TieBreaker
TieBreaker
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@MSX_exe said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3680874#Comment_3680874
Sure it is, how dare I say anything against it
You think the perk is unfair, and they think it's fine. What's the problem?
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Stealth still has it's place in the game and can be the right choice in certain situations. But yes, it has become weaker over time. There's a lot more aura reading perks than there used to be, scream perks are more numerous (Ultimate Weapon being the best currently), and new maps are usually much brighter than the older ones.
I'm more than happy to have stealth players on the team, assuming they know how repair generators and are willing to go for unhooks and body block when necessary.
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What I would prefer is anti-tunnel tools that are extremely powerful early game, but weaker or just deactivated in late game. Tunneling someone out should be extremely difficult prior to two or three gens being completed, but easier after that point.
The game needs more things to limit the kind of one sided stomps that happen constantly. Will those sort of changes affect the game's balance? Sure. But then you just adjust things around that.
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I don't think anyone wants consistently easy matches. Sometimes it's nice to have an easy match inbetween all the sweaty ones, but in general, people want less one sided stomps, which happen more often than they should.
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3680556#Comment_3680556
The MMR gain/loss is calculated based on how likely the game thinks you would have won.
For faster queues it gives up accuracy so there's more likely huge skill differences in the lobby than if queues were longer than more accurate. Dying is likely not dropping your MMR as much as you think it is considering the main complaint is how unbalance the matchmaking is.
On top of that, lobby dodging is a big factor in mismatch matchmaking, because filling up an empty slot is even more loose in accuracy.
I can only guess based on the kinds of teammates that I get, but they are consistently weak. The amount of survivors I get matched with who have under a hundred hours is absurd.
Sometimes I just think that a lot of the more experienced survivors have stopped playing, so all that's left is inexperienced survivors. My experience in solo queue is so poor, so consistently, that it's sometimes hard to believe it's just the matchmaking screwing things up.
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3680542#Comment_3680542
This isn't fully true. They added in MMR adjustments that give you MMR for each survivor on the team that escapes.
Team Based Ratings
With escapes being the win condition for Survivors, dying heroically to save your team can feel a little anti-climactic. We’re introducing Team Based Ratings to remedy this. Your rating will adjust based on not only your own performance, but the team’s performance as well. Sacrificing yourself to save the team won’t be nearly as punishing.
But if the matchmaking fails then the most common result is that everyone dies. Those adjustments don't really have much impact in the majority of matches. Maybe it works in a match where one survivor can keep the killer busy long enough to power all the gens, but how often does that happen?
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Survivor MMR is just broken in general. The game has no idea how to determine if a survivor plays well or not. If you play well enough to get three iridescent emblems but die you lose MMR, and if you let your teammates die and escape your MMR goes up.
How can survivor matchmaking ever work under those conditions?
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@Slowpeach said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3678973#Comment_3678973
To be fair the survivor streak was done with comp restrictions which massively weakens survivor capabilities. To my knowledge this means only one of each item, the whole team can only use the same perk once, certain perk combinations addons and map offerings are banned. Someone can get the exact details if they like but the point is they were rules and restrictions placed upon them.
The Nurse and Blight streaks had no such rules upon them. Still though, it does prove that those killers are basically cheating within the rules. Such streaks just should not be possible. The game is designed in such a way that your luck should run out and things should eventually work against you.
It absolutely boggles my mind how these two have been so dominant since I started playing and have gotten only baby nerfs and some could argue those weren't even nerfs at all. Also just because two killers that can cheat within the rules can create these streaks does not mean the game is killer sided. It's been said before but the game is sided usually to whichever side is willing to optimize the broken state of this game more. Map offerings alone are hard evidence of that.
Nurse has had her kneecaps broken by BHVR several times. But she floats, so it never impacts her much.
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1947 wins.
1162 wins.
171 wins.
One of these doesn't look like the others lmao.
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Because it's easier. Just having a flat square with stuff dropped in the middle is easier to program than building complex terrain.
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@jesterkind said:
I think this is a little reductive when it comes to Trickster - there is skill expression in his kit from the killer side, aim and positioning are important to playing him well - but I would have a hard time arguing against the broad strokes of the topic for either killer.
In general I'm wary to invoke full on, ground-up reworks. I think that was a bad thing when it happened to Freddy and was only barely acceptable when it happened to Skull Merchant, I don't like the concept at all- but even with that in mind, Spirit especially really is kind of a nightmare.
I'm not sure how to fix the problem, but the problem definitely exists.
Also, my sincerest condolences on you having said the words "Skull Merchant" and thus guaranteeing half the responses are going to be blind incoherent rage.
