AmpersandUnderscore
AmpersandUnderscore
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3546976#Comment_3546976
Perhaps if you get slugged for over a minute or something like that? When it is somewhat obvious you won't get picked up again? But not speed increase as the perk added back then.
I still think the problem was the unlimited uses, not speed.
The entire game revolves around survivor resources being limited and finite, from pallets and chests to medkits. And the only way to 'infinitely' do anything requires another survivor to assist.
I'm generally opposed to adding any perk as 'base kit' to the game. I think my one exception to that right now is that shadowborn should be an accessibility slider option.
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@Tsulan said:
Several streamers are currently attempting to break each others "repair 5 gens + open exit gate + escape" record. Which is below 3 minutes.
This is fine...
And several people are also on killer win streaks that are in the hundreds, if not thousands of games.
Last I saw the win streak records for clown and twins were over 800 games.
This is fine...
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What even is this post?
If you're camping a hook you're just letting the survivors do whatever they want away from the hook (hint: it's gens).
If you aren't camping the hook, are you examining the scenery? Go chase a survivor off of a gen. That's called pressure.
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The PTB testing infinite unbreakable was not because of 'slugging isn't fun'. That PTB was testing the finisher Mori system, where slugging survivors was literally a game winning strategy.
It doesn't take much consideration to think that if you added finisher Mori from that PTB *without* some way for survivors to deal with slugging, that the core game would fundamentally change and hooks would become completely useless. Every single killer would just slug survivors for the win instead. It would be much faster than tunneling, the current 'efficient' strategy.
And even with infinite unbreakable in that test, there were still games where the killer was able to slug all 4 survivors in under 3 minutes to win the game with 0 hooks.
Infinite unbreakable was a bad idea. And the finisher Mori from that PTB was an even worse idea. Neither one should see the light of day ever again.
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There's already a killer that starts the trial with all of their traps, and that's hag. Not saying that they can't share that trait, but think about the gameplay.
Hag hooks their first survivor and spends the next minute setting every trap at the hook.
You can do that with the purple bag for trapper, but the trade off is that those traps can't ever be moved again.
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I honestly doubt it.
BHVR wants killers to actually chase survivors, not sit and camp hooks, gens, or really camp anything else. And the devs seem to not care if the killer is chasing the same survivor 3 times in a row, as long as there's a chase going on.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/391731/please-try-to-prevent-lobby-dodging
Not allowing people to leave lobbies literally is the worst idea.
What if someone needs to get off the game or changes their mind about playing another round?
Why do people think turning matchmaking into a hostage negotiation would fix matchmaking
Just implement the DC penalty if you leave the lobby, 'lose connection' when you see an offering you don't like, as well as disconnecting from the match.
Things happen, and the DC penalty is forgiving enough to allow that one in a while. But people deliberately lobby shopping will quickly ban themselves, and good riddance.
Imo, lobby shopping is worse than intentional disconnect. Dropping from the game ruins the match for 4 other players, but lobby shopping ruins it for 5 other people.
There's a lot that needs to be done to combat lobby shopping, but BHVR currently seems satisfied with both having MMR and allowing players to have a trivial way of disabling that same MMR system to try and game the system.
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@KaTo1337 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3544611#Comment_3544611
Get Nemesis punished? Or Wesker? Or Blight? Or Nurse? Or any other killer?
I agree with the opener. REVERT THIS CRAP, please. Xeno feels so bad now, Im already back at Wesker and Oni (because normal M1-Killers like Freddy are pure garbage vs. Made for this, you need SPEED) with hopes that Xeno will get reverted. If not, this was the last license I bought on release.
Nemi and wesker get slowed by bringing out their power and holding it for any length of time. The wind up is the slow (and Nemi has a recovery as well).
Blight and nurse also have a recovery for missing. Nurse has an actively longer fatigue for a missed attack. You're not only desperate, but seem to lack basic understanding of these killers' powers.
