runningguy
runningguy
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@Wolf65 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4002185#Comment_4002185
Did they change the mechanic? When I played survivor (before my retunr now), you did not get crows, if you at least moved just a little bit. Crouched in cover, just sway a little left to right and you#ve been safe. Did that change? and if so, instead of fixing it, they removed it completely (killer nerf)??
AFK crows was supposed to have a buff because people were dropping and picking up items and moving from locker to locker hiding making no attempt to do gens while preventing crows. The devs have actually said avoiding the objective while not progressing the match is a reportable offence, hence why they introduced anti hiding crows to trigger more frequently. Survivors said they were too oppressive and triggered when they were just looking for a hex totem or looking for a gen so the AFK crows were reverted back to the original AFK crows that remains useless in preventing survivors from hiding for 20min, 30min an hour in some cases.
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@rxolly said:
Obviously this doesn’t mean stop putting out other limited time games modes but I think 2v8 would be a good permanent addition to the game. Not only does it allow friends to play killer together in the same lobby but it also opens the door for a friend group larger than 4 to play together. The games are also pretty fast and fun so I truly don’t see why not. I really enjoy it myself, as both killer and survivor!
i dont like the idea of simply voting or upvoting or downvoting without explanation so i will provide my reasoning for my "no" vote.
Simply, it splits the q times of everything so 1 v 4 q times as survivor and killer takes a hit. 30min to q up for killer in 2 v 8. play as you wait does help with this, however when i q for killer, i want to play killer not survivor. For people that only enjoy killer role, they have a choice, wait 30min in a lobby doing nothing, or play a role they dont like and have no interest in playing while they wait. If q times were reasonable during 2 v 8 then sure by all means add it permanently. Untill that happens i have to vote "no"
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@brewingtea said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4002057#Comment_4002057
"The situation" isn't even necessarily a low escape rate. It's a lack of agency and fun.
Even if they gave us bazookas that didn't make us win more, at least we'd have something to do other than hold M1…
i think thats just the role of survivor, i mean 1 person in chase, 3 others on a gen pressing a button now and then. get hooked and you have to stay there doing nothing until someone unhooks…if they unhook at all. People play survivor knowingly and willingly with the knowledge that the gameplay at its core is boring. At what point should people start thinking maybe the game or that particular role just isnt for them? i wouldnt play a first person shooter and then complain when i get shot, if i dont like that aspect then maybe first person shooters are not for me?
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@Ohyakno said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4002265#Comment_4002265
It's the same issue as being straddled with a random team as any online game. Human beings have volition. They do stuff they want to do that makes sense to them, not what you want them do it. It's an. Intractable problem and I'd argue, not a problem at all. The world would be a less interesting place if everybody just did predictable stuff all the time.
true but as a solo player i dont think the fault of teams losing lays at the hands of the killer or the tactics they use. it lays in the survivors hands as a whole. that being said, out of 75 matches this month so far i have escape rate of over 50% as a solo player that runs gen builds… raises the question, is tunneling and slugging really an issue at all? not for me and im no means a go survivor lol
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100% agree that solo needs to be buffed to be in line with SWF, i play soloq so i know what its like. However, people dont want chat options, they even dont use the pre match lobby to attempt to communicate their perks. i used to say "running gen build" or something to let people know what i have but people dont bother to listen and just not interested. i recently said "running better together" please dont bring the killer to me when im 95% done on a gen" what happens? they bring the killer to me every time.
its like people want to win but dont want to win as a team they want to be able to do it alone and when they cant they complain about tunneling or slugging or op killers. i have people on my teams with no perks at all and then get annoyed when the killer brings their A game and wins.
You cant make people play as a team if they dont want to which is the key difference between solo and swf. swf are on the same page with the same goal. solo players might be trolling, or working on totems instead of gens or just want to meme and not always on the same page as the rest of the team. These things cant be solved unless bhvr changes it so survivors can win alone without teamwork, which obviously will mean swf would be untouchable.
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@misskins83 said:
I need new tomes. I need goals. The daily things are not it. I've done all. The survivor ones I can. Please. I beg of you. Give me new tomes
if you have done all survivor ones, why not do killer ones?
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while i know the ptb was a colossal failure but has hinted at things to come, i wouldnt stop playing killer until the changes have actually happened. look at the anti hiding AFK crows, still waiting on them with no sign at all they will ever be implemented after survivors complained. Same could happen with the changes to killer, could be months or years…its been months so far regarding the AFK crows.
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@XDgamer018 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4002201#Comment_4002201
when did michael myers have to loop around a rock in the movies? or when was myers bothered by flashlights?
he didnt and he wasnt, thats why lightborn, tinkerer and tombstone is good lol. stalks, stalks and stalks then from out of nowhere someone on gen looks behind them and sees myers next to them, makes them jump and mori. pretty accurate.
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i first started playing dbd on xbox and it was great. Never even knew chat existed. But every match felt like i was playing bots, play the match, win or lose the match ends with nothing post match. Then i started playing on PC gamepass and i never looked back. As solo survivor i found i was able to say things like "running gen build" to let others know what perks im running in pre game lobby and post matches became more interactive. True, toxicity is rife and very often people will vent but for me, its mildly amusing to get survivors saying "git gud" and "learn to play noob" after they have just lost the match. i mean, i won…looks like they need to learn to play but ok. Just adds to entertaining interactive value of the game.
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@sinkra said:
The game has always been extremely survivor sided when survivors are playing to win and not just goofing around like what happens in soloq.
This is why solo and swf are like 2 very different modes and should be treated as such. solo is very much killer sided. swf is very much survivor sided.
swf teams often climb the ranks of mmr like the killers do which is why they usually get to a point that killers get swf teams more and more frequently. solo players can struggle to get into high mmr because its so killer sided, they lack the team work that swf provides and often have some random guy going next or avoiding gens. easy win for the killer. But when killers get SWF with good team work and coms the killer needs to do whatever they can to win. the difference between playing to win and goofing around is crazy regarding the gen speeds.
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@CrypticGirl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4001072#Comment_4001072
What do you mean? Killers have every comeback mechanic in the world, from windows getting blocked, pallets being destroyed, Killers getting bloodlust. Or of course they can resort to those strategies like tunneling, camping, and slugging. The number of times I've seen Killers turn the match around from a bad start is through the roof. And as a last resort, there are plenty of endgame perks that have little to no counters.
