miaasma
miaasma
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Comments
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bloodlust needs to get completely removed once they fix pseudo-infinites and map setups
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there are emblem penalties for this to prevent killers who do this from ranking up IIRC
this doesn't apply to killers chasing survivors who are looping around hooked survivors
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please remove bloodlust once you fix maps
the problem isn't that these pallets are unsafe and can be mindgamed, the problem is that they can be reliably bloodlusted
once the problem loops get addressed (which hopefully will happen asap) this game will HUGELY benefit from bloodlust's removal because it is such a glaring problem
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@thesuicidefox said:
I didn't watch the part about maps, but most of his ideas for killer changes are good.
However I disagree with him on some points, specifically Spirit and Pig. While it sucks for Pig that people can get traps off on the first try, that's just part of her kit. If it was ALWAYS the case where you never get it off the first box well that can screw you over sometimes, particularly if she uses Amanda's Letter and there are only 2 boxes. I think they should just increase the base time to search and adjust the way traps work during end game to make her more like she was prior to EGC update. As for Spirit, well collision can both help and hurt her. It helps because it's obviously a bit easier to find survivors, but it also can hurt in cases where you want a particular survivor and others body block your phasing. Here is a good example...
https://xboxclips.com/thesuicidefox/f2f7d804-693a-4928-b239-70af791d4cfa
In the clip we are a 4 man. We decide to just yolo at the hook, and then after the save we attempt to body block her so she can't get Dwight. She still slips past us, but I'm willing to bet we made enough obstacles for her to slow her down just enough that she couldn't get him before he got to the gate. If there was no collision she could just phase through us and there's no chance for the Dwight. It's also something you can use to your advantage as survivor, since you can hover around a pallet and when you feel collision you drop the pallet and stun her out of phase walk. I honestly don't think Spirit needs any changes.
For Nurse, but I do agree that she should have 2 blinks and only 2 blinks. IMO those add-ons should be changed to increase her base speed instead, which would be strong but not completely OP if the limit is something like 108% speed. Range add-ons should have an actual penalty, like longer fatigue time or longer charge time (such that the extra distance you want to travel is that extra time to charge).
collision doesn't hurt her at all and literally gives her hits and downs mid-chase, often rewarding her for misreading the survivor and punishing the survivor for making the right call. i realize you're a spirit main but her having mid-phase collision is objectively a pretty stupid mechanic. he outlines this in the video
along with the other changes he mentions in the videos (buffs to most killers and map changes) spirit definitely needs tweaking
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@Sluzzy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/575906#Comment_575906
When you go behind a wall, she has to guess where you are going...that's your counterplay opportunity.
is this why you use 3 blinks every game? the truth has been revealed
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@Captain_Doomsday said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/574946#Comment_574946
The flashlight forces the Killer to look away, so you wouldn't. It's still valid for juking while running, and that's how it should be used.
The main issue is that unavoidable flashlight stuns:
A) Reward toxicity with free BP, and
B) Punish less skilled Killers for something more or less out of their hands
Even though higher-level players lose ground when cashing in their free blinds, the mere fact that it's common behaviour among toxic players illustrates an issue with them.
flashlighting during a chase doesn't do anything. a killer can look away/up/down without losing you or losing distance on you at all. spending time shining a flashlight at a killer who is actively chasing you means you aren't gaining distance so it's a bad idea from that standpoint too
this argument honestly doesn't make any sense to me; using a medkit to heal yourself while injured is also "free", as is using a toolbox on a generator. at least in the case of flashlights there's some timing involved and flashlight saves take understanding pickup animations in order to pull off
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sometimes when a survivor dies on a hook a dark specter of them will appear near you and T-pose for a few seconds before disappearing
this patch is cursed
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good video, but there's already a thread on this page about it which can be found here: https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/75131/scottjunds-ideas-on-how-to-improve-the-game-video#latest
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@SodiumIntensifies said:
I think insta heals are enough. Survivors have more then enough "second chance" mechanics.
