Easy solution to hook suicides
I'm seeing a lot of threads crop up with a lot of comments frustrated about survivors killing themselves right away on the hook, and it confuses me because there's a pretty simple solution to solve this problem (which I'm not sure people have discussed because I'm not reading through a full 5 or 3 pages of comments on multiple threads)
When a survivor gets hooked initiate a hidden timer that the system keeps track of how long a survivor has been hooked. If a survivor hits second state and stops struggling before 10 or 20 seconds have passed they get hit with some kind of punishment, say a subtraction of 5000 bloodpoints from your total earned that match or something.
My first thought was hitting people in BP but the punishment for doing this could literally be anything, it could be treated exactly like DC penalties if the community requested in worked that way, preventing people from queuing and playing again until a certain period of time has passed.
The timer itself is also subject to any kind of change I just suggested 10 or 20 seconds because it's a short time period meant to deter / discourage / stop players from letting go immediately as soon as possible. But it could be something longer like 30 seconds
Hell, create a big penalty on letting go right away or quickly after, and a small penalty for letting go at any point before you would have died naturally. Survivors should be fighting to stay alive for as long as possible, providing more incentives like increased BP for doing so is also a good way to combat this issue.
Comments
Why is everyone elses fun my responsibility? I queued up to a game, stop acting like I signed a contract, lol.
If I see something (which 99% of the time is team mate related and not killer related) that I don't want to deal with, I'll play as normal and dip on my first hook. You can't punish people for it beyond what already happens (lack of bloodpoints, pip loss etc) and you can't force people to stay in your game. You're like one of those people who says "NO KILLER! FACECAMPING IS BAD BECAUSE IT KILLS MY FUN!". Like...that doesn't mean anything. All you're doing is whining. Your fun really holds no value whatsoever to anyone else playing. They are playing for their own fun, not yours. Get over yourself. Nobody is responsible for making sure you have fun, but you.
This really isn't an argument you can win.
Except you did sign a contract, in fact that's exactly what you did to a T.
As soon as you booted up Dead By Daylight for the very first time from day 1 you agreed to the End-License User Agreement or EULA and Terms of Service from BHVR (that really long body of text that nobody reads)
Here's a link in case you're curious:
Here are two terms that you are technically violating when you suicide consistently and repeatedly to get out of matches early:
Quote:
"While participating in the Game, you also agree to comply with certain rules of conduct that govern your use of the Game (“Rules of Conduct”), for example you may not:
The important parts to recognize to these Terms of Service are the beginning statements which as you can see are separate rules or codes of conduct to be followed separated from the rest of the statement because of the legal grammar being used created by a comma or an "and" & / or "or"
...Soooooo.... Did I win the argument? Did I do it?? 🤣
I'll just repeat myself.
And no, you didn't. There is literally no version of this where you can win. The second you bring up forcing people to play the game, you lost. Period, end of story. Go argue with someone you can outwit. Spoiler: It's not me.
Alright, I'll play you're game:
Yes I did. In no universe can you ever prove that purposefully quitting in the middle of your matches is healthy for the community and should remain unpunished. The second you bring up sacrifices the fun of the other four individuals in your lobby because you yourself "don't wanna lose" you lost. Period. End of story. Argue with somebody you can outsmart, because spoiler alert: it's not gonna be me.
If being assertive is all it ever took to win an argument, I'd be a goddamn master.
I didn't say it was healthy. There - you lost again by putting words in my mouth.
Easy.
So you agree that suiciding on the hook should be punished? Because naturally if it's not healthy and not in the best interests for the community, then you agree with me.
So we agree.
Nice. ez.
You're quoting me as saying things I never said.
Trolling is an art - it's not supposed to be obvious. You're failing in that too.
Here's an idea: if someone dies on hook within the first X minute of the game, everyone else in the match gets additional BP. So rather than having something taken away, the person just loses out on something.
Well obviously you never said it, it's supposed to be implied that's how this works. I'm inferring that you agree with me because you agreed that it's not healthy.
What's wrong with that statement?