The problem with Trickster's power is that sometimes there's just no counterplay. Unless you have a loop or cover that he can't hit over you're losing a health state. If you can't make it to a good loop with the burst you get from losing a health state, you're likely to go straight down as his main event is probably available at that point.
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@Nick said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677827#Comment_3677827
That sounds like projection though. Fun is subjective and who says theyre throwing a tantrum? You might be because you view a killer going for someone multiple times in a row as toxic. Which is fair enough, thats up to you, but you can't force them to play how you want. That would get very confusing because everyone likes something else
The easiest example would be classic Wraith from before the AFC was implemented. If you ran them for more than twenty seconds or so, they would throw the match and just stand there infront of you either smacking you on hook till you died or spamming the bell. If a player is willing to lose the match just so they can make one person's experience bad, I would consider that player to be tilted and throwing a tantrum with their subsequent actions.
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@Raccoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677868#Comment_3677868
From a different perspective, someone may need Lightborn to counter flashlights due to inexperience/limitations/etc, and may take a fast switch as their game being 'ruined.'
Someone else may be using a chill build as there are no items and get fast switched into 4 toolboxes and decide to tunnel from the get-go.
You can never know what people are thinking/why they do whatever, but they're free to think/act how they want within the confines of the game.
No sense in wondering why people do x...it's a video game, not a psychology course @_@
There are an infinite number of possibilities and reactions.
True. Trying to read into someone's behaviour is mostly pointless, especially in a computer game.
But we should limit how many free passes we give ourselves to behave in the worst way possible. People should at least take a brief moment to consider why someone might do something, before they let the ugly out. Refusing to do that is just self-centred and emotionally lazy.
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@supersonic853 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677840#Comment_3677840
I know his addons at least need a update. And maybe his tantrum time. 5 seconds is a bit long. And some of his addons like the iri or the extra token don't need a speed downside. Otherwise they arent really that bad.
I don't play Bubba, so I couldn't say what QoL buffs he might need. But I think they could make some of his add-ons basekit without sending him over the edge.
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@JeanGreyarea said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677868#Comment_3677868
I had made a thread the day before about “chemical trap and champion of light” stacking and i said i would try to use this combo. Killer brings lightborn then thats a perk slot wasted and an item wasted. Wasnt trying to bm the killer and anyone that watched the video can see i didnt flashlight click or tbag. I didnt even try to get its attention. Yeah maybe i should have used a different character to avoid p100 lobby dodging but claire is the one with all the flash lights
i get back then quick switching into a key was toxic because of old hatch
The problem is, that if someone has a bad attitude, it doesn't matter what you do. They will find something in your conduct that they will use to justify how they treat you. We all know that lobby dodging is an issue for many players. If the killer refuses to even consider that when seeing you switch out, then it's not on you, it's on them.
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677852#Comment_3677852
Nope, this is just the same gaslighting as comments like 'why you getting mad at me repeatedly pressing a (CTRL) key bro?'
Or 'it was just a friendly teabag, wasn't meant as BM' when it clearly was.
In my 4k hours since Jan 2019 I have played a lot of killer even if I am a survivor main myself and I have versed many a 6 second switching lobby and not one of them was a pleasant experience.
If you start off our initially neutral interaction with deception/BM, then YOU have set the tone of our future interactions and you cannot complain about that. You already destroyed any benefit of the doubt we started out with
Gaslighting? If you decide to interpret every action someone takes in the worst possible light and never consider possible reasons for why they might do it, then you are just giving yourself excuses to behave however you feel like.
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@Raccoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677852#Comment_3677852
Given the multitude of people in the thread that consider it BM, it seems that is the general consensus.
Personally, I'm alt-tabbed out until a match starts, most times, so it doesn't bother me.
Yeah, they consider it BM because they don't take a moment to consider why someone might be doing it. Everyone has a desire to let their negativity and aggro out and people will look for any excuse for it.
Example: Survivor brings flashlight - The survivor obviously wants to grief me for the entire match and make my experience miserable, so I'm going to make them miserable. Maybe they have a challenge? Nope. They're just toxic.
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677546#Comment_3677546
It really is that simple.
I am the least sweaty tunnelling/camping killer imaginable but for some reason the quick/6 second switch really pisses me off
It's really not. You've simply decided that if someone does this, you don't have to be nice and are free to be as toxic as you want to be.
Instead of seeing someone who wants to play their favourite survivor and is sick of getting dodged for it, you see someone who is toxic and deserving of mistreatment. Maybe if you gave the other person the benefit of the doubt, instead of just assuming the worst of their intentions, you wouldn't end up feeling pissed off.