yeah, uh, not what the thread is about
i do think odd bulb and BNP either need some love or a downgrade in rarity because neither are good. odd bulb is full on detrimental since it drains your flashlight battery faster and BNPs don't have an impact that is comparable to strong ultra rare addons; even if you hit the skillchecks, that's it, it's gone, and if the killer has PGTW they can literally undo its effect on the game by kicking the gen once
i don't really want them to be on par with instaheals, though, since i think instaheals (syringes in particular) are really gross and bad for the game
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@Sluzzy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/574743#Comment_574743
i also want to point out how nebulous the "nerf nurse" point always is
there's never any specifics, just "nerf nurse" so she doesn't have to change the survivor's playstyle, just "nerf nurse" followed by a list of reasons of how she breaks the game because they absolutely have to run in the open with no care for the killer or they have no fun
it is so, so stifling to a balance discussion to have people constantly contributing the idea that the killer is not supposed to be strong, redirecting the dialogue from "how do we maintain a viable killer" to "how to make nurse into a loopable killer like all the rest"
it must be comforting, as somebody who only plays 3+ blink nurse every single game, to type this and feel like it's reasonable or accurate whatsoever
"killer isn't supposed to be strong" false equivalencies aside it is funny to me that this is the best someone who literally mains the strongest killer in her most broken possible setup can do. even tons of nurse mains agree that the stuff you run is nonsense, so where do you think you fit into this discussion?
anyway, if anyone wanted a prime example of somebody who is literally incapable of being self aware and considering how the only killer they play, with the addons they run, has no counterplay regardless of what they're presented with, here you are. "i win with this because i'm good it's definitely not too strong or anything. of course it has counterplay! just uhhh, counter it." i call it nurse main cognitive dissonance
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who on god's green earth is calling clown an A-tier killer
your points about him being a bad killer aren't solid though. they effectively boil down to "camping pallets counters clown". this means he goes through pallets super quickly
as far as killers who have to deal with loops go (so not spirit and nurse), clown's definitely not bad
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i love resilience and hope, and i wish i ran them more often
on killer i love monitor; right now i'm running it on myers, pig, leatherface and billy. especially on the latter two, people thinking you're farther away than you actually are facilitates getting easy downs
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definitely think this could be a good idea. i'm all for our trapper guy getting some QoL changes to help him out
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how did i disregard what you said? all you said was "watch the video, stealth works", i did, and then i explained why it's a poor example of the point you were trying to make. like, in detail. i seriously do not understand how this disregards what you have to say. if i am misrepresenting you, then say so, but i don't think i have been
and no, as far as i read, you didn't answer the question. i asked you why tru3's video constitutes evidence but tofu's does not. both of them made youtube videos from a specific lens regarding the nurse, and both videos have had very different receptions from people on this forum, so why is his video being definitively praised by some people but tofu's is cherry picked and bias-ridden?
edit: apologies, i missed the post in which you did answer the question. the problem with your answer is that using both videos as "evidence" of the points they're trying to make doesn't work because both points are incompatible. tru3 is trying to show that the nurse has counterplay, whereas tofu is trying to show that she doesn't. if both videos are evidence and both are true then she both does and doesn't have counterplay, which is a paradox
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i dislike the non-directional lullaby and would far prefer they just give her 115% speed, especially with their seeming insistence to constantly add maps (and change old maps) so that she gets shadow nerfed like every patch
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@NuclearBurrito said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/573754#Comment_573754
So that we have something to work with to compare to the current Nurse.
You say she has all of these problems. How do you fix them? If you or someone else can't think of anything then this discussion won't go anywhere. Note how 0 progress has been made in the entire rest of this thread.
Comparing the pro's and cons of implementing a specific change or set of changes is far more productive than something more vague.
For example:
Blink's no longer travel through stuff besides survivors
Nurse is now 110% and has 3 Blinks.
the discussion won't go anywhere due to the sheer number of people who are unable to process how conceptually absurd the nurse's presence is in a game like this
if we don't have that level of understanding across the board, a course of action for how to fix her will never be reached. if nothing else, this thread (and any other thread about nurse) is a commentary on how far people are willing to go to defend a clear problem with the game, regardless of what they are presented with
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@Condorloco_26 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/574746#Comment_574746
People like you have always been asking for evidence that stealth works against her. What other evidence you want, if not a video proving exactly that?
If not for the instantly disconnecting chump playing Kate in that game, I'd say it would have been a 1k at the most. 3 guys did 5 gens with an experienced nurse breathing on their necks all the time.
Maybe more people should try that playstyle against her, I don't know.
Or maybe I'm wrong and running in circles is the most exciting thing in the world.