Survivors, on the other hand, have very little in the way of comeback mechanics. Those perks that are labeled as "anti-tunnel" perks are really only "delaying the inevitable" perks.
thats because survivors are not supposed to be able to run forever. survivors start the match at their strongest, the killer is weakest at the start. survivors have a full team, full set of pallets, can spread out to do more gens. as the match progresses this slowly shifts to killer being strongest at the end and survivors weak at the end after they use pallets and reduce the amount of gens that need to be done. thats the base of the game, hardly 2nd chances for killers to get kills after failing. keep giving survivors chance after chance and they will start the match strong and will not get weaker as the match progresses.
2nd chances are things that give the player another chance after failing, breaking pallets and chasing long enough for bloodlust or survivors vaulting same vault so it blocks isnt the killer failing.
1.survivors can fail to do gens and still escape via hatch.
2 they can fail to find hatch first and still escape if they have a key.
3. survivors can fail a chase and get injured then heal.
4. survivors can fail in 2 chases get hooked/downed and still get saved after failing the chases.
5. now they want another 2nd chance after failing chase by recovering themselves from being downed.
when can the killer get a kill without doing anything after failing? they dont have a team to protect gens for them or to chase for them, the killer has to do everything, survivors wont die on their own while i sit back and do nothing. but if i have a good team as survivor it is possible for me to sit back and do nothing then escape.
you say these anti tunneling perks only delay the inevitable, i dont run any anti tunnel perks or anti slug and im solo. i go in with a gen build. this month so far out of over 70 matches my escape rate is 52%. im by no means an amazing survivor but i do play a fair amount of survivor and killer and i seriously dont see the issue. the only issue i see is the god awful team mates i get. if i had a good team constantly maybe my escape rate would be higher. sorry but i have to call skill issue in many cases that people fail against a tunneling/slugging killer. it is strange that a lot of people complaining about these tactics actually have an escape rate of around 40% atleast which is the target rate for survivor. if these tactics were effecting escape rates negatively and making killers over 60% kill rate fair enough but they dont.
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@Alicia_Tried6041 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4001634#Comment_4001634
So basically this game caters to the swf because there is zero counterplay against this broken mechanic in solo q besides being bottlenecked into bringing we're going to live forever and other anti slug perks.
i wouldnt say 0 counterplay because i play solo and if i get good team mates then it can be countered but in short, yes the game caters to swf. killers get buffed to compete with them. soloq that lack the coms and tactical advantages that swf have usually suffer.
solo and swf are very different because swf has advantages that solo doesnt. if solo people could counter things then swf would be invincible so solo needs a buff to bring it in line swf without making swf even stronger. its a team game so should require team effort.
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@brewingtea said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4001434#Comment_4001434
You can camp a slug all you want. If someone tries to pick them up, they get no unhook protections like BT, so you can down them again instantly AND go for the other person. Also, a pickup can be interrupted, unlike an unhook.
Also, people don't "Recover" like they should, so picking them up could take FOREVER, unlike an unhook. (They were going to remove that and make auto-recovery a thing, but killers complained that they need a way for survivors to literally throw or else they can't win as much.)
Even if the downed survivor is recovering, you can't pick them up until that meter is full. You have to sit there and hold M1, making you vulnerable that whole time. If they were hooked instead, you would have them back in the game immediately.
As a solo queue player, I have to run Kindred so I can see when it's safe to unhook, but that doesn't work against slugging. There are a ton of perks activated by hooking, and while few of them are indefensibly "fair" as "Kindred on solo queue", it's still a way for killer to disable all hook perks in the game with basically no downside. Killer can just choose not to bring Pain Resonance et al so there's no "risk" for the reward they're getting. You even said the timers are comparable, so there's certainly no downside there.
But if I'm wrong, and they're totes the same, then why was that recent proposal so punishing again?
Yes but my point is im in soloq and my team mates are not saving me, how is it any different to being slugged? the experience is still the same, sat in one place doing nothing. For me, i would rather be slugged so i can move to a pallet or possible move to hatch spawn location (i have escaped through the hatch doing this).
You say there is no down side but there are down sides and plenty of risk.
- slug timer is 4min so if the killer is camping a slugged player it gives others 4min to do gens.
- the slug can move to a pallet and possibly picked up, the killer then has wasted a lot of time and 0 hooks for doing so.
- as i said before, a slug can escape through hatch or even the exit gates.
The main problem people seem to have from being slugged is of the teams own undoing.
- the slug didnt hold the recover down which means getting them back up can take too long
- everyone stops doing gens to help the slug and they all end up getting slugged
- the only way a killer can slug whole teams is if the survivors let them (to get fast abandon option) or if they do poorly in chase.
i recently played v a slugging blight and a slugging deathslinger. blight got 1k death slinger got 0k. how? because the team knew what they were doing. However i in many soloq maches i get team mates that dont know or bother to help slugs or even hooked team mates. i have been left on hook the full timer many times, first hook and stayed untill i was sacrificed. So the issue isnt slugging, the issue is failure of team play to counter it just like when im left on hook.
i know many survivor refuse to accept this but thats how team games work they need team work which is rare to get in solo.
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@Alicia_Tried6041 said:
..is just miserable these days. Killers are still way overpowered especially the newest killer which makes huntress obsolete. Unlimited hatchets, teleport and built in tracking. Really BHVR? Then when word gets out survivors get a little help via tunneling and slugging its the end of the world. Ignore the killer mains on the update. There is no reason to ever leave a survivor slugged more than 90 seconds.
how long is a hook state? The reason i ask is because people seem to complain about being slugged as it stops them from doing anything, cant play the match. How is this any different to being hooked? You still cant do anything and play the match.
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@AbsolutGrndZer0 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000738#Comment_4000738
When facing a hacker you should not be penalized for not wanting to play through the match, especially when hackers can hold games hostage for up to an hour.
no one is saying that, they are saying cheaters need to go which solves that issue. but the penalty for quitting the match just because they can should stay.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4001396#Comment_4001396
Mind you, that's a boon to killer side, cause losing Killer Adepts because of hatch is buns, and you can only really do them if you're facing Bambi's... a 3k requirement would be fairer.
