NekoTorvic
NekoTorvic
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@aorion said:
I have been saying this for a while. The discord is very positive. Apparently you don't need perks to slow gens. And you should be able to hook before 3 gens every time (45s from the start of the game). And all killers are viable.
Obviously this isn't true. Basically if you play a killer with less than rank 3 meta perks specifically for slowing the game down, you're toast in about 5 minutes. You can run to exactly one survivor, down, hook, and lose the first gen. Then run to the next survivor, down, hook, and lose 1 more gen. 2 if you were just a little too slow. Oh and everyone had time to heal as well.
Then you have 4 people completing 3 gens. If they are any distance at all apart, you are toast. You have about 45s before the next gen pops, so you need to kick people off gens. But you can't cover all that ground so you are scrambling just to get at least someone sacrificed, so that's where your rule comes in.
The real problem is, you can't base the game balance around perks, because then the game is by definition unbalanced once perks are not available. Nobody who had not leveled multiple of the correct killers for at least a million blood points is going to be able to play a "fair game". I suspect that with ruin and undying, gen speed is about "fair". So by definition, if you are running without that, or some substitute, then gen repair time is objectively not balanced.
The only real solution is a rebalance starting with significantly increased repair difficulty, and after that, tune ruin etc. Down as necessary. This will make more perk combinations and more killers viable.
I mostly agree, though, Im not sure it's just a gen speed issue.
Gens are too simple and too safe. They literally consist of holding a singular button on the other side of the map while the killer isn't looking.
Whenever Im having 20 second chases and still gens are popping, I don't feel outplayed. In fact the only thing i feel is "I'm busting my arse trying to outplay and manage these people over and over again and all they have to ######### do is hold M1 to pressure me" It's a frustrating feeling that eventually devolves into contempt during matches and it also devolves into the tactics I mentioned above. Slugging everyone and 1 or 2 hooking everyone is generally easier than chasing everyone at least 3 times, so is tunneling someone early, or camping a specific area of the map, but what is my incentive to make the game harder on myself (impossibly harder with some characters) if all the survivors are doing is "hold m1 for a bit while listening to music"?...
I think the whole system is poorly designed, but then when we get to things like gen slowdown perks, all it translates to from the survivor perspective is "I have to hold m1 for longer now" which also isn't ideal.
It's a complicated issue, and I can't presume to have the answers. I just think the way people tend to think about these issues is a bit misguided or oversimplified, which is why i made the post.
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@Awakey said:
What I'm getting from this post is "I don't like perfectly valid, fun for the killer strategies because they aren't fun for the survivor."
Got it.
Edit: Clarity.
I engage in all those three tactics whenever I feel I have to. I'm not above them, nor am I judging any killer for engaging in them. I truly believe that given the current state of the game, they are completely valid tactics, and I will not ever presume to speak for what is and isn't fun for other people.
However, what I'm saying is simply that these tactics, quite undeniably, deprive survivors from engaging with the game, and that there is a sizeable chunk of the survivor population who gets very aggravated by them. A survivor tunneled cannot engage with proper chases, for they will always be injured, they cant do totems, save their teammates, do gens, search chests and get goodies... A survivor camped stares at their screen without being able to do anything at all, and a survivor slugged has a similar experience.
For the sake of both sides having the best experience and engagement with the game, regardless of whether they win or lose, I think there should be some changes so that these tactics aren't the most effective way to play killer. I would prefer if survivors have a good time playing too.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
I agree with this post. This is why you should not listen survivors when it comes to "UNDYING+RUIN IS OP REEEEEEEE" or "Freddy OP". Killers use these game slowdown perks so that their chasing skill gets rewarded and it allows them to go many more chases as chasing with killer is pretty fun but having issues extreme game tempo for doing so is not fun. Weakening perks like Pop goes weasel or Thanophobia(Slowing healing) and releasing underwhelming perks like Surge or this new Oppression perk or Dying light is not exactly helpful and only makes people run more uniform builds. After they wonder, "Why is ruin used 95% of the time" and its like... um maybe because perks that slowdown generator kinda suck? Killer use perks to slow gamedown to try remedy problem of slow killers that are simply too slow at getting downs for game tempo and if those perk aren't enough to solve the problem than killer will start to use strategies to cut corners.
Ethan made statement in Q&A that he is uninterested in adding new effective perks because he is afraid of power-creep apparently but I doubt the guy who asking about meta perks was asking for powercreep perks, more over he was probably asking for more alternative perk options that are not plagued with braindead drawbacks(Cooldowns, Counter-productive effects such as visual cues on stealth perk), too many conditions(Basic attack, timers,Bloodlust etc.) or ineffective rewards(e.g Furtive chase,Monstrous Shrine, Gearhead etc.) that intentional make the perk worthless. Just another one of those great mystery answers.
