Smoe
Smoe
About
- Username
- Smoe
- Joined
- Visits
- 0
- Last Active
- —
Comments
-
Personally not a fan of her inclusion, the inclusion of her IP just sticks out like a sore thumb to me and it kinda worries me about the direction it's gonna take the game going forward when it comes to future licenses and the long term consequences it's gonna have for the game's theme and identity, same way Nic Cage's inclusion worries me about more real life people potentially being added as themselves or worse, if it leads to the inclusion of content creators as characters.
Overall, would have preferred someone who is actually from a horror IP.
-
More gross and disgusting skins for killers.
-
I agree, do it bhvr.
-
@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3748004#Comment_3748004
That would fix the meta issue, but that's also specifically not what op said they wanted.
Doesn't change that the game mode would become stale after a while either.
Doesn't change that the game mode would become stale after a while either.
Well for one, that depends on who you ask as there are people who enjoyed Chaos Shuffle way more than the regular mode all the way through the limited time period it was available for and will most likely still enjoy it more than the regular mode. Secondly, the way to fix something from becoming stale is not only to add modifiers like Chaos Shuffle as a permanent aspect to the game, but in fact adding more than that as the more modes you have to choose from, the less likely something is to becoming stale.
-
@AmpersandUnderscore said:
I think the devs are going about it the right way to have limited time modes for these kinds of events. Even a popular one like chaos shuffle. Everything gets stale eventually.
The issue with it being a permanent game mode is that you'd still have a meta develop over time, and not in a healthy way. Even with random perks like CS does, what do you think happens when someone decides to make a new account and only unlock the 4 meta perks? The game can only give them perks they have unlocked, so the 'random' mode becomes identical to normal mode as people do that more. And it would actively punish people for progression.
Which can easily be fixed by allowing the game to assign people any perks in the game when playing Chaos Shuffle, regardless of whether they have unlocked a perk or not.
-
So play the regular mode instead?
-
bhvr should do their own original vampire if they are ever to do a second one, that way we can get Nosferatu as a skin.
-
I genuinely hope 7 never gets implemented, it carries way more cons than pros.
-
Because all RE characters with the exception of Claire and Jill look different from their trailer faces because bhvr don't have their actor's likeness rights.
-
Ditto, i hope they bring back Scamper for Hidey-Ho Mode too in some way or form.
-
@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
Knight
- Make him more simple, remove parts of his power, only make him kick stuff with guards or create long paths.
Singularity
- Auto-aim on biopods for your ease.
Hillbilly
- Less cooldowns on everything, more easily to curve
- Remove sky billy or secret spots
Trickster
- Walking fast as regular killer, spam your ability to get free event to get free minigun, repeat
Blight
- Remove techs/bugs to make him more simple
Chucky
- Remove degree flicks with Slice and Dice, remove scampper to make him more easy to play (and againts)
etc.
With each killer update, unless its simple number tweeks and QoL updates, each killer gets more brainded, more easy and more shallow to play. Is this a good thing tho? It sounds pretty scary to me. Some killers should be easy to play and pick up and we allready have plenty of those, but why are you devs trying to make hard killers with lot of going on braindead and easy and more boring for some players who like them allready?
Remove techs/bugs to make him more simple
You mean fixing unintended exploits that depending on how well Blight could utilize said exploits, could gain an unfair advantage over the other side.
To which i say is nothing but a good thing that it got fixed and that i only wish that it did so way sooner.
-
No.
-
Change every nighttime map except Nostromo into Daytime maps instead
-
@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3746351#Comment_3746351
It's not the most known horror game ever, that's true.
But I still think it has some potential to be interesting. Maybe once all of the 80s classics are already in the game.
It's not that it doesn't have potential, every IP got potential.
The main obstacle is the fact that IPs that are niche and cult requires more demand and show of interest from the community before BHVR would realistically consider pursuing it due to licenses needing to make enough economic return to cover for both the amount spent on obtaining the license of the IP itself, but also for making the in-game content related to the IP itself that's going to be sold as a dlc, something that niche or cult IPs pose a risk of not doing so unless there is enough of a desire from the community itself to see it added, so that it's inclusion proves worthwhile financially.
Even if we got all the iconic horror movie villains from the pre-2000 eras, it wouldn't change the likelihood of the IP coming in.
An example of niche/cult stuff that got into DBD would be Crypt TV, reason it got in was because there were alot of people asking for it's inclusion into the game, or at least enough to justify the IP's inclusion as skins, something that the owners of Crypt TV showed the amount of those requests they have received about it to BHVR in order to convince them.
