kit_mason
kit_mason
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ill agree hes so, so bad on the new map - otzdarva actually just made a really good video about that so im really hoping bhvr takes another look at the map sometime
but i actually like him more like this. hes more skill expressive as hitting knives is more rewarding but missing them is more punishing, theres a solid bit of incentive for going for long distance knives to catch a survivor by surprise (and even an addon to reward them directly) - speaking of addons his addons are far more interesting, and hes more interesting to vs too as 4.4 means youre more directly rewarded for high-quality, tight around corners looping.
i think theres spots he could do with some tuning here and there, dont get me wrong, but i hugely prefer trickster like this and am more than happy to add him to my rotation of killers now
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she released as a 4.4m/s killer? and she hasnt been changed in nearly 3 years and that change was lightburn removal???
genuinely what are you talking about???
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(data from steamdb)
its literally not. you can see a general upwards trend even amongst the mountains and valleys of content releases. and this is just steam numbers - we have no idea how much the game has grown on console as improvements continue to be made, like the addition of M&K or more console platforms as time has gone on.
ppl need to stop saying "the game is dying" and start using the phrase "i don't like", instead.
(ps: before someone says "what about that dip from february to march 2026" march is a slow month pretty much every year (except for March 2024 bc of Blood Moon) - you can check!)
additionally, adding together my winrates on my two mains, i have a 44% escape rate on survivor across nearly 3000 survivor matches - and on my newer main, Taurie, its 54% across ~550 matches. my kill rates are close to 60% on basically every killer i have any amount of time put in on, including a 61% kill rate on skull merchant - a killer i almost exclusively played post-execution, across 56 matches.
so maybe - just maybe - the game isnt benefitting one side or the other. its just that the better player tends to win more. there are exceptions, of course - cheaters, absolutely stacked builds against players running next to nothing - but in general? i think "Getting a 4k is as easy as spelling your own name." is a gross misrepresentation of how strong or weak either role is right now.
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Nah, I think this is pretty par-for-course as updates go. The Trickster rework made him more fun to play and he feels basically the same power wise as the parts of his kit were shuffled around fairly well.
The new visceral skin isnt my cup of tea but a lot of people seem to like it so… sure.
The map I think has some problems but they're problems with general tile strength disparities (i.e. lots of strong windows to make up for a lot of weak pallets) that can be fixed over time.
Wesker is the biggest loser of the patch with changes I sincerely hope they reconsider, as he feels much more awkward to play even as someone who doesn't play Wesker at a level of play enough to properly deconstruct how his techs have changed.
So… its a mixed bag. A bit of good, a bit of bad. Like I said - normal for patches atp.
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Billy doesn't need changes. Most agree he's still amongst the strongest killers in the game (with many placing him in or around the 5th strongest) and he's, at least in my opinion, the only member of Top 5 to be strong yet fair.
Buffing him, then, would be hugely overkill.
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They dont have a server, so they're going to get tossed to whatever server has the best ping in the moment.
Ideally, BHVR would address high pings causing such a huge disparity in play, as well as maybe even adding a server for DBD players in Africa.
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@DemonicDemons said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4064041#Comment_4064041
In 1:19 there were two gens done, at 3:02 four gens were done. I have the video, so then what you're telling me is that I was going against cheaters who were using some kind of gen rush hacks?
So… two gens in 79 seconds when theres three survivors available? Seems normal with some great skillcheck luck and some doubling of a gen. And then 103 seconds for two more? You vsed efficient survivors and failed to build pressure quickly enough to pull them off gens.
Whats… actually meant to be the issue here? I'd love to see the video, to see what the issue even is, because from where I- and from the looks, everyone else on this thread- are sitting, it sounds like you lost a game you deserved to lose and want BHVR to change the game to make you win games you're supposed to lose, instead.
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The intent, I imagine, was to foster camaraderie amongst the community.
Unfortunately, it's failed at that goal, so I would support the argument to remove it entirely.
