We still don't have a killer that benefits for doing its job
I was wondering why we don't have a killer that gets stronger for every time you hook a survivor, kill a survivor, and sacrifice a survivor
Like at the start of the trial its M2 power is like demogorgon's dash attack with far more range and cannot break pallets, and every token added onto it increases the speed and control of the dash attack, and once you hit x tokens it becomes a one shot down attack with less control and more speed
Comments
But every killer tilts the match more in their favor for every incapacitated or dead survivor though. Survivors are at their strongest when 3 are on gens and 1 is being chased, and get weaker from there.
And there's probably also the fact it could be argued such a system would reward tunneling and/or camping depending on the implementation. Obviously it's perfectly legal to do either, but I feel the devs wouldn't really want to encourage it directly like that like old Dying Light could do.
Does injuring count?
if so this is one of my favorite Killer idea's that I've made.
I'd prefer it if we had a killer with an ability that helps getting the proverbial foot in the door in the beginning of a match.
because the company is the in the business of making money and they don't want to tick off survivors by adding a killer who with a mori would make the game harder and harder . if you have played this long enough you would see a trend , they only really hit survivors with big nerfs when the survivor ques get long because no one is playing killer because the games are so one sided . But to keep the appearance of equality they do small things constantly to survivors while completely redoing killers for "the better" .
Take the freddy rework , he was considered one of the worst killers in the game , yet they kept talking about how he was so unfair to survivors , now he is a bit more powerfull and easier to play but he is also weaker then the right build with the right addons were on old freddy . Class photo and pill bottle that would give you a extended 2 mins sleep timer and the ability to see all the others auras , you just chained them to sleep and chased down the last survivor . this was better then ruin , and using other aura perks like bbq and nurse you could see all survivors almost all the time . that is why they changed him and his add ons . If survivors cant deal with it they change it , plain and simple .
the nurse changes , she is still a valid killer but dependant like freddy was on add ons , you can boost her speed to normal killer speed but loose the ability to blink through objects , so if you run the right perk and add ons she will be considered overpowered still because she can still use blink to catch a survivor in the open . next im sure will be spirit .
Meanwhile the survivors get nerfs to things like insta heal which if you had to rely on one item to make or break the game then you need to play better , its not like they are changing the whole basekits on survivors , they haven't realy fixed totems placement but instead added survivors the ability to find and locate them easier and even perks for destroying them giving a added bonus to something they should want to do . they are giving them more and more ability to aura read killers or counter aura reads .
You have to understand that BHVR wants to make money and in a 4 v 1 game you don't want to make massive changes to the 4 and run the risk of killing your income , if you run off killer mains the odds are they will become survivors or you just run a free to play and sale to get new killers in , easier to replace 10k killers then 50k survivors , plus to be honest new blood means new money potential . So if you want a high turn over rate its in the killers not the survivors .
It would be a little backwards to have that, to be fair. The biggest thing for a killer is building up pressure early on. You'd ideally like to be as strong as possible as soon as possible. Getting stronger with each hook/kill is neat on paper, but in practice, it just means that you're weak when you need to down people the fastest and way stronger than you need to be when there's only one or two survivors left. At that point, the ball is already in your court. You don't need to be crazy strong when there's only two people left, it'd be overkill. Having someone dead on its own skews things in your favour massively; that's one less person that can do gens or go for a save.
There are some perks that work that way, though, if that's what you're after. Devour Hope, Dying Light, Huntress Lullaby, Thanataphobia, etc.
That's a very interesting perspective, but no, that's not the case. There's actually an excess of killers right now, so that theory is already right out the window. Killer queue times on average tend to be longer than survivor queue times (outside of Japan) at the moment. Beyond that, I'm not exactly sure what you mean by base kit nerfs for survivors. Survivors don't have powers that you can change, only perks. Most of the survivor perks have been nerfed significantly over the years, and even the basics such as vaulting have been toned down dramatically. Even the level design has shifted to more unsafe pallets.
I could grab you some old footage to show you how much things have changed, if you like, but choosing to ignore anything that doesn't support your point doesn't strengthen your case.
