survs, that person is not gunna have a good time, and likely ruin the match for the other Survs. Heck, even if the Survs would have normally won, that weaker Surv is either going to make it a 3v1 from 5 gens, or create a bunch of deadzones the other Survs no longer could juice.
As far as empirical things that happen, the same can happen to pump kill rates/drop escape rates. People can have a tome that basically has them throw the game. They can have to get up and deal with answering the door or fussy kids. They can have a VPN Killer getting lag hits from the moon since we have a bad server check system. We can have people taking chase in the wrong direction unknowingly towards the 90% gen when the Killer has Pop. All of these happen as well, but the stats are our best way of guestimating at which frequency they occur for or against each side.
Also since this is getting mostly off-topic, I do agree with OP's point about reducing Xeno's tail CD down to 2.7s. That way it maintains parity with the other attack CDs.
If you want to continue this (non-Xeno) discussion, create a new thread and @ me, otherwise feel free to have the last word.
he is trying to get 50 regular normal games stats that start with 4 people and end with 4 people.
Why because 1 person can be above the stats, no one can be below the stats? They are all in the same MMR bracket, otherwise they wouldn't be matchmade together, so they can't simply be baby Survs inflating the stats.
yes there can be baby survs inflating the stats. it has to do with how BVHR classifies high MMR games. you have 1 survivor that is high MMR and 1 Killer that is high MMR but 3 mediocre survivor that are not high MMR. that game may be counted as high MMR game because the killer is high MMR. this is done to keep queues at minimum. you can call it below buffer games.
In normal stats, you are bound to have a 40/50/60/70/80, and that averages out to 60. Heck, you can play a match right now and get a 4K, or a 4E. Does that mean the kill rate is 50%? We average the results over a long period of time.
On average, there is more games below buffer. so baby survivors inflating the stats.
He doesn't normally sweat for every single match, but you bet he is gunna sweat for content for a video. That level of sweat in unsustainable, otherwise he would still exclusively be playing that way.
If you play this all the time, it is not really anything special for you.
If we take this Survivor 65% rate, couldn't we also take winstreaks on Killer? That simply means Blight has ~99.95% winrate, and Oni has ~99.85% winrate if the next match was a loss from this post. That's why this logic fails.
this is average escape video. not a win-streak video and those win streaks are…. done by utilizing below buffer games. guaranteed that your not doing win-streaks vs 4 man swf with random maps. eventually they'll win.
Also since this is getting mostly off-topic, I do agree with OP's point about reducing Xeno's tail CD down to 2.7s. That way it maintains parity with the other attack CDs.
Well my opinion remains same. xeno suffers from add-on variety through add-on tax and doesn't have any notable tail strike add-on to bolster his strength.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Je3AQGuG2C8@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3779921#Comment_3779921
Team sucks I lose - Yes, the greatest flaw of the (Survivor side of the) game shouldn't be exacerbated. Glad we agree.
I assume players are better than losing to an M1 Killer - I mean you are talking about such a small percentage of the population, that I'm not sure that assumption is valuable. BHVR's latest stats has Onryo 2nd, Pinhead 3rd, Freddy 4th, Pig 6th, Dredge 7th, and Myers 9th (lowest with Myers at 61% kill rate). Now to be fair, they only listed all MMR for the Killer specific rates, but even their 2022 stats (the most recent I could find quickly) for the top 5% has Trapper at the lowest with a 56% killrate. So even in the tippy top most players they are still dying to M1 Killers at and above 56% of the time. What's even more crazy, is the lowest and highest kill rates in 2022 comparing top 5% and all MMRs has kill rates higher in top 5% MMR, and lower across all MMRs, so the kill rates might even be higher across the board.
Hens did a video where he tried to ask a question: "Is the average solo survivor match really that bad?". He averaged around a 65% escape rate across 50 matches. It cannot be that killers have average 60% kill-rate and survivor is able to achieve 65% escape-rate. The statistics must be including mostly new players or average players making making mistakes in-game. My personal experience also does not support such poor escape-rate since I was definitely escaping way more then 39%. I also use similar build to hens while playing soloq with same ideas discussed in the video which I found very surprising.
I cannot base killer strengths on new players/average survivors. I have to base killer strengths on decent survivor soloq survivors and SWF. if you play a killer well, your likely to be matched with these players on average which is what your view of average balance looks like. I never based balance on empirical kill-rate stats. I base my thoughts on balance based off empirical situations in dbd that are likely to happen in the average match. If my ideas are correct, then then stats should validate what is already happening. I see stats as more of confirmation to behaviour, not an empirical tool to balance itself. In this case, they don't so they are not a good determining factor.
