AChaoticKiller
AChaoticKiller
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1983272#Comment_1983272
The hatch is unhealthy. Even for survivors. The last survivor usually isn't the one that performed well,but the one who was hiding and searching the hatch once there is only 2 survivors left.
I stopped counting the amount of times where only 1 gen was left, I kept the killer busy and the other survivor just ignored gens and searched for the hatch. This isn't great gameplay for the third survivor. It's boring and stale. Just like slugging the third survivor and searching the hatch/last survivor.
Removing the hatch would solve this.
Yeah at 2 left they are not going to win, one will die so they play safer. That isn't a good enough reason to remove hatch and games that last an extra 5 minutes or even near that when there are 2 left are rare. As said last survivor hatch escapes are fine. In fact removing the hatch wouldn't even solve this.
still doesn't change the fact that it would make 4k wins wayyy too easy and what's funny is that they can't even reduce gate time to compensate for the killer you would go against or gate spawns since gates themselves are too rng and there isn't a right way to do them due to the large variety of killers we have. edit: Also pretty much all indoor maps have set gate spawns, on lerrys, the game, and hawkens any gate set up is actually too far to effectively patrol so escaping on that against certain killers would almost always happen.
Removing hatch just isn't the correct thing to do for those reasons not to mention that while it would make the killer community happy it would piss off survivor players more since as said last survivor hatch escapes means the killer won regardless. Also before you mention second chance perks or whatever it DOES NOT MATTER in the case of last survivor hatch escapes due to it's nature and the fact that not every damn player runs second chance perks and hatch effects all players.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1982574#Comment_1982574
The team failed as a whole. Why does the last survivor need another second chance on top of all the second chances he already has? Where is that second chance mechanic for the killer that performs bad?
The same can be said on the survivors part, why should they barely have a chance if any at all depending on the killer to escape just because the other 3 died.
The logic goes both ways and killers don't need a 4k every time they win, it doesn't matter what they brought the last one should have a decent chance at still being able to escape.
All I'm reading off you is "I want free 4k's on won games", and you can't say I'm biased because i want there to be an actual balanced way to open hatch with keys and unlike you i presented an idea for it instead of the lazy "just remove it".
Lastly the last survivor escaping by hatch has always been and will always be fine and fair.
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@UncleStabby said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1983099#Comment_1983099
That Locker tip doesn't work anymore. Victor now has the power to trap people in lockers so Charlotte can get there.
it does it stops the twins from getting anymore pressure as charlotte HAS to go to that locker or let the survivor in it get away resulting in the killer just wasting time, if you are injured and by yourself it is probably the best thing you can do especially with DS.
If you also know that your too far away from the twins for her to get to you in time jumping in a locker is the best thing to do as charlotte will only be able to cover 46 meters in those 10 seconds.
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@Haddix said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1981370#Comment_1981370
Copy and paste tips from a Twins player that goes against players that have literally no clue how to counterplay this killer all the time (and this is why they are hated, despite being a balanced pair of killers):
Get in a locker. Always get in one when injured. You completely deny a Victor snowball. If far enough away from Charlotte, you literally get away for free.
Pre-drop a pallet and CAMP IT (Do NOT run around it). Crouch after vaulting.
Lots of meta perks counter them. Good healing perks as well. Unbreakable, WGLF, Soulguard, Exhaustion perks can help you rush to a locker to avoid Victor. Every healing perk is awesome against them. Iron Will is always great. Lucky Break combined with Iron Will would counter Victor hard, but Lucky Break is obviously pretty trash.
STAY ON TOP OF HEALS. Medkits are also fantastic against them.
When Victor misses a pounce, kick him. When Victor lands a pounce on an injured teammate, you can STILL kick him.
So, STICK TOGETHER. When Victor downs your teammate, kick him. Heal your teammate off the ground if you can (this is why WGLF is a solid pick). A lot of people don't know this, and it's ridiculous.
Camp windows.
Keep Victor on your back for as long as possible unless you need to get him off for some reason. If your team is injured, ALWAYS keep him on your back and allow your team to heal each other so you deny a Victor snowball. You can keep him on your back at any point in the game though, it's just especially important if your team is injured.