I honeslty would prefer to completely axe gen slowdown perks entirely and balance the game around more utility based perks...perks like STBFL, Blood Favor, Spirit Fury, Enduring, Brutal Strength, PWYF, Thrilling Tremors, BBQ, Nurses, Monitor...all provide gameplay advantages and can open up different possibilities. Genperks skew the perseption of game length, and basically translate to: survivors hold m1 for longer... I think gens are just a big issue in general. Rui + Undying are necessary in the current meta (i never use them though), but i don't think they're healthy because it's best if the base game is in a good state instead of requiring these perks for decently paced matches.
I would honestly prefer if the game had more base mechanics instead of just adding perks for everything.. but i guess i see where they're coming from. As much as I do appreciate good perks, making some perks to allow for certain niche playstyles for players who would like to engage with them is a good thing for those players. However I absolutely despise the idea of them using that as an excuse to make perks completely ######### useless, like Coup de Grace...######### insult of a perk... Also Shadowborn...what a disgrace to put a QoL option in the form of one quarter of your loadout...this one is embarrassing.
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@MasonOliver123 said:
I’d say it’s not really to deprive survivors of gameplay, it’s the most effective way to play the killer.
its human nature to do anything the most effective way, if you’re able to, why wouldn’t you?
Of course. Like I said in the post, Killers don't do these things to purposefully deprive survivors of gameplay out of malice... However, the most effective way to play as killer just so happens to be something that denies them of a gameplay experience. Tunneling, slugging and camping are all effective strategies when applied well by good killers, but they all deny survivors of gameplay in some measure, they prevent survivors from engaging with the game and making plays.
Maybe this is something we should recognize and maybe it's something that would be best changed in some way, instead of just throwing a tantrum at what the other side does. I'm not saying you're doing this btw. I'm just explaining what I feel is the point of my post.
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Literally no reason why the transition takes so long... its another one of those things where they add a downside/slowdown to a killer ability for no reason.
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Well you see, for no good reason, Lery's, Hawkins, Midwich, Badham and Ormond all run like absolute dog ######### for me... and they didnt use to. 35FPS in some places in Ormond...what the actual #########
I cannot be happy playing in these maps when they run so bad, because it's sickening and i do mean it literally, it makes me sick to look at the game when the frames are dipping so bad. This game does not have ANY excuse to run this bad, and if I have to turn the graphics to low just so I can play the videogame then what the hell is the point...there are way more complicated games that my computer runs without a hiccup on higher settings.
I absolutely love the McMillan remake, except for the breakable walls. Yamaoka is fine. Autohaven is a bit too dark but mostly fine.
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Loops can be pretty mindless sometimes...but it is the main mechanic by which survivors avoid killers and some tile chaining requires a decent level of attention from survivors to pull off. There are plenty of killers that can deal with loops.
Doctor shuts them down.
Freddy and Clown prevent them from going on for too long.
Slinger and Huntress shoot over them.
Pyramid Head has an option select and hits through things.
Nurse goes through stuff.
Spirit can mindgame any tile.
Hag doesn't need to go on chases at all, she just places traps.
I honestly find survivors that just hold W a lot worse than loopers....at least loopers, *sometimes* try to outplay you. W key survivors literally just shut their brain off and abuse the fact you catch up very slowly. For those, I recommend Blight.
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The Twins are literally just another killer that does everything too slow to compete with gens. Slinger has the same problem. His chase potential is amazing, but if survivors keep their cool and hold that precious M1 button, the game is over.
There are killers with way better anti loop than the twins. They usually are way more practical to use and a lot more expedient, which in turn allows them to better compete with gens, makes them better at chase and allows killer skill to better translate into pressure.
Hag and Bubba are way better at camping than the Twins...and to be honest if that's what they have going for them I don't think they are good for the game.
Also Hag is literally better at them at being at multiple places at once. Her traps give her more map control, and unlike the disgustingly sluggish transition between Charlotte and Victor, you can instantly teleport to an activated trap, or mindgame the activated trap, because the survivor doesn't have a 100% clear telltale of whether you're gonna teleport or come from a different angle for a cheeky unexpected hit (unlike the massively telegraphed transition between Victor and Charlotte). Unlike Victor, the Hag can actually down survivors instantly instead of spending 15+ seconds lining up a shot because survivors spammed their A and D keys barely thinking, and Unlike the Twins, Hag can be in up to 11 places at once...and can pick up a downed survivor... and kick a gen...and patrol hooks...and search lockers...
I absolutely love the aesthetic and concept of the Twins... I love their music. I love the potential an idea like that could have in the game. The execution was sloppy and lackluster and the fact that this killer is literally the opposite of time efficient just kind of baffles me...like how, after 4 years, do the devs still believe that a killer doing everything slowly can compete.... its honestly like they balance the game around survivors not understanding that all they have to do to win is hold M1 for a bit...This is not even speaking of the actual quality of the game itself, but that's a different discussion entirely.
All in all, I hope I'm wrong and i hope you're right, because we don't need useless worthless killers. We need interesting, strong killers that allow the skill of their players to shrine in game. Just doesn't seem to be the case...