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@femme_fatal1 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3776752#Comment_3776752
per the perk description
"Upon damaging a Generator, this Perk activates
. While active, the next Generator you damage will become Compromised."
stop talking out your ass
yes and my suggest is to remove 2nd part.
"Upon damaging a generator, this perk activates:
When a generator is completed, you gain 10% haste and 60 second of undetectable."
there is no 2nd kick or any compromise. I don't know, just for the 3rd buff if it ever shows up. Maybe then the perk will be good.
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@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3779911#Comment_3779911
The ignore turret facet is an interesting argument, I just have a hard time finding the spare time large enough to get an M2 out of it that couldn't have been an M1 instead (maybe an LT wall turret in the center?). It just feels too specific of a scenario. I'll take your word for it, but it just feels too niche.
Individual vs team though, I have to disagree. Ideally, everyone spreads on gens, and places a turret on their gen (or a nearby loop). Even if you have everyone duoing on gens, you still get a double chase on tunnel exit, and even as a bog standard 4.6 M1 Killer, that is such a winning scenario.
Your final point about the Xeno Sing difference kinda cements my teamwork point though. If the team isn't all at the same level of knowledge in terms of perfect turret placement, you lose. The Xeno can let the baby Surv place turrets, and chase the knowledgeable Survivors, and in a worst case scenario, the Xeno is still a normal M1 Killer. Maybe because I have Ghosty/Myers/Legion among my top 5, that isn't a problem for me, so I don't expect it to be a problem for others as well. EMPs only need you to know when to bother EMPing (or a teammate to merely delay a tunnel/chase in a final gen scenario).
If the team isn't all at the same level of knowledge in terms of perfect turret placement, you lose.
if my team sucks, I lose. what a surprise? Almost like it applies to every killer.
The Xeno can let the baby Surv place turrets, and chase the knowledgeable Survivors, and in a worst case scenario, the Xeno is still a normal M1 Killer
Sure, If your winning as m1 killer, than you might as well just play Freddy. You'll win all the same. I am assuming the players are better then losing to a m1 killer.
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@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3779869#Comment_3779869
Xeno doesn't need any turret based add-ons since it is easy to reaction M2 and break a flame turret (add-onless) unless they put 2 on the same spot. Putting 2 on the same spot is already such a disadvantage for the rest of the map, that the cost is too great. Plus there still is the problem of free hits on tunnel exit if someone dares grab a flame turret.
The biggest flaw and strength of Xeno is similar to Pinhead, being a soloq/lack of coordination stomper. When the Killer is designed around abusing the lack of Survivor coordination, the Killer fails conceptually IMO. They need to make Xeno's counter less team oriented, and more individual oriented. That's why I think Singularity is perfect, because you can individually OR teamwork to work against them. If you are getting tunneled and tunnel facecamped by a Xeno, there is no meaningful counterplay. What, is a teammate gunna walk a flame turret all the way over to hook, or risk giving a potential camping Xeno a free camp tunnel hit? So Xeno's design is just poor all around.
where to begin…. where to begin.
these add-on are not used to BREAK turrets. these add-on are used to IGNORE turrets. if i had to give an analogy, let's use tanks in league of legend or whatever concept of tank you understand in video games.
Imagine your health bar as health bar for going out of Xeno form. Imagine this as your HP bar in league of legends. If your tank, you want to tank damage for your team such that you take MOST amount of damage possible without dying.
So here we have two tanks.
Player 1: tank is 1000 hp.
player 2: tank is 3000 hp.
The most amount of damage you can take is 1000 damage, but in practice, taking 999 damage is gonna get killed in the game. You don't want to take all 999 hp, let's say you play it safe and you take 600 damage. by not taking Emergency helmet and Stardew map, you are taking risks because your barely killing turrets and any turret you come across, you HAVE to break it.
Now we go to player 2 who more tank. He can take 3000 damage. so he is also going to play the game safely and not take 2999 damage. He has more wiggle room to say take 2400 damage. So first benefit here… that you will never fail to break a turret but the real benefit is that you can ignore weak threats to threaten you out of the turret and calculate whether a turret is worth breaking or not.
You don't want to be playing Xeno on edge where you respect every turret and you only just make it to break turret. in practice, you want to be ignoring turrets entirely because if you can ignore turrets entirely and down survivor without losing your power, you can punish poor turret placement. If the player complete a gen, by you NOT destroying the turret, the survivor has to and pick up turret and slow to use that turret else they're just -1 on that turret.