-
The IP is rather niche, so i don't think it'll be anything more than just a cosmetic collection at best.
-
Castlevania is horror though, as it is officially categorized as gothic horror, so i don't think you can really use it as an example of something that's only horror theme'd.
It not being scary to you doesn't mean it isn't horror as scary is subjective.
-
Which is ironic, considering some of the people on twitter that complains about Gabriel's cosmetics and how they stick to his sci-fi theme are also the same people who at the same time are the first ones to start pissing and moaning about Vittorio's cosmetics and how they don't stick to his medieval theme.
-
Yeah sure why not.
-
@OrangeBear said:
For me it doesn't mute but it changes to the store music
Which is basically the same as no music, since you hear the same background ambience from the store as you do in the lobby or in the main menu if you turn the menu music option under the audio tab in options down to 0.
-
accuse our opponents of cheating regardless of whether they actually did or not.
-
@Queen_HawlSera said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3741541#Comment_3741541
nod
I hope Warner Bros. gets with the heckin' program and realizes giving Freddy more stuff for DBD can only be a net-win for everybody.
Heck I hope they're willing to lend out their other licenses, a DC Universe chapter with The Joker as a killer… Not sure who the survivor would be
"BATMAN!" I hear you shout, but Batman has good chances going hand-to-hand with Uber Jason, he's not running and hiding from the Joker.Considering that both Killer Klowns from Outer Space, Toxic Avenger & Friday the 13th have had some type of collaborative effort where they branch out to different things, it's not unrealistic to assume that the ANOES IP itself will have some type of similar thing going for it since nostalgia sells and companies loves money. However until then, what we have is what we're gonna get.
Also with the exception of specifically Solomon Grundy & Swamp Thing, i'm completely against any DC or Marvel chapters in general, as well as against characters like Homelander from The Boys
-
@Queen_HawlSera said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3741118#Comment_3741118
Why wouldn't Wes Craven's estate wanna play ball?
It's not Wes Craven's estate that wouldn't play ball, in fact they were looking for new outfits for freddy at one point as well as continuing the original movies, it's specifically Warner Bros that doesn't wanna play ball because they are notorious when it comes to lending their IPs out, as well as being stingy about it.
They are more willing to let companies under their own umbrella use their IPs than they are in allowing companies outside their umbrella in using their IPs.
-
@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3741186#Comment_3741186
scamper isn't removed. it is still his kit. it is poorly balanced. it is survivor skewed mechanic where previously it was extremely killer favored.
I know it isn't removed from his kit, i was specifically talking about it not being available during hidey-ho mode like it was previously.
It was killer favored before, i don't deny that, but it should still be available during hidey-ho in some way or form, not just during Slice & Dice.
I don't really care how it could be potentially changed to make it more fair, all that matters to me is that it's there and available no matter what during hidey-ho mode, even if it'll be less stronger than before.
-
@OrangeBear said:
I miss scamper too but i think it kinda had to be done. It got a lot of negative feedback and i don't see how scamper could be tuned so it's still useful for a killer but feels fair for a survivor. If you make it too long it would just be better to break the pallet. I think maybe killers vaulting pallets normally isn't something that can work. It has to be in the power like with legion and wesker.
Sadly though slice and dice scamper is terrible. If survivors know you are going to scamper a pallet, they will just stick close to the pallet and you can't hit them, then they will vault back over. When it comes to vaults if they just loop the vault you won't be able to hit them. I feel like the only scamper hits i've gotten is on players that didn't realise chucky can do it.
I have hope that with the upcoming change they are making to the slice and dice recharge, making it so the cooldown starts after it finishes rather than when it ends, they will then consider buffing scamper. Because i can see right now that making scamper good could be problematic with the cooldown because the power recharges whilst you are scampering.So put a cooldown on it so it can't be spammed or something idk, i just don't think outright removing scamper from hidey-ho is the right call no matter what, because i believe it's too important to chucky's identity as a character, to the same degree slice & dice is.
-
@Queen_HawlSera said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3740827#Comment_3740827
Apparently, New Line Cinema failed to understand that Dead By Daylight was a video game and mistook it for some movie tie-in merchandise. Because of this New Line Cinema kept saying it only made sense to promote the newest movie, and Englund wasn't in it, Behavior kept going back and forth and when NLC still didn't get it they went "Okay fine, we'll just take remake Freddy", fearing that it was this or nothing.