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-Every single snow mound on the new Ormond and the benches in Ormond. They have 0 collision.
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Since the PTB, i realised that Blight is the funnest thing they've added to the game for me. The experience can be frustrating because they still have to fix collisions with props and environment. Theres so many things you slide off of, and so many things that are barely in your FOV that you still collide with.
However, zooming around, predicting survivor movements and smacking them in the face is extremely satisfying. His counterplay is easier than it should be at base, but with turning addons he becomes a massive powerhouse.
The only limiting factor with him is his very low FOV, but that will eventually be raised, tracking scratch marks will become a lot easier. His collisions will eventually be fixed as well, so he should become more consistent.
I still feel he could have something in his kit that relates more to his lore. You'd think he'd be able to do something with the serum as part of his kit...at the moment his serum injection is just cosmetic. I kinda like the effect he used to have with one iri addons where he would release some smoke that would hinder survivors when slamming...But he is so strong already that I feel extra tools could be too much.
All in all, awesome killer. Love the design, love zooming around, love that he's pretty strong, love the horrible growls and noises he makes al the time, love his first person animations, love how complex his power is. Altohugh I hate his his first person cast shadow looks...have you seen how goofy it is? holy ######### why cant they just give us the 3rd person model shadows XD
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Verbs with a noun counterpart like the that usually are pronounced with a Z sound at the end.
House(/haʊs/) - Noun
House (/haʊz/) - Verb
Same thing happens with Abuse (/əˈbjuːs/) or (/əˈbjuːz/).
Uh-Byuus is a noun
Uh-Byuuz is a verb.
In the case of the perk, I believe both Monitor and Abuse are used as verbs, so it's pronounced with a Z at the end. However...it ultimately doesn't matter too much. Pronounce it however you like.
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Keep it exactly as it is but without the basic attack requirement and without it being a hex, make the cooldown it's duration. I honestly believe the effect is mild enough that if left as is, it doesn't have to be a hex, have the basic attack requirement or even a cooldown....if you must give it a cooldown, the cooldown Quick And Quiet has is good enough... I honestly think the cooldown could just be the perk duration and it wouldn't be busted.
-It becomes a direct counter to Power Struggle/FlipFlop/UB combo. Pallet saves become impossible at the cost of one perk slot, similar to lightborn making flashlight saves impossible.
-The perk forces survivors to leave the current tile in a chase, and punishes them hard if they choose to stay, but if they move away from the perk range with their on hit sprint burst, they they counter the perk.
So if you hit someone at shack and they choose to stay at shack, they must play extremely well with the window until the pallet unblocks, or they die.
I do however see the possibility of coming through the window at shack with bamboozle, getting a hit, blocking the pallet and now the survivor has no options at shack. But again, the counter is simply to leave shack for another tile with your on hit sprint burst.
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When the game is balanced around the killer being able to get 12 hooks and survivors dont win the game in 3 minutes by literally holding a singular button, i dont care if a killer than tunnels literally explodes and gives survivors an automatic victory and 50k BP while getting deranked and banned for 5 minutes... But the game isn't balanced like that, so whatever killers do to make the game easier on themselves, as scummy as it may be, is fair game...
Nothing a killer can do comes even close to being as easy as repairing a generator.
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It doesnt even matter to me if its situational, even though I think people who dismiss it as such grossly underestimate how abusable this perk will be with the right set up...
Ultimate its yet another perk on the survivor side that can have it's description swapped with the following: Undo the fact you were outplayed or made a mistake by pressing/holding a button and waste the killer's time for free.
DS, BT, UB, SB, DH, SG all of these can have that description...and Power Struggle is no different.
The only perks that killers have that come even close are, NOED, Enduring, Spirit Fury and Unrelenting....the only strong one there is NOED... compare that to the survivor meta...
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To be fair... id rather axe every gen defense perk aside from info perks from the killer side if the game was actually in a state where matches didnt last 2 seconds without them.
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This.... nothing like losing all momentum because you misplaced a slug you couldnt hear...even if it's 6 extra seconds you spend looking for them instead of hooking them and moving on, it's free time youre giving the survivors cuz the game cant be bothered to work properly.
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This idea is a decent compromise. It still makes BT a protection perk, while not allowing a survivor to just block a doorway, when you as the killer are trying to be nice and not going for them, because they believe a perk makes them invincible.
I really dislike how easily BT can get used to make dumb plays that are basically unwinnable for killer, especially when paired with DS.
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As killer, BT and DS combo. I understand the necessity for those perks, but if a survivor, for a split second tries to prevent me from hitting the unhooker, because they were rescued with BT and they have DS so they think they are invincible, I will tunnel that person out of existence. I do not appreciate being outperked. Those perks are supposed to protect you against scummy tactics, but they end up just allowing you to play stupidly, because you think you're invincible. Luckily Blight doesn't care about BT or DS, so usually I catch those survivors pretty quick.
