That's how they should be, they're offerings. They shouldn't drastically change the game.
Are you trying to say that being able to practically determine which map you play on ISNT drastically changing the game? Tell that to killers dealing with Haddonfield offerings.
Are you trying to say that being able to practically determine which map you play on ISNT drastically changing the game? Tell that to killers dealing with Haddonfield offerings.
-shudder in horror- haddonfield...that cursed a place
You can still bypass DS after the second unhook. So you still get your free tunnel into a dead Survivor.
So they are not entirely useless. And tbh, I rather have a weak Offering than an Offering which is so OP. (And yes, they are still Iridescent Offerings, but eh... Odd Bulbs are also Iridescent, let alone that most Survivor-Stuff is useless in the Bloodwebs)
Countering a single perk that a survivor might be using (also assuming that if they do have it, they didn’t use it after their first hook) doesn’t justify 7000 blood points IMO
Stop crying, so many people are talking about that.
People in this forum can't talk on the same discussion about the same subject ?
If keys were changed before moris : survivors are crying
If moris are change before keys (in this patch) : killers are crying
Why are you all crying ?
The only people crying are mainly killer mains who believe keys should have been nerfed at the same time. Despite the fact that it has been announced that changing keys will require more time to do than Moris. People don't want to accept that so they're crying that this happened first. Just saying if you're this upset that Moris are changed then you probably relied on them a little too much instead of skill.
If BHVR had actually thought this through they would have reduced the BP costs of the affected Mori's in the Bloodweb. In particular the Ebony Mori is less useful and therefore shouldn't cost 7000BP - the grind is hard enough as it is.
To be honest, if they'd done that I'd have no complaints aside from the fact that there are a multitude of bugs (both long-term and many game-breaking ones introduced in the latest DLC) and they chose to spend time and effort on this?
No hes not the complaining in this thread is absolutely childish.
Why is being upset with game changes, that negatively effect one side of the spectrum while leaving an advantage for the other side of the spectrum, considered childish? It's called being upset because its balanced one direction, and not equally across both playing field.
Why is it every time someone defends a survivor "issue" they immediately go to the "Well SWFs are...." etc etc. You do realize that people play this game solo as a survivor right? My first 100 hours or so of playing this game I never once played with anyone else as a survivor. My current gameplay consists of:
Solo Survivor: 25%-35%
SWF Survivor: 10%-15% and that is not a full SWF most of the time just me and 1 other person.
Killer: 50%-65% (So yes I consider myself a killer main...so your assumption that I hate killers or am being childish is frankly rubbish and a fallacious attack on my character without cause.
The victim mindset that is perpetuated by declaring every (or even the majority of) bad round(s) as a killer as the result of a SWF is simply a mechanism players use to justify their loss and is in no way based in an absolute reality. Are their SWFs... absolutely. Are SOME SWFs overpowered...absolutely. But I can also tell you that solo gameplay as a survivor is tough as hell; especially in the purple/red ranks.
Calling out bad behavior and temper tantrums is not childish... it is realistic and needed in this community. Blaming others consistently for your loss is about the most childish thing one can do. I learned a long time ago that...guess what... you will not win every game...you will lose...sometimes when you lose it is your fault...and that is ok. If you have to play a game and win - you should question why you play the game. I'm not saying don't be competitive.. bring it on! What I am saying is stop making excuses, accusing others of unfair gameplay, and grow up.
The rhetoric/vitriol on these forums is ridiculous, but pales into the absolute garbage chat in end game...where the majority of killers nowadays simple tells the survivors off for being in a perceived SWF etc etc. It got so bad that in the last two months I have actually collected data on end game chat - 73.6% of comments by KILLERS in end game chat has included at least one disparaging profanity that is either racist, misogynistic, xenophobic, and/or homophobic. I have reported...wait for it - 116 players in two months for these comments. This toxicity is what is ruining this game...not any perceived injustices of perks/addons. The forums are just a pale reflection of this childish behavior...which is sad.
