Bran
Bran
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- Bran
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Jane I guess.
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What's the alternative? Barely being able to chase a survivor through minutes of looping?
Anyway, continuing to pile more and more stuff to stop this will lead to more and more people not playing.
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I'd pass on that. Too much power to the player.
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I don't see why not. Even with the downsides, I'd say sure why not. I doubt I'd pay attention to them most of the time anyways.
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Having seen the skin, I think it's kinda cool.
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Biggest problem is survivor(s) going to contest the unhook in view of the killer. A single survivor is more manageable, but multiple isn't as much so.
If this effect works then if survivors enter the area the effect lessens. Makes it so it puts them in this situation "you have endurance, get the unhook or lose it".
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3220611#Comment_3220611
All the previous Christmas and Blighted skins are also for certain time periods, particularly the Christmas skins, and yet they aren't timed exclusives.
You know what, I forgot about that.
Further clarification is needed then 🤔.
That does suck and there isnt any reason. This is pretty uncharacteristic of me, but I kinda wanna see what they do with that.
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I'd say long as the skins return the next Halloween it all good. Probably then with the shard price tag as well.
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Because they are specifically made for the Halloween season which is usually between October into November.
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Tunnelling isn't so cut and dry. There is actual definition to it than just hitting the person who just got unhooked.
My own definition of tunnelling is "Specifically targeting a player for a specific reason and ignoring anything else, most likely to be toxic or mean overall".
An example is going after someone who has ttv in their name since they have ttv in their name. Someone who you believed was toxic i.e. flashlight as pallet or t-bagging.
Not an example is punishing an unhook if they were unhooked in close proximity to you. Essentially a bad unhook. Or going after someone who has already been hooked instead of someone who hasn't if you can choose between 2 people to chase when neither has been the previous chase.
Tunnelling or sometimes re-hooking can be done organically and isn't inherently toxic as is.
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Long as the skins are available next Halloween seems alright to me.
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Eh, it's whatever. It makes sense the skins are only available since they are specifically halloween. Maybe we'll see em next year, maybe not.
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Well if it's eventually, then it isn't currently. Also the fact these outfits are specifically halloween themed.
I'm not defending it or anything, just saying. They might be back next Halloween or something. Or I'm looking too much on the bright side and they won't be available again, which is what bhvr has said wouldn't happen, but idk.
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I'll skip the mocking and just say we should be using this energy to not be buying the battlepass.
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I dont know how I'd equate them, but...
Gen rushing is just as it sounds. Kind of a disregard for other objectives, such as healing, saving teammates, cleansing hexes or any other objective they could have.
Its on a similar playing field with tunneling and camping. Both disregard objectives to focus on a single one basically.
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If I ever catch it slacking on the streets it's game over.
But yeah...won't catch me playing much.
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Probably not. Not even for the obvious reasons, but for the idea of "what would he even do in-game"?.
Far I know he doesn't have much uniqueness rather than flight which probably is no go anyway.
Yeah....
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Very true, tunneling and also camping aren't all black and white. There are legit and valid reason for doing so.
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I can see where your coming from. Many add-ons just buff said item/power.
So we could remove or decrease the amount of generic ones (or even combine some of them) and keep the unique ones.
This could give us less cluttered bloodwebs letting us get what we want more often. Which gives us more value for our BP.
It could however give the strongest add-ons or items more often, allowing for more aggravating gameplay.
Not the worst thing basically.
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Well it was bound to happen sooner or later I suppose.
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I guess that'd be okay. No real reason against it.
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Not the argument I'd go with, but your not entirely wrong on the tunnelling and camping.
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That's what I've been thinking, I just hadn't said it. So yeah I agree.
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You do have a point, it really isn't the fairest thing, but can't do much so really nerf it.
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I do agree, but even if that isn't the change to it, the kick should still count and it should get damaged with any other perks that it would proc.
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It may not impact too much, but it is too much to be added in. I could say 45 seconds after the person recovers to the point where they need help (that would let UB remain the same at least).
That is obviously my biggest nuisance that it's just 45 second after being downed.
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@SmarulKusia said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3210229#Comment_3210229
? Flashlights have been a concern because they used to be OP before. I am criticising BHVR trying to play this change off as 'we are trying to be more accessible because it causes seizures!' When they fail to target other things that people have been triggered by such as Clown's effects, or Plague's vomit.