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@Elan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/465086/how-terribly-bad-this-game-is-balanced
It's Dead By Daylight, not Survive By Daylight. Surviving or escaping should be extremely rare, however the game is so insanely survivor sided that you are handholded in almost all situations. Survivors have so many stuffs to fight back or overall shield themselves that killer at this point is just the weaker role.
Incredibly interested to hear what your goal kill rates for the game WOULD be, then?
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double posted above comment, apologies! -
@Rokku_Rorru said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4063391#Comment_4063391
Right that makes a lot of sense when it's explained like that, have the devs ever explained that's why they chose 60 percent?
I don't think they have but its the explanation that seems solid enough to me - and if it wasnt their reason, its a nice byproduct nonetheless.
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@TheTom20 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4063266#Comment_4063266
That's not how it works
Examples of 60% kill rate
Example 1
Out of 10 games 8 games were draws an only 2 were 4ks
so even though the kill rate is 60% the win rate is only 20% in that example as 2 of the games were a win and 8 were draws
Example 2
Out of 10 games 4 games were 4ks, 4 were 1ks and 2 were 2ks (draw)
so even though the kill rate is 60% the win rate is only 40% with 4 of the games being a loss for the killer 2 a draw and only 4 being wins
60% kill rate you still can not win most of your gamesThat's… you just described the lower bounds of a bell curve. So to reiterate what I said above your comment: 60% kill rates construct a bell curve - one that is CENTERED on 50%. That doesn't mean its impossible to have any other winrate, its just the most common outcome.
@Rokku_Rorru said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4063257#Comment_4063257
I don't think there is any proof its a bell curve, is there? Feel free to post them, coz I'd like to see them genuinley.
I mean, it's math - math you can do basic versions of yourself. Take 5 games, lay out every way those 5 games can go that result in a total of 12 kills (60% kill rate) with no repeats, you'll get a rudimentary bell curve with 50% wins being the avergae result (1 20%, 4 40%, 4 60%, 1 80%). Repeat for 10 games, if you want. You'll hone in on a more and more precise version of DBD's winrate belllcurve for a mean of 2.4 kills per game.
@azaxydbd said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4063257#Comment_4063257
75% killrate is a win for the killer, so on average over 60% means broken strong, get ur facts checked, u dont need 100% killrate to win.
I genuinely have no idea what your point is, ngl. Rephrase, please?
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@azaxydbd said:
the fact that u get downvoted is wild, but ye, according to stats the game is killer sided, people that deny it basically deny stats and stats>feelings.
60% kill rate = bell curve of winrates centered on 50% for killer (what the winrate looks like for survivor is slightly more philosophical on if a 2k is a draw or a survivor win, but thats bhvr's balancing point - killer winning 50% of the time.)
stats > feelings tho!
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@OrangeBear said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4059361#Comment_4059361
If they're waiting for you to drop the pallet then just don't drop it. It's like huntress. Even if you go down anyway, it's a better outcome.
his myriad of animation bugs make this form of counterplay unnecessarily difficult, and the bugs are so easy to do you can do them accidentally.
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@Salafur said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4062390#Comment_4062390
I think it should give a partial MMR for the killed survivors that get killed until about 1 minute after they get a bot. But no MMR for bots after this time (because often people disconnect before they get hooked or get downed) but full Bloodpoints for the kills and hooks so far, maybe + 1000 BP per Bot that’s still alive when the game gets Closed.
As it is today, when you close a game when you re the killer and there are only bots left (4people disconnect) - you get -0- Bloodpoints and gets punished as a loss when you also disconnect and this can’t be ok in my opinion . Because fighting against bots is a waste of time when there isn’t even one player on the other side left , I hope the defs see that poll and change something a little
100% agreed
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im putting down No as more of a "There's Nuance" answer, since your poll options are… VERY specific.
i think that giving out the Vicory BP to the killer is a very good idea! but I think MMR alterations should account for the significantly shortened game in some way. in what way, im not sure - i dont have a good enough look at how DBD's MMR works to say, but I do think it should be accounted for beyond just "the same as a normal 4k" because it isnt the same as a normal 4k.
killers that get abandons could be due to a game they've won fair and square, or it could be because they locked plague and lucked out against four ppl with emetophobia. those wins, to me, are not equal, and treating especially the latter as a normal win seems wrong. maybe VERY short matches where the killer gets an "all bots abandon" give victory bp, but no mmr? unsure.