@Peanits I feel like survivor queue times are usually longer than killer queues on PS4. Is this a platform-related thing? Or is the time of day the deciding factor? Would it be possible for you to share statistics with us?
Definitely depends on various factors (rank, region, time of day, etc.), but the average shows that killer queue times tend to be longer across the board. We could look into possibly sharing those stats in the future, but it's sorta' tricky; there's no good way to show it because of all the variables that affect it. The average just shows the average and might not line up with what you experience based on where you live, what rank you are, what time it is, etc.
@Peanits Gotcha. 👍️
This. Sometimes your matches technically end at the beggining as killer. Didn't find anyone fast enough? You lose. Didn't bring RUIN (or it got broken immediately) and you had a lengthy chase with 2 to 3 gens popping? Well I hope you brought NOED/BW because if not you are probably going to lose.
Killer Matches are decided very early sometimes. It would be nice if they gave all killers a BBQ like effect at the start to give you a direction. And/Or had the entity block off gens for 30 seconds everytime a gen pops to prevent the "pop pop pop" effect.
A power that grows in strength would be Myers.
I think it would actually be a cool feature to have a pop up if the role you selected has a significantly longer expected que time at that specific moment.
Something like "Hey a ton of people are playing Killer now, so if you play Killer then expect a long wait". That way more people will switch to play the other role instead thus reducing que times overall.
I'd like to have a perk as a quick band-aid for now:
At the beginning of a match, see the auras of the 2 survivors farthest away from you for 4 seconds.
(I suggested that 3 months ago: https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/75624/new-killer-perk-hunters-instinct )
Every killer gets stronger automatically by default as soon as one survivor is out
How in ######### name would that be fair. It's already bad enough for survivors if someone kills themselves on a hook or gets tunneled to death. Not only would they make tunneling a much bigger problem than it is but it would also make the game near impossible after your first kill if the survivors have only finished, say 3/5 gens.
This is a completely ridiculous idea and I don't see how you don't understand that a killer killing a survivor benefits them because suddenly there is less survivors left to complete any of their objective
I quite like the concept but I feel it starting off with basically -1 orb in all categories would be too much of a negative (I understand there's addons to negate, but still). One very good looper could make it so you don't power up for a long minute and until then you're worse than a wraith even
In that case there was already a proposal that would remove the need for the downside. Please reply with your feedback on it because you are not the first person who's said that.
Personally my feel would be make them all be -.5 an orb rather than change it altogether. I suppose it'd be an odd killer though to never be 115 at some point, but someone using play w/ your food or so on would be used to it (and that would probably be one of the better moves to use with it early game to assure hits).
Can you put that on the actual Killer suggestion thread?
Also elaborate on what you mean by -0.5 an orb cuz each orb has it's own effects.
Lets see ruin, blocking 3 gens at the start for 2 minutes. I'd say that's pretty in the door.
sorry I didn't get a chance to respond , had things to do today and haven't been on forums . What do I mean by basekit nerfs , how about instead of items they have one per assigned to a specific survivor , jake for instance sabotage , clauds self care , that is what I mean . when you say a excess of killers , im not sure if you mean the number of killers in game or the number playing killer , but either way im fairly sure that both numbers are less then survivors , so how is that a excess ? yes ques are longer , but like you said lets go back a little over a year before the self heal nerf , I believe the killers had the shortest ques , as I stated survivors get minor adjustments until they end up with longer ques then get hit hard .
I never said that they didn't get nerfs , just not major ones unless numbers of survivors vs killers need to be adjusted . is only takes 10k killers to run 10k matches but it requires 40k survivors . And yes I do know about the early map designs and endless loops that have been changed to some degree and most of these changes are still going on 3 years later . Just like the issue about totem placement has been around since launch , some work has been done but the issue still remains . I have never been anti BHVR , matter fact in other threads ive been called a fanboy because I supported things like premium rift . But I do call things how I see them , and from a marketing and money making perspective as well as what changes have and haven't been done over the three years now , there is a noticeable pattern .
