Blueberry
Blueberry
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3320567#Comment_3320567
Or, someone can just accept that Incapacitated is a really bad status effect and should not exist like this on a Perk like Eruption.
One hit of Eruption is basically half a Gen added. Considering how often it can activate, it is quite easy to see that it is completely overtuned.
You do realize each successful DH is in most cases way more than half a gen added as well right? You’re also getting those more often than an Eruption as well.
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Yeah the stalk limit is just silly.
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This would actually be perfect for dbd! It’s also not the normal vampire people are used to since it’s actually a parasite. Little something different!
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Just make eruption block the gens instead of incapacitated. Boom. Easy. The unfun factor is now removed as they can do other things and it effects swf and solos equally. Technically a weaker version but it’s only a minor nerf.
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Definitely a good start. He needs a lot. Honestly there needs to be some kind of punishment for just having 1 survivor follow him around all game making his traps useless. Running his two Iris feels required currently as they counteract this and also with the rearming makes him more time efficient with how extremely un time efficient he is at base. Their last buffs they gave him were way, way too light handed.
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Dredge 100%
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Irrelevant? No. Underwhelming? Yes. I think they should remove the stalk limit per survivor, reward him more for far away stalks, and finally make t3 have a mini built in endurance and brutal strength.
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I always felt like Torment could do a little more and be easier to apply. For starters his m2 attack should apply Torment itself. This rewards good PH’s but not bad ones.
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Deathslinger is just a boring block LoS as long as you can with little interactivity. Very boring. Hag is just gonna be them picking a 3 gen, hook someone in the 3 gen, then never leave and essentially every single hook save to be a trade for the rest the game. I don’t blame them for this as it’s what you have to do with her, it’s just super boring and non interactive. I’d say huntress and spirit are my favorites to face.
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@Phasmamain said:
I’d gladly lose DH if it means eruption also gets removed
I’d take this deal 100%
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@Firellius said:
Realistically, I think the only applicable info from the patch will be that someone else is going for an unhook, and whether or not they got intercepted. I really don't think this'll result in some huge escape spike.
Which if even applied to only 1 generator is adding almost an extra half an entire gen of completion PER unhook since the other survivor can stay sitting on it. That’s constant gen time of going all the way for the unhook and coming back. Just that, is extremely significant.
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Hooks breaking after killing a survivor is very outdated to me. Bad rng can already create dead zones by default but also having a hook broken permanently just makes it worse. A survivor should never not be able to be hooked without intervention from other survivors, ie body blocking, sabo’ing ect. Picking a survivor up and literally seeing no hooks in range should not be a thing, bad design. This is especially prevalent on indoor maps which are notorious for bad hook/lack of hook placement.
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3318940#Comment_3318940
For instance, why can the garden have nearly 20 pallets on an outdoor map with plenty of tiles and a good main building? ######### is up with that.
Oh yeah Garden is at the top of the list. Extremely unbalanced map.
Needs a much smaller size, less pallets and nerfs to the main building.
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While the game could use changes there are many, many more maps that are much more problematic.
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@lagosta said:
Buffing numbers is not a rework. Some of the proposed changes are just straight-up buffs that can turn perks obnoxious to play against or just do nothing at all.
I'd advise you to focus on interesting perks that fall short of fulfilling their purpose.
Ex: Any Means Necessary allowed anyone to reset a pallet but if in a team without comms, any user would have to follow the killer around to know which pallets were used but not broken. The aura reading effect was suggested in these forums to add to increase the viability of the perk without buffing it for SWFs by just decreasing the CD.
How to rework one of the perks you mentioned:
Spies From the shadows
- What seems to be its original purpose? Locate stealthy survivors close by.
- Does another perk with a similar purpose performs better? Yes, Whispers.
- Best case scenario? Indoors map where you cannot see startled crows and audio obstruction can interfere with the killer's tracking.
- Worst case scenario? Open maps, where the benefit of the perk is extremely diminished.
I don't know if you ever played with Spies, but it can become really spammy. Loud noise notifications popping up every 5 seconds can be really annoying and if you just remove the CD and make it map-wide, you'll drive a bunch of players away from the perk based on user experience alone.
