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@CatnipLove said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3597114#Comment_3597114
I outran and hid from him the first two times I got exposed. The third time I went down, got hooked and the obsession changed. I got rescued and healed only for Chucky to get another hook and I became the obsession again and he exposed me. I just wish the obsession would swap between survivors instead of just afflicting the same survivor constantly.
The Obsession was switching between Survivors, it’s just that you proved difficult to catch so you remained as the Obsession.
The general use of this perk is to have a snowball effect especially when paired with Furtive Chase/Nemesis. The counter to this perk is for the Obsession to not get hooked constantly which you managed to achieve by escaping him twice.
I would say you managed to counter his build to some extent by not going down immediately and stalling out the Obsession change. You not being hooked constantly was the reason why the Obsession wasn’t constantly switching as well lol.
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@CatnipLove said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3597098#Comment_3597098
I just wish it would inflict itself on someone else. Getting exposed every time someone gets hooked is frustrating. The obsession should at least change so it doesn't hit the same survivor constantly until they are dead or the match is over. It's like Rancor but it lasts through the match.
The Obsession changes when the Killer hooks the Obsession. If the Killer hooks a non Obsession, the Expose and aura reveal on the Obsession happens.
If you wanted to not be the Obsession, you could take chase and get hooked to lose the Obsession status. So either the Killer deliberately chose not to go for the Obsession, or the Killer found someone else before they found you and chased them instead. Either way you didn’t get chased much let alone go down due to the Exposed status effect.
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@CatnipLove said:
Is the perk meant to expose only one survivor for the entire match? Everytime Chucky hooked someone I was exposed. It happend four times and it exposed nobody else. Please tell me it's a bug and BHVR didn't build a perk specifically to help killers tunnel.
It only exposes the Obsession for 20s if the Killer hooks a non Obsession. That means the Killer was chasing and hooking someone else multiple times if you got exposed 6 times, how is that tunneling?
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@egg_ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3596309#Comment_3596309
The term conspicuous action got introduced with 6.1.0, prior to that (patch 4.6) DS had a list of actions in its description that would tell what would disable it. "Conspicuous action" was introduced to include all of them, and opening the exit gate was added. This was so the term could be generalized for other perks too, and the endurance effect
https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Decisive_Strike#4.6.0
@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3596309#Comment_3596309
That's because 'Conspicuous actions' wasn't a term until 6.1, because until then, the only perk that worked with that feature was DS.
If you check the changelog for 4.6 for DS, you'll notice that it lists all conspic actions as things that disable DS.
6.1 only applied the label to these actions. DS had been deactivating with these conspic actions since 4.6.
EDIT: Also, from your earlier post:
Unless the wiki is not updated, Conspicuous actions that disable DS do not include body blocks or flashlight saves. If 5 second DS got reverted, that means a Survivor who just got unhooked could just bodyblock the unhooker, go down, get a free escape when picked up and have 5 seconds to make a getaway.
DS does nothing to protect from slugging. If they body block, don't pick them up. They'll waste their own time more than yours. If they try to go for flashlight saves, just don't pick them up and keep your focus on the person you were going for. Down the flashlighter or chase them off, then return to the person you were originally going to hook, just like you do with any flashlighter.
That makes sense, thanks for clearing up the confusion! I was under the impression that other actions that disabled DS was not implemented till 6.1.0.
@Firellius Slugging which is also complained about after tunneling and camping? So a Killer who plays nice and decides to go after the unhooker would potentially have to deal with an unhooked Survivor being annoying with bodyblocks/flashlight saves, down them and resume looking for the unhooker who would have probably have made some distance by then? Plus they can’t pick up the downed Survivor for a minute at the risk of a stun that people are calling for to be buffed from 3-5 seconds?
That doesn’t sound appealing to Killers who want to play nice.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3596276#Comment_3596276
This is incorrect. It got the Deactivation in Endgame and the 3 seconds in the same patch. The change with conspicious actions came before that and was well-appreciated.
According to here, Conspicuous Actions (CA) was first introduced in PTB 6.1.0, the 3s nerf and deactivation due to CA is mentioned in the same page too.
The DBD wiki here also indicates that the DS changes were all released together within the same patch. The Conspicuous Action page also indicates that the concept CA was implemented in 6.1.0.