As a survivor: Devour Hope. I hate this hex with a passion. At the very least NOED, you can see coming and if NOED procs, the game is over, you can just leave, and you have the whole game to get rid of it. Devour Hope is insidious, and when it procs you're doomed, especially on swamp maps or maps where totems are near unfindable. Its one of those perks that makes you feel like you've been outperked more than outplayed.
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Repairing a generator is the easiest thing in the game aside from just being AFK. Until repairing generators actually requires some measure of effort, I do not care what killer players do to make the game easier on themselves.
That being said, I understand how tunneling can be quite unpleasant and annoying same as camping. I think punishing tunnelers on its own is a good way to get a bunch of killers to not even touch the game again.
The way to fix it is by making game pacing more reasonable, and going on multiple chases, against multiple people more rewarding, and then you can actually punish tunneling, because at that point, only people who do it out of malice would remain.
I couldn't care less about Blood Points if my matches are lasting 5 minutes because survivors AFK on gens. It should be a tangible, in-game incentive to make killers want to go for multiple targets.
About your ideas specifically:
-Your idea of making hooks work like PH's cages would completely destroy the potential of any killer to exert control and pressure over specific areas of the map. Killers with low mobility will be unable to lockdown an area by hooking strategically between a 3 or 4 gen, meaning they will be at a massive disadvantage from the get go against killers with more mobility. During mid to late game killers who havent killed at least 1 or 2 people might as well just give up entirely, because even if they get a survivor down, all survivors need to do is unhook and heal, reset and the killer has 0 pressure again.
-A debuff to hooked survivors could be interesting, but flat gen speed reduction can be pretty unpleasant. Gens are boring. Holding M1 for longer is not the way I'd go about fixing how fast they can go. Maybe skillchecks could be harder similar to lullaby? you get a massive reduction in skill check warning cuz your character is clumsier cuz they're wounded? Also just a flat speed reduction will make late game almost unwinnable for survivors, especially if the killer managed to secure a 3 gen.
Also maybe getting a speed boost after hooking every new survivor? kind of like devour hope? Maybe not as strong, something like 5% for like 10 seconds? that way it incentivizes even low mobility killers to move away towards other survivors and they will also think "i need to get the best use out of my speed boost! it might even make my next chase just that little bit easier, at least for the first hit" It rewards them for playing well and incentivizes them to go for other survivors.
-The emblem thing, I don't think is a good idea flat out. I can tell you I would much rather have games that last a decent amount by tunneling someone out of the game early, than be rank 1 and risk survivors finishing gens in 2 seconds...Now imagine killers that actually know how to end chases in 20 seconds or less against decent survivors going against lower ranks, because, as much as people like to pretend killers that tunnel are incompetent, there are killers who have strong chase, but still get nuked by gens and killers who are very very very good but sdtill have to resort to tunneling if they are trying to win. That would ruin the time of lower rank survivors and wouldnt really fix the problem, unless the killer actually gives a damn about the emblem system.
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This is precisely the reason his power is still used mostly in animation locks despite the nerf to try and fix it. You have to be very very good using his power and even so, the survivor has the last say on whether it lands or not.
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Blood favor literally counters itself. Block pallets close to you, survivor gets speed boost and runs to pallets far from you... and you need to use a basic attack to trigger it... and it's a hex...ant it has a cooldown. It's bad.
It could be decent imo if two things happen:
-Stop it being a hex, make it a normal perk with a reasonable cooldown. A cooldown like I'm All Ears would be decent on it. It is definitely not strong enough to deserve a 60 or 80s cooldown if its a normal perk.
-Remove the basic hit requirement. That way it starts to synergize with killers a lot more and it's a direct counter to pallet saves and the soon to be added, newest "undo the fact you made a mistake by pressing a button" combo: Power Struggle, FlipFlop and UB.
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Gens. The single worst part of this game. If you lose to gens its because survivors held a button...what an outplay. If you win as survivor it means you and your team held M1, you sure beat that killer! Holding M1 on the other side of the map while your teammate lasted about 20 seconds in chase but you won anyways...
Many suggestions have been given to solve the issue of gens. I don't think the answer is a basic "make them last longer" cuz it's just boring for the survivors.
One of my favorite ideas is one where survivors need to grab parts scattered around the map. This makes it so survivors can't just sit in a corner listening to music and looking at memes while the bar fills up... they have to put themselves in some sort of danger and go around the map.
Something important is to make completing gens not as simple as holding a single button. I don't care if its puzzles, I don't care if its a rhythm QTE, something needs to be done so completing these things doesn't just consist of hold M1 to win videogame.
There isn't a single thing in the game that is as easy as the core of the survivor's main objective. Maybe camping insidious Bubba...and even that requires at the very least one chase, so Bubba would have to outplay one survivor at least 1 time.
