STB giga nerfed for no reason.
Killer ques are long and you keep finding odd ways to just nerf the funnest surviour stuff.
This is a absurd change, you have giga nerfed the perk for no reason.
Ive seen people have concerns over hook shuffling which is a valid concern. But nobody. NOBODY was asking for people to be broken rather then exposed.
I guess the most die hard killer mains where because they despratly want a easier time but look at que times, time to stop listening to them so heavily.
I dont mean to make us v them but there is no other logical reason why this perk was curb stomped into the gutter so hard.
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No reason? This perk was considered by many to be the strongest survivor perk in the game. Preventing a kill for the low cost of taking that persons hook state and 40 seconds of exposed. It still provides that same super strong effect with harsher downsides. Almost anyone would agree that having four survivors up with one hook stage on two of them is WAY stronger than one dead survivor and three with no hook stages.
It's FAR from gutted.
If you haven’t noticed since last year the whiniest of voices (killer content creators) have gotten everything they wanted an more, despite the fact bhvr acknowledged survivors have received the short end of the stick and now here bhvr is again continuing to give in to these entitled streamers who want 4k’s handed to them on a silver platter.
These same killer content creators always talk about the things survivor had given to them as if the small pittance they receive isn’t compensation for the stuff killers get.
Bhvr its time to revert the syringe and styptic changes since we didn’t get any of the anti tunnel or anti slug stuff that promised. Why did killers get everything they were promised while everything survivors were promised got scrapped.
Best survivor perk, it's so good that it's banned in comp dbd.
And what's so fun about it?
There are multiple reasons for queue times to be long on killer side and they were always long.
We are completely ignoring the killer nerfs ig and survivor buffs like pallet density.
I dont agree with you.
It is not the same "super strong" effect i dunno what perk change you are reading.
Can only be used once and you get hit with a absurd amount of time in broken. 2 whole minuites of broken is stupid and only is their to help low skill killers who could not take advantage of exposed
Now the perk is utterly useless againt top teirs. Im sure they are really gonna care that STB was used when that the person that used it is forced to be injured for 2 minutes.
Yay i can still use against skull merchant i guess but perk is clearly gutted. So agree to disagree because wont be swayed here.
Well they wont put all the changes in one easy to find place. (Thanks BHVR)
From killer perks i have seen they are not giga nerfed like STB has been.
I would like to see you take advantage of the 40 seconds of exposed when paired with exhaustion and current pallet density when it's an actual GOOD survivor. I'll tell you what, you won't be getting that M1 hit unless its a killer that can quite literally force an M1 which not a lot can. And against a majority of the killer roster you only need that one shoulder the burden even more-so the face if your teammates are on your skill level.
Taking away a kill earlier than expected did warrant a bigger downside than a pathetic 40 second exposed.
"No reason."
Wild.
So wheres the unique hook incentives that were proposed on those PTBs? Survivors literally got an entire killer gutted to quell the whining about her until they can rework her instead of telling people to get good.
I just went for the unhooker when I heard the tell for it, it's not like the hook state is removed from the person lol
Agree to disagree I really dont understand why it so hard to just say "that person looped better then me gg" then needing a cruch of 2 full minutes of that person being forced injured.
To be clear, not opposed to perk being changed. But the way they have changed it is silly and only their to benifit killers who could not take advantage of exposed.
Exposed to short? Extend it. Dont just giga nerf perk by making it one time use AND changing from exposed to injured AND increasing the time of effect. Three nerfs for one perk.
they also have been releasing strong killers for the past couple of years while almost all the survivor perks are mostly situational or bad. It’s funny your bring up skull merchant but don’t bring up the temper tantrums killer main content creators were having over that PTB that was supposed to help vs tunneling and give hook incentives. Guess who they listen they ended up listening to.
The problem was you could still be hit by shoulder even when not tunneling. You just need to understand that keeping 4 people in the match longer is worth the downsides that are possibly coming. 4 more perks in the trial, 1 more person to do a gen or waste time in chase with. Every nerf it got was super deserved.
And once again go against a STB user, that has exhaustion, current pallet density with even a mid range killer and try to take advantage of the exposed. Note this also screwed over killers who's M2 is their primary source of damage but even then some M2s on killers weren't physically strong enough compared to just M1'ing them.
If you werent tunneling then the person who unhooked dies early, due to being targeted over your tunnel target, no?