just avoid the question and cherry pick what constitutes "evidence" and what doesn't, classic
i watched the video and saw an "experienced" nurse player using busted addons, losing people mid chase because his tracking was off, whiffing blinks (even messing up blinks while not in chase), spending extended periods of time looking for people in dead zones rather than patrolling gens, and getting punished for all of these mistakes
the title for this video should be "how to not play against immersed survivors 101" rather than "how to counter nurse 101". like i said in a previous post, this video is the outcome of him playing poorly, not the survivors playing especially well. and this isn't a dig against tru3, i actually do think he's a good killer player, but this points out a huge issue with how a lot of people on this forum digest information; watching this video uncritically and proclaiming it as evidence that stealth "works" but denouncing tofu's video as fallacious and cherry picked. the generators didn't even go quickly in this video (how could they? he was against 3 people), he just spent a lot of time floating around doing nothing. once again, nothing against tru3, but the fact that he propped this game up as an example of how to counterplay nurse instead of an example of him just playing badly kind of reinforces the notion that you guys should probably consume his content a little more critically
survivors cannot both stay constantly hidden and do generators. especially as a killer who can go from no terror radius to directly next to you in a second, there's really no excuse for doing this poorly, especially when you're running 3 tracking perks. patrol gens enough and you'll find people (who will proceed to go down in a matter of a few seconds), don't spend time looking for people who are actively hiding from you, and "stealth" turns into "pointless inaction" really quickly
not sure there's much to be gained from explaining this to somebody who thinks looping is devoid of skill but hiding in a corner is an act of gaming excellence but here we are
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the solution to people playing with their friends: not allowing people to play with their friends
galaxy brain
can't believe nobody's ever thought of this
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@Condorloco_26 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/574732#Comment_574732
Well, you've made up your mind already, even in the face of evidence.
No point discussing any further.
evidence? did you take the ohtofu video in the other thread as "evidence" too?
i didn't realize a youtube video was this infallible discussion point. i guess all the devs need to do is watch a few of those and we're set
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i also want to point out how nebulous the "stealth" point always is
there's never any specifics, no situational decision making or anything tangible, just "use stealth" followed by a list of perks you absolutely have to run in case you run into a nurse or else you deserve to lose or something
it is so, so stifling to a balance discussion to have people constantly contributing these hollow points and redirecting the dialogue from "how to counterplay a nurse" to "how to not deal with a nurse"
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@Condorloco_26 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/574715#Comment_574715
They literally just posted a video where stealth works well against an experienced nurse. Did you watch it?
stealth and completing objectives are antithetical
stealthing mid chase is impossible even with perks if the killer doesn't mess up
stealth is not feasible against good killers ever and if it works it's on the killer, not the survivors, especially with how many tracking perks exist
the idea that a nurse who spots you should be able to down you essentially for free because your "stealth" failed is so hysterically flawed it's crazy to me how many people have managed to buy into it
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it's just the usual "everyone tries to pallet loop a nurse and it doesn't work" rhetoric that is completely divorced from reality (nobody who has been playing this game for more than a week tries looping a nurse)
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to be fair rarity isn't really an indication of how good a perk is
balanced landing is a green perk at rank 3 and premonition is purple, for example
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@Condorloco_26 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/574705#Comment_574705
Feel free to throw a tantrum, won't change a thing.
i didn't realize pointing out that stealth doesn't work constituted throwing a tantrum
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pallet blinding isn't even good anymore now that sounds work
someone blinding you at a pallet is screwing themselves by not gaining distance on you, and if you play with your ears at all you can pretty reliably follow them while blind (look up or down so they don't chain blind you, though), so i tend to down pallet blinding survivors way quicker than the ones who just run to the next tile these days
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"use stealth" ugh how do people still say this in 2019
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@ReikoMori said:
I dunno. I feel he's proposed things that are far too simple and just props up issues rather than outright fixing them. I get the rationale of of going that simple to put things out there that have what one assumes is the highest success rate of being implemented. Yet, going that small scale doesn't fill like problems are getting solved as much as it feels like we'll just get more of the same with band-aid fixes that after another year will still see the game not evolving.
i don't see how any of the changes he proposes in the video are band-aid fixes. changes to specific maps to make them less abusable isn't a band-aid fix, it addresses specific problems in specific scenarios and yet is not a complicated solution. agree or disagree with them, but they address issues as they come up in this game far more than ######### like bloodlust ever did
anyway, the only glaring flaw i see in the video is the plague's proposed change. while i agree that there needs to be more incentive to cleanse i also think her corrupt power is way too strong for her to just be getting it because survivors literally cannot function while sick (puking and retching are common while sick, so doing generators will be absolutely horrible if those things interrupt actions). on top of that, a big issue with cleansing against plague is that you'll often get sick again through some means or another; you need to unhook a sick survivor, a sick survivor gets on a generator with you, the plague finds you shortly after cleansing, etc. i think a combination of a buff to vile purge/nerf to corrupt purge is the way to go to make plague a more engaging killer to play, but i don't have any specific ideas for how that could be done
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i've both revealed him and been exposed by him through walls and objects
revealing him out in the open is extremely inconsistent
i feel like bhvr overestimated themselves when they released this killer because he absolutely is not working as intended
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no, killers have always been able to hit you through fences. you have to hug the fence tight in order for it to be possible though, so just avoid that when the killer is on the other side and you're fine
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@AnthonyC2014 said:
This is the reason why MLGA (Make Lobbies Great Again) was bannable. There was a feature that could let you block certain people so you don't have to face them. The devs don't want to encourage that behavior.