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About your Hatch idea. I kind of like it, but I think this idea underestimates how much a survivor can just extend chases by pre dropping pallets without even thinking about it when there's nothing else to lose. I've had endgame chases that have lasted forever, simply because throughout the game, survivors didn't use many pallets and now the survivor is just going from safe pallet to safe pallet.
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SWF are a very significant problem. However, people do bring up issues with solo queue... all the time, in fact.
I believe most issues with solo queue are due to matchmaking pairing you with people who don't know what they're donig, even if you do. Even though I don't like survivor in general, I find myself having a pretty tolerable, and even decent time playing when my teammates are decent, even if we don't escape. My biggest frustrations come from running the killer for 3 minutes to see no gens done, a teammate running around like a headless chicken, one hiding in a locker, the other one right beside me as im being carried by the killer, thinking the killer didnt see them...
My guess is, if matchmaking gets better, so too will solo queue. But SWF will remain a problem for as long as their communication just trumps the balance of the game, gives them several perks for free and negates several killer perks and powers for free.
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I hate playing survivor. I win cuz me and my teammates hold M1. I lose cuz teammates cant be bothered to hold M1. It's boring. I stopped playing the game when i was having a horrible time playing survivor to get archive challenges. Came back to the game and I now basically only play killer.
As killer, I hate gens. I hate worrying about them. I absolutely hate how bad of an objective they are. They are so mind-numbingly easy to complete and they are so safe because of how they are spread. I can count with a single hand how many matches i've lost because of actual survivor skill, and them actually properly outplaying me. I do not remember how many matches I have lost because survivors hold M1 even though I outplay them in chases in less than 20 seconds, its the single most common reason I tunnel, slug or lose.
If I were to change anything about this game, I would just like to change it so that gens are harder to do and less safe, not necessarily that they take longer, though. Gens are boring for survivors as they are, I dont want them to have to hold M1 for longer... If gens are made harder and less safe, there you go. I never have to tunnel or camp again, and at that point and only at that point, I hope the game literally nukes killers for tunneling and camping...gens are the single worst thing in this game for me.
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If you have the luxury of being on a PC, you can change the graphics settings to low and it helps.
Badham is probably the map I hate the most at the moment. I've always hated it before the rework, but at least I could see. Now I still hate it because its structures are BS and also because it's impossible to see anything further than 20ft in front of you.
Badham shack has a bunch of invisible corners where you get stuck as killer and survivor, making looping it annoying and inefficient. Both the houses are ridiculously safe structures. The school still has a god pallet and even though its not as strong as before, the fence vault still is a free waste of the killer's time by holding W and shutting your brain off.
Some people are saying the map is glitched and has increased odds to be selected...i dunno if this is true, but I know ive played in these maps more frequently than any other lately and I absolutely detest it. If DC penalties were not a thing I would dc instantly every single time I get them, and im this close to just AFKing every time I get them tbh.... Playing them is just not pleasant.
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@MasterGrit said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1765358#Comment_1765358
They didn't say it. It's my guess.
Fair enough then. I do hope youre right, but who knows with BHVR T_T
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@MasterGrit said:
I think we can expect it on next mid chapter or the twins patch if lucky.
Did they actually say this? it would be amazing if that were the case, but, if im not mistaken, in the Q&A it was brought up they said it would require redoing a lot of animations so it wasnt necessarily a priority...
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Blight. Absolutely adore this zoomy goblin man
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The biggest problem are clusters of tiles where as soon as a survivor loses sight of the killer, they don't even have to mindgame, they have another window or pallet they can reach without worrying. Those set ups are a lose lose scenario for basic killers no matter the mindgame they try, and they waste way too much time if a mindgame fails. Even with bloodlust, basic M1 killers suffer in those set ups. Those set ups should not exist in the first place, but they do.
The middle of Suffocation pit is an example of this. Any basic M1 killer should stay away from these tile clusters. There's a tile in Yamaoka that can have a mostly safe window directly facing shack. A good survivor will never, ever go down in this set up.
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I mostly agree. The only circumstance where I feel Bloodlusdt 2 and 3 are useful is during Endgame, where youre trying to prevent a survivor to get to the exit or to the Hatch, and so you cannot break pallets and give them that distance, however there's nothing stopping that survivor from just predropping every pallet. So BL 3 balances the survivor playing it that safe and extending chases without thinking about it.
Otherwise, during normal gameplay BL 1 is the only one needed.
It could actually be pretty cool if we make it BL 1 is available throughout the game, BL 2 unlocks after all gens are done and BL 3 unlocks after hatch opens or after the gates open.
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I am now a killer main where i used to like playing both sides equally. I mostly agree that at least BL 1 is needed. But, Im sorry to say that this is a pretty bad example of how bloodlust is needed.
The car loop at the beginning you were looping too wide. You're still a bit clumsy when it comes to going around things, you see it in the fence loop.
