Crowman
Crowman
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Weird topic to make if you really don't care about these character model updates.
BHVR is updating all the visuals of the game, because it's a (almost) 5 year old and they want the game to have better visuals.
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@WiiFitTrainer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2152126#Comment_2152126
It's not even worth it during chases most of the time. The regular tonic is more useful at area denial than the negligible speed boost you get at loops with yellow bottles. Sure you can say "just use both" but you can literally get the same hits with 2 tonics and not have to bother with the timing of yellow bottles.
The only time I've gotten any consistant use from yellow bottles was catching up to shift w players in the open. It's nice to be able to throw a yellow down, then hit them with tonic so you can get the best of both worlds.
IMO, The only reason yellow bottles aren't more useful at tiles is with a lot of the map reworks and general balance changes to maps, most loops are simply not long enough where the value of both is needed.
The only tiles I can think of where both bottles are likely to make a difference are Shack and those long tiles that love to spawn on Cowshed.
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Clown being considered weaker than most other killers does not mean he's bad. For the most part, there's not really a bad killer in the game currently.
Some killers like Myers, Pig, and Trapper desperately need some major changes to their kits, but even in their current state they can still win against average survivors.
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@ShamelessPigMain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2151764#Comment_2151764
That's not what I'm talking about. All I'm saying that is DS and BT don't actively prevent a tunnel or a camp, only give a small slap on the wrist for them.
Because you can't prevent another player from making the choice to camp or tunnel you.
DS and BT do their jobs well and give the survivor a 2nd chance to escape a tunneling or camping killer.
There's nothing more that can be done besides offering the 2nd chance.
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@ShamelessPigMain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2151754#Comment_2151754
Right, but my point is that most of these hope that the punishment for action x, y, and z will be so great that it discourages those actions after the fact, but they aren't great enough to prevent said actions.
If a killer wants to keep chasing you after you got unhooked, no amount of perks or teammates body blocking is going to stop him. This isn't a perk issue.
DS is fine. Killers who want you out of the game will do so regardless.
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You can't really stop another player from tunneling or camping without getting to a point where you create situations of where survivors are actually invulnerable which isn't fair.
Anti-Tunneling/Camping perks work by making it take longer for your opponent to succeed.
BT prevents a camping killer from instantly downing you and giving you time to reach safety.
DS gives you another chance at leading the killer on a chase giving your teammates more time to do gens.
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You can always drop the survivor manually. If you see multiple people heading to body block, it's better to just drop the survivor and leave them slugged on the ground and go after the body blockers.
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I wouldn't expect any more changes to him until at least the next midchapter, but most likely it'll be an even later midchapter.
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@kyogul said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2151130#Comment_2151130
The fact that you made all of that projection--erroneously at that--over someone having a different opinion than you about a video game character is truly interesting.
It's always the bellends who have to act morally superior when they can't form an argument. News flash: no one cares about meeting any of your standards. No one cares if you give them your stamp of approval. No one asked. When there's demand for irrelevant, meaningless, and pretentious opinions, you will be the first to know as I will need a reliable supplier.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2151061#Comment_2151061
Yep that's kind of my point. There is technically a sound he makes when he's about to shoot, but the fact that he can quick scope and that the sound amidst chase is not reliable makes that indicator meaningless, much like the husk (?) on Spirit's body glowing when she's phasing, or her animation reset.
The fact that people have to parse through so much tripe to find "counterplay" to these killers and list unrealistic counters showcases the point about why people dislike going against these killers. These killers have significantly more power to win a chase than the survivor ever will and it comes across as unfair. Nurse is the same way but I think she is the exception considering she actually takes skill to use even decently. Deathslinger is about can you shoot or not. Spirit is largely about how good is your hearing, though I do think people don't acknowledge playing Spirit involves game sense as well since you do have to anticipate moves sometimes instead of just relying solely on scratch marks or sound.
Look if you want to keep a bad player mindset where you blame all your loses on everything but your own skill, go ahead.
Deathslinger and Spirit both have counterplay and are more than just "hope they are bad".
But maybe one day you'll figure it out.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2149900#Comment_2149900
they won't. you know what else is high on Otz tier-list? Freddy, He's B-tier. He will be joining Billy in C-tier. He might be so bad to the point that he joins D-tier or even F-tier but people won't realize this until .... 1 year later after the change. Billy has been low-tier for.... a long time, just community is slow to adjust. Too many bad survivors in solo-queue.
I mean they could give back Billy's instantsaw add-on by removing their drawback and freddy changes... but they won't because survivors asked for these changes and killers have to live with consequences with them. Its just how cookie crumbles.
