RpTheHotrod
RpTheHotrod
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@justadreampallet said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3807432#Comment_3807432
I’m going to try that style as soon as I can
It's a lot of fun, but sometimes you have to be a bit more aggressive - especially with bully squads.
Here's a general way to play ghostie with his power without just running around doing chase-builds if dealing with bodyblock flashlight SWF squads. Made a few mistakes due to having covid at the time, but the general concepts remain.
https://youtu.be/8zVrpuZrlBM -
@justadreampallet said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806963#Comment_3806963
that makes a lot more sense now that you brought up how he was intended. I’m used to seeing people play chase ghostface.
Yup. Here's a prime example
https://youtu.be/jXOm9vKSGnA -
@tippy2k2 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806957#Comment_3806957
I've tried having my camera centered all over the place because I've heard that same exact thing (your character model "blocks" the camera from seeing GF so you need to have it in the top 1/3 of the screen so you're not in the way). Never seems to work and we just have a staring contest that ends up with me losing every time :D
Hmm, never had any issues. I know it can be connection related.
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806963#Comment_3806963
I think there would be a point to be made if his reveal mechanic worked properly, but it doesn't.
It works for survivors if you know where to place him on your screen (see my comment above where I posted a picture). However, it REALLY sucks as ghostie, as survivors are allowed to reveal you through walls and even if facing the entirely opposite direction. For example, 10 seconds into here, I'm able to reveal ghostface when he's entirely behind me and not even on-screen.
https://youtu.be/tBjdJ31Cgwk?si=7dNpr8WWYV02UzU- -
@justadreampallet said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806809#Comment_3806809
I say 99 should deteriorate after a bit. The devs want you to get a stalk to 90 something before getting in close, revealing them, then jump out. But 99 chase builds are kind of like Myers’s and removes the fun parts of him.
@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806816#Comment_3806816
I say 99 should deteriorate after a bit.
I agree.
He's already a very weak killer. As a survivor, your job is to deny him stalking you or force him into dumping his stalk by taking protective hits and such. He keeps his distance and stalks you over time. That's his whole schtick. If that deteriorated, then he may as well not exist as a killer, consider that he stalks, then has to approach to ambush, and womp womp, his stalk meter deteriorated. While most killers rush in and go straight for chases, ghostie has to prep his ambushes and chases (unless he's just playing basic m1 style and may as well be playing trapper or wraith at that point). The stalk meter deteriorating would essentially punish him for using his own unique mechanic. He has zero chase power, so he's entirely reliant on successfully stalking someone to 99 and saving them for a later ambush…assuming you're wanting to actually use his power. Stalking someone up in their face only works against new players who don't have any situational awareness.
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@tippy2k2 said:
Not gonna lie fam…
I HATE with a Capital H A T E going up against GhostfaceI have no idea if it's a SKILL ISSUE or what but I swear I can't reveal him if I'm staring him right in the whites of his mask. Unless of course I'm playing as him, in which case survivors can reveal me if all they can see is the sash of my stylish killing robe…
Then he also has the mechanic that I legit can't stand for him; 99%ing
It makes zero sense to me mechanically and thematically why he can 99% people. He's not stalking me if all he has to do is look at me in the middle of an open area to put me into exposed and it feels incredibly cheap and unfair as there is literally nothing you can do about it.
So yeah, not a fan. I'll play against him when I have to but I don't like to.
Make sure you're actually revealing him correctly. He needs to be centered in the halfway point between the middle of your screen and the top of the screen. You DO NOT want him centered in the middle of your screen. If the middle of the screen is 50, and the top of the screen is 100, you want him at 75. He's incredibly easy to reveal, but most don't realize exactly where his reveal sweet spot actually is and assume he's broken. In their defense, the game absolutely does NOT tell you this sweet spot location.
Imagine the black box is your screen. The green box is where to put ghostie in your vision:
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@Marc_go_solo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806539#Comment_3806539
I voted anti-cheat as my main choice of focus for BHVR. There were other options I also liked, but defense is the best way to start, so a more robust anti-cheat system to make games more enjoyable to start with would set a nice base to work from.
