ReikoMori
ReikoMori
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@Zaydin said:
So many survivors I run into seem less interested in playing the game and more interested in tormenting the Killer in some fashion. Constant flashlight blinds regardless of whether they are necessary, incessant teabagging, BM abound, etc.
There are two DBDs
Public Facing DBD- Everyone is a collective community that wants to uplift and generally nice.
In-game DBD- You are both the toy and torture master trapped in a cycle of dealing with players who thrive on your misery eventually you grow to thrive on making them suffer.
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@[Deleted User] said:
You seem like the type to tunnel regardless protection hits are a valid mechanic also mettle exists….
No one said it wasn't a valid mechanic.
Survivors do have a wild habit of complaining about being tunneled when they go out of their way to draw aggro instead of running away. Like if you draw the killer's attention from a healthy survivor to you, you're going to be chased. That makes sense and is normal expectation of cause and effect.
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@Boons123 said:
Watch this video and then judge
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/W3ITIA4CLRD0/2c996466-24e8-40a7-8d7e-1b254b71f39b.jpeg
Clown was better for a lot of us the way he was compared to the way he is now. Don't matter how good something is if we don't like using it to begin with. That's how I feel about antidote bottles, sure they can be interesting, but I don't use them and I addons I used all the time and were comfortable with have turned into antidote addons. It killed my entire drive to play clown because I was fine with how he was.
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@Exerlin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3456197#Comment_3456197
When you unhook someone, they get endurance. If you get hit while near the hook, the killer goes into an attack cooldown. That attack cooldown is normally just enough time to unhook the survivor, then right as you can control, the killer can swing and down you. If you have at least 25% faster unhooking speed, however, the unhooked person has just enough time to phase through you and bodyblock/tank a hit, leaving you both in the injured state instead of you being downed. Leader gives your team the ability to unhook you in front of a killer under this scenario without just giving them a free down. Desperate Measures allows you to always be able to do the same since, in this scenario, you are going to have at least 2 tokens of it.
I hope that makes more sense! It helps against camping by utilizing the endurance that the unhooked player gets to save a teammate (or yourself) from going down.
You can do that without either of those perks though.
I watch do basically every other game in the exact you described without having Leader or Desperate Measures.
Just seems like the only real thing helping you in that situation is base kit BT.
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@Hawk81584 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3456174#Comment_3456174
To be honest just go watch people on twitch, there are some extremely skilled killers out there
It's not about skill.
It's about clear and concise explanations on how to use the power and then how to use it effectively. A lot of content creators are great at showcasing their individual skill, but don't often specialize in making teaching content. Not everyone can just sit and watch vods or streams of people playing and pick up what to do. Some people are looking for detailed explanations of how the power actually works, what it's limitations and strengths are, etc. etc. Information that isn't maybe easily asked for or gleaned during a streamers session.
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@Exerlin said:
Hello! While playing with a friend, I have had a lot of oportunities to deal with campers. I found out that Leader allows you to tank a hit for your friend when you're unhooked if the killer hits the survivor that saved you. The same is also true in reverse with Desperate Measures (assuming they know to try and not let the killer just down you. These help a lot! Just wanted to share, thanks!
I don't know what Leader is really doing for you as that perk only gives other survivors on your team increased action speeds. It offers zero in the way of protections to you or the person unhooking you. It does make someone unhook you faster, but as for tanking hits it contributes nothing at all. Same with Desperate Measures it makes unhooking and healing speeds faster for every injured, hooked, or dying survivor, but that increase only affects you so it doesn't help the person unhooking you at all.
So I'm unsure how these are Anti-camping perks?
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@mikewelk said:
Devs think MMR is perfect when, in fact, it is the worst matchmaking experience I have ever witnessed compared to so many other games.
They don't think it's perfect and they admitted that upfront.
@Seal_Massacre said:
Proposal for a new MMR formula for Dead by Daylight
Hello to whoever takes the time to read this. Let’s start with an introduction of myself and then move onto how I think Dead By Daylight could have a better MMR/SBMM system implemented.
My name is Jon (AKA Seal or Seal_Massacre on twitch) and I am a 6k+ hour killer main on Dead By Daylight. Roughly 70% of that playtime is on the killer side and around 30% of that is on the survivor side. I have done pretty much every build you can think of for both sides. I have been playing MMR based games for nearly 15 years. Games such as Smite, Gears of War, Call of Duty, World of Warcraft just to name a few. With that being said I have and currently do play every single killer in the game including the newest release The Singularity as I am writing this. I also do monthly challenges where I take a killer each month individually from Ash 4 to Iridescent 1 going in order of release. As I do those I record all of my kills. I consider a fair win condition to be a 3k+ with a minimum of 9 individual hooks on the killer side of things. As survivor win rates go I consider at least 3 survivors escaping regardless of hook stages. 2k’s being a draw for both sides if the killer has hooked at least everyone once. Let’s move on to the more in depth calculations of my thought process and possible better ways to tweak this system we currently have in the game.
Now all I would like to say is that most if not all of the community agrees that if a killer gets a ton of actual hooks instead of forcing stages by camping and also ends chases quickly makes them a better killer. I get that camping and tunneling is a strategy but it’s the easy way out if done properly. With that being said it also makes the game stale for both sides. Survivor on the other hand I want to talk about chase time and altruistic plays such as pallet saves, flashlight saves etc. As a killer main I will actually compliment survivors if they run me for a longer chase than I want. Now the people that hide all match long and still escape but didn’t go for any chase time to prevent their teammates from dying early. Did they actually do anything skillful? I feel like everyone could just hide all match and escape if done correctly. Also makes it frustrating for both sides. The main take here is that Killers should be rewarded for actual hook actions, ending chases fast and spreading pressure as efficiently as possible. Survivors should be rewarded for having long chases and being altruistic and interacting with the killer. This whole MMR system being solely based off of kills and escapes is not good for the game.
Everything we need for this formula is already being recorded in game. The MMR should be visible to everyone when you’re in a lobby and at the end of the match near the scoreboard somewhere. All survivors should have the same MMR meaning no matter which survivor you play you will have the same MMR regardless. Since Killers have different powers and are played differently for the most part they should have their own MMR rating and not being influenced by other killers in the game. I do understand that if this gets taken seriously and someday goes into effect that there will be some matchmaking issues but it will be resolved by playing the game. What I mean by that is, let’s say a new killer comes out and it starts off at the base starting MMR which is 1000 for the sake of this discussion. Then Veteran’s such as myself won’t get thrown into a lobby full of extremely good survivors while I’m trying to learn a killer. I know that bot matches exist now but it’s a much better experience to play against real people to learn because bots play way different than actual people.
Let’s talk about the MMR brackets now which I think should have a tiny range adjustments. This formula I am proposing to BHVR is going to need a complete reset of all players. So please bare with me and keep this in mind. Only time will make this work way better than the system we have now. I understand that once this goes into effect there will be bumps early on but it will fix itself over time.
Bracket 1 : Ash: 0-650 MMR – Everyone would start here once this would go into effect. Starting at 0 and working upwards. Brand new players will stay here until they get a hole od the game and move into the Bronze bracket,
Bracket 2 : Bronze: 651-1000 This is for the fairly new players that kind of know how the game works for both sides but still need improvement or the people that play the game very casually.
Bracket 3 : Silver 1001-1600 This bracket is for the more experienced player that have some time in game. They aren’t super efficient but they know what to do to get the job done. A good chunk of the player base would be in this bracket or the next bracket.
