dude i constantly get games with 2+ DS in red ranks and i rarely get stunned. just dont tunnel when you got an obsession, if you cant win games without having someone kicking the bucket early than maybe go down a few ranks by playing without tunneling. Than once you get used to playing without tunneling maybe try to rank up. you can still slug people who get unhooked and are in hitting range but dont go out of your way to slug that one guy.
DS only lasts for 20-30 seconds. No more "I was not tunneling" excuses.
Once the unhooked Survivor gets downed by the Killer within the 30 seconds, DS becomes active and stays active until the killer picks up the survivor. No more slugging and playing around DS.
When picked up, the Survivor faces a difficult skillcheck
DS becomes deactivated once the survivor is fully healed or hiding in a locker or doing any actions like repairing Generators, unhooking or healing someone else. No more abuse of DS.
Simple and effective changes, for both sides very fair.
DS only lasts for 20-30 seconds. No more "I was not tunneling" excuses.
Once the unhooked Survivor gets downed by the Killer within the 30 seconds, DS becomes active and stays active until the killer picks up the survivor. No more slugging and playing around DS.
When picked up, the Survivor faces a difficult skillcheck
DS becomes deactivated once the survivor is fully healed or hiding in a locker. No more abuse of DS.
Simple and effective changes, for both sides very fair.
"DS becomes deactivated once the survivor is fully healed or hiding in a locker. No more abuse of DS."
No time for that, but i am sure, they mentioned it right before the rework.
That's not how this works. You can't just say "idk where or when, but I'm sure they said it." Either get a direct quote or don't spread misinformation.
""DS becomes deactivated once the survivor is fully healed or hiding in a locker. No more abuse of DS."
Or touches a gen and we have a deal."
I already had.
If you don't think so you can do that without backhanded sarcasm.
Unfortunately for you, you don't get to dictate how I write my comments. If you think it's inappropriate then report it. Otherwise worry about yourself.
Unfortunately for you, you don't get to dictate how I write my comments. If you think it's inappropriate then report it. Otherwise worry about yourself.
You started a conversation with me.
You don't start a conversation with someone and then tell them to mind their own business. If you don't like my opinions then mind your own business.
If you actually get to rank 1 on both sides you will understand this games balance a little more.
With Enduring no longer affecting stuns why can't we have the 3 second long stun back? 5 seconds is absolutely insane
Given that it is now very situational and easy to avoid, it doesn't seem to be necessary. Three seconds of stun time (of which you're locked into an animation for one second) is not enough of a deterrent to make the perk worthwhile.
I remember when the devs said they took out the “slight counter of enduring” To DS because it was 3 seconds. Which was understandable. Then they proceed to buff it to 5 seconds and not revert the enduring changes to it.
makes logical sense.
the amount of free escapes I get with DS is unbelievable, its funny to use it when you have borrowed time applied to you. :DD
Given that it is now very situational and easy to avoid, it doesn't seem to be necessary. Three seconds of stun time (of which you're locked into an animation for one second) is not enough of a deterrent to make the perk worthwhile.
Thanks!
Maybe this will decrease the number of DS topics :3
I remember when the devs said they took out the “slight counter of enduring” To DS because it was 3 seconds. Which was understandable. Then they proceed to buff it to 5 seconds and not revert the enduring changes to it.
makes logical sense.
the amount of free escapes I get with DS is unbelievable, its funny to use it when you have borrowed time applied to you. :DD
The timeline is a little bit mixed up here. It was increased to 5 seconds and then Enduring was changed.
Given that it is now very situational and easy to avoid, it doesn't seem to be necessary. Three seconds of stun time (of which you're locked into an animation for one second) is not enough of a deterrent to make the perk worthwhile.
What about in the endgame situation where it's eat ds and escape hit bt and escape or get hit by both
Well yes, but enduring no longer plays a role in the stun time. Which is odd considering at end game it’s crucial. Not to mention they can farm you with BT, it’s pretty much a lose scenario. 5 seconds is is a lot of time to in a survivors hand.
Decisive Strike Q&A with Horvath | February 22, 2019
Today we did a Q&A session on discord with Stefan Horvath about the upcoming changes on Decisive Strike.
So here are below the answers given by our Game Designer/Stefan Horvath.
Question: What led to the decision to put the timer on Decisive Strike?
Horvath: We decided to put a timer on Decisive Strike as one of the solutions to Decisive Strike being used too often, we tried 2 minutes internally and found that players were able to use DS a long time after being unhooked, where it no longer serves the purpose to protect you from being tunneled/ farmed
Question: Are these changes final?
