caipt
caipt
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out of the mentioned only a generously estimated 5 of them deal with pallets so well that they can, at times, be useless. Only one of them genuinely is unaffected.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3792423#Comment_3792423
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3792512#Comment_3792512
How should survivors loop the tiles on Haddonfield? You know the ones near the hedges that don’t connect to anything at all. How about the tiles on Greenwich that are a pallet and a pole or a pallet and a rock? And what’s the skill expression for killers on these loops?
greenville also has tiles with 2 pallets…
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@ReverseVelocity said:
How is "new wiggle" any different to "old wiggle" apart from not having to destroy your A and D keys?
I think they mean beta skill check wiggle that would save 1 second if you hit all greats
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only thing better would be a map
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3785662#Comment_3785662
except it is not rewarding. what is the point of using assassin if the assassin get outplayed with 0 thought process. you fake vault, AI bug out. no hit.
Now you can't even use him because 30 second cooldown.
getting a hunt will still waste the survivors time which has always been their most conistent value
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3787117#Comment_3787117
The problem is all but one of those anti-tunneling ‘fixes’ are cancelled with a single hit. The one that isn’t (DS) doesn’t net enough distance to help as it was nerfed. Again. I agree with survivors changing their playstyle to help but the only other option is stealth and killers complain about that too.
Hitting a survivors basekit BT is mathematically less efficient than waiting it out, unless your objective is slowdown from deep wound and not to tunnel. OTR is good because it forces the killer into a worse situation while making it harder to relocate them later, the killer hitting you right off hook might not be optimal OTR value but its better than if they waited out BT. Plus the iron will buff is an indirect buff to OTR, you can no longer tell if the survivor has it effectively in most situations. As for DS I think 4s is plenty.
as for the playstyles theres more than stealth, you can play altruism, chase, gen jockey (but who wants to that+killers complain), and any of the numerous meme builds out there. -
@Gandor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3787127#Comment_3787127
that's actually wrong. 50% kr means PRECISELY 50% win rate. Killer plays 4 matches in 1 trial. So when we speak about ties/draws, we are not technically correct. Because it single trial killer can win 2x and loose 2x. It was explained in one of the dev streams (quite some time ago). It was an explenation to MMR - which is the exact thing how game considers when you win and when you loose and this is exactly the number by which you get sorted in lobby.
As for your example - it's not true. You picked survivor that won. That's very arbitrary. So arbitrary, that I can do the same thing - a killer got a "tie" with 2 kills and "I" as a survivor actually lost…
No, a 50% killrate would mean that a survivor wins 50% of the time and the killer ties 50% of the time. I could phrase in the inverse, "a survivor loses 50% of the time while a killer ties 50% of the time", but that kind of defeats the point in a discussion about winrates.
How isa 2k not a tie, even in technicality? If the killer one twice and lost twice as you put it, thats +2 and a -2, resulting in a net 0, non-win match for the killer. Which means, looping back around to my original point, the killer ties (more importantly, doesnt win) the same rate that a survivor will escape.
I agree my example was arbitrary and underdeveloped. However, your counterpoint doesnt change anything. Of course survivors still lose under a 50% killrate, the issue is that its less often than the killer by a sizeable margin. Under a 50% killrate, the killers chance of getting at least 3 kills is only 30%, while the survivors chance of winning (individually) is 50%. Yes, two survivors die in a tie, but that doesnt make it a killer win. Fact is that if the killrate were 50% then the game would be (and was when it used to be) outrageously survivor sided on average. A 60% killrate makes for a balanced game on both sides with a roughly 50% winrate. -
@Gandor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3787112#Comment_3787112
Most basekit features in last year or so were in favor of survivors, which doesn't support your claim.I don't care about specific changes. The overall goal which they clearly are going for/change stuff up to uphold is 60% kill rate. The specific changes mentioned by either side serves no other purpose then to get away from the main point of discussion. 60% kill rate is just way too much. It's literally 50% more kills then escapes. That's just WRONG.
In time when the game was balanced (around 50% kr - and it was on average 52+% kill rate if I remember right for a long time since 6.1) the game was fun. Now it's so fun I actually uninstalled.