Bracket 4 : Gold 1600–2200 This would be for the players that are experienced enough to be considered average and where most of the player base would sit around.
Bracket 5 : Iridescent 2201-2800 This bracket is for the really good players that have a ton of knowledge of the game for both sides. I would call this bracket the comfort zone where you don’t feel like you’re going to win or lose every match but there would be a good balance of really good players.
Bracket 6 : Grandmaster Iridescent 2800-3000 These are the absolute best players in DBD for both sides. Killers that are extremely efficient at getting a lot of hooks every game and ending chases fast. While Survivors being the ones that can have a long chase almost every time the occasion rises up. This will be where all the competitive players will be once and if this system becomes a reality.
So finally getting into the deeper math part of this formula. These will both be brief explanation of how I think and many others think it should work. Starting with Survivors. I think this should be split up into 3 categories. Altruism, Chase, and finally Objectives.
Altruism points would be revolved around taking protection hits, unhooks, healing others, sabotaging hooks, flashlight saves, pallet saves, and locker saves. The more you interact with the killer the higher this rewards. Causing Distractions and wasting the killer’s time in the best way to get the final objective done which is getting those generators done and escaping.
Chase points would be how long you can last in a chase. Now some may say just pre-drop pallets to make this easier to get. Yes so here’s the solution. Chase time is the BEST thing a survivor can do to show personal skill. So stunning the killer with a pallet will reward you more points as it already does in game in this category. The longer the chase the more points you get in this category. Every 10 seconds of chase would give a certain amount of points in this category. We will need a little bit of an adjustment to when the chase ends in game because most of the time if the killer breaks a pallet the chase ends. On a side note generator progress that is being done during chase will be implemented into the objective category for yourself.
Objective categories will be the smallest factor in this equation but still punishable if you don’t do anything objective wise. I think the first two brackets are more important than this one. Anyone can sit on a generator and hit skill checks. But this needs to be done for the final objective. So in order for this to change the outcome of this not reducing the MMR granted in this category a survivor must do at least 1 generator and 1 totem. Gens have to be completed and totems can be done but it’s optional for the most part but Hex perks do exist. Reminder this will be the least focused on category but still looked at like a bonus category.
Onto the killer side of things. Most people will say that good killers will get 8+ hooks a game and end chases quickly. I want to split this up into 4 categories instead of the 3 for survivor. The reason for 4 is that there’s way more to do as a killer than a survivor has to do. Categories being Chase, Sacrifice, Gatekeeper (Gen defense), and Brutality (keeping health states and getting a lot of hits)
First up is Chase. The faster you end a chase is going to make your games go smoother. You’ll lose most of your games if you chase too long and a good killer knows that. So what you want to calculate here is how fast you can end chases. Now I know there are instant down killers such as Bubba, Billy, Ghost Face, Myers and a few others with the right addons. So once a chase starts the points will start at a maximum for any given chase. For example, not real numbers…Let’s say once a chase starts you start with a total of 20 points every 15 seconds you’re in a chase you lose 1 point. If it’s an instant down you double the points lost because you take two health states if they are healthy. But let’s say you use your chainsaw to get the down on the injured survivor. You’d still get the normal points deducted if any. This would be the second most important ingredient to this formula.
Next up Sacrifice. The most important one. 12 hooks (3 individual hooks on each survivor) is a perfect game. Accomplishing this is would make you get the most amount of points in this category. Let’s say you get 2 points per individual hook. Which would make for a total of 24 points in this category. In order for you to get points for a hook stage due to another survivor not saving them would only require you to be more than 24m away from the hook when they go to 2nd chase or death. This would prevent camping and securing stages because I know that’s an issue currently. Everyone does. If you hook every survivor at least once you’d get another 2 points if you hook everyone at least twice that’s additional 2 points. That would help with the tunneling issue if you wanted to increase your MMR to the max. This would encourage to go after everybody in the trial. It wouldn’t solve camping and tunneling 100% but I think having the mindset to get a ton of hooks and chases with different survivors would make it fun for everyone in the trail.
Moving on to Gatekeeper. This is your ability to YOU GUESSED IT protect your generators. Most of the time the first 2 generators are free for survivors and they are usually gone by the 2-3 minute mark of the match so losing those first two won’t make you lose many points in this category it’s the final 3 remaining generators to complete that we will be talking about. So let’s say that you start the match with 25 points. Losing the 1st generator is -2 points, losing the second generator is -3 points, losing the 3rd generator is -4, losing the 4th generator is -7, losing the 5th generator is -9. Now even as a veteran player I do lose all 5 gens so we are going to have to equate how long these gens stay up as well so you don’t lose all the points in this category. Every 120 seconds you will be rewarded a point back. If the gates are not opened you get an additional 2 points. If all gens are still not repaired you get an additional 5 points.
The fun category. Brutality. Chasing survivors is the most fun you can have and getting those nice cross map hatchets or those chainsaw curves with Billy feels amazing. Enough of the fangirling for Billy though. To get points in this category you will have to get a lot of hits on survivors and will get bonus points for using your killer’s power. As a killer you want multiple people injured at any given time. This will make chases easier and force survivors to heal if they don’t want to go down fast. Last thing you want are those survivors working on gens. It’s your job to protect them. So getting points for injuring survivors and bonus points for using your power. It will make it a little more challenging for killers to get those bonus points since I’ve seen it numerous times where Wesker will only M1 you and never use his power instead of using it for distance. Just an example. USE YOUR POWER GUYS!
Thanks to anyone that took the time out of their day to read this and maybe consider reposting this to get it to BHVR’s attention. I didn’t want to go into too much detail but I can actually write up actual numbers of what I think would be good. These numbers I used were just for examples. But I just wanted to get BHVR to maybe take a second look at the current formula. Because in in my eyes this would be a much healthier system even though it’ll be rough in the start once everyone got reset to 0 MMR. It would balance out over time but it would only take maybe a month to get resolved and working to the best of it’s ability. If you want to contact me with any discussion or changes to this or just to give me your thoughts on this you can find me on twitch @ twitch.tv/seal_massacre. I stream late nights Central time anywhere from 8pm-9am. Thank you again for reading my suggestion. I hope BHVR sees this some day and takes it into consideration.
The Skill-Based Matchmaking Rating, often abbreviated as "SBMM" or "MMR", is a hidden scoring system used to match Players together for ranked Trials in Dead by Daylight . The system has been in use since 8 September 2021 and replaced the previous matchmaking system, which had matched Players based on their Grades. The Skill-Based Matchmaking Rating uses a hidden score that is influenced by the Player's performance in ranked Trials.There is no way for Players to know their specific score. The SkThis goes over how the current MMR works in detail.
My question for you is how exactly do you intend to differentiate between common problematic scenarios that happen in the game that effect MMR such as farming, sandbagging, subtle hacking and people getting carried to higher ranks, but as a result being permanently trapped there due to MMR loss protection. Another thing I would ask is how you would deal with the fact that high concentration of hyper efficient players lead to worse overall reported game feel and more stale gameplay. Like it's a very well known concern that players in high MMR don't actually like constantly playing against other high MMR players. The people who do enjoy that level of constant competition tend to not even play regular dbd matchmaking in favor for scrimming with other comp players in customs.