Freddy isn't going to be d tier after his nerfs. People really got to stop overreacting considering the worst nerf Freddy got wasn't even a direct one, it was the bt change.
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@kyogul said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2150509#Comment_2150509
Try the 'you're bad because I disagree with you' argument on someone else, I'm not the one.
In technicality you can outplay them. The issue is that they have much more control and leverage to outplay you than you ever will to outplay them, if all things are considered equal. I don't consider guesses to be counterplay.
You can break LOS from Deathslinger to avoid getting shot at, but that's a "counterplay" credited to the map rather than the survivor. Léry's is a good example because of how many walls and LOS breaks there are. Majority of maps are very open in comparison if not in general, so I stand by what I said again: you don't juke a deathslinger, he simply misses his shots.
It's not a "you are bad because you disagree with me". It's the mindset that you only win or lose because you faced a certain killer then you are not acting like a good player and are just looking to protect your own ego because you lost.
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@Star99er said:
He was already pretty easy to deal with around small loops prior to his nerfs so it's not surprising that he has him at below-average.I am surprised how low he put Ghostface and Myers though, I know that they struggle to apply pressure early game but they both have great snowballing. Myers is a killer I pip most of my games with.
Ghostface is very map dependent. Get Hawkins and his power really excels due to all the LoS blockers. Get Blood Lodge and good luck every catching anyone off guard let alone get any stalks for quick downs. Because he's really map dependent it's really hard to rate him above C, because his performance varies too much.
Myer's kit is just a bit outdated and struggles to keep up. Myers starts 105, has to build up stalk to become a normal killer, and then has to stalk more to get access to his super mode which is just a 60 second expose, longer lunge, and faster vault. It's not bad, but it's kind of weak given how much he has to build his power. Compared to Oni who starts off at 115, has an easier time building up his power as he just needs to M1 one person to start getting blood, and doesn't even have a limit to how many times he can fury unlike Myers.
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@kyogul said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2149474#Comment_2149474
outplaying spirit is like outplaying a deathslinger. you didn't juke him, he simply missed. you didn't outplay a spirit, she simply misheard you.
it's reliant on how good she is, not how good you are
That's a bad player's mindset right there.
There are things you can do to outplay both a Spirit and a Deathslinger. They simply are not guaranteed to work all the time.
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Plague has the issue where if survivors don't cleanse she loses chaser due to 1 hit downs. And if survivors do cleanse she loses malicious because survivors get a free heal.
You are likely just better off avoid using Vile Purge and bring some apples for extra corrupt fountains to take advantage of.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2150349#Comment_2150349
Let me explain myself a bit better - I didn't mean to say I hate slugging or that all slugging is bad. If that's the impression you got, that's my bad for not explaining myself properly
My point was - if slugging is the only viable Strategy for a killer's power then I believe that's unhealthy for the game. That applies to Twins because it is quite literally counter-productive to down someone with victor, swap and then hook every time. It's the same with Oni, but Oni has mobility and map control. Twins doesn't
Slugging is completely fine when it's not the only thing killers are setting out to do. I apologise if you thought I was trying to call all slugging bad, that wasn't my intention
Oni can pick up a survivor he downs with his power just fine. He keeps the rest of his power bar so he can pick up some more blood and have his power back quickly. He's certainly not forced to slug like he was on the ptb when he would lose half his power bar picking up a survivor in his power.
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@[Deleted User] said:
The discussion around Spirit is weird to me because people list things they try against her and express frustration that those things don't work. And people consistently list the same things as counterplays they've tried.
The reason it's weird to me, and I say this as someone who plays Spirit at a competitive level, is that those aren't even things that work against a decent Spirit. Apparently the commonly accepted counterplay, yet players CONSISTENTLY express frustration that those things don't work. Like...maybe those aren't the things players should do against a good Spirit? Nurse has a bit of the same thing. Doubling back will almost never work against a good Nurse.
Fast vault followed by a slow vault is the easiest thing in the world to hear for a Spirit. Same with dropping a pallet and vaulting it. You can even see a dust cloud on the pallet in the direction they vaulted. Doubling back in a straight line means you're going to breath in her face at some point. Want to chance that on a Spirit with $900 headphones, an amp, and an EQ?
So what do you do? Healthy breathing at a stand still has a distance of 8 meters standing still. Hard cut off at 8 meters. Running is 12-16 plus footsteps depending on the character. Injured is whatever. You might as well be screaming.