The "temper" tantrums where even an Ex-dev and balance lead came out to say the changes were bad? Lets say 9.2.0 ptb went through. Literally ALL killer diversity would die because who wants to play even a mid range killer where EVERYTHING is stacked against you. You got no breathing room because if you tunneled someone out you can no longer regress gens. If you got a kill before six stages they permanently got a 25% faster repair speed and note if you arent completing 2-3 gens by the time first chase is done against the majority of the killer roster, the survivors did something wrong.
they’re gone to my dismay, i wanted them and was more than fine with the anti tunnel changes since i try my best not too since I’m competitive and don’t require playing against a handicapped team.
Eliminating a survivor at 4/5 gens is like playing streetfighter with your opponent having their life reduced to 3/4. It shouldn’t be able to happen and it cheapens the win.
Hypothetically yes but they still got their value. They still extended the time that four people are still in the match which is what makes the perk so strong. Up to four more perks still in the game, another survivor to go for saves, do gens, heal etc.
I'm going to say this. If a survivor is dead at 4/5 gens they were majorly out matched. They shouldn't have even gone against you. The problem wish shoulder is people of even equal skill level using it in the game thats still inherently survivor sided against the majority of the roster. Sure Nurse, Blight, Jason etc don't have much issue with it but when its Nemesis, Clown, Doctor its literally game changing.
I understand what you are saying but I think the one time use for everyone was enough to combat this and extending exposed if they really needed too. (all tho with vigil nerfs exposed is more valuble and we also judt had less edurance off hook so less likley to body block the STB player) at very least would of been worth testing first before such a harsh change.
Every nerf was not "deserved". The injured for me ontop of the other changes to perk is what makes it a giga nerf to me. If they kept it as longer exposed time I dont see that as problamtic.
I had made suggestion berfore in another thread that if you STB someone you can not be STB so killer can keep pressure without hooks being shuffled, i understand the imporatnce of killer pressure, but this perk change does too much to try to cater to killers who are not good at looping so they need the gaurentted injured state for tracking and easier down if they run down 2 min timer surviour is sill injured.
I dont agree with you on pallet denisty so that test would be futile (I also play billy here so may be why i dont have issue with pallets)
Well yeah Billy would explain why you don't have much of an issue with pallet density. I would just much rather the perk be reworked because taking a hook state away from a death hook survivor to add to yourself is just way too volatile to properly balance. It affects some killers WAY more than others. But as it stands currently you would need to increased the duration of exposed to 2 minutes to make it a proper downside and even then it would still be too strong.
honestly. I think the only downside the perk requires is that you gave away a health state. That is more than enough of an equal trade. What you want and other killer only players is for the perk to be worthless. It didn’t need exposed and it didnt need broken either.
having to work for your kills is unfair.
this seems to be the repeated talking point lol… Vigil and SB just got thrashed as well, yeah of course the next best thing is going to be the strongest if everything in front of it is nerfed and barely anything is ever restored for survivor anymore. and what's worse is BHVR almost NEVER regularly nerfs anything, it's always a curb stomp that feels unnecessarily bad.
What's next? Lithe is the strongest perk and it's always run so it needs to be nerfed? it's just a slow erosion of survivor perks which disproportionately affects the regular players.
STB has been the strongest perk in the game since it was added with Taurie. Sprint burst WAS the strongest EXHAUSTION perk. Not the strongest perk in general.
Hex thrill of the hunt is litterly nerfed harder then shoulder the burden. Thrill is basically shot at the knees
I'll be judgment here. Even as killer main I think people overrate shoulder the burden in 99.9 % cases. My issue is the absolute top tier usage where 4 survivors have it, play swf, extremely well and distribute hooks between themselves. While this is near impossible to go against it's also nearly impossible to deal with. There is only one situation where you should use the shoulder the burden and that is when someone has second hook stage and you have none. Either of they go second or if they are on hook for second time. This creates scenario where killer can choose to go for either unhooker or unhooked survivor in order to have a person with second hook stage. So the best case is that stb user has ds, go straight on second hook stage and can delay killer. Worse scenario is where they go for the unhooked survivor who isn't very good, has no antitunnel and die in next 20s anyway. Issue with STB isn't the casual game, if STB user is hooked first the perk is gone (theoretically). The issue is that in an absolute top level it can be abused to insane amount. Do I think new downsides are justified? No. But I do agree that this perk is too hard to balance to make it reasonably powerfull across all mmrs. 2 minutes of being broken is very big downsides and will make facing killers like Twins, Oni, Dredge or any slugging reliant build way harder to deal with. So I personally will forget this perk exists even when I used it a few times and will rather run perks like babysitter or borrowed time to support the teammate in different way.