At least that's how I heard it.Basically, New Line (who went defunct in 2008 and was absorbed into one of Warner Bros' subsidiaries, so now it's Warner Bros that owns the IP) only uses Remake Freddy with video game related things, happened with both Mortal Kombat and Dead by Daylight so far.
With DBD specifically, bhvr were originally denied the IP, however Warner Bros changed their minds later and offered them the remake, when bhvr asked for the original, Warner Bros told them that they themselves weren't ready to offer that one and that the remake was all that they were willing to offer bhvr and that it was a take it or leave it offer.
Of course that was all 2 years prior to the Wes Craven estate re-obtaining the rights to the US Parr of the IP with Warner Bros still retaining the international part of the IP, so if BHVR hadn't obtained the IP prior and decided to do it now, chances are that they would be more unlikely to succeed in obtaining the IP.
-
@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3740833#Comment_3740833
Indeed, my personal opinion is that scamper is a unique part of Chucky's identity... and should be a big feature... however the old scamper was admittedly kinda cheap....
The problem is S&D is hard to aim accurately, and when you scamper your camera is pulled behind you... this makes it so your aim is pulled off your target, so you almost always miss.
I'm convinced free camera during slice&dice scamper would make it actually usable, with worthwhile skill expression…
EDIT: so that's the direction I would go, especially if old scamper can't be brought back, at least make s&d scamper good. Either way scamper should be a prominent part of his kit.
Scamper during Hidey-ho mode and Slice & Dice charge attack are both core parts of Chucky's character, definitely no question there.
However i will say this, if Scamper during S&D is to have free camera, it should only be for the first second of the charge, as being able to have free camera movement during slice & dice's entire duration would just make it too strong.
But mainly my focus is on scamper during hidey-ho since that's what's missing currently.
-
@UndeddJester said:
I'd be more happy to lose it... if scamper during slice and dice wasn't completely useless 95% of the time.
Like even people who thing the Chucky changes and greater cooldown are actually stronger... you have to admit you never see a high skill Chucky use Scamper.
So far, i haven't really seen the use of scamper during slice and dice much at all, most chucky players i've seen just use it to dash forward only similar to Hillbilly & Wesker.
Honestly, i'd rather have Scamper be more of a focus around stealth and mind gaming in general.
-
OG Freddy all the way, should have been him instead of remake Freddy.
-
@tippy2k2 said:
Him or Pinhead as it sounds like Pinhead was accidentally summoned to the realm and decided this was fun. His Mori also implies that he can leave whenever he wants as he can send survivors to The Labyrinth, he just chooses not to because there are plenty of victims for him. Not to mention The Leviathan that Pinhead can call for backup from...
Although the lore to The Dredge also implies he might be an Entity Level Threat as well. Like The Garden of Joy, there is way more to him than meets the eye.
A dark horse contender could be The Demodoggo. Obviously doggo himself isn't that powerful but The Mindflayer could arguably be part of that package.
We don't really know if Pinhead can actually leave the realm or not or if the Survivors actually gets sent to hell or not though, his voicelines are not enough to tell us since most of them are just mostly references to the first movie.
For all we know, Pinhead could be believing that he's sending Survivors to hell, but actually doesn't do so as The Entity always returns them to the campfire instead since it doesn't allow anyone to actually leave unless it desires so.
Edit: I'm actually pretty sure Pinhead can't leave because the box doesn't function as it normally would when used.
The Lament Configuration is the Cenobite's main way of creating a gateaway between Hell and wherever the box is located at. If the box is solved, then the gateaway opens and if it's reset, the gate closes and sends the Cenobites back, however because the box has clearly been tampered with by The Entity itself to disappear whenever it's interacted with (as in the trials and in Pinhead's lobby animation), it would essentially mean that that it can't be used to go back and unless Pinhead by some chances acquires a different means of creating a gateaway to Hell, both he and any Cenobite he summons from Hell is pretty much stuck in the realm indefinitely.
-
You can find more lore in the archive menu in-game, through unlocking the many lore entries locked behind challenges in the different tomes.
There is also the DBD Wiki, which have all lore related content freely available for anyone to access
Lore content creators also exist on youtube, i'd recommend the archivist vault on youtube as they have all base lores and tome lores which you can listen as audio books and allows you to form your own opinion on the lore. (I would also advice to avoid watching lore content creators such as pixel bush, who have shown repeatedly to let his bias affect the videos of his lore coverage or will straight up either lie or skip important bits in a lore, in order to make his narratives of said lore fit, while trying to present it as something factual.)