The reasons why SWF is so often brought up is because it is an imbalance in the spectrum, and the reason why people complain about is because it's a loss that's OUTSIDE your control, you can't control the use of comms, you can't control 4 man small pp builds, you can't control 4 man OoO builds, and all of those things have such a heavy advantage on you as a player that sometimes no matter how hard you try, 4 ds's, 4 OoO's and 4 DeadHards, are just something so far out of your control that you can't stop that it loses competitiveness.
You bring up competitiveness like its just about winning, no competition derives from a handfull things, and one of those things is a balanced and equal experience where one side doesn't have an advantage over the other. Mori's were a great counter to the 4 man OoO, or the 4 man toxic DS squad with BT, same way that keys were a great counter to having a Mori, or wraith camping the hatch before closing it in your face. Competition derives from balance, and competitive people get very upset when someone starts tilting the scales away from that balance.
I am a killer main, i have over 2k hours, maybe 300 of those I spent as solo surv, 350 maybe in my usual swf dbd crew. The rest, was purely killer, I strive to be the best killer I can be, i play every killer, I'm trying to really hone my skills with the nurse after neglecting her for so long. And I can confidently say I have the skills to take on most matches and at least get a 3 unless there is a hatch leave.
But when I get put up against an OoO team with 2 keys and 2 flashlights, and one key doesn't have a ring on it so if they die it stays and I'm struggling to keep up with an entire team watching me the entire game, pressure gens when they know I'm coming from 72 meters away and no matter how hard I try, or what new tricks I come up with to try and elude their watching eyes, there's not much I can do but accept defeat. And that, is where competition, and competitiveness no longer exists because its not an even playing field, because its not a fair fight, and that all happens because a 4 man can coordinate add-ons items and perks before a match even starts to ruin the experience of the killer, because it's "hilarious".
And if I play a mori because it's obvious af its a 4 man swf bully squad, and they had intentions to do that to me than they deserved it, but now we can't even do that, now we really have to accept defeat while the other side of the spectrum is allowed to run free and continue bullying.
I am just north on the killer side of main (roughly 60/40%) and I think moris definitely needed to be changed. I just think this particular change was not well thought out at all. With the changes there is no benefit to using them now. I'm hoping this is a first pass by the devs and that they will continue reworking.
Something that brings back the element of horror. Really that means making a condition beyond just hooks. It should be something along the lines of being after the first hook AND even then only after the hatch spawns. That way killers can't just tunnel someone out of the game early on. But yet the moris could still be useful to the killer in late game.
Countering a single perk that a survivor might be using (also assuming that if they do have it, they didn’t use it after their first hook) doesn’t justify 7000 blood points IMO
I honestly dont care. Many stuff from the Survivor Bloodweb is not worth their price anymore. Every Iridescent Add On or Item (except for the Skeleton Key) is not worth 7k BPs either.
I guess Killers will survive if they still have to pay 7k BPs for an Ebony Mori.
I will start tracking perks/addons of people I go against because...being 100% honest here... I have never had the scenario in which you described to my knowledge. I have not had a 0k in a very long time. Maybe we are of different mindsets, but I don't need a 4k..3k..or even a 2k to feel like I have done well. I justify my "win" based off my score and not how many survivors are left.
I can also honestly say that when I do SWF... the only thing we really do is make sure no redundant perks like two people running Kindred... otherwise we are just there to support one another to try and escape. Then again... I am not red rank... merely purple. I play the game for fun...both as a killer and survivor.. what determines if I am having fun is not whether I escape as a survivor or 4k as a killer, but rather did I have fun...did I do well points wise... etc. I am probably older than 95% of the players in this game and maybe that is why I am not so bent on "winning" and more about the fun to be had.
See that's the part you're missing, part of the fun is the competition in a game, madden, and sports game yes their fun but they play for the competitiveness, which is a massive part of the game for a lot of people. Competitiveness, sportsmanship, all make a part of what is considered fun in a game.
And having fun, for me is a balanced and well treated game, not dealing with teams who try and specifically abuse control perks, that makes anyone else other than wraith and ghost face useless due to stealth mechanics.
Like play as trapper and go against a team of OoO, your power is useless and you're just setting traps at loops where you're being looped than they just run to another, and your chases are already down to nothing but useless.
