honestyoverbias
honestyoverbias
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I don’t see a problem, nor have I had one playing killer or survivor. This just sounds like complaining.
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You realize that in addition to some of these changes not being possible without major changes to the game, trapper already received a buff recently and now possesses an add on to start with all traps carried? These suggestions, while imaginative, are unnecessary. I main trapper among other killers and I would not call him the weakest killer, I actually find him quite easy and enjoyable to use if you understand how to strategize. Some killers only shine when you understand how to employ them.
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The struggle mechanic is one of the dumbest fails by the developers. And I don’t mean that in ######### talking way, it just was never a good or creative idea and it’s very obvious it doesn’t fit gameplay. Nobody cares or is interested in having something to do on their second hook and it takes away more from the game than it gives. It was a bad idea, people have bad ideas sometimes, that’s ok. The next step in realizing you had a bad idea is to get rid of that bad idea.
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@Nossy said:
Not a very bad idea but to be sure it only work against real face campers, it should have 2 conditions :
1) Not applying if a survivor is less than 32 meters of the hook cause sometimes you saw or know there is someone who followed you and hide for the unhook or by any other mean (Flashlight fail, BBQ, contagious fright etc...) and you have to search around the hook for it tho youre not actually in chase.
2) Not applying when all gens are done, it would be a dumb move for killers to leave your last kill when you have almost no chance to down another surv and doors is 99 (which all survivors do before rescuing).
As for DS in basekit, its okay but they should make it so if you hook someone between (and of course the DS surv is not down to avoid slug exploit) it would not apply, you shouldnt be punished cause you were good/the ds surv being bad or greedy and end a chase quickly, cause actually good surv exploit it, making them virtually invincible for 1 min and allowing them to bb, do gens/totems in front of you or take the chase for another surv.
Valid points from someone who put thought into their response rather than dismissing the idea completely. I agree with these points, they are quite fair and compromising.
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@Theninjajesus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1841752#Comment_1841752
1) Yes you can hide in lockers and whatnot; most Survivors don't bother doing that. And if you don't see anyone, they certainly ALL wouldn't hide in lockers outside 40M away. If you don't see anyone you might as well hunt around the hook region.
2) it's YOUR job to demonstrate how you could make it unexploitable. YOU'RE the one saying this is needed.
3) No, it's not. It's a behavior, not an error coded into the game. It's a real scumbag move. I hate it and it makes the game worse for all parties.
4) yes, you're right. The corollary to your statement is that a good killer may stay NEAR a hook without camping to do some of the other stuff I said (reload, set traps, break pallets, kick gens), and, by the extremely bad idea you support, would not get any hook progression.
You got camped by someone who felt uncertain in their skills. I'm sorry you had that terrible experience. It sucks. This solution makes the game unplayable for killers. Every killer has several things that survivors do that are jerk things to do that aren't exploits and gets them riled. Flashlight flicking, teabagging, gesturing at the killer, locker spamming? These are all jerk moves. I'm not going to suggest something like giving anyone who crouches 10 times in 5 seconds exhaustion for 30 seconds for basically doing squat thrusts in front of me.
Your idea is not a solution.
Edited to take the edge off a bit. I'm getting a little heated by you spamming this forum topic trying to suggest this "solution" as a thing that wouldn't completely break the game. It would. Stop.
Interesting...
- that’s straight up exactly what most survivors do, I’m getting the idea you’re inexperienced.
- Anything that doesn’t financial compensate me is not my job, otherwise I’d put it on my taxes. I choose to provide examples and I have so scroll up and find them if you want to read more about it.
- To exploit; to selfishly take advantage of someone or something at benefit to one’s self, commonly at the cost of another. (Nothing to do with coded errors, exploitation is, as you stated, a behavior)
- setting traps, breaking pallets, yada yada yada, does not take much time, so if given a grace period of say 10 seconds of not pausing the hook and your still there, yeah, your obviously camping and trying to find an excuse to still be in the area.