While we're at it, Survivor Adepts also suck with map offerings being removed. Someone suggested a map of the week queue to help with this, which might be an idea. If not, maybe there could be a map of the week to boost offerings chances in the regular queue? If it's a really bad map, sac wards are a thing.
being a stealth killer im all for map of the week like they did with fnaf. it would allow people like me to play good stealth builds. pretty difficult to do on wide open maps which seems to be an abundant of these days.
map offerings was an issue mostly because people would dc in loading screen if they saw an offering they didnt like (i spent 2 hours trying to get a match but people would DC in loading screen whenever they saw RPD or The Game offering, when i removed the offerings i got a match instantly). So hiding them was a good change, but nerfing them into oblivion so they no longer work at all has had an impact on stealth killers.
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@AbsolutGrndZer0 said:
Just saw someone get their Adept Artist, even though the last survivor escaped through the hatch. Was this a change, or was it a glitch? Anyone know for sure?
i hope to god its not a change because it would further incentivise hiding for hatch which the devs were supposed to be preventing. But i wouldnt put it past them to do something like that.
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@BigStan said:
So what would it take? What do I have to do to prove that I am in a high MMR and that I am still getting 4Ks? I don't want excuses why it can't be done, I want out of this BS.
the only thing that would demonstrate that would be to kill players long enough. trust me, if you get enough kills and win enough you will see the difference between high and low mmr. As mmr is hidden there is no 100% way to be sure anyone is high mmr but getting kill rate to 60 or 70% would be a good indicator that your winning matches thus raising mmr. I would like to clarify im not trying to tell you how to play the game or anything, you play your way however you want but if you want high mmr then you do need a fair amount of kills under your belt.
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@TheTom20 said:
Today when i played survivor i had multiple people doing nothing hiding etc
switch to killer and had teams every game in a row with gens being slammed at lightning speed multiple flashlight saves pallet saves tons of body blocks were was all that in my survivor matches lol.i noticed this too, i came to the conclusion that its because as killer my actions are my own win or loss its on me. as my skill increased im assuming my mmr increased and i started getting swf teams that smash gens like no tommorow.
But survivor im reiiant on team effort so as my skill increased my mmr hasnt due to other players actions like going next or avoiding gens.
The result is that im teamed with equal low mmr players that face similar issues. killer matches = sweat fest. survivor matches = pretty easy going "whatever" sort of matches. very different experience.
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@BigStan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4001323#Comment_4001323
No, I get it. Everyone is saying I am fighting the babies. All I can do is keep spouting the same stuff since everyone else is doing the same thing. I can play a match or ten in front of you if you need proof of skill. It's not like I have 2200 hours of experience and learn to play the game in that time. I definitely never hit iri 1 and went months of struggling in matches as I learned the ins and outs of the game. Nope, just babies. The entire time. Anything I ever did before my current playstyle doesn't exist. Completely invalidated and rightly so. It's shameful that I ever thought about anything other than stats and kdrs.
This thread has been so soul sucking. I regret ever making it.
people are saying the same thing because we are trying to explain that watching you play a match or 10 or even 20 matches wont show anything because your mmr is low. your pick rate for myers is 11% and under 40% kill rate with less than 100 hours on that killer and its your top killer. it is highly unlikely you ever hit high mmr in that timeframe with that kill rate which is why people are saying your point might be valid for low mmr but you cant possibly comment on high mmr because its unlikely you ever hit that high.
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@BigStan said:
I didn't even know there was a tracker. Neat.
this demonstrates my point, kill rate is under 40%. thats lower than what a survivor escape rate should be. killers kill rate should be about 60%
@BigStan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4001298#Comment_4001298
I think I am being kind because I am killing the survivors evenly. I am reducing the worst thing survivors deal with. Downtime. It does not matter if I let them go or get the 4k. It's what's BHVR is trying to fix, it's what has to go. The best way to do that is prevent dying within the first 5 minutes to scummy tactics. This would make life so much less frustrating for survivors and should have been dealt with years ago before people got use to the scum.
You say your reducing the worst thing survivors deal with but all your doing is artificially pushing them into the higher mmr where they will go against players like me lol. as i have said before, high mmr killers need to bring their A game. How am i supposed to know if im going against a pretty new player that has been boosted up the ranks by killers letting them escape? i dont… so they will end up being treated like the SWF teams i usually go against and they will get steamrolled. thats not a good experience for them.
MMR isnt a perfect matchmaking system but your actions of letting survivors escape and climb the ranks of MMR will make it far harder for them later on. Players should be matched with equal skill players but your throwing babies to the sharks by doing what your doing.
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that is the exact reason i gave up being a survivor main. it has nothing to do with being tunneled or being slugged.
The reason is because at its core, survivor gameplay is boring. 1 person looping the killer? 3 others should be sitting on gens doing diddly squat. Generally boring concept.
Trying to win in solo matches is difficult, again not because of tunneling or slugging but because no one does gens. Even now when i play survivor i go in with full gen build because i know if i dont do gens then they just dont get done at all. I dont complain too much because the objective of survivor is do gens and escape so i know what im signing up for when i play that role which is why i avoid survivor these days.
The only time people want to do gens is when they are on death hook and they dont want to die, then its "ok dont tunnel me, let me sit on a gen" its a very frustrating role lol
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@BigStan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4001286#Comment_4001286
If you watch me kill, you would know my kill rate. You are by no means the first person to have this thought and neither will you be the last unfortunately. I don't even know what to tell you. Am I suppose to have been tracking my own KDR? No one gave me that memo.
The official DBD tracker tracks your kill rate.
i usually check it every month to keep an eye on it. i screenshot 1 a couple months ago. my all time kill rate is currently about 80% this is why i believe my mmr is high. I say believe because i cant be sure as its hidden, but logic would say that a kill rate that high over hundreds of hours would do something to the mmr and it shows in the matches im getting. frequently getting good performing SWF teams on coms.
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@BigStan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4001281#Comment_4001281
If you are so concerned about my skill against more experienced players, you are welcome to hang out and watch me play. If I prove to you that I am not just bottom feeding, will you be willing to admit the changes are not so bad?
wwatching you play wouldnt prove anything if you going against low mmr players. thats why i asked what your kill rate is.