I think you are misunderstanding my post, mate.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3210312#Comment_3210312
I agree. The point of my post is that I'd rather them just be up-front and honest, rather than trying to hide behind something for why they are making changes.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3210347#Comment_3210347
It's still nerfed then Lol, the fact that it's nerfed is not a big deal or the point of my post tho
Yeah they need to be up front. Not doing so makes them look even more crummier.
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3210320#Comment_3210320
Should be 3min, no slow down when there is a down.
If make the end game so hard for survivor, there is no point to attempt securing, just open gates and out.
Alright alright, fine 3 minutes would be okay too.
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@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3209639#Comment_3209639
It's only tunneling if you follow through with it. I'm a fairly nice killer. I don't tunnel, I hook then leave the hook area so they can get unhooked, and I almost always give hatch. If I end up downing someone that was recently hooked, I leave them there for someone to heal them. If no one comes for them, I just pick up and drop until they wiggle out and let them reset.
I prefer everyone have fun as a whole. Just my style.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3209671#Comment_3209671
Accurate! Protection hits are good. Just sometimes you can take advantage of that. I play both sides, but mostly play killer these days.
Geez. That reply to wham makes you look mad toxic in my eyes.
Either way, it's a smart strat.
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I think it should become a flat 2 minutes.
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Is that an excuse? Sure.
Is it a bigger for killer? No. You dont need to constantly click to blind a killer in any scenario.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3209910#Comment_3209910
Why you did it is irrelevant. You can dress up tunneling however you want, but at the end of the day it's still tunneling.
It's very clear what tunneling is. Any deliberate choice to target the recently unhooked survivor is tunneling, regardless of the why.
Whether it's to get someone out early, or to ruin someone's game, or because of some larger strategy, or because of a mistake another survivor made, or because they bodyblocked with Endurance.
Yeah sure, we can say that I won't deny it, but if we talk it being an issue then it just ain't it.
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@Gandor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3209912#Comment_3209912
I respectfully disagree. Imagine survivor could hold 1 specific button to freeze himself and after say 5s of using it, he would transform into stone. And after 5s of holding it again, he would revert. If this was possible - how many survivors would try to loop killer? And how much fun would be in playing the game? If somebody didn't (ab)use this mechanics, he would loose way more. But where is the fun in using this thing? And do you thing forum would have less or more threads like camping/tunneling to remove this from the game?
I mean this example is extreme. But it illustrates the point nicely. I think.
I don't think we need extreme, but simple and common. Maybe a little extreme to even it out, but ya know.
Makes things easier.
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@Gandor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3209890#Comment_3209890
Yes.
The specifics are open to discussions. But the idea should be clear. If it's easy and not risky, then it should not win you the game.
The logic to that is flawed. Either easy or risky both can be legitimate ways to win. The same logic can be applied to both sides.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3208588#Comment_3208588
The definition of tunneling accounts for all instances in which a recently unhooked survivor is downed and placed back on the hook. The situation you're talking about is called "Survivor-induced tunneling", and the blame, more often than not, falls on the teammate.
We all know what tunneling actually is at this point, and killers know if they tunneled or if they didn't. There's no need for any mental gymnastics to justify it. If you tunneled, there's no need to justify it. If you didn't, there's no need to defend yourself against baseless accusations from salty survivors.
As I said, your definition defines it that way. Mine does not.
If I re-down a recently unhooked. I did that because it was what I thought was a good or best play in the situation...
(It isn't the hard tunneling I'll attribute to any complaints or issues. For the most part at least.)
...Not because I wanted to get them out of the game or ruin their game, which is what I'd account to tunneling.
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@Gandor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3208734#Comment_3208734
I never said all of them. But I will insist, that most of them ARE. At least in my MMR range. For this reason going for the safe unhook is not possible. There is no time given by the killer to unhook safely. Killer will never leave hooked survivor to create such an opportunity.
And I agree that this is killer playing killer. Because camping and tunneling is so easy, yet so beneficial. But that is also not fair. Something boring and easy should not be also optimal way how to play the game. The design of game that makes it all of these 3 things easy, beneficial and boring makes it bad design that needs to be addressed by developers (not by killers. But by developers). So again. There needs to be something done to make the tactics risky or hard to pull off (because making it low reward is not really possible under base premise of this game), so that this tactics is NOT OPTIMAL way to play killer...