- I’m not “sorry” per say, that you’re getting “a little heated” in a community discussion, but it is unfortunate. Nobody is going to back down because you want them to, that’s not how things work in the real world.
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@dezzmont said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1841745#Comment_1841745
For real, if someone is at rank 1 and your ACTUALLY threatening gens and constantly pop them, the blight won't be at rank 1 for long. So said blight CAN'T be doing that every match. Its actually impossible.
Furthermore, its important to remember that while, yes, some killers may camp 100% of the time and thus auto-lose the game rather than 'correctly' going off the hook... so what? This problem self corrects, and the cure is worse than the disease here. Especially because good survivors tend to NOT assume they will get all 3 hook stages unless they set it up ahead of time for the entire SWF team to have BT.
So there was supposed to be a video attachment to show exactly what happen but it didn’t post for whatever reason.
Regardless, you actually can pip up from this kind of gameplay style, which ties into the other issue that killers rank system rewards you even when your not doing a whole lot of effort which should definitely be reworked. If your not putting in a lot of effort towards your emblem categories it should be properly reflected post game. Currently you can pretty easily pip up even if you camp or at the very least safety and that’s taking it real easy on killer gameplay.
Lastly the problem doesn’t “self correct “. If that’s true, why has it not self corrected in all this time? Doesn’t look like it’s going to at any point. And to the point of the cure is worse than the disease(which is almost never true in any situation), that statement alone is a dramatic over exaggeration. No matter what the issue, its absolutely ludicrous to suggest that it’s beyond the capacity of a capable human to remedy. We’re not in the stone ages, there’s plenty of viable solutions as long as you try. What’s impossible is to fixing something without attempting because your afraid it can’t be done. If we were all to adopt that mentality we wouldn’t have the technology and resources we have now to begin with.
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@NZCrazyMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1841775#Comment_1841775
This game has been around how many years now? I'm sorry if this offends you but if you are right that's shameful rationale. There is an old gaming psychology that states that when games are developed, devs just pay attention because gamers are far more likely to take the easy way than the proper way. Move spamming (hadoken anyone), cheats codes, sacrificing teammates, whatever - any dev naive to rely on players to behave should be fired. Is that cynical? Of course. Doesn't make it wrong.
I think you are putting too much faith in game developers, as well as people in general. They themselves are of a generation plagued by a degrading work ethic and pride in accomplishment. It’s a phenomenon prevalent in more than the game industry and growing rapidly, each new generation is becoming lazier and more complacent in their work. People (not all, but many) don’t like to work hard, if they can take the easy route they will and that’s what happens when you lack drive and dedication to your craft. Game developers are not an exception, they’re just normal people trying to get a paycheck and it’s easy to say “good enough”. And I’m not offended, I’m saying this is the reality of things. Sure, I could be wrong, but if you look around, I don’t think I am. Sad, but true.
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@NZCrazyMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1841775#Comment_1841775
This game has been around how many years now? I'm sorry if this offends you but if you are right that's shameful rationale. There is an old gaming psychology that states that when games are developed, devs just pay attention because gamers are far more likely to take the easy way than the proper way. Move spamming (hadoken anyone), cheats codes, sacrificing teammates, whatever - any dev naive to rely on players to behave should be fired. Is that cynical? Of course. Doesn't make it wrong.
I think
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It’s because the devs prefer to be hands off and had an idea for how the game would work, trusting that players would take it upon themselves to create a fun experience. Keep in mind a large majority of players are youths, when was the last time you found maturity in them. Case in point, the following comments from everyone I just “offended”.
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@stargazer9 said:
No. You say it’s because you encounter many PC players exploiting and hacking. I honestly don’t buy it. Many of us who play on PC haven’t encountered a single hacker. You can also see DbD streamers, some of them stream for more than 8 hours and some even do 24 hour streams and they don’t encounter a single hacker. I’m not saying there are 0 hackers in the game but if there are any they are very very rare, you could put more than 500 hours into the game and not encounter any.