Let's be honest, you got used to the bugged version of xeno's attack that had no wind up *and* no miss penalty, which was clearly not intended. That's all that's happening here.
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3543097#Comment_3543097
I find a good way to buff Hux is emps not complete printing, but requires extra 6-8sec to tap and get emps (then he has an extra minute than the current state). I believe emps is there as basekit slowdown for him, only the slowdown is barely exist because of complete printing.
For turret I think they only need to make each turret station only spawn 1 turret per min. Because I find in 3 Gens situation (survivors cause it), they just can keep get multiple turret at the same station, making Alien no power.
We need killers that not oppressive in chase but with base slowdown. Longer chase is fun for survivors, and longer objective is better for killer.
Its only up to them to balance between the chase strength and basekit slowdown.
We need killers that not oppressive in chase but with base slowdown. Longer chase is fun for survivors, and longer objective is better for killer
This is an incredibly fine line to walk. Getting it wrong is exactly what we have with chess merchant, even after regression nerfs.
Unfortunately you simply can't make the slowdown *too* strong, or it will be the only thing people do. Sadly, 'don't ever chase but kick gens for an hour' is a play style that a lot of killers seem to *want* and will take any opportunity to do it.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3542787#Comment_3542787
Thats not what the current gen rush record attempts look like. Last time i checked, completing all 5 gens, open the gate and exit was possible in 02:57 Minutes. Main mistakes killers made, was to not take corrupt and no way out. As those 2 were the only perks that could partly slow down the record attempts. Not by much though.
Killers defend camping, tunneling, and slugging tooth and nail, in large part because that's how competitive DbD is played.
Competitive survivor DbD is gen rush, comp drop, and run to comp corner.
I'm all for making the game less competitive personally, but the general trend over the past year has been to utterly destroy any aspect of casual play. And for the record, that's for both sides.
But in order to make casual play the focus, they would have to address all of those play styles together.
Almost every person who posts on here wants 'the other side' to be addressed separately while leaving 'their side' with all the sweaty tools. That's never going to work, and it seems highly unlikely that the game will shift away from being hyper competitive by addressing everything.
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@KaTo1337 said:
I loved the message from Friskk in the DBD-Stream yesterday.
"You dont have to 4K to have fun".
Or, in other words:
"Accept that when the survivors just do their job by holding M1 on diffent gens while pre-dropping safe loops you dont have the power to 4K with most of the roster. Accept, that you 4K when the survivors do mistakes, not because you played well".
Regarding your 'in other words':
It's a PvP game. If the killer were able to effectively 4k even when the survivor team played perfectly, that is wildly out of balance.
The entire point of playing versus other players is to capitalize on the other team's mistakes.
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So, one of the arguments for years to about dead hard was that 'being injured isn't risk'.
While I'm glad to hear that attitude might actually be changing, it really feels that whether being injured is 'risky' just depends on whether it involves nerfing the most hated flavor of the month.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3540700#Comment_3540700
So they want the game to be exciting, but not exciting enough that it wouldn't be relaxed?
Let's be completely honest about this particular post. Ruining the game for the other players isn't some kind of collateral damage side effect, it's the point of the play style.
You can't ruin the game for bots that way, which is why that's not an acceptable alternative.
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I haven't seen most of these, but I fall on the other end if the spectrum on one of them.
Flashlights being kill switched is a good thing, and people who were holding games hostage using them this way should be bannable.
I hold the exact same philosophy for holding 3 gens for an hour, like with skull merchant: she should likely be kill switched, and players using her to hold games hostage should be banned.
I feel like holding any other position on this is disingenuous and inconsistent.
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@xEmoGirlxAlexisx said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3539319#Comment_3539319
so u want to see Skull Merchant Players get banned for playing Skull Merchant?
Yeah the Skull Merchant holding a 3 Gen for Hours tactic is annoying but it is valid and not bannable because they dont abuse a Exploit also the Devs are working on it and are going to rework her
That lockers glitch is a Exploit that shouldnt be possible and ppl abuse it to troll the Killer Player and hold him hostag it is cleary Bug Abusing als every1 who is doing this should get perma banned
Nowhere do I say that skull merchant players should be banned in a blanket sense.