They need to make Xeno's counter less team oriented, and more individual oriented. That's why I think Singularity is perfect, because you can individually OR teamwork to work against them. If you are getting tunneled and tunnel facecamped by a Xeno, there is no meaningful counterplay. What, is a teammate gunna walk a flame turret all the way over to hook, or risk giving a potential camping Xeno a free camp tunnel hit? So Xeno's design is just poor all around.
xeno's turrets are already individual oriented. most people only use those turrets as global 1 man personal alert systems on average. the turrets a lot stronger when they're used as 2 man vantage point to break xeno out of his power because they make him waste time to go back into tunnels which often isn't good thing as you lose chase. I disagree that putting 2 turrets is wasted opportunity cost. the key to using them is to put them in high traffic area where it is easy for survivor to get to it. For example Growning storehouse main building is great example. it is easy to get to as survivor and once you get to it, you can easily abuse the god window while also destroying his crawler mode. Even if the player has bamboozle+Self-destructive bolt, The add-on won't do anything when out of crawler mode and bamboozle doesn't help if the player switches loop to nearby strong loop to use the pallet when Crawler mode is cooldown. There is countless map examples where stacking turrets at the right time can mess up Xeno's time efficiency.
The real difference between singularity and Xeno is that singularity EMP counter takes 0 skill to use meaning that its value is always consistent while Xeno's turret take understanding of map awareness and positioning to have relevancy. In my opinion, your just asking for xeno's turrets to be as dummy full proof as Emp's and on technical level, they are as dummy proof as Emp's If you don't use turret add-on's because xeno will break every turret and every turret is free distance/chase extension. That is why we use these add-on for xeno so the turrets aren't dummy proof.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
The current move speed was the original one on the ptb, like you said, and it was perfectly fine during that testing period.
The only reason people noticed a difference or even complained at all was the bug when it went live where there was zero attack slowdown at all.
People got used to having zero penalty for missing and are apparently still blaming it on this change, even though that's never been the issue.
there was not zero penalty for missing. you still suffered a cooldown. you just did not lose any distance.
the noticeable part of nerf was that it made turrets into free health-states because you lose distance for hitting turret with your tail. The other noticeable aspect is that dbd doesn't have missed cooldown movement and successful cooldown movement speed. it only has hit-cooldown movement speed.
So it is either fast or slow. The 2.0 m/s gave Xeno soft-version of stbfl. It was only like 2 stacks or 3 stacks but it made killer feel a lot better.
Current xeno has bad add-on variety because of turrets require xeno to use emergency helmet or Stardew map. In some cases, it is just better to use both. His other add-on focus on tracking but tracking is so somewhat situational and not really needed. What he needs is add-on for his tail to be better. He should have an add-on to increase his tail strike length by +2 meters and an add-on to decrease successful cooldown by 0.6 seconds. Add-on that make killer feel good to use and don't feel like a game tax.
I want them to buff Xeno without nerfing his tail charge time. unfortunately, i don't think they will buff him without nerfing his tail charge time meaning that xeno is stuck in limbo. he needs buffs to be A-tier killer instead of high B-tier killer but they won't give him the buff to be A-tier because survivor will complain that xeno is "unfun".
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i am pretty sure they're just giving you cypress mori and retiring the add-on. it is nothing crazy.
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so where is water attacks and wind attacks? i want to do star wars force push into trees/objects and water-pull attacks with like hindered effect imitating drowning.
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i don't understand, singlurarity is same killer with worse numbers on overclock and worst haste numbers. Unknown is mediocre.
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@TieBreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3779184#Comment_3779184
Pharmacy is getting tweaks, Distortion is getting an update. I believe Mandy said that tweaks are usually just number changes, where as updates are more substantial.
I think it's getting some big change. I just don't know what yet.
Also, enjoy whatever brain rot I left for you in that other thread just now. I've already forgotten what I said lmao.
i think it will just end up Nowhere to hide, Lethal pursuer and BBQ aura reading nerf's.
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@TieBreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3779161#Comment_3779161
In defence of the ramblings of the OP, it either gets better, worse, or BHVR does a nuanced change that doesn't make the perk worse overall.
It ain't getting buffed, and BHVR isn't known for it's nuance with game balance lmao. I'm gonna guess nerf.
remember that bvhr doesn't slam survivor perks as hard. the change could be extremely minor like increased token generation by from 30 to 45 or reduced the distortion aura block duration from 10 to 4/5/6 seconds which means that long aura blocks consume more tokens. the perk might still be effective even after its nerf.
