dugman
dugman
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- dugman
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I don’t recommend balancing anything based on how a hacker uses it.
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@Kebek said:
Like literally, neither side wouldn't have a single perk. All addons & items would stay exactly the same.
Ignoring the fact that game would have less variety, would you enjoy to play DBD like that ?
Why would I ignore having less variety? Variety is a lot of the reason I keep playing the game.
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@Sea_man69 said:
This game is going to end up like Overwatch if BHVR doesn’t fix how awful it is to play killer nowadays.
As a survivor main, some killers just don’t stand a chance on certain maps and it makes it extremely boring for both sides. There’s no way a Trickster can do anything on RPD or Mother’s Dwelling unless the survivors throw.
Also please buff Billy <3
If by “end up like Overwatch” you mean have 6 million active players over the last 30 days then I’m pretty sure Behaviour would love that.
On this page you will see Overwatch Live Player Count or the players currently playing the game. How many players playing it on a monthly average playing -
Michi, aka Lord of the Hag, posted an hour long video called Totem Trouble for Halloween where he just killed survivors over and over who were cleansing and blessing totems.
https://youtu.be/LXwZ0BtXyXM -
I watched some VHS gameplay, not really doing it for me. 🤷♂️ I don’t care about the ‘80s theme, and the fights look more like typical shooters since the survivors are firing back, but if I was interested in a shooter I’d probably just play more Overwatch instead. I’m probably skipping it.
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Nice. 🙂 You should try swapping in Rancor for one of those perks too.
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I Prestige for fun because I like resetting the characters and seeing what I get on the next play through. But no, there’s no practical benefit to it, and if your goal is building a complete collection of perks it’s a bad idea.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2660907#Comment_2660907
I agree with this, but only if the gen is regressing because the killer actually kicked it (eg. this wouldn’t apply with Ruin).
I’d do something like this:
- Increase base regression rate to 0.375 charges per second (halfway between the current normal rate and ruin)
- Change Ruin to 50% of 1 survivor’s repair rate (this makes it remain the same as it is now)
- Nerf PGTW to 20% (instead of 25%, to account for #4)
- If a generator is directly damaged by a killer, survivors must first “fix” the generator (there could be a better word for this). This action takes 2 seconds, can only be done by one survivor (cannot have multiple survivors to make this faster), does not have skill checks, and progress resets if interrupted. During this time, regression pauses but will resume if the survivor stops or is interrupted. Upon completion, regression stops and survivors can then resume repairs. If a survivor is “fixing” a generator, they are considered to be “repairing the generator” for purposes in regards to other perks (eg, DS is disabled, eruption can trigger on them, etc.).
- If a generator is regressing due to a passive effect (eg. Ruin or Surge), regression may be stopped by simply tapping the gen.
I don’t think the game distinguishes between possible reasons a gen is regressing. It doesn’t matter if the gen is regressing because it was kicked or a perk like Ruin, etc, it’s just a condition the gen is in.
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@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2660448#Comment_2660448
Haunted Grounds is actually quite a bad perk. Only 60 seconds of 1 hit downs that you do not control when it happens or even if it happens at all. Extremely overrated perk.
Especially now that we're in a boon meta noed is almost always guaranteed to activate. At any given time, especially near end game, you will generally always have someone on a hook or about to be on a hook. Those couple downs from NOED turns that 1 hook at end game into 2 quite easily and that's at bare minimum depending on the map rng of totem spawns. You can quite easily turn a 1k into a 4k solely from noed alone.
Also while I do think comp games are a joke in a game that's this unbalanced, they are very good players. Go watch their matches and you'll see the killers always running NOED. If you had any doubt about it being a good perk, that should alleviate it. There's a reason they do.
"If NOED actually statistically overperformed in terms of kill rates it probably would have been nerfed a long time ago given how long it’s been around and how many people complain about it."
Actually no, they wouldn't.
It's kept in that state because it artificially increases the kill rate statistics to higher levels as a scapegoat to justify the balance changes they make towards keeping the game skewed towards the very average casual survivor. IE we point out how unbalanced the game is and they go, "no look at the data killers are actually much better than you think". Now they do not overtly tell you what conclusions to draw from said data as I was slightly hyperbolic there. They tell you not to draw conclusions from it because they themselves know how flawed that data is from multiple things, noed being one of them.