-
@VantablackPharaoh91 said:
That's fair enough, Smoe, but it seems like the Devs may have removed this on purpose, which is why I said it wasn't a bug.
It's possible, but given how the status of the thread is marked as ''under review'' and ''Not a bug'', there's a chance that it could be a bug.
Also there would be a mention of it being removed intentionally in an older patch somewhere if it wasn't a bug, so until some info is obtained on whether it is or not, it's a 50/50 atm.
-
his rework should always be front runner…
Yeah, i stopped reading after that.
Anything that brings old freddy back in any capacity is already a big fat no from me.
-
@Peanits said:
Hey folks, now that we've had some time to see it play out and think it over, I wanted to give a quick update. The current plan is to make some changes to Mage Hand in one of our upcoming minor patches.
We'll be slightly reducing Mage Hand's range to 14m (was 16m)EDIT: This one is no longer planned.- We're reverting the pallet lift time to 0.5s (was 0.35s) - this is the same as the PTB version.
We'll also be reworking the Ring of Telekenesis add-on (which currently causes Mage Hand to pick up pallets quicker) to have a different effect since this turned out to be a very risky number to mess with.
And lastly, as a quick reminder, we'll be fixing a bug which caused Mage Hand to continue picking up a pallet after it stuns you (the stun will correctly cancel Mage Hand), so combining it with Enduring will no longer be an issue.
Keep an eye out for patch notes in case anything changes.
Here's a better idea, how about we just don't do that?
-
@VantablackPharaoh91 said:
Confirmed, not a bug. This has been there forever.
And where is it confirmed to not be a bug?
Something that's been there a long time =/= not a bug, as some bugs have been in the game for a long time before.
-
@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3732662#Comment_3732662
Wait… That was a thing? When did they change that?
I can't recall specifically when, but i remember that it was roughly at some point in time betwen 2020 - 2021 as Killer perks were still visible in the end game screen before the match had ended during the 4 year anniversary, but not during the 5th.
-
Lore answer: Because all realms/maps are based on character's memories of places, which in turn is manifested in the realm by The Entity itself to the best of it's ability to interpret it, however it isn't capable of completely understanding it fully, so the result doesn't always come out accurately compared to what it's actually supposed to look like. What you see isn't the actual Nostromo itself, but the Entity's recreational attempt of the ship on a recreational attempt of LV-426.
Game answer: The chapter itself focuses almost exclusively on the first movie, all from lore, Xeno's add-ons, the chapter's banner, character base cosmetics and perks. So the Nostromo is going to be the pick for the map since it's the movie's main settings. Problem is however that having Nostromo as an indoor map wouldn't make for a good map due to how narrow and relatively small the ship's size is in terms of DBD maps, so instead they opted for a mix between outdoor and indoor as the final result.
-
It was made that way because back in the days when killer perks were visible at all times, swf Survivors would call out the Killer's perk to their friends who were still in the match.
-
From what i've seen, there seems to be a pretty sizable cosplayer part in the community, so chances are that there is going to be people who are interested in buying them.
Also question, what materials are the masks made out of and how do they look like from behind?
-
That DBD is the only game that exist where you can legally play as many different horror icon in an authentic way.
-
@Brutha said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3731426#Comment_3731426
Why does Pixel make you not want it? I'm newer to the community did he do something?
I think his gameplay/power rework ideas are awful, as well as how both his lore coverage videos and his takes on the lore overall are even worse.
-
@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3731420#Comment_3731420
Ofc you can, but not when you use normal cooking stuff… When you make some weird cannibal cooking thing it can be. But not when you take some ordinary ingredients, despite some people having a phobia for ordinary cooking ingredients…
The issue is that in both cases the word is meaningless… Because if basically everything is or can be horror then it is not descriptive anymore, the same goes for when you base it only on subjective thoughts about the topic the words loses its meaning.
Thematically it is horrifying, but it does not get projected onto the gameplay, which is what I was saying the entire time, the gameplay does not provide the theme that the lore and the visuals have … It does not feel like doom closing in on you because of the restrictions the gameplay provides. You're not running for your life, because A. thematically you will just get into the next trial even if you do in fact die or get sacrificed to the entity, so you're not running for your life in that sense. You could argue you run to avoid pain I guess.. B. The game just is not able to give that feeling during the chase, while all this might be thematically true it is not really conveyed through the gameplay… Because the chase just does not feel like I am getting hunted down by a powerfull monster, because most of the killers are severely restricted by the map which is why it feels like a goofy match of catch… The theme does not get translated in the gameplay.