If the calculations are going to be opened up to such a degree a lot of players are going to be shifted into places they actually can't handle or stuck in high MMR hell. How does your system account for and correct these issues
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@TheSubstitute said:
I saw the trailer for the Twisted Masquerade. Pretty good job on the masks and the costumes. The art, as always, looks pretty good. I have just one question though. Has anyone told the costume designers there are more survivors than Feng?
There is only Feng Prime and Feng Variants.
My personal favorite is currently Nerd Witch Feng
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
Attack on Titan leaves fog. I don't know if we should worry about other licenses we have... First Stranger Things and now AoT.
https://twitter.com/DeadbyDaylight/status/1669706465240555521
And of nothing of value was lost
Smokin on that AoT pack once again
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@lifeisstrange said:
Perk is so situational , I see people using it and the killer 115% or killers like spirit/nurse/blight/wraith or even onyru still catches up quite fine. Unless 110 killer and well hope which makes 110 kill impossible to catch you its really aint that serious imo. This perk only maybe a problem in swfs but so far am not seeing many people even using this perk lol.
The problem is how it can extend chases and that there is nothing that really gates it's usage. You get 3% basically because the killer has attempted to play the game with you. It's a bad way to give haste and the fact that it can stack with other perks isn't great. Yeah, you can play around it, but that doesn't mean it's balanced. Just means it isn't gamebreaking. DBD is big time management simulator and 3% adds extra seconds and meters of distance to chases. Killers are only a single player and can't cover everything at once. The game pace is already on the cusp of being completely out of control and unconditional chase extensions suck to deal with and should be limited.
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@lifeisstrange said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3454905#Comment_3454905
Jokes on you I do not see anyone running scavenger because built to last is much better LOL and if you was only talking this chapter you would have said so, the way you worded your post make it seem your talking about perks survivors got every patch new release since 6.1
How did my post come off like that when the entire context of this thread is about the new chapter?
It makes more sense to assume that people making statements in the thread about the sentiment around the new chapter would be unless specified otherwise about the new chapter. You chose to respond to me, but why not anyone else when the level of non-specificity was used by them as well in their statements.
Just because you don't see something doesn't mean it is happening and that in the context of wider game experience it isn't problematic when looked in relation to others things. Reading comprehension isn't hard when you account for context.
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@lifeisstrange said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3454261#Comment_3454261
What nice perks? The last perks that was only good imo that survivors last got was Yoichi's perk and no one even uses them.
Haddie perks= No one uses her perks
Ada/Rebecca= wire tap is the only good one, no one runs better than new, no one really runs reassurance. I hate skill checks so hyper focus is a no no for me.
Vittorio= No one uses his perks
Lyra Twins=no one uses their perks
Gabriel =maybe only made for this
Knight and Dull merchant was two hand me down killers with 0 thinking skills
Knight= Easy anti loop and decent at 3 gen/camping/tunneling. Killer that with just one push of button that his body guards does all his work for him. Always forced to leave a pallet or any would be strong window/loop
Dull merchant= the legion/knight 2.0 mix 3 gen master. Simply using a map like rpd and running corrup + 4 gen=almost instant win, her add ons are all good to busted and so she DOES have good chasing power even though people say shes bad at chasing.
My statement was specific to the chapter we're talking currently, End Transmission.
Gabriel got Made For This and Scavenger which are generally more useful than anything Singularity shipped with.
I'm not going to go over everything else you mentioned cause it's irrelevant to the discussion.
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@Boons123 said:
They want an killer that is oppressive, unbeatable, easy to learn, and requires no mind games (like old the spirit)
no 4kill on 5 gens = Bad killer
This mentality is some of the community
What mind game is required of Singularity? You either get the pod or you don't.
People want a killer with a power they can effectively use which right now Singularity can't do and he still has similar issues to Twins where switching out of cams is weird and slow along with if you check a cam while near a hook you basically take a stun's worth of slowdown despite the fact if you're actually using the pods you're not intending to camp 99% of the time as that is the worst power for it. It's not about being unbeatable or oppressive, it's about being worth the time investment to learn and currently for the average player he offers too little benefit and requires too much investment.
Old Spirit had mindgames, but they were mindgames that often came down to a 50/50. Why people say she didn't have mindgames is beyond me when a 50/50 is a mindgame.
The average player isn't fiending for a 4k at 5gen stomp. Most people playing Singularity just want to actually experience his power and have fun using it, but the current situation of emps is still pretty bad. Survivors have far too much ease of access to them and they're still far too good at just totally shutting out his power which means you literally can't learn how to use the killer effectively. No other killer is so thoroughly shut out of their power currently to the point where you can't functionally learn how to use it. That's what happens you make a complex power with an overly simple hard counter.
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@mustdogen said:
Do you remember the day that when the new killer come out.
Killer's lobby will immediately become need to wait ssssssssssuper long to play.
And when survivor go in to the game,there will be the new killer every single game, continue like 2-3 weeks?
What happened now?
In this 7th years celebration chapter,it feels like we have nothing happened.
I even need to wait more than five minutes to find a lobby as a survivor.
And i haven't seen the new killer yet.
It's summer time so a lot of people are on vacation
The killer isn't that good currently and folks don't want to load in just to spend most of the match emp'd outta their power.
The survivor perks are good, but the killer perks are meh so a lot are just leveling Singularity without playing him.
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https://youtu.be/ecytHvIkFW4@Boons123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3454266#Comment_3454266
Can you write the name of the video? I would like to watch
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@supersonic853 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3454266#Comment_3454266
I was there for the jugg one a while ago. 4 more seconds of invigoration. Funniest crap ive ever seen.
I love when my brown addons are better in every way than my yellow addons
I love my yellow addons are better than my purple. Just feels right
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It's not the first time they've done this. Otz made a video on it.
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@Sharby said:
People expecting another Wesker + last two chapters being bad + internet's hyperbolic nature = what we are seeing now.
Is it wrong to want a killer that is fun and accessible to play by the majority of players and isn't so bogged down by the hardcoded counterplay mechanic?
@Exerlin said:
I don't get it. We get some cool perks and a neat killer, but everyone's just complaining about it. Did you want a perfect update or something? A lot of y'all are so blinded by your reactionary disappointment that you can't see that we have some fun new toys to play with. There doesn't seem to be anything to warrant such an outcry in this update, it's fine and didn't break the game
Survivor got genuinely neat and more universally useful perks, but killers got another slate of pretty niche perks with limited use cases or inconsistent uncontrollable uses. The best one might be Genetic Limits, but that isn't really something great. Singularity is visually cool as heck, but his gameplay's already quite difficult and disorienting to start with and he currently isn't really able to shine due to ever present emps. The average player is going to have a difficult time getting a feel for a power that they often never get to use fully. He's retained a lot of the issues he had on PTB as well such as the atrocious slowdown from cancelling out of cams when near hooks. Like if you're using the cams then you're likely not going to stick around hook.
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@Mandy said:
Whilst I appreciate the feedback around the EMP's - this is obviously something we are going to be looking out for with the latest chapter. Franklins will only work on Survivor Items, not the special items moving forwards, so this includes Sadako Tapes etc, this is not expected to be changed.
The change to item categorizing was needed, but also the way it's been handled is messy and flawed. There had to have been a point where someone said "What if the Franklin's interaction of dropping an item was preserved, but the killer items were exempted from charge loss?". If the counterplay to a killer's power is going to be baked in mechanics then killers have to have some sort of concrete measure to attempt to counter the counterplay. Franklin's Demise had a significant push/pull strategic effect on how we as players on both sides interacted, but now increasingly that push/pull factor is being carved away. Offloading the cognitive need for survivor countermeasures to be discovered through learning how to use the pre-existing tools and techniques in favor of hard coded binary mechanics really needs to still have room for killers to have soft counterpoints to said hard counters.