But if you're intentionally, repeatedly holding 3 gens for an excessive period of time in matches, without trying to chase or down survivors...that is confirmed to be holding the game hostage. And those players should be banned.
@Peanits said:
If they are making no attempt to down anyone and purely stalling the game by keeping everyone in madness 3, only downing and slugging them if they refuse to move, that would be considered holding the game hostage. We would need to see that they are doing this for a long time, though, not just a couple minutes. The 3 gen strat on its own is not bannable, it only become an issue when it's being used to grief instead of win.
So, like that 'chess player' who went up against team eternal.
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@SleepyLunatic said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3539319#Comment_3539319
Holding 3 gen is annoying but not holding game hostage and not bannable.
dont spread false infos.
Game can atleast still progress there, with the locker exploit the game doesnt progress in any way until the abusers choose to.
Holding a 3 gen for an excessive amount of time with making no attempt to chase or down survivors is taking the game hostage, and can be a bannable offense according to the devs.
@Peanits said:
If they are making no attempt to down anyone and purely stalling the game by keeping everyone in madness 3, only downing and slugging them if they refuse to move, that would be considered holding the game hostage. We would need to see that they are doing this for a long time, though, not just a couple minutes. The 3 gen strat on its own is not bannable, it only become an issue when it's being used to grief instead of win.
I don't have the second link, but this was confirmed more recently as well, specifically in regards to skull merchant in the current game.
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@the_honey_badger said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3539076#Comment_3539076
You are quite literally by definition cheating, it's not intended to never get hit/downed. By using this bug you're gaining an unfair advantage and you're literally able to hold the game hostage if other survivor's do this. By all accounts, it's cheating.
Holding a 3 gen for an hour is also both holding the game hostage and not intended gameplay according to the devs.
Let's hope they roll out bans and hotfixes for both issues as soon as humanly possible.
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3538924#Comment_3538924
The xeno cooldown bug does not hold the game hostage nor is the bug something the player really controls.
The locker + flashlight exploit holds the game hostage and it's something that the player has to intentionally do. You don't just accidentally bug yourself into the locker making yourself invincible.
While I agree that the locker/flashlight issue should be kill switched until it's fixed, your argument implies that 3 genning as skull merchant should also be kill switched as well.
I'm all for both, actually. With game bans for each abusing player.
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@Hanuka5 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3538705#Comment_3538705
If thats the case, lets say the game is at 20 Minutes 3gens left and only 2 survivor, what is stopping the survivors from just hiding (for example in lockers) for the 10 minutes remaining?
On the other side, lets say only 1gen remaining and 20min, now the killer will do everything to protect the last gen for the remaining 10 minutes (how its suppost to be)
The problem is that if survivor "win" or "draw" this way, nothing can stop em from. ATM we see the problem with skullmerchant and some players who play it this way (its annoying AF) with your Idea it would be a solution for every survivor in every game to at least draw it.
I can't ever say this enough:
Gens are not the killer's objective, survivors are.
It's a 'killer' role, not 'saboteur'.
Ideally, you never want to reward a stalemate scenario with a win for either side. You want *less* incentive for anyone to hold the game hostage, not defaulting to a win if you can intentionally drag out the game until it times out.
Simply ending the game with 'current BP for everyone' is at least slightly better than what we have now. Survivors can't physically even come close to maxing the survival category without the escape bonus. The other option is that the server force disconnects all parties with 0bp, and everyone loses equally, which is worse by far.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3536497#Comment_3536497
3% haste is 20% total catch-up for survivor. the haste has similar effect on killer but killer are always playing catch-up. survivor are always ahead of the killer. that is why killer's take longer catch-up because every meter of distance that survivor gets is compounded by itself.