Go against a good meta team that knows these things and it's nearly impossible to win.
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If you like needing to camp and mass slug to win against decent team go ahead and play them.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1982540#Comment_1982540
Doctor and Demo aren't exactly meta killers. Annoying? Sure, but meta?
doesn't matter if the killer is meta
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1982286#Comment_1982286
Having 2 gates to choose from is having no chance?
not against doctor, demo, or any high mobility killer.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1981021#Comment_1981021
Hatch was introduced to avoid a stalemate where the match doesn´t progress, because the last survivor isn´t doing gens.
Since we have the EGC we don´t need the hatch anymore. Just trigger the EGC once there is only 1 survivor left.
Hatch gives the survivor a better chance at escaping and the doors are very well known for being incredibly unfair to survivors and some killers like demo, doctor, or just high mobility killers would just always get 4k's. let's not forget that it would also buff slugging for a 4k.
hatch is fair for the last survivor as the killer has already won no need to give them a free kill, keys can be balanced in regards to opening the hatch there is no reason to remove it when there are better options that are not limited like mori's were.
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YEAH NO
My problem has ALWAYS been the WAY hatch is opened with keys
They shouldn't be the instant BS we currently have, IF they took time to open the hatch and had a fair way to alert the killer, keys opening hatch would be balanced.
I personally think this is the best way it can be done HATCH REWORK IDEA
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@[Deleted User] said:
Yes, i'd want to use this with pop, but the cooldown just makes me not use it. It should be reduced to 30 seconds at least. The base regression is quite garbage and tracking does not work if survivor succeeds skill check. No idea why it would have such a long cd.
I wouldn't say 30 seconds as it does effect 3 gens, i'd say 45 or 60 seconds would be a good cooldown time that way you wouldn't be able to spam it easily however i would learn towards 45 seconds.
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I feel like that would nerf dying light as 4 hooks results in more than -10% repair speed.
blood warden need no changes it does what it is supposed to do also that feels like a nerf kinda but i do get what you were trying to do.
monstrous shine would be too RNG like that and wouldn't do much unless you camped.
I don't think that the third seal change would do much really like tbh the only thing that matters in that list is the hook progress but survivors will just kinda know how far you are along and make sure to save sooner.
I have 2 rework idea's with those perks
Hex: The Third Seal: As long as this hex is active up to 2/3/4 survivors hit with your basic attack suffer from the blindness effect as long as this totem persists. When you hit a survivor with a basic attack while this totem is active they also suffer from the oblivious effect for 15/20/25 seconds.
Monstrous Shrine: For each survivor hooked in the basement all survivors get -15/-20/-25 % to repairs, cleansing, and opening the exit gates while monstrous shine is active. Monstrous shine is not active unless you are 32 meters away from the basement. Survivors in the basement suffer from the oblivious status effect.
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I just don't think they need representation is every god damn popular game.
I have no problem with LGBT people hell one of my friends is gay and even he thinks it's ridiculous that the community finds it offensive if there isn't a LGBT character in a game.
This is a "horror" game one where your characters will die or kill others it effects the real world in no way, now i personally don't care if they add one it's the forcing a LGBT character that i don't like
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@Shirokinukatsukami said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1974556#Comment_1974556
You already won that game.
Is your ego so fragile that letting 1 or 2 survivors have an escape after you trounced them all game is so injurious to you?
mate i wont argue from that pathetic statement
i said i'm fine with the ability to escape by hatch but that aspect should have interaction with the killer and it shouldn't be usable in a chase.
ego? how about actually playing smart and skillful to escape instead of relying on an item to do all the work for you and up to 3 other people.
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That music clip is kinda good would be cool if the killers chase music was similar.
Don't like k-pop to much tho and i find the videos cringe.
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Guys i guess we are getting a fortnight chapter soon, can't wait for the killer to build over pallets!
or will it be survivors doing that?
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@chadbeastofprey said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1974556#Comment_1974556
I’m not arguing about keys, I’m a survivor main and I don’t care about them and I want them nerfed just so killer mains will finally shut up. I’m just wondering if you mean the killer is losing. Cause if 3-4 gens are done and there are 3-4 survivors left that means the survivors are winning lol
it depends on how many times you have hooked the remaining survivors, the gen positions, and your pressure.