The answer is always make distance and create a 50/50 at a further tile. The answer is NEVER stay at the tile or go towards the Spirit. She has a finite amount of charge on each phase walk. You need to make her burn some of that closing the distance. It takes practice to gauge the timing, but I like to wait and bait her to commiting to one side of the tile and then vault or drop the pallet at the last second of her phase. It's the most effective counterplay but the hardest to pull off.
Lastly, it is 100% patently false that she has no tell when she goes into phase
https://twitter.com/SeyItAint/status/1384471343685582853?s=19
I think the issue is people expect tactics to work 100% of the time, but killers with strong chase mechanics don't have counters that work 100% of the time and it becomes a game where you try to make the other person think you are going to do something and you do something else.
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@Kebek said:
Tbh billy right now is not that great, he's not bad by any means and C tier is a bit of a over exaggeration but I can understand where he's coming from.
Billy, just like myers, without any addons with new overheat get severly overshadowed by newer killers like Oni or Blight. They just do things he does significantly better.
Imo they should make overheat into a risk mechanic insted of a punishment. The higher it gets (50%, then at 75%) you start to get bonuses like increased chainsaw speed, charge etc or all together. That way you on purpose increase your overheat to get a chance at crazy plays with better stats and if survivors manages to outplay you, you fully overheat and go on massive cooldown.
That would make overheat actually fun mechanic for both sides insted of unnecessary annoyance.
I think the main reason Billy got pushed to C tier is that Otz is trying to keep a balance with tiers. Basically not overloading A Tier or B Tier with too many killers.
Because honestly most killers are viable against average survivors and none are really that bad by any means. The D tier killers (except Clown) have major flaws with their power that need a major look at. RNG for Pig/Trapper, Trickster's laceration mechanic, Myers limited EW and mess of addons. Pig also has a mess of addons. Clown I don't think is truly D tier material and could certainly have made C tier.
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Hard to say. There are a lot of strong killers in the game so I could see a case for putting him in B tier based on the power of other killers that exist.
I don't think Freddy will be significantly worse than before.
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I honestly haven't noticed it.
But most of my end game chats simply don't have much outside of gg.
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Outplaying spirits is fairly satisfying given how strong her kit is and the limited amount of ways you have to play against her.
I have enough experience playing against spirits and some experience playing spirit myself that I can usually predict when she is phasing.
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I wouldn't say that Tenacity and Unbreakable are similar perks let alone Tenacity being a worse version of Unbreakable. Soul Guard is much closer to unbreakable than tenacity is.
Also of all perks to compare to Adrenaline you pick No One Left Behind and not Hope.
I also wouldn't say Object is strictly better than Distortion as they do different things. Object shows you the killer's aura when they can see yours. Distortion blocks the ability for the killer to see your aura. Distortion has more competition with Off The Record as it's the only other aura blocking perk survivors have.
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Personally, it's a bit entertaining to see twitch streamers get really upset. I remember a twitch streamer's friend said on their stream that I must have no friends for getting a 4K with a meme build.
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I don't get it, tbh.
People complain it requires no skill and is not conditional, yet 90% of the time the survivor dead hards in the middle of nowhere which accomplishes nothing or they dead hard too close to a window or pallet causing them to miss the timing for fast vault or pallet drop.
Some survivors even try to dead hard through you which is easy to counter as well.
I generally respect Dead Hard users who use it well to extend a chase, because most survivors don't know how to do that. And frankly I don't think I've ever lost a game because someone Dead Harded either.
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@Demogorgeouse said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2147541#Comment_2147541
He didnt evenirritate me lol im jus saying bhvr shoukd fix tunneling. Idrc abt the facecamping cos my team made it out
What is there to fix? The killer got 1 kill and depipped. The other 3 survivors got to escape.
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@Cornpopers_Evan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2147473#Comment_2147473
Yeah, I believe they want to see who the community votes for first then they'll slowly reveal the other three over the coming weeks depending on how popular they are. So, basically, most popular shown off first to the least popular shown off last kinda ordeal. That's just my opinion though.
They did this before with map reworks.
Make a poll about which realm people wanted to see reworked, then revealed both next week.
There's no way all 4 aren't getting an update at the same time given previous times they've done these polls.
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@Kebek said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2147143#Comment_2147143
Not to intrude into the heated discussion happening here but I got to ask. What skillful action do you do exactly to counter huntress ?
Her biggest counter is to abuse high wall loops that you tight loop so that her wind up doesn't allow her to throw at you, basically you use loops that favor you because low wall loops are free hit for her just like slinger. Not much all that different skilful interaction there, you just force M1 or make a 50/50 guess at pallet if she's going to throw.