There'll always be catch-up against hackers, but swifter responses, and more proactive anti-cheat system, makes it much harder for them.
Yup! I probably have to report at minimum 2 people a day (with video evidence) - it's pretty ridiculous how many people you see sliding across the ground prone while traveling 10x faster than the killer. That, or people literally phasing through pallets.
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Appreciate the update.
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@PuddleOfBludd said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806534#Comment_3806534
that makes sense. I cannot confirm if they were hooked on a scourge hook prior. I am still a little baffled about the insane amount of regression, which seems to be a bit more than 15%. But I’ll just have to look at that a few more times and gauge it
Could be regression stacking like surge for the down followed by a PR hit. There's various ways a gen can get regression dumped, though it's harder to do these days.
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There's a load of cheaters (mainly due to the free DBD on Epic blunder), but the good news is in the latest poll, one of the options is if you feel anti-cheat is more important than other things to focus on in the game. Hopefully we get a lot of people voting for better anti-cheat.
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It's first hook on a scourge hook. The killer can hook them on non-scourge hooks and it won't trigger PR. For example, if the killer hooks a survivor two times in a row on a normal hook, nothing happens. For the third and final hook, if he hooks them on a scourge hook, since it's their first hook on a scourge hook, then PR would trigger.
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Every update, BHVR continues to add more and more gen rushing perks. Every survivor pack that comes out comes with SOME sort of gen speed boost. Just recently, they also added 10 more seconds to hook states, so that's an extra 10 seconds survivors can be slamming gens out without having to go for a rescue. Essentially, gen speeds are so insanely fast that gen regression is mandatory at higher MMR to stand any kind of chance at winning (ESPECIALLY for m1 killers without map traversal abilities). The reason those specific perks are used over other gen regression perks is because BHVR has nerfed the majority of them into oblivion (such as call of brine).
A lot of killers are even under the intended 60% kill rate (bear in mind, a 50% kill rate is only a 2K. A 3K is a 75% kill rate in a match. A 62.5% kill rate would be on average getting a 2.5K per match on average), so 60% means they win just under half their matches on average). Considering a lot of killers are well under 60%, they are struggling to win on average which is pushing gen regression even harder as mandatory.
Heck, this PTB update literally just gives all survivors free gen speed just for someone taking chase, and now you don't even need to bother to even hit skill checks - missing them becomes great successes.
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@MindGame3301 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806036#Comment_3806036
Hag is similar. They play traps for power and killer power is like learning to use a knight or bishop. They are stronger pieces in many cases but wont get you far if you don't understand their movements/placement strategy.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806055#Comment_3806055
Good looper would have to be the queen, four queens in that scenario are gonna need a queen for a killer. I like the analogy for the pieces being a play style tier list.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806045#Comment_3806045
Is that also a chess opening? a lot of thinking ahead is required for killer.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3806043#Comment_3806043
Yea explaining that it really does, awesome analogy. I find im learning more about game with all these analogies :D
En Passant is a rule that not too many realize is in the game. It's where if the opponent double-moves their pawn from their initial starting space and it lands next to one of your pawns, you can capture by placing your pawn behind the opponent's pawn and essentially "backstabbing" the pawn. It's essentially treating the opponent's pawn as if it only moved one square instead of two. It's the only time in Chess that a pawn can attack another piece without moving into that piece's square. En Passant translates to "in passing".
https://www.chess.com/terms/en-passant
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En Passant is the equivalent of Ghostie 99'ing a survivor and letting them go. He may not go directly for them, but he'll ambush them from behind and down them where they'll least expect it.
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3801700#Comment_3801700
I don't think games with zero mistakes exist. No one plays perfectly. There's also alot of RNG and other variables at play in a match. So I personally don't put much stock into "zero mistake" hypotheticals.
High MMR is, in my personal opinion, an anything goes bracket. The people in that bracket are there because they use the best perks, items, add ons, and probably every dirty trick in the book. If that means having to use Nurse or Blight, then so be it. Their opponent will likely come at them with the same energy they are bringing. If they can't compete then they shouldn't be there, or the simplest answer is they aren't in that bracket and matchmaking has failed them. I am happy to never enter that bracket for as long as I play, but I don't understand why it gets brought up so much on this forum tbh. Most of us aren't there and never will be there.