BVHR doesn't nerf survivors perk as hard most of the time and if they do, they just end up being reverted anyway, see Iron will and DS.
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
I dont see how Lethal Pursuer would need a nerf, especially when we are getting Eyes of Belmont soon and it's basically the Survivor equivalent of Lethal Pursuer.
you can easily see them adding 60 second timer to lethal pursuer before the perk activates. Imagine you equip a perk to reveal the survivor at the start of the game but the perk only works after 60 seconds.
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i doubt it. dad boots is good because you can charge his overdrive. when in overcharge, you can miss his chainsaw and m1 survivors out of position due to missed cooldown. While overdrive is active, you use curving. when overdrive ends, you abuse dad boots to get overdrive again and you do same thing.
Billy is like hit & run killer with strong chase. When he gets downs, dad boots helps him proxy camp and return to hooks. It is currently in my opinion his best add-on.
The other 2 add-on that people debate on being strongest which are iri engravings and Lopros chains.
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Fixated has same issue. It affects walking speed which nerf's pinhead chain ability. they left few interactions where a survivor perk nerfs a killer power.
they did not change them because vigil has 1.81% pick-rate and fixated is 2.41%. their play-rate is small enough that they do not see need to change said interaction.
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Play Machine gun killers like Leatherface, Huntress or Trickster. Otherwise if you want to play other killers, you can use nerfed version of STBFL and RB.
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he only needs cooldown buff. If they care about 0.1% survivor gameplay, they should also fix all these AI bugs and exploits. They're almost as bad Pinhead's chain ability where you hit the survivor and you get no reward.
I like playing knight. It is just his drawbacks feels bad.
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
I am sorry to be the party breaker, while is this true devs did many great changes to killers I am now not going to mention (good job), this list is kinda mix bag. They did many good updates to killers but also many bad ones.
List goes:
- Onryo (she is still too weak and her previous version I prefer more)
- Pig (she still relly on add-ons on her dash, but the base kit buffs were nice but small)
- Twins (their big rework was just small QoL update in the end, huge waste of everyones time for waiting a big rework)
- Chucky (scamper should be nerfed and not removed and dashing scamper should be buffed its useless joke and window scamper was shadow nerfed)
- Knight (got nerfed to please Survivors while he got small something for huge chase nerfs).
the rework are not expected to always be liked by everyone but in my opinion the two rework that failed were
→Onryo
→Twins.
Chucky is 50/50. he is not worse for me but i feel like his changes could been a little bit more refined.
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Skull merchant and Plague are doubtfully going to be failed reworks that make character worse for the killer. Pinhead could be success but he could also miss the mark.
While i am concerned for 3 above killers, most people are likely more concerned about Billy, so I am curious for how they'll change billy and what the popular opinion is for billy after his changes.
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@TieBreaker said:
Bat form gives you the ability to chase survivors with increased speed, with minimal slowdown after leaving the form. So it's not quite as good as Spirit, but it's pretty good. It can ignore god pallets. The teleport can ignore a bunch of map traversal, which is nice. Especially when going upstairs. He's undectable, so his aura can't be read when moving around the map.
It's a really good form. So it's okay if survivors run three perks to make chasing harder. It's still a good form regardless. Plus he has two other forms to work with if one isn't that effective against a particular survivor.
one of things that is good on dracula is his ability to chase like spirit in bat-form, then when your near survivor you transform into wolf form and then m1 attack. that's kinda what i was doing in PTB Dracula. OP is right that if survivor do run Iron will, it will make his chases less viable. I just played him like bad spirit because his other two forms didn't really do anything. I ran those bat teleport and bat range add-on so i could be more mobile. you can't really stealth anyone with the bat but you can follow people and hit them in dead-zones. if people drop pallets, just break them. it almost felt like playing an m1 killer.
Dracula form in ptb worked vs player that didn't shift-w pallets but i know the dracula won't really work vs good players on live server so i don't bother to learn strategies that only work vs bad players. The only problem with like playing bat-form spirit dracula is that he has really silly transformation cooldown of 5 seconds, so that can mess you up.
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@BlightedDolphin said:
I think there are 2 reasons why:
- You can see the aura of the survivor healing them when a gen pops. The survivor that was uncaged doesn't have their aura revealed, which was a nice attempt to reduce tunnelling, but when you see someone across the map healing thin air it's pretty obvious what is happening.
- There's so many survivors and a lot of overlap in character (there's always like 2-3 Sable's and Lara's every game in my experience) that often you forget who you are even chasing and happen to find them again.