The 20% number is just bullshit. It's just a way to make a pitiful 3% increase sounds scary so it gets nerfed.
In order for this to actually be a valid number, the killer has to deliberately get rid of bloodlust on cooldown *and* never use their power, ever.
You can not break chase with MfT unless the killer is playing the game with their monitor turned off or the survivor is vastly outplaying the killer.
Either way it's a gigantic skill issue, not a perk issue.
Edit: spelling.
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There were some good things in 6.1. Dead hard for distance and DS persisting in end game needed to be removed or changed either way (tho I still think the nerf to 3s DS stun duration was too much).
The critical flaw in the 6.1 changes was the shift from chase based perks like ruin, pop, pain res - which only function if the killer is pressuring survivors and/or getting hooks, to a 'gen kick' meta.
The gameplay turned into dropping chase to kick gens because it was easier to play PvE gen kick simulator than to chase in a PvP game. Even after several nerfs we still have issues with players holding a 3 gen for an hour until the server times out.
I feel like the gen kick meta has had catastrophic long term consequences for the game, even after perk nerfs. It's like certain players figured out they can hold games hostage and technically win, and now even have a killer specialized in doing so, and there's just no going back from that until BHVR can implement their solution.
In the end, what I really miss is the killer mantra of 'gens aren't worth the time to kick' from before 6.1.0. Chase was the most important thing in the game, and that mentality is mostly gone now.
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@appleas said:
Sadako with map wide Condemned gets called out for no skill gameplay.
Alien gets called out for skilled (hitting the tail still needs practice) gameplay
ok
Being in range of your opponent, predicting their actions, and hitting a single button is considered skilled now?
Glad to hear it.
Although it's interesting that when it's a killer ability it's 'skill', but when it's dead hard, it 'takes no effort and is free' for literally years until it gets nerfed into the dirt. Strange how that works out.
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I wouldn't say overpowered, and technically not a perk, but the hemorrhage effect is overkill now. It was buffed in 6.1 to combat healing, but it doesn't need to be as strong anymore now that circle is dead and medkits are heavily nerfed.
It would be nice if perks like resurgence or reactive healing weren't dead in the water simply because of hemorrhage.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3531901#Comment_3531901
the very first version of decisive strike was that whenever a killer pick you up from dying state, you can wiggle off killer's grasp stunning them for 4 seconds. there was no timer, no hook condition, no skill-check. nothing. I am just referencing your comment when you were talking about a perk that makes killer objective 25% longer. it was free 4th hook. later perk was changed to be obesssion perk and then changed again to require unhook and a timer that is more familiar towards today's version of the perk.
I know, I already acknowledged that that version of the perk was unhealthy. I'm only talking about the stun duration on my most recent post, and I've been very clear that I think every other change to the perk has been healthy.
Losing use of the perk when performing a conspicuous actions, disablling in the end game, etc, were all good and healthy changes.
We both agree that those previous versions of ds and thana were both overtuned and unhealthy for the game. We established this earlier.
I'm not sure why you keep coming back as if this is some kind of gotcha, when we've both agreed on this point for a while now.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3531860#Comment_3531860
a perk is only as good as the player who uses it. you make it sound like equipping thana was an instant win button.
I never said win. It gained value just by equipping the perk and playing the game.
It was absolutely overtuned in the 6.1 patch, and the amount of value was far too much. It didn't lose any meaningful power by healing one person, and there was no penalty built in for tunneling or one person early either. Those were added in the nerf.
And unlike DS, Thana is still powerful in some circumstances. Legion and plague, as others have mentioned, still gain full value from the perk... Especially now that healing nerfs have made the perk even stronger.
DS has no consistent situation where it can still shine. The perk is too weak to perform it's basic function with a 3s stun, 1.4s of which is animation locked for the survivor. So you gain 1.6 seconds of head start, which is beyond laughable, and trivial for any B tier killer or better. The conspicuous action and ecg nerfs to DS were fully justified tho.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3531850#Comment_3531850
Imagine if survivors had a perk that, after just playing the game normally, increased the killers hook requirements by 25% overnight
they did have that. decisive strike. it was one of strongest perks in dbd because it increased the total hook count from 3->4 by giving you an extra life/free wiggle off.