Singularity's entire power is in his pods and slipstream infection. The average player is currently not going to remotely see a lot of the potential strength that power has because there no build you can run that allows you to somewhat counter his unique counter mechanic. Franklin's would have been the only thing, but now there is nothing which pretty bad. So instead of push/pull scenarios you get feast or famine scenarios where either you're really good and very lucky to the point where you're probably able to succeed no matter what or you get games where you're gonna spend the entire just not having power outside of glorified surveillance camera with a slow switch back ala twins style.
Why design in ways that are easy to see as frustrating for the average killer player? It's hard to trust that anyone actively working on the game actually plays the game in the same way everyone else does when the design decisions that are making it to live servers are more often than not frustrating and confusing to us.
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@Marc_go_solo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3453345#Comment_3453345
A long-term fix would be to deal with Skull Merchant and maybe spread the distance between gens a little. That's all they need to do.
It was explained that there was some issue with spreading gens in regards to setting a minimum distance which I just do not buy. It's not difficult to change some spawn settings and in many cases where survivors lose because of a 3-gen, it's not the killer nor the placement that were issues, moreover the survivors were not taking into consideration gen placement when doing them.
I do feel the game has moved towards a handheld experience because people do not wish to put the time in to learn and just enjoy it.
3-gen isn't a Skull Merchant issue it is a bad map design issue. Skull Merchant is slated to get retooled anyway which she needs cause her power currently isn't actually useful in ways it was meant to be used. The 3-genning issue is just more pronounced than ever due to the last two chapters having killers with powers that function at require survivors to interact with them, but being completely useless you place them in areas where survivors need to go. With the way maps are currently designed and just generally how the procedural tile spawn rules are I don't even know if they can fix it without changing the survivor objective.
Some maps are too small which means the gens can't be spread out in a way that stops 3-gens, but some maps are so big that if gens are too far apart basically no killer can really defend them.
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3452293#Comment_3452293
Freddys interaction should be removed, thats for sure.
But I feel reducing the boost to 125% for 3 seconds would hit it way harder then just removing the ignore effect, don't you think?
Why do you think reducing the boost is better than removing the ignore, just because of the consistency reason (genuine question)?
At 125% for 3 seconds the perk is still fairly strong and useful in escape situations, but not overly so. You still have perk synergy with other movement speed increasing perks as well as you health state. 150% for 5 seconds isn't overly strong, but if we're talking a sensible nerf that isn't removing the health state then you can only trim the either the time and boost amount. That's an issue older perks have from the release of DBD is that they are extremely basic to the point where changing them is literally either make it no do a thing and do a new thing or just change the numbers until it feels more inline with what you want balance wise.
Removing the ignore runs counter to the thought process that Adrenaline is supposed to push past exhaustion both in a gameplay sense and just a thematic sense. That's kinda how it works IRL as well a surge of adrenaline pushes a person past the usual limits even if they are exhausted, but it's short term. Personally I would prefer if Adrenaline just gave the speed boost and only gave the heal if they were slugged that way sure they would be faster for a bit, but they wouldn't completely reset a chase in the endgame.
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@Blinckx said:
What is sad is, everything people are saying now has been said in the PTB but, as usual, BHVR don't listen player's feedback
I legit made a thread explaining my experience playing Singularity from game to game and the outcomes mentioned in this thread are exactly what I experienced. This killer's gonna be extremely niche and hard to play for not much benefit.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3451990#Comment_3451990
She's the worst designed Killer and it isn't close. Her design manages to surpass even original Legion. She's excels at area denial and NOTHING else. She's completely useless without her 3-gen or Totem Defender.
I'm sorry, but the amount of Dull Merchant's that just sit and hold games hostage simply because they can is enough for me. I'm sorry that there will be people that (somehow) find enjoyment out of this complete train-wreck of a Killer and that it will, likely inevitably, be ruined for them.
She's the only Killer that I genuinely think would've been better off removed. She brings nothing positive into the game and while I applaud BHVR for not giving up on their creation, there's simply too much work to do, imo.
She's actually a decent stealth killer with enough effort put into playing her as such. She definitely doesn't need to hold a three gen or defend totems, but doing so makes her power more consistently useful because the survivors need to interact with her drones. With the way maps are designed and generally how big most of them are it is too easy for survivors to ignore her drones unless you place them in areas they need to go. The deployment and activation delay makes her less consistent at loops and the in my experience survivors just leave loops for a fresh tile without a drone on it as she can't do anything, but be a regular m1 killer. You're at no risk even in deadzone tiles unless you were already injured and she was actually closing in on you.
Her power isn't being used as intended and I think that is because their original intent was not in line with what they designed. She's good at area denial, but they wanted her to be a tracking/hunter. She lacks the tools to actually do that and part of doing that relies on stealth, but the current drones run counter to being a stealthy so you need a lot of perk support to fill in the gaps which is bad as it basically means that playing her using her power is the same as playing her without using her since the bulk of her actual support is perks.
There are good ideas in Skull Merchant and she's a sassy breath of fresh air visual wise, but her power needs to be retooled and probably shouldn't be so centered into her drones so she can actually do other things.
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Welp, no reason for me to play then.
I only care about BP I literally don't use shards for anything.
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3451855#Comment_3451855
Just because it worked like this for years does not mean it has to be set in stone. If anything, it shows how outdated the perk is.
And like I said, with the addition of the HUD icons, you can totally get consistent value out of it even without the ignoring effect. Not to mention that we are only talking about the sprint here, the heal would come either was. You just have to play a bit smarter then, not brainlessly use your exhaustion perks since you know you will still get you Adre sprint.
Let me ask you, what is your opinion on Adre? Is it fine or does it need a nerf / some toning down?
For me, it's a little bit to strong, esp. in swf. It's far from being "high risk, high reward" imo (that only applies to solo Q). With the right team, it's more of a "win harder" perk. How often does it really help a group that is struggling? I see it in my solo games, where we fight hard to get the last gens done and you really hope the one on dead hook being chased has it, but they usually don't. But where do you see it to great effect? 4 man groups rushing through the gens with resilience not bothering to heal bc they have Adre. And the one person you are chasing when the last gen pops just timed their other exhaustion perk right to get the double sprint boost.
So, how to nerf it? Removing the heal would kill it. Making it exclusively heal or sprint boost might work, but that also hurts solo more than swf than can coordinate well. But removing the exhaustion ignore would hurt SWF more than solo's, bc only the former can make make use of it consistently ("wait a sec for my SB to wear of, then pop the gen!"). And with the HUD changes, you have enough info available to not unintentionally use an exhaustion perk seconds before Adre pops.
As a mostly killer player I find it much more annoying that I can be mid chase with an injured survivor and they suddenly just get the whole health state I just took back which resets the chase to square one. Survivors just being faster for a few seconds is much more tolerable because depending on your killer and if they happen to misplay their speed boost at loop I have ways to capitalize on it to get the down. There isn't much to do when they get a health state and speed boost cause even if I counter the speed they still get to jog on. Removing the heal would kill the usage of the perk because it would just be hope which is a perk we already have.
