SidneysBane1996
SidneysBane1996
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3852043#Comment_3852043
Maybe, but I think the difference is that the Unknown's reveal mechanic isn't frustrating for the survivors, because it actually works.
It really, really doesn't in my experience.
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The problem isn't slugging. The problem is the rise of slugging because hooking is looking increasingly much less useful, feasible, and worth it.
If BHVR wants to fix this they need to implement hooks being a powerful thing for Killers, not a tool Survivors can use or prevent the Killer from using.
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I have a fix for you:
The Killer can now Mori ONE person on death hook per round, regardless of if they're the last one or not.There, now you can't slug for a 4k and you don't have to worry about this being a problem.
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I just think you shouldn't be able to have four people bring it. If everyone brings it and someone uses it, it should deactivate for anyone else who has it until A FRESH Survivor is hooked.
And, you should only be able to use it once per round, and not in the endgame.
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@Emeal said:
Killers dont slug for the fun of it,
I know at least 50 that do and would slug for the fun of it.
Out of how many of all the people in the game who play Killer? The game has millions of players. You know 50 jerks, not a majority.
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If they do this they have to weaken Invocations as a whole. I would rather the downside be even harsher and they still can't stack, but the effects of each be even stronger.
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@Oputeeva said:
Devs said they can't in Q&A because it will ruin luck offerings, some perks have to be changed like slippery meat
Then they should change the perks and make it so giving up is punishable. That's such a non-answer.
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It just means the queues are mostly balanced. If you're seeing high BP incentives you're seeing people not wanting to play that side as much.
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This is literally true of every single Killer. Once you know the counterplay they're pretty easy to deal with. The problem is people would rather have their hands held than learn counterplay.
Unknown suffers a similar issue to Ghostface because it uses the same Reveal mechanic - that being that the reveal mechanic is finicky at times. The difference between Unknown and Ghostface is that Unknown has to hit three times to down someone. Ghostie only has to hit once.
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Like it or not, the Devs have basically all but confirmed that not only is slugging not toxic, it's a-okay and intentional gameplay. If it was anything other than a-okay strategy intended by the game, they'd remove it. Like it or not, it's part of the game and here to stay.
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@Langweilig said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3850685#Comment_3850685
You just want it to go back to useless again
Of course they do, a lot of Survivors don't like it when they have nothing else to do besides gens but then get mad when ANYTHING ELSE prevents them from doing gens.
BHVR please don't listen to people calling for blanket nerfs. Decrease it to 12% and remove the token system instead. Then test out changes like this before release on PTBs in the future. Thanks. :)
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3851703#Comment_3851703
Lucky.
It was terrible, killers no longer bothered to really chase you, they just returned to gens constantly and it was always the same builds. Like I say, I quit playing for months until they fixed that ######### it was just so bad
We went from the gen kick Meta to the MFT meta. Sadly I started playing during that time.
I do not have kind words for people who want busted metas back. We just found a balance. We don't need more broken stuff.
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Maybe it's purposeful and they want more people to try Survivor?
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Because the Devs have all but said some tunnelling is a valid strategy, by refusing to remove it outright, giving us Killers good at it, and giving us perks to counter it. Time to let this go and accept someone focusing a weak link is strategic, not toxic, It's not 2017 anymore.
Anti-tunnel isn't a crutch, but using anti-tunnel aggressively against Killers that aren't even tunnelling is about as cringe as slapping four gen perks on against a team that clearly has no way to genrush you and are all absolute babies at the game.
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@TheSubstitute said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3851550#Comment_3851550
How does any of that relate to STB being a bad perk and your logic being flawed?
Objective opinion that "my logic is flawed" is objective.
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Doggo, if I as a Ghostface Main can make his jank-aah reveal system work for me enough to consistently winstreak with him, even against half decent teams, I am certain people can make Houndmaster's jank work.
Your opinion is an opinion. It's valid but just opinion.
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@TheSubstitute said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3851373#Comment_3851373
The problem with the logic in your first sentence is the perk is supposed to help against tunnelling. How many tunnellers do you see that don't also proxy camp and return to the hook as fast as possible? That's part of why this is such a bad perk. I don't know how BHVR defines tunnelling but the definition I use pretty much implies the Killer is also going to proxy camp by definition.