The ranking system in the game being MMR goes up when you kill. in order to v high mmr players you need to kill. You have admitted to "usually dont get any kills" which means you cant be going against high mmr which is the point im making.
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@BigStan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4001256#Comment_4001256
You are correct. I am stating that killers do NOT need to use certain tactics. That is why they wanted to implement the changes. To fix it. There are some difference how I play in low and high MMR though.
Low MMR
-Low Effort
-More time waiting for gens to get done
-No Tier IIIHigh MMR
-Sweaty effort
-Sometimes gens get done
-Tier III is a mustJust because I spare babies doesn't mean I don't know or never have played against iridescent players. Either quality of survivors, I do just fine without camping or tunneling and slugging only when necessary. These are the things that are trying to be removed. If someone like me can do well without it, then ANYONE should be (more) capable.
The reason these changes are being made is to improve the quality of life for survivors. If everyone dies evenly, then no one is stuck with as much downtime. Downtime is the WORST thing a video game can have in it. You play because you want to be engaged. To be entertained. You are not either of these things if you have to sit and wait while watching everyone else having fun.
BHVR wouldn't have to change anything if we all played nice. But asking everyone to do that is an unreal expectation. That's why systems are being put in place to force us to play nicer. I'm just saying it's a necessary change and it's not as bad as everyone thinks. That's it.
However the fact you admit you intentionally lose matches means your mmr cant be high mmr. i am curious what your kill rate is with myers. Claiming you lose (tanking you mmr) then saying you play sweaty v high mmr in the same sentence makes no sense.
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i do think that tombstone piece could do with a tweak because its current state gives me 80 to 90% kill rate with myers (partly because people dont understand how to use lockers or stay out of line of sight). However reworking the entirety of myers and changing his base core is what i disagree with. From what i have seen, new myers is just weird blend of pig, ghostface and other killers. Thats not myers.
I honestly thought people would appreciate myers as he doesnt slug or tunnel which seems to be the main gripe survivors have. Tombstone takes a while to build up, during this time people can do gens, and play the match. There is no waiting on the floor or waiting on hook or being tunneled out. He offers creepy and scary vibes and when he does finally chase its very tense because you know he means business but he has no anti loop. i rather tombstone myers any day over a blight, ghoul or nurse.
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@BigStan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4001193#Comment_4001193
You can hook. You can kill. That's not the point of the thread. The point is that the scummier tactics at a killer's disposal need to be removed so the survivors have a much needed quality of life improvement in the form of less downtime from being tunneled out.
i believe the point of the thread was to highlight that killers dont NEED to use certain "dirty tactics". But your missing the point, that only applies to low mmr. high mmr is very different. what happens when these tactics get removed so low mmr have a better time? result is the high mmr with the swf sweat teams will make the experience unfun for the killer and make them OP. you rely on underperforming to achieve easy chill matches.
OK lets flip it. Do you propose SWF teams handicap themselves but not having coms to make the match more fun for the killer?
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@BigStan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000997#Comment_4000997
Good morning!
I played my first game of the day and took some screenshots. The Jane ended up getting mori'd at the end since she wanted to be mori'd and would not leave, but otherwise it went as any other game. I will admit they hard several gens ready to go when I finished hooking. If they prioritized better, I probably would not have 5 gens waiting.
It is true that when I play as a Chiller I don't enter Iridescent ranks. This does mean I do not always get the most challenging of players. Sadly, you can't go higher than Gold I playing this way. When doing quests that revolve killing, I do kill. Iri I players do make me sweat, but I still play the same way. A lot of times they do escape and that's okay. You don't HAVE to go for the 4K every time. Just have fun. If I pop Tier III or stop tracking hooks, it usually ends the same way though.
I'm not trying to brag though. The point is it's easily done. You can play with the new limitations just fine. It's okay to be considerate of your fellow teammates. It's okay to play at a handicap when encountering weaker players. It's better they have a good time and get the confidence to keep playing and improving at the game than just being mercilessly crushed nonstop until they ragequit the game.
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p12 and 13 is the max p level in that match and 2 survivors brought no items. if i had players like that im sure it could easily be done. the gold/iri ranks dont make a difference to the type of people you go against. your mmr does (which is hidden). im p100 myers main with about 600 hours on that killer and im getting p100 swf teams that go into the match with meta perks and coms that act like a pro swat team. these matches cant be won doing what your doing, i have tried and its not a pleasant experience lol. chill players wont raise the mmr that much so will get easier players, people that enjoy winning climb the mmr ranks and go against like minded sweaty players that have to bring their A game. unfortunately i cant see when i do get the occasional solo team or someone who is new with little experience only matched with me because they on a swf with a friend has high mmr untill its too late. maybe if there was a notice saying SWF sweat lords or SOLO players then i would know if i need to bring my A game or if i can play chill.
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@DeBecker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4001072#Comment_4001072
Basically everything killers have is second chance, but nobody cares.
such as? the only real 2nd chance the killer has is NOED.
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@GillyBeannn said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000063#Comment_4000063
For people that know hatch spawn locations, it's still a HUGE RNG that it even spawns exactly where the survivors are. That's just pure luck on their end, especially for the last survivor that's slugged, so no people don't know "exactly" where hatch will spawn if they gamble running to a part of the map, that again is pure luck as this game's environment is built upon. I do not agree with hatch being outdated, I'd argue that DBD's variety of methods for escaping is waaaay limited than other asymm games. Other games always had up to 4 methods of escaping through objectives, and DBD only has 2 and the 2nd option for escaping is pure RNG and requires your teammates to die or be left behind EGC
That sort of mindset of when things go downhill to just simply give up is such a poor mindset, when there have been many scenarios for comebacks or impossible escapes to happen. Same thing with killer.