Then you’re misinformed or not aware. There’s plenty of people who experience it, there’s videos on YouTube, you don’t have to look far to find people hacking and 9 times out of 10 they are pc. If you look for the smoke, you’ll find fire.
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@Theninjajesus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839292#Comment_1839292
Guess you're not a Futurama watcher, then. Otherwise you'd understand I was quoting said show.
I could go into other things about how pausing a hook timer while a killer is within range, say, setting traps, or using intel they have from their perks (if bbq and chilli doesn't show everyone, then all three must be within range, but I'll run away and let them get that unhook for free because if I don't walk away the hook timer will never start...), or breaking pallets, or any number of things that aren't camping but would be treated as such by this bad suggestion, but I really didn't want to do anything other than convey my point with a pithy quote.
In short, this is impossible for survivors to NOT exploit, even by mistake, and it's impossible it's not punitive against killers. What OP suggests is "What if all survivors had a free hook pausing perk that they could exploit by keeping the killer within range?"
- Not showing survivors auras is no guarantee that all 3 are in range, there are several ways to hide your aura from that perk you should be aware of.
- there’s plenty of ways to make such a feature less exploitable if you put some thought into it.
- camping in itself is an exploit so if your going to resist this function on those grounds you should acknowledge the former.
- any killer worth their salt has no fear of unhooking. Unless you are not confident in being able to find a survivor more than once.
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@dezzmont said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839462#Comment_1839462
They talk about in later dev posts how they aren't interested in persuing this and implore survivors to, in not so many words, 'Get good.'
For real, camping isn't actually a problem in the game if you know what your doing, and the devs are super sick of people complaining about. They flat out said any reports about camping will be discarded.
There is no valid reason to punish killers for defending hook if the survivors refuse to punish them. You have the tools to stop camping. Use them. Survivors have been complaining about this since 2016. Its not going to change, the 'anti camping' feature of the game is the killer believing at least 2 survivors are on gens so if they camp for the 3 minutes required to get a kill they lose (As 2 survivors can do 6 gens in 3 minutes if they are good at skill checks).
Convince the killer you WILL punish them, and they should move. If they don't they will depip down to 20 pretty quick and most people will statistically pip past a hard camper meaning they will find themselves alone vs other people who can't play. If you are at 20, you have problems outside of getting camped.
So here’s a perfect example of a rank 1 blight who made no effort to leave the hook even with 3 survivors on gens so the idea that the threat of gen progress while they’re camping does not apply. This is no isolated incident, but rather common in higher ranks players, they will risk gens popping if it means they can remove even 1 survivor from the match.
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I like the idea, but I think 40 meters might be a bit excessive. 30 at lvl 3 sounds fairer. And would how would the perk choose which survivor(s) are affected at lvl 1 and 2, would it be in terms of proximity to the hook? ie. the survivor closest to the hook is prioritized. You would also have to consider how long it takes for the perk to activate, I think the killer would have to be allotted a grace period to move away from the hook, 10 or 15 seconds sounds right. I’m not sure about stacking it, prove thyself doesn’t stack with itself for that reason.
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Also, to the point of “if you don’t want to be camped then get good” what does that say to players who have just started playing or are still learning? Yes practice makes perfect, but there is an importance in providing a reasonable learning curve and at a certain point that point of view turns away players who were interested in playing, but are immediately discouraged when their first week of playing is 70% getting face camped. That’s a pretty bad first time experience on a game you were hoping to play, any new player would feel like they’re being punished for being new to the game and having little opportunity learn. And we see that reflected in how many console players have left the game as well as players who tried it for a month and just moved on to a different game. I get that there is a learning curve, but it doesn’t need to be so severe and no game should ever ignore the focus of providing new players a welcoming experience. That’s a very “gated community” outlook.
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@dezzmont said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839462#Comment_1839462
They talk about in later dev posts how they aren't interested in persuing this and implore survivors to, in not so many words, 'Get good.'
For real, camping isn't actually a problem in the game if you know what your doing, and the devs are super sick of people complaining about. They flat out said any reports about camping will be discarded.