I agree that perfect plays throughout isn't feasible. My point was that when it comes to which "side" has the most power over the other, the survivors winning or failing almost entirely falls into them making mistakes. Survivors have every tool available to them to always succeed over the killer. It's shortcomings that cause failure states. A killer, on the other hand, can play absolutely perfectly in theory but still lose.
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@Nazzzak said:
The better players should always win. That's how games should work. If one side steam rolls the other however then it's more evidence that the matchmaking system isn't working. I've had countless games end at 4k with 0 gens done. On the flipside, I've had games where all gens get done and the killer has only 1 or 2 hooks. Both are a failure of matchmaking.
The problem here is that survivor teams who make no mistakes will pretty much always win. Killers who make no mistakes can still lose. At highest skill levels, it's about killers having to take advantage of survivor's making bad plays. If they aren't, then unless the killer is playing nurse\blight, it's over before it begins.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3800327#Comment_3800327
There are multiple people trying to boil it down to 4 1v1s but that is not at all how the game is played. This is 100% a team game. Almost no survivor would say they won if they were the only person to survive a 3k, for example, and survivors will seldom win in the first place if they don't respond to the needs of their team.
2k is a draw for both sides. 3k+ is required for a win as killer. 1k- is required for a win as survivor.
There is no explicit win condition set by the game, but this definition is based only on the following:
- DBD is a team game.
- The killer's primary objective is to kill survivors.
- The survivors' primary objective is to survive.
Even if you would die on the hill of agreeing with the first bullet, though, if you're assessing game balance, it only makes sense to weight each 1v1 equally. Two wins and two losses is functionally the same as a draw. You are .500, average, directly in the middle between the best and worst possible outcome. The same is true for the killer, who is between obvious win (3k+) and obvious lose (1k-) conditions and who has completed exactly half of their primary objective.
Please link where the devs say DBD is 4 individual 1v1s, because that sounds like it's being taken out of context. I could see them saying this while explaining how SBMM is implemented rather than describing how the survivor role is played. It's a hard argument to make, even for solo queue, that DBD is not a team game.
The devs have clarified that the game is 4 individual 1 on 1 situations happening at once and the survivors are not a team (but naturally are more likely to succeed if they work together). Just do some googling on it. You shouldn't have any difficulty finding a post as they've brought this up on numerous occasions.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3796848#Comment_3796848
The source was linked by @Moonras2 a couple of comments below mine.
Aye thanks. I edited in a response. To say that quote is flawed is an understatement. See my edited response.
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3794629#Comment_3794629
But that would mean killers never lose. 2K is a draw so if that worst result then can't deny the game is not killer sided. Likely the 60% kill rate is pretty close to same as win rate for killers. Generally you either win get 3-4K as killer or lose get 0-1K and not that many matches in between.
You have to keep in mind there's actually no such thing as a draw in the game. Draws require both sides to neither win or lose which is not possible in this game. Survivors aren't actually a "team". The game is set up to be 4 individual 1 v 1 situations going on simultaneously. That's why at the end of the survivor screen, there's no "survivors win". You, as a survivor, either survive or you don't - you personally either win or lose. There's no situation where the killer and a survivor neither win nor lose (except for server crashes, ha). That means a 2K is a loss, as you can't draw. Again, draws require all parties to neither win or lose. If 2 survivors escape, then that means 2 survivors lost, 2 survivors won, and the killer is stuck in a grey area where generally the community has agreed that a 3k+ is required for a win. With that thought process in mind, then the killer would lose in this situation. Even if you ignore the devs statement that the game is 4 individual 1 v 1's going on at once per match and assume that the survivors are together as a team, it still wouldn't be a draw, as again, a draw requires NO part has any wins or losses. You can't have the killer not win and the survivors partially win - that literally is against the definition of a draw. If the killer doesn't win, and the survivors even partially win, then clearly the survivors are the winners. Again though - that's only if you assume survivors are a team that wins together (which they aren't in DBD).