So to restate it for N-th time... Developers should hard nerf camping and tunneling. One way how to do this is to give much better tools to defend from camping and tunneling (to address camping - make more perks like reinsurence and buff it. To address tunneling give 10s 150% speed to unhooked person without any collision or anything until conspicuous action is done - that way survivor makes it hard to tunnel him right of hook, but said survivor can't abuse it in any way because he can't do gens or bodyblock for teammates).
Thats a strong ideal and a near delusion on some of the reasonings, which I guess boils down to it being too easy and beneficial and so therefore it should be hard nerfed.
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Anime would be hard because your essentially making it not an anime, but more live action so it can fit into the games design and art style.
Collaborations could look better since they'd essentially just be the characters in costumes. Which is likely to make said characters look odd, but it would work though.
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@Gandor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3208475#Comment_3208475
It is tunneling. And it will happen 100% of times when killer facecamps or proxy camps. The alternative is to leave that survivor to die on the hook. Again - survivor has no way how to "safely unhook". Killer gave 0 opportunity to do so. And I will agree that facecamp is rare. But proxy camp is not. 70% of games killer proxies (keeping himself inside terror radius distance of hook, not patroling gens, only waiting for unhook to happen and zoning out survivors trying to go for said unhook) - so that he can tunnel efficiently (droping any chase that he gained by proxy camping survivor).
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3208422#Comment_3208422
That is just plain wrong at least at my MMR range. Killers returning to the hook is so common, that I see the behavior you mentioned like in 10% of games instead of 90%. It's much more likely killer is waiting for unhook in close vicinity so that he can efficiently tunnel that survivor out of game.
Our definition of tunnelling are definitely different. Sparing the lengthy paragraph I had typed. It just isn't a good representation of it.
If the killer is in the position to go back over and re-hook re-down, that's just the killer playing killer. Saying it's unfair is ridiculous. Can't expect special treatment so you can have fun in a pvp game by not being attacked when your an easy target.
It might come as a surprise, but not all killers are facecamping and tunnelling entrepreneurs (it just so happens I am, but that's a coincidence) and not all of them are camping and tunnelling just because they are in the proximity of a hooked survivor.
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@Gandor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3208103#Comment_3208103
Nah. Maps are totally fine. Camp and tunnel is THE problem that is mentioned here all the time MUCH MORE then maps and for way longer time. Maps are way lower prio then camp/tunnel solution
Nah man. Definitely the maps.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3208475#Comment_3208475
It's still tunneling. The unhooked survivor has no choice, the unhooker is likely to do it again because they aren't being punished for it. People just tend to overlook that, since it's the unhooker's fault.
Maybe your definition accounts for punishing a bad hook, but mine doesn't.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3207377#Comment_3207377
Tunneling and Camping are in absolutely no way "vague". Sure, post-game chat you get salty survivors saying the killer camped but that's not really an issue if you didn't camp.
To outright eliminate tunneling, off the record can be buffed to provide a 150% haste bonus for 5 seconds but the survivor loses collision so they can't bodyblock.
Being tunneled out of the game at 5 gens by a killer with mobility is just salt in the wound.
It is definitely vague. You can throw out a single scenario and have 5 people say different answers.
Its like a said, it truly is tunnelling if you aren't specifically targeting that survivor. Punishing a bad unhook with a re-down and re-hook isn't tunnelling.
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@ProfSinful said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3205409#Comment_3205409
The mori change is what's unneeded. As it stands, moris are currently fine and often times no different from carrying someone to the hook in terms of time needed to complete the action (moris range between 7-14 seconds in duration, which is actually less than the average time spent carrying survivors to hook considering the fact that often times you'll find a hook within 1-6 seconds of downing the survivor).
As it stands however, slugging can often be a problem and generally takes away from the fun of the game. That being said, having infinite and unconditional unbreakable in addition to having a buffed unbreakable is incredibly unhealthy for the game and the buff to unbreakable as well as the new slugging mechanic need to be looked at and adjusted. No reason you should be able to just up and pick yourself up without having bled out a certain amount (20-25% of the bleedout bar would be fair. At that point, you've already been slugged for a minute and there's no excuse for that, ever).
Reasonable.
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@GannTM said:
So what you’re saying is, Shrek can be a killer in DBD?
Shrek is love. Shrek is life.
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Its a very unneeded change entirely.
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@jajay119 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3208100#Comment_3208100
It's everything to do with entitlement, if you refuse to realise the survivor is better at looping you than you are at catching them and continue to pursue, its no surprise the gens pop because you're refusing to come and chase People who suck at looping.... like me lol
Except has nothing to do with being the better looper. Some loops you physically cannot beat them at.