Survivors can be winning even if one is dead at that point but it depends on gen positions and if you can actually get the gen done against whatever killer and anti gen perks they are using.
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@burt0r said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1974574#Comment_1974574
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1974577#Comment_1974577
Maybe just tag "Ilovedemo" and make it quick. I am quite astounded that he is not already making comments here.
(Btw, just for clarification, is this already considered as naming/shaming or the like?)
I don't consider his response name shaming, yours might be even then i don't think it's serious.
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it's a teachable from Laurie, you can only get it if you have gotten the teachable.
you can get the teachable from the shrine or from leveling up Laurie, only then will it appear on other survivor bloodwebs.
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You have a lot of perks so im only going to comment on ones i think are good, if it's not here i didn't agree with 1 or 2 aspects of the perk.
- Broken on blood echo sounds nice but i doubt it will really do much still not a bad change
- Fire up is also pretty good but a bit too heavy with 10%
- territorial is also pretty cool however i feel it is extremely unfair to the unhooked.
you others are either too strong, don't make sense, or simply are not that good. No offense i do get wanting to present more unique ideas.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztqeD_N0H5E&t=1s
get good here's the basics
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@GannTM said:
Haddonfield is the epitome of horrible map design. If there is any survivor that think Haddonfield is fair and balanced, I will go off.
You are practically asking a troll to respond XD
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Yup haddonfield is just one of those maps that completely rely on the survivors making major mistakes and not being optimal on gens.
The game is like this too simply because it has the most pallets as well as the most safe pallets and god pallets, get a team of good loopers and you stand no chance.
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@chadbeastofprey said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1974389#Comment_1974389
3 or 4 gens done means the survivors are losing ???
yes and keys turn that around in an unfair way, there is no skill all you need is an item.
Example in a swf on a losing game if a key was brought or found and hatch spawns usually after 1 or 2 die the other 3-2 just play stealthy until hatch is found and meet up to instantly escape and YES this is including the fact that they did 4-3 gens.
hell the fact that it can be used in chase is unfair, like i said im fine with hatch allowing survivors to escape however the way it is implemented is completely BS and has no real counter play not even franklins because you can just drop the key.
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Yeah it's been pretty annoying not being able to play any of my online game.
guess i'll go play civ
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@PhantomChimera said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1973569#Comment_1973569
The hatch isn't available at the beginning of the match. When it spawns depends on how many survivors are left and how many generators have been done.
dude im wellllll aware
why do you think i said 3 or 4 gens done? It's because that is when keys can be used on losing games for survivor.
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@DropdeadPiggy said:
It literally does what it's designed to do open a hatch like if you can't get anybody by the time those gens get done in a hatch pops up you are indeed the problem
it's the way it is done that's a problem
Like im fine with keys still opening the hatch but it shouldn't the instant BS we currently have.
also optimal survivors will get at least 3 gens done if not 4, you basically saying as a killer survivors shouldn't get to 1 or 2 gens ever if your good which simply isn't true.
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@DeadHardMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1973273#Comment_1973273
Dance animations/emotes for Survivors finally?!!!!
What is this Friday the 13th?
Based on what we have seen i bet if they made dancing animations it would look stiff as hell XD
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@Asssblasster625 said:
How would the tail work?
imagine it's like a whip you can use around objects.
like if a survivor is looping you you just use your tail and it curves around to hit the survivor.
Also i always imagined xenomorph being able to climb up openings onto higher floors/platforms, maybe it can also use the tail to attack as it does this or something.
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@AsherFrost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1973473#Comment_1973473
Also, have you yet realized that the brilliant counter you have to Franklin's Demise (a perk that makes survivors drop their items) is to drop their items? That's a real "they can't fire me if I quit" mentality there
that doesn't mean anything XD
new franklins is meant to literally erase items if an item can be used later and is ONLY used later it makes sense to drop it so it wont be erased.
the only time fraklins will do anything to a smart key holder is when they are looking for hatch with key in hand and you hit them and as said in a swf not even that will matter.