Many killers kills come from entirely NOED as well at lower tiers and removing that would make many of them quit the game.
Like I said earlier, I am not saying noed is op whatsoever, it's not. I'm just saying it is good if you care about winning and is unhealthy design for the game.
That scapegoat theory sounds like bunk honestly. The devs nerf killer perks they perceive to be overpowered all the time, they don’t leave them in the game to somehow artificially inflate kill rates.
Moreover I’ve never seen actual data indicating NOED inflates kill rates overall compared to other good perks, just a lot of speculation about how good or bad it is. Has anybody actually tracked results of randomly sampled games on kill rates in games with NOED versus games without it? If so it’s be an interesting read.
On a tangent I’ve had good results with Haunted Ground but that’s just me. It rarely doesn’t go off early in the match because survivors are hyper aware of removing hexes nowadays. And since it goes off early in the match it normally happens within a time frame I am already chasing a healthy survivor. So while I don’t know how good or bad it is overall I doubt it’s as bad as you seem to think. 🤷♂️
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@Sakurra said:
And why are you talking about that guy? I have no idea why you people like him. He's very disagreeable.
🤨 Who doesn’t like Otz as a person? I don’t watch him that often but he seems like an extremely nice guy.
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@StarLost said:
Over the past few days, I'm sure we've all seen the various 'Otz hates MMR see video' threads and - catching up on one of his streams recently, I just want to put this thing to bed once and for all.
For those who don't know. Otzdarva is one of the most prolific and influential DbD streamers around, with an amusing 666k on Twitch alone and YouTube videos that rack up views in the millions. He's also a legitimately nice bloke.
So - in a recent stream, he went on to clarify his stance on MMR. In short:
- MMR is not a big problem.
- He sees the benefits of it (implied).
- The problem is that MMR highlights the longstanding problems with the game, particularly from a balance standpoint and the gulf between 'meta' perks and killers and the rest of the roster.
I've essentially said all I've got to say on the matter, and this very much mirrors my own opinions. The issue isn't MMR. The issue is balance.
Yep, I would say those bullet points are totally reasonable.
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On a related note, I do think it should take survivors a 1-2 second charge time to actually start repairing a generator and stop it regressing, similar to how it takes a killer a charge time to put a generator into regression. It just feels silly that a survivor can, mid chase or while a killer is standing swinging at them, literally just instantly tap the generator to stabilize it. I think adding that 1-2 second charge up timer wouldn’t significantly alter the game balance, it would just get rid of that dumb looking scenario of a survivor running past a generator and doing The Fonz bonk on it to fix it.
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@Ssajbambusa said:
@dugman No it would not my dude. IW and Stridor are now coded to be counted multiplicatively, not additively.
It used to be: 100% sound - 100% sound (IW) + 50% sound (S) = 50% sound volume
Now it is: 100% sound - 100% sound (IW) * 150% (S) = 0% sound volume (Cause multiplying 0 by anything is still a 0)
If IW3 was 90% sound reduction, the remaining 10% would be increased by 50% into 15% of the sound volume.
I know it’s multiplicative, my dude, that’s why 100% completely cancels Stridor.
My whole point was Stridor 3 would somewhat reduce the benefit of Iron Will 3, making it like you said 85% versus 90% reduction for instance. So technically not the 75% of Iron Will 2, but still less reduction than Iron Will. It’s some impact versus zero impact.
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I think Iron Will being being at 100% at level 3 is the issue. Just adjust that to 90-95%, it would still be significantly better than level 2 but would also still allow Spirit at least some small chance of hearing a survivor and would allow Stridor to mitigate it a bit (Stridor 3 would basically make Iron Will 3 into Iron Will 2)
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@Blueberry said:
OP? No
Unhealthy for the game? Yes
Overrated? No.
NOED on average will single handedly net you significantly more kills than you would have got other wise. Not because you did anything skillful, but simply because the survivors were lazy.
I’m a bit skeptical NOED significantly improves kill rates more than other good perks. It can get one or maybe two downs at the end of the match that you might not get without it, but for instance Haunted Grounds gets you one or two downs early in the match and early downs can snowball into a 3v1 before the gens are completed which significantly increases the chances of a 3-4k. And running NOED means you have an unused perk slot for the first 80% of the match or so.