Horvath: We are constantly looking at feedback from out players as well as in respect to the new content that we create, for now you will see this version of Decisive Strike on the PTB
Question: Why the timer? Doesn’t that just encourage the survivor to get downed again just to have a perk?
Horvath: Well, it depends on how you see it. You only disable Decisive Strike if you've successfully hit the skill check, or if you tried to hit the skill check and failed. Therefore the timer serves as a window to use the perk, but not to lose the perk.
Question: Doesn’t the change to DS make it very similar to borrowed time and kind of redundant in purpose?
Horvath: I feel like borrowed time and Decisive Strike serve a similar purpose, but DS is controlled by the person on the hook, whereas Borrowed Time requires a teammate to run it and unhook you. I believe there is place for both perks
Question: Have you considered making it so Enduring doesn't apply to DS stun, now that the stun lasts 3 seconds?
Horvath: There has been a lot of feedback regarding the 3 second stun for Decisive Strike, previously the stun has been 4 seconds for a long time, once upon a time it used to be 5 seconds. We are currently revising and investigating what we will do regarding enduring and the Decisive Strike timer, it may end up being 4 seconds, but I believe we will try 3 seconds in the PTB. I look forward to your feedback
Question: About the DS changes, wouldn’t these changes punish killers if they find the same survivor and or during a killer's snowball?
Horvath: There is definitely a possibility that this happens, I deliberately ran to the killer and was downed/ picked up to just get my DS off and it definitely affected the tide of the game. But ultimately, we have tried to mitigate the amount of time DS wastes in respect to the killer, having the skillcheck occur during pick up and no longer having the non-obsession wiggling out at 35% will save a lot of time.
Question: Thanks again for being here it's really nice that you take the time to be closer to the community. When you started the discussion about DS, what did you have in mind ? Did you wanted to straight up nerf it or just change/adjust it ?
Horvath: Decisive Strike has been a topic of conversation for a long time, we have entertained several iterations in the past. I will see if I can go into the interations. Ultimately, when we look at balancing the game we try and offer an experience that is fun for everyone, while understanding that one side is trying to kill the other :P. There are definitely frustrations, and we are constantly looking to make this more fun and enjoyable for everyone.
Question: Should the stun not be longer (original 5 sec) if the Survivor who used DS was already the Obsession to give them extra time against like for example a black box Freddy?
Horvath: Definitely a possibility, I don’t know if we will go to 5 seconds though
Question: Isn't this DS change a nerf to Dying Light? Since the obsession changes and is therefore alive when a new obsession is chosen?
Horvath: This will definitely affect Dying Light if survivors choose to proc DS at the right moments. Depending on the gameplay and decisions made a survivor team could reverse the effects of Dying Light, until another obsession dies. I think the new obsession interaction should be quite interesting, and I look forward to how you guys use it.
Question: Could you confirm that rancor won’t be an insane perk because of the new changes?
Horvath: Rancor will be quite interesting, the edge case to be able to achieve 4 mori's with Rancor will be very hard to achieve. Considering the time it takes to mori someone, and that the last person still needs to get off the hook and have time left on their Decisive Strike. It may happen though, and I hope it's clipped when it does
Question: i personally think it’s almost impossible to do it as by that time survivors will either win or simply use the ds early so you only get 1 rancor kill
Horvath: You may have to try and put more chance on your side with Blood Warden
Question: Why doesn't the timer only progress when you're in a hunt? I mean, wouldn't that be balanced?
Horvath: We chose to keep 60 seconds as the window of opportunity to limit the situations where you can use DS. Feedback that we have received from the community and evidence of how our games play out indicate that being able to DS out of the killers grasp at any time in the match can have a major effect on the killers efficiency. With the timer now, players should feel more rewarded when hitting their DS and hopefully killers won’t feel that the DS stun was out of place under the current conditions
Question: Will the size of DS' skill check remain the same? or will we be seeing a bigger chance due to the change to it?
Horvath: The skill check is going to be slightly larger than the first tier overcharge skillcheck.
Question: Does it feel good to make a change to a perk that has plagued both sides of the community, killers and survivors, for so long?
Horvath: We will see how it works out in the wild, I believe we as a team enjoy to work at making this game more pleasant and interesting for everyone.
Question: I have very interesting question to you and your team but i don’t know you want to say that to us. We will get Decisive in PTB, so there is my question - PTB will come to us in Tuesday?