I don't really think it would, but whatever ^^
The themes alone don't make the game a horror game, as stated before, its gameplay is what defines it.
Ofc you can, but not when you use normal cooking stuff… When you make some weird cannibal cooking thing it can be. But not when you take some ordinary ingredients, despite some people having a phobia for ordinary cooking ingredients…
That would still be considered horror for those people.
The issue is that in both cases the word is meaningless… Because if basically everything is or can be horror then it is not descriptive anymore, the same goes for when you base it only on subjective thoughts about the topic the words loses its meaning.
As if your definition on horror aren't already completely based on your own subjective thoughts and idea of what horror is.
Thematically it is horrifying, but it does not get projected onto the gameplay, which is what I was saying the entire time, the gameplay does not provide the theme that the lore and the visuals have … It does not feel like doom closing in on you because of the restrictions the gameplay provides.
Which i am going to disagree with every single time because i think that's completely wrong in what you're saying and that it does project and provide it's themes onto it's gameplay more than enough.
You're not running for your life, because A. thematically you will just get into the next trial even if you do in fact die or get sacrificed to the entity, so you're not running for your life in that sense. You could argue you run to avoid pain I guess..
Running to avoid excruciating pain is still enough of a reason for anyone to want to keep themselves safe from harm and temporary death.
B. The game just is not able to give that feeling during the chase, while all this might be thematically true it is not really conveyed through the gameplay… Because the chase just does not feel like I am getting hunted down by a powerfull monster, because most of the killers are severely restricted by the map which is why it feels like a goofy match of catch… The theme does not get translated in the gameplay.
Which i am going to (again) disagree with every single time because i think otherwise.
I don't really think it would, but whatever ^^
The themes alone don't make the game a horror game, as stated before, its gameplay is what defines it.
Which the gameplay does.
We're talking in circles at this point and none of us are going to change our minds on the matter, so i'm ending the conversation here since we're basically getting nowhere and i don't feel like dragging it out any further than it already is.
-
No.
-
No, i already don't want old freddy back in any way, fact that this is coming from pixel himself makes me not want it even more.
-
@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3731296#Comment_3731296
There are phobias for basically everything, if the only requirement for it being horror is that some people are afraid of it then cooking simulator is also a horror game because some of the ingredients might scare certain people that suffer from such a condition… That just makes this way too wide of a defnition.
People also feel competetive about single player games, just think about the dark souls no hit runs… I don't think it would last longer in total, but just in comparison to its runtime… When you play it again it will lose that aspect similarly fast, and I don't think it is different with any other game where you can become better and learn the stuff that otherwise might frighten you because they are unknown.
My point was that I don't think lore or themes are enough to make a game a horror game, and I don't think the aspects are visible enough in the gameplay for it to be considered a horror game, I don't think the lore, the themes and the characters matter too much when it comes to what a game truly is… I guess that just means that I don't think it is a horror game, others think it is and there is no correct opinion about whether it is or not.
A book does not have gameplay and lore divided, lets call it world building and plot for that aspect… plot is what the characters do and world building is the world around it… You could write a book, that plays in hungary, at the time of Dracula, and in this world Dracula truly exists but the plot does not care about that and it would not be a horror book for that reason, as it literally plays no other role than being there. When we look at that for dbd now then we have gameplay (the plot) that does not really have much of this horror aspect, as it is basically just a goofy game of catch, whereas the world around it might be a horror setting, but it does not really matter that much. And characters present does mean much either… I could write a comedy book about Dracula cooking dishes with garlic, would it be horror just because Dracula plays a role in it? Rather not…
I just don't feel the gameplay reflects its horror theme enough to call it a horror game, which is why I will say it has horror aspects, but it is not a horror game.
There are phobias for basically everything, if the only requirement for it being horror is that some people are afraid of it then cooking simulator is also a horror game because some of the ingredients might scare certain people that suffer from such a condition… That just makes this way too wide of a defnition.
Horror exist in the first place because of what people fear, some horror subgenres exist because some of them plays on fears that aren't as widespread as the more common ones.
You absolutely can make a cooking simulator into a horror game.
Horror is a wide definition of many different things people fears as the genre is incredibly broad, even just by the fact alone that you personally reject dbd as a horror game while naming other things as horror just proves that point.