There is no valid reason to punish killers for defending hook if the survivors refuse to punish them. You have the tools to stop camping. Use them. Survivors have been complaining about this since 2016. Its not going to change, the 'anti camping' feature of the game is the killer believing at least 2 survivors are on gens so if they camp for the 3 minutes required to get a kill they lose (As 2 survivors can do 6 gens in 3 minutes if they are good at skill checks).
Convince the killer you WILL punish them, and they should move. If they don't they will depip down to 20 pretty quick and most people will statistically pip past a hard camper meaning they will find themselves alone vs other people who can't play. If you are at 20, you have problems outside of getting camped.
I haven’t seen any other dev streams where they’ve stated that so I won’t speak to it. As for convincing the killer they will be punished in game, I can tell you there are many killers who don’t mind that and will still choose to camp as gems go off. What’s more, while many of them are low rank there are red ranks as well that do so and I myself have witness rank 3 or 2 killers go up a rank after camping 2 or more hook sacrifices so the whole de pip thing is not entirely accurate. I don’t actively take clips in game, but I can look through and see what I have and if you want I’ll try to remember to record an example of this. But I have for sure witnessed it happen. That’s why a lot of red rank killers end up with only 2 kills and say the match was too hard...well you camped 2 survivors you had difficulty with while gens went off so what did you expect to happen? But it’s enough to still get one pip so for some killers it’s worth it.
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@PeaceNGrease said:
Why is anyone still entertaining this thread? It's obvious bait and this guy even admitted to not playing in red ranks "I still play with SOME red and purple rank killers"
This is a joke, guys. Don't even engage, it's not like the devs are going to use this to nerf pig again
Where did I say that? Or are you just saying that I said that?
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@sulaiman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839352#Comment_1839352
So you dont give evidence, you dont discuss the evidence there is, and that invalidates your whole point actually.
Because you want something to be changed on your own personal metric, and that certainly is not healthy for the game.
Also, the devs do have the full statistics, while we only have a part of it. If that game is not challenging enough for you, maybe you should move on to something else.
(and just to clarify: I am a survivor main what used to play both sides, and i stopped playing killer because the game favors survivors way too much. My escape rate was around 75%, but since the mori change it just gone up)
I’m not going to stream videos because you can find videos where said evidence is provided, you simply need to look for it, no I’m not taking the time to do that for anyone. And this is an opinion shared by more than just myself, just look at the forums discussions. But no, I’m not going to further discuss the topic of video evidence, such a topic is unnecessary.
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@dezzmont said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839430#Comment_1839430
The mechanic they ended up making was a combo of BT and BBQ. The dissatisfaction with the fix wasn't because they wanted to remove camping (again, they literally said in the clip they don't want to make camping worse, they want to reward not camping, and they said they will never 'destroy' camping), it was because their solution had too many negative costs.
Pausing the hook timer is not an option. Not because it makes the game 'harder' for the killer, but it breaks a core interaction. Pausing the timer when the killer is 'camping' (AKA: defending the hook, which may or may not be correct), breaks the game because it removes all pressure the hook creates from the survivors.
I am sorry, but getting hooked is MEANT to suck. Its meant to make the game worse for the survivors. That is to encourage you to not get hooked in the first place. Same with how getting shot in CS:GO sucks, or getting cornered in a fighting game sucks. Games NEED gamestates that dramatically disfavor certain sides to work.
So get good at doing good rescues, get good at not getting caught first, or get wrecked. Don't be the guy complaining that AWPs are OP because you can't rush down long wildly firing an SMG at max distance and get instantly killed because you won't buy a 50 dollar flashbang in counterstrike. Camping is here to stay, because its too important to the game's health.