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It needs a Phase 2 first. Basically all of the health changes were scrapped because, as it turns out, basekit systems don't hit the killers that need to be hit by them (top 5) nearly hard enough at the expense of hitting bottom 15 too hard.
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Caffeine Tablets would need to be removed, and it'd just turn into Sadako counterplay, something survivors are famously terrible at, but it could theoretically work.
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I took a gigantic break when I was told something along the lines of what you were told, and when I came back I started doing little challenge runs - it started with perkless + padded jaws trapper just to see how often I could win (still a very fair bit) and now I'm trying to push to p100 on Billy without using perks.
I think periodic breaks from titles like this is a good thing for your mental especially given at times this community is capable of saying some really vile stuff. Hope you find a way to feel better soon!
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Why would you winstreak in Ranked if that mode has sweatier players?
Surely you'd want to winstreak in Casual where the games are easier and therefore the ability to make your winstreak longer is also easier?
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(Addendum: Discounting perks that cause Exhausted on Survivor side only adds Hyperfocus to the list)
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@ImWinston said:
- I'm shocked by only one thing: yes, Kaneki is very strong and truly deserves his "S" tier, but he's still weaker than Blight and Nurse. Why does everyone (including Devs) focus on him and do nothing for the other two killers who are truly problematic? The only counter to Nurse is to pray to God she's not good with her power... it's not normal. I've gone up against "good" Kanekis, obviously he got his down, but I still managed to run a "decent" chase for 20-30 seconds. Against a good Nurse, there's literally nothing you can do. Yes, okay, feints, going to the edge of the map, taking unpredictable routes, hiding line of sight... but I assure you, even these tactics don't work against a good Nurse.
Easy to play but vsing him means executing on very precise counterplay, makes every win he gets feel unearned, compared to Nurse and Blight who are both far more expressive of skill.
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@Sepi said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4060996#Comment_4060996
there already is a massive pool of survivors not playing. there is NO variety. and there is NO variety in builds bcs all perks except like 10 are USELESS
even if you presume that what you said about perk viability is correct, what makes you think bhvr basically giving survivors one extra perk each would be any different?
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i guarantee that, in practice, there'd be a small pool of optimal survivors and a sea of largely useless passives, hugely decreasing the variety of survivors played and even potentially harming BHVR's revenue stream as skin sales for survivors with bad passives crash.
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The reality is 1k simulator setups are just that - 1k simulators. Buy as much time as you can, force her to continue to babysit you, pray your team understands the wincon and slams gens.
Would it be nice if it was less possible for a killer to do this? Yeah, probably, but killer-specific anti-tunnels arent the kinds of systems the devs seem to have the time to prioritize at the moment, so we gotta play around em until they're dealt with
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finally! so glad this was added. play while you wait next if the queues are above a threshhold of 15 mins or so?
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You've shot down basically every exhaustion-causing perk presented in this thread, so I'll present an alternative: Exhaustion counting.
Have patience if you haven't seen an exhaustion out of a survivor yet.
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I would like more frequent PTBs with a seperate install, actually.
Something that's been an issue with the last few is that the amount of changes were so vast that some of the things that needed changes flew under the radar, because there was something more pressing that EVERYONE was talking about.
Krasue's PTB showed that really well, I think - Krasue and a Shape rework and Antitunnel systems meant that Krasue's necessary changes were drowned out by everyone talking about the Antitunnel systems. But the current way the PTB is structured doesn't lend itself well to many changes - I don't want to have to reinstall my game every week to test out and bugfix the changes BHVR wants to make. I think a seperate install fixes that problem and opens the door to more frequent and more focused PTBs.