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He's pretty difficult to balance. There are situations where he can cause more damage than any other killer in the roster, not to mention how good he is at camping hooks. You can't really give him any major buffs when his strengths are so strong. So you'd need to give him small QoL buffs or exchange some of his extreme strengths for other serious improvements.
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@TheSaltySaloon said:
And that’s saying something considering he’s not as overpowered as Nurse, Skull Merchant etc and there are other arguably more obnoxious killers like Wesker, but it’s something about wraith players that take him to a whole new level of insufferableness that’s amazing.
Wraiths know only a few things…
find one player and tunnel him off hook immediately then go on and do the same to the next survivor. BM you on hook as if they did anything clever. Or in the few instances where you literally just give up and let them down you, they’ll stare at you on the ground with the audacity in their eyes as if saying “why aren’t you playing the game?” Then leave you there as they continue for their 4K.
I have no shame in saying that unless I’m in a SWF I immediately just give up when I realize it’s a wraith.
What you're describing isn't Wraith, more the people that play him. Which is fair, he does seem to attract a lot of low skilled players with terrible attitudes.
@Nick said:
If you struggle looping a basic m1 I don't really understand why you dont hate pretty much all the killers? Its so easy to make a wraith lose if he's trying to tunnel 1 person.
Hit and run Wraiths on the other hand can be a real threat
Some people just don't like playing against people that exude toxicity from every pore on their body. I have more fun in a match where I lose against someone with a good attitude, than when I beat someone who's throwing a tantrum.
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@JeanGreyarea said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677321#Comment_3677321
Dang they bleed you out for nothing, yeah u think you can have fun in this game but the other side comes to ruin it lol
Contrary to what you might hear on the forums, not all killer players are saints that only behave like that when someone has wronged them. Some of them are just rotten. Just like survivors.
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@Akumakaji said:
I am not endorsing this kinda behaviour, but I have done it a couple of times to real mean bully squads, because I know that they were a team and were all waiting to get into the next game and my standard response in the EGC is always something "sorry, I thought you guys like bullying so much". But its a really douchebag move when done to regular survivors.
On the other hand, do you guys have any idea how much of MY time as a killer main has been wasted by survivors waiting at the exit gates with the sole purpose to rub in that they won and twerk mindlessly? Yeah, I could scare them out, but I would rather not face that humiliation and keep a small sliver of dignity after a crushing defeat. Bleeding out as the last survivor is nowhere as common as BMing the killer at the exit gates (I know that this is a bit whataboutissm, but its still a fact that killers get BMed way much more).
I am still advocating for a general perk called "Just Leave" that exposes survivors who stay in the exit gates area for too long and errect the blood warden barrier for them alone, until they move 42m away from the gates.
Also, there is this one corner case: the killer won fair and square, the survivor didn't play in any charming way to win over the killers heart, but even BMed them during the whole trial, but due to unlucky hook spawns the killer can't hook the survivor. The survivor could accept the L and not crawl into a comp corner and struggle ... but most won't, so in such cases, its bleedout for them.
This is one of the reasons that stuff like this will never get fixed. Players don't want to lose their ability to grief others, because they want that tool available for when they deem it appropriate.
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@JeanGreyarea said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677292#Comment_3677292
I did and they didnt get any better, tunneling artist, tunneling huntress with a mori, and then i did escape vs a deathslinger but he had lightborn too (ugghhhh) and he tunneled one of my teammates out. Just unfortunate l. Also that billy game was my first one of the day. Amazing start
Yeah, it sucks when you get matches like that right from the start. I hadn't played the game for a few days. Earlier I watched a funny moments compilation of the game, and decided to boot it up.
I played a solo match. One person yeeted themselves, two disconnected and the killer bled me out for the lulz. The desparity of what I saw in the video and what I experienced almost gave me whiplash. Sometimes your first match is bad enough to stop you playing a second.
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677295#Comment_3677295
I don't think so honestly it would stop some of the oppressive meta (obviously there will be a new meta but hopefully not as oppressive) I think this is really worth a try as a test for a month on the ptb.
It won't stop new survivors getting wiped out because they don't understand the game. It won't stop survivors getting singled out and tunneled. It might stop some players from leaving, but it won't help the game retain newer players, which it needs to do if it wants a thriving playerbase.
I (as someone who has like seven hundred hours on the game) would love a system like this. But it's not enough to bolster the playerbase.
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677278#Comment_3677278
Exactly and im saying this will help.
The only way this game could grow it's playerbase and retain them would be if the game was actually welcoming to new players.