In the past adrenaline was actually extremely popular, but also extremely inconsistent as it lost the speed during exhaustion and the perk would proc and burn out if you were hooked. The QoL changes it received over time made the perk overall more consistent which is better for survivor play which is ultimately fine. It's only when you have like multiple people with it where it feels super annoying. I think it is important to keep in mind that the HUD has no more effect on Adrenaline than comms does as the perk isn't reliant on timing anymore and hasn't been for years. It either works or doesn't which is just cleaner design overall.
If you really are deadset on putting a nerf out there just make the speed boost 125% for 3 seconds and remove the interaction with Freddy's power because that's literally something that was only needed when Freddy had his old power and no longer makes sense with his current power. It would weaken it just enough to still be worth running, but not feel as bad to play against and Freddy would be able to outplay adrenaline gamers since they'd be susceptible to his power
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3451849#Comment_3451849
The instant heal will likely never go away, the perk would be too weak without it. So whats left for adjusting is the sprint and the exhaustion ignore. About the sprint, many have already suggested to make Adre only give one, heal OR sprint. So that's nothing new.
BUT, I cannot recal an instance were someone suggested to remove the exhaustion ignore effect. That's a rather new take (atleast for me), so I posted about it. And imo, nerfing that aspect is actually justified just bc. of ther HUD changes.
People don't suggest it because that is how it used to work and the way it works now with ignoring exhaustion is a QoL to make the perk work more consistently.
Adrenaline is a Unique Perk belonging to Meg Thomas.Prestige Meg Thomas to Prestige 1, 2, 3 respectively to unlock Tier I, Tier II, Tier III of Adrenaline for all other Characters. Rework: Adrenaline now causes Exhaustion for 60/50/40 seconds. Quality of Life: ignores the Exhaustion condition. Quality of Life: Adrenaline is now on hold if you are disable at the moment it should take effect and will activate when freed. Quality of Life & Buff: Adrenaline now heals one Health State no matter the s -
@sizzlingmario4 said:
It should only be triggering when the killer directly kicks a generator. If stuff like Pain Res is activating it, you should report that as a bug. This used to work correctly but I haven’t used Blast Mine for a little while so it might’ve broke recently.
Pain res might be coded to act as a long distance disjointed kick and if so it probably has more weird interactions with counter gen kick perks
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Even as a predominantly killer player I will have to disagree with this. This is a perk interaction that makes sense for adrenaline and the most problematic part of the perk is the instant heal because a fast survivor with only one health state to worry about is much better than a normal speed survivor with 2 health states.
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@mikewelk said:
Yeah you have every right to be annoyed by that. If there's no counter to it, then it doesn't belong in the game. I had one like that recently but he messed it up because he was too trigger-happy lmao.
The counter is for your teammate who unhooks you to bodyblock for you to take the spear or force the break if you're already speared. I know not having a total get out of jail free card option sucks and depending on coordination in Soloq is a hard sale, but the strat to counter this was figured about 3 months into Slinger's lifespan.
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@TerraEsram said:
If we put aside the killers who camp, slugg, tunnel, from the beginning just for fun because they have a few things to prove to themselves, what I want to talk about is mainly related to the endgame chat...
Two case,
One time, at survivor, I faced a Blight, who... give us a hard times, but I survived with the gate open, I was the only one who survive, The killer say a "Gg" and, me, with some sort of habit, when I got a good team or face a good killer, I just say "well play everyone"
And there, the Blight respond that "No I don't think so, you are just so weak, you are nothing, I just let you live, you are just so stupid like the other"
I think it was... Kinda pathetic this reaction, like, we have done all gen, all the team help each other, in healing, all gen done... So, why? Why react like that? Like we are just some piece of ######### and we are nothing more than some amusement for a guy with a giant ego?
The second one is against some survivor, who, in game chat, insult each other because I let one of them survive... I got a hard time against the two other, one who are very good at looping, the other, just there for trying to bully, so, in the end, it left just two survivor at death hook, and, in the game chat, the feng and the nea just insult each other because one got the escape and the other not, saying thing like "you did nothing, you don't deserve escape"
Why... not just chilling and playing a game with some zenitude? Guy's... Chill... It's a videogame, it's technically something where you can decompress from your day...
Please, be more calm, don't forget that you are not alone here, everybody have some problem, some hard day, but we are here for having fun, killer or survivor, everyone, try to be a little more calm, and I'm pretty sure that a lot of problem in the community gonna be resolved
Thank you for reading me, and have a good day!
This is not a game people tend to play to decompress from a hard day. This a game where people often take out their frustrations on each other.
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@ElodieSimp said:
I see it in my games sometimes and a lot of YouTube videos. Why do killers chase down one survivor for a long time, usually at the start of the game, then get tilted in end game chat?
Any killer mains here that do this? If so what is the reason?
Sometimes that isn't the original intent of the killer, but a consequence of not knowing how to think objectively when a gen pops mid chase. A lot of player at every skill level sometimes just get swept up and stop thinking objectively and the blinders come down. You go for the person you're already chasing even though it's costing you the game by doing so. Especially if you've been playing a lot of games where you've just generally been needing to really sweat or play way outside your comfort zone. Emotions carry over from trial to trial and tunnel vision is usually the consequence.
I would caution against taking youtube videos to heart cause as someone else mentioned a lot of time it is just baby killers who've probably go 10 or 20 hours in the game at most getting stunted on by someone who basically plays this game for a living. That isn't to say that there aren't just bad killers who get caught in 4k doing bad chases and getting super salty just that dbd chases are junk food content that has a history of being farmed off players who didn't really stand a chance to begin with. Same with those killer destroys toxic survivor compilations, a lot of times it is clear there is a huge imbalance of skill and game knowledge.
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@NerfedFreddy said:
High mmr killers lobby shop too much. It messes up matchmaking really bad and distributes high mmr survivors down the ladder to weaker casual killers completely ruining their experience. BHVR should just remove lobby shopping either by locking everyone in lobby and penalizing for dodging or by hiding survivors, items, prestiges, profiles from killers
That would do more harm to the game than anything. People who "lobby shop" are still people consistently wanting to play the game. Forcing them to play games is a quick way to just burn them out faster than normal to the point they aren't going to play at all or take lengthy breaks which means matchmaking will still be just as poor.
I'm like in upper mid MMR most likely and tend to get paired up with groups who are usually trying to speedrun trials. So I'm usually only playing 2-5 games before I hop off from stress. I don't really care about prestiges, but if I see a lobby with toolboxes I'm out. It's such a pain to do these day since that seems to be all I'm getting so I'm usually only playing 1-3 games before going to do something else.
That's the problem with making this game as simple as it is, optimization and level balancing actually makes this sort of game not fun to play. There is no incentive to get better or play strong opponents cause the game is just worse the better you get at it.
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@nars said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3450770#Comment_3450770
Yeah the ranking systems a bit different now. Theres still 20 ranks in total, but their in groups of 5. In descending order, Ash -> Bronze -> Silver -> Gold -> Iridescent. If you meant MMR though i have no clue lol, got implemented a few years back and has been invisible since. But considering you just came from a 4 year hiatus, yours is probably in a lower bracket.
Heres a website to help you out --> https://otzdarva.com. Its got tier lists for everything, 4 different strong builds for each killer (including 4 soloQ builds and 4 builds for SWFs), and even a quiz to see which killer you'd like mosts. Hope it helps!