And for the killer forcing the survivor off their shoulder to sell out their last teammate, well that can be considered teaming and is reportable.
true teaming is reportable and shouldnt happen but the problem is it is very difficult to prove the survivor rat them out if the killer is chasing them around the map. just as avoiding gens and hiding indefinitely is reportable and shouldnt happen. Both do happen which means something should be done. (afk crows was supposed to help prevent the hiding but people complained and it got reverted back)
i can only say from my experience of playing the game for years, that as survivor i can find the hatch way easier than the killer. i can use an offering to increase that chance while other survivors use offerings for BP or to seperate survivors at spawn so im not missing out on anything. dont forget hatch offering is now hidden so if i bring that offering my whole team can benefit and the killer has no idea. true killer can also use an offering but does the killer want to use their 1 and only offering on the hatch and miss out on BP or to counter the survivor spawn offering? as survivor i can also bring a key to open the hatch after the killer has found it first and closed it. the killer cant do anything if the survivor finds the hatch first. a guaranteed escape? no. there is still luck involved but its most certainly not 50/50 even chance when hatch spawns.
i agree people shouldnt simply give up when things go down hill, however people have been doing this for years and still doing it. All people slugged, all people have unbreakable so can continue? nah just abandon, killer now has to play a match with bots.
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@CrypticGirl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000954#Comment_4000954
at some point people have to accept the loss.
And yet you admit to tunneling because you aren't able to accept the loss. Maybe you should take your own advice.
the difference is killers dont get half as much 2nd chances as survivors do. the hatch for instance, its not the killer that wants to avoid kills and wait for hatch, thats survivors. as previously said, i can take the loss. when all gens are done i acknowledge game over, survivors won. when all are down/hooked survivors should acknowledge game over, killer won.
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100% agree that coms or something to that effect needs to be added to solo to bring it in line with swf. balancing the game would be far easier. imo SWF is whats breaking the game at the moment. the coms alone pretty much nagate any stealth build because if 1 survivor can see where the killer is in the distance, they all know where the killer is which makes stealth almost impossible. SWF can negate stealth builds so why cant solo?
i dont see any reason why solo coms cant be an option, if people dont want coms they can turn it off. but if they want it they should have that option. TCM had coms and a few matches i played there was usually atleast 1 guy basically commentating on whats going on which was handy for me and the team as we knew where the killers were, what was going on on what they intended to do. obviously coms cant be banned because how do you ban someone talking if they are playing together in the same room, but it does seem odd that people cant use external things to provide them with a tactical advantage but thats exactly what coms does for survivors….provides them with a tactical advantage. This tactical advantage means killers need buffs to compete which then means solo players have a harder time keeping up with the buffed killers.
Gameplay buffs for solo players might work but it would need to take into account that 1 solo player can be teamed with an SWF so having a 3 man SWF and a buffed solo player might cause issues. And the are many TTVs around, if they went into a match solo and got the solo players buffs people can still join their stream and benefit from the SWF coms which could cause an unintentional buff to SWF which we really dont need.
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@MissMischief99 said:
Behavior keeps enabling killers to be more and more toxic, and they’ve implemented things to force survivors to stay in the game. They do not care about the survivor experience whatsoever. Everything is lip service and they walked it back immediately. Making sure that killers have everything that they want and they don’t give a ######### about what happens with survivors. The only way that will if enough survivors do drastic things to make sure that they have to pay attention.
every abandon option available was for survivor benefit. they are adding more pallets for survivor benefit. the anti go next to stop people suiciding leaving 3 people to do all 5 gens was for survivor benefit. they even back tracked on the anti hiding afk crows because survivors complained. to say they dont care about survivor experience is just flat out wrong.
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must be troll post. if not then please show everyone how its done. IF indeed you are getting 8 hooks with myers while handicapping yourself then do you think its possible that you never raise your mmr above the learner ranks so always getting new players that dont know how to play? i mean you did say you dont get any kills.
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@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000954#Comment_4000954
I don't DC so they're gonna have to do the gens or die. Those are the options. I don't think I've ever seen anyone hide and rat for hatch the entire match.
I get cordinated teams but I can't remember the last time I saw a true bully squad. Or maybe I just don't notice because I run Lightborn and Iron Grasp and I watch out for hook denials. So yeah, you can bring perks to counter them. Survivors have four perks. Almost no team except upper MMR cordinates perks. I play in parties and not a single person has ever done that. And most people are probably solo. You're saying your solo but you're talking like everyone is skilled SWF.
Whether SWF would demolish killer remains to be seen. There are a lot of people just in this forum with 80%-90% KRs. I've ever seen survivor stats anywhere near that.
If you're going against sweaty, cordinated teams consistently then you're higher MMR and that doesn't mesh with you saying you struggle to be at 60%. Even with the killers I have 70%+ KRs on the sweaty SWFs are still the minority. So what is your KR?
they die eventually yes but the bully squad dont care at that point, they had their fun. i have seen it many times. i have also see hiding for the hatch very often as have others, thats why they were doing anti hiding afk crows. it was becoming common place in my killer and survivor matches they would hide for up to an hour in some cases. theres a reason the anti hidding was on the agenda.
i didnt say i struggle to be 60%, i said i struggle to get 60% if i dont tunnel. with tunneling i maintain 60 to 70% kill rate v sweaty swf on a regular basis. the matches are pretty even, fun and balanced. without tunneling, my kill rate will plummet. the only exception is when i play myers, my kill rate is between 80 to 90% and had somthing like 100+ win streaks but thats due to tombstone being op which is why they are reworking myers. no myers and no tunneling = big drop in kill rate, swf demolishing me and very unbalanced matches. there is no denying swf and solo are very different, killers need to be strong enough to handle swf teams. the result is soloq suffers because they dont have the advantage swf teams have. weaken killers so soloq can deal with it (by nerfing tunneling and slugging) sounds ideal but the result will be swf will be way too op.
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@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000906#Comment_4000906
Both tunneling and bullying are choices. Doing gens isn't optional. Even the bully squad will have to do gens if they want to leave. I've never seen a squad that just let's themselves be killed once they're done terrorizing the killer because they don't like gens. Strong loops and pallets are also built into the game. You're comparing a choice you are making to things that are an inherent part of the game's design. Tunneling and bullying are choices that can help you win but that make other players miserable, but one is much more common than the other.
You can make the same argument for bully squads. Don't like being bullied? Should have brought Franklin's, Awakened Awareness, Two Can Play/Lightborn, Mad Grit, Agitation. Or maybe you should just "git gud." You expect others to loop amazingly but can YOU counter being tunneled? Can you loop the killer for 3-5 gens and also escape the match? You've said you tunnel cause you can't manage otherwise, but you expect other people to be good enough to counter it. Bit of a double standard.