Now it's true that a 2K is considered MMR neutral, but MMR adjustments are historically not tied to win\loss conditions. MMR only cares about one thing - trying to balance the game. That's why in MMR systems (ie ranking systems), you can have situations where you can win but not go up in rank, or lose and not go down in rank - Chess is an example of this. It doesn't care if you win or lose, it cares about the balance of the whole system and tries to adjust accordingly to make future games more balanced. BHVR uses a very simple ranking system, so they decided to go with 0-1K can reduce your MMR (though not always - you do have a minimum threshold to prevent people from MMR dumping), 2K is neutral, and 3-4K can increase your MMR (up to the ceiling).
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@CrypticGirl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3799872#Comment_3799872
According to the dev update, the mori won't be forced. Idk why people are still thinking that…
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/144FAI0T3G1G/finishermori2.png
It's not an additional effect, it's a new effect. That means the mori offerings won't actually be mori's. It'll just give you bonus BP once you mori the 4th survivor. That means there will only be one possibility of ever doing a mori every match, and that's after there's no longer any threats against the killer.
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You don't have to play it. If you're doing it for the rewards, then if they didn't bring it back, you wouldn't get rewards, anyway.
I'd rather them just modify it. I think the distance of visibility should be doubled, or at least have holding up the candle (using it) cause visibility to increase. Would be cool to have someone designated as a lookout while others do gens.
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I think it's an actual darkness effect than it being a lack of light…..so doubtful. BTW, why specifically say killers? Survivors would be just as likely to abuse something like that.
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Hard to say without a video.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
How did you manage to get the Gens blocked from kicking? Since its implementation, it happened to me once that a Gen was blocked, if I remember correctly.
Overall, when the patch came out, it was a Buff for Killer, even with the Regression events. The only Nerf Killers got was that they cannot do more than 8 Regression Events per Gen, which is something which is almost never reached in regular gameplay.
But they got that Survivors cannot just tap a Gen anymore AND regular kicks remove 5% from the progress. And this basically as compensation for something which almost never happens anyway (reaching 8 Regression Events).
It's pretty easy to weaponize it against the killer. I've managed to have a central gen blocked within the first 3 minutes of a match. All you have to do is just repair a vital center gen. Once you hear TR, just pre-run. They obviously will regress it, then you just hop back on and do it again. It's too vital NOT to defend, so that sucker will be permanently blocked in mere minutes for the rest of the match. Guaranteed loss of a vital gen. It's worse for weak m1 killers because they can't afford to patrol gens far off, so they naturally are more localized in the center of the map. Yup, the WEAKEST killers get punished the most with the 8 regression limit. One of the worst ideas BHVR has implemented into the game. Not THE worst…mind you - I'd say that goes for BNP's originally instantly finishing a gen, ha.
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I love the idea of lights out, but I think the visibility distance needs to be doubled (or have holding up a candle cause it to be doubled - it would be cool to have someone designated as a lookout who stands with a candle up high while the others work on the gen). It's bit too claustrophobic and allows killers to get way too much of a jump on someone. At the moment, the optimal play is to just hide until you see someone is being chased, THEN touch gens…the moment the chase icon stops, everyone hides again. Not very engaging.
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At least we have a chance to have it changed while on PTB.
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@ZamasuManzon said:
Can we get a moderator here please?
Maybe Mandy?I don't think it'd matter. We voiced our opinions on this issue a LONG time ago, and they are absolutely obsessed with pushing it through despite it being an incredibly unpopular "feature".
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The only thing they need to fix is where they can be dropped inside of your character hitbox. That makes walls useless against it. At the very least, have it create a skill check the killer has to pass to close their eyes, lol.
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@Valimure said:
There's an event going on right now so the normal mode is filled with sweatlords more than normal at the moment.
Killer is the power role in low MMRs, but as you get higher the game does end up being quite survivor-sided. If you're new, chances are you're just a victim of the crappy matchmaking right now due to the lower player population, or you might be playing against groups where one person is a much higher skill level than the others.
Learn the tiles the best you can but also just expect you're going to lose plenty of games. I still do, that's for sure.