This system could work in DBD, but it would not benefit newer or more casual players. Their experience would still be miserable.
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@JeanGreyarea said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677269#Comment_3677269
He clearly was mad at me about something since he hit me on the hook at the end. Im also p100 idk if that has to do with it as well?
It could be. Whilst there are plenty of chilled out killer players, there are some who genuinely despise survivor players. Absolutely anything will set them off.
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677260#Comment_3677260
Some left from that MMR made 90% leave. Like I said bad game mechanics because mmr incentivizes things like tunneling and gen rushing so you never gain skill. Have a skillful game and more people stay pretty simple concept.
This game has never been good at retaining players. It's just not built for casual players to have fun. It's not just the MMR system.
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@JeanGreyarea said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677248#Comment_3677248
Why tho? I get back then when people used to quick switch into keys, but i quick switched into a flashlight when they had Lightborn already. So what exactly is the problem?
People always have some sort of excuse for their lousy attitude.
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@Hexling said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3677253#Comment_3677253
Well the game had 100k people now has like 29 30 and thats from poor game mechanics. yes you can make games grow it happenes all the time.
The game brought in players with big licenses like Resident Evil. But once people realised what the gameplay loop is like they eventually left.
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You can't make the game grow beyond a certain point. Most players want to play survivor, and are stuck in solo queue. They'll have constant matches of teammates going 4% or disconnecting, or they'll get tunneled out by the killer, find it miserable and quit.
This game is only suited to people who want to spend hundreds of hours learning the game through trial and error, and dealing with the most miserable tactics along the way. In other words, this game is built for almost nobody.
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How do you make an accurate comparison between survivor and killer perks, when the two roles are completely different?
You might as well compare a two story house to a bag of oranges, and try to figure out which is better for an organ transplant.
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@AbsolutGrndZer0 said:
I mean we just got Maria from Silent Hill very recently in the grand scheme of how long it takes to develop things.
I think they've added most of the characters that people care about. Nobody's asking for the dude from Downpour, whatever his name is.
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@JeanGreyarea said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3675017#Comment_3675017
You act as if im asking for cosmetics for Quinten or something. I am aware that they cant do much for some licenses, but licenses like resident evil, silent hill and stranger things, they have a good relationship with those licenses holder and just dont do much with them
Something tells me that if they could pump out skins for popular licensed characters they would be doing it. BHVR has never been afraid of money.
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I was thinking about perk limits, but I was thinking of applying it slightly differently.
Give certain perk categories a limit to how much they can stack. This means you can buff weak perks that are bad on their own, but could be busted if they were stacked with other perks.
Examples (don't quote me on the numbers, I'm just making stuff up):
Self Healing can't exceed speeds of 120%.
Gen speeds can't exceed 150%.
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I'm sorry you are experiencing this kind of mistreatment. Whilst it's impossible to police tunneling, I hope BHVR is able to identify when people are saying bigoted things in the post game chat and doesn't hesitate to ban them. People like that should be purged from all forms of public life. May they all rot.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3674964#Comment_3674964
I believe it's important to consider whether our game design decisions inadvertently provide ammunition to transphobic individuals. While I don't believe bHVR intended for the cheerleader skins to perpetuate harmful stereotypes, it's crucial to acknowledge when a design crosses the line. I trust that bHVR wants what's best for their community, as they always have. It's essential to recognize when something comes too close to the line.
A constructive solution could involve issuing an apology, reaffirming commitment to inclusivity, offering refunds for the cheerleader skins, removing them from the game temporarily, and tasking the animation/art team with creating new, more inclusive versions. This approach may be costly, but it demonstrates a commitment to rectifying unintentional harm. I still believe that an Unknown cheerleader skin can be created, but it must be done in a way that avoids perpetuating harmful stereotypes.
I also agree wholeheartedly with the importance of our commitment to our community.
BHVR apologising would simply affirm what the bigots were saying. That these skins were akin to anti-trans stereotypes, which they are not. They've taken a monster that hides inside a person's skin and tranformed it into something bigoted. Again, you are giving ground to the bigots.
I haven't had the opportunity to ask my trans friends how they feel about this (I'm not even sure I want to, as they don't really like being essentialized by their trans status), but I'm certain that they would see those skins and just think they look cool.
Stand by trans people and remind them that you support them. But don't let bigots take something that is fine and turn it into something grotesque.
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@Spare_Them_Mori_Me said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3674665#Comment_3674665
I'm sure there's plenty of examples even on this forum that make you totally incorrect. I main Trapper and get 3-4k's plenty. I enjoy SWFS because I know they'll be keeping me on my toes most likely. Come at me.