As for slugging, I said they don't mind losing in fair and balanced matches. I didn't say they don't mind losing to cheese tactics. I am one of those people saying survivors should have a comeback chance. There's no reason to leave people on the ground for multiple minutes. There's also situations where the killer hovers over you and keeps your teammates away until you die. That should not be happening.
im not sure what bully squads you have against but in my experience bully squads spend all match trying to make the killer quit, they dont do gens at all. and with the hatch, doing gens is optional as many have clearly shown they can hide all match not touching a gen and still escape. survivors CHOOSE to loop pallets. they can lose line of sight, hide, make use of the whole map but its not optimal to do so and will result in them losing. thats why people loop. killers can CHOOSE to spread hooks but its not optimal and often means the killer ends up losing thats why they tunnel. elimination is built into the game just like pallets are. survivors use pallets as efficiently as they can, killers eliminate is efficiently as they can. there reall is no difference.
The argument to bring perks to counter bully squads doesnt apply to killer because killer only has 4 perk slot. its impossible to cover everything with only 4 perks. survivor on the other hand, they are a team. they have 16 perks between them with many perks that benefit everyone not just themselves.
survivors have plenty of 2nd chances throughout the match i really dont think giving them yet another chance to come back after they have all been downed is the way to go. at some point people have to accept the loss. if survivors misplay and end up getting themselves slugged in a group together no way should they have yet another 2nd chance. its like saying if all survivors perform so badly in chase they all get themselves hooked then expect a way to come back, being left on the ground and being left on hook is the same. Both disable to survivor from playing the match, both not fun experience, slugging is longer but it also means its more time for other survivors to do gens.
my apparent double standard is due to the drastic differences between my killer and survivor matches. as killer im going against sweaty swf team and a regular basis so i have to use everything in my arsenal to win as do they. as survivor im solo so it is harder to counter tunneling especially when people dont do gens or just mess about in the corner of the map but i can counter it with a good team and even with bad team mates sometimes. not always counterable due to the team or my own skill but i counter it enough to maintain a 45% escape rate, tunneling requires team effort to counter effectively.
i know many people have said shouldnt need a team to counter tunneling because some people go in solo but if that was the case then swf would demolish killer. thats the main issue i have seen, swf v solo. they are like 2 different game modes. v solo tunneling isnt needed so much because you can always rely on poor team play and people that just do totems or going for adept. this helps by the killer time to play fair. SWF is totally different. they have good team play, coms, synergy with perks….thats when tunneling is needed, its not a choice its a must. how do i know i dont know if its a swf squad or solo team from the start so i assume its SWF and i play to that. sorry solo people but i didnt know your not swf untill it was too late.
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@coolgue1 said:
At this point every match feels the exact same:
- Someone gets hooked
- Teammate trades
- Killer goes right back to hook and tunnels
There’s no counterplay, no variety, no skill expression. It’s just hook → trade → tunnel until someone is out of the match in the first 5 minutes. Survivors don’t even get to play the game, and killers aren’t being pushed to actually improve because tunneling is the easiest way to win.
The worst part? Every killer can do this. It doesn’t matter if you’re playing Nurse, Wraith, Clown, whatever—they can all tunnel, and they don’t even need a perk to do it. Yet survivors are constantly told “just bring X perk” as if it’s our fault. Why should survivors be perk taxed just because killers want the easy way out? If it’s a strategy every killer can abuse without building for it, it’s a design problem, not a survivor problem.
And BHVR, stop listening to the people that live on the forums instead of actually improving their gameplay. The players defending tunneling aren’t interested in balance, they just want their free wins. Meanwhile, the larger community is getting tired of the same unfun loop.
BHVR needs to implement something at this point. Look at the player count—dropping every single day by the thousands. That’s not just “burnout,” that’s people getting sick of an unplayable loop
Dead by Daylight is supposed to be about tense chases, teamwork, and clutch moments. Right now it’s just a tunnel simulator, and if nothing changes soon, the playerbase will keep bleeding out.
the counterplay is dont unhook too soon, do the gens furthest away from the hooked survivor. killer will have to either camp the hook giving people free gens or they will have to go fair distance to chase someone else which then someone can unhook and run. dont hook heal and dont unhook too soon.
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@THE_Crazy_Hyena said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000906#Comment_4000906
Anything that enables toxic behavior should be removed in my opinion. Doesn't matter the side, but the amount of toxicity I have been facing lately has been almost unbearable.
Mostly by the killers, in the form of bleeding out while being constantly humped.
And you know you can easily play around bully squads, right?The "abandon" option is only a band-aid fix on a broken bone. It doesn't make the experience any better.
And no, it shouldn't be a requirement to always run perks like DS, Unbreakable and other anti-tunnel perks every single game because you always assume the killer to be tunneling. That's just anti-funtunneling isnt toxic behaviour, its the killer doing their job. if bully squads were doing their job (gens) i wouldnt have an issue with that either because its part of the game. killers shouldnt be required to run slow down perks but look at how many do…. part of the game
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@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000898#Comment_4000898
You are indeed forcing people to play a frustrating match if you're hard tunneling. The killer is making the choice for others. Just like bully squads choose to make frustrating games for killers. And it's not about losing. Most people probably don't mind losing an even and balanced match where no one played dirty. Close matches are more thrilling than stomps. They mind being forced into a loss by some showing no skill and who was unwilling to engage with regular gameplay.
But if you can't hover near the average KR without constant tunneling (and I'm not sure I believe that) then that's on you, and that's why something needs to change in this game.
Huge difference between squads that intentionally go into a match to bully with no intention of actually doing the gens or playing the game v a killer going into a match doing what they are supposed to be doing (killing). This is part of the game, part of the gameplay. its like survivor saying they dont like sitting on gens because its boring… dont play that role then? if i was frustrated with pallets then we should remove pallets? no, just dont play killer.
People do mind losing very much lol, survivors hated being slugged for 4min by toxic killers, understandably. They wanted a way out of that match and claimed for ages "i dont care i lost, i just want to go to the next match." They got exactly that….abandon option. Now people have that option, many have openly admitted they want a way to recover when slugged so they have a way to make a comeback. But people said they didnt mind losing when slugged as long as they can get out of the match penalty free.