My point was that I don't think lore or themes are enough to make a game a horror game, and I don't think the aspects are visible enough in the gameplay for it to be considered a horror game, I don't think the lore, the themes and the characters matter too much when it comes to what a game truly is… I guess that just means that I don't think it is a horror game, others think it is and there is no correct opinion about whether it is or not.
Which by your logic, only the things that people personally considers as horror are actually horror, while whatever everyone else think horror is within the genre who's opinion doesn't match out own is not horror, meaning nothing is objectively horror in the horror genre as a result.
Either horror is an objective thing used as a term that encompasses all things people considers horror regardless if other people don't find it scary themselves or horror is just completely subjective and changes depending on who you ask and no one else's opinion on horror that would go against their own is correct.
It can't be both.
A book does not have gameplay and lore divided, lets call it world building and plot for that aspect… plot is what the characters do and world building is the world around it… You could write a book, that plays in hungary, at the time of Dracula, and in this world Dracula truly exists but the plot does not care about that and it would not be a horror book for that reason, as it literally plays no other role than being there. When we look at that for dbd now then we have gameplay (the plot) that does not really have much of this horror aspect, as it is basically just a goofy game of catch, whereas the world around it might be a horror setting, but it does not really matter that much. And characters present does mean much either… I could write a comedy book about Dracula cooking dishes with garlic, would it be horror just because Dracula plays a role in it? Rather not…
Except the plot here is that Dracula is acknowledged as the main antagonist who is out to get you and hunts you down as a result, with you hearing spooky music as you hear your imminent doom closing in on you, running for your life from him in a life & death situation, which if he gets you will result in him having you painfully impaled and hung from a dirty meat hook for a spider god to come and eat your soul piece by piece, calling it a goofy game of catch does not change that all those things i've just mentioned is pretty damn horrifying things in of itself and saying it isn't just returns us to the point of you using horror as a subjective term.
Also yes, a comedy book about Dracula cooking dishes with garlic would still be horror, it would in fact fall into the comedy horror subgenre.
I just don't feel the gameplay reflects its horror theme enough to call it a horror game, which is why I will say it has horror aspects, but it is not a horror game.
And i believe it does as the elements, themes and actions found in the game are objectively horror as they are all something that's found in other horror related things outside of DBD, anything aside from that is just subjectivity.
-
They didn't start doing custom lobby music for Survivors until around the first Resident Evil crossover.
-
@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3730635#Comment_3730635
I said, AFAIK, that it isn't scary after x time and not therefore it's not horror anymore, but I don't see the horror elements besides the characters and themes...
Perhaps, but usually you don't have the creators intention openly aside from the plot, similar to when you do literature analysis, you can guess what he meant but you cannot know for sure if there is no indication in the text. People consume the medium and based on that have an opinion what the genre is, if the creator did a good job you will see his intention in the finished film/book, if not you won't and therefore it cannot be taken into account in my opinion.
Thats kind of ironic now, because if I tell you you're wrong that would kind of cement your verdict of me being always right and if I don't then I agree with it being true as well ^^ Puts me in the same spot regardless of what I do. Well I don't mind being wrong about stuff especially if it is for the benefit of the game. But oftentimes it seems like people don't argue along the points. When I start of by asking what is horror about the game except for character and moris I'm asking about specific elements and then I kind of expect that a counter argument leads by naming elements... For example the killer chasing his victim would be thematic to some degree... That's one point nobody mentioned and I would have to say yeah, sure that might fit. But usually what makes it horror is not that the play tag for 10 min without ever getting close, but the killer being relentless and always right behind and nothing seems to stop them, and that theme is just completely gone when the survivor knows how to play... The killer is still close by but the threat of getting caught is kind of gone, which reduces the theme as well.
You could say as well that horror is the fear of the unknown, which could carry the argument that when you have a few hundred hours in the game there is nothing unknown anymore and therefore this part also disappears.
What stays is the visual, audio design and perhaps the characters and themes. I just feel like that's not enough to make it a horror game... Because the gameplay does not really carry that whole concept. Similar to how modern shooters tend to have skill trees aka rpg elements you could say dbd is a game with horror elements but not necessarily a horror game.
I said, AFAIK, that it isn't scary after x time and not therefore it's not horror anymore, but I don't see the horror elements besides the characters and themes...
Even if you don't see the horror elements, those characters and themes are still a reflection of things found in the horror genre, along with all the other elements in the game.