Horvath: I unfortunately cannot tease you with the date! But I am excited for you guys to try it out.
Question: What do you think about all killers perks like "play with your food", "rancor" or even "remember me"? Isn't the new DS a kinda huge nerf for them?
Horvath: It depends on which perk you are running, Rancor could end up with multiple moris on multiple survivors, Play With Your Food may change your mentality, and you may lose the chase with the survivor to gain a token to chase someone else down. Remember Me will allow you to trigger more time on the door if you have not reached maximum stacks.
Question: There are a lot of bugs in the game, and you guys think about changing perks…
Horvath: I think it's an interesting question, I focus on many aspects not just improving perks, perks can sometimes be easier to adjust in comparison to large components of the game and they definitely add value to replayability and keeping things fresh.
Question: Does this mean dribbling a survivor serves no purpose? Good on BHVR to remove that.
Horvath: Yes dribbling should no longer be a thing, I do not believe this was mentioned in the blogpost but there is now a 0.5 second delay before a killer can drop a survivor after picking them up. This should avoid dribbling and flashlight dodging right after a pick up. (flashlights can still be avoided by facing away from them)
Question: With how short game time is if survivors choose to optimally complete their objective, isn't DS still a perk that grants too much ground, and now encourages 4 people to run it in a game since everyone gets the same effect regardless of obsession status?
Horvath: I am quite excited to see how we behave with the new Decisive strike Changes, I am not sure everyone will run it, I am also wondering if some killers will even see DS proc if they do not tunnel. The 60 seconds does allow for enough time to find a killer after being unhooked, but I believe it will come down to a smart strategy in that case.
Question: Do you have any plans at the moment to adjust the other Obsession perks, since the obsession-switching has such a drastic effect on that mechanic?
Horvath: All perks can possibly change depending on what ideas we have for them, if they fit and depending on how the community views them. The Obsession mechanic hasn't had many updates so far, so it is possible more changes will come for them.
Question: Out of curiosity, What has been the general reaction to the new decisive strike changes?
Question: Out of curiosity, What has been the general reaction to the new decisive strike changes?
Horvath: There have been a lot of emotions, I believe there have been more than a few people who have wanted DS changes and even more who are unsure whether they like or dislike the changes. I am personally excited to see what happens when it is released.
Question: Has it been asked yet if the DS timer will continue to count if BT is applied? I'm assuming both timers will run simultaneously?
Horvath: I am not 100% sure, they should be both running simultaneously imo.
Question: Does the 60 Second timer introduced with the rework still run when in the dying state? Meaning can a killer just slug the suspected DS user to wait the DS out?
Horvath: Absolutely, from what I've gathered from the community feedback so far and internal talk, there may be some slug metas incoming, and obviously anti slugging perks will probably come out to play as well. time will tell though
Question: So you can no longer save DS? once you miss it, it's a wrap right?
Horvath: If you succeed or fail the skill check it's gone. But if you let the skillcheck go by it will be active again when you are unhooked the next time
Question: Why does DS have to make the survivor the obsession? Am I missing something?
Horvath: We thought it would be an interaction that the players would enjoy, it was not necessary.
Question: Is the timer still something that BHVR will be looking into? DS's effective time zone seems incredibly small as of right now and easily countered by simply slugging for a minute.
Horvath: Timer can be subject to change, it will be 40/50/60 seconds on the PTB though for you guys to try it out and offer your feedback
"Horvath: We decided to put a timer on Decisive Strike as one of the solutions to Decisive Strike being used too often, we tried 2 minutes internally and found that players were able to use DS a long time after being unhooked, where it no longer serves the purpose to protect you from being tunneled/ farmed."
Given that it is now very situational and easy to avoid, it doesn't seem to be necessary. Three seconds of stun time (of which you're locked into an animation for one second) is not enough of a deterrent to make the perk worthwhile.
"Horvath: We decided to put a timer on Decisive Strike as one of the solutions to Decisive Strike being used too often, we tried 2 minutes internally and found that players were able to use DS a long time after being unhooked, where it no longer serves the purpose to protect you from being tunneled/ farmed."
Thanks, that's interesting. I still think they see anti tunneling/farming as DS' main purpose but not necessarily its only purpose. But I appreciate you sharing that quote.
DS only lasts for 20-30 seconds. No more "I was not tunneling" excuses.