Suggestions on how to make the perk better include: making crows startle regardless of the close survivor's speed (causing crouching to become ineffective), making the startled crow follow the survivor (similar to AFK crows) for a few seconds.
I actually disagree on your premise. Most of these perks are perks that are interesting and fall short of their purpose. These changes didn’t have to be all reworks, lots of perks only needed number changes. Which perks are obnoxious or not enough? Without specifics we can’t fix them. Finally Spies is very bad. My change would not make it spammy on the killer as we’ve replaced the noise notification with aura reading. The perk would still be awful with the changes you recommended. I don’t think keeping the perk in its “intended” purpose is even a good idea as it isn’t a very good one.
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I don't really have any qualms about facing either killer using any addons so I don't see the issue. Is it a harder game? Of course. They've all been totally winnable if we play well. Never have I been like wow that guy was actually bad and only won because of those addons, just rarely if at all a thing.
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Oddly enough I’ve had a ton of success on Pig. She’s absolutely low tier and many would even stick her in bottom 5, she does need a lot of changes. That said I think I’m at around a 50+ win streak so far with her and still going at high mmr.I don’t try to tunnel anyone out and I don’t even try for a 3 gen. The only gen regression I run is Jolt and even that’s not required as my first 30 wins of this streak didn’t even use a single regression. You get a ton of built in slow down from traps. I run double search slow down and pressure boxes and gens simultaneously. The boxes taking so long that making them let go to restart even once costs them a ton of time. Pressuring like this gets me at least 1 head pop every other game. The games without head pops you get a ton of free hooks/downs as people are so desperate to get the trap off that they make bad plays or literally can’t make plays when their team needs them at all. Jolt is the flex perk in my list that you can swap out, I run Corrupt, deadlock and stbfl as my others which I consider locked perks. STBFL is a star and makes swf trying to force body block hook trades impossible.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3318538#Comment_3318538
It's incredibly under-rated.
This would be suggesting that Brutal Strength give a 45% buff to kick speed if it were proposed last year.
Too much imo, especially on maps without many pallets. It might be balanced on The Game, probably not on other maps though.
Well most maps with low pallet count are low because they are much larger maps or with stronger window loops. The amount of time using BS and not using BS saves in a chase is quite small. Rarely do I ever see that getting even remotely close to saving me as much time as another regression would. Were probably just not gonna agree though but that’s okay! Not sure why you’d stop there, I’d love for you to look at the rest of them.
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@GensByDaylight said:
I like the majority of these changes, and I belive that they would make some bad perks used more often. After reading all of them, I wonder if Coup de grace could be stacked with unrelenting to allow the killer to lunge around the map quickly.
Some of the perks like predator would still never be used, and need some further buffs though.
Ah that’s a very good point! How about Coup just giving a much smaller lunge increase but it’s permanent and slowly gets larger per gen completed. Ie not large enough to make spamming efficient? That’s a fair point for Predator, any ideas to make it better?
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@HugTechLover said:
I actually like a lot of the changes. I will say though… as a blight main, I would be able to weaponize some of these into some crazy strong builds. Especially with a third seal change like that, mixed with how fast a good blight can end chase.
But pretty sick post! When you gonna do survivor edition?
Thanks! We can work on fixing any that you see as problematic, what we’re the issues specifically? I tend to try and push hexes to be very strong as they need a very immediate impact on the game for how fast they can be gone. High risk/high reward basically. I’ll hopefully post the survivor one this week if I’ve got the time, it takes quite a while to write this all up lol.
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@Maelstrom808 said:
Lethal Pursuer and BBQ are base kit in most of my killers. Knowing exactly where to go to immediately put pressure on survivors is worth more to me than a 2nd or third slowdown. In addition, you often catch sight of the rescuer which is a solid target if you want to try to force two hook states off of a single hook without camping.
I'd personally like to see a thing with BBQ where for every "first hook" on a survivor, it would reduce the minimum range on the aura reading by a bit.
Oh I love your idea for BBQ actually! I’ll update to your idea when I’m back at the computer! It seems like a good QoL change and further encourages fair play.