Perhaps, but usually you don't have the creators intention openly aside from the plot, similar to when you do literature analysis, you can guess what he meant but you cannot know for sure if there is no indication in the text. People consume the medium and based on that have an opinion what the genre is, if the creator did a good job you will see his intention in the finished film/book, if not you won't and therefore it cannot be taken into account in my opinion.
I will meet you halfway on this, you're right that the content is in most cases are required to be consumed first in order to see the intention of the creator, unless it is specifically stated by the creator themselves beforehand on things like the first page of a book or on said book's cover.
However, it is not something that can be applied as easily to something like horror, because in order for something to be horror, someone needs to find it scary and because of that, horror as a whole is both determined by what people personally find scary/fear while also not being determined by what people don't find scary since someone else will find it scary/fear it instead. After all, horror is not just a genre only, it is a primal concept in of itself that have existed since humans have walked the earth, which also extends to certain animals too since they too can also feel fear.
Also because so many different types of horror subgenres exist, if means that even if you read some book or watch some movie that falls within one of those many subgenres and you don't find the theme of said subgenre scary, it is still considered horror as the subgenre exist in the first place because other people find it scary/feel fear from it.
Thats kind of ironic now, because if I tell you you're wrong that would kind of cement your verdict of me being always right and if I don't then I agree with it being true as well ^^ Puts me in the same spot regardless of what I do. Well I don't mind being wrong about stuff especially if it is for the benefit of the game. But oftentimes it seems like people don't argue along the points. When I start of by asking what is horror about the game except for character and moris I'm asking about specific elements and then I kind of expect that a counter argument leads by naming elements... For example the killer chasing his victim would be thematic to some degree... That's one point nobody mentioned and I would have to say yeah, sure that might fit. But usually what makes it horror is not that the play tag for 10 min without ever getting close, but the killer being relentless and always right behind and nothing seems to stop them, and that theme is just completely gone when the survivor knows how to play... The killer is still close by but the threat of getting caught is kind of gone, which reduces the theme as well.
The thing is, DBD is a pvp multiplayer game, which in of itself automatically means that it is bound to lose any semblance of fear much quicker compared to single player games, goes as well for other pvp horror game out there.
When you play a multiplayer game, people will try to master it and maximize how efficient they can play in order to increase their chances of winning. Had DBD been a PVE game instead where people play only as Survivors like in Outlast: Trials or Lethal Company, the feeling of fear from the game's horror would have persisted for longer as the competitive nature people get from a pvp game isn't there.
I don't think there are any examples that i could give you about the game that would satisfy you, however while you can say that the feeling of fear is gone for you, you can't really say that the theme itself is gone since it is objectively still there as part of the gameplay that reflects elements from the horror genre that it's imitating. That and because while you may not get the sense of it being scary or feeling like horror to you anymore, other people (again) will still feel said fear and their experience with it is just as valid as anyone else's and doesn't make what they think and experience any less horror.
You could say as well that horror is the fear of the unknown, which could carry the argument that when you have a few hundred hours in the game there is nothing unknown anymore and therefore this part also disappears.
Which returns us to the previous point that all things horror related stops being scary when any horror's unknown factor becomes known and have been re-experienced enough times that it just becomes trivialized and loses it's effect, it's something that applies to horror in all forms of any kinds of medias no matter what.
What stays is the visual, audio design and perhaps the characters and themes. I just feel like that's not enough to make it a horror game... Because the gameplay does not really carry that whole concept. Similar to how modern shooters tend to have skill trees aka rpg elements you could say dbd is a game with horror elements but not necessarily a horror game.
When you say ''not necessarily horror' and ''I just feel like that's not enough to make it a horror game...'', we're moving back to the previous point of horror and it's relation to what's scary, which i will repeat my previous point. Because scary is subjective, it doesn't make DBD not a horror game since there are people out there who would find the game scary instead and their fears and thoughts on horror is again, just as valid as anyone else's.
Also it kinda contradicts your previous argument "Books get categorized by their content not the intention the author had when writing them." (I know you wrote books, but other medias like video games and movies can be applied here too). DBD's content in all those areas you just mentioned from visuals, audio, characters and themes are all things found in the horror genre itself such as in elements from slasher movies like Friday the 13th, Texas Chainsaw Masacre, Halloween, etc. As well as other things like the game's lovecraftian themes inspired by the Lovecraft mytho or DBD's gameplay having clear influence from horror games like Alan Wake & Naughty Bear, therefore because the game's content and it's themes is both based on and reflects so much from the horror genre itself, the game by default would also fall within the horror genre regardless if you personally feel any fear from the game or not.