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i think a focus on a much smaller pool of more transformative addons rather than 20 different ways to pencil-push numbers around could be really interesting provided they partialled or full-basekitted the major addon reliances the various roster members have.
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@CompetitifDBD said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4047126#Comment_4047126
They should be balancing around people knowing what they're doing, you can't just keep babying bad players by showering them with buffs. That's just making the role even stronger than it already is, not helping inexperienced people and only being further utilized by good survivors.
Why would you balance around a group of players you recognize is a huge minority? Isn't the game meant to try and be fun for most people?
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@CompetitifDBD said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4047126#Comment_4047126
Well its easily fixable if the devs actually made good tutorials for players to understand each killer kit, but they for some reason haven't done that yet, thus most people who don't play often have no clue how to beat like half the killers in the game (looking at Freddy and Sadako with a high kill rate, despite being weak killers)
…wait a sec I think I actually made a post abt this last week. I'm just gonna copy that.
The issue, I think, with adding very specific counterplay tips is that sometimes the devs intended counterplay and the actual counterplay aren't the same.
Look at how bots play against Plague. They spam cleanse. And that's bad because most players prefer to vs low-cleanse plague, where you are all injured and shes an m1 killer with very limited uses of her power (outside of iri), instead of high-cleanse plague, where youre all healthy and try and force her power on her by using up all of the fountains.
When approaching making tips for plague, what do BHVR suggest? To cleanse, like they instruct their bots to do, or not cleanse, like the playerbase agrees to do?
Of course, some killers would be made easier to vs by adding better tutorials. But honestly? I think most players wouldn't even look at them properly, and those that do risk being given advice irrelevant to the killer, region or mmr theyre playing against/at.
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@CompetitifDBD said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4046819#Comment_4046819
You do realize majority of survivors suck, right? Those stats are very skewed
So are we balancing around the majority of survivors or the tiny slice that are outskilling the masses?
Seems silly to want to rebalance the game around a phenomenon only relevant intermittently.
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I feel like there'd reach a point where SWFs entirely deprioritize trying to win because it becomes not worth it under systems like this.
Full 18% gen speed penalty + slowdown + gen spread means that macro isnt worth it over just taking chases and then going next when the chases get boring.
I get wanting to even out SoloQ and SWF, but you need to do it by bringing SoloQ up in terms of information disparity with more QoL for specific SWF-focused perks and situations more easily solved by SWFs, not punishing people for playing with their friends to the point that it feels like a waste to even try and win.
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@Michael_Afton12 said:
Lately I've seen there's a ton which can be improved in the SoloQ experience, such as the communication with YOUR OWN TEAM. Let's be honest:
- It makes no sense I can't even see MY TEAMMATES' auras during the whole game. Whenever I jump into a SoloQ match, the games feels like I am playing a 1v1 against the killer instead of a 4v1, I have no idea where my teammates are and therefore I can't heal without carrying a medic kit (which isn't infinite at all).
- There is NO WAY TO COMMUNICATE. It is incredible hard to play this game when I have no information about the killer's location or any other important stuff. What the hell am I suppossed to do in the middle of a chase if I have no information about which zones are unsafe and which zones are safe? Whan can I do against a stealth killer if I have no information about his current location? How can I protect my teammates without chasing them across the map, losing a ton of time, if I can't see their auras nor communicate with them?
- The MMR system and the RANK system is simply useless. Why do you guys even wanted to change the RANKS system? In the past it used to work way better than it does nowadays. I am in the lowest rank possible and yet I have to play a match against a killer whose skills aren't in the same level I am playing on. There's no way I am forced to play against The Ghoul using META builds when I am starting at the game and have no knowledge about perks and my teammates are in the same situation than me.