Then go against an OoO team as deathslinger, they're running away before you even get there to take abuse of you're 110% movement speed.
It's not fun to be constantly abused by SWF, and builds that are so broken that you might as well accept your defeat and chill in a corner cause no matter how hard you try, you aren't going to do that good, and get anything above a 1k.
I'll say it again, running around and not being able to do anything without the team knowing your every move and running from your every move isn't fun, and having to run an extra 15 seconds just to start a chase against the 3 guys on a gen who started running the same direction because they all see you coming.
And in terns of being your "that happens often" a pink mori can only happen as long as they have a mori, so only a few times, where ######### perks combos can happen infinitely and are only made worse by add-ons and items
lets not forget that it is still an Ultra Rare offering - those are ment to hold some serious punch.
yes, the old one was way too much. but that doesnt mean they had to kill it like they did.
why not take Otz's idea where the mori will only work once every alive (cuz DCs) Survivor has been hooked at least once?
the mori would still be powerful, the Killer cant just tunnel one player from the start and survivors could actually play around it, by being extra stealthy as long as they havent been hooked, while being less stealthy once they have (to ensure the killer wont get the 4th guy).
but the version the Devs made is easily the laziest and worst possible solution they could have found for it - and i wouldnt be complaining now had they done that exact same change multiple years ago with the message "hey guys, we know moris are broken and we're working on something for them. in the meantime, take this ^^" (or sthg similar) - but they did this change NOW, over 3 years since the last time they touched moris and havent said anything regarding an actual change with the aim of making the offering less powerful, yet still usefull.
it took them 3 YEARS (3.5, actually. 1.5.3, the patch that originally added the hook requirement was on 4th of July 2017) to come up with something and they gave us THAT.
i am honestly very disappointed in that mori rework.
its lazy and its way, way too harsh - and its not like there werent hundrets of threats out there that had tons of actually good and fun suggestions for the offering!
Not that ultra rare. I have 10 on one killer and 22 on another......
Unlike Mori, they already had a big condition. Like most issues, it's really only a problem when its SWF. So maybe nerf them in SWF. The only time i ever got screwed by a key was when I shut the hatch and as soon as I shut the hatch the survivor literally reopened it and left. I laughed at it too because it never happened. Aside from that, Keys already have a counter. Franklins, Mori, they need to have people DIE to use it and have to have gens done on top of that. Keys are not nearly as much a problem as mori. I do however, believe that if they're going to nerf them, speed up the animation or award extra blood points for getting a mori. It's now literally only a flashy way to finish someone.
Not that ultra rare. I have 10 on one killer and 22 on another......
its less about how often you find them and more about the level of rarity they posess (which, in the case of the Ebony Mori is Ultra Rare).
Ultra Rare things, on both sides, are ment to be the strongest things available for the character(s). they are ment to be gamechanging - which, with the two hook requirement, is barely the case for moris anymore (unless the killer hardtunnels off of 2nd hook of course, as hooking a survivor is usually faster than killing them with a mori - which means that the new Moris still support the "tunnel one target to death" playstyle. but not only that, its now also the only way of actually getting value from them)
I'm so glad I spent all those bloodpoints on ebony moris. I'm so glad they're worthless now. I didn't even want to use the things I spent thousands upon thousands of bloodpoints on. That be crazy if I did. 😐
its less about how often you find them and more about the level of rarity they posess (which, in the case of the Ebony Mori is Ultra Rare).
Ultra Rare things, on both sides, are ment to be the strongest things available for the character(s). they are ment to be gamechanging - which, with the two hook requirement, is barely the case for moris anymore (unless the killer hardtunnels off of 2nd hook of course, as hooking a survivor is usually faster than killing them with a mori - which means that the new Moris still support the "tunnel one target to death" playstyle. but not only that, its now also the only way of actually getting value from them)
I agree with you what i dont agree with and devs knows this already and so do mods cause i have called them out in multiple places on this is making changes to the game (major not minor) to items or content after purchase such as the Ebony mori's. Im still on my first cup of coffee so this may be a little disjointed
You guys do realize that the patch notes are misleading right? Me and my friends tested this. You just have to be dead on hook to be moriable. So if you're a split second too late and your teammate reaches second state, they can be mori'd.