Then you agree that Thana was over tuned. That was my point.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3531815#Comment_3531815
what was wrong about them? this game has killer like nurse and blight that have constant chase powers. plague acquiring corrupt puke the entire game is certainly stronger chase killer but it is by no means an auto-win for her and than you have legion who is entirely m1 killer and relies on survivor grouping to be effective. one of aspect that people always talk about is spreading and doing gens at the start of the trial. how is that not a counter to thana? thana's effectiveness is strongest at early game because with 5 gens with 0 progress means that you need to do 5 gens under the penalty. with 1 gen, you have a much less of penalty go through because it is just one gen. because you need get injures, thana on average has most strength in mid game which is around 2-3 generator marker because that is the point in the game where killer has injure pressure which thana is based off.
that is good summary of how gen defence perks work in the game. gen regression is strongest at 1 gen(see 3 gen skull merchant). gen-blocking is best at the start of the game and -action speed is more middle game. of course different people will have different opinions for what part of the game is most relevant for the killer to be successful at.
The perk required nothing extra from the killer, just to play the game with the perk equipped. In return, you get a 22.5% increase in survivor objective work required.
For the two weeks between 6.1 release and the Thana nerf, it was in 100% of games. It effectively made gens go from 80 seconds pre patch to 112.5 seconds after patch, which was and is completely overkill.
Imagine if survivors had a perk that, after just playing the game normally, increased the killers hook requirements by 25% overnight. So after dropping 3 pallets or vaulting 3 vaults, the survivors gained an extra hook stage, up to 3. That would be used constantly and would be insanely over tuned. That's why Thana got nerfed as fast as it did.
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@fussy said:
bro skill issue just run 20% more distance than usual
I love how people constantly use awful assumptions to make a 3% skill suddenly into a 20% number instead.
When it was dead hard, it was 'it extends chase by 45 second OMG' because that made it sound as evil as possible. Why not use a number of seconds? It's it because an extra .45 seconds sounds really pitiful, like it really is?
Oh, right, people deliberately do math where bloodlust and killer powers don't exist. Now I remember.
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I miss the days when kicking gens 'took too much time' and killers focused on being in chase as much as possible. I never expected that 'gen kick simulator' would be so popular.
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@fussy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3527409#Comment_3527409
Lol, Boil Over wasn't ever nerfed, it was changed from 25% total progression to 33% of current progression, because these two weeks was nothing except some annoying Kate players abuse it and die at top of main buildings.
Thana was buffed by 2% and nerfed literally into state where it is worse than it was before buff.
So it is a terribly bad example, try again.
Edit: Both gained significant popularity when they got buffed and then died out when nerfed two weeks later, which is the main thing that I was responding to here. Also, both perks fall into the "takes no skill other than equipping a perk" category.
Since his complaint is entirely about "survivor perks aren't ever nerfed quickly" it's 10000% valid as a counter example.
If you are raising the bar to "nerfed into oblivion quickly" then Reassurance and Scavenger were nerfed from PTB to live (6 weeks) and are effectively useless to perform their effective functions. That's 3 counter examples now.
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@grandpa_general said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3527409#Comment_3527409
Who said anything about us vs them? Stop putting words in my mouth.
Complaining about Thana being nerfed quickly, but that MfT will take a long time to change.
Those are your exact words.
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Current game choices for those survivors:
- Rush gens, escape, and earn 7k BP bonus just for escaping, in addition to any other game play bonuses. At least 15k total, before offerings. The killer also gets 15k+ for just existing.
- Screw around, let the killer tunnel someone out (who also brought an offering probably) and earn 4k total for the match, before offerings. The killer gets 18k.
Gee, I wonder why survivors are rushing gens.