As far as im concerned if people cant counter being tunneled thats on them. As others have pointed out, its a tactic and sometimes it doesnt work. if it worked EVERY single time then yes nerf it but it doesnt work EVERY time. Its exactly the same as loops, some are very strong and cant be mind gamed, have to force the pallet drop. do these strong loops work for the survivor EVERY time? no. Should we nerf them because they can be strong and unfun for the killer to deal with?
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@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000605#Comment_4000605
I am the very definition of average.
And that's cool that you're not frustrated, but you don't care if your opponents feel that way instead?
To be blunt… no i dont care. i dont mean to sound harsh but when 2 sides are competing and 1 side is losing, its not always going to be fun for the losing side. no one is forcing people to play a frustrating game, they do it out of choice. survivor or killer, makes no difference. As selfish as it might sound, when i play any game, im playing for me not to entertain others.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000656#Comment_4000656
Or they could just look to actually balance the game instead of being biased towards killers. /s I know that will never happen.
well bhvr track record dont fill me with much confidence with balancing anything. im still waiting on these afk crows and anti hiding they said would do for phase 1 of operation health lol. if they cant get that right then i dread what they will do with tunneling.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000641#Comment_4000641
Even if survivors are supposed to lose more by design that would still mean killers should lose time to time as well. But to agree with you, if tunneling being nerfed does drastically reduce kill rates for an extended period of time and it's more than just killers who never learned basic gameplay struggling then I think there would be reasonable grounds to remove the anti-tunnel system.
but killers do lose from time to time, with the exception of a few outliers that have unusual win streaks most killers lose from time to time. bhvr needs to be very careful because they have that 40/60 they were after. they need to tread very carefully to maintain it after making a such a huge change to the game which is why i honestly dont see tunneling changing. it either remains as is or they remove it and spend the next few years trying rebalance the game after killing the killer role. look how long it took them to balance the game to what its at now. i could be wrong but time will tell
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@bleep275 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000629#Comment_4000629
If they cant say "i play trapper and don't need to tunnel" per your counter-argument to it. then you cannot use your survivor escape rate. if their personal accounts are invalid to you, then you must except that your personal accounts are invalid as well. You also need to take into account that the kill rate is not only skewed by tunneling, but also nice and friendly killers who go in to goof off and allow people to escape regularly. Also to my knowledge there is no recent official kill rate percentage. The one people usually go for (nightlight) only tracks those players who are registered to it, and frankly, I have yet to meet anyone who is registered on there. Stats and win rate aside. The reason tunneling is a problem and is under attack is its inherently unhealthy gameplay and mass toxicity that it creates. It is by no means healthy for the game community. Keeping it for the sake of "but i cant perform otherwise" is not a good argument. You can adjust balance to make the game effective for non-tunnelers, as it already is for froggy and myself. You CAN nerf or remove certain behavior and make other in game adjustments to compensate. The pro-tunnel argument is essentially just being afraid that you cannot win without tunneling.
im all for being able to pick up wins without tunneling, im just saying as the game currently is, tunneling is needed for myself and others. if they buff the weaker killers so i dont need to tunnel then great. but thats why the changes they proposed was nowhere near the ball park of whats needed. not even close. it would have killed the killer role in its tracks. i honestly dont see an issue with tunneling being unhealthy. its part of what makes it an elimination game which is what i like about the game as killer and survivor. they are making the games faster paced with these speed killers and regress perk nerfs and aura reading everywhere to get people into the action, into chases. killers need to be able to keep up, if bhvr can work that out great. but i dont see it happening without changing the core of the game
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000629#Comment_4000629
I understand that not everyone can be expected to be able to do the same but that's how an MMR system works. If you are at your limits or are just bad at a certain killer then sorry but thems the breaks. But anyway, if tunneling is not an automatic win strategy how do you explain any of the 10,000+ killer winstreaks that exist? If you or anyone else can get a 10,000+ survivor escape streak then I'd agree with you here but the simple fact is tunneling is just a broken strategy. Kill rates from the devs have gone on record for being artificially lowered where anyone who DCd or went next are removed from the rate which coincides with toxic gameplay from the killer like tunneling. The actual kill rate is likely somewhere in the 70%+ range when you look at accurate data but we can only speculate unfortunately as the devs don't share everything.
like i said certain killers are op when combined with tunneling so many of the winstreaks are with high tier killers. and the reason you dont get such streaks as survivor is because the escape rate is 40% by design. they are supposed to lose more than they win. besides the fact that these people with win streaks are outliers, they dont represent the average player. i know kill rates are not completely accurate because some survivors just go next if they get a map they dont like or they go next because their swf friend was killed first and they want to join another match together or friendly killers let people escape or let them get the hatch. but according the the devs and the way they monitor the stats, they want 40/60 which is whats currently at. i would love to see the numbers after a few weeks of tunneling being nerfed to the ground, both kill rates and player count. i would switch to survivor main in a heartbeat and never touch killer or just quit the game.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000625#Comment_4000625
So, few things. I play trapper and Myers. I don't need to tunnel to win and they are generally seen as the weakest. You never need to tunnel to win if you understand basic game mechanics and are good at the killer. Are you going to lose sometimes? Yes because that's how an actually balanced game works. Tunneling being an automatic win strategy is bad and that's why it should be nerfed. Tunneling and op killers are the issue and while certain killers could use a buff that does not detract from the basic fact that there's no actual counterplay to tunneling besides knowing ahead of time to bring the right perks.
you cant say "i play trapper and i dont need to tunnel" and expect everyone else to be able to do the same. i have 45% escape rate and have no issues with tunneling killers. they can and have been countered and i dont use any anti tunneling perks, i go in with a gen build. so because i do ok against tunneling killers others should do ok too based on your "i can do it so can you" mindset. you make it sound like tunneling is actually an automatic win but if this was the case killers would have far above 60% kill rate. its not an automatic win at all and the numbers show it. if killers rates were above 60% i can understand that tunneling is op and unnecessary but the fact kill rates are 60% WITH tunneling suggests its not as op as many claim it is.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000614#Comment_4000614
Okay and tunneling is OP especially on killers like blight, ghoul, spirit, and nurse. There's nothing survivors can do to counter it besides get lucky and hope you brought several perks that slightly help you against it. Unless your advice is for survivors to have psychic abilities and know that the killer will tunnel and that you specifically will be tunneled I don't see what options there are for counterplay which is why tunneling is OP.