If NOED actually statistically overperformed in terms of kill rates it probably would have been nerfed a long time ago given how long it’s been around and how many people complain about it.
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2659566#Comment_2659566
This was...literally my exact thing. Grabs on demo coming out of the portal are the most fun things ever.
A few more:
- Landing a really juicy Surge on multiple gens simultaneously.
- Giving a pair of survivors who were really fun the gate.
- Prenerf Wraith.
- Chaining multiple Hunts together on Cenobite (RIP addons)
- Bending a hook through shack door, out shack window and hitting a survivor who then DCs.
- Watching people freak out when they trigger traps on Hag.
- Jumpscaring people in general.
- Downing, hooking and killing a teabagger or flicker.
- Playing Demo with the whistle and yellow fungus addons (seriously, this makes him almost 'A 'tier if you use it right).
It’s funny, I don’t remember if I’ve ever gotten a grab with Demo after a tunnel. I think the killer I get the most grabs with is Michael in Evil 1, usually right at the start of the match. For a big guy he’s scarily quiet! 😄
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Probably an accidental oversight considering that Cleansing totems does cancel DS.
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I watched some of the gameplay videos of VHS and not really digging it so far. 🤷♂️ Looked more like a shooter than a horror game.
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I’m more or less onboard with this list. 👍
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Boon placement, snuffing, and replacement are ok as is, provided that the individual Boon perks are balanced around it. All they need to do is balance Circle of Healing against the current system by adjusting its healing speed and it will be fine. The issue right now is that its healing bonus is probably too fast given the way Boons in general work.
Shadowstep may or may not be overpowered, it’s hard to tell. I’m pretty sure it’s fallen out of favor compared to Circle of Healing so if it needs any adjustment it would be a minor one.
The new Boon Exponential isn’t even out yet so who knows there. 🤷♂️ Again, though, if it hypothetically needed an adjustment they could tweak its speed or radius of effect.
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You didn’t actually win either game it sounds like. 🤷♂️ 1 kill is still a loss.
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@IlliterateGenocide said:
It makes me sick.
I wouldn’t mind it being base kit. I don’t know if it’s necessary, though, and some players don’t like it.
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Neither is “dumb”. They need a way to leave the game in case something comes up in real life. And they need to temporarily suspend people who abuse that.
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Other - Detective Allison Kerry. She was in the first three movies (died at the start of the third movie)
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@themoobs1984 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2659846#Comment_2659846
If they buff solo survivor that isn't going to fix anything on the killer's side. That will just exacerbate the problem. Killer players will still be at a disadvantage, just a bigger disadvantage than before. Best thing to do for killer players that have an issue with this whole matter is to avoid playing against SWF teams. If killers refuse to play against them then they won't ever get a game to play. From an unbiased perspective, this is all I can think of that would resemble a fix.
I’ve said that they should consider giving solo survivors a small buff to compensate for not being on comms and level the playing field between solos and swfs, but then slow gens slightly to compensate the broad survivor boost and keep the overall balance about where it is.
Allowing killers to leave groups they think have swfs is a non-starter, never going to happen. Literally half of games have at least a 2-4 person swf in them.
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Just to clarify, the devs have always said they don’t have an issue with swfs using comms, they fully expected it from the beginning and do it themselves. The reason they didn’t build an ingame voice chat has more to do with good third party comms already doing the job for people interested in that and them not wanting people who don’t like comms to feel like they’re mandatory.
That being said, there’s also inherent imbalances between swfs on comms and solo survivors which they also know about. Whether they’ll over time tweak certain things to buff solo survivors or nerf survivors on comms a big is more of a question. For instance, a while back they nerfed Object of Obsession in part, if I remember right, because it was particularly overpowered in swf groups. So they might look at certain things in the margins related to swf, but probably aren’t looking to do a sweeping change.
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Michi almost always runs Make Your Choice. Hook someone, move away to place traps, after an unhook sets off a trap port back and hit the exposed rescuer. Can’t just heal from that!
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@Beaburd said:
There's actually some skill involved in this technique.
What you want to do is also hold W. Now, I know, you think I'm crazy, but hear me out.