Yeah dead hard has had a... hard life this past year lol. Last years anniversary really shook up the meta by reworking 70 perks, one of which was DH. Back then, they just removed DH for distance so it could actually have counterplay and it fell out of the meta... for two weeks. Once people figured out how to use it it was back in full force with a 30% pickrate. It was completely unstoppable at pallets, because if you swung you got dhed and if you didnt you got stunned. So like 2 months ago they outright killed it.
I wanna elaborate a little on that unstoppable killer meta lol, the gen kick meta. So basically a perk called call of brine got released with sadako in the ring chapter, doubled kick regression nobody used it at the time because ruin was still good but after the nerf it was really popular. Then they buffed overcharge to ramp up to 200% speed regression, and buffed eruption. You are so lucky to have missed the eruption meta; when you kicked a gen, it would activate on it. When you downed a survivor, any gens afflicted will explode, losing 10% progress and giving any survs repairing them 25s incapacitated.
So basically, you had 300% regression along with eruption granting 40s per down. Gone now though thankfully, people would use the killers knight and skull merchant to make 3 gens unwinnable with these perks.
Heres a few things to look forward to by the way:
- Basekit anti facecamp
- Killer FOV slider
- nicolas cage midchapter
- anniversary (obviously)
- Hillbilly, trapper, freddy, and twins reworks. Hillbilly kinda got completely gutted while you were gone.
- new survivor items
theres barely any regression in the game now, so games dont really get drawn out for no reason most of the time. See you in the fog!
Clarification and Correction
Skull Merchant was not released while Eruption offered incapacitated status. She only got the benefit of about two and half months of Call of Brine and Overcharge pre-nerf. The "3 gen meta" and "gen kick meta" while having overlap should be explained as two separate and distinct events as the level of effect on the game between the two is not the same. 3 gen has been and still is a situational meta strat that can for games into lengthy stalemate scenarios. Gen kick meta conversely while making games longer on average than they should have been was not known for stalemating games long term just making them much harder to win.
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@WeakestNurseMain said:
The game is fundamentally flawed at its' most basic level, without fluff like ruin, pop, decisive, eruption, and dead hard, everyone's focus is on the core gameplay, which is:
- Do gens asap,
- try to protect someone from getting tunneled,
- try to 3E,
- repeat.
Or for Killers:
- Try to down someone asap,
- if first chase takes too long, tunnel,
- get one survivor out and then try to get a 2K to tie.
The games issues can of course be solved, but it'll take a long time if Behavior churns out content at the this pace. New game modes, official modding support, and better game optimization would go a long way in keeping the game going.
Short of an effective DBD 2 I don't see them solving the parent issues with the game and some of those issues are just part of the normal thing that happens when a game lasts as long as this one. it's on pace to match Payday 2 in terms of content produced and years of being an active game. Them adding a shop and battlepass has completely destroyed any chance for supporting mods as now there is far too much recurrent user spending to be potentially lost if mod restrictions were lessened. The game is probably as optimized as it is going to get in terms of performance unless they do a second engine update which I don't even think is a possible route for them now. At least they are working on getting new modes, but we'll have to see how that shakes out in practice.
A lot of the core design limitations and technical issues could be addressed with a sequel, but it's a massive risk and starting fresh means decided whether to try and support both or put the current game down and bury next to Naughty Bear and Deathgarden.
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@Jangles said:
I feel like this is a massive oversight. Can we make this happen? At the moment you just slam into air which is pretty lame. I want to throw someone at someone doing a gen on main street on haddonfield
While it would be a cool visual it would massively mess up his gameplay which currently extremely solid and feels good. It's be a while since we had a killer whose power didn't lowkey just screw them over cause it has some weird interaction.
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@Maxthewicked100 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3450175#Comment_3450175
I appreciate the open mindedness. It would probably need time to lift off but if it got thrown around it could be played with bots only with full progression to boot, give it time to flourish and queue times would be the least of anyone's concern. I just hope they'll update us soon on when bots get a proper update since they're adding them bit by bit. Mobile's already there and that was free. The PC version should be ahead.
Keep in mind the mobile game's principle development and tasking seems to be handled by NetEase. It's a different team with different goals and obligations. What you're currently asking is going to be a hard sale if you want to include progressing rifts which are strong money maker for the game currently. We should have some sort of PvE mode as it would open up the game to players who enjoy dbd's story and atmosphere, but not the PvP aspect, but all of that is being rolled into offshoot games that just take place in the same universe rather than the main game proper. They have said they are working on some different modes for events, but not much is known about that yet.
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@Gandor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3450154#Comment_3450154
if you do your gen "normally", it doesn't change anything. The perk is good to buy you "free" time, that you just can't reasonably insert into doing gens. Meaning - if you can heal self/someone, it's worth it. If you can unhook, it's worth it. If you need to do your challenge - you don't really waste team's time that much (well you waste 50% of normal time). If you need to loot chest for some good reason (hoping for self-heal) it's not THAT bad. If you use the time to continue working on the gen, then you just wasted perk slot.
But let's not be theoretical. Let's do math. Best toolbox in the game saves you 17.33s (that's commodius with scraps and spool AKA yellow and brown charges). 30s of repair at 50% speed means you just lost 15s of gen progress. So this whole perk gives you at best awesome 2.33s on gens. That's worthy of perk slot isn't? To be fair, you get more skillchecks. So if you play hyperfocus, then maybe it's usable. But generally - even resilience will buy you more time and is better perk. So no. In reality if you don't want to change the perk to basically give you meager 2.33s, you absolutely NOT continue to work on a gen, because that way you get full downtime from the perk - turning the perk to in best case very niche (something for hyperfocus genrush build just to abuse more skillchecks only) and in worst case to the worst positive-result gen-repairing perk in whole game.
As for your brown toolbox - let's totally forget moving time, because that would just kill your idea then and there. Rummaging takes 6s. But brown toolbox will save you whooping 5.33s. Net result? You just lost 0.67s just by taking the item out. So no. The rummage part is absolutely and irredeemably bad if you are talking about "genrush" potential and you actively loose something if you try to take advantage of it no matter the circumstances if we are talking efficiency. In fact the only reasonable usage is to use it as (a very very slow) sabotage toolbox for 2 uses OR if you want to "burst" that gen, because it's 90% done and you see killer running at you from distance (but again, you only got to this situation, because you decided it's good idea to rummage said toolbox instead of being on the gen).
So to sum up. The perk barely hits any positive efficiency if you want to sit on a gen from start to end. You are much more likely to get benefit from basically any other genspeed perk over this one. The only real benefit this perk gives you in terms of efficiency is when there's stuff to be done outside of repairing gen during it's reduced efficiency time. Overall outside of hyperfocus niche build, this perk almost does more harm then good if your goal is to only repair gens as fast as possible.
My goal is to not have wild variance in game pacing. I generally want a reduction to efficiency outliers by enforcing actual down time if a perk is going to restore charges to an item. Scavenger should be held to same function and timing standards as Built to Last and Flashbang where to get the benefit you should be forced to drop what you're currently doing and go through a non productive period or don't receive the benefit until you do.
I don't like toolboxes and I don't want a perk that can give toolboxes more capability to influence the pace of my games. It would be different if there weren't already a ton of perks that are seeing regular usage that only serve to make the game go faster than it should be going. The thing I hate most about this game is I can have 4 minute game or 40 minute game, but at least the odd 40 minute game is also a high scoring game where as the much more common 4-7 min games are generally low scoring and not particularly enjoyable because that level of barely restrained efficiency is handle generally makes this stressful. So, since killers aren't really allowed to have such strong effect on gen speed reduction survivors should not be given more tools to keep adding more variance to the game pace. Games should be 9-15 mins and no longer than 30 at max. I want the game to be more consistent instead of dealing with perks and items that genuinely throw the game out of wack. This isn't even about a full on gen rush it's simply me wanting literally anyone to understand that this game is getting optimized to death and we need to seriously start curving the efficiency potential in meaningful ways across the board.