I also looked at the previous patches, 6.0.X and there was no mention of Conspicuous Actions.
So if there was a patch that somehow got introduced between 6.1.0 PTB and 6.1.0 release patch which didn’t have the DS changes, please enlighten me on where I can find this information. Then we can talk about this period of time where DS was still 5 seconds and was deactivated by CA only.
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@BUFFDECISIVEPLS said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3596264#Comment_3596264
The old version of decisive strike after the conspicuous action Nerf never got any hate lol
DS got the Conspicuous Action change and 3s stun duration in the same patch.
What is this old version that you are referring to?
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3596218#Comment_3596218
The only complaint left with DS back then was that it should deactivate in Endgame. I dont really agree with that (because for some reasons Killers think they deserve a pity Kill once Endgame is reached), but it was an understandable complaint. There were not really any other things, since DS deactivated when progressing the game in any way.
The Nerf to 3 seconds just killed the Perk, because previously it was not good against the strong Killers, afterwards it was not good against any Killer. DS was one of the Perks which got nerfed heavily to remove them from the Meta and the Devs seem at least to have realized that it was the best Anti-Tunnel option (not a good one, but the best around).
@Topic:
IMO buffing it to 5 seconds and disabling the Killers power for a few more seconds would be fine. This would have less impact on the weaker Killers, but more impact on the strong Killers. A Trapper would not want to set a Trap anyway at this point, but a Nurse would instantly start blinking after the Survivor, rendering DS almost useless.
But I dont have high hopes for it. It would be nice if there would be something the Killer has to have in mind when trying to tunnel, because the current Anti-Tunnel features dont really provide this, since they all resolve around Endurance and one hit will disable all of them.
Unless the wiki is not updated, Conspicuous actions that disable DS do not include body blocks or flashlight saves. If 5 second DS got reverted, that means a Survivor who just got unhooked could just bodyblock the unhooker, go down, get a free escape when picked up and have 5 seconds to make a getaway.
Alternatively, they would loiter around the Killer chasing the unhooker and try to get a flashlight save. If they succeed, both Survivors get away, if the Survivor fails and goes down, DS lasts for 60 seconds so theres still a chance of the Killer picking them up and getting the escape.
If the idea of DS was supposed to dissuade the Killer from tunneling, then it should remain that way only. 3 second DS meant that Survivors could actually be punished if they tried to use it altruistically, which was part of the reason why the old version got so much hate.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3596236#Comment_3596236
No, most people would call DS a band-aid.
Killers really need to get over this 'survivors are only supposed to get one chance' mindset. Game's clearly built for them getting three.
Sadako and Devour Hope says hi.
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Doesn’t she have an iri addon that increases her base movement speed already? That’s why speedy hag is a thing
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Feels like the big changes from the “meta shake up” that 6.1.0 did are gradually being undone or scaled back.
Not sure if this will bode well or not.
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Dark Devotion seems kind of conflicting/redundant. If you hit and injure the Obsession, you would want to leave the Obsession so that you can benefit from the undetectable status effect. If you down an injured Obsession and get Dark devotion, wouldn’t hooking them give you Undetectable from Furtive chase already?
Perhaps a perk like Plaything/Hysteria or a chase perk for the 4th slot would be better.
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Either Grim Embrace needs to give a stronger reward or the prerequisites for it to activate needs to be made easier. If devs want to make a perk that encourages hooking everyone useful, the current iteration needs to be better
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After reading this thread, I would admit I’m a bit worried that they would go the Freddy route and nerf Sadako’s Condemned mechanic till the point that it’s not a concern. (Most people ignore Alarm clocks against Freddy in general)
Cage choosing to talk about Sadako when he was officially revealed to be in DBD has always made me suspect that the devs buffed her because Cage liked her and now that they have gotten enough sales from his DLC, she’s going down the nerf bin.
I feel that no matter which iteration of Sadako we get, as long as her Condemned mechanic allows her to bypass hook stages and get a Survivor out of the game, people will still complain about her because of the expectation of having 3 hook stages ergo 3 chances to survive (That’s why tunneling and camping are hated so much.) This is the sad reality that Sadako mains will have to accept :(
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Just give 10 s of Deja vu aura reading basekit after completing a gen.