i agree tunneling is op on those killers but thats the killers that are op not the tunneling. so nerf the killers or buff the rest of the roster to keep them in line with the top killers. but nerfing tunneling across the board which effects every single killer including the ones that are already struggling isnt the way to go. tunneling as it is allows people to play weaker killers and stand a chance. nerf it without major buffs to certain killers will force everyone to play the same top tier killers. as survivor i know i will get fed up very quickly of constant nurse and blights. there are counters to being tunneled, people have countered it many times when i tunnel them and i have countered it many times when its done to me. if there was no counterplay kill rates would be well above 60%
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@bleep275 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000592#Comment_4000592
If you lost as much as youre saying for several hundred hours then you're either using hyperbole or just genuinely lacked skill. Im willing to bet you did not lose as much as you want us to believe, you just remember the losses because theyre more emotional charged than wins. And if anything if youre losing that much then you DEFINITELY dont want to tunnel for tow reasons. the first being mmr. the second is that by losing the devs are seeing that this specific killer is underperforming and is need in buffs. However by tunneling for that ezpz win. Their stats are showing the killer is doing well enough and does not need a buff. tunnelers are literally shooting themselves and other killers in the foot. If all the tunnelers who tunnel becuase they "have to, to win", just played regularly they would either see their overall skill improve or buffs to killers. Tunneling serves only the purpose of gratifying one specific person in one specific moment.
basically tunneling does the following:
Artificially inflates your mmr so you perform worse and get increasingly frustrated
Prevents the devs from getting a clear picture of killer data so they may implement appropriate buffs.
100% disagree with what you said there lol. if losing with a killer meant devs would buff them to keep them in line with other killers then we wouldnt crapper that has never really been touched in 9 years or an overly nerfed skull merch which is now underperforming compared to a lot of other killers. i have had many good years playing this game thanks to tunneling helping me raise my kill rate and i have have way more fun matches as a result. still do have fun matches so i honestly dont regret my decision at all. im far less frustrated now than when i first started. if that ever changed i would find something else to play, its really not a big deal. But from my experience the 2 points you raised of what tunneling does just isnt true. my matches are not worse as a result they are better. And the devs still have not buffed underperforming killers in years.
IF and its a big IF, my actions of tunneling does end up biting me in the derriere and i get frustrated and struggle and lose then i still wont regret it because i have already had many years of fun from this game, i will move on.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000484#Comment_4000484
I never really got the whole 'it's optimal' argument for why it's okay. If survivors had OG brand new part and popped four gens in ten seconds would you say it's totally fine because 'it's optimal'?
optimal is fine if its not too op. brand new part was too op and when it was at its strongest the kill rate was still below 60% so it made sense to nerf it. looping, tunneling sort of optimal play is fine because they are not too op. it remains 40/60. if optimal play shifted that too far then no it wouldnt be ok. is playing optimally fun? maybe not for the losing side but thats part of having a game with a win/loss criteria.
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@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000528#Comment_4000528
I play as mid and lower tier killers and have a 60% KR and I've never needed to tunnel to win.
then your very skilled :) i on the other hand and many other killers out there are not as skilled as you. i cant achieve what you can. i get 45% escape rate with poor team mates and tunneling killers. im sure others can too right?
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@bleep275 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000569#Comment_4000569
the logic makes perfect sense, the only reason you cant comprehend it is because you cant fathom losing that much. It does not take a lot of losses to lower mmr to where you belong. Now for someone who habitually tunnels because thats the only way for them to win…it will take more. because they artificially inflated their mmr well past where they belong. Given the choices…yes you keep trying and keep losing so your mmr settles at a comfortable level. it is only tedious because you used cheap desperate tactics to win and inflate that mmr. You will get to a point where you dont need to tunnel to win. I dont EVER tunnel. hell half the time i dont even have gen regression….i do perfectly fine. The desperation for that validation of a win is so powerful those who tunnel are willing to make their game experience miserable and the experience of others miserable simply because they want to win that badly. Learn to accept loss, fundamental skill in life tbh. Survivors by design…lose most of their matches, if they can handle constant loss…so can everyone else.
The devs did not revert the update because they are in favor of tunneling…they reverted it because it was too punishing for regular killers who don't tunnel or may accidently tunnel. The goal was to punish tunneling and reward healthy gameplay, but they punished those trying to play healthy as well, hence the delay.
drop the comp mindset. let your mmr settle naturally. i PROMISE you will find this game to be less frustrating and anxiety inducing. Hell i just got 3 4k matches in a row with scratched mirror myers. no gen regression. it is a thing you can do. my main ghostface build is all aura reading…no gen regression. I do very well with it. Tunneling is not necessary, even less so if you let your mmr be at where your actual skill level is and not where your ego wants it to be.
i think your ignoring the fact that i mentioned i hit a wall and lost match after match long before i started tunneling. few hundred hours of losing constantly with no tunneling. i ask again, how long should i have played the game, losing every match after i legitimately raised my mmr by playing "fair"? you might have a point if i raised mmr by tunneling at the start when i first played but i didnt. survivors lose 60% of the time by design, thats what they sign up for by playing that role. killers shouldnt lose 80% of the time like i was before tunneling. thats not the design i sign up for as killer and not the design the devs had in mind either. im not after all wins like you seem to be suggesting. im after 60% kill rate, thats not an absurd thing to expect from killer role. i can take a few losses its no big deal i take losses with tunneling but like i said before, not tunneling = far less than 60% kill rate for me. if it ever got to that point again i would walk as many other killers would too.
i play survivor as well as killer and i honestly have no issues regarding tunneling. i am currently at 45% escape rate (which is higher than the 40% goal). my only issue with survivor is my team mates are often usless. besides the obvious issues that sitting on a gen can be pretty boring but generally i have no problems regarding tunneling killers in my matches like everyone claims they are. if i can get 45% escape rate with god awful teams and tunneling killers then why cant others? you say you can achieve a good kill rate without tunneling so others can do it too. equally i can get 45% escape rate, why cant others? skill issues? poor game design? need 1000 hours to practice tunneling counters?