Wow, they were smart to keep this change a secret. Were they nerfed too much is now a big question???
Keys are fine because they require a lot of work to use them. Hope they don't surprise and change them.
The change is coming and needed scuzzy. The moris are maybe nerfed a bit too much, I would have preferred a "total hook count of 6+" condition. but as long as keys are changed so a 3 man can't escape till after they do all gens and there's an unlocking animation, then I'm okay with the current mori status quo
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Comments
Are you trying to say that being able to practically determine which map you play on ISNT drastically changing the game? Tell that to killers dealing with Haddonfield offerings.
-shudder in horror- haddonfield...that cursed a place
Countering a single perk that a survivor might be using (also assuming that if they do have it, they didn’t use it after their first hook) doesn’t justify 7000 blood points IMO
*Reaches into bucket and watches the fireworks*
The only people crying are mainly killer mains who believe keys should have been nerfed at the same time. Despite the fact that it has been announced that changing keys will require more time to do than Moris. People don't want to accept that so they're crying that this happened first. Just saying if you're this upset that Moris are changed then you probably relied on them a little too much instead of skill.
If BHVR had actually thought this through they would have reduced the BP costs of the affected Mori's in the Bloodweb. In particular the Ebony Mori is less useful and therefore shouldn't cost 7000BP - the grind is hard enough as it is.
To be honest, if they'd done that I'd have no complaints aside from the fact that there are a multitude of bugs (both long-term and many game-breaking ones introduced in the latest DLC) and they chose to spend time and effort on this?
Why is being upset with game changes, that negatively effect one side of the spectrum while leaving an advantage for the other side of the spectrum, considered childish? It's called being upset because its balanced one direction, and not equally across both playing field.
The reasons why SWF is so often brought up is because it is an imbalance in the spectrum, and the reason why people complain about is because it's a loss that's OUTSIDE your control, you can't control the use of comms, you can't control 4 man small pp builds, you can't control 4 man OoO builds, and all of those things have such a heavy advantage on you as a player that sometimes no matter how hard you try, 4 ds's, 4 OoO's and 4 DeadHards, are just something so far out of your control that you can't stop that it loses competitiveness.
You bring up competitiveness like its just about winning, no competition derives from a handfull things, and one of those things is a balanced and equal experience where one side doesn't have an advantage over the other. Mori's were a great counter to the 4 man OoO, or the 4 man toxic DS squad with BT, same way that keys were a great counter to having a Mori, or wraith camping the hatch before closing it in your face. Competition derives from balance, and competitive people get very upset when someone starts tilting the scales away from that balance.
I am a killer main, i have over 2k hours, maybe 300 of those I spent as solo surv, 350 maybe in my usual swf dbd crew. The rest, was purely killer, I strive to be the best killer I can be, i play every killer, I'm trying to really hone my skills with the nurse after neglecting her for so long. And I can confidently say I have the skills to take on most matches and at least get a 3 unless there is a hatch leave.
But when I get put up against an OoO team with 2 keys and 2 flashlights, and one key doesn't have a ring on it so if they die it stays and I'm struggling to keep up with an entire team watching me the entire game, pressure gens when they know I'm coming from 72 meters away and no matter how hard I try, or what new tricks I come up with to try and elude their watching eyes, there's not much I can do but accept defeat. And that, is where competition, and competitiveness no longer exists because its not an even playing field, because its not a fair fight, and that all happens because a 4 man can coordinate add-ons items and perks before a match even starts to ruin the experience of the killer, because it's "hilarious".
And if I play a mori because it's obvious af its a 4 man swf bully squad, and they had intentions to do that to me than they deserved it, but now we can't even do that, now we really have to accept defeat while the other side of the spectrum is allowed to run free and continue bullying.
I am just north on the killer side of main (roughly 60/40%) and I think moris definitely needed to be changed. I just think this particular change was not well thought out at all. With the changes there is no benefit to using them now. I'm hoping this is a first pass by the devs and that they will continue reworking.
