White ward vs Franklins demise
So, is it meant to be that Franklins counters the white ward offering? Or is it like that because of bad coding/code limitations?
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So, is it meant to be that Franklins counters the white ward offering? Or is it like that because of bad coding/code limitations?
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How do you die without getting hit first.
Let Franklin's do its job. Its literally useless during chase, useless for tracking, useless for everything expect a lobby with a key or at least 2 toolboxes.
You've never shared a fast medkit with a friend?
So now we all know
Perk > Offering
Non-basic hits, like chainsaws and hatchets.
It also used to be that way with the moon offering JS
Never with a white ward.
things like Locker grabs or hatchet hits wont proc Franklins.
Wanting to keep an item not in your possession is like wanting the ward to work even when the item runs out of charges. It's, for all intents and purposes, gone. No longer present. Survivors don't need free items any more than killers need free ultra rares
Free items? It's an item you earned + wasted an offering to protect. Your bias is heavy
It's not any kind of bias, I mostly play survivor. You're asking to keep an item you no longer possess. The ward prevents you from losing the item when you DIE, it specifically states that. You're asking for a buff to an offering and that's what it comes down to.
Then you wouldnt lose your item.
That's my point. They're saying WW should protect when you die and drop your item. But you dont drop it if you dont get hit by regular attacks.
Grabs and chainsaws wouldnt cause you to drop your item.
If you bring in an item, especially a flash light with at least 1 other flash light player expect franklins. Also if you play survivor you should know not to be too attached to items to begin with.
I was honestly 100% blown away that this topic exists :P
Will you STOP with the 'bias' thing?
Every time someone disagrees with you, you say 'bias!' like it's a magical 'I win!' comment.
YOU want an item that works fine changed to favor YOUR style of play (Survivors) so YOU can keep items you'd normally lose, even if YOU put it down/a Killer uses Franklin's on YOU.
That's basically being pretty biased, dude. 'Favor what I play' with a pretty loudly not-said 'Because I play it'.
Why do I say that's unsaid? Because there's no valid reason, balance-wise, to want to change White Ward. The only reason you want to change it is because you want to keep your items.
IE: You want it changed to favor YOU. Which is BIASED.
No, I only say "bias" when I see bias. Has nothing to do with disagreeing. Now move on with your bias somewhere else, thanks.
Ok. If I'm not biased for disagreeing, AND I'm giving you legitimate reasons for White Ward staying as it is..
Why am I biased?
I haven't say that you are biased, I said that to the one who said that items are free and got confused that you quoted me
You just told me to move my bias elsewhere.
Either you're a troll, and this thread should be deleted, or...I dunno what else.
I never said items were free, I said asking for the changes you're thinking of is like asking for a free item. The moment you drop it, it's no longer in your possession. You no longer HAVE an item for the ward to protect. You're asking for them to magically throw it back into your inventory when you die, aka a free item.
As I said, I got confused that you quoted me. I thought it was that guy again
Guys/Gals, just disengage, please.
We all know it's nonsensical, stupid, and will never be implemented.
Take solace in that instead of feeding further confrontation :3
Side note...
Ever think its weird that killers lose their addons no matter how well they did? I get you dont want a killer to be using their iri heads and such EVERYGAME, but why are survivor items not treated the same way? Not trying to start an arguement and this isnt meant to be a loaded question. I get that using really strong killer addons would boost the chances of you doing well, which would then boost your chance of keeping the addons if they stayed when you "win". What I dont understand though is why its not both ways when the same can be said about someone cranking out gens with the same stocked up toolbox each game.
Then it's bad design.
A perk should not override an offering. If someone uses a WW it should protect the item they bring no matter what.
Imagine if DS made you immune to mori. Killers would have an absolute fit.
If you want to avoid franklins and keep your item, jump in a locker and make the killer take you out.
White Ward ONLY saves your item if you have it IN YOUR HAND while you die.
And even then, it protects whatever item you're holding, NOT exactly what you came in with.
Came with with White Ward & no item, died carrying a toolbox? You keep the toolbox.
Came in with a brown medkit, died carrying a green flashlight you found? You keep the Flashlight.
This is not bad design. This is literally what the offering was made to do. You only think it's bad design because you want to keep your item no matter what.
Explain why perks should not cancel out offerings
I have always wanted a 4k to save killer add-ons, but balance it to only be below ultra rares or something.
Find it pretty silly that you don't get your item back
Isn't the icon of White Ward a pretty big signal saying that you need to have an Item on you to keep it?