This is true. At lower MMR, it's killer sided. Around mid MMR, it's roughly balanced. At high MMR, it's survivor sided. If you're new, you're in this awkward area where the game is trying to figure out where to place you in MMR. You'll get some rough patches here and there until you settle. However, as you go up in MMR, it will get more and more difficult as killer - that's where you're less likely to be handed some easier kills and you'll need to use your killer experience to overcome that. On paper, survivors have everything they need to always win. However, not many players have THAT much experience to use everything they have effectively 100% of the time. At higher MMR, the game ends up coming down to the killer needing to capitalize on survivors making mistakes. Essentially, if survivors never made mistakes, they'd always win. If killers never make mistakes, they can still lose. The trick is taking advantage of when survivors DO make mistakes (and they will). Once you eliminate a survivor, then the match starts to swing more in your favor. Focus on map knowledge and mindgames, and you'll be far more likely to put survivors into a position where they start making mistakes.
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The ironic thing is your best tracking option is following the light their carried candles emit.
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Throw in Deadline for the lulz for even more gen speed shenanigans. At this point, we're gonna start having gens completed within 15 seconds.
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I wouldn't mind them if there wasn't so many ways to get aura reading (both sides). I REALLY dislike the new perk change where survivors see the killer's aura at the beginning of the match simply because it takes away one of the few things stealth killers have going for them - a surprise ambush before their identity is known. Why kick an already weak class in the gut? I'd rather them have a version of "survivor's instinct" which would show the killer's location but NOT their identify.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3797468#Comment_3797468
A killer sided mode?
You mean the one where:
- Gens are 20% faster, despite the fact the killer has no access to gen defense?
- Basically basekit OTR, so now you get your anti-tunnel perks for free.
The game is balanced around killers bringing gen defense perks, and last time this mode was out it was a complete joke when you went against even halfway decent SWFs, you just need discord and you are good to go on this mode.
It's incredibly easy if you play it right. We had chucky DC with one gen left and no hooks. All you do is only touch gens if someone is in chase. Once chase stops, everyone hides. Once someone is back in chase, everyone rushes gens. You'll pretty much outpace the killer guaranteed.
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Keep this up and they aren't going to even bother doing skins - just not worth the drama and stress.
I'm LGBT. We don't need "equal representation" in every video game in existence. BHVR is plenty supportive of the LGBT community. It's unrealistic to expect to make one of each kind of possible representation. These things take man hours, time, and money. We're getting to the point that we're going to start demanding game companies to make 50x the amount of skins\flags to be "represented" when they only have it in the budget to make 1.
Just chill - it's a video game. Enjoy what comes our way. No one realistically cares if a character is straight\bi\black\white\good at calculus\prefers pineapple on their pizza. They aren't real. It's just words in a Bio. David isn't really gay - in fact - he doesn't actually exist. Dwight isn't really straight - he too does not exist. At the end of the day, whatever something says in a bio accomplishes absolutely nothing. It has no gameplay affect - it's just fluff. Heck, did you know that Lambert in the original Alien film is trans (MtF)? Probably not - because it doesn't even matter.
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I don't understand why the change. It's a completely unwarranted and unnecessary nerf. Iri mori was super handy to use against bully squads with all flashlights, flashbangs, powerstruggle, and so on. If you managed to get someone on deathhook, downing them is a secured kill that would otherwise just get powerstruggled or flashbanged. With this, now you could only Mori the last person which already isn't at risk at a save.
They should keep the iri mori exactly as-is.
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The hide and seek concept was abandoned years ago with looping becoming a thing.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3794629#Comment_3794629
Peanits said the kill rate and win rate are the same not long ago.
Would need to see a source here because that makes absolutely no sense. Let's say a killer is just….really bad at the game. They get a 25% kill rate EVERY match (ie a single kill). That absolutely does not mean the killer wins 1 out of 4 matches on average. With him getting only 1 kill every match (not talking on average, in my example, I mean literally 1 kill every match), then he would never win. Kill rates absolutely are not win rates.