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@grandpa_general said:
They are quick to nerf thanatophobia but MFT? Nah, let's wait another year maybe then we'll decide to rework soon™
They were just as fast to nerf boil over months before Thana. Both perks lasted two weeks before getting nerfed again.
This isn't an 'us vs them' thing, no matter how much you want it to be.
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@WilliamSN said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3524743#Comment_3524743
The thing with nightlight is that since its a website that appeals to more competitive people you'll get stats from the higher MMR's.
Its blatantly obvious that self-care and spinechill aren't perks you see in mid to high MMR lobbies even though according to "official stats" you should expect to see it fairly often.
Dismissing nightlight because it doesn't include stats from the low MMR bracket where nobody knows what they are doing resulting in worthless data, is just intelectual dishonesty.
Mid to high MMR is the only valuable dataset since thats where people become effecient and know how to optimize the game and abuse perks/game mechanics, and that just so happens to be the crowd nightlight appeals to.
I'm talking about statistics and usage rates. Larger population size will generally be more accurate, and since BHVR has 100% usage rates they will always be guaranteed to have more accurate data than Nightlight or any other source.
There is also zero indication of MMR in game, in data sent to nightlight, or anywhere except internally at BHVR. Claiming to be at a certain MMR is just ego puffery unless or until they officially make that number visible.
Most everyone tends to think of themselves as 'above average', which is, again, statistically impossible.
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@Chordyceps said:
We don't need to change game mechanics just because people use them to be a little mean sometimes.
This was the exact reason that blind immunity was added to locker grabs. There were a small number of survivors abusing double locker setups that got blind immunity added for exactly this reason.
I 100% guarantee that 'slugging for the 4k' is way, way more common than double locker bully squads were.
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I'm not really a great huntress personally, but what helped me learn killer in general was not really caring about the 'win' but focusing on improving.
I had a number of games where the 'winning' play was to switch targets or drop chase, but I stuck it out because the survivor was doing really well. It helped me figure out how to chase the better loopers and get better at zoning, mind games, and learning which pallets are safe vs winnable.
It wasn't every game, but if I found a particularly good survivor I didn't mind losing the match to have a chance to get better long term. I feel like that investment has paid off personally, but ymmv.
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@solarjin1 said:
I don't understand why people continue to disregard nightlight numbers. Most of the time they are only a couple percentages off from behavior stats. Within the margin of error
Because in statistics, population is everything.
An English website that tracks volunteered information and is, at minimum, subject to user bias in submissions should be taken as exactly that and no more.
It's an interesting read, but to extrapolate that it's somehow better and more accurate than BHVR's 100% of the player base statistics is insane and grossly incorrect.
The margin of error can be incredibly large. Nightlight doesn't even usually include self care in the top 10 perks. BHVR consistently has self care in the top 5, usually the top 3. That's a massive difference.
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@Xendritch said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3523014#Comment_3523014
I'm going to keep a counter of people not realizing that this is literally my point and saying something only boosts something "by a tiny percentage" is not a valid argument for it not being impactful.
We're at a point now where those changes have gotten powercreeped because we reached critical mass on survivors perks that boost their numbers in chase.
I never said it was meaningless.
I said you're completely ignoring a 10% gain to complain about 3%. You're the one who was trying to say how broken it would be if killers got buffed... which they did, globally, base kit, for free, no perks required, and for larger values.
That seems inconsistent, and frankly biased.
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@Xendritch said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3522974#Comment_3522974
So we can buff killer speeds across the board by 3% right?
That's such a tiny percentage.
They did.
In 6.1.0 they have 10% action speed to nearly every killer action, like blade wiping, break actions, damaging generators, improved bloodlust gain, and some I'm probably forgetting.
Been hearing nothing but how 'useless and meaningless' those base kit, free buffs were for over a year now, but oh. my. god let's ######### about 3% on a perk incessantly.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3521225#Comment_3521225
That's not a problem unique to DbD though. Literally every other game with a ranked mode has this possibility. I don't understand why this always gets brought up. It's not like matchmaking gets turned off entirely in quickplay. One mode would just be what we have now: people sweating in casual mode with fairly loose MMR.