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Slugging for the 4 man is okay. Especially if the survivor downed would be in their last hook. The safer way to get it.
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@Roaroftime said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3207398#Comment_3207398
usually is though 99% of the time
Possibly inflation.
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@mizark3 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3207447#Comment_3207447
Actually as I said I like rewarding riskier plays. The riskier play for Survivors is grouping up. I would reverse gen efficiency (except on solo gens). That way it would less efficient solo, same efficiency duo (as current solo per person), and more efficient trio/quad. When the Killer is able to disrupt a gen, they now get rewarded with disrupting multiple people off of gens, and the Survivors get normal/more gen speed. High risk high reward. Since 2 people is the minimum for the current efficiency this would naturally slow gen speeds also.
Similarly I would decrease solo medkit speeds (to 66%) and increase altruistic medkit speeds (doubling all altruistic bonuses on medkits, or providing an equal altruistic boost as the universal boost) such that using a medkit on an ally is more time efficient than using it on yourself (travel time not included). I would also have an additional bonus for co-op healing, giving a 33% multiplicitive boost so a duo basekit heal takes 6s from the current 8s. Again, if the Killer can disrupt the heal then they disrupt 3 people, providing massive value. With my changes the basic brown medkit would take 24s solo, 10.66s altruistic (or 21.32 Surv seconds when accounting for the 2 people).
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3207522#Comment_3207522
The Plague game is a perfect example of bad design. She knew she could get away with camping (or facecamping, I don't know the degree for you) rather than chasing the first Survivor in the area, or even toggling. Since you didn't say she got anyone else that leads me to believe she cheesed your timer for the kill rather than used skill to down the other Survivors allegedly swarming hook. She was rewarded for being bad enough to not get a follow up down, not good for getting 1 or 2 more. Similarly Bubba knows he can get away with facecamping out entire hook states. Preventing unhooks for the entire duration of a stage shouldn't be the default or the go to strategy. A surgical 15s punish for a late rescue, sure. But not waiting out the full 60s.
In the Rebecca Bubba example I don't know the timeframe, but the 2nd hook on her sounds like the fruits of camping, and the 3rd hook (if the DC didn't prevent it) was a bad teammate. The third was fair, but how were you close enough to not find someone and returned to hook just in time to chase the Rebecca? That in the vast majority of circumstances isn't "punishing the unhook" that is camping then tunneling the Rebecca. You could fairly punish the unhook if that weren't the case by getting an easy down on the rescuer.
I am confused how you think Survivors "stall(ing) for that chase is lame", but you don't think the same of the abusive scenarios of tunneling or camping. It most certainly is lame being camped out an entire hook state (or 2). It most certainly is lame being immediately chased once rescued off of hook. Both vaulting to evade the killer in chase and camping/tunneling are players accomplishing their goals, that is Survivors surviving and Killers killing, but there should be better checks in place to prevent those worst case scenarios like window blocks/camping/tunneling.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3207557#Comment_3207557
For proper MMR, 50/50 is what you are supposed to go for, with each side being lumped together (aka team MMR), but this 60% is probably meant to account for noob Survivors padding those kill counts. Also for Killers being able to facecamp a 1k minimum if done correctly, padding the kill count despite being a net loss. If the game used team based MMR, averaging the Survivors then adjusting their individual MMR after the win/draw/loss came in (based on the total kills, not individualized), then I think it would work much better. I think the main reason we have this flawed MMR is because part of the advertising is something to the effect of "Survive together or don't". So to accommodate a solo victory or selfish gameplay they have to not actually commit to calling the Survivors a team in the MMR, even though they need to in order for it to work properly.
Plague was able to stall since she ran a survivor away and saw the Feng run over. Plague got to hook fist and Feng didn't want to risk the down or hook trade despite 2 gens left and she hadn't been hooked and was injured. It was a logical choice, not abuse.
As for Rebecca. A gen popped behind me, but when I ran over I didn't see anyone and Rebecca was u hooked behind me. The hook was close to a corner and she had ran into the open. An easy down.
Survivors can loop all they want, but being able to loop for so long and be able to go to other loops all at once is pretty lame.
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@jajay119 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3207398#Comment_3207398
But a vast, and increasing ,amount of time they are. Simple as that.
Then again, it is also not. An impass. Doesn't require a change