So, if a Survivor should be merked for using this when a Killer is near, and a tunnelling Killer will, by definition, by near, when is a Survivor supposed to use this perk and get enough value from it that it's actually worth running?
So use Babysitter, WGLF, or something else if you're this paranoid about preventing a strategy the devs said is valid gameplay, but don't expect the Killer to be happy with you and also it won't win you rounds against any Killer who spreads hooks.
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@Nazzzak said:
It's your build. Literally every killer is playing the same build, or similar variation, so I'm assuming they're over it. Their mistake though was loading up for a game in the first place, since their next game is likely to be the same sort of build. I'm currently not playing and haven't in a few days because of it. Better to not play than ragequit. Even the streamer I'm literally watching at the moment as I type this is against a ToTH hex build 🤣
I ain't been playing since 2v8 began (because it wasn't that good this time around let's all admit it), so I haven't seen this in action. I have no reason to use this myself as I don't use broken things. I certainly don't want to play against it.
See y'all for Bone Chill. uwu -
Not interested anymore, Yama. Bye.
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Head On is super annoying and super frustrating and has a lot of jank… but it's not OP and not broken. Just fix its hitbox, I should not be getting stunned coming around the side of the locker from Head On.
I think Blast Mine should probably have shorter duration or some kind of accessibility concerns addressed but it's not broken or OP either. It's fine, it's just annoying and I hate being hit by several in a row, which is why I never kick gens anymore and let perks do it for me. I'm not here to be your silly dance monkey you stun all round. Would genuinely rather be Head Onned.
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It's griefing and it's a temper tantrum.
Don't entertain it. Ignore it. They'll eventually leave when they realize they're only wasting their time.
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They're here because for the past seven years, the Devs have been so bad at addressing Killers and Killrates that the game was Survivor-sided for aboutn 5 years, borderline Surv-tilted for another two, and only just now is balancing out to more Killer-sided.
That's why these tiles are here,and it's stupid because they should have just addressed the issues that made the game a slog for Killers and gave a lot of Survivors an expectation that they deserve to win more than Killers do before having to DO this.
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@Rulebreaker said:
We're pretty much just joining the echo chamber of it doesn't do much if you're not hard tunneling someone out.
For what it's worth, it still has some value outside of this scenario (long as the user and rescuee aren't potatoes) but since it only moves hook states and announces itself with user, it's not a major difference. Someone will be closer to death no matter what.
Even if they are, it just means now two people each have one hookstage, and are both closer to death. I'd rather not have an extra hookstage and be more vulnerable if I can help it. It really is just meant for someone to bring it to protect a friend being tunnelled.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3850721#Comment_3850721
It doesn't though, at least not if the killer has more awareness than a brick.
The perk announces itself when used, so the killer can just switch targets and get someone out of the game early.
It also just switches the "strategy" from tunneling to hard camping, since the survivor who just took the hook state is literally a free kill and hook. I honestly don't think it's suddenly "too hard" for killers to figure this out, since camping and tunneling are literally the go-to (only) strategies some people understand in any capacity.
I think if you're stupid enough to not wait until the Killer is well out of range to go for a save when you have this perk, you kind of deserve the Killer coming back to the hook to merk your silly ass. XD You're EXPOSED, you SCREAM when you take the hook stage away, if you're really not planning ahead using this perk of course the Killer will use it to their advantage.
Some Killers also counter this perk by being fast or ranged. Nurse, Billy, Blight, Huntress, Slinger, and Xeno can all get back to hooks fast making this perk really not great to use against them. Stealth Killers are also dangerous too, someone like Ghostface, Pig, or a Tier I/stealth build Myers could be expecting you to do this and may be close to the hook banking up stalk, in crouch, etc. and waiting to slap you for a free Kill. Yes, you can loop them and run chase, but you still are Exposed and all it takes is you screwing up once. And even the best Survivor can screw up chase.
I really don't know who is seriously taking this perk besides four man "never hook me never catch me" SWFs who sabo and Boil Over and StB and stuff to mess with the Killer. I'm not playing for a bit right now, on a break, but it can't be that common a pick, right?
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Nerf it to 12% or nobody has any reason to use it, since it no longer gives BP. That or they have to rework it. Just reverting the buff makes no sense and will add it back to the useless pile; BHVR is trying to prevent perks from being in the useless pile.