I know, i know, mechanics shouldn't be based on artwork, but maybe in this case artwork is based on mechanics. 🤔
The easiest way to explain it at this point is dropping an item is like using all of it's charges. It's gone. For good. Picking it back up is like finding an identical item to the one you used up! So, if used up there is nothing there for the ward to save unless you pick up the new, identical item. Wanting it to save your dropped item is like asking for the game to open a chest and give you an identical item to the one you used up. A do-over, a freebie, whatever you'd like to call it.
You already get to keep the item and add-ons if it's in your hands and you escape, but you're asking for an offering to keep your item and add-ons even if you die without having it on you. As biased as they come.
Thoughts and Feelies, obviously.
Yea and it shouldn't be that way. If you bring a WW you are doing it to protect your item. That's what it's meant to do. Give me a reason why you need to outright remove the item from a survivors inventory if they use an offering specifically to protect their item.
Okay then DS should make you immune to moris. I'm sure you would think that's fair since perks should override offerings. If you don't agree that should be a thing then you are a hypocrite.
Perks can be reused. Offering cannot.
WW should protect your item no matter what. It's bad design that it doesn't because not only would you lose an item you waste an offering too.
No, it's not bad design.
It's you being selfish. You decided 'I want to keep my item no matter what' and expect the Devs to agree.
It's selfish & biased in the extreme to claim 'It does not favor me more, so it's bad design'.
White Ward is fine. Stop asking for a heavy buff/a nerf to Franklin's just because you don't want to spend your BP on more items.
LOL
That's pretty terrible logic, sir/madam, particularly when everything is literally functioning as intended, but you're so entitled that you feel it necessary to continue a losing "argument."
(Argument is in quotes, as both sides generally need to have some type of foothold for it to be a worthy endeavor)
Ds does not state it protects you from moris. The ward SPECIFICALLY states it protects your (YOUR) item if you die. Don't have it on you? Not yours. Man you're biased.
Cuz perks can be used every time, offerings are getting consumed. Imagine you could use a perk to disable a killer addon. Or make you not mori-able. Would be stupid design.
Yet most survivors don't need perks for that lol I certainly don't
So then if DS was changed to say "you cannot be mori'd" you would be okay with that?
I would bet money you guys would be the first to come here to complain about it.
My point is that a perk should NEVER override an offering. And it doesn't matter what the offering currently says, the point of the OP is that it should NOT do this.
Stupid design is what you're literally advocating for.
There's a reason that you're in the (literal) vocal minority with regards to this.
Tag a Dev here and see what they say - I'm sure we'll all be amused.
Just let it die. It's obviously 2 people who just want the game to skew towards Survivors in this aspect and can't admit that their only arguments for it as coming from a Survivor bias.
LOL because of all the killer mains that want to keep it the way it is for literally no reason. Like for real look at everything you guys are saying. You're only argument is "derrr that's what it says" which ignores the entire point the OP is trying to make. IT SHOULD NOT WORK THAT WAY.
Tell me, what is the point of removing the item from a survivor's inventory? There is no reason you should even care, the only thing that matters when you use Frankie's is that the survivor cannot use the item during YOUR trial.
I already hate the current DS, but I'm fine with it being in the game, much like I think Adrenaline, NOED, etc can be a bit silly, but I accept them as being in the game.
Using hypothetical/non-existent changes and my perceived reaction (really, Google some logical fallacies, please), doesn't do add anything to your argument at all.
You CAN use a perk to disable a killer add-on lmao. Hell, some survivor perks negate killer perks. Distortion, killer can't see my aura no matter the add-on or perk for three instances. Calm Spirit just negates part of the Doctor's entire power. No Mither kills the Spirit being able to hear you. Tada. Man you're biased.
There, I think that's the number of times you've called a dissenting opinion a "bias".
"IT SHOULD NOT WORK THAT WAY."
Ask the devs why it does, please.
Really, do it.
I'll wait :D
So killer add-ons shouldn't be removed at all either? Cause you shouldn't care right? Iri heads every game are cool right? Like an engineer box with add-ons every game for every survivor? We need to be able to take it from you otherwise survivors win every game just because you can take down. 3 gens before a killer even sees one of you.
If you bring a Black Ward no.
But image a survivor perk that would remove your add-ons, then even if you used a Black Ward you lose them.
They don't negate your offering though. If you offer a mori, no survivor perk will counter that.
Distortion has limited use.
Calm Spirit can be countered by aura read or illusion extension add-ons for Doc.
No Mither you still make sounds, and Spirit can use Stridor to counter Iron Will.
@Peanits Can you or another dev come in and end this inane argument, please?
It's getting nowhere and it needs to be ended, and only a dev can put right the opposing views, regardless of which is right or wrong.