You can absolutely mindgame that car loop to get a hit or to get the pallet out of the way. The loop is short enough that it is mindgamable EVEN if they can see your character over it. Something as simple as turning one way and walking the other can cause survivors to stop for a second, giving you enough distance. Especially with Demo you can mindgame shreds to get them to keep the pallet up, then smack them. The loops in Autohaven, are actually unmindgamable, because not only can you see the killer over them, they're also too long for a small turn on the killer to actually cause the survivor to mess up enough for a hit. Even so you can still attempt it to get pallets out early, but the car loops in badham are not as safe as the autohaven ones.
You shouldn't keep going back and forth on yourself. You can moonwalk, but pick a direction and stick with it, and tighten those corners. Otherwise you're always going to fall behind and give the survivor too much distance. You'll never get the pallet out of the way in time.
I don't know what happened at that fence, I guess its a mixture of some clumsiness together with getting flustered? That fence should never give a 115% killer so much trouble. You need to learn the distance of your lunges more mate.
There are genuine spots where the killer cannot mindgame a survivor. Whatever the killer does, the survivor can get to another window or pallet. The TL clusters in the middle of Suffocation pit are an example of this. Or a Jungle Gym into pallet that you get in Ormond. Or Jungle Gym into God Bus, or even God Bus by itself if it has the window in the middle. The House of Pain in Haddonfield and Badham. All of those are extremely safe structures that are basically "Hold W and waste time loops".
However, your examples are those of a killer that still needs to learn quite a bit. There's nothing wrong with it, everyone starts out needing to learn. But It's important that people learn what they're talking about and learn what optimal play is before they try to make an argument for something regarding balance.
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A survivor is still able to kidnap Victor for 45 seconds at a time and the "Big Risk" that devs are talking about is the killer being able to see Victor's aura after that long... I dunno what survivor that knows how to play the game thinks that a killer knowing where they are is anything more than a mild inconvenience. 45 seconds without your ONLY power is still ridiculous.
I find it amusing that the devs say some obstacles made it "difficult" for Victor to hit when the reality is that the piles of tires in Autohaven, or any object like them were a literal infinite against him. It wasn't "difficult". It was literally impossible to hit survivors around those obstacles. Would have been nice to have that actually acknowledged.
The thing with the lockers can be good or bad depending on the time they make it last. If Victor can hold the locker for like 15 seconds, maybe a bit more, then its fine. If its less than 10 seconds, then you'll waste half of that just changing back to Charlotte, and then you'll realize you're half a mile away from that locker, so you basically accomplished nothing. We'll have to wait and see.
The exit gate blocker change is good. It actually makes Victor mildly useful to stop someone from going through an exit gate. IF Charlotte is even close enough to the affected survivor for that to even matter.
Coup de Grace is almost an insult of a perk. If you purchase the killer with actual money, its a bad product. You're better off with Shadowborn than Coup de Grace. At least Shadowborn gives you a real benefit throughout the match.
I don't think there's real understanding from the devs as to what constitutes an actual risk for survivors or how time efficient killers must be. This killer seems like the opposite of time efficient.
It's a massive shame because there is so much potential for this killer, the concept and visual design of the killer are amazing. The execution, imo, is extremely lackluster and at least for now, I see absolutely no reason to get this killer. Might as well keep my iri shards.
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The almighty W key is fairly strong for survivors on several locations still. Bloodlust 1 i think is still necessary. Bloodlust 2 and 3 are not necessary and are irrelevant.
Now I will say this. Bloodlust can be seen as the game gifting the killer an advantage after some time. But i'll ask this in return:
When a survivor gets a set up of jungle gym, into shack, into window, into pallet, where it pretty much doesn't matter what the killer does, the survivor will always make it to another window or pallet, even if the survivor makes a wrong read. Is this not the game gifting survivors an invincible set up? Is the survivor outplaying the killer or is the killer getting destroyed by the map layout?
This kind of thing is still in the game. The middle of Suffocation pit. Haddonfield. All the buildings in Badham. The main house in Mother's Dwelling. The pier in Swamp. Yamaoka can have some quite un-mindgamable window set ups too. The Saloon main building, the set of buildings in front of the saloon which is basically a massive chain of windowed tiles. Lets not forget fun bus as well...
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I honestly just hope for some new animations to improve some of the jank.
An animation for killers legs when they look from side to side so it doesn't look like they're just spinning on a record player.
Better animations for when killers recover from hits. Some killers have no leg animations so it looks like they're sliding after they've landed a hit. Some animations look really strange when the killer is slowed down for any reason. Like when clown reloads his bottles. It doesn't look like he walks slower, it looks like he walks in slow motion which is jank.
Better cast shadows from 1st person. Remember the bug where killers started every match with their First person model? It looks ok from the killer's perspective but the shadows those models cast in first person are hideous and goofy. You only need to look at your shadow as Blight, legion or Myers. The shadows just horrible.
If they ever fix issues like these I'll be impressed.
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I find going against Deathslinger quite fun. When you know when the Deathslinger has to go for shots it's quite fun to make him miss. You feel like your in the other player's head. It's a change of pace from the usual, run around a thing on autopilot then drop pallet you get against other killers without antiloop.