If you don't want to lose control over the game and risk being eliminated without you being able to do anything to stop it, play better earlier in the match and apply gen pressure so the killer never has the time to even CONSIDER camping. Don't be the definition of a scrub, someone who when things don't go their way in the game don't adjust their own playstyle or try to get better, but instead complain the game itself is unfair despite everyone understanding the rules beforehand: http://www.sirlin.net/ptw-book/introducingthe-scrub
If your complaining that it is unfair you can lose, you lost the game before you started. Games don't exist to let you win or have fun all the time, they are a more cohesive experience, and if you can't enjoy how the game makes you lose, you should re-adjust yourself, rather than demanding the game changes.
I agree with you on some points, though what I heard them say word for word in that video was “if it’s is exploitable (hook camping) then we want to fix it, but absolutely no concrete information on how at this time”. I don’t think it breaks the game because there’s ways to implement game mechanics that make it harder for survivors to exploit a paused timer ex. causing an exposed or exhausted status on survivors when near a hooked survivor for too long. Also if a killer is in a chase the timer doesn’t need to pause. If you get creative with it there are many ways to get this to work in a balanced way, it just takes imagination and an openness to experimentation
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@Xyvielia said:
If you want a pretty decent challenge, play Nurse on console, no perks or add ons (could prove worthwhile on PC as well)
you should find yourself putting forth a bit more effort than you usually do, and also may enjoy potentially heightened challenge finding and downing survivors
I only play on console and I agree with you there, nurse is an exception of a killer that provides an acceptable challenge as killer. If more killers were as challenging as she is I would be much more satisfied. But I’m not satisfied with one or even a small handful of challenging killers. Shout out to all those hardcore nurses, y’all flaunt your talent like no others
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@dezzmont said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839289#Comment_1839289
They talk about it in Devstream 21. They had prototypes that did things like blind the killer near the hook, or make the timer longer, but that caused survivors to game the time mechanic by doing things to force the killer to stay near the hook but not actually engage in a chase, because if the hook timer doesn't go down and the killer can't leave the hook without the survivor getting off and away, the killer legitimately has no other options, so they committed to never adding more negative reinforcement against hook camping (And, on top of that, reiterated its a good strategy and they want killers to feel better about LEAVING the hook than making being by the hook worse.
Vid link attached. Starts at 17:30
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7oRfaMJuCPU&feature=emb_title&ab_channel=DeadbyDaylight
I’ve watched the part you’re referring to and the final response was they were “not satisfied” with the mechanics they tested so far and will continue to look for a viable solution as they have acknowledged killers need to be encouraged away from camping (at least that’s what they are hoping to see). Not that they are giving up on that route and it will never happen. It’s in the works, they said. As for the killers options if they leave the area the timer resumes and survivors must unhook, always the killer to proceed. It may be difficult for the killer to adjust, but is the point of any game not to challenge every player to improve and try new things?
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@VicThor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839354#Comment_1839354
No worries! We just can’t take you serious in that case.
You* can’t . You* are asking for validation. You do not speak for all.
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@The_Krapper said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839323#Comment_1839323
It's not as common as you would think when it does happen it could be for alot of reasons and I don't think the hook timer should freeze or anything like people are suggesting, you seem like you're trolling with a new account with what you're saying to people and how frequently
I play at all times of the day and I experience it often enough for it to be common. And having a strong opinion and not having a problem voicing it is not trolling, it’s being engaged in the community. Responding negatively to someone choosing to be involved in that community is trolling and discouraging their participation. People are allowed to voice there opinions and disagree with others
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@Kadajacs said:
If you want a challenge all you have to do is play Wraith. Outright the worst killer in the game. He can't even get his gimmick of being invisible right.
I’m not disputing that there are crap killers out there, although wraith has his strengths when played properly, but yes he is difficult
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@VicThor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839252#Comment_1839252
BTW I killer main and nope I don’t see the same way at all. That’s why I asked you to stream it.
Well I’m not streaming it, I’m to old for that kind of thing so stop asking. Or continue. The answer remains no.
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@sulaiman said:
no, its proof on high level gameplay where everyone is knowing what they do. And for killers, it is challenging.
On general gameplay, a lot of players struggle and are challenged enough as it is.