Using your superior skills as a killer, you will eventually catch up to their W. You may think this wastes a lot of time, you may think the gens might all be done by then, and you may even blame me for losing the game by following my simplistic advice. If you think this way, you'd probably be right.
But that's not the point. I'm only here to tell your options as a killer on how to handle this.
And the secret solution is by engaging in an intense battle of wits and skill by holding W yourself.
There actually is a bit of finesse though beyond just “hold W also”. Namely deciding when it’s worth holding W to continue chasing them and when it’s not. For instance, if they’re holding W and leading you away from all the gens that might not be worth doing, but if they’re holding W toward generators then chasing them could also pressure people off those. Or similarly if they’re holding W but heading into a corner then you’ll catch up more quickly and it might be worth it. And you can also potentially influence the direction they hold W by forcing them onto one side of a pallet or the other before you break it, for example.
So yeah, the actual act of chasing them is straightforward (no pun intended) but there’s some nuance in when to actually do that and positioning at the start of it.
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I dont tunnel, I like it when I use STBFL and injures multiple survivors and pressure them from there. Since the Boon Coh, it just doesnt work any more.
Ironically probably the biggest benefit of Save the Best for Last with full tokens is that you can hit someone and rechase them much more quickly to get the down, versus hitting and then finding another target.
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Keep in mind there’s 90 killer perks. Even if all 13 perks in the original post aren’t great that’s still not close to “most killer perks”.
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They originally planned to do something like give people rewards for lots of thumbs ups, but never followed up on it.
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- Doesn’t happen often but getting five tokens on Devour Hope and killing the survivors with it is pretty sweet
- Gen grabs while stealthed
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Just for reference here’s the link to the list of things that can result in a temporary ban. Being afk or not participating isn’t bannable, but using a bot is.
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@RoaderFrost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2659365#Comment_2659365
It ruins clicky-clicky fun. Just one perk to rule them all... no pallet blinds, no flashlight saves, just like that. Definitely OP :)
Honestly I’m tempted to run it against Blast Mine, not because that perk is all that big a deal really in terms of helping them escape, but because it’s annoying getting blinded when you kick a generator. 🤷♂️
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Never thought I’d see a thread saying Lightborn of all things is overpowered.
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On a tangent it’s unreasonable to balance a killer around literally no add-ons since it’s expected that they’ll have at least two brown or yellow add-ons every match. Running no add-ons at all is a bit like playing a shooter or RPG using no equipment, it should be obvious you’ll perform a little worse than expected that way. Likewise for expecting killers with no perks to do well.
That’s not to say you should expect killers to have to use specific rare or ultra rare add-ons to do well. Pinhead shouldn’t hypothetically only work well while using Engineers Fang for instance. But expecting them to at least use two add-ons of any color is in line with how the game is designed.
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If the argument above against the MMR is there are less instances of high skill players smurfing and trouncing low skill players then that’s not much of an argument. It’s not exactly an issue that a streamer has trouble winning 100 games in a row because they’re facing more competent players since they win so often. If the only way someone can enjoy a game is stomping on newbies then that’s a “them” problem.
Nor is it a problem if a player who uses a terrible build loses matches against people who are playing just as well with better builds. There’s nothing preventing you from running whatever build you want, but there’s also no reason you should expect to not lose and have your MMR go down when you use bad loadouts or no loadouts, etc.
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2658701#Comment_2658701
I will never understand Ash being a survivor; guy is terribly suited for such a meek role.
Ash isn’t the survivor, he’s just the guy who carries the real survivor - Puppet Ash.
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I like playing killer much better than survivor
- I mainly play solo and killer is the solo-only role
- There’s a much wider variety of killer abilities and playstyles than survivors which helps keep things from becoming too stale
- Killers have a lot less downtime than survivors. A significant portion a survivor game is spent either doing a gen, being downed or being on a hook. Killers are in contrast always worst case able to proactively at least try and get into chases (aside from the very end of the game once you can’t prevent still standing survivors from escaping.)
- Thematically the killers are more interesting than the survivors which are mostly pretty generic. (Aside from maybe Ash)
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The devs already commented on another thread that these events are scheduled months in advance.