I feel like people overstate how bad the low tier killers are. Being the worst doesn't necessarily mean they're unplayable.
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It's just a bad time right now. Survivors are messing around and trying things out, and killers are still sweating pretty hard. It's a bad combo, but it will pass.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3674639#Comment_3674639
You can go look at what is taking place on Twitter, I'm not posting them here, the mods would delete me. Its mainly a combination of claiming the Unknown is trans representation, claiming that at or in earshot transwomen community members and claiming those community members ARE those cheerleader skins. Its frankly horrid and its a matter of time before they pull worse things off.
The problem isn't with the Lore, the lore is fine, the problem is those skins look like transphobic caricatures, which makes them ripe tools for transphobic bullying. A similar problem to 'that Bubba Mask', but a different marginalized group in our society
I understand that it might seem like these issues are being blown out of proportion, but it's crucial to recognize that the impact of certain content can vary for different individuals. Video games are a shared space where people from various backgrounds come together to have fun and enjoy a hobby.
When content in games perpetuates stereotypes or mocks certain groups, even by accident, it can inadvertently contribute to a negative environment for those players. It's not about creating problems where none exist but rather fostering an inclusive and welcoming space for everyone.
Consider that some players may face discrimination and stereotyping in their daily lives, and the gaming community can either be a supportive escape or an additional source of distress. By addressing these concerns, we can work towards creating a more positive and inclusive gaming culture that respects the diverse experiences of its players.
There's no point in coating the world in bubble wrap. Bigots are going to bigot, regardless. No transphobe was waiting for these skins to be released so they could belittle and harrass trans women online. They were already doing it.
You don't beat bigots by retreating so they have more space to spread their hatred. You come together with others to rally behind those are being mistreated, show the bigots just how heavily outnumbered they are, and then you crush them.
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I understand the concern of having something that could be perceived as transphobic, in a global environment where transphobia is rampant, but this outfit is exactly what you would expect from a creature that hides inside of people's skin, both men and women.
I understand that negative experiences with certain issues can make a person see something and draw links between things that other people may not notice. I grew up in the 90's where people still believed some of the most disgusting lies that were spread about gay men. But this feels like a stretch. This feels less like something that is blatantly offensive, and more something that someone might see and worry some people will draw negative inferences. These kinds of people who make these kinds of inferences are not the kinds of people that are on the fence. Not having a creature that wears people's skins wearing a woman's skin will not stem the tide of transphobia.
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If the change to the boxes makes it so that Pig players find it harder to force head pops then great. Her kill rate will become more reflective of her actual strength as a killer, and she can be buffed as necessary. Even if she isn't that strong now, if the changes have normalised her, she can keep getting improved.
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High MMR SWF have an average escape rate of like 48%. How is that rigged in their favour?
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Every killer nerf ends up with players saying they're gonna tunnel now. As though the majority were not doing it already.
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He falls into the same category as Trickster. Not the strongest, but awful to play against, and sometimes you have zero counterplay and just die.
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Sounds like a Prey crossover.
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I just had a solo match against a Doctor, that hard tunneled the weakest player out (he wouldn't chase anyone that could loop for more than ten seconds). Then proceeded to patrol gens for the rest of the match. We managed to get two players out, but it took about half an hour to do.
Tunneling is the most anti-social way of playing the game. Targeting one survivor whilst ignoring everyone else, and forcing survivors into matches that last much longer than anyone wants to be there. I could have played three fun games in the time it took to get through that one awful match.
I really hope the DS change is strong enough to make what I described as a losing strategy. Bullying the weakest survivor out of the game and holding the remaining players in a thirty minute match, should not be a such an effective crutch for when your looping abilities are terrible.
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I'm not even sure what a Bully Squad is at this point. The term has been stretched so far that it's lost most of it's meaning.
It used to be full squads, that refused to progress the game and only griefed the killer. It then started to be used to describe any strong team of survivors, and now it also refers to duos with flashlights?
Your solution isn't just a nerf for traditional Bully Squads, it's a blanket nerf for anyone playing with friends.
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Seems like a good idea. Those perks aren't great.
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@fussy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3672265#Comment_3672265
You should be at least on the cover of Vogue and in Chanel and Dior ads with such prettiness!
To the OP's post: once against completely surprised of how underhated PH is. No one mentioned him, but he is easily most uninteractive killer in the game. I will deny your every movement and possible counterplay with just going behind you with 4,4. Never stops surprise me how low hated this killer is for how annoying he is.
I'm still waiting for that call back from L'Oreal.