Sixth month of SBMM
We're on our 6th month of SBMM, and can honestly say, it's worse than before. Yes, in theory and on paper, it's better. And if it actually worked that way it would be. But it simply doesn't.
Before you'd have mostly even games, with people running all different kinds of builds. Occasionally you'd have survivors in red ranks that weren't actually supposed to be there. Or you'd go against rank 20 survivors when you're rank 1, or you'd go against a full sweat squad, but it wasn't every single game.
Now however it's one or the other. You're either going against baby's, or full squads running full meta builds.
Just last night alone, very first match went against a wraith that had 1 yellow wraith perk and less than 10 hours in the game total. Now I'm not a top tier survivor, but I'm decent. And the randos I was with were decent and they all had full builds of the most meta perks. The wraith got 2 hits the entire match.
Very next match, I'm paired with extremely bad survivors. And I end up going against a top tier killer main TTV that has thousands of hours in the game. I know his gameplay, as I've watched him before, and know he's really really good. Far better than the people he was playing against. Every survivor I had on my team had 1-2 perks and less than 50 hours combined. I only have about 70 on survivor as I mainly play killer.
When I play killer, this is every match for me as well. It's usually a full team of meta survivors and the match lasts 5-7 minute, and I'll get anywhere between 4-8 of those in a row, and then I'll get a full team of baby survivors who don't deserve having to go against me because I'm actually pretty good on killer. But there's no in between. Nobody running interesting fun builds anymore, it's either full meta all around or nothing.
Like I get that they said it was due to backfill. But it's been 6 months! Six months of a large majority of players having to deal with this and still no fix. All we know is it's being worked on. It's no wonder people are leaving in drones. This system right now, is not better than the old emblem system by any means.
Comments
6 months on from the implementation and damn it's almost like the people that were saying it'd be terrible (the majority of people) were right and it's terrible and it's yet more proof that the community should be included far earlier in the design process to let the teams know that an idea is terrible
Well, not to say I told you so, but I did say MMR would be horrible way back in August.
i wish I had been wrong
Its terrible because it only counts kills and escapes.
That's not the only reason.
There's literally not enough players to support our current system. Even if it were tightened up, we'd be looking at 30 minute queues for Survivors at peak hours. Nobody wants that.
Honestly?
I saw more people for it than against it just because the Rank System was super hated. They were hopeful. One thing I saw tossed around a lot was, "It can't possibly get any worse."
Naïve little us, thinking it couldn't possibly get worse than random.
How wrong we were.
If life has taught me anything, it's that saying the phrase "It can't possibly get worse" means it is now 100% guaranteed to get worse.
Devs will say the stats say it works fine while ignoring the players saying it doesn't feel fine and is encouraging unfun gameplay.
Yeah I knew it was gonna be a bad idea to implement it for a game so heavily influenced on RNG and chaos. But I didn't think they'd just, ignore everything and do it anyways. Silly me for having hope.
unfortunately they refuse to believe their dogshit system isn't awful and we're stuck with it until the game is done
Grade progression stuck +0
Look at this thread. There is the explaination that grades are mostly still the emblem system. And that is a far superior indication of skill.
The biggest joke of the whole SBMM/MMR thing is when one of the CMs, I think Peanits came out and said something like "yeah we tried MMR based on kills and escapes before and it didn't work, the new system is better"
Then we learn it's the exact same thing. Nothing has changed on the surface
Hilarious
Yeah I've made a bunch of posts about that. Grades are still skill based. As killer, you can't grade up in iri if you only get 2-3 kills. You have to consistently get 3-4ks with few gens getting done in order to pip. Maybe early in like ash-silver it's time played, but once you get to gold and iri, you have to do well to pip. Which means you have to be skilled and be skilled enough to do it consistently.
It's fine when it actually tries to do its job of making balanced matches. It just rarely tries to do that. What's the point of even having SBMM if it's going to freak out and start throwing people of all MMR together once wait times get long? It's worse than what we had before.
I get absolute babies for solo teammates and go against babies on killer if I play during peak hours. They're also so bad at detecting cheating that you get punished for being at the top end when SBMM actually tries to work. My 4 man SWF gets hacking Spirits every other game on Saturday mornings when we usually play. Pre-swinging out of phase with Mother Daughter ring healthy or injured everywhere on the map, even crouched behind random objects at the edge.