One thing I give you though is the situation where someone gives up. Yes, this is actually good point. The thing is, that if he DC's, it's not counted. If killer gives up, but doesn't DC, that is also counted. Sure, this can happen more on survivor side. But not that much, that it's fair for killers to get 50% more wins then survivor. Otherwise it would mean we have serious problem with people giving up basically every like 4th game (I didn't do math, so if it's every 5th game, so be it) and devs should really do something about it - but that's not the case AFAIK (at least not THAT often).
Also survivor escaping thru hatch is fully counted in statistics as survivor escape - even though it's tie. So it should be discarded in this regards.
If you don't get to escape regularly as SWF it's skill issue.Sure. Even with 99% kill rate if you are literal god and play against newbies, you will win every game. The difference is, that the game is so balanced, that 2K "wins" (3+kills) are done on killer's side, but there is no survivor's record for 3+out for at least 500 games (at least not since the very early stages of the game). This argument is similar to going for a running race, but "you can win even with severly injured leg - it's possible and if you can't compete against other competitors that get free backwind from fan that will follow them whole track, then that's skill issue". Meaning you can overcome malus, but that doesn't make it fair.
A 50% killrate does not equal a 50% winrate. DBD doesnt work that way, a killer tie results in a win for 2 survivors while a survivor win could still be a loss for their dead teammate.
Since according the MMR system a 3k is counted as a win minimum for the killer, a 50% winrate would mean that a killer gets a tie the same rate that a survivor gets a win. Of course resulting in a survivor sided game where the killer winning (on average) is uncommon, while a survivor winning is a simple coin flip.
A 60% kill rate means an average of 2.4 survivors killed per match, jus about half a kill from a win. This means that while the killer still ties on average, they perform better doing it and could have won if they were a bit better. I ran the numbers into a probability calculator:
probability of a kill: 60%
flip coin 4 times
when set to at least, it said that the killer would get at least a 3k 48% of the time. -
Killers to not wait in queue to fight robots. There'd be a DC everymatch just because somebody didnt like that they got nurse.
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@Doxie said:
I love how killers always go to "punish survivors for DC or Suicide out" rather than fix the survivors issues. People don't do that for no reason…it's frustration over an unplayable, boring player mode. As a killer I get to switch my game play, as survivor I get to do gens, unhook and repeat... except that killers tunnel, camp hooks etc preventing a lot of game play. They respawn hooks, make gens longer etc etc. What have they done to nerf tunneling And camping?....nothing. FYI, for the kids that like to twist my words....I neither condone suiciding out nor DC. I've screen shot this for the record... I just don't want another ban.
they've done quite a bit about tunneling and camping. Basekit BT+haste, anti camp meter, numerous powerful anti tunnel perks. And if you so choose you can change your survivor gameplay with different builds.
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dumb question but was it artist?
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@Boons123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3785313#Comment_3785313
However, some ideas are transferred from the mobile version to the other versions, such as the visual terror radius, so what really prevents the use of visual cues in all versions?
because one is accessibility tool for a core game mechanic that is imperative for hearing impaired players while the subject of debate is 1 killer out of 30 or so that would lose he identity as a result.
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@Boons123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3785294#Comment_3785294
What? The mobile version is the same as the other versions, the only difference is that it meets the mobile requirements to run it, such as graphics and control.
Same gameplay, same characters, same maps, same rules, so how is the mobile version so different from the other versions?
What harm would it do if this visual cue was carried over to other versions of the game? Nothing!
Its designed to be played as a mobile game. That being a casual, on-the-go experience to pass the time. People play mobile games because their an accessible option; thats why people veer towards pc/console gaming instead when the option presents itself. Thus dbd mobile is designed to be a low barrier to entry, free game to pass some time on your commute etc etc. Therefore its designed to require as little investment as possible, I.E. made to not require headphones.
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@LadyOwO said:
Do you play survivor at all? I highly doubt you'd understand how absurd it feels to play against her. I can guarantee you that she's not balanced at all right now.
as a soloQ survivor, good pathing and mindgames still destroys her. Shes always been an all or nothing killer, if you run her to the loops shes bad on you just win most of the time.