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Hey, Im another Blight fan who has basically played him non stop since release. I put these tips in another threat asking about Blight. Might as well pur them here again XD
Flicking your mouse quite a bit when hitting can help you get survivors who make 90 degree turns around objects depending on the distance. you'll get better the more you get a feel for him. Corners really don't do much against Blight once you learn how to flick. Medium, round objects are way worse than corners.
Depending on the situation it can be better to rush onto the closest thing to you and then lethal rush to catch up and hit survivors. Sometimes rushing to catch up and then lethal rushing to hit can allow survivors to react and get behind something to protect themselves.
Don't be afraid to cancel your power. There are many loops where your power will give you nothing. You're 115%. Chase normally, get the pallet out of the way then hit them before they can get to the next tile. This is very important. Many times, Blight players will try to use their power where they shouldn't and they will waste way more time than they need to...i know ive certainly done it.
Hit and run can be good on him. Blight is very fast so he's good and going after multiple people and keeping them injured. If a survivor is in an advantageous position and they know how to exploit Blight's weaknesses, sometimes it's best to leave them and go for someone else. you's waste too much time trying to beat an impossible setup.
Shadowborn is really good to help you not lose track of survivors when they spin around you or try to wiggle (Honestly can we just have an FOV slider already? not seeing a survivor cuz they mildly moved to a side is ridiculous)
If you hit on a lethal rush the instant it would have ended, you'll get stuck in place for a second or two after the injection animation. Try to avoid that.
Take careful note of what you can slam into and what you slide off of. The benches on haddonfield and some of the fences in Thomson's house have 0 collision for Blight's rush as of the posting of this comment. There are certain objects that need to be hit a certain way or in specific areas to trigger a Slam, and other objects that you will hit even if you barely see them in your FOV, like the debris in Autohaven. Try to stay clear of those and don't use your power when those objects are too close together.
Really take note of how survivors run tiles. If you know exactly what they're gonna do you can rush ahead and catch them. Jungle gyms are one example, sometimes they'll vault a window mindlessly, you can slam onto the wall behind the window then hit them (doesn't work with longwall jungle gyms). Shack is another example, sometimes Shack will have objects around it that you can lethal rush off if you bait survivors into vaulting shack window.
Play without addons first and get used to it so you don't miss addons when you don't have them. It's actually impressive the amount of people who underestimate how much blight can turn even without turning addons.
Take note of how each survivor plays. If you know a survivor has dead hard, plan a rush to bait the dead hard. If a survivor spins too much and you lose track of them, try slamming onto the thing behind them and then rushing towards them, it'll be harder for them to spin twice in a row to account for an unexpected rush.
Try to chain several rushes to play with the expectation of survivors. Sometimes they'll account for you going one way, but if you chain more rushes you can trick them. This is more advanced and you need to be well aware of what survivors are doing and more comfortable with your rush before you do this. But it can mindfuck survivors.
Learn the timing of your rushes. You'll get a feel for it and you'll be able to maximize the distance you travel so you can be more efficient.
When chasing a survivor, ALWAYS pay attention to where they're running and visualize in your mind how to approach it with rushes. You'll get good at it the more you do it.
You'll get a feel for how to catch up to survivors in each map, but before you are entirely comfortable with it, you should try to line them up before you rush to them. It'll make your rushes more effective. By this I mean, have some line of sight so you can see where they went and where they're going before you start to rush and realize you've no idea where they went or that they went to an area here your rush would be useless.
And that's all I can think off. I hope it helps : )
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I agree with you. Though I think Badham is the single worst example of this trend.
In a game where killers are pressed for milliseconds, its just stupid to have you waste even 3 seconds getting your bearings or locating a survivor in a dark place.
In Badham you literally can't see anything past 20 ft in front of you unless you play on low or use external programs, which is ridiculous.
Yamaoka used to be worse but seems better, at least to me, and McMillan has been the best so far. I think McMillan is the perfect brightness.
Autohaven is a bit weird its possibly too dark and Ormond is too Bright.
The Game is another map that I find nearly unplayable because of how dark it is unless i switch to low but its an old map.
Its bad as killer and as survivor because if you get hit with deep wounds as survivor or youre in freddy's dream in those maps, you will literally have NO idea where the hell you're even running to. It's awful.
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Survivors that will demean you or talk ######### to you would do it no matter who you play or how you play. Best thing you can do for your sanity is turn off post game chat or whatever option you need to turn off to not get random messages if you play on console.
I loved Deathslinger before Blight came around, I played him constantly and whenever survivors said anything at all about it, I just told them to go and hold m1 in a corner. If they don't like it, theres 21, soon to be 22 killers in the roster and they can find something more to their liking in the next game. They have 0 business telling you what characters you can or cannot play.
Pay no mind to them and play the game to enjoy yourself.