Edit - just looked up his post. They said that "winning" is subjective - some people see pips as a win even if they didn't kill anyone, some see a 4k is minimum for a win, and so on. They also said they don't really define wins due to it being so subjective, and suggested just considering that kill rates are = to win rates just to make it easier to understand. The problem with this logic is that it's claiming that getting a single kill gets "win" credit when it comes to coming up with a win rate. In my example above, someone only ever getting 1K every match would have a 25% win rate - which is just silly to consider. I don't think any DBD player actually considers a 1K as a killer win, but if you go with kill rate = win rate, a 1K is a "win", and you can win up to 4 times in a single match. I don't think anyone would seriously accept this as a reliable balance method for numbers.
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Being injured should be an actual danger. Easily being able to heal yourself effectively makes injuries a no biggy.
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@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3794336#Comment_3794336
Yeah which completely demolishes the idea of the game being 'Survivor sided' when they are designed to lose 60% of the time. Even when we falsely use Apex Fallacy for 4-man SWF at High MMR from these alone, we still see the game is Killer sided since they still win more often than Survivors.
You['re mixing up 60% kill rate and 60% win rate. A 60% kill rate isn't a 60% win rate. A 60% kill rate is very slightly higher than getting a 2K on average per match (which would be 50%). A 62.5% kill rate would be 2.5 kills on average. Essentially, a 60% kill rate means roughly 2.4% kills per match when averaged over several matches. This ends up meaning, on average, killers get a 2K vs a 3K every other match which generally gives them slightly under a 50% win rate if you define a 3k+ as a win.
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Because it is…….."technically". That's the big takeaway. If you take a survivor team that makes no mistakes, they are guaranteed to always win. If you take a killer that makes no mistakes, they can still lose. When survivors get enough experience to take advantage at the multitude of tools they have to use against the killer, matches essentially come down to killers capitalizing on survivor mistakes. In general, the game is absolutely survivor sided…BUT…when you take the whole population of DBD, very little survivors have that much experience to "make no mistakes".
TLDR; Survivors have the potential to always win, but reaching that level of "no mistakes" is nearly unachievable. The survivors have ALL of the tools to always win, but it's incredibly difficult to properly use those tools at the right time. Killers, on the other hand, win by taking advantage of survivors failing to use those tools to their max potential.
There are some exceptions to this - a couple of killers are fundamentally broken (they bypass all the rules that keep killers in check by design) where even the best survivors will fail. This is a killer specific issue on those particular killers and not killers as a whole. That's why in tournaments you almost always see just nurse's and blights. At high level play, those survivor players typically have more experience to understand the tools survivors have against killers, so standard killers just aren't viable at high MMR. Many tournaments acknowledge this issue, so many of them put in rules that survivors have to play by (for example, only one deliverable per team allowed) in order to try to nerf survivors enough where other killers can be picked (no one wants to just see nurse and blight only every game). That's right, at high level play, survivors are so broken, they get restrictions applied to them in tournament play just to give killers a chance to win.
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Excellent, imho…except for Leon - he's just annoying to hear, lol.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3784384#Comment_3784384
A 3K is a win, confirmed by the Devs. And while I would agree that Challenges and Adepts are a thing, I highly doubt that every Killer who slugs for the 4K is on some Challenge or wants an Adept.
I dont really see BP as a valid reason, since the time wasted by slugging for the 4K will probably earn less BP than just going into the next game.
And its is not like not slugging for the 4K means that the last Survivor will escape. The last Survivor will only be able to find Hatch when they are lucky (assuming no Hatch Offering is in play), because Killers have all the advantages to find Hatch first (moving faster and no need to hide).
Curious, do you have a source for the devs stating 3K is a win? Historically, they have avoided answering that question. We know that MMR positive adjustments require a 3K+, but MMR adjustments don't go hand in hand with MMR adjustments in rating systems. MMR only cares about trying to make future games more fair regardless of match outcomes. For example, in chess, a Grandmaster wouldn't gain rating vs a brand new player, and a brand new player wouldn't lose rating against the grandmaster. MMR systems (ie rating systems) don't define a win or loss.
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What's the issue, exactly? Killers are allowed to bait and mindgame. If the killer is trying to bait, then punish him with mass gen progression. Slugging isn't breaking any game rules.