See? Now THAT is a sensible, non-authoritarian BS idea. Now we're onto something.
Look, a better idea than yours.
Hey, I'm all for suggestions, so far I hadn't seen too many solutions until I made this thread, so it's serving it's purpose! We're brainstorming, I like that.
I have no idea what you're talking about, I'm a patriot through and through. I love democracy, burgers, the colors red, white, and blue (especially in conjunction), bald eagles, anything fried, the imperial system, the grand canyon, and everything else that comes with living in the sweet US of A
Authoritarian is the last thing I'd be
LOTS OF AUTHORITARIANS LOVE BURGERS.
(I'll admit, authoritarian wasn't the word I should have used)
My whole point is, you can't tell people "if you don't keep playing, you'll be punished". That attitude is no more healthy than what you're complaining about. You start telling people they have to play when they aren't having fun (and you know as well as I do, fun comes and goes in this game, sometimes mid match), people will just stop playing.
Instead, compensate those who now have it harder.
I personally never disconnect during any matches because I was taught to always finish a game no matter what happens.But there are times when teammates are somewhere far away healing themselves in a corner and or they are too afraid to rescue me as the killer waits somewhere near by hiding watching for other survivors to unhook then downs them.And therefore it leads me to dying on the hook.And or when a killer is guarding The hook and hitting me showing no signs of leaving me alone. So I fully support that ending yourself on hook is 100% except able.
What? I never said they have to play.
In all reality 5000 bloodpoints isn't a big price to pay for suiciding on the hook and leaving the match, and in fact neither is a short 5 minute ban timer in the grand scheme of things, in which case you can walk out of the figurative door of your trial whenever you feel like it! Just uhhhh... Don't forget to pay the toll, that's all.
Punishment, compensation, potato potato is what I say. As long as something happens.
So many times I've watched other survivors on the other side of the map with no intention of coming over to rescue me. I'll try to get myself off the hook, fail, and then why should I hurt my thumb or my controller struggling to stay in a match where the three-man SWF obviously isn't concerned about anyone other than themselves? No, thanks, I'm out. No, man, you can't punish people for dying on the hook when second state is such a [BAD WORD] show.
I and many others have complained multiple times that second state is bad on the joints and bad on hardware. The devs insist on keeping it in.
Not to mention there have been plenty of times I've suicided on my first hook to give the other person the hatch. Or I'll suicide on my first hook when I see the other survivors could escape but are thinking of trying to rescue me, that way they don't get themselves killed. There are times when suiciding is the team play, it all depends on context.
It's a 3 minute ban and the more you disconnect in, I guess, a certain amount of games or something, it will add more time for each ban.
You could have been banned, but didn't notice since you restart your computer 🤷🏼♂️
I'll reference a quote from xQc
"A QUITTERS BONUS? HOW ABOUT A LEAVERS PENALTY?!"
Rewarding others for quitting is also abusable. What is to stop me from making a second account and quitting every game on it/suicide in order to get bonus BP?
Yeah you can. If you get a team of potatoes in a game like LoL or DotA or CS:GO they also don't let you leave the game just because of that. if you do you get banned. Why should you be allowed to leave just because you don't like your team? You literally signed up for getting random teammates by queuing as a solo. If you don't like how randos play, don't play with randos.
Survivors rarely suicide out of my games. Crazy how just not being an ######### has that effect.
Maybe they should address the primary, underlying reason why ppl hook suicide - like they should have with DCs, and people would be less likely to do it.
Or they can just punish hook suicides and watch people abandon their game like rats from a sinking ship. Either or. :)
They do go together though. There's a reason they didn't put in DC penalties first and then activate dedicated servers. Fix some of the causes first, then put in penalties if it still seems like a big enough issue. With cross play coming can't really have them do one thing for console and another for PC anymore.
I agree for change in struggling mechanic make it interactive rather than remove completely, just don't have it be like what we have now that hurts the equipment and if you screw up shouldn't instantly kill you like it does now. Have the "give up struggle" option - that way can track how often people are doing it on purpose, what information is consistent for them doing it, and put in changes that would be appropriate. Someone doing it just to derank, a penalty for BP/Pips isn't going to matter to them. Someone doing it because they're being camped and see no reward in staying anyway - try giving them BP/Safety pip as long as killer is in certain proximity so it seems worth it to stay in match.