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@Thralfazuz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/358877/perk-reworks-killer-edition
I would love that coup de grace gave stacks for hooking instead of losing gens
on Territorial Imperative I would make like wire tap but for killer like for example after kicking a gen you can see survivor aura unless they repair x amount of gen progress or leave the area
Ohh I love both these ideas! Will update when I’m at the computer.
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@Xernoton said:
Some very good ideas but also some less good ones. Brutal Strength and Enduring should not be touched. They are completely fine and increasing their strength would only make them disgusting. The Hubris buff is unnecessary as well. Its a niche perk but not every perk needs to be universally strong.
Also, this might be my addiction speaking but Shadowborn doesn't need a buff. It does its job just fine. Just make it base kit already or add an option turn it on/off in the menu.
I find both BS and Enduring to be weak which is why they’re rarely ran. How often are they going to save you more time than just stacking more regression perks? Very rarely. Hubris is rarely getting you value. You get maybe one or two procs (and that’s if you even get value from those procs) and then they pre drop everything hence why we don’t see it.
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@Pulsar said:
I read up until Brutal.
Brutal was also buffed during the shake up. It doesn't need anything else, it's good.
It’s still quite a bad perk which is why no one runs it.
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@LuthirFontaine said:
I haven't read them all but you could have saved time saying buff every perk :-p
I actually did say this! At the beginning I said this was all for weaker perks getting buffs and not for perks needing nerfs.
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@RainehDaze said:
Yeah, a lot of the chase perks are... really easily played around once you're aware they exist. And with BBQ, it's one of those aura perks that currently go "if you don't have lethal pursuer, it starts activating while you're stuck in an animation and because you can't turn hooks around, have fun if the map is behind you".
I disagree with changing Fire Up to be a game-start one, though; especially not when it loses a stack on every gen. If you can't pressure Survivors immediately, you'll drop to current maximum Fire Up range before, what, the third chase? The idea of a perk getting stronger as gens are complete is fine... it just needs to not be "5 gens and now you do things 0.4s faster".
Spies from the Shadows: 36 meter range for a visual queue and a 5 second cooldown ---> Map wide, aura reveal of that survivor for 8 seconds and no cooldown.
The cooldown is there so you don't get constantly spammed by bird notifications, not to nerf it. xD
I totally see your point on Fire Up and agree. Let’s just change the percentage to actually matter more then. For Spies if it’s not aura reading instead of a location ping it can’t be annoying so we don’t need the cooldown :) like most everything else?
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@YOURFRIEND said:
I had the weird thought last night that the knight is kind of just better clown with the upcoming changes. Speed boost after a delay. Lethal anti loop you don't have to aim.
Knight is a worse Clown. He takes longer to get the hit than Clown does.
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@Stabby_Widdershins said:
Honestly, just make it so Survivors don't get the speed boost off his yellow tonic.
The facts that they do is a horrible idea made because BHVR thinks any Killer change or buff needs to have some sort of Survivor buff as well. Plus the horrid idea that every Killer power needs some sort of easy-to-use built-in counter.
Sadly, that mindset does not work in reverse.
This.
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The inconsistency of scourge hooks is why I don’t like running them. I mean honestly would scourge hook perks be overpowered if every hook was a scourge hook? The answer is no. Most of them are just meh to alright with the only real good one being PR.
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Not sure where all these unwinnable 3 gen matches are but playing literally 6-8 hours a day I’ve yet to really ever see them. More often than not it’s a skill issue. Just regression perks isn’t winning them the game with a 3 gen and multiple eruption procs means the survivors are getting downed a lot, ie getting outplayed a lot. They also had to mess up in the first place letting the 3 gen happen to begin with anyway. I play entirely solo queue as well.
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I think that stems from a bigger issue which is tons of bad/useless addons and offerings. A lot of them need improvements.
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It just needs to be do more for a hex.
Make it also block all fast vaults as well.
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A perfect change.
The perk is however very weak and still needs buffs in general to be comparable to No Way Out. Maybe at max stacks it adds like 45 seconds to the gates. Not as much time as No Way Out is adding, but also add that is causes gates to now regress at a very slow rate if not opened.