There's no way to fix the second one but they could easily fix the first one by making it so your aura is hidden when healing a teammate that was uncaged in the last 10 or so seconds. Or just simply hide your aura for a couple seconds after uncaging/being uncaged someone.
or because wraith and billy are strategic good for tunneling and eliminating someone out of the game early is key to slow down generators in 2vs8.
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3778521#Comment_3778521
Dredge is no way near A tier imo. His chase power is still pretty much same just bit better and all he does is teleport around and still depends on map lockers.
Dracula feels like Vecna but bit better in chase. They both are "I have everything in my arsenal but I excell in none of these" cathegory.
Dredge has fast spammable teleporting, easy zoning, the strongest tracking in the game and is undetectable.
I disagree. Dracula is garbage tier.
Dracula form is garbage because whenever dracula channels his fire-fissure, you can just run away to next loop. if he holds his ability, he is slowed entire time. if he cancels his ability, he is omega slowed down. survivor never need to throw pallets or win any mindgames as they win by W-keying.
Wolf form is garbage because he is 4.4 m/s, his speed orbs do nothing. Wolf can't double back or mindgame anything. So it is worse then regular m1 trapper. Pounce is hard to use and land with with current balance.
Bat form teleport is slowest teleport in the game. it has limited radius of 32 meters and the bat has 45 meter lullaby undetectable useless.
It is like dev only test killers against themselves. terrible killer.
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i think dredge is A-tier after his buffs. Dracula in ptb feels like D-tier killer.
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@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3778310#Comment_3778310
This makes me so sad, but yeah. It really feels that way. She doesnt even get killer instinct out of her tvs in addition to the other stuff I mentioned.
it is ironic because originally, the community popular opinion was that Dredge was the "Better Sadako" and what actually happened was that Sadako was the better dredge, so she got nerfed and now dredge is in fact the better Sadako because condemn mechanic which is the most important part about her kit doesn't work.
So yeah, now i can finally agree with popular opinion of Dredge > better then Sadako with dredge's buffs.
@MechWarrior3 said:
I agree with you on the first part. However, the second part respectfully I dont agree with. Her condemn is what makes her unique. Its one of the biggest parts of her lore too. I would hate to see that the "weakest" part of her kit and right now it only performs well on noobs. Swfs just eat you alive. At least on Sadako 2.0 the balance was even.
Her phasing could be stronger, I agree too, however at least the addons for it make it really good so they probably wont touch it. Specifically talking about Newspaper and Mirror. Reikos watch for demanifest is so bad and so its clump of hair.
they're unlikely to change her most pinnacle defining lore mechanic any time soon. Just look how long it is taking them to fix freddy. Your definitely going to be waiting long time for her.
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@MechWarrior3 said:
To be fair they adjusted her upon release 5.6.0 (Ptb) then again on 7.1.0 and again on 7.5.0 after all the negative backlash, but it was rushed.
She still has some pretty big core issues and addons to address.Is she getting love? Yes. 🙌🏼
Is she complicated to find the right balance? Yes, but I believe the devs will make it right. They’re more talented than what people give them credit for.
Sadako is like current freddy. She'll stay bad for 2+ years until she is reworked again. In the mean time, i recommend playing new Dredge. The better Sadako.
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@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/423520/nerf-leatherface
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/9ONZZCQMCUYM/img-3011.jpeg
Statistically. He’s not strong enough. Hes barely preforming at an average kill rate. His kill rate is suppose to be closer to 60%.
He’s still eating a lot of 0ks and 1ks.i don't even understand how you get 0k with leatherface. he is mechanical intensive character for the average player. i don't think his kill-rate will ever be that high for that reason. he is very-nooby stomp. a bad team can lose vs leatherface in less than 2-3 minutes with bad play so newer player will always associate leatherface as overpowered/too strong where as experienced player will say he is strong but not over-dominate.
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@caipt said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3777889#Comment_3777889
While this is effect counterplay, it does rely on everyone doing it without communicating. Plus I think its bad design that not bringing items is the most effective (not only) strategy. Just feels like less variety :(
I agree that weave is basically the dead mands switch effect; fair on its own but a meta combo demon. Not that weave-franklins is og pain res+dms levels bad, but its certainly more annoying.it doesn't require everyone to counter it. you don't need all 4 items in corner for this perk to be bad. even 2/4 greatly diminishes effectiveness of weave. some items being left on the floor in sem-ideal spots is ok because like i said, information isn't the end of the world. it can make you lose but you can also get aura read in places where it has low meaning. the big thing is preventing it from gaining value in high traffics area where people constantly pass through.
i don't see the perk as needing any changes. in retrospect, circle of healing had more potencial urgency in being too strong than this perk. if this perk was more like, whenever your near an item, you get exposed when near an item with 30 seconds linger, than maybe this perk would in same category as old COH but right now it is just an ok effect that is relatively easy to mitigate.