If you go into a 'casual mode' game in, say, a 5v5 scenario and one person on one of the teams decides to sweat their balls off that game, you might notice, and it could sway the game, but the impact is likely going to be minimal unless that one person is also much much better than everyone else.
Basically, the game balance it out because the sweaty player is balanced out by being in a casual team.
DbD has the unique problem where one team has exactly one player. If that killer player decides to sweat, and the other survivor team is playing casually it will absolutely be a stomp for the killer. There's no 'team member' to balance that out on the killer side.
It isn't much of a stretch too see that if a casual mode was actually played casually, it would attract every killer who wants easy wins, even if it means they sweat every game. If it's a nearly guaranteed win, it stops being a casual game mode and would simply fail entirely as a concept.
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@thisislastyearsmodel said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3514275#Comment_3514275
The real complaint is that being injured means nothing anymore because of the amount of endurance perks and haste effects.
What's the point of rejoicing over the devs taking steps to make healing less effective if you can just tank two, three or even four hits anyway?
The healing nerfs went to far, which is obvious from the outcome.
Healing, as well as booning, were *good* things for the killer. Time spent looking for a totem, blessing, running to and from the boon aura, and even the ~22s spent self caring were all time spent not on gens.
The devs did exactly what killers asked for and 'made healing suck'. Killers seem to have had this vision of survivors running around blindly, looking for heals and wasting minutes of time for those same health states.
But that isn't the end result. The obvious outcome from 'making healing suck' is that survivors will stop doing it entirely. All that time spent setting up, running around, and healing is entirely on gens now. No one bothers setting up a boon at the start of the game, instead they just get on gens.
If 'gens fly' now, that's 100% the reason. The only secondary objective survivors have ever voluntarily chosen to go do was deleted completely.
As with dead hard and various other changes over the past year, killers got exactly the change they asked for, it just isn't what they wanted.
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@mca240 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3515032#Comment_3515032
When Thanatophobia got buffed, it got nerfed within 2 weeks because it was unfun. There has been no excuse regarding the before mentioned perks.
I used to be able to play this game hours on end. Now play mostly 3 matches because of how unfun it has gotten since MFT + Hope + Buckle Up + FTP.
On the brink of uninstalling the game, so that is what'll do yeah.
Thana got nerfed before any feedback was even taken in. The devs saw the usage rate jump to nearly 100% over night and made the change themselves almost immediately in the first available patch.
Boil over received a buff before Thana that was also reverted two weeks after going live in the same way. So I guess you think that was also purely due to feedback?
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3514737#Comment_3514737
bHVR is already developing a solution of Face Camping.
And if they implemented stackable perks to reduce basic attack cooldown low enough, it would hard counter that feature.
If you can swing twice fast enough without really losing any movement speed, it doesn't matter if the survivor has endurance or not. They go down and back on the hook, self unhook or not.
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@Caiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3514275#Comment_3514275
"OTHER SIDE BAD"
Great insight.
That's not what I said, and I'm not making a statement about everyone who plays killer.
Just people who have constantly complained for years that survivors were healthy butnow are just playing injured, which was the obvious effect of the medkit changes. These types of people seem to be genuinely offended that survivors aren't dead when the match starts, or think they deserve a 4k because they have the god tier skill to click 'play as killer' at the main menu.
I like to think that's a small minority of people, but there seems to be an inordinate number of them that have more skill in posting on the forums to complain and get daddy BHVR to nerf things for them than they have any actual skill in game.
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@Caiman said:
Medkits were nerfed to make injuries apply more pressure to survivors. Then survivors were given all the perks they need to nullify that pressure while being injured. Nothing was solved, in fact things have arguably worsened.
Circle and medkits were nerfed because killers were complaining about survivors being healthy all the time.
Now killers are complaining about survivors being injured.