I didn't say I didn't like how they play. I've played enough matches to be able to recognize when I'm going to be saved and when I'm going to spend a minute hurting my thumb mashing a button and still not get rescued. If the devs fixed second state, that wouldn't be an issue. But it is an issue. They want to pay for a new controller and pain meds? Fine, I'll continue button mashing. Until then, don't penalize players for not holding out just to die anyway.
THIS!
I don't think you can viably punish people for this heinous act...which, admittedly, is unfortunate at times; especially when the Killer is face-camping. Take one for the team and buy them a couple minutes.
I think Malatruse is correct ~ it's probably better to reward the type of behavior you want to see in-game than try to punish those who don't comply. I think making the decision to stay on that hook and struggle, and thus helping your team (no, I'm not going to talk about the hatch), should be rewarded with extra bloodpoints! Tack them onto the survival category, those are probably the most difficult to obtain anyway.
I’ll suicide when my team mates are potatoes! I’ve been hooked and watched my teammates continue to work on gens, or be completely oblivious etc. By your logic we should just put up with that.
Killers: Do something about DC’s they’re robbing me of BP.
Devs: Ok *Implements dc ban*
Killers: Do something about hook suicides this is BS!
Can you hear yourself when you speak this utter garbage? You probably complain of survivors standing at the exit gates when they’ve won too “They’re just wasting time I want to move to the next game” You see the contradiction yeah?
Then whats the point of DC punishments if were just adopting a mindset of "if someone doesnt wanna play they should be allowed to leave".
You dared point out competitive multiplayer games policies against a casual multiplayer one. Bold but idiotic since no MMR/Rank or anything is affected by a player dying sooner than expected. Thus PH cages should grants the ability to give up, being hold hostage in games you don't want to be is annoying AF if you already know you're going to die anyways.
I mean, there literally are ranks in this game, and dying early makes you lose rank....
Remind me the purpose of ranks since rank 15 killers facing ranks 2 (botched matchmaking) is far from uncommon and you have any rewards for hitting high ranks whatsoever ?
I'm not saying DBDs ranking system is great or anything, but you literally said
Bold but idiotic since no MMR/Rank or anything is affected by a player dying sooner than expected.
When that is LITERALLY false, there is a rank that is affected.
It's not false since rank is meaningless. Those competitive games ranks have a purpose, DbD hasen't.
It is literally false. There is a rank, and dying early makes you lose it. How good the ranking system is irrelevant. You sentence was a false statement.
Oh god help me with this one.
I am merely judging the content of your statement.
The statement
Bold but idiotic since no MMR/Rank or anything is affected by a player dying sooner than expected.
Is literally a falsehood. Claiming otherwise would be a willful lie.
You're not adding much besides proving there a rank system in dead by daylight.
Everyone is aware you know ? It has nothing to do with my statement. but keep trying rookie.
So you don't think your statement is false?
No I think all your blabbing is worthless to this topic thus having nothing to do with my statement.
Consider changing your nickname to Captain Obvious. you desserved it for wasting my time.
False statements are false, if you wanna lie and throw false statements and logical fallacies all it does is prove you don't know what you are talking about.
But those are 1. games designed to be fair and competitive, and 2. games that also have unranked modes for fun. DBD is neither. As much as hypersweat players try to convince you otherwise, DBD is a party game that will never be competitively viable. Most people play it for fun. And if they're not having fun in the game, they will want to move on to the next.
So if a survivor hits struggle stage on their first hook and has no teammate attempting to rescue, the hooked player should be punished for letting go? No.
I just want to point out how hilariously ironic it is that OP will say things like "that sounds like a personal problem," while complaining about people ruining the fun of his matches, and also ignoring the fact that there's several people bringing up similar points (remove the struggle system, struggling is annoying because it damages equipment/thumbs, sometimes you will die even while pressing the button, wanting to suicide on hook to give team mate hatch, etc.).