If Survivors still 3 gen, it’s on them.
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This perk paired with Nemesis or Furtive Chase actually encourages going for different Survivors and pointing out where to find them.
Good perk.
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The proposed changes don’t feel good.
Unless the other perks that are proposed to be changed offer more slowdown to Killers, there’s even less incentive to play the weaker Killers
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I think removing global condemn is fine but they can’t just do that and call it a day.
One glaring issue with her pre rework was that barely anyone took tapes. So builds like Sea soaked + rickety pinwheel and walking around manifested as a pseudo stealth killer worked but it just made her a m1 walking killer.
16 m Condemned range is too small and I hope the proposed changes dont gut her totally.
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I don’t see the point of registering my phone number with a company just to play DBD. What would the company do with this sensitive information and what if it is leaked or sold for malicious purposes? Your suggestion will turn most casual players away for the sake of your “fair play”.
I’m guessing DBD would have to set up some sort of scan for programs like Nvidia to weed out people using Filters. Once again, this will be interpreted as an invasion of privacy no matter how you spin it, pushing more players away.
Is reducing the playerbase and potential revenue worth it for the sake of your “fair play”?
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It will not be received well.
Some Survivors think it’s unfair that they complete all the gens and everyone gets downed due to one misplay and no ed invalidating all their hard work.
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@dknb said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3593074#Comment_3593074
Suicide on hooks and DC are mild signs of ``no one wants to play Survivor.''
The reason is because of the killer's unpleasant tactics such as tunneling and slugging
I’ve seen Survivors suicide on hook because their team opted to rush gens over saving them.
I guess this is the Killer’s fault too?
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OP, if you just want to get to Iri one for the achievement.
Pick strong Killers with high mobility and use meta perks. Don’t use one shot Killers, Plague or Condemned Sadako.
Minimize your chase time. Killers with high mobility or strong anti loop excel at this.
Lobby shop. I assume you already know how to check hours so do it and dodge anyone that you think you might have trouble dealing with. Try to get solo queue groups so you will have a better time doing chases and spreading hooks. If you see multiple Survivors holding items in the lobby, dodge.
Identify which part of the map you want to play on and stick to it on large maps. Try to hook Survivors you down in your patrol zone so you can get trades more easily.
Tunnel and proxy camp if you need to. Remember to play for hooks especially in the higher grades but tunneling one person out should always be the priority. Pinhead with Original Pain addon is an excellent counter to anything that gives endurance. Use it as you see fit.
If you are comfortable at playing on certain maps and have the offerings for them, use them especially when trying to pip on Gold/Iri. The same goes for addons too.
Slugging for pressure is good if you get a down away from your patrol zone, no hook regression perk or the downed Survivor is not on death hook.
Lastly, losing games is not the end of the world, but try not to depip. If you run STBFL, use it to camp late game too. Getting those few hook trades will save your pips. If you don’t have a lot time to play DBD during every reset, you have to make each game count.
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Endgame/EGC needs to be toned up so that more people would run endgame builds.
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Yes
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Killer has to be made slightly attractive or there would be no games.
During the few months prior to 6.1.0, barely anyone was playing Killer. If the game ever falls back into that state again, then all the effort from 6.1.0 a year ago till now would have been a waste.
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@xEa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3591033#Comment_3591033
Just no. Why should this be acceptabel? Because it is meta right now? Because it is the way it is? There is 0 reason not to change that. Or is it your opinion that the most fun you can have on both sides is to play that way?
The ideal for this game is that killer is going for as many hooks as poosible without camping and tunneling. Would you disagree? If so, what is then more fun then many chases?
If the Survivors were less skilled than the Killer, then yes the game can be about chases and hooks instead of getting one person out early.
However the current iteration of dbd doesn’t allow for enough time to go for multiple hooks not incentivizes the Killer doing so. The longer 4 Survivors remain in the Trial, the lower the chances of the Killer making a comeback in general.
If Killers were forced to spread hooks in the current iteration of dbd before they could get a Survivor out of the game, the kill rate will definitely plummet. Low Killer gameplay satisfaction leads to fewer killers playing and 10 minute Survivor queues may make a comeback which no one wants.
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Until the devs implement Killer bots, the DC penalty is here to stay.