At this point, it really just feels like the real complaints are that survivors don't start the trial slugged or already on hooks.
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@Ivanynakov said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3512513#Comment_3512513
Give all Killers movement speed boost because animation doesn't match their long legs. Would survivor players complain?
...
You do know that every killer in the game is at least 10% faster than survivors by default, right?
This already exists.
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@Moz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3510710#Comment_3510710
I've never claimed windows helps with mindgames, but as you mentioned it tells the survivor how to connect loops to prolong chases. If you play SWF the same people with actual callouts it's less viable but if you run solo or duo's it's a huge benefit. I'd agree that the top players do not need windows as their map awareness and teamwork doesn't give it any benefit, but what windows does is take mid-range players and push them up a level. As far as your personal experiences playing killer go have you considered that you're the one playing at the lower end of the MMR? Not that I want to turn this into an MMR discussion because you can't prove how MMR even functions, if at all. Second game as killer tonight and guess what the best survivor is running?
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/3PFTLQBCND9A/receipt.jpg
Funny how the survivors with 1k-4k hours seem to be running windows, must be a coincidence I guess.
My favorite thing about this community is is that every single time they complain about a perk and show a screenshot, it's at least a 3k or even a 4k, like this one.
You have every game you've ever played and you choose the screen shot where you trounced them. (And someone is running alert and technician here, c'mon).
If this is your evidence that Windows of opportunity is overpowered, you've completely missed the mark in making any point except the exact opposite.
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3513440#Comment_3513440
Play with your food has heavy restrictions. That's why it's not considered good.
It needs you to find the obsession and start and stop chases with them. This takes a lot of time,that you as killer is not harassing gens, getting hits, getting downs, getting hooks....
You can have 3 stacks that decrease for every usage of your power, if you (killer) have a chase power and every m1. Hit or. It does not matter. You can waste a ton of time farming stacks and then not even getting a hit, you lost a ton of time for no reward.
Sure you can use it in combination with other perks to make it better, but you only have four Perk slots. Giving two up for a Perk that has this many downsides is very risky.
Now look at made for this.
Constant 3% haste effect without downside. Will eventually be activated in Game. Guaranteed. Has synergy with very strong perks without downsides. Can be used on all survivors for a grand total of 4 per match. This is not even about the extra endurance effect it has.
No. I don't think people overstate their opinion about this Perk being problematic.
By that measure, MfT haste ends when the chase ends too. So both expire when the killer lands a hit.
Either way, 9% haste from pwyf or the 15% hate from bloodlust, which stack with each other, should be considered OMGWTF godly.
MfT haste isn't an issue, it's just the 'new thing' killers cry about since dead hard and ds were deleted.
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@emetSdidnothingwrong said:
The simple fact is an unlimited movement speed boost with no downsides is never going to be balanced. I mean imagine if the new killer perk just gave you a 5% haste after hitting a survivor and didn't expire until something stupid like getting stunned by a pallet, it would be wildly overpowered.
Imo they should make it like Lucky Break: a set duration of the perk being active that runs out over time and can be recharged via some kind of action, such as healing others or honestly not let it recharge at all depending on the duration. As for the numbers that's not for me to say, one thing I do agree with Otz on though is haste stacking should not exist in any form.
Play with your food does exactly this though, and isn't even considered good, let alone 'wildly overpowered'.
It's a 3% per stack move speed bonus that stacks up to 9% and you only lose a token on a successful hit.
It's far from 'wildly overpowered' because the hype over a 3% move speed boost is insanely overstated.
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@Sharby said:
I know the point is for visual clarity but tbh obscuring what is and isn't a vault would be way cooler and reward map exploration.
If the tap is going to stay I wish they'd at least theme it after the map.
Obscuring vaults would only lead to 2 things: more people running windows, and more complaints about map design.
There's literally zero reason to make vaults harder to see. Maps and map design/balance are already one of the biggest complaints in the game, let's not actively make the problem worse.