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The Blight imo is the best thing to happen to this game. The most fun killer to me and he is extremely powerful. From the PTB i thought he was extremely fun and i saw some potential
I really like the design and concept of the Twins. I wish the execution was better. But we'll see how they are in live version. ATM i think they need some serious work.
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This is literally what I think every time see a post about tunneling and especially about camping or slugging.... The game does not reward killers for going on fair chases. Every second you're in a chase you're falling behind cuz the other 3 survivors are just holding m1 on the other side of the map far away from any danger...
I honestly don't think that gens should take longer to complete. That would be boring for survivors. But they need to be more interactive and less safe, so they actually feel like they're constantly under threat, and most definitely they should require more skill and commitment than holding a single button and occasionally getting a "are you awake" check.
It's unfortunate but I try to believe the devs do the best they can...lets remember at some point in the distant past they did mention they were working on something similar to End Game Collapse but for early game...I would hope that is still a thing and I'd hope that solves the issue of matches going to quick for killers to want to bother with chases.
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@Elena said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1736751#Comment_1736751
If I recall, the music is different for Oni's POV
Yeah that's what I mean. Oni was the last one. I guess i must have worded it wrong 😅
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@lunaticlifter said:
@McLean just confirmed me on twtich , that it's an issue, so guys sorry for breaking your expectations, but it will be fixed.. i only hope devs will realize how bad is the standard fov is, and 10 degree more doesn't ''BrEaK the game'', and all the survivors '' crouching-window JuKe'',.. a good change for console players just went down in a matter of days. At this point i have no reason to play nurse on console anymore, since the bad fps, the low fov, and perk slot i have to sacrifice for shadwoborn.. gg
Ive been following this specific thread since it was created just to see what was the deal with this. I wished for a brief moment that it was an intended change. It's unfortunate it's just another bug that will get fixed.
Such a tiny QOL thing, that makes the game more playable for so many more people who get sick with the normal FOV... but nah, we need survivors standing a little bit to the side of a killer to be invisible and inaudible... cuz thats fair. You know how you killers have 4 perks to deal with 16? you have to use one for FOV, just so a survivor doesn't disappear cuz they moved a tiny bit to the left...
How does anyone in 2020 think that a killer seeing them is enough of a big deal that they'd defend killers having a miserable FOV...😒
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Blight and Deathslinger. If PH still had his PTB music I'd probably like that one too. His current music is a bit meh compared to the PTB one imo.
On a side note, its sad that since Oni they've made it so chase music is the same for both killer and survivor POV. I wish we still had different music for either roll...
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Blight already barely cares about DS. If you make the stun shorter Blight could catch up to a person after they use DS without the slightest issue. It would probably make him quite the tunneling powerhouse, up there with Pyramid Head.
The problems with DS imo are its duration and like BT, the fact that survivors can use it aggressively instead of defensively to punish the killer playing well while they make dumb plays cuz they have a perk.
This being said tho, if DS was a shorter stun, but with a sprint burst, it would be entirely up to the survivor to make the best out of it, instead of them just benefitting from the game disabling the killer for 5 seconds, cuz they would have to find a tile and play it well to get good value from it. They can't just finish a gen in your face while you're stunned, they have to look for a tile or they die. BT into DS hook bombing would become more risky cuz killers wouldn't be stunned for that long... However, because sounds are messed up, it's possible that if a survivor uses DS and then sprint bursts away, you won't be able to hear where they went to track them, which currently you can. Overall I think I like the idea.
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Chains of Hate, the Hag one, Silent Hill and Descend Beyond.
Blight is my favorite killer at the moment and Im not sure I'd ever be able to go back to normal speed killers XD It's unfortunate that we didn't get a map tho. Hope that does come at some point in the future.
Before that chapter I loved playing as Deathslinger and Despite the horrendously powerful main building, I do love the saloon map.
The silent hill map is pretty cool even though it has gameplay design flaws and Pyramid Head is pretty formidable as a killer.
Hag is just bae...i love not having to chase survivors...like having survivors trying to get my attention and im just there chillin, setting up my traps, not even looking at them... and then they all die. I like the aesthetic of the swamps, but unfortunately they're a bit lacking in actual gameplay design.
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Flicking your mouse quite a bit when hitting can help you get survivors who make 90 degree turns around objects depending on the distance. you'll get better the more you get a feel for him.
Depending on the situation it can be better to rush onto the closest thing to you and then lethal rush to catch up and hit survivors. Sometimes rushing to catch up and then lethal rushing to hit can allow survivors to react and get behind something to protect themselves.
Don't be afraid to cancel your power. There are many loops where your power will give you nothing. You're 115%. Chase normally, get the pallet out of the way then hit them before they can get to the next tile. This is very important. Many times, Blight players will try to use their power where they shouldn't and they will waste way more time than they need to...i know ive certainly done it.
Hit and run can be good on him. Blight is very fast so he's good and going after multiple people and keeping them injured.
Shadowborn is really good to help you not lose track of survivors when they spin around you or try to