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@AsherFrost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1973473#Comment_1973473
You seem to be of the opinion that something has to work 100% of the time, in all situations to be considered a counter. I disagree with that. In the scenario you're listing, why is the Survivor got all the time in the world to drop and pick up this key? How uneven is the pressure being applied if they have this time?
Nerfing an item due to swf concerns needlessly punishes solo survivor players, which means there will be less of them, which means that you'll end up facing more swf squads. That's why I think it is a separate issue.
Im sorry im not the under the impression that survivors don't have a brain nor do i think solo's should be the main focus when balancing since swf is just that common.
regardless hatch opened with keys is an issue and it doesn't take a swf to simply drop a key or go pick it up and drop it to avoid losing it you see it all the time in high ranks when franklins is used to try to counter it.
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@AsherFrost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1973457#Comment_1973457
Of course Franklin's is a counter. It isn't on a timer or only used once, you can always knock the key out of their hand when they pick it up.
The other is more the swf issue, but If you are there, don't look for the survivor, find the hatch, that's where they're going, or slug it out, make the seeker come to you or choose to abandon the team.
you just drop your key boom counter play to that counter and you have time to go pick it up and drop it on the spot if the killer tries to guard it after hooking you or you just get a friend to do that.
Besides Hatch's main problem is how easy it is to open with a key in a swf this is not a unrelated issue swf's are very common and need to be considered in balancing the hatch.
besides any good survivor usually last second switches to keys since killers usually bring franklins when they spot one, i would even say it is last second switched to more often then flash lights when it is brought.
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Same brother I really hope we get a xenomorph, I already love demo since it's a monster i have no doubt i would love playing as a xenomorph unless they somehow make his power the worst in the game.
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@tippy2k2 said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdzauZQg3xQ
They're finally introducing an older lady to the cast!
When can we expect her to be added?
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@AsherFrost said:
Big guy/gal with a weapon can't figure out how to stop one survivor with a key?
I agree they have some issues, but to claim they have no counterplay? You can see them brought in (unless found in chest) and you can bury any survivor with one, or bring franklin's demise and make everyone lose their items.
If the whole team is alive, the hatch won't spawn until the last gen is done, that gives you a bit of time to figure out how to kill one of them. If you can't, honestly you probably wouldn't have won that match anyway, key or no key.
Franklins isn't really a counter since you can just drop your key say at shack for latter and in a swf just have a friend go pick it up for you.
However the main issue with keys is once a survivor dies since once it gets to 1 gen you can just go look for hatch and escape which is what swf's do. At this point the killer can't do much other than try to find a survivor who is looking for hatch and hope it is the key user and even then the other 1-2 will still look for hatch and if they find it they will guide the key user to it or if they get sacrificed just go pick it off them then open hatch.
There just isn't any real counter play, once the key gets to hatch your losing at least 1 kill and regardless EGC is starting so the other 1-2 basically skipped gens and can escape, if there are 2 left after that your more than likely losing 2 kills.
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@Unicorn said:
Stop feeding into this bait. Its what they want.
bait? maybe.
But keys are an issue, he is right that once hatch is found and a key is brought to it there isn't any counter play. Also finding hatch with an swf is not difficult at all if your team knows the spawn locations hell you can do it as a solo.
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If it means we can have 2 daddies I'm all in!
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That's just awful, poor girl.
Humanity as a whole just sucks, we have good people then the bad ones who just ruin everything.
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Jesus and im happy with just my measly 10
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Keys need an addon rework, time to open hatch and a fair way to warn the killer, and maybe even an extra feature to them. I don't care how rare it is that hatch gets opened with keys the way it is done and how it works is completely bs.
I made my own rework for at least the way hatch gets opened i think they need to do something similar to this.
@AChaoticKiller said:
The problem with the current way keys open the hatch
The reason hatch is so unfair when it does get opened are the following;
- It is instant, the second you get to hatch with a key especially if you're not injured you won.
- There is no interaction with the killer that allows you to stop survivors from opening the hatch
- Once hatch is found by survivors as a solo you have trouble getting your team to follow you and as a swf you just get there and all escape.