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It doesn't CAUSE tunneling and camping, but it does certainly increase the amount of it. There was always tunneling and camping.
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If you lose the item, it's not protected because you don't have the item to protect anymore. You have to keep it in-hand. For example, you can't give the item to someone else and then get it back with a duplication exploit. If it's dropped on the ground, it doesn't duplicate and come back into your inventory again. If you use an item that "uses up" the item such as styptic agents or syringes on medkits, it doesn't materialize again back in your inventory. It only functions if it still "belongs" to you.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3792428#Comment_3792428
No honey, you're making a critical error where you only consider average outcomes.
Just because half your matches are 3Ks doesn't mean the other half have to be 2Ks, which is what your 62.5% figure is dependent on. Think about it for a second: You're only considering the killrate for a pair of matches where one match is a 2K, and the other is a 3K.
But if one match is a 0K, and the other is a 3K, that's still half the matches being a 3K, is it not?
And 3/8 survivors killed is nowhere near 62.5%. So no, that's not required for a 50% winrate. Your math is only considering the outcomes closest to the average, but DBD doesn't work like that. In fact, it works quite the opposite: 2Ks are, by far, the least likely outcome.
You are choosing literally the second highest killrate configuration for the 3K+ rate, which is incredibly unfair, just like the aforementioned 37.5% would be, as that is the lowest possible killrate configuration.
Long story short, your "side of the argument" comes down to the grounds that a single kill is considered a killer "win" (and a killer can win 4 times in a single match with a 4k)
I have never once mentioned 1Ks as a win. That is a complete fabrication. Go back over the math I showed and try to find where I counted 1Ks as wins.
We're talking about averages. If you have a million matches, and you get 5 4Ks in a row, you can't run around and claim you have a 100% win rate. That's not how averaging works. The greater the sample, the greater the accuracy. Having two matches which is what your example is based off doesn't remotely have enough of a sample. That being said, your example would put you at a 1.5 average kill rate (0k and a 3k). I'm not going to go into depth on what averaging means - I'd suggest you google it.
Perhaps you have issues with percentages, so let's make it easier. a 62.5% kill rate translates to a 2.5 kill rate. That means on average, you're getting 2.5 kills. Over the period of several matches, that essentially translates to you winning roughly have your matches (where winning means a 3k+). While you can have a 0K match and even some 4K matches, on AVERAGE across multiple matches, you'd essentially be alternating evenly between a 2K and a 3K.
I also see you're confused on the topic, but we're talking about standard gameplay, not new gamemodes with 8 survivors - that whole thing throws gameplay balance out the window for the sake of chaotic fun. The balance was so broken, MMR didn't get adjusted - which makes sense.
I'm not "choosing" the 2nd highest kill rate, I'm just saying that generally the community sees a 3-4k as a win, a 2K as a tie (though there's actually no tie in the game due to reasons I won't bother going into), and a 0-1 being a loss. It's a pretty good system. 0-1 is loss, 2 is "tie" (though actually still a loss since you can't tie 4 individual 1 v 1 scenarios), and 3-4 is a win.
As you counting 1k as a win, that's the only logical outcome that it's what you believe if you genuinely believe that someone with an average of 1.5 kills (37.5% kill rate) per match can get a 50% win rate. Let's make this easy on you. Let's actually increase that to a 50% kill rate. That means on average across all matches played, that player is only getting 2Ks. With a 3-4K being a win, on average, he's never winning. CAN he win? Certainly! Just over multiple matches, on average, he is not. With your number, it's even worse. With your 1.5, that means on average, he's teetering between 1-2 kills on average. Again, there's literally no way someone who only gets on average 1-2 kills is having a 50% win rate UNLESS you subscribe to the belief that each kill is considered a win and that a killer can win up to 4 times in a single match.
I hope that clarifies it for you. If you're still not getting it, I don't know what to tell you.