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The closer both sides are in terms of skill level, the more important eliminating one person from the game as soon as possible becomes as mistakes become more impactful on both sides.
If people support the idea that people of similar skill level should be matched with each other, then they also need to accept that focusing hook states on 1-2 people is much better than spreading them out among 4 people.
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Entitled Survivors, report them.
Some of them will kill themselves on hook just because they got hit first
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@ratcoffee said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3590398#Comment_3590398
CJ tech is good for the game though, it's fun for survivors and easy to outplay for killers
Doesn’t change the fact that it’s stupid tho. It is solely due to key mapping not being available for various interactions
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A timeline where Coal Tower didn’t make it.
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If they play other competitive games like Apex, OW etc, I wouldn’t recommend DBD
Because they will definitely come across someone telling them how they should play, not to improve their chances of winning, but to give everyone a fair chance to play the game. I never knew how bad gaslighting could be until I started playing dbd
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I don’t see an issue with giving Survivors free Kate. As long as they don’t complain about pallet density being insufficient on some maps because one person dropped 5 pallets in their first chase.
While tools to improve the gamplay experience for newcomers should be given, mistakes should still be punished and not be made less impactful on the match outcome
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Lack of qol like this is why dumb things like cj tech exist
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3590015#Comment_3590015
If you don't take chase at some point in the game when everybody else is on death hook then it is your fault, you should eventually find out about STBFL if you play properly.
The main issue with the STBFL is that in general by the time Survivors do realize that the Killer has this perk based on the weapon wipe animation, the Killer already has 6-8 stacks, which may make it too late for the Obsession to bodyblock etc to reduce the amount of stacks. Giving the Obsession the information that the Killer has this perk lets them make a choice:
1) To be altruistic and take as many hits as possible so that the Killer is unable to build up stacks quickly
2) Take advantage of this fact and engage in as little chases as possible. Selfish gameplay but at the very least the option to counter stbfl has been given to them.
@Nos37 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3590015#Comment_3590015
Sure, but only show the Obsession the perk after the killer has landed an M1 hit.
That’s fine. It beats going through the whole game wondering why the Killer was getting downs so quickly before realizing they had stbfl in the endgame screen.
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Rather than nerf numbers, I think informing the obsession that stbfl is in play makes more sense, what’s the point of increasing the stacks lost from hitting the Obsession when the Obsession in general will not know STBFL is in play because the Killer won’t be hitting them?
The change to STBFL could be giving the Obsession the status icon similar to dying light and dissolution on their screen. That way the Obsession knows that the Killer has STBFL and will most likely go after the other 3 players. So it is up to the obsession to make the altruistic plays like bodyblocking, rescuing from hook. More interactions with the Killer means a higher likelihood of reducing STBFL stacks.
Survivors are supposed to work as a team to escape, so give them sufficient information to do so. Since Survivors dont usually realize stbfl is in place until the Killer has 6-8 stacks, giving the Obsession this information would introduce the potential for counterplay.
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Dying light should be reworked. Maybe have an additional gen speed debuff when all survivors are hooked once. Remove the Obsession related debuffs. Given all the nerfs to regression, gen speed reduction (Pentimento, Scourge GOP, Dying Light) might be the alternative to slowing down gen progress.
Thanatophobia should be buffed back to pre nerf numbers to incentivize healing. Healing was supposed to be the slowdown to make up for the gen regression perk nerfs. This is where the Obsession healing bonus from Dying light could be implemented so that the Obsession would become the “medic” for faster heals as a counter to Thana, encouraging teamwork.
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@LazyClown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3587756#Comment_3587756
You didn't read the post, it is this way for protection for players that play this game legit. If a survivor is trying to avoid a tunneling killer then the game in it's vanilla state will force the killer have to focus as much as possible meaning that you could lose the survivor if you are not paying attention closely, then the music on top of the chase makes it even more harder to pay attention, this is protection for the survivor being tunneled. You use filters or reshade and file manipulation you are under minding that system which will make the trial one sided in your favor. If you are gaining an advantage over someone else you are cheating since DBD can easily become one sided depending on what happens in the trial. "I have no desire to strain my eyes". Absolutely disgusting.