Once the unhooked Survivor gets downed by the Killer within the 30 seconds, DS becomes active and stays active until the killer picks up the survivor. No more slugging and playing around DS.
When picked up, the Survivor faces a difficult skillcheck
DS becomes deactivated once the survivor is fully healed or hiding in a locker. No more abuse of DS.
Simple and effective changes, for both sides very fair.
Given that it is now very situational and easy to avoid, it doesn't seem to be necessary. Three seconds of stun time (of which you're locked into an animation for one second) is not enough of a deterrent to make the perk worthwhile.
My only issue with DS is it lasts 60 and keeps ticking no matter what. I don't want to have to leave that guy on the ground cause he maybe has DS. 60 seconds is a long time in DBD, and alot of survivors abuse it. Making it shorter or ending it when they do something like heal or fix a gen or something, would really help alot.
Before anyone says anything, I don't tunnel or camp, I rarely slug cause i like Thrilling Tremors. I still get hit with DS cause I found that one guy again before the 60 seconds is up.
Given that it is now very situational and easy to avoid, it doesn't seem to be necessary. Three seconds of stun time (of which you're locked into an animation for one second) is not enough of a deterrent to make the perk worthwhile.
I disagree, Survivors can put you into a lose-lose situation. You slug them? Unbreakable Dead Hard or Flip-Flop. They jump in a locker? Head On and Inner Strength. You pick them up? Now you're just tunneling.
"Horvath: We decided to put a timer on Decisive Strike as one of the solutions to Decisive Strike being used too often, we tried 2 minutes internally and found that players were able to use DS a long time after being unhooked, where it no longer serves the purpose to protect you from being tunneled/ farmed."
KILLAH MAINZ: tUnNeLiNg iS a LeGiT sTrAt!!1
DEVS: *changes most complained about perk to be anti-tunnel intstead of making a survivor basekit mechanic to counter tunneling*
KILLAH MAINZ: *still tunnels unhooked survivor but then slugs allowing the Dev's change to be countered and making the reason for their change pointless*
I've been a killer main for around 1500 hours of my 2k hours. Since the DS change, I've been hit with it a total of three times. Why? I don't tunnel. If You are one of two left and I down you shortly after the hook, I slug you and go for the last. By the time I get back to you, 60 seconds is gone. No DS concerns. I have enjoyed living a DS-free life to be honest.
If you have a problem with DS, you should try not tunneling so much. Period.
"Horvath: We decided to put a timer on Decisive Strike as one of the solutions to Decisive Strike being used too often, we tried 2 minutes internally and found that players were able to use DS a long time after being unhooked, where it no longer serves the purpose to protect you from being tunneled/ farmed."
KILLAH MAINZ: tUnNeLiNg iS a LeGiT sTrAt!!1
DEVS: *changes most complained about perk to be anti-tunnel intstead of making a survivor basekit mechanic to counter tunneling*
KILLAH MAINZ: *still tunnels unhooked survivor but then slugs allowing the Dev's change to be countered and making the reason for their change pointless*
You should really look into the issues actually being presented regarding DS before commenting.
I'm fairly certain that most survivors agree that slugging is a fair DS counter option.
Tldr: This is an archived version of the DBD forum, it has all posts, comments and media. The archived data will be published at the end of October. This site is not in any way affiliated with or endorsed by Behaviour Interactive.
Comments
Still waiting for them to revert that buff to 5 seconds because the reason for it no longer exists, but probably not.
What adjustments are you asking for though? I think its fine as it is.
dude i constantly get games with 2+ DS in red ranks and i rarely get stunned. just dont tunnel when you got an obsession, if you cant win games without having someone kicking the bucket early than maybe go down a few ranks by playing without tunneling. Than once you get used to playing without tunneling maybe try to rank up. you can still slug people who get unhooked and are in hitting range but dont go out of your way to slug that one guy.
How to change DS:
Simple and effective changes, for both sides very fair.
"DS becomes deactivated once the survivor is fully healed or hiding in a locker. No more abuse of DS."
Or touches a gen and we have a deal.
yea good adition.
How about if a survivor moves DS becomes inactivate?
Which DS are we talking about here? Decisive Strike DS, or dedicated servers DS?
In the case of the former, no. In the case of the latter, yes.
No thank you. DS is perfectly fine.
Please find me a quote where the devs said DS is only to be used for anti tunneling purposes.
When you offer up an intelligent change for the perk I'll be sure to do just that.
No time for that, but i am sure, they mentioned it right before the rework.