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Not going to happen for awhile - it's been pro-survivor patches overall for quite some time. They'll likely get a lot more buffs until those mid to low 50% kill rates are dripping into the 40's. The biggest problem right now is that we have a couple of over-performers in regards to killers (which frankly need nerfs), but BHVR doesn't do targeted killer nerfs, really. Instead their style is blanket nerfs across the board. The weaker killers will eventually just getting lost, then BHVR will have to reconsider their balance style. They can't just keep kicking all killers in the gut just because 2 or 3 overperformers are dominators. All that's pushing is more people to jump on board the overperformer bandwagon as the weaker killers start dissipating. I don't think anyone wants to see blight\nurse to end up being in the majority of all matches - either "side".
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3791869#Comment_3791869
60% is the intended kill rate.
Yes, but not for balancing reasons.
It would take a 62.5% kill rate for killers to get a 3k+ in half their matches
That is incorrect. Winrates and killrates are not that tightly confined because there's more than two outcomes. You can get a 50% winrate off a killrate as low as 37.5%. You don't need 62.5% kill rate for 50% KR at all, as is proven by the current Nightlight statistics.
The higher the MMR, the worst the kill rates get.
No, higher MMR has higher kill rates. Why do you keep insisting this when BHVR's official stats have disproven this?
A 52% kill rate essentially means the killer is only getting a 2K every match which is pretty terrible.
I see you've been to the Batusalen school of 'how not to calculate averages'.
Current lowest killrate according to Nightlight is Clown at 52.8%. He gets a 2K 11% of the time. He gets a 3K+ on 46.95% of his matches.
Y'all need to drop this dummy kill rate argument because it's just flat out wrong in all regards.
I didn't say anything about a win rate. I said it would take a 62.5% kill rate for killers to get a 3k in half their matches. You're not understanding the basics here, so I'll explain the basics. a 1k is a 25% kill rate in a match. A 2k is a 50% kill rate. A 3k is a 75% kill rate. a 4k is a 100% kill rate. The exact halfway point (on average across several matches) between a 2K (50%) and a 3K (75%) is 12.5% (50% + 25% is 75%, so splitting the 25% down the middle is 12.5%). That means the halfway point in kills between a 2K and a 3K is 62.5%. With a 62.5%, you're kill rate is in the middle of the road between a 2K and a 3K on average. Now, "winning" is completely subjective in DBD (which is why BHVR refuses to define it), but the majority of the community accepts that a 3K+ is considered a killer win. In reality, each match is 4 different 1 v 1 situations and there is no survivor team (weird, I know, but that's the design). If on average you're only getting a 1K (your 37.5% number) every match + the additional 12.5% average carry overs, then you're clearly not winning half the matches like your saying unless you're defining a single kill as a killer "win" (which TECHINCALLY is true, since the killer wins 1 out of 4 for the match and the game is made into 4 different "games" per match). However, while I see that's what you're claiming here (and technically you're correct), most of the community doesn't see killers getting 1 or 2 kills as being a win.
Long story short, your "side of the argument" comes down to the grounds that a single kill is considered a killer "win" (and a killer can win 4 times in a single match with a 4k) - but that reasoning is very convoluted and easily confuses the greater balance of things. A killer that can only get 1K every match shouldn't be considered as having a 100% win rate when you consider the whole picture of there actually being 4 survivors he's facing. It's better we all accept the more common view that a 3K+ is a win.
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Distortion simply needs to have it's recharges restock only when in chase. That way, it's enough to save you 3 times, but otherwise, you're going to need to do your job and get some chases in if you want to re-use it in any form.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3791076#Comment_3791076
Not according to official stats, and you forgot to mention that even if kill rates were higher, that's with the caveat that you must play a select few killers.
No, that is exactly according to official stats and that's not only counting the top few. In the details from September 2022, the lowest killrate in overall MMR was 52% for the Nurse. The lowest killrate in high MMR was 56% for the Trapper. A couple of killers lost around 1% in killrate, a bunch of killers gained much more than that in killrate, moving from overall to high MMR.
60% is the intended kill rate. It would take a 62.5% kill rate for killers to get a 3k+ in half their matches (so they are intended to be balanced around getting a 3k+ slightly under half the time). Anything under 60%, and the killers are underperforming. The higher the MMR, the worst the kill rates get. A 52% kill rate essentially means the killer is only getting a 2K every match which is pretty terrible.