This thread basicly reads as if you want to make the impression that killer were too easy and powerful, while it is clear for most people that is not the case.
You can´t factor in bad allys in terms of balance in a game like this, because if you do, it becomes broken easily if the bad allys happen to be good ones.
Maybe if someday a usefull matchmaking is implemented, but i doubt it will happen.
Yes and I’m not discussing tournament gameplay as it’s not relevant to the majority. In my experience those that struggle are themselves making bad gameplay choices as killers and not looking to what mistakes they are making that cause them to struggle, thus, they don’t improve. And yes, that’s the exact point I’m making, that’s why it’s the title of the thread
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Ive played both sides enough to say that I’ve personally experienced games where rank 1 killers get match with say a rank 2, 3, 9 and 14, which is not what I would consider a proper matchmaking system and games where low rank killers are matched with high rank survivors. Yes, it does also properly match you sometimes, but I’ve seen that the former is more common. I’ve also met and made friends with a number of killer mains who share my opinion and we discuss the topic often and in great detail and most of them are red ranks. I assure you, the higher rank killers who don’t feel they are challenged exist, even if you have not encountered them.
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@Blueberry said:
It was already tested long ago and abused by the survivors so it was scrapped.
I think camping/tunneling happens way less than people act like. Many times the survivors are just making bad plays and getting punished. Not saying it doesn't happen, but even on survivor I see way, way more games where the survivors accuse the killer of camping or tunneling, than there are games that they actually tunneled or camped.
All that said, the reason many killers camp/tunnel is because of the games poor balance. It incentivizes them to do so. The way you fix this is not by punishing them for camping/tunneling, you fix it by making it more efficient to leave the hook and down someone else than it is to focus the same guy.
IE you are trying to cure the symptoms of the disease(camping/tunneling) rather than curing the disease itself (game imbalance).
The killers camping and tunneling is them backed into a corner from poor balance and feeling like they have no options left. Just gutting them for that with nothing else doesn't make them stop camping or tunneling, it makes them quit the game.
Camping and tunneling is extremely common, I’ve seen it, many players have seen it, if it were false there wouldn’t be as many discussions on it as there are. Where there’s smoke there’s fire right?. That said there’s plenty of killers who don’t rely on those tactics and do exceptionally well so there’s no reason why any killer should need to rely on them as long as they focus on improving themselves
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General gameplay as a whole is not based on tournaments, there are other players in the community and that is the focus, not a small percentage
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@The_Krapper said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1837544#Comment_1837544
I play killer and survivor both equally and have 9500 hours in this game, I'm a nurse main granted so I don't ever stick around the hook for 15 secs that's a straight waste of time as a killer when every second counts, 90% of the killers I see that camp hooks don't ever leave them and their intention is to secure that kill and they don't care if survivors are right there or not , I'm usually on a gen and once it pops I go for the save and the killer is just circling the area, NO it's not every game and I'm not saying it's impossible to win I'm saying that killers are camping just to be a dick to that survivor for whatever reason they feel like and at that point gens are usually the least of their worries and they've already thrown the game to make sure that one person dies
This is one of the more honest comments I’ve seen and I agree. It’s not to say every killer does this, but it is extremely common and therefore should not be dismissed as if it doesn’t ever happen. It’s a popular tactic that players don’t like to admit to. If you want to camp that’s fine but the penalty for it should be just as equal to a potato survivor that hides on the edge of the map and doesn’t help with objective categories.
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@AnnoyedAtTheGame said:
This is so stupid. So basically the survivors always win. The killer always loses.
Camping is a strategy in this game.
Survivors mains always moan about this.
If a killer is camping your choice is do gens or risk unhook.
Camping is a lazy strategy for those who have no other resort. The fact that you have the ability to play lazy does not mean it should be encouraged. In any game, players should strive to leave their comfort zone and improve the areas that need improvement
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This comment is lazy and you should form a worthwhile response
@Theninjajesus said:
This suggestion is bad and you should feel bad!
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@dezzmont said:
The devs tested it and then said categorically it will never ever ever ever happen.