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We cannot complain and/or ask for nerfs of everything just because Nurse using them is broken if she is good enough. Nurse herself is very strong used well, it's not really fair to hold every other Killer to that standard because she's an outlier.
We cannot, and should not, ask for nerfs of perks JUST because they are too strong on the three strongest Killers in the roster.
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p22 Ghostface Main here. I play commonly with Grim, Thrilling, an info perk and a rotator. That's it, that's all. I do not have a chase power. I do not run hardcore addons. I run Leather Sheath and another addon (used to be Matchbook but I don't need it anymore since his minor buff).
I still win 9/10 of my games. Yes, against "good Survivors" who know what they are doing and coordinate. Yes, against "good Survivors" on unfavorable maps for stealth/M1. Yes, against "good Survivors" who bring the strongest stuff in the book. How do I do it? I just know this Killer really well and know how to use him, on a good day I actually have to SLOW MYSELF so I don't skyrocket my MMR.
It's possible. You can win as Killer against Survs without playing too nasty (though admittedly Ghostie isn't THAT strong and sometimes I do need to play sorta nasty, just business nothing personal). If a High C to low B tier Killer can get decent results you can do it with anyone else. If you re struggling to catch people, that indicates you need to brush up on M1 chase, your power and how it can/can't help in chase, and your mindgaming. It's bread and butter for a reason, everyone needs to know how to do it to understand ANY Killer.
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Bro I can't help you, I only ever tunnel people with bigoted usernames and people who really annoy me. You have to REALLY annoy me. I don't target specific Survivors, and I don't think most Killer players do either.
However… I do noticed people who pick certain characters tend to play like jerks. Steves for example? Either chill af or jerks in a full fourstack SWF with the NASTIEST item and perk combos imaginable, no in between. Aces? Kinda jerks. Sables and Mikaelas? Complainers.
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Only if I don't like the perk.
Most of the big changes never affected me anyway because I dislike using anything too busted or broken. I didn't combo FTP+BU, I didn't use MFT, I didn't combo gen hold in the 3gen era, and I am not using TotH until it's fixed. I still win most of my games without needing that.
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@thefallenloser said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849780#Comment_3849780
Thanks for leaving a comment!
To elaborate on why I think that Thrilling and Furtive should be buffed in the ways I mentioned: I think the design of both these two perks is pretty healthy. Thrilling is an info perk that can also act as slowdown on gens not being actively worked on. That being said, the info this perk gives isn't entirely as reliable as a simple aura, even though it can get around aura blocking effects like Distortion. Dropping the cooldown on such a meh perk I think will allow it to get a bit more use even when downing and hooking many survivors quickly. And since Furtive is a hooking perk that encourages you to spread hooks by targeting only the Obsession, I think the effect could stand to be a bit more tangible and rewarding for how much the killer has to go out of their way to get any use outta this perk. Also, I feel like usually what happens is that when this perk activates, by the time I actually want to actively use the effect (especially on low mobility killers i.e. Ghostie himself) there's only like 5 seconds left haha.
And yeah, it feels really weird to be able to get snapped out of Night Shroud by a survivor on hook or downed across the map— and it feels really painful on more open maps like Autohaven and Coldwind.
I agree with all this and your rationale makes sense. I think it's time to just remove being revealed by hooked Survs altogether, but keep revealing by Downed Survs (prevents slug-camping). I myself really like Thrilling Tremors on all M1s, I pair it with other similar perks like Grim Embrace or Surge for extended gen hold and to also buy me time on slower Killers. I think all Ghostie's perks right now are healthy options that encourage good practices, and reward it by giving something sweet in return. I just think they'd be better picks if they did a little more. Killers want things that give them an edge over certain styles of Surv play.
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849974#Comment_3849974
I didn't say there was none, there is barely any, have you tried using it on there? it doesn't proc at all
Also I love how they flopped with teamwork perks, buffed them without the downside, no one still uses them.
The same would happen with this if broken was removed, I just have no idea why they think this is a great way to do perk design.
You can have power but lmao suffer.That's because Survivor is not the power role. They are not in any way supposed to have a lot of power. They can bring four of the same perk into one game; by necessity they have to be weaker perks.
It blows my mind in 2024 people still don't understand and accept this fact. The game isn't meant to be Survivor-sided or a Survivor power fantasy. The game as Survivor is where you try to survive. It's Dead by Daylight, not Get One Over on the Killer by Daylight.