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I usually say gg plus something else, like “gg, that was close”. Sometimes a sore loser still talks trash after that but usually they either say nothing, say gg, or sometimes get into a nice conversation.
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I don’t main anybody, I just play a match or two with my daily mission’s killer.
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I just play killer and I can hardly ever think of survivors commenting on my perks. Other than the one a few weeks ago that was super salty at losing and called me a trash killer with NOED. (I wasn’t using NOED, it was Thanatophobia, and the gens never finished so even if I had NOED it would have made no difference.) If anybody has ever been thinking “huh, you don’t see Deerstalker every day” or whatever they never say it.
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I don’t have a strong opinion on how good or bad he is, but I think he’s overall fun to play which is what matters more in the end. 🤷♂️
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Keep in mind Huntress comes with the game and might be the best of the starting characters after Nurse so it shouldn’t be surprising if she’s popular. Blight requires shards to purchase so him being as popular as a base game character is a testament to how good he is.
I wonder who the most popular licensed killer is though? You actually have to pay a small amount of money for them so it requires a little extra desire to want them. Leatherface aka Bubba might be the most effective licensed killer? But with the licensed ones I wouldn’t be surprised if their popularity has as much or more to do with the popularity of their franchise. 🤷♂️
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@whispersenthusiast said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2655725#Comment_2655725
Yeah I've seen he runs that build. I personally don't find Deadlock very engaging, but it's a good guaranteed gen slowdown.
I think Lethal Pursuer is really good with Corrupt, depending on the killer, and especially if survivors get smarter about hiding out the timer. All killers except for Trapper and Hag can benefit from it I think, and it's especially good on killers who need to tier up their power quickly or have powers with a big snowball potential. I'm surprised more people aren't running it honestly. Getting pressure immediately can be a bigger game changer than mid-game gen slowdown.
Two reasons I can think of I don’t typically run Corrupt
- Not everybody has it unlocked on every killer. It’s a Plague teachable, so it’s not guaranteed people will have it at all. (I prestige for fun normally and just kind of use what I have available for instance so I know most of my killers don’t have it unlocked.)
- Even when I have it available I don’t typically run it simply because it can make it take longer to find survivors. Barring using Whispers or Lethal Pursuer, etc, my normal strategy is to move in audible range of the gens and listen for noises. With half the gens blocked it takes that much longer for the survivors to find a gen and work on it, which means it takes longer for me to hear them. And since I mostly just like to get into chases ASAP at the start of the match, having that take longer is a bit of a downer. (Again, not saying it’s not effective at what it does, just saying I find the games without it to be a bit more exciting in the beginning of the match.)
That’s just me though,
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No Way Out is a good slowdown perk. It doesn’t slow down generators but it does slow down escaping the match which is really what the goal of slowing down generators actually is.
Tru3ta1ent currently swears by No Way Out, Corrupt Intervention, and Deadlock for slowdown and a fourth for utility (typically Fearmonger). Those first three all slow the game down without needing him to kick gens or use Hexes.
The main possible weakness Corrupt Intervention has is when survivors are savvy enough to just hide it out. If as a team they just scatter and hide for the duration then the killer can get nothing from it and now they’re playing the rest of the match with one perk. Fortunately for killers in most matches someone isn’t hiding initially so this isn’t a common tactic, probably only happens if the survivors are on comms and decide as a group to do it.
p.s. I wonder if Lethal Pursuer pairs well with Corrupt? Since the best strategy against Corrupt is to hide it out, Lethal Pursuer makes it impossible for the survivors to hide for the first 10 seconds of the match and guarantees the killer someone to chase right away. That puts them immediately into the position Corrupt works well where the killer has someone on a hook early but half the gens are blocked and there’s less to patrol outside that hook.
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FYI You left out Lery’s and Dead Dawg Saloon
A while back before the map revamps the devs released a chart of escape rates by map. It’d be interesting to see a new version of that. Consensus among streamers seems to be that Haddenfield and Baden Preschool are the most survivor biased maps (they might differ between themselves on which is worse than the other but those are the top two). Hawkins was generally considered one of the best killer maps I think too. I’m not sure off hand which is the best killer map overall now though, maybe Midwich? 🤷♂️
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I don’t know how good or bad he is exactly but I don’t enjoy using his rifle, the turning speed just feels super slow.