Perks like Scavenger exacerbate the issue just like perks CoB, Overcharge, Older versions Ruin had the potential to do in the other direction. I want fun medium length games where we all get plenty of bp. That's what I want. I don't the game to be super slow and survivors to be unable to do anything, but I certainly don't want anything that even remotely increases the ability to make the game go faster. This perk isn't all that bad, but it certainly doesn't need to exist in the form it did on ptb or will on live when we need to be pulling back on all the others perks and toolbox addons.
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@Gandor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3449999#Comment_3449999
those -50% means it's not genrush. 30s not being able to effectively work on gen = it's NOT a genrush perk. Means if you use the toolbox immediately, then you just wasted it. So no diminishing returns. It just is NOT genrush. It's burst repair. That's it. If you use your toolbox to "mitigate" -50% malus, then you don't have toolbox once the malus runs out so you wasted perkslot for NOTHING.
Not to mention, that you don't get skillcheck every 2s, so you will not get like 10 refreshed toolboxes anyway (most of the time you can realistically expect 1 extra toolbox from this perk).
And rummage is most wasted stuff - brown toolbox gives nothing....
Did I mention genrushing? No. You're in such a hurry to defend the perk you're not even paying attention to what I said.
It's not about using the toolbox immediately, it's about the fact that you can REPLENISH THE DANG THING WITHOUT NEEDING TO GET OFF THE GEN. It should be held to the same function as flashbangs and built to last as that would mean that survivors needed to stop working and to go through a small downtime period. It serves as a better efficiency cap than just saying "lol 50% repair speed for 30 seconds surely isn't a benefit". The diminished return is still a return being able to continue your up time of doing just GENERAL REPAIR WITHOUT THE TOOLBOX WHILE GAINING CHARGES FOR YOUR TOOLBOX IS OVERLY EFFICIENT.
The true limiting factor of this perk is the great skill check requirements rather than 50% cut to gen repair speed because as I said that can be mitigated. So I'm looking at it from a stand point of we're not actually getting a 50% cut but instead depending on the scenario and the loadout of your team mates we could be getting a 50% or less, like 45% or 40% depending on how Scavenger interacts with other perks during that 30 second period. Like if you hard capped during period and the game won't let any other perk act as a mitigating factor the it's moot. It'd still be a return that I disagree with, but it would have consistency which is preferred. If it can be mitigated then the question is to what degree because if the perk says 50%, but with the right combination of perks spread across the rest of your team that 50% is in reality more like 40% or god forbid less than 40% it would be problematic.
Brown Toolboxes is still so it does give something. Also one extra toolbox is kind of bigger deal than you're wanting to give it credit for considering toolboxes are and have been unbalanced for a very long time. Now why do I care this much about it? Because I strongly feel we should keep adding perks to the game that mess with consistency of how a trial is paced. The game can swing between going too fast to being absolutely punishing cause nothing seems to get done fast enough. Borked on both sides, but at least with killers it isn't as borked as used to be because most regression perks have been flattened out. The same can't be said for survivors' repair speed perks and items. So yes, I want survivors to have tangible hard cut to their efficiency and the best way to have that is to make them get of have to get in a locker for bit.
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@DaddyMyers_Mori said:
The hell are buzz cuts?
It's a very short utilitarian hair cut often seen on men. It's really common among military personnel as it is quick, looks clean, and can be done by soldier in the field with little to no barber training.
There are different styles of buzz cuts but generally they are half step before you just get a complete bald head. They are also known as Fades in the black community, but there is some variants such as a Hi-Top Fade which basically leaves most the of the hair intact while trimming down the sides and hairline to buzzcut level.
Actually I just remembered Adam exists has a Hi-Top Fade.
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@Gandor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3449868#Comment_3449868
You literally get 0 effect if you repair during that 30s with said toolbox. You just burn it down for no reason. So no. It does nothing for genrush. Now it's only good for repair bursts. -50% for 30s does exactly that...
The problem isn't them trying to use the toolbox during the reduced period it is the fact they don't have to stop doing the gen to get charges on their toolbox. It's an efficiency problem which is why I said diminishing returns are still returns.
Every other item perk that gives you a new item or restocks the charges on your item makes you actively stop doing what your doing and go spend time doing something else. Scavenger still allows you to have uptime on repairs but a slower rate for 30 seconds, but that really doesn't matter since 50% repair speed that can be mitigated means not much was truly lost in efficiency.
On top of letting you rummage for another toolbox.
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@mca240 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3449879#Comment_3449879
Hag can teleport anywhere on the map. The key is to place traps strategically and defend an area. Not simply place traps at hooks and proxy camp. Her lower speed is negated by her teleporting abilities. It just boils down to lazy players abusing her power to put minimal effort into player a killer like the Cannibal standing next to an hook. I think it would be much healthier to remove her ability to set traps next to an hook.
She can teleport to her traps which theoretically can be placed anywhere on the map, but she has a distance restriction on how far away she can be from a triggered trap before she can't teleport to it.
You also can put down a lot of traps, but you don't necessarily want to spend time placing them everywhere, only where they are most useful to you.
Press the Active Ability button to teleport to a tripped Phantasm Trap located within a range of 40 metres, taking the place of the Mud Phantasm
So you put some at loops and a few near the hook.
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@mca240 said:
Hag is an interesting killer with plenty of potential. Nobody however tries to master her. All the do is spam traps near an hooked survivor, preferably in basement, leading to very stale gameplay.
Why is it an Artist cannot set up birds next to an hooked survivor but an Hag can? Makes no sense in my head.
Artist and Hag aren't comparable.
Artist isn't a trap setting killer while Hag is. The reason why Hag can and does set traps at hooks is because they constitute her mobility as she's 110% movement speed killer and thus can't traverse as fast which means her ability to defend and for hook trades lives and dies based on having her traps there. Mastering Hag is about figuring out how to minimize the amount of time lost setting up traps. In Artist's ptb she had the ability to be played as a trap setting style killer, but that sort of got axed cause she was really really strong in a way that was hard to deal with.
Unlike Trapper who is better off not trapping the hook as his traps could be in more effective places for countering chases since he has to spend a lot of time to reposition. That isn't to say there aren't good times for Trapper to trap hooks, but you're gonna need to physically spend time getting that trap later. Hag can just throw down traps pretty freely so she doesn't really lose much time trapping hooks and loops at will.
Mastering a killer is about mastering how to get the most value out your killer both offensively and defensively.
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@Gandor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/378394/generator-speeds-are-not-ok
I would like to know where your math comes from. Because AFAIK proof knocks off ~6s from gen. Yes. It's 7s if 2 people are working on a single gen. The thing is, that the effect it provides barely counters basekit malus for multiple survivors working on a single gen.