Something that brings back the element of horror. Really that means making a condition beyond just hooks. It should be something along the lines of being after the first hook AND even then only after the hatch spawns. That way killers can't just tunnel someone out of the game early on. But yet the moris could still be useful to the killer in late game.
Finally.
Keys at least requires doing objetives and now seems mori too.
I honestly dont care. Many stuff from the Survivor Bloodweb is not worth their price anymore. Every Iridescent Add On or Item (except for the Skeleton Key) is not worth 7k BPs either.
I guess Killers will survive if they still have to pay 7k BPs for an Ebony Mori.
Moris still required an objective. And this change just makes them mechanically useless, unlike keys which still have a use.
Big facts Vetra :( Now we gotta work extra hard for a second hook+save.....
See that's the part you're missing, part of the fun is the competition in a game, madden, and sports game yes their fun but they play for the competitiveness, which is a massive part of the game for a lot of people. Competitiveness, sportsmanship, all make a part of what is considered fun in a game.
And having fun, for me is a balanced and well treated game, not dealing with teams who try and specifically abuse control perks, that makes anyone else other than wraith and ghost face useless due to stealth mechanics.
Like play as trapper and go against a team of OoO, your power is useless and you're just setting traps at loops where you're being looped than they just run to another, and your chases are already down to nothing but useless.
Then go against an OoO team as deathslinger, they're running away before you even get there to take abuse of you're 110% movement speed.
It's not fun to be constantly abused by SWF, and builds that are so broken that you might as well accept your defeat and chill in a corner cause no matter how hard you try, you aren't going to do that good, and get anything above a 1k.
I'll say it again, running around and not being able to do anything without the team knowing your every move and running from your every move isn't fun, and having to run an extra 15 seconds just to start a chase against the 3 guys on a gen who started running the same direction because they all see you coming.
And in terns of being your "that happens often" a pink mori can only happen as long as they have a mori, so only a few times, where ######### perks combos can happen infinitely and are only made worse by add-ons and items
Not that ultra rare. I have 10 on one killer and 22 on another......
Wrong.
Unlike Mori, they already had a big condition. Like most issues, it's really only a problem when its SWF. So maybe nerf them in SWF. The only time i ever got screwed by a key was when I shut the hatch and as soon as I shut the hatch the survivor literally reopened it and left. I laughed at it too because it never happened. Aside from that, Keys already have a counter. Franklins, Mori, they need to have people DIE to use it and have to have gens done on top of that. Keys are not nearly as much a problem as mori. I do however, believe that if they're going to nerf them, speed up the animation or award extra blood points for getting a mori. It's now literally only a flashy way to finish someone.
Judt get gud. Killers are stronger then ever before.
its less about how often you find them and more about the level of rarity they posess (which, in the case of the Ebony Mori is Ultra Rare).
Ultra Rare things, on both sides, are ment to be the strongest things available for the character(s). they are ment to be gamechanging - which, with the two hook requirement, is barely the case for moris anymore (unless the killer hardtunnels off of 2nd hook of course, as hooking a survivor is usually faster than killing them with a mori - which means that the new Moris still support the "tunnel one target to death" playstyle. but not only that, its now also the only way of actually getting value from them)
I'm so glad I spent all those bloodpoints on ebony moris. I'm so glad they're worthless now. I didn't even want to use the things I spent thousands upon thousands of bloodpoints on. That be crazy if I did. 😐
I agree with you what i dont agree with and devs knows this already and so do mods cause i have called them out in multiple places on this is making changes to the game (major not minor) to items or content after purchase such as the Ebony mori's. Im still on my first cup of coffee so this may be a little disjointed
You guys do realize that the patch notes are misleading right? Me and my friends tested this. You just have to be dead on hook to be moriable. So if you're a split second too late and your teammate reaches second state, they can be mori'd.
The change is coming and needed scuzzy. The moris are maybe nerfed a bit too much, I would have preferred a "total hook count of 6+" condition. but as long as keys are changed so a 3 man can't escape till after they do all gens and there's an unlocking animation, then I'm okay with the current mori status quo