How to fix this?
What hatch needs is a way for all players to find hatch and it needs interaction time to open. This will allow the killer to stop the hatch from being opened and the killer can go after the key holder to at least temporarily stop survivors from escaping this way assuming only one key is brought into the trial.
The basics on how opening the hatch will now work
Before reading ahead know that numbers are subject to change if a value doesn't set right with you it can be changed.
- Hatch will now take at base 12 seconds to open
- Progress on opening the hatch does not save
- The killer can grab you in this interaction
- You no longer immediately jump into the hatch
- If no one has escaped the trial when it is opened with a key the EGC timer doesn't start.
This allows the killer to stop the hatch without the time being too short or too long for either side, hatch should not be something you can open in a chase or in just a few seconds near the killer. To make this a little more fair and something that can be changed is survivors not immediately escaping this allows them to help other survivors however this also runs the risk of the killer simply closing the hatch and to make this fair EGC will NOT start if no one escaped as that is basically survivors skipping having to do gens as the killer had to close the hatch. So how do we fairly alert the killer?
Idea 1: directonal audio
The first one and the one that out of the two idea's I will suggest is probably the better one and more realistic is directional audio. Depending of if the second idea to alert the killer is implemented the values will be as follows:
- All players can hear the directional audio of hatch being opened at 20 meters
- The audio is almost constant during the whole 12 second interaction
- If the second idea is not implemented the audio should instead have a range of 40 meters.
idea 2: the seal
This idea is pretty basic basically the hatch will have a seal of some sort this can be in the form of bars, magic, the entity whatever the point is you can't open the hatch until this is broken. once it is broken by an interaction it will alert all players by a noise bubble much like a hex totem being cleansed.
- interaction time to break the seal 6 seconds
- once broken all players are alerted to it's location
- If the seal is not broken and only one survivor is left in the trial the seal will "dissolve" and hatch will still open. This does NOT alert the players of the hatches location.
What does this all do?
This provides a way for all players to find hatch mainly the killer and with hatch taking time to open and telling players a survivor is opening it allows survivors to try to help and the killer can try to stop it. I think that both of these idea's should be implemented but if one of the two would be implemented it should be the directional audio. This would make keys fair with how hatch currently spawns as well as how and when you open hatch and provides more interesting gameplay.
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wow im late to this
Like others have said this game wasn't designed for high coordination between survivors that goes regardless of if swf was planned to be implemented or not simply because the game was designed horribly in terms of balance.
Go look at old gameplay infinites, pallet vacuums, incredibly fast gen times, perma sabo'd hooks, and broken perks for each side mostly survivor tho. The only reason killers got kills back then was from survivors not being optimal/experienced that is literally the only reason. You CANNOT say that when balancing this game for the first 2 years that it was swf being in mind as the standard for balance this game has for a long time been balanced around 4 solo's until recently with the DS and OoO nerf coming.
The result of this has been that a swf filled with good survivors who coordinate is stronger than the killer and can reliably beat all but 1 maybe 2 killers and while yes survivors have received a lot of nerfs over the years it still hasn't been enough to change that truth.
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@Lazerboy88 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1973243#Comment_1973243
Not really :/ the original killers don’t really have any link to their survivors, so I doubt the killer would be similar.
I mean they can, we have no info for the killer so speculating is all we can do.
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If we are getting a singer/pop star or whatever I have a good feeling that the new killer is going to be related to that or just sound in a way.
Like the killer could be a crazed stalker who killed to reach her or even just something related to sound like a banshee, god i want a banshee as a killer I think that would be cool as hell.
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Yeah a killer that disguises as one of the survivors or just hides the TR with no other effects would be very weak and any form of info would screw them. Like why even hide the TR legion always gets a free hit anyway and that is the main point of stealth killers.
I think instead they should just reward legion for getting hits in frenzy kinda like this also yes the 4th effect is fair and would also be uncommon not to mention it often won't be able to down more than 1 sometimes 2 survivors.
For each hit in frenzy you gain a token. Tokens are consumed when frenzy ends.