In life and DBD.
Mandy also mentioned lobby dodging as one of the reasons why match-making isn't working optimally. I hope they address this and backfill with March update. I have zero motivation to play killer the way things are.
That's part of the issue yes. But the community has been telling them there's been issues the entire time. 6 months with no fix whatsoever. Most other developers would be all over it, and probably drop a hot fix patch before their next update. Especially if they spent 2 years developing it.
But we've everyone seems to have grown so accustomed to Behavior taking a year or even years, before they actually address anything.
Blame the balance of the game. Not the MMR. Its working as intended. Priotizing faster queues over fair matches.
If the game was more balanced = we´d had more killers = shorter survivor queues = better working mmr = better experience for everyone.
But the "better experience for everyone" part is also fault of our community. We can´t choose who we get matched with, but we can choose how to react. Getting matched with troll squads and barely getting any hooks is as fun as getting matched with new players that last for 20 seconds. We as a community can´t change that. BUT we can change how we react to it. If you notice that you are matched against a player of a lower skill level, then go easy on them (this goes both sides) and be nice in the endgame chat. Getting belittled after getting stomped is as encouranging to continue playing as getting flamed and stalked on the profile by someone who lost to you.
If life has taught me anything is that, “life finds a way”.
Honestly the entire anti-SBMM argument comes off as toxic entitlement of "can't stomp lesser players, wah".
Like bruh its a game.
What a strawman
Gamers when they can't think of a counter explanation to an argument: "mmm yes, strawman. Victory royale."
No it doesn't? As most people who complain complain because we're still getting babies, or people widely outside the range of who were supposed to be going against. Either we're facing babies or we have babies on our team and we're going against people who have thousands of hours. Which is the same thing that people were complaining about the emblem system. SBMM in it's current state just amplified the issue further.
The issue is adding a skill based system, a broken one at that, into a non balanced and heavily RNG based game. Check out what other games have SBMM, what do they all have in common? They're competitive based games with 0 RNG. Like COD, or league or any other game. The maps don't change. You know where you're going beforehand. Everything outside of loudouts and personal skill is the same at the beginning of the match. The game progresses based on skill.
In DBD you could be in a losing state at the beginning of the match just due to gen, survivor, hooks, and totem spawns. You could already have a higher chance of losing/winning just based on the map alone. That's not skill based.
Then you're taking this broken system and making changes based on the stats it gives you.
What they really shouldn't done if they really wanted SBMM in the game, is removed all RNG elements first, then balance it, then add in the SBMM. Would it suck without the RNG aspect? Yeah. But it just goes to show you why it doesn't belong in a casual party game.
We don't want to bully babies. We want fair and balanced. But right now it's not that
(Thank you for actually posting a counter argument)
Yeah, there are aspects of it that don't work and they need to iron out. RNG is also apart of some of the games you mentioned, while maybe not on the same core aspect of DBD. (Hip fire in cod, critical strikes in League (if they're still in, havent played league in forever))
But yeah, RNG is a huge nono.
The whole "kills/escapes only count" thing is dumb as ######### I agree.
But if they actually flesh it out to work not soley off kills and escapes, and make it not broken, I'm down for SBMM.
Tfw I make my response, notice a typo, edit it, and it has to be approved before appearing again. RIP
I think the main issue is a lot of killers sort of got tired of only facing full meta builds so the result was less people playing killer. Now the killers that do play typically get just the sweat squads, or are the only option for a group of new survivors. Like you said, no in between. It's a flawed system that doesn't belong in a game like this.
Personally my matches have been ok since MMR. I actually like it better than the emblem system. That's just me though.
Well eeeeeeeeeuh😱😱😱😱😱
Told it would be a bad decision to implement SBMM
I didn't leave the game for no reason 2 months after they put in that crapy system 😂
I admit I wanted MMR and supported it in most discussions. However I was sold a false promise of every killer would be on it's own MMR. So I could try Nurse/Blight/Billy etc and not have to get steamrolled by my normal opponents. The 1st/2nd test I loved worked perfect for me not sure how we got this current version but had I known I would have been against it as well. False promises are bitches.