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don't bring items. perk does nothing if there is no items. if you do bring an item, there is counter to it. The other aspect to talk about is that aura reading is not end of the world for you as survivor. it gives information but by no means is that game-winning by itself. Sometimes the aura being revealed may not impact the outcome of the match.
that is very different from where circle of healing was where there was no counter to it. the value it gave always hurt killer because extra health-states is good in 90% of situations for survivor minus extreme cases like exposed and it had very strong perk efficiency. 1/16 perks vs 50% of killer load out.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3777694#Comment_3777694
Ahh we glazed over that second one so our bad on that
That said still sorta poses the same issue of many killers going to be getting nil for those 2 min (as the timer reactivates upon losing chase [which is different than losing the survivor mind you]) without heavy investing in that time sink (since this is at the start survivors have all the pallets to work with [so we're unsure where the whole bloodlust factors in here])
This is very good description of Corrupt+Deadlock+Pain Res+Hex:Wretched fate for survivor. 2 minutes of doing nothing due to 4 stacked slowdown.
Thing is, this is a whole combo of perks compared to 1 single one. Is this combo awful and boring to go against? Absobloodylotely. But the combo requires 4 slots and in the case of 2 of those hooks while yours is at the start of the gate and requires either a hit (which for the average m1 is gonna be tough unless the map helps) or a minimum 30 second sink just for the boost and not counting the time to hit after (and then again for the down). In addition, its not gonna affect a good handful of killers already commonly seen (blight, billy, wesker, huntress), just the uncommon ones (pig, trapper, meyers, gf [to be fair for gf, sneak attacks work]) which gives some less reasons to play them.
Surely you won't face proxy camping+Tunnelling at 5 gens vs C21 Blight or Other killers with wall-hack add-on's. I.e Cigar box clown etc.
So now this part your gonna need to explain to us why its here.
Thing is, this is a whole combo of perks compared to 1 single one. Is this combo awful and boring to go against?
you act like survivor don't have combos of perks that also slow the killer down… like Lithe+Decisive strike+Med-kit with Red syringe. Dead hard+Iron will+Decisive strike Med-kit Red syringe, Sprint burst+Off the record.
Anyhow, it was perk idea that i wrote 2 years ago, didn't post it because i never thought old MFT would ever show up up in the game but i forgot that i wrote this perk idea 2 years ago.
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3777496#Comment_3777496
His tier 3 is already scary enough imo, the only issues he really has is having the ability Slow Start (he just cant get it going!) and his zombies are tree huggers
t3 bonuses feel underwhelming. this change has potencial give something good for both nemesis tiers.
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@Rulebreaker said:
We'd say it probably would need more deactivate conditions, especially if you'd want it to have 120 seconds as if everyone runs it, it's pretty much 2 minutes of nothing for most killers.
it already has two deactive conditions. if you get an opening hit, the perk deactivates and if killer chases for 30 seconds, the bonuses expire. They can be re-activated within the timer by killer losing chase or survivor losing chase but honestly losing chase with bloodlust 2. you move fast enough that you shouldn't be losing chase.
if everyone runs it, it's pretty much 2 minutes of nothing for most killers.
This is very good description of Corrupt+Deadlock+Pain Res+Hex:Wretched fate for survivor. 2 minutes of doing nothing due to 4 stacked slowdown. Surely you won't face proxy camping+Tunnelling at 5 gens vs C21 Blight or Other killers with wall-hack add-on's. I.e Cigar box clown etc.
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@Shroompy said:
Only when you initially get infected I believe
Also 1 less charge felt nice, definitely helps his early game.
it should work all the time if your tier 3. it would make his tier 3 a bit better.
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farming killers means that killer gives up and says that he lost. So he farms with you instead of accepting the humiliating loss. It is honestly red flag that killer is in a bad state because it means that killer don't want to play the game normally because it is imbalanced/unplayable.
@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
Full? I see maybe like 1 in 20 games when its BP event or something.
Farming is a grey zone. Its not something supported from players to do and devs are not a fan but it isnt bannable (unless you combine it with like game hostage, forcing others, etc.)
i don't see farming killers that much at all but i think it is super bad to have mass farming killers. Killers giving up every game is like equal to survivors rage quiting on hook and disconnecting. You can't play survivor game if every killer is a farming killer.