At some point, you have to wonder how much reasoning it will take to make somebody realize that punishing somebody for dying early on hook, at least in DbD's current state, is not a good idea.
And don't even get started with that "so what you're saying is.." kind of BS, Cathy Newman. What I said is what I meant: it's just not a good idea in DbD's current state. I don't need my words twisted around into some sort of garbage about how I think it's a good thing for every player to just kill themselves and disconnect every game.
Name one single? Apex legends. Cheers.
I never, ever used my own matches for reference at any point during the entirety of this threads existence.
Try throwing words in other peoples mouths. If you had been paying attention the whole reason I created this thread was because I saw other people talking about it and I created an easy solution to combat the problem. I even linked another thread where the OP was asking for penalties to be applied to those who killed themselves, which is what sparked my idea. I only ever used general statements about how killing yourself makes the game less fun for everyone else in the lobby.
It's a problem, problems need to be fixed, here's a potential solution. That's the short of what I have said. If you happen to disagree, please come up with your own alternative solution rather than saying "we should all just live with the problem, it is what it is".
Also, who the ######### is Cathy Newman??
I don't give a ######### if you brought up matches you played dude, because you clearly throw out your opinion about how you feel about it, how you think it should be in the game because of what you feel. You're claiming that it's not okay to let go, which is a statement of your opinion.
Don't act like just because you didn't bring up specific matches that you aren't putting your opinions out. No I'm not putting words in your mouth. Maybe it wasn't worded in the best way, but the point is you're telling somebody that it sounds like a "personal" problem when you're sitting here trying to argue for a change and give opinions, like your feelings aren't something that's involved here? Bullshit dude.
You say it's a "problem" and that's exactly what I'm talking about. Just because you think that it's a problem, doesn't mean you're entitled to have everybody agree with you. There's several people in this thread and all the other threads of a similar nature I see, I also see the same things being said. Yet, you ignore them, insist it is, and then when they offer counter arguments you once again you just act like their concerns don't exist. You obviously are arguing for a "personal problem" of yours. I think it's even more funny now that you've taken my comment and decided that I meant that you referenced matches that you play, when that's not what I was talking about. I'm saying you are advocating for your feelings (which is what I meant by people ruining the fun of your games).
And look up Cathy Newman. She's famous for her line "So what you're saying is..?" You'll probably find the search results funny.
Reason I said that, is because I get plenty of people just trying to take my messages to the extreme, like a time I jokingly commented "The hopes and dreams of survivors" as an answer to a thread asking what everybody likes to eat while playing killer, and somebody stalked through my comment history and pulled that up as an example of how I'm a killer main and don't care about survivors' fun or something.
Of course it's my ######### opinion you nut, that's what the forums are for to provide feedback based on the experiences (and yes, feelings) of a collective community to balance or create future content based on said given feedback. Not to mention, it's my thread so of course I'm going to let my opinion be known, if you want to create your own thread about how stupid you think the rest of us are for wanting to punish players who ruin the collective chances and experiences of a group of random survivors, you are free to do so.
"My opinion", that's about as obvious a statement as telling me the sky is blue and expecting me to say otherwise, like I'd actually deny that.
What I find "hilariously ironic" as you so eloquently put it, is you disregarding the opinions of others who agree with me and pretending that they don't exist. By framing the conversation and singling me out as if I'm prioritizing my experience over others you deliberately paint me as a selfish figure on purpose, disregarding the entire fact that I'm one of many who have called for these changes for the collective good of solo players who don't have the benefit of an SWF at their beck an call.
Just a couple weeks ago:
Most all of these threads have hundreds of views on them and plenty of comments to boot, and it's not like these are the only threads that exist either. So I'm directly calling you on your bullsh*t @Huff saying that I'm prioritizing my own experience over others. When I quite literally stand with a large portion of the community who are currently and have been repeatedly calling for these changes. I'm not the first, and nor will I be the last.