Oops, you literally fit the definition.
Nobody in this thread said they want easy opponents, in fact, several mention how they hate going up against new players.
Try to actually have an argument next time and I'll put in more effort.
The reasoning behind that is because the devs feared for the new players.
Because you have knowledge of the game they think you will steamroll new survivors (probably would) and thus killing the fun for them.
So de went for an average score for all killers, so you basically can really learn anything when trying new killers because the matches go to fast if you're learning.
But the devs forgot 1 crucial part of it when going against newer players.
Yes you might steamroll them and maybe the next match as well, but your score will be increased every time so every match you get better survivor that are more to your level.
And that way they will put up more of a fight then when you just started trying that killer you never played.
Tbf, most people that was for SBMM probably didnt think the devs would lie and backtrack to the pointless K/E system lol.
Honestly it wouldn't surprise me if the soft cap and the awful determination of skill is to blame.
I personally just wanted the emblems tweaked with a harsher rank reset
Thankyou for making the damn Jurassic park theme stuck in my head -.-
//
Gonna be humming this theme all night now lol
good theme
(G)amers constantly whine about SBMM so much in video games, that they flat out state they want it removed.
Because a majority of the time, they just wanna abuse broken ######### and dunk on lesser players with no effort.
Have you not seen twitch culture? "Sweaty" "Bot", etc etc?
Lmao that theme is legendary
Can't wait for the new one this summer. Having all the cast from original excites me.
Us to the devs in regards to Sbmm lmao
Me too I cried watching the trailer. Alan grant is one of my heros. The first Jurassic park is my favorite movie of all time. It’s gonna be good. But you know what would make it great? If this guy or girl showed up lmao
https://youtu.be/GB3DPX85Kg4Automatic 10/10
Didn't they actually say that in the last Q&A that it's working as intended.....I know they said that about Boons but I thought they said that about MMR as well.
only if the t-rex kills it
😉
I love both lmao just a cameo and roar is enough haha
I don't care about SBMM in other games, I care about SBMM and it's impact on DBD.
It has not yielded any results. At best, it's the exact same as the Emblem System except the Devs devoted 2 years of work to trying to make this system work for zero benefit.
At worst, it's substantially worse than the old Emblem System, because I am being matched with new players. I may have been matched with "bad" players in the old system, but I never actually saw a brand new player in my Red Rank lobby. It is NOT an extremely rare occurrence.
The reason this happens is because the MM system is set-up to favor queue times over fairness. In essence, it just tosses everyone together, which is somehow worse than the old system. Yet, the Survivors queues I sit in are still 10 minutes long.
The MMR (SBMM) system doesn't work and it cannot work until we have more players. Unfortunately, since SBMM was announced to be permanent, we have been losing players, even through hype Chapter releases like Hellraiser or Hour of the Witch.
You do realize steam isn't 100% of the playerbase right?
Yes, I am well aware, considering that I play on Console.
There is no reason to believe that those stats are not indicative of an overall downward trend. I can only work with the information that I've been given and said information indicates the overall playerbase is trending down.
It's pretty telling when a game that for the most part has been steadily rising in players over the past few years (even pre-covid and such) is suddenly starting to drop players consistantly even with the promise/hype of new content on the way
I do partially agree with your argument that some people hate SBMM on the basis that they want to 'stomp' weaker players but there's also another side to that, some of us want to just play the game without feeling like it's an unbalanced chore. I'm no SWF hater or anything but it's clear to most people Solo Q and Killer are chores to play a lot of the time. It's not just about beating lesser experienced players because that still happens anyway due to the que times/lack of killers
BHVR wants to push DBD in a more 'competitive' way, that's what MMR is for but the game is not built to be competitive.
Map offerings exist, for example.
Huh, noted.
Then as long as they fix it to where it doesn't Soley track kills/escapes (maybe time to downs, time being chased, hook proximity, etc), it would work a lot better.
I do agree that the current system doesn't measure actual skillful play, or just exploiting the system.
But I do like SBMM, it keeps the game fresh and challenging for people like me who want to get good, and keeps true casual/chill players in their pools.
Removing it entirely? Nah.
You'll find that the better you get, the more boring the play becomes.