Survivor can't play the game properly either if every game has self-suicide on hook or disconnect on hook from their teammate.
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@fussy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3776632#Comment_3776632
Releasing it as a beta separate from the main game also provides more safety and flexibility to try out bolder changes
It's obvious not for try out bolder changes. Every killer since Knight was underpowered on PTB and was buffed. The only one really bold ptb was last Twins, but I don't know how they made it to ptb in this state to begin with. Hard to believe no one on a team didn't understand that it was ridiculous, not just bold.
The dev are not obligation to change anything from direct feedback. They may change elements of the game from PTB but they also may not. The PTB is important for testing bugs and seeing how the character plays on average. PTB allow them to adjust the killer if that killer is too powerful or increase the killer's power if the killer turns out to not play well.
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@Roaroftime said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3776888#Comment_3776888
Because being slugged and add ons that promote toxic boring gameplay is so healthy and "fine". It needs a cool down.
here's a hint. just get hit by guard. If your healthy, by the time guard comes back, you can leave. You only need to be healthy/healed to get out while having enough distance away from the knight.
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@joel84 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3777026#Comment_3777026
First of all, thanks for the calculation, but what does this mean now? Is this a nerf or a buff for the add-on?
it is nerf for add-on only if a single person is injured. it is buffed in every other instance. The total amount of time it takes to get nightfall passively is 192 seconds, 106.6 seconds, 73.84 or 56.48. do keep in mind that Dredge does receive some minor nightfall points for hitting a survivor, hooking a survivor and staying in a locker however those point are very inconsequential compare to passive nightfall build up of keeping survivors injured.
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@mizark3 said:
66% of .75/s (per Surv) bumps to 1.25/s (per Surv).
25% of 1.0/s (per Surv) bumps to 1.25/s (per Surv).
It is a buff without the addon, and the same as before, with the addon.
The TP speed is a MASSIVE buff, and will be very helpful.
Overall though, Dredge's current greatest weakness is the lack of lockers. More maps need to be fixed and have lockers actually placed throughout them. (Also Temple of Purgation needs the lockers behind the main gen gate to be removed/moved.) Someone else mentioned a good idea that Sadako TV/Xeno Tunnel locations could be Killer specific locker locations (like for Huntress/Trickster/Dredge), or just universal lockers in the absence of those Killers. I think that would be better change that helps more Killers, and also gives Surv Locker perks more value.
that is not how it works. Old Malthinker used to increase nightfall build-up by a flat value of 66%. the default nightfall build is 0.25 and you gain 0.75 per injury. You need 1 injure to activate Malthinker skull.
this is total 1.0 charges. Malthinker skull just add 66% increased nightfall flat when one survivor was injured. so 1.0x0.66 = 1.66.
New Malthinker does something completely different. The new one increases the total passive nightfall build-up by 25% for each injured survivor.
1.25+0.312 = 1.562 → 192 seconds
2.25+0.562 = 2.8125 → 106.6 seconds
3.25+0.8125 = 4.0625 → 73.84 seconds
4.25+1.0625 = 5.3125 → 56.47 seconds
Apart from 1 injury which has reduced charges of 0.10 charges per second, every other instance of new Malthinker skull is superior.
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@femme_fatal1 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3774984#Comment_3774984
oh you meant like that the perk activates after the first gen kick fyi so without describing that you wanted an activation cost change what you meant didnt really come through. tho then the perk would just stay basicaly useless with the only exeption being 3 gen builds and even if it worked without the rng (which isnt really rng tbh) it would get nerfed instantly cause that change doesnt really do enything exept make it stronger on the like 5 killers i mentioned previously and stay awful on the rest of the cast like maybe this makes you add blight to the list but do you really wanna make a perk more powerful just so it can be great on blight. oh yea and also the perk just wouldnt be fun why rework something to make it less interactive
no, the perk activates after 2 gen kicks. it doesn't pick any gen to compromise. it is just stay active, next gen that is completed activates speed and stealth. It is like you compromised all generators on the map.
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@Neaxolotl said:
I'm not sure if messing with tiles are correct way to buff killers
that kinda thing that BVHR has trouble figuring out. Is it that Ghostface is too weak and needs buffs or is it that Badham preschool is too strong such that ghostface is m1 killer with no chance to win on said map if the survivor is equally skilled.
BVHR has trouble deciding this. In the end, they seem to do a mixture of both buffing killers. good strategy? bad strategy? hard to say.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
Medusa's Hair might legitimately be the worst purple addon in the game. 10 seconds of blindness is worthless
i think someone mistranslated the add-on. I think it is suppose to be 10 second of exhaustion, not 10 second of blindness.