IMPROVEMENTS:
- Make it so I am able to see my teammates auras during the WHOLE game, it is not fair I got to use certain perks to have the information of something as simple as knowing where my teammates are.
- Add some kind of communication, such as pre-written messages which I can use by pressing number combinations. ("The killer is…", "The killer has…", "Do not rescue, focus on generators", "I need a heal", "Tank a hit for me", etc etc.)
- Remove MMR completely and bring back the old rank system, it was way more effective and didnt force you to play against 5000+ game hours people every match.
- Force killers to play as survivor every 3 matches, and so the same mechanic forces survivor to play as killer every 4 matches. This will help killers to be more conscient about how unfunny tunneling and camping actually is, and at the same time it will make the survivor mains realize going as killer is not as easy as they think
- maybe a bit too good to have it all the time but certain situations should absolutely have qol added to them to help soloq decisionmaking.
- no. it would just be used to find a line that can be used as an allegorical "youre the reason we're losing" and that would be the only thing that was spammed. see: league's ? ping (or worse the brief period of the hook ping)
- eh. both systems suck, but the grade system came with the huge issue of the game being entirely unplayable for the few days following the 13th. id prefer adjustments to the mmr system like Hens' recent suggestion of a toggleable strict matchmaking, so you can decide if you want to take the queue time hit for a better quality match yourself.
- and theres the game-killer. the person forced onto their off-role would just throw to get back to the role they actually want to play. game quality is already bad enough right now with burnouts causing the "go next" crisis. we don't need to be making it worse.
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The issue, I think, with adding very specific counterplay tips is that sometimes the devs intended counterplay and the actual counterplay aren't the same.
Look at how bots play against Plague. They spam cleanse. And that's bad because most players prefer to vs low-cleanse plague, where you are all injured and shes an m1 killer with very limited uses of her power (outside of iri), instead of high-cleanse plague, where youre all healthy and try and force her power on her by using up all of the fountains.
When approaching making tips for plague, what do BHVR suggest? To cleanse, like they instruct their bots to do, or not cleanse, like the playerbase agrees to do?
And this is just one small example of larger disparities in play. It doesn't account for regional differences or playstyle differences or tech to nulify intended counterplay.
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the teamwork perks you mean? they turn the -15% debuff into -10%* in exchange for buffs that don't actually make the gens go by faster, so they're actually a straight debuff compared to perkless gen splitting, i thought. one of them makes working gens harder to hear and the other one makes it easier to hit good skill checks, not even greats.
a huge step away from "the most busted genrush era ever" lmao - you release on game release BNPs did 100% of the gen right?
i don't think anyone will use the teamwork perks tbh - deja's a more consistent slot in builds and for full genrush setups they're subpar to splitting gens anyways. i'd love to know your math on the gen speeds, though. it must be some real scary numbers to justify buffing nearly every relevant slowdown to 150% of its current values.
* yes i know thats not how debuff speeds and buff speeds stack. its close enough. -
"oh, my main is banned this week. guess ill come back next week."
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I saw a comment that said "why are we treating Iri Shards like they're a paid currency" and that really hit the nail on the head. Honestly, giving enough IS for a new character is getting your foot in the door on that player buying cosmetics, idk why we're withholding IS this much.
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More Nurse players need to start using Matchbox so the playerbase understands how terribly 4.4 Nurse would go.
It's so boring for the survivors to just get walked down until a forced animation gives the nurse a blink hit guaranteed. It's boring for the nurse too - that's why they dont run Matchbox - but it's still bad all around.
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I don't really get why you can be aim dressed into a miss at all. The game is admitting you're deserving of the hit, that's why its dressing the aim to make it appear more legitimate than it was.
Surely the game should recognize that it's giving you a hit and then give you the hit, no?