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A loss is a loss but I dont see is as a skill issue if it was like 4 p100s with GoJ or something, still a loss but not one I take seriously.
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@Shinkiro said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3785248#Comment_3785248
We don't, but its unreasonable to ask for the entire game to start being designed around specific disabilities and affecting everyone elses enjoyment. It's not realistic at all because it VASTLY limits design creativity and game balance for, lets be honest, a tiny minority of people who might have a few specific problems.
I am all for reasonable aids (such as the visual terror radius) but asking for things that are an obvious nerf that EVERYONE can use to gain an advantage is unfair, in this case to spirit players having their power telegraphed. Now imagine you can hear properly and also have visual cues to her phasing.
exactly it'd be pretty silly to gut everything that makes spirit unique so a small percentage of players have a better time vs her
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@Boons123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3785187#Comment_3785187
I saw in the mobile version that there is a visual indication when playing against the spirit, and it looks like a red curved line that increases in intensity the closer she gets to you, and this curve tends towards the killer.
So I think it's also right to add that to this version as well and then it's fair to face her.
or you could just use headphones and then its fair to face her. This is like bringing no perks and complaining when you die.
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@Boons123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3785178#Comment_3785178
I am talking about playing against, if the player have hearing problems then the player can simply play another killer.
But it's completely different when you play as the survivor, you don't know the identity of the killer until the match starts , if the killer is the spirit and you do not use a headset or have hearing problems, then you have no chance of standing up to it when being chased.
As you said, there should be visual cues to help deaf or hard of hearing players because without them the match turns into a complete guessing game.
I was talking about playing hearing impaired as survivor as well. But as a non-impaired player (I assume, apologies if I'm wrong) you dont deserve extra visual cues because you refuse to use the sound cues. It does not matter that you dont know what killer it is when the match starts; Because a headset doesnt take up a perk slot, if the killer is spirit you can simply plug in your headphones next time you're safe. Its like 30s of your time and opens up a world of counterplay for you to use, however when you choose not to use it you lose the right to criticize the audio-based killer's balance. This isnt a "bring calm spirit for ultimate weapon situation", this is a "have basic gaming equipment avaliable while you play" situation. But yeah there should be some kind of visual cue that shes phasing, not showing where she is but just that shes using power. Like how people used to say the shards glow.
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@Boons123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3785164#Comment_3785164
Why should the player wear a headset? Any other killer you can face without being forced to use a headset, the entire game can be played without a headset
Why do you think they added the terror radius to help the deaf or hard of hearing if the player must use his headphones?
because killers have directional sound cues and tracking survivors at low sight loops needs good use of audio. Thats why iron will is strong, if audio like injury noises wasnt valuable information it wouldnt have been meta for so long. Why SHOULDN'T the player use a headset? Besides spirit needs the headset much more than the survivor does. Unless you're deaf as long as you can hear that she is phasing, then you can counter her. After that its mostly mindgaming her. There should be a visual cue that shes phasing for the hearing impaired players, however you dont have the right to complain when you are choosing not to use the solutions presented. Really not getting why you dont already play with a headset.
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@Boons123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3785093#Comment_3785093
She can still see scratch marks and she still can use her powers to navigate a map, etc.
While to face her against her, you need to use a headset.
This is unfair, you can't know which killer you're going to face.
You should be playing with a headset anyway and its not like a perk, you can put on your headset any time! Its not her fault that you lose wen you are actively handicapping yourself and then calling for nerfs.
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camping from medium distance is fair play as you can get a trade, whereas without the anti face camping mechanic it would take 2 survivors to save one (and one survivor trying would get downed for sure).
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this actually used to be in the game as a bug. If you stunned nurse with a pallet during or just after a blink then she would get stunned and then also go into fatigue, result in a roughly 5 second stun. But alas bugs get removed :(
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@adam1233467 said:
Nobody plays hag because she is boring to play
My proof for this is singularity, even with the buffs that he received, I still do not see him being played
Why? Because he is boring to play, and people like to play the killers that are fun, remember when wesker was released? Everyone was playing him because he was fun.