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3316799#Comment_3316799
I mean they did it with Eyrie of Crows, who's to say they wont start doing it with other maps?
5 years of us telling them, them not doing it, and then continuing to release new maps that are too big as well. I'm more pessimistic from the track record. I hope you're right though.
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@Dionysus42 said:
Funny how the hud changes are somehow both 'bringing solo up to SWF so we can balance more consistently' AND 'just a qol change that won't change kill rates'.
Literally my thoughts exactly lol
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The issue isn't maps, the issue is map design. If most maps were actually balanced well the offerings wouldn't really matter.
Also, it's quite silly that all map offerings are weighted equally when its a 4v1 game. The killers map offering should be weighted more than 1 survivors.
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I generally don't pay attention to who's been hooked how many times on purpose. I just go after whoever I run into and would be quicker to down as well as create the most pressure. Sometimes that just happens to be the same person and the amount of times you still get called a tunneler is ridiculous. The term "tunneler" is extremely stretched in definition.
Making a bad call and deciding to risk healing under hook? Still a tunneler.
Rescuing a person off hook when I'm still nearby and hiding so that the only person I see is the unhooked one? Still a tunneler.
Instead of healing they work on pushing gens faster while injured? Still a tunneler.
Ever downing the same person twice in a row regardless of any circumstance whatsoever? Yup! Tunneler!
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He's not underrated, he's very bad.
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As always map design is the games number 1 issue.
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They should start by reworking and shrinking lots of maps. That's the biggest issue.
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Entity block for the same duration instead, nothing else is needed.
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3316653#Comment_3316653
Whoops, not Discordance, it's Dissolution I've been running. BBQ and Discordance would be a weirdly redundant combo.
With Plague, any aura read on top of black incense seems overkill. You already have that + Lethal, why get more?
For the meme's. I feel like if my intent was actually winning I wouldn't be messing with the whole aura thing in the first place.
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3316581#Comment_3316581
Or both. Both is good.
I could probably swap out Shadowborn and do Lethal/BBQ/NWtH/Discordance (or STBFL), I've been having fun with that. OTOH, I like the FOV.
Pretty nasty stacking all the aura readings on Plague with Black Incense too lol
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Sounds great to me.
Some additionals:
She shouldn't have a lullaby as a stealth killer, it defeats the entire point.
No global notification on tv teleports. Ruins lots of potential mind games and outplay potential. The survivors should be asked to pay attention to and be aware of tv locations, that isn't asking much.
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3316451#Comment_3316451
But how else can I amuse myself by heading in the survivors' direction and pretending I don't know exactly where they're hiding only to spin around and say hi?
Yeah that is fun lol. I find lots of that fun with NWtH
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Way overrated perk in my opinion. The initial aura reading to me is barely above worthless. With enough game knowledge you already know survivor spawns so the information is basically redundant. The only use I see in it is the extended aura reading which is also only really worth the slot with multiple aura perks/addons. Also, Distortion is ran quite often these days countering all its use entirely.
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Yea it should effect killer auras. You’re wanting to nerf Blindness as a status effect which is in most cases already quite weak and undertuned. Blindness as a status effect needs buffs.
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It’s definitely Garden as the next killer torture map. That map is extremely unbalanced and ridiculously large.
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It’s a start but not enough. I think they gave her a few addons that are too strong as well. Unlike many I do think she has counter play, it’s just too small if the nurse is good enough. I’d personally give her a shorter post blink lunge. This makes her just as good if the person is very accurate with their blinks but gives more counter play room if you can juke them a bit. Many times the nurse will be a bit inaccurate with their blink but the post blink lunge is far enough to compensate for the slight bad aiming and still give them the hit. This may sound minor but I think this would actually lead to a lot more missed blink hits.
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And significant buffs at that, small tweaks/buffs aren’t going to be enough for all his issues. Bare minimum the survivors seeing the orb and the range around guards needs to be flat out gone. The survivors are given way too much counterplay for him and takes away any mind game potential he could have. The orb being invisible at a long range doesn’t do anything for him as there’s nothing he can capitalize on from that other than wasting that survivors time except that’s not as relevant as now you’re an m1 killer with no power trying to pressure three other survivors.