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Information is the second strongest thing in the game anyone can have. Killer or Survivor. Unblockable info in the form of crows is strong. I DO think Broken shouldn't be the penalty for this though, it should probably be something like Oblivious/Blindness all round instead as a tradeoff for the fact you can ONLY see crow noise notifs now.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3850930#Comment_3850930
the perk is still possible to cleanse. cleansing every game shouldn't be a given every single game.
This is why TotH needs slight toning down, and then perks that can help against it should be buffed - so it has counterplay with perks, but is still meaningful and not TOO oppressive if you don't bring anti-hex. It's the same reason why Buckle the People got nerfed, CoH got nerfed, Pain Res got nerfed, and Grim-Pop-DMS got nerfed - because when used in some combos it's too strong, and if the other side didn't bring anything to help with it then it becomes too tough to handle.
Let Killers have things, yes - TotH needed the buff, 10% was silly and not useful and we need more hex defense perks to make hexes more viable. BUT it still shouldn't be what it is now… 12% should be OK but not 14%. -
@YamamuraVideoRentals said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3850512#Comment_3850512
Sorry? I was never part of that discussion. Don't act like I've been dodging or ignoring questions I haven't even been asked in the first place. Anyway…
I've said this in multiple places on other threads, but the REAL problem with totems is their placement. 90% of the time they're just out in the open, very easily visible as you are running across the map. 60% of the time, feels like they're RIGHT next to a gen. Can't tell you how many times I have ran a hex totem only to find it near a generator in plain sight.
THIS IS THE PROBLEM. We need better hiding spots for totems, and we need more of them.
Fiddling with the numbers on perks only does so much, but in this case, I'm afraid "toning down" is no good and the change needs to be utterly reverted. 28 seconds even feels like a bit too long, honestly. Because when you also run Face the Darkness, that still makes totems impossible to cleanse for those who are screaming. Even with resilience.
Buffing the counter perks isn't really a solution either because then that's basically bhvr admitting there is a problem, but instead of fixing that problem, they replace it with an even worse bandaid fix by buffing certain perks that help cleanse totems. Trust me, we do not want a meta arms race of impossible-to-cleanse totems followed by perks that make cleansing totems super fast. Because then if you're running any sort of hex build, also running Thrill of the Hunt becomes mandatory, otherwise your totems get destroyed in 5 seconds by people who came with those counter perks.
Remember, this is why hex builds are so often coupled with Hex: Undying. Because "RNG" is usually so bad that hex totems get found within the first 30 seconds of the match.
Instead, completely revert the slowdown change. If you're actually interested, I've written a topic about how the devs could tweak Thrill of the Hunt and add another interesting effect here.
Friend that's a lot of words, and I'm not sure why you're so angry at me for responding to you responding to someone else who asked you to answer a question. I didn't even come at you angrily or with any amount of aggression.
Now I'M confused.
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@PetTheDoggo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3850511#Comment_3850511
I'm sure plenty of people are fine with Houndmaster
are those people in room with us?
There are killers that are definetly not console friendly, or hard to control. But she is simply buggy and her power unreliable.Rulebreaker above us appears to be one of said "people in the room with us". :)
Your opinion is she's bad because bugs, your opinion is also objective because it's clear people play her DESPITE the bugs, people like her DESPITE the bugs. I'm more than certain that most of the type of people fine with Houndmaster are not on forums like these debating how good or bad she is, or worrying at ALL where she lies on a random tierlist some Youtuber made. And the ones that are, don't care about tierlists and strength anyway - they still are playing her. Like Rulebreaker, apparently.
Instead of worrying what others may or may not think and why they're OBVIOUSLY wrong (in your opinion), just don't play her if she's bad for you. After all people play Ghostface and he's also buggy. And HIS strength level is just s debatable, some people call him low B and others call him D. Houndmaster is in the same boat. I've heard everything from B to C to D and even someone calling her an A tier (which I think we both know is ludicrous).
Outside of the bugs? I think she's about a low B high C. Fix the bugs and that's where she's at IMHO. She's seeing play, so obviously not EVERYONE finds her "miserable to play as".You are welcome to disagree with me, but please do not act dismissive with the whole "is this in the room right now" comment again, it's rude and not necessary to this discussion.
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I agree being able to stockpile addons and items can be problematic sometimes but like… what's wrong with people having p100s?