Even with the buffs that Hag got one time ago, still nobody plays her because her playstyle is boring, of course there are players that like the character, but, it’s not a considerable number of people that like her.
nuh uh larry the goat
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@JPLongstreet said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/424404/why-is-sadako-barefooted
Isn't the Nurse and Spirit as well?
what does a floating lady need shoes for anyway
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@TieBreaker said:
If you can put your controller down for almost five minutes during a match, and it has no impact on the outcome, that's bad gameplay design. It's a ******* computer game. It's designed to be played.
Most of dbd for survivors is just holding a button and waiting for something interesting to happen anyways, remove skillchecks and theres almost no difference between gens and being slugged imo (gameplay wise). It is bad game design but pretty much all of dbd is designed that way so I dont get why this specifically is what people center on.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3784380#Comment_3784380
i did not even mention a comeback or anything. You, yourself already said that the Survivors lost aka the Killer won. So why prolong an already won game just for some Egoboost?
To be fair some killers might not consider a 3k a win (which is stupid), and there are plenty of reasons for wanting the 4k beyond ego. BP, challenges, adepts, etc.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
What does it matter if the killer is slugging for the 4k, you practically already lost so just tab out and do something else.
And the Killer already won. The Killer is basically just slugging for a 4K while already winning the game, just for the Ego, wasting the time of others.
Yeah so just tab out and watch some youtube or something. Actually trying to comeback in the kind of situation will probably take longer and get you nowhere. Besides what right does the survivor team have to complain about the killer denying hatch? Both sides do whatever and anything they can do get the 4-out or 4k if the opportunity arises.
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@coolgue1 said:
If just funny because since the hook resapwn update I never seen more killers slugg for 4k in my life or the entire team for that fact so when it the other way are it fine but when a survivour tries to do it is bad makes no sense just take out hook respawning again their was no Need of it anyway or make the wiggle timer shorter and give Bk unbreakable after the killer leaves the area of slugged person let's get real here the wiggle time is far too forgiving if killer makes a mistake 1 toolong to wiggle off u can legit travel more than half way across any map with some on your shoulder and along with the 20hook on ever map wayy to many
wiggle timer exists so the killer cant take you to basement every time. If the killer downed you to begin with you deserve to be hooked.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3783981#Comment_3783981
because all know how boring is play as soloq todayThen don't play soloq. It's the only way I've ever played survivor and while there are changes I'd make if I could, lots of people really enjoy it.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3783994#Comment_3783994
Usually we take a couple of weeks before we do a math thread again.
im not seeing how that disproves my point. if your definition of balanced is the killer losing/tying more matches than they win I dont know what to tell you.
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@theonryo123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3783983#Comment_3783983
why because killers couldn’t get a kill so all of our perks disabled at end game when killers get to have their end game perks? Make it make sense
The survivors finishing all the gens is intended to happen, on average, in most matches. If the desired kill rate is 60%, then the devs want the gens to complete in most matches resulting in a killer tie and 2 (close) escapes. Since the gates are meant to open in the majority of matches you cant say that its because the killer didnt get a kill; they probably did and the gates opened anyway. And they might've gotten another if survivor didnt run X perk back in the day so its good they dont work in endgame.
Edit: plus if we want to talk about unearned kills/escapes, by your logic hatch is dumb and should be removed. -
@sinkra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3783780#Comment_3783780
Is this a joke? For some reason many killer mains think 65% average kill rate is "more fair" than when it was closer to 50%, which is the definition of fair and balanced.
No, a 50% WIN rate would be fair and balanced. a 50% KILL rate does not accomplish this.
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@RickSanchez said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3783600#Comment_3783600
Theres no windup time to his ability, its just unreactable and instant, he can keep spamming his sight so he can zone u for free, he is not fun to play against at all, the best you can do is spread out and push gens
it does have a wind up its just faster than typical powers. Besides hes helpless if you break los.
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@theonryo123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3783697#Comment_3783697
it doesn’t matter because killers should earn a kill and not just given to them because they lost the game when they can’t stop survivors from doing 5 gens
Survivors should have to earn their escapes, not just get lucky with their perk.