I don't know how the hell you can see "selfishness" in my creating this thread when the entire thread is about punishing individuals who abandon 4 other players in a match because they're salty. In essence prioritizing themselves over four other people, believing they're entitled to a win, a better team, or even just a better start to their game, and I'm the one who's selfish and entitled? That's such a ridiculous leap in logic that I will never understand, Evil Knievel couldn't make that goddamn leap.
As for how you were treated on other threads by other people, how about you check that ######### and leave it at the door when coming into an entirely brand new and unrelated thread?
They just need to change it to how pyramid head's cages work. Fixes suicide and button spam.
"Name a single other multiplayer game that allows you to sucide/remove yourself from the game while playing ranked."
As much as i want to die for saying this. But fortnite allows it. In tournaments (which are ranked) dont punish you for disconecting in a match because hey its a game and your allowed to have fun and while your vonna pull the tos out on me. Save it for someone who cares. If im not having fun i eill suicide on hook Because im not staying to just waste my time. I have had team mates work on a gen right next to me as i was on hook and before you say "but the killer was probally camping" they werent they were on the other side of the map chasing someone so im not staying in that game. Suiciding on hook isnt against any rules as you did play the game , you got in the game found the killer and got downed. That is still playing the game and when you want you can leave as dbd has two main ways out the exits or say it with me death and suiciding is choosing death as a way out of the match. So hows everyones day been? Hope its been good.
Disgusting.
Spits
What a shoddy example. Not just by reputation, but also in gameplay it's a battle royale, so nobody cares if you dc because it's less competition for everybody else.
Even if that weren't true, a single game (especially FORTNITE of all things...) does not upset the standard set by most multiplayer titles in the industry. Where the overall consensus is that disconnecting, or purposefully losing which may as well equate to the same thing, are never encouraged, often discouraged, and frequently punished. That is the standard
Not to mention I'm not going to abide by a philosophy set by Fortnite of all titles, and I think many would agree with that statement. Spits again
I don't need to read much of that, because it's clear by you devolving into namecalling instead of addressing my point that you have nothing to say against what I told you.
You say I'm the one putting words in your mouth but then here you are telling me that I'm disregarding other peoples' opinions. No, I just made fun of you because you're clearly responding like an ass. The whole message I'm trying to put across is that you have the gall to tell somebody that it's "just a personal problem" when I've seen many people say the same things. Just like you are arguing here, that you're not arguing for only for your sake, but because you agree with the many threads posted before. You're literally saying the same thing about me that I'm saying about you and yet you don't see how that's ironic. It's amazing how closed minded you can be, to tell me that I'm the one disregarding peoples' opinions when I only commented on how you responded, and to not see how "hilariously ironic" it is that you are textbook definition disregarding somebody else by telling them "sounds like a personal problem." It's so utterly tone deaf it's astounding.
There's no "bullsh*t" to call out. I told you you're disregarding the opinions of those who disagree with you and here you are. Doing it again, to me. Have fun being closed minded with your double standards, unwillingness to actually recognize or take criticism, and complete incapability of empathy (as shown by your willingness to ignore my logic but then try to still argue with that same logic.) I can't waste any more time with somebody who either obviously has a disability or is just completely unwilling to actually hear out an opinion that doesn't line up with his own.
So yeah. Please, tell me what "bullsh*t" there is to call out. Tell me how I'm disregarding the opinions of others and how you aren't a hypocritical garbage fire.
This is the comment I was talking about.
Once again, hilariously ironic that you can't see the hypocrisy of telling somebody expressing valid counter-arguments that I've seen several others share, "That sounds more like a you problem than anything else," while you also try to pose an arguments that you claim you've seen several others share. The same thing, but "rules for thee but not for me," right?
dude this is not a ranked game the ranking system is just a way to match you with players of similar skill, this is a casual game it is not competitive with the amount of rng and luck in the game name a casual game should not have a dc penalty, the dc penalty on its own is a bad idea because of the amount of bugs in this game if i get glitched in a pallet and the survivors dont leave im forced to dc not because i wanted to but because of a bug, and if you say "well devs should just fix the bugs" new bugs and exploits will always come up every patch