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so we're basekitting haywire, removing the genkick limit, slowing down gens basekit, and we're making changes to EMPs whilst compensation buffing hux into being way too good at walking survivors down (survivors who cannot run away anymore)?
chess and terminus stall isn't ever going away if these are the suggestions bhvr is gonna keep reading lmao
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whenever the dc penalty is turned off the game becomes unplayable. go next behaviours completely break the fundamental balance of the game beyond repair, so they must be dissuaded at all costs.
cheaters are annoying - i get it - but not only are they never going away, taking away a penalty because of them just trades one issue out for a different one.
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Seperate them into different groups and do what with that information exactly?
Players don't want needlessly difficult matches so they're going to join the soloq only queue to bulldoze. That's an issue that needs to be solved by upping SoloQ's access to information, bringing Solo and SWF in line and then balancing the game around both groups now they are equal.
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I'm a little confused. You both claim that your goal is to create a True Ranked Experience (which in and of itself requires a solid balanced foundation to the game) but also that your goal is to make Killer "actually scary". So which is it? Should killer be the power role or should the game strive for balance?
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@Elan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4035876#Comment_4035876
The counterplay would be exact same, spread out and don't let him 5th hit, bodyblock etc.
7m/s for 11s is 77m before hits, kicking walls or kicking gens refreshes that duration. how do you simultaneously spread out further than most maps spread gens out in and work key gens and play for bodyblocks on survivors a brisk 19 seconds of running away?
This changelist individually would make legion a monster, but together would easily drop them at the pinnacle of eruption stall, as they can keep the entire lobby injured whilst they run between a 4/5 gen and kick them to keep eruption up and wait on a mistake they can capitalize on to win the game with.
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@Starlesque said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033410#Comment_4033410
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033356#Comment_4033356
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033338#Comment_4033338
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033322#Comment_4033322
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4033209#Comment_4033209
Here are my frustrating issue in today’s game: https://x.com/giannijezebel/status/1994625470852468769?s=46&t=Ys22ZfEajz7Ez2gJMAWBPQ
This "Operation Health" needed to be about bugfixing, and because it wasn't here everyone is suffering the consequences. Hopefully Artist gets bugfixed soon but honestly? The devs are making more bugs than they can fix with the timelines they're having thrust upon them, it would seem.
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I'd hugely prefer QOL - especially bugfixes. She's exceptionally well-designed and the only real change change i'd want for her would be to reduce the effectiveness of lockers, letting her express skill at longer ranges, but even that I would be fine with not getting if she just got a really solid chunk of her bugs fixed.
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I think they should last forever once purchased (I'm paying for content let me earn it, Helldivers understood the assignment there) but they're released slightly more often so people that want to grind each rift before the next one releases can still do so.
Win-win for the playerbase, only "concern" is that it means paying more artists to make skins for the game more regualrly, and from what it seems of other companies in this space, executive shareholders don't sufficiently grasp that the devs and artists are the ones padding their bank accounts
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@Nerchanild said:
Restore Leeched status on hook, I believe that's the main issue. Disclosure: I am a Survivor main and do not own Krasue. I did play against her in PTB though a lot.
Leeched on hook was removed because it blasted the door open for her hard tunnel strats. There was basically no reason to go for anyone other than a fresh hook on Krasue, because tunnelling on her was so easy.
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Unless they got healed, they were cheating.
Presuming you wasted minimal time after the down, they would need to self-pickup in at best 2.5s. The required charges per second to make 4 charges happen in 2.5 seconds is 1.6c/s, but because of the self-pickup debuff you'd need to amass 220% bonus pickup speed.
Unbreakable gives 35%, Exponential gives 100%. 135% falls beyond short of our required 220%. So they'd either have to have been healed - WGLF and no self-pickup debuff easily clears 1.6c/s needed to get to the recovery window for Conviction - or they were cheating, hiding it with Conviction Soul Guard.
Conviction should get nerfed anyways, it's still egregiously easy to utilize even when the killer is only loosely leaving a survivor on the ground to ward off a potential flashlight save, but just for your peace of mind on the outcome of that match - you got a cheater, I'm almost certain.