DBD is a live service game. You can expect major changes to perks every now and then. People have been asking for a meta shake-up for a while now and it seems like it's finally here.
Or has anyone forgotten the big perk update from the 6.1.0 Mid-Chapter patch?
Either way, I am looking forward to seeing what changes. Undoubtedly it's going to have an impact on every preset build I have on my most-played characters. I might have to revisit them, and try them out.
I think what they have done to it is definitely overkill. The broken is not neccesary. Increase the expose length, sure… and making it 1 use per trial for everybody is enough.
Nobody should be majorly out matched in a game designed around casual play, with only a casual queue. Maybe if and when there is a ranked queue yes I'll agree.
But as of rn it shows there is a huge flaw.
TOTH is a unique problem though, the perk itself is defining how viable / unviable hexes as a whole are, that's entirely bad design for the sake of the game. STB does not share this problem in the slightest, and there's no justifiable reason to nerf it even nearly as significantly as they did.
STB doesn't affect a grand majority of games btw, Interestingly enough… it's also an anti tunnel perk… -5s of BT, STB Obliterated, SB Obliterated… Tunneling is STILL the number one most loathed aspect of DBD and it doesn't really have a close second, and BHVR continues to endorse it.
STB has a less than 3% pickrate and it doesn't set the killer back directly at all, it just moves a hook state. so destroying it yet again disproportionately affects solo queue by closing out another avenue of altruism build and destroying a perk that actually had value that made people want to bring it…
Which is another extremely bizarre design choice by the way, it's like BHVR thinks survivor perks that have a noticeable effect on a game are a bad thing. people want to bring perks that are going to have an effect, survivor players are getting increasingly angry because perks that do have an effect and can lead to memorable moments in the game or game saving plays are getting stripped away.
SB gets guaranteed value every game it's brought even though that value varies (now the perk sucks so it's debatable), but for nearly 10 years It could get you out of a deadzone and to a pallet or vault, now it really can't especially not against high movement killers. STB has no value if you are tunneled directly, and it only gets real value when someone is getting tunneled besides yourself. It's banned in COMP because when the very very top players in the game use it, it can be broken when going against some killers, just like there are perk builds for killer that are banned in COMP.
And i'll remind you BHVR almost never does anything to make up for nerfs on survivor side, it's just a trend of everything getting worse… what's most baffling is that it's also not even a reasonable nerf, like ever… they take good perks and turn them into abysmal perks because they just totally thrash every aspect of them. Vigil is a waste now, SB is a waste now, Distortion is a waste now, STB is a waste now, even perks like Dead Hard are extremely easy to wait out as killer now and killer power creep is making more and more things weak anyways.
I agree completely. Counterplay is for SURVIVORS ONLY
Just because it doesn't affect the grand majority of games doesn't mean its not inherently a problem perk. It promotes literally just let your teammate sit on hook until near death then rip off before they die. If a killer wants to confirm the kill since you let the person hit second you can just crank out gens for nearly 140 seconds, rip off hook and transfer the hook stage to yourself so the killer is in a lose-lose situation they can do nothing about. They either chase the person with 1 hook stage or chase the person with 1 hook stage while 1-2 gens are left and 4 people are still up.
It's does MUCH more than the simple minded thinking of "it just moves a hook state"
I mean come on… how is this even a talking point, the Killer could also be… pressuring the map and gens for 140 seconds. the killer is out nothing for that, actually. it's a strategic move by the survivors that costs them one active survivor on the map for 140 seconds. if you're playing a mobile killer like Blight (ironically your PfP) you should have ZERO problem keeping chase and gen pressure against 3 people in that span of over 2 minutes.
if the killer plays poorly in that entire span and then wants to return to hook for a freebie kill but can't get it because someone transfered the hook state that is happening because the killer played poorly and the survivors played well. that's how PvP games are supposed to work. and they CAN do something about it. if you don't want 3 survivors to crank gens for 140 seconds then put them on hooks also. if you can't then its an issue of you not playing well enough, or having to admit that maybe you're not the greatest player in the entire world and sometimes survivors outclass you.
"lose lose situation you can do nothing about" in an asym game where the killer holds all of the power to… kill is crazy btw.
you can call me simple minded but that's literally what it did. how you choose to respond to a hook state being moved is up to you, but maybe if you're resting on being able to tunnel someone out and you lose because they stop you from doing that, you are to blame because you went into a game expecting to tunnel someone to win and they prevented it.