If you're in the open or just a bit out of position so that she has time to throw, she's much harder to dodge as good huntress who know how large the hatchet hitboxes are won't miss you right, that's just her missing, not you dodging. At least I never see any survivors actually dodging mid thrown hatchet without predicting good huntresse's shot before it's thrown.
The biggest difference between these two in terms of chase counterplay is literally that slinger has more chances to shoot and outplay even the high wall loops thanks to the fast ADS forcing more predictions then huntress does. You do the same vs both, stay out of loops that favor them and gain as much distance as possible while prediction their shots.
Also Deathslinger has 1 shot vs Huntress 5. Meaning he misses a shot and he has to reload giving you time to get distance.
Huntress can miss a shot and start up another hatchet.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2146870#Comment_2146870
...such as? A D A D spam and saying a quick prayer?
I agree that not every killer needs map pressure and that variety is good, but a 1v1 chase power that all but ignores survivor skill is not healthy either. I would not have no problem getting shot by him if I had a reasonable opportunity to counter it. In practice, your only option is basically to hope he's bad.
Huntress is a model killer in this regard. She's solid in the 1v1 despite having basically no stealth, 110% speed, and a hefty charge time before her hatchets can be thrown too fast to dodge. This is what DBD should be striving for: reasonably powerful killers with a high skill cap that give skilled players options to counter them. Chases should always be interactive.
Use walls to block LoS, keep distance as it's harder for Deathslinger successfully reel you from a distance, fake your direction (i've caused a few Deathslingers to miss by pretending to take a window or pallet), when take advantage of safe pallets and pre-drop unsafe pallets when he's not in LoS. If Deathslinger has missed his shot take advantage of the reload time to get distance or move to a safer area.
All chases are interactive. Some killers just demand different actions from the survivors to avoid being caught out. Complaining that Deathslinger is uninteractive just means you don't want to adapt to play against his power.
If at the end the day the only take away is that YOU can only escape a bad Deathslinger, then you just need to get better.
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I don't think 4.6.2 will exist. It'll be week 3 from the PTB start next week and that's the earliest the mid chapter will release.
So I'm positive at this point the next patch will be midchapter.
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@jakesotto said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2146807#Comment_2146807
It's not a matter of "complaining" about a killer and begging for them to be nerfed, it's the fact that slingers power is poorly designed and quite honestly unfair in 1v1. The argument "but he lacks map pressure" is all the more reason he needs a rework. He needs map pressure. He needs counterplay other than hoping he commits to his shot and misses it.
It's not unfair. There are things you can do to help avoid getting shot.
Also not every killer needs map pressure. We don't need every killer to have the same strengths.
Variety is good. Deathslinger isn't overpowered and just because you don't like getting shot by Deathslinger does not make it a problem.
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There's a few things that can help but like playing against spirit in general there's no guarantee any of it works.
Crouching reduces your noise which can fool spirits into thinking you are farther away.
Spirit's phase duration is limited so strong windows and pallets with enough distance from when she starts the phase will force her to stop phasing. Of course some addons make this much harder.
You can use ambient noise (like the barrels on fire on some maps or repaired gens) to help hide your own sounds.
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Because there's nothing really wrong with him.
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The only thing is I don't see how the devs would figure out which blight players are using the exploit.
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Perks/Addons that have gamebreaking bugs should be disabled by the devs like they do with maps. If they don't have a system to do this, they should work on.
As for exploits like JFlick or Stretched Res, there's no real way for BHVR to know if someone is using them as they are done outside of the game.
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@Blackandwhiteroses said:
Honestly think the ds nerf is fine. The only thing I think would make it a little less bad is if they made it so you can open chests without it deactivating. It should also be activate for a little longer than 1 minute. Cause if you aren't doing objectives for that long, then it's fine. Maybe 90 seconds would be okay enough.
I Also feel you shouldn't be able to 99 doors, though, so like you can't 99 a totem clean... maybe I'm just dumb.
Opening a chest does not deactivate DS.
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No matters what the devs do, someone will find something to call boring and changing things just because people find something boring to face in a pvp game is not exactly high priority imo.
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@FrenziedRoach said:
I always figured it was his ADS spam. In open ground he can more or less just tap aim to fool survivors into weaving which makes it easier for him to catch up. They more or less have to weave because if they just shift-W, he's going to take the shot and there's almost no time to react when that thing goes off.
His power totally justifies his 110% speed.
Honestly ADS spam doesn't matter when they are out in the open, because survivors either weave trying to dodge out your quickscope in which case you just run behind them or they try to run away in a straight line and you quickscope them.
But being caught out in the open should be a death sentence against any killer, because you got caught out in an area with no safety.