-
In terms of inevitable
- Friday the 13th because of the Jason Universe.
- Predator because we got Alien.
In terms of possible but not guaranteed because of the license holders have expressed interest public to collab or bhvr already have a relationship with them
- Outlast because devs on stream told people to ask bhvr for a collab instead of them.
- Terminator because Deathgarden had it.
- The Thing because it's owned by Universal, who also owns the majority of child's play and chucky
- Slenderman (Slender: The Arrival version) because Blue Isle Studio is open for a collab and have said that they have reached out to bhvr
- M3GAN because James Wan have in an interview stated that he wants to see Megan sprinting on all fours in DBD.
- Hack/Slash because the creator have openly stated he wants it.
- Terrifier (Don't need to say why with this one, i think most people know)
- Dark Deception because the creator have openly stated he wants it.
- Cry of Fear because creator originally have openly stated that if bhvr contacts him, he'll allow it.
- Bendy because the creator have openly stated he wants it.
- Dead Meat because James have openly stated he wants it if people wants it.
- Trevor Henderson because he have openly stated that he'd like to design skins for killers like Unknown and Dredge, also that he'd like to see Sirenhead in the game.
-
@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3730550#Comment_3730550
Well then it is debatable at least isn't it? Because some people are convinced it has nothing to do with horror, except the characters and the themes and others disagree. But surely it is not the intent that's relevant but what we actually got.
That is a weird thing to assume and a bit petty at that isn't it? ^^
Well then it is debatable at least isn't it? Because some people are convinced it has nothing to do with horror, except the characters and the themes and others disagree.
Does something stop being horror the moment it stops being scary? I would personally say no because scary is something that's highly subjective and changes based on who you asked.
If you play the same horror game or watch the same horror movie over and over again enough times, it will all stop being scary eventually simply because you know what to expect from it, it's something that's inevitable for all things horror.
I don't personally think most- if any at all horror games are scary, not even games like Silent Hill, Amnesia, Outlast, Alien Isolation, Resident Evil, Darkwood, etc. However that doesn't mean that they aren't still horror games, their horror haven't disappeared just because i don't find them scary, because neither my own personal opinion nor anyone else's dictate horror as a whole, since horror is a vast, universal concept (and genre) shared between all people that lives, and where one person might find something not scary, another person will. DBD is no different in that regard.
I feel that whenever someone says something is not horror anymore because it's not scary to them personally, it's essentially them saying that only the things which they themselves personally think is scary or closest to be perceived as scary is the only correct type of horror, which by default also means that they're as a consequence invalidating all other people and what they would personally would find scary from the horror genre and see as scary instead.
That is my stance on the matter.
But surely it is not the intent that's relevant but what we actually got.
If we're going by Brave Browser's AI search result, then the listed things below is what's used when sorting things like video games, movies and books into genres.
- Plot and setting
- Tone and style
- Target audience
- Themes and subject matter
- Creator’s intention
Which means that we're both correct, since it's all taken into account.
That is a weird thing to assume and a bit petty at that isn't it? ^^
Call it weird and petty if you will, but it is the general vibe i've gotten from you more often than not whenever i see you argue on the forum and it's something that tends to annoy me quickly whenever i see people be like that, or at least whenever i get the impression of it from people.
Of course, i could be completely wrong in what i'm saying since i don't really know you, but it's simply just the impression that i've gotten from you purely from personal experience and observation, feel free to tell me otherwise in case it ain't actually so.
-
@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3730508#Comment_3730508
Thats not it at all my man... I can write the worst book ever intending it to be a love story, but my intention does not turn it in one but its content does... Books get categorized by their content not the intention the author had when writing them.
The intent is completely meaningless if it does not show in the results...
That just sounds like a word that is so wide that it has lost its meaning and everything falls under its definition.
And yet despite that, DBD is still officially categorized as a horror game and the horror genre still have subgenres that are all different from each other, yet are all still considerd as valid parts of the horror genre and are categorized under it, or are you gonna tell me that's all wrong too because it doesn't conform to your way of thinking and your ''I can never be wrong'' mentality?
-
@Mandy said:
The patch notes are not out yet - the Dev Update gives the main points that's changing from the PTB to Live. Vecna passing through Survivors is a bug that was on the PTB and should be fixed when the update goes Live.
Speaking of patch note, can you confirm whether or not the Scamper change is getting reverted?