- Nothing
- Reduced feral frenzy fatigue
- Reduced feral frenzy fatigue and all survivors affected by deep wounds are revealed by killer instinct for 5 seconds.
- When feral frenzy ends you go into a fatal frenzy, your movement speed is drastically reduced for 2 seconds before moving at 5.2 m/s it then lasts for 8 seconds during which your attacks injure and down survivors, hitting survivors in this state adds 4 seconds to it’s duration. Survivors affected by deep wounds in your terror radius are revealed by killer instinct during this time.
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Demo
Do the ROAR
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The counter is not being near other survivors then once he is in EW3 play more stealthy after he gets whoever he popped it on.
If he only gets a single down from it or even 2 after he hooks the first guy he can't apply that much pressure, if he runs infectious fright run AWAY from the downed survivor so the others can pick him up.
If you are the one he popped EW3 on good luck your probably getting downed.
edit: i completely missed the point XD just read the title.
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A win for me is 3+ kills, however i also go by the degree i won meaning If i slugged to win and i barely hooked the survivors that isn't a good win meanwhile 12 hooks is the best win.
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If survivors know the gen spawns that map is extremely survivor sided, i played demo with spirit fury and enduring and it barely helped simply because their were too many pallets.
like go to the bottom floor and count 10 seconds as you travel you can probably pass 5+ pallets with the right route. Hell on the interaction of the game i played the two god pallets in the corner easily connected to 3 more. Also with the new god pallet in the middle of the map it connected to a long wall pallet then to another vault+pallet tile it's ridiculous.
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If the survivor is a previous singer or whatever i think it could be likely that the killer would be similar or related in a way.
A banshee perhaps? I kinda want that kind of killer as for the power who knows.
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What makes fnaf scary is how the animatronics don't move in your view until they are already on you
They honestly wouldn't be scary otherwise i would just view them as furry robots
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@meowzilla69 said:
- undying rework(won’t work but my idea): undying would have tokens at the start. Undying would begin with 1/1/2 tokens. The tokens would work as the old undying, once the tokens are used up, undying deactivates. Undying’s aura reading ability only affects hex totems. They’re also no hex notifications that undying is active.
- distortion rework: get rid of the extra seconds for no scratch marks & increase the tokens 3/4/5 tokens. 6 seconds of no scratch marks & your aura isn’t shown to the killer.
- coup de grace buff: 2 tokens for each generator done.
- sloppy butcher buff: tier 3 affects the survivors tremendously. Slightly slower gen speeds ( they can’t focus from being brutally attacked).
- thanatophobia buff: 7%/8%/9% reduced action speed.(stays the same) an addition of adding a penalty to exit gates.
- overcharge buff: I like theclownisking’s idea on how to buff overcharge. Which can be found here: https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/229410/an-idea-to-buff-overcharge#latest
I think undying is fine with how it protects totems what is NOT fine is how they gutted it's secondary effect as the aura reading is pretty useless. I personally think they should switch undying and TOTH effects to look like this. Since TOTH also kinda has retributions effect I'll include it too.
Hex: Undying: When another hex totem is cleansed it replaces this totem and keeps all of its tokens. For each totem in the trial cleansing speed is reduced by 5/10/15 %. (This makes totems take 21 seconds to cleanse until a hex is cleansed)
Hex: Thrill Of The Hunt: While this hex is active when a survivor is within 5 meters of any totem their aura is revealed for 2/4/6 seconds. When a survivor cleanses any totem their aura is revealed once more for 10 seconds. As long as this Hex persists gain 50% more bloodpoints in the hunter category.
Hex: Retribution: As long as this hex is active when a survivor cleanses a dull totem they become oblivious for 35 seconds, when any hex totem becomes cleansed you gain the undetectable status effect for 60/70/80 seconds or until you down a survivor.
Honestly i think anything that increases distortions token count would be a buff however i would like a way to earn tokens same thing with coup de grace. As for overcharge since gens have red sparks players will quickly realize overcharge is being used i think there are better buffs.
As for thano and sloppy i don't agree with, 9% is way too high i would make that at most 7% and sloppy is fine as it is and has nothing to do with repairing.