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There's no reason to have profile comments open to public tbh.
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@KillerKiryu47 said:
Yep i 100% regret coming back to see how this post went.
Already knew these forums were dominated by killer mains but this just confirms it. Literal photo evidence that keys are utterly useless and yet you all still find a way to pin the blame on something else and claim they are still overpowered while whining old moris need to come back. These ######### forums never change.
Wait you are trying to say keys are useless because you had a game where you and your team played poorly and you only got an escape because of a key.
That's not right. If anything it shows how dumb keys can be giving players who did nothing to deserve an escape an escape.
Emblems are not the issue people have with keys.
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Survivors just need to learn to do gens when a killer is camping. If it's a bad camp, survivors should have no issues getting gens done.
If it's a good camp where the killer is able to pressure the hook and gens, well that's just him playing smart.
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@KillerKiryu47 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2138457#Comment_2138457
It's always survivor's fault with you guys.
I was playing with a friend and the 2 other survivors were playing like trash and throwing. There was no time at all to do gens because of that, and a key was the only way out at that point. I play the game just fine, stop trying to pin blame on me just so you can keep bitching that keys are broken. They're just bad in general.
No where did I say keys were broken. Just that depipping with a key escape shouldn't happen without survivors playing poorly.
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Well the emblems kind of suggest you didn't play that well yourself.
Silver Lightbringer - Normally when you get silver it means you were chased a lot and got points from your teammates doing gens, but you have bronze evader. Means you only did at most a single gen and if you weren't getting chased based on evader emblem then you should have more.
Gold Unbroken - Means you went to dying state at least once this game. Which with bronze evader means you aren't doing a good job at buying time by keeping the busy for a while.
Bronze Benevolent - So I'm pretty certain the default emblem is silver. Which means to get bronze you have to unhook a survivor unsafely or let a survivor die on hook without rescuing them.
A key escape should very easy be at least a black pip. The embelms you have shared with the screenshot kind of suggest that you weren't playing that well to begin with.
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While I could understand the idea behind Deathslinger's build and it sadly didn't work out once for him. I really don't understand what Coconut was actually going for with his considering he wasn't playing in the way you would assume considering the perks he brought. Also Coconut probably could have won as he was putting pressure on the entire survivor team at multiple points, but kept giving them breathing room to reset.
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You lose a pip because you got caught and died on first hook while not doing much else.
Does it suck to lose a pip because you got camped, sure.
It just means you have to get better at losing the killer.
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I don't think the devs need to ban people for bugged perks. They just need to disable perks/addons when they are broken in a way that hurts the game. They already do so for maps with gamebreaking issues.
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There's a super secret tech you can use that makes the perk do nothing.
Don't get found for 30 seconds.
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I don't think it's toxic, but this was the only yes option.
They just need to make it so survivors can't switch characters in the lobby like killers. There's almost no reason you would need to switch characters in the lobby screen outside of using the last second switch to put the character with the item you didn't want to give the killer time to see and decide if he wanted to bring something to deal with it.
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There really aren't any perks that actually specifically counter certain killers.
Calm Spirit yes prevents Doctor from finding you with screams when he static blasts, but you still gain a tier of madness. He can still find you with illusionary doctors or with addons. Illusionary Pallets from Order, Red Stain from Discipline, and Aura reading from Restraint all make it easier for Doctor to keep track of you.
As for spine chill, sure they hurt stealth killers a bit more. But any killer that lacks mobility will get hurt by spine chill because of the head start warning spine chill gives.
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@supersonic853 said:
Posted this in a thread yesterday. Tldr billys throne has been taken by oni and bubba. Overheat sucks so bad.
The billy in otz video never overheated. I don't think overheat is the issue with billy right now.
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Unless the survivor who got camped went down immediately at the start of the game, gens should already be getting done by the time a killer hooks the 1st survivor.
If the killer is going to camp then you guys should already be at 3 gens lefts.
If you get into a situation where the killer can camp a survivor at 5 gens, then your team already messed up.
At best a camping killer should only leave with at most 2 kills. Anything more than that means the survivors failed to capitalize on the camp. Now there are exceptions to this. Camping a hook surrounded by a 3 gen is a valid strategy and shouldn't lose the killer the game.
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@brokedownpalace said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2134152#Comment_2134152
I don't think the Brand New Part nerf was tested in a PTB but that might have been before they started PTBs or I could be wrong altogether.
I wasn't around for original BNPs, but I imagine the BNP fix is similiar to the Mori fix we got. It's a balance change towards one thing that wouldn't need pbe testing to check for bugs.