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I always thought hitting P100 should unlock cool animations for using items and typical actions for that survivor with a red/red-adjacent focus. Like doing a gen has a red variant of the potential energy animation with some differences, the flashlight beam turns a more pinkish red color.
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@Ilikechips said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3782250#Comment_3782250
53% kill rates are a little killer sided.
65% means that killer is baby mode easy and survivor is a waste of time.
killrate =/= winrate. If the kill rate is 50%, then that means the killer (on average) kills 50% of the survivors in a match. If 50% of the survivors escape, that means the average match results in 2 survivor wins and a tie for the killer, meaning the killer getting a 3k/win is unlikely. With a 60% killrate, the average match still consists of 2 survivor escapes, but its a closer match that the killer could have won if they'd played better.
Essentially a 53% killrate would mean killers are underperforming and a 65% (though not nearly to the extent described) are overperforming by a small margin. -
Blight is fine, nurse should have stun-fatigue back+lightburn
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Have you perhaps heard of the control key?
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3782110#Comment_3782110
Run it and see for yourself, ok?
I would like this perk to be good, but it needs a bit more. If it gave 15 charges per gen, maybe then it would be decent.
I'm joking ;-;
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3782105#Comment_3782105
And makes you Broken. For the rest of the match.
Plus, ~2 years ago, you had this effect for free. At all times.
bbbbbbbut unfair!!!!
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3782026#Comment_3782026
No matter what perk you choose, there is always someone who says it's OP. Even stuff like the invocation.
Hey man weaving spiders does even more than seven BNP!!! Seven!!11!!1!!
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bro is complaining about lightweight ;-;
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@doobiedo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3781564#Comment_3781564
This is actually not true all considering I regularly see streamers with like 8000 hours using it. Like to see your gameplay where you're "uncatchable" just from using Windows. It should be basekit considering the insane amount of maps now.
If the reason you want basekit windows is because you dont know the maps, thats a skill issue.
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with the removal of hug tech his power no longer works at every loop unless you're just that guy. But its still one of the better anti loop powers at longer tiles like shack or some tall walls, plus great map mobility. If hug techs an exploit to be removed, they should also remove crouch tech too though.
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Yeah kinda tired of bad players with no map sense crutching the perk. Should be reworked to have a cooldown of maybe 20s but also buffed to show broken pallet locations within range even when off cooldown. That way WoO users actually need to get good and learn the maps, but soloQ players using it can still see where the broken pallets are.
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isnt self care meta in asian servers? Plenty of time is already getting spent off gens.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3780675#Comment_3780675
No player is entitled to a win. Both sides should have a chance at victory during every minute of the game. Killers have natural comeback mechanics. Survivors do not. That is a problem.
survivors have a built in coin flip to win if they get stomped, not seeing the 50/50 pity kill mechanic anywhere
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Reminder that he cant teleport if cant see you
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It depends on what your looking for. For strong meta perks, Zarina Kassir offers Off The Record as an amazing anti-tunnel perk, Jeff Johansen has Distortion to counter auras (however distortion is getting changed soon, could be gabrage in a few months. I'd say Feng Min is best ot buy if you've already got a grasp on pallet/vault locations and how to run them. She has Lithe (massive burst of speed after a fast vault once per chase), Alert (shows killer aura when they break a wall/pallet/gen), and Technician (A good perk for new players that miss skillchecks a lot). If you arent the best with pathing to tiles then I'd reccomend Kate Denson for Windows of Opportunity, which shows you the auras of all pallets and vault locations within 32m. Laurie strode has decisive strike for more anti tunnel if you'd like that.
edit: Otzdarva.com has a tier list of the best and worst perks on both sides. Hes also got a video on his youtube channel all about which survivors are best to get if you're interested. -
I'd prefer if they started grouping more maps together in realms so you can choose a variety of map but not the exact one. Kind of how greenville is in the garden of joy offering so now its a 50/50 chance instead of guaranteed GoJ. Then also add offerings banning realms. Maybe a total of 6ish realms? Hopefully with indoor/outdoor maps separate so billy can ban leri's.
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I'd personally like to see a more faithful adaptation, however the dedicated nemesis players out there dont deserve to lose their killer :(