MLGA isn't bannable and the devs don't care about it, don't spread misinformation
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moris would be fine if they were less strong
i've always felt that the healthiest position in the game for moris to be in is to see the animation and maybe get a personal bonus, rather than providing a huge in-game advantage. maybe make them usable only on death hook but have them give you a whole bunch of blood points so they're less of a drag to play against while not defeating their purpose entirely
rarity isn't fairity but i'd reduce ebony moris to very rare if something like this were implemented
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@Raidoku said:
I assume I upset killer mains I am rank 4 survivor as of today lost rank 3 for playing with randoms but ok I forgot that complaining about anything killers have in the game is considered toxic ill just deal with it even tho all low tiers use the skill with other OP perks
i am not convinced that you are serious
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claudette's base hair needs physics and now kate's does too
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sometimes i'll crouch and look up at them, or turn to face them and nod a little. other times i'll wave them over to hit me out for points (a killer doesn't need to do anything gracious for this; as long as they weren't a super dick all game i like giving them the points)
if i have an item i don't really care about (like a toolbox, or a weaker medkit) i'll give it to them
if the killer had a really bad game and didn't do anything especially mean spirited i'll point at a hook and give him the hook/kill. looking at you, michaels who spawn on fractured cowshed
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@Kabu said:
I wonder how many of the people here arguing in favor of Nurse argued against the Legion. The complaints are quite similar such as "game breaking" and "unhealthy for the game." Also, someone here posted that a dev stated that base Nurse won't be touched when it's also been said by a dev that she be reworked to the point she won't be recognized.
Overall, if Legion was unhealthy then so is the Nurse for the same reasons.
correct, both are bad for the game
legion was a more egregious example though since you didn't even need to be good to break the game
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@ScottJund said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/573613#Comment_573613
why do we post here
we hate ourselves
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i thought nurse was balanced
in fact, go into any thread about the nurse and read someone's post in which they attempt to convince others (and themselves) that nurse is fine because "use stealth". that was me about 2 weeks into playing this game
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@Orion said:
Base Nurse is balanced. If you lose to base Nurse you're just worse than the person playing her, period.
wrong
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very thought provoking
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forcing early pallet drops is a huge component of being good in chases
clown's issue is map pressure, not chases
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@Sluzzy said:
"I play survivor for 5000 hrs, does that mean it is ok for me to have the potential to demolish killers?"
You can. It's very possible with that much experience to pallet loop most of the killers for 5 gens.
"The bottom line is, a killer that ignores all the survivors' defenses/mechanics should not exist in this game regardless of the skill required to master that particular killer."
This is because most survivors believe pallets are their only defense. The counter to nurse is not pallets but stealth, breaking LOS, and Iron Will. Distortion is actually also quite strong but I almost never see it.
if any killer is getting looped for 5 generators it's because the killer is playing poorly, full stop
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clown is good at chases
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no
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wow mind=blown redpilled checkmate atheists
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poor bubba needs a lot of love. his power is so bad it can hardly even be used to punish mistakes mid chase unless you run beast marks (and i swear those are so rare in my bloodwebs these days). he also gets screwed over super hard by wonky object hitboxes - the fence openings on preschool immediately come to mind, it feels like those edge hitboxes are the size of the entire map
as for legion, i'm fine with where DW is but his frenzy could use some tweaking to facilitate the stab multiple people playstyle he was meant for; unless people are really clumped up it's hard to make it to another target before your power ends
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@Visionmaker said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/571866#Comment_571866
Bring back old BNP and instablinds!
i swear navigating my survivor blood webs now is just a game of "how to avoid the BNP/odd bulb"
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did not realize how old this thread was
yes, it's terrible
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a lot of people on this forum have hysterical definitions of "toxicity" so your post doesn't really mean anything if you don't go into specifics
were they a big meanie head to a killer in-game?
did they knowingly abuse an exploit on stream?
did they use a slur in post-game chat?
whether or not action should be taken is going to depend on the severity of whatever it is you think they did, and no amount of dummies on here telling you to go ahead and report someone for something as vague having "bad habits" is going to change that
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what immersion? a survivor has to have a meat hook shoved through their chest on 3 separate occasions in order to die
body blocking hooks isn't toxic, it's just basic altruism. do you play survivor? i'm guessing you don't if you think this