Like I said to the op though , a killer like that isn't good marketing and something as simple as a ebony mori would shunt the game soo much to that one killers side it wouldn't be funny . Personally I like to have fun , a fast game isn't usually fun (if they are toxic and I have a ebony by some stroke of luck then its satisfying) , neither is something that seems impossible , which is why I avoid playing at rank reset . anyone who has played me can attest to the fact that if I play someone who to me seems out of their league I take it easy on them and usually let them live no matter the outcome , I like for people to have fun . a good game to me is where after the match you can talk like human beings rather then something living under a bridge . Ohh and I play more survivor then killer just so you know , but your a dev and im sure could look that up should you choose . I enjoy playing killer more then survivor , but with limited time I go for whats the fastest , and no I don't use SWF either .
So is there any plan for Tier 1 Myers? It's too painful to get out of Tier 1 just to become a normal M1 killer with smaller terror radius.
You need to waste so much time stalking survivors at the beginning, which is the time when survivors are strongest. By the time you get out of Tier 1, 1-2 gens are done if survivors know what they are doing
They all get stronger this way??... Like what?
Every time you hook someone they do gens slower????
And on top of your dash ability that sounds like a ranged hit/shot ability so something like a hunter or a sniper
That's not a foot in the door. A foot in the door would be a hooked or at least a downed survivor.
If anything it should be stronger for every generator and survivor alive.
There's no need for such a silly power.
Here's the thing:
All killers benefit from doing their job.
Killer's job is to kill survivors. When you hook a survivor, you prolong the game by taking a survivor off the gens and forcing others to go for a save. If you sacrifice or kill the survivor that's one less person to worry about. This is an automatic huge benefit for all killers. The more you kill, the easier the game becomes.
There is no need to give extra benefits to the killer for doing so, but there are certainly perks that do so.
On the other hand, it's Survivors who do not benefit from doing their job.
Survivor's job is to finish gens so they can escape. When there are 8 gens on the map there are more safe places where the killer might not find you. As you finish gens the number of safe spaces you can be in go down, until there are only 3 spots left, making doing gens increasingly harder. Then if you manage to finish all the gens end game perks trigger like Rancor or NoEd that make life even harder for you.
Survivor is a job that gets harder as you do it.
It actually gets easier if you don't do your job. What is not your job? Doing totems -- this is a distraction but it makes the game easier for you. You can take out troublesome things like Ruin or Lullaby, or take out deadly things like NoEd and Devour Hope. Breaking hooks is not your job. But it can make certain places on the map safer for you.
So it's funny, but survivors absolutely do not benefit from doing their job in the sense that it just makes their job harder. It's necessary though to ultimately escape from the match.
I hope this opened your eyes a little.
One should differentiate between the normal flow of the game, and such a snowball-killer's unique kit.
Normal flow of the game applied to everyone...
The "snowball killer" gets stronger ADDITIONAL to the normal stuff.
---
I dont think such a slowstart would be in any kind balanceable at all.
"He has endgame potential, so we have to make his early game atrocious" - thats how such a killer would be designed in DBD, start as F tier, endgame turn into C tier.
In my opinion gen repair speeds need to be slower without any help from perks, playing in the top ranks against mostly swf friends groups it does no good to bring ruin, or devour hope, they are both nailed within the first minute of the match, while chasing a damn good survivor through endless loops, by the time you down that survivor the totem is gone and 2 gens have popped. Totem placements are garbage, and damn near every match you've got a survivor bringing a map or a key, usually both! In all seriousness the game is balanced if the 4 survivors are randoms without party chat, but those pesky swf groups, which happen quite often in the 1-8 ranks, the game is completely unbalanced! I don't know what suggestions or actions to fix some of the issues, make bloodlust great again would be nice, or a slight speed buffs to killers. I'm sure there's going to be replies of get good or so on, but I play as both survivor and killer and both are equal ranks and it's not even close to being balanced in ranks 1-8!
The killer who I got to rank 1 with is Ghostface running Barbeque and Chili, Nurses Calling, Hex Ruin, and All Ears they really come in handy
PS4 player here. Queue times have always been longer as survivor than killer. No matter the time of day, rank, swf, or solo.
Yes, and it's worse for the swf groups also! Solo from either side is quick!
I've had to wait 20 minutes as a solo as well. But yes swf can be crazy long.