""DS becomes deactivated once the survivor is fully healed or hiding in a locker. No more abuse of DS."
Or touches a gen and we have a deal."
I already had.
If you don't think so you can do that without backhanded sarcasm.
That's not how this works. You can't just say "idk where or when, but I'm sure they said it." Either get a direct quote or don't spread misinformation.
Unfortunately for you, you don't get to dictate how I write my comments. If you think it's inappropriate then report it. Otherwise worry about yourself.
Going to copy/paste this. :)
With Enduring no longer affecting stuns why can't we have the 3 second long stun back? 5 seconds is absolutely insane
You started a conversation with me.
You don't start a conversation with someone and then tell them to mind their own business. If you don't like my opinions then mind your own business.
If you actually get to rank 1 on both sides you will understand this games balance a little more.
People struggle with ds even after the big change?Lol
Given that it is now very situational and easy to avoid, it doesn't seem to be necessary. Three seconds of stun time (of which you're locked into an animation for one second) is not enough of a deterrent to make the perk worthwhile.
"If you actually get to rank 1 on both sides you will understand this games balance a little more."
Not taking that bait, but nice try.
When you only play at low ranks you wouldn't.
I remember when the devs said they took out the “slight counter of enduring” To DS because it was 3 seconds. Which was understandable. Then they proceed to buff it to 5 seconds and not revert the enduring changes to it.
makes logical sense.
the amount of free escapes I get with DS is unbelievable, its funny to use it when you have borrowed time applied to you. :DD
Thanks!
Maybe this will decrease the number of DS topics :3
The timeline is a little bit mixed up here. It was increased to 5 seconds and then Enduring was changed.
What about in the endgame situation where it's eat ds and escape hit bt and escape or get hit by both
+1
They should deactivate once gates are powered. There is very little counter play here.
Well yes, but enduring no longer plays a role in the stun time. Which is odd considering at end game it’s crucial. Not to mention they can farm you with BT, it’s pretty much a lose scenario. 5 seconds is is a lot of time to in a survivors hand.
@Peanits
Here is the best I can give you:
"Horvath: We decided to put a timer on Decisive Strike as one of the solutions to Decisive Strike being used too often, we tried 2 minutes internally and found that players were able to use DS a long time after being unhooked, where it no longer serves the purpose to protect you from being tunneled/ farmed."
Not enough? I profoundly disagree.
Thanks, that's interesting. I still think they see anti tunneling/farming as DS' main purpose but not necessarily its only purpose. But I appreciate you sharing that quote.
I do like this idea though.
My only issue with DS is it lasts 60 and keeps ticking no matter what. I don't want to have to leave that guy on the ground cause he maybe has DS. 60 seconds is a long time in DBD, and alot of survivors abuse it. Making it shorter or ending it when they do something like heal or fix a gen or something, would really help alot.
Before anyone says anything, I don't tunnel or camp, I rarely slug cause i like Thrilling Tremors. I still get hit with DS cause I found that one guy again before the 60 seconds is up.
I disagree, Survivors can put you into a lose-lose situation. You slug them? Unbreakable Dead Hard or Flip-Flop. They jump in a locker? Head On and Inner Strength. You pick them up? Now you're just tunneling.
Give Killers an incentive to not tunnel.
"Horvath: We decided to put a timer on Decisive Strike as one of the solutions to Decisive Strike being used too often, we tried 2 minutes internally and found that players were able to use DS a long time after being unhooked, where it no longer serves the purpose to protect you from being tunneled/ farmed."
KILLAH MAINZ: tUnNeLiNg iS a LeGiT sTrAt!!1
DEVS: *changes most complained about perk to be anti-tunnel intstead of making a survivor basekit mechanic to counter tunneling*
KILLAH MAINZ: *still tunnels unhooked survivor but then slugs allowing the Dev's change to be countered and making the reason for their change pointless*
I've been a killer main for around 1500 hours of my 2k hours. Since the DS change, I've been hit with it a total of three times. Why? I don't tunnel. If You are one of two left and I down you shortly after the hook, I slug you and go for the last. By the time I get back to you, 60 seconds is gone. No DS concerns. I have enjoyed living a DS-free life to be honest.
If you have a problem with DS, you should try not tunneling so much. Period.
You should really look into the issues actually being presented regarding DS before commenting.
I'm fairly certain that most survivors agree that slugging is a fair DS counter option.
What's the timeline on getting it changed back, now that Enduring no longer effects it?
Stop tunneling