Camping is purely a survivor sided issue caused by bad survivor play. This is counter intuitive, it SEEMS like the killer is choosing to camp, but the killer is actually playing purely reactively when it comes to the hook.
The killer's ONLY objective is based on what the survivors do. If the survivors themselves divebom the hook, or just don't repair gens? The killer literally has no choice but to camp. If the killers do gens? Camping is terrible.
Good survivors don't let their teammates get camped not because they are sicknasty at instantly rescuing their bud from the killer, but because they put the killer under enough pressure that they can't take the luxury of spending a whole flippin 3 minutes (for perspective, that is enough time for 3 survivors to repair 7 generators counting skill-checks, so literally every generator in the map, including the 2 you don't need to do) unless the killer has a very good reason to suspect that they are actually pressuring 3 survivors while camping.
If you remove the reward for camping, suddenly the killer has no incentive to hook. What the devs found is the killer... just slugs. Every time. Because if you are literally not allowed to defend your hook, hooking the survivor is BAD actually, even if you don't WANT to defend them. It costs you time to bring a survivor to a hook, and your 'reward' is 1/3rd of their way to death, and giving the survivors the ability to instantly heal them to full. If camping doesn't create an objective the killer can defend, suddenly you have no reason to want to hook, because it actually makes the killer gamestate worse. If you slug, the survivors either need to invest time into healing the downed player, or the downed player has to heal themselves which means they aren't insta-unhooked.
Killers will always camp unless the survivors pressure them. It isn't just 'you counter camping by doing gens.' You get the killer to stop hanging out by the hooked survivor by doing gens. The killer needs a reason to leave based on the survivors threatening him. If the survivors refuse to threaten the killer, the killer should be able to do whatever they want. Acting like the killer shouldn't be able to get the kill if survivors don't do gens is like saying the killer shouldn't be able to down survivors even if they don't run away: If you don't make things hard for the killer, guess what? It isn't hard for the killer, and they are going to walk all over you. Give em something to think about other than 'Wow I could just get rid of this guy right now and there isn't a damn thing the survivors can do about it."
This is not true.
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Absolutely. If the idea being the game is high stakes hide and seek, then the game should always being motivating the seeker to continue seek. That’s the objective.
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@sulaiman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839252#Comment_1839252
Well, we have high-level tournaments that show quite the opposite from people who play killer for a living, so no, its not there to see.
You make a claim, and the burden of proof is on you, because all the proof we have indicates the opposite.
Tournaments between select audience are not proof of general gameplay experience
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@sulaiman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1838909#Comment_1838909
Well, but that won´t happen. If you play random, you are very likly to meet a team with at least one potatoe, making the game a 3v1 in your favor. To have your challenge, you need to play against swf, but you cant choose that if you play random.
You can try to persue the devs to make an extra swf queue, so you would be able to match with them specificly.
And there lies the dilemma, limited experience with no aspirations for improvement and growth
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@Nosferatu3145 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839216#Comment_1839216
Yes, best build ever. Undying, Thrill of the Hunt and NOED. I wonder why we don't see this god build in tournaments or any casual game ever. And yes, killers have to assume all survivors have DS cause the majority of them really has
You don’t seem to have read the context of that response because none of that pertains to what was being discussed. Seems like you just skimmed
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@VicThor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839213#Comment_1839213
Sounds like bold claims without evidences.
The evidence is there if you want to see it, there’s no need for me to display an example for anyone and I won’t. If you play as killer you know what I’m talking about
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@Moundshroud said:
<snorts> Best BS I've read all day. Just remember that April Fool's Day is in April next time.