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he got add-on rework on legion update and then they lowered his cooldown + buffed his crouching speed in another update. He got 2 QOL updates. Doctor got his range and detonation base-kit which was his first QOL. His second QOL is static blast.
They're equal in number of updates. 2 for 2. Doctor still has a bunch of add-on that realistically produce low value for madness. Calm madness doesn't do a whole lot, Order add-on are as laughable as freddy fake pallets, Restraint feels like it should be a base-kit effect+aura doesn't do much. the premise of doctor is suppose to be that you have madness and you get pick madness effect that correspond to some kind of build or play-style but these effect don't really corresponding to a build or play-style.
With how it is now, those Cater notes are rarely used for their madness application and are only used for base stat increases that all arguably could be base-kit and they wouldn't make doctor over-perform.
Ghostface suffers from a simple idea that has low kit expansion. It is like opposite to what new killers are. Vecna and Dark lord are killer with many abilities therefore many functionalities.This also applies to Knight, Skull merchant, Pinhead, Wesker so on and so on. people argue these killer have too many functionalities where as Ghostface has legit opposite problem. he has such simple power that there is almost nothing to buff or expand and player doesn't have much skill expression to utilize.
As a result, Ghostface will likely always be a low-tier killer unless he receives extra powers and functionalities to his arsenal. It is like comparing Old Mundo in league of legends that is stat-stick vs New Mundo is league. League for example will update outdated old characters and attempt to add new dimensions to a character other than "stat-stick to win". DBD on other hand doesn't do that. they'll rework character and improve numbers to call them reworks but really all they're doing is buffing numbers. It is kinda weird. you would think buffing killers or even weaken killer would be simple process but it is not and it is very complicate one in dbd.
Full-on reworks should be complicated but they rarely ever occur. a lot of the time, they don't need to occur but for someone like GF, he might be candidate for it. Freddy might be candiate for it as well. we'll see where freddy goes.
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@VomitMommy said:
Nurse, Singularity, Blight, Wesker?
Nurse definitely fits the most for this description.
all i know is that playing for hooks and not camping does not work against strong SWF. You waste too much time getting into chase and too much time breaking safe loops. 70 second hook timers is an issue.
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out of all killers written in road map, He gives me most hype/excitement. I assume they'll buff his possessed chain and weaken his chain hunt. The 3 buffs I would like to see are following
→ Chains no longer break on the environment.
→ Survivors and Cenobite no longer break chains when crossing their path.
→ Cenobite movement speed modifier when channeling gateway increased from 0.8x to 0.96x(~110% m/s)
My guess for how they will weaken chain hunt is prevent Cenobite from being able to spam solve the box.
→ New feature: When 90 seconds of chain hunt elapses, Chain hunt automatically activates for 30 seconds.
→ New feature: Lament configuration solved by Cenobite activates chain hunt for 30 seconds.
→ Increased Lament configuration respawn time to 30 seconds when solved by Cenobite.
→ Added a 45 second chain hunt pause period after chain hunt expires.
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I'd give blight base-kit old alchemist ring, restore rushes on successful blight rush hit, Base-kit infinity rushes when within 16 meters of an ally killer and whenever blight slams into an object, all surivors working on the generator are faced with a tremendously difficult skill-check in a 16 meter radius. Base-kit old Soul Chemical.
Blight gains +2 rush tokens in the mode and -0.5 second recovery speed in the mode.
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@femme_fatal1 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3773621#Comment_3773621
just no you would have to nerf the duration to a point where it wouldnt do enything if it was garrenteed making it a gamble would allow it to keep its powerful effect
you have to spend time kicking 2 gens. the compromise mechanic adds rng on top of time-sink to use the perk. this is not accounting that survivor can also hear/see the activation of the perk meaning they can entirely avoid the perk effect.
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@Rickprado said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3774294#Comment_3774294
Skull Merchant cannot hold a 3 gen stalling the game like before, but she can get downs easily while protecting a 3-gen area """""""abusing""""" the broken status + the haste she gets.
I don't hate Skull Merchant in any way - i like her a lot - and i think most of the hate the community has for her is baseless but i see some issue in her kit that i which the devs could adress so everyone can have a nice time while she is the match.
strangely enough, i have feeling that BVHR will not remove broken feature feature in her kit because they originally designed skull merchant to be generator defender killer. i highly doubt they will weaken the very aspect that they designed for her. if anything, they'll likely make her more 3 gen focused which will make survivor hate her even more like in the past but it will be weak 3 gen killer that easy to break.