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Honestly the one issue we have with gen repair speeds isn't perks or Surv repair speed.
It's toolboxes, which stack with perks and repair speed. A green toolbox, which is pretty common and which is copied for the anniversary items (which people stockpile), can go pretty fast with the right charges and pushing.
Nobody actually uses toolboxes to sabo, that change to make people ise them for that didn't work. People use toolboxes to push gens. Pushing gens with a bunch of things that stack on top of toolbox repair speeds is the issue here.
So, just nerf toolbox repair speeds, or make toolboxes NOT stack with perks, and we're good. :)
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Last time CoH was strong it created a miserable heal meta.
No. You can argue for the other boon perks but NOT CoH. Do not buff CoH.
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849765#Comment_3849765
This is a strong perk already. It doesn't need a buff.
Yep. The worst perk in the game, is strong. Are we even playing the same game?
Info is power. Info is stronger on Survivor against most Killers than you think.
Unblockable info. Unblockable info the Killer can't avoid.
That's hardly "the worst perk in the game", please stop trying to lowkey insult my intellect.
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@YamamuraVideoRentals said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3848804#Comment_3848804
This isn't just "anything new", this is a spike in power that is absolutely busted and extremely abusable with certain killer powers, perks, and addons.
I agree, but why can't we tone down TotH while also buffing some of the counterperks? You never answered that.
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@PetTheDoggo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849768#Comment_3849768
But no killer should be miserable to play with.
That's extremely objective, I find Wesker miserable to control on a controller but plenty of people love him and find his controls great. I find Huntress intolerably sluggish but lots of people love Huntress. I find Pinhead isn't that hard on controller but many people find him intolerable on controller.
I'm sure plenty of people are fine with Houndmaster, despite her bugs. You're just not one of them, and that's okay. Nobody's making you play her. I do hope her bugs get fixed though.
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@vBlossom_ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849220#Comment_3849220
no, Thrill should be nerfed back to 10% and 12% should be tested in next PTB.
Literally what is the point of Player Test Build??
And what would be the issue with adjusting it down to 12% instead of nerfing it back to uselessness at 10%? The point was to buff the perk, the issue is they buffed it too much.
I agree it needs a fix, but damn. Let Killers have things.
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Oh does the Bone Chill event start now? Or next week?
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@Mandy said:
Hi all! We will have our normal cadence of hotfixes - slightly different time frame, but you can definitely expect 2 prior to the holiday break. There will be adjustments to Houndmaster as well as to the Live Balance changes from PTB (as explained in the Developer Update, these were released the same way they were in PTB), there will also be a lot of bug fixes that you can expect. Not all that we're finding now will make it for the first hotfix as time is always a constraint, but we're aiming to get as many in as is humanly possible.
We do appreciate your patience, we understand very well how frustrating it is waiting for these changes <3
Thanks for all your hard work. Along with these can we also maybe expect a slight toning down of Hex: TotH, a look at how StB can be a bit too strong, and maybe some further Ghostface reveal/lean adjustments pwease? 🙏
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TOTH is slightly overtuned and makes hex builds too strong right now. It's not the Ghostface Buffs, it's the hex builds buffs.
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See this is the hypocrisy. Some players believe that Killers should be forced to play a whole game out, but when they have to do the same, they end themselves on hook. It's crap whoever does it, it shouldn't be possible.
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These all seem really good for Ghostface. I have said for a long time Chewed Pen and Lasting Perfume need reworks, because they encourage bad play. Your suggestions are great!
I like the idea of making Thrilling a bit stronger, it's good info and not terribly strong gen hold. This would bring it in line with others. I also like that Furtive Chase rework, it encourages spreading hooks and gives a benefit for doing so. 5% haste for 30 seconds may be a little much, but it's understandable.
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StB is maybe a little strong and could use a timer, maybe longer Exposed. I don't like this trend of punishing hooks by turning them into an advantage for Survivors to abuse and use as they want.
At the least show Killers hookstages if you're going to mess with hookstages like this.
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Smurf, stop pinging me, I know I can't convince you and you won't convince me. I don't want to argue. I stopped quoting you for a reason, because I do not want to argue.
This change won't get reverted because this is what the Devs want for the game, regardless of what the players want. They always intended to have this. It's not going away, I'm sorry.
Now kindly stop quoting me. I don't want to have to ask again, please.