Going into math: both basekit malus and perk are 15%, but the base from which you count is different - to illustrate base speed is 100%. If 2 survivors work on a gen, each will get 15% malus for 85% repair speed. Now you take this new base 85% and you calculate +15% from this base - which is 0,85*1,15 = 0,9775 speed or to use percents again - you get 97,75% repair speed. Meaning that if we take gens take 90s to repair, but you have 2 people working on it, you would theoretically do it in 45s if there were no modifiers. With proof and basekit malus, it's 90s/(0,9775*2) ~= 46,0358s instead. Without proof, you get 90s/(0,85*2)=~52,9412s to repair the gen. Given the difference between these 2 numbers, proof actually shaves off little less then 7s. This presumes no great skillcheck/toolboxes/anything else is in play (because those would eat away from that bonus even a little more). Now I am really curious how you came up with 30s, because this just does not add up no matter how I try. Also as you can see even better then using proof is to split to 2 gens where you get 2 gens completed in 90s which can be averaged into 45s/gen or 100% speed (meaning you do your gen ~1s quicker AND save a perk slot).
And for scavenger - it seems you are misinformed. It was already stated, that PTB version of this perk will NOT go live. The perk got changed completely and even though it will still remain mildly useful in niche cases, it will absolutely not boost your repair speed (basically they added extra token for requirement and as the perk activates it provides huge debuff for gen repair for 30s - making it useless for genrush purposes and instead making it only good for batch-like repairs - basically only useful against 3gen camping)
Where others see junk, you see valuable improvised tools.
While holding a depleted Toolbox, Scavenger activates:
- Succeeding at Great Repairing Skill Checks grants 1 Token, up to a maximum of 5.
- Reaching the maximum number of Tokens automatically consumes them and fully recharges the Toolbox.
- Activating Scavenger will reduce your Generator repair speed by -50 % for 40/35/30 seconds.
Scavenger grants the ability to rummage through an opened Chest once per Trial and will guarantee a basic Toolbox
It's not that huge and the offset can be somewhat itself be offset. Diminishing returns are still returns and the only real limiting factor is hitting great skill checks which while nearly impossible for new and low skill players is something fairly common for intermediate and high skill players as long as they don't have dead cat reflexes or lackluster internet connection.
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@Kaitsja said:
Apparently WoO is now an overpowered perk because it has the highest usage rate. My question to you, the community (admittedly a small part of the community), is whether or not the perk itself is a problem or if it's maps that allow strong loops to be chained together that is the problem?
Due to its usage rate, WoO is being likened to pre-nerf DH and DS which were must-pick perks due to how you could use DH to extend chases and DS to get a free escape in EGC. These two perks dominated the charts in terms of usage rate.
It on it's own isn't that great
It in the context of maps oversaturated with vaults and palettes can be tedious. It's a perk that allows us to optimize the guess work out of a loop
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@Xxjwaynexx said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3449340#Comment_3449340
As a nurse main, nurse is easy when you play survivors that don't punish missed blinks, whiffs, dont abuse los blocks, edge map, as well as the environment, and give second chances every moment. Don't get me wrong she's extremely oppressive but shes not unstoppable. 90% of nurses are mid tier. After playing for more than 1500 h I've found out that most of the player base is just bad, Survivors that know how to play against nurse punish her constantly. It's like everyone sees Alf or Knightlight and assume all nurses are that cracked they're not lol. I promise you spend 4 to 5k hours on any killer they'll be cracked though. They could take away the second teleport and it would seem more balanced but we all know they aint changing her or blight due to the power of swf.
Yes any killer is easy and oppressive to bad players, but that's not my point. I don't base whether or not a killer is easy to learn and play around survivors skill or lack thereof. Nurse is mechanically difficult to learn to play and proportionally she's also quite strong which is my rebuttal to someone who is of the opinion that Nurse is relatively easy and too strong as a result.
The vast majority of Nurse's aren't cracked precisely because she has rather steep learning curve regardless of the caliber of the survivors they're up against and unlike in the past before she minor reworks and addons passes she was difficult to learn, but also had more external tools to cover up for player deficiencies.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3449340#Comment_3449340
He's actually fairly strong in the current meta.
I didn't say wasn't strong at all, but he's not comparable to Nurse in terms of strength.
He's in a good spot right, but that spot isn't particularly strong. Like he's not stronger than he should be for the level of skill required to play him. That's what I was calling out along with Nurse being too easy to be as strong as she is which is untrue because she's actually quite difficult to learn. After all the addon passes and minor reworks to power she's harder to learn now than she was in the past because you don't have the addons to cover for making errors in blinks.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3449223#Comment_3449223
Nope, I did not. Trapper is one of the weakest Killers, but this is fine. He is a simple Killer, it is ok that a Killer like him is not as strong as e.g. Blight or Wesker. (The only outliers are Nurse and Wraith IMO, both too strong for how easy they are to use (relatively))
The rest of your post is nonsense as well.
Maybe... it is you who is the problem? And not the Killer you are playing?
Nurse isn't easy to use at all and Wraith is easy to use and not particularly strong.
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@Celalbey said:
I think unlicensed killers and survivors should be 250 auric cells and should not be sold with iridescent shards, because people don't use the shrine of secrets that would give them a reason to use it and buy more stuff.
People still wouldn't use the Shrine of Secrets because it's current setup is extremely old and needs substantial work.
The changes made to lessen the grind actually run counter to the value the shrine used to provide so now it basically wastes your shards. You're better off just actually prestiging characters with bp as it is faster and not hampered by the rng of 200 perks with 3 tiers each with escalating shard costs. No one is dumping 12k to unlock a perk from tier 1 to tier 3 when it could be used to buy a original killer and cosmetic or two.
There is absolutely no value add to paying for stuff in the shrine unless you need perks to do a tome for a chapter you didn't buy.
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@Veroles said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3448910#Comment_3448910
I wouldn't even say it's fair. I think it's neither unfair nor fair. It is simply part of the game like camping or tunneling also. It is just not happily seen. But it's the same with camping and tunneling more or less.
I think everything is a question about necessity.
Is it really necessary to play certain gameplay to stomp people out of their life when they obviously not even have a chance to do anything and are absolutely not even close on the same level? That's a question what everybody has to answer to themselves if that is okay for you personal or not.
I at least do not stomp everybody because i simply play both sides more or less the same and have a certain feeling what feels unnecessary and what not.
Most things that happen in dbd are unnecessary and this is game where you can go from a 4 man slugfest to 4 man escape in 4 mins.
It's a game of extremes in which is fair or unfair based on a player's perspective at the time. Sometimes it is necessary to play in ways that absolutely take the fun out of the game for your opponents and you have no way of knowing what their skill level is generally until you're at the end screen of a trial.
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@betelgeuseyes said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3448248#Comment_3448248
I wasn't sure about that, thanks for clarifying.
My point is, in order to escape, 5 gens and a gate needs to get done aswell as survive the killer and their powers.
All the killer needs to do is down them. Not even hook them.
And you guys think that's fair?
Yes that's fair, the killer's objective is much harder than you're wanting to give credit to.
It isn't easy to kill survivors and most killers will never win a game where they go for a 4 man slug as you need to juggle to play the mind game of can they get up or not. It's an insanely boring waste of time that more often than you think will make you lose the game. You also have to keep in mind while y'all have to work somewhat cooperatively you have strength in numbers to start while the killer only has their power to rely on. It can be a tremendous amount of work depending on what your power is, what map you're on, the skill of the survivors, and how much rng wants to favor or destroy you.
Not saying it is a great system, but the objectives for both sides are deceptively simple by design yet have weird layers of complexity. MMR is extremely flawed in this game and the games get worse the further up you go so it isn't anything to worry about.