Back then, I had a 3 man swf Claudette in dark cosmetics with No Mither who brought me to Dead Dawg, crouched in the grass and threw pebbles in the random spots of the map without doing gens. I went after the random who was doing gens and got him out of the game, but the 3 Claudettes refused to do gens and continued crouching in the grass. I eventually managed to find them after 20+ minutes because I was playing Nemesis and my zombies located them.
So tell me, if vanilla dbd was forced and Killers had to go up against builds like this, is this what DBD is supposed to be? No Chases, just crouching in grass and refusing to do the objective/interact with the Killer. Is this the type of game that would make DBD exciting and worth playing?
I beg to differ
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They could remove the kick requirement and just have it automatically proc when a gen is completed, Tinkerer but it procs after the gen is done.
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Apart from all the mockery of streamers not having chill matches anymore, the harder matches could also encourage some streamers to go for Kills over fresh hooks if they weren’t before.
Not sure if this will set a good precedent or not as it definitely doesnt encourage multiple hook gameplay
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Back when MFT was in PTB, people said that it was a weak perk and Lithe/SB would be better.
Fast forward a few months later, people are saying Lithe/SB will be better after MFT nerf
Ok sure
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They did. Remember that patch they did that made scratch marks more easier to see with screenshots in the patch notes?
The scratch marks are barely visible now
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@MaddieMage said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3589115#Comment_3589115
You admit in your post there is a counter in STBFL. Just because it may not have the strength that you want it to have does not equal no counter.
Time to define english words again I guess? A counter would be something that completely shuts down a specific play or perk like Lightborn. A survivor can drop 20 flashbangs and the Killer would still not get blinded. That is what counter means to me.
If Stbfl to you is a counter then sure go ahead and think that way. You are entitled to that.
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Lots of people have ptsd against SM. To the point that it could have been a SM without addons or perks on Red Forest with a wide gen spread and people would still complain.
SM lives rent free in a lot of places
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There is no proper counterplay to it. Against flashlights, a killer could equip lightborn. Against Aura reading perks, a Survivor could run Distortion or Calm Spirit against Ultimate Weapon.
Apart from STBFL with multiple stacks which lessens the impact of this combo, there is no counter to it.
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The game is not designed for 12 hooks against Survivors on a similar skill level. Arguing that this is possible is an insult to the Survivors’ skill level.
Playing Killer can demand constant focus especially against a sweaty/strong team. Streamers also have to read chat and interact with viewers so having chill matches would definitely make it easier. Scott is also thinking from a content creator perspective when he talks about preferring to face lower skilled opponents. If he keeps getting matched against sweaty players and loses or ends up ignoring his chat to focus, it can bring a negative vibe to the stream.
Ironically, 12 hook matches will only exist if the Killer has a higher skill level then the survivors. Playing without strategy or counting hook states isnt reliable in winning.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3588575#Comment_3588575
I don't know if they tweak'ed mmr but i highly doubt. But what is happens i think, casual players ( mostly survivors ) are leaving DbD since they have not fun anymore.
Like dying is fine but when you just lose and lose countless times, it's no longer fine anymore. Every match killer is tunnelling someone out and then getting their easy 4Ks. Solo and casual SWFs are not getting enough wins. It's really not surprising me to see BP bonus on survivor most times.
More casual leaves DbD = More sweaty survivors you will face. Nature of matchmaking.
If that is true, that means the average tunneling Killer will start losing to more sweaty players and eventually stop playing.
That will leave sweats with sweats.
Sounds like a good idea.
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@DrDucky said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3587763#Comment_3587763
They would never make it a bannable offense because as they have said in their previous posts, you cannot account for every niche scenario. Tunnelling is a part of the game and if a killer wants to do it no measures that you can put in will stop it.
That depends on the state of the game. If the game is about a chill, party game, they could give the tunneled Survivor no collision invulnerability until they perform a conspicuous action, it’s whether they want to. This would make things imbalanced from a competitive perspective tho, which leads back to competitive vs casual party game
@Archael said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3587763#Comment_3587763
despite of dbd being competetive or casual, tunneling is unhealthy
Tunneling is common in competitive dbd, if it anything it has been accepted as a necessary evil.
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Tunneling is a necessary evil
Just because you play chill, it doesn’t mean Survivors will play chill.