Not at all, but if it bothers you to the point of that kind of immature response instead of having a real opinion that’s on you
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@valvarez4 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839139#Comment_1839139
Wel, if you tunnel someone an take the ds stun, ds and ub are 2 wasted perks during the game. Same if you don’t tunnel. And every killer think they’re op
Ds is annoying, but can only be used once same with unbreakable so you just force them to be used and they are useless after that
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@Nosferatu3145 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839188#Comment_1839188
That's because there are 8 of these in the survivors team, not 2, and they are not used to anti tunnel purposes, they are used offensively and have no counterplay. And you know what is the counterplay for NOED right? Do bones
That’s assuming they are all running those to perks which is mostly unlikely and easily countered. And undying and thrill in comparison are much easier counters to prevent totem cleansing
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@VicThor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1838868#Comment_1838868
I was about to ask the same
Same answer I gave the original question
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@Yamaoka said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1838920#Comment_1838920
What killer(s) do you play?
I’ve tried most of them, but currently I prefer demo, I find he is well balanced, not to strong, not to weak, plus stranger things so that’s fun
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@Nosferatu3145 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1839117#Comment_1839117
Ruin+ Undying can be extremely good, but if one survivor is deliberately looking for totens It won't last long. And NOED is a trash perk, that only hinders good killers by playing with 3 perks the whole game and maybe got 2 downs after the gens are completed, I still don't understand why people think it is OP or whatever
I agree although it’s quite easy to get a few hooks before they find it and yes noed is trash and still one of the more popular perks. I don’t think it’s op I think it’s a crutch that many killers high and low rely on too much making them inefficient during most of the game
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@gibblywibblywoo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1838981#Comment_1838981
Fun fact. Playing during peak times means you're actually significantly more likely to get lower ranked/worse survivors due to the sheer difference in player counts. I only get good matches against good players during the day time. I don't even play killer in the evenings anymore as its too easy.
I’d agree with you there
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@gibblywibblywoo said:
Theres a lot of disparity in killer power. You have some killers that have to work a lot for only a little real reward ( Trapper, Wraith, Clown, Legion and The Twins if you aren't a camping scumbag) ones that are extremely hard to play but once mastered are nigh uncounterable (Only really Nurse, Blight to a lesser extent but he is definitely easier to learn and doesn't break the game wide open and has clear counterplay) some who are middle of the road like Doctor and Pyramid, Huntress who is very strong but also extremely map dependant. Then you have killers that are extremely strong but very easy to play and don't require much mechanical skill (Spirit, Freddy, Deathslinger).
It must make balancing the mountain of killer perks and map layouts a complete nightmare.
I agree with most of that, though I think legion is pretty easy as long as you know what your doing and pyramid in my opinion is of of the easiest killers to play, way too easy honestly.
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@Nosferatu3145 said:
Wait, how exactly Hexes are training wheels? They can be removed literally 20 seconds into the game. If you want a challenge play with all your perks beings hexes
well I should rephrase that as I don’t mean all hex perks. I mean perks like undying which lets me see anyone who happens to walk by a hex or ruin which lets me ignore damaging gens or the worst one Noed which is just relying on last minute hooks
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@valvarez4 said:
That’s because killer is easy as hell. But in this forum full of killer mains they want to easily 4k with a rank 10 trapper against a 4swf squad with 5.000 hours each
Well that’s the point I’m making, it’s far too easy and for someone looking to push themselves the game doesn’t make you feel pushed. How do you really improve when the game makes it easy to stay in the comfort zone?
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@TicTac said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1838909#Comment_1838909
Then wait for the mmr-system and hope its working this time.
The average playerbase will never be good.
Well that’s vastly disappointing
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@ALostPuppy said:
Maybe try perkless? It's what I did for a while and it was pretty fun with some killers. (Well, I ran BBQ and shadowborn because points and so I could see but that's it). Speed limiter Billy is also quite fun. Run it with the yellow cooldown add-on and get some really good chainsaw practice in. Or nurse with her 2 limiting add-ons, forgot what they were called. Or intentionally send yourself to Haddonfield or Ormond.
There are plenty of ways To make this game challenging. A lot of them aren't that fun, but they're usually more fun than winning every other game in 4 minutes.
I have tried that and it does make it more challenging, but it is the games responsibility to challenge me the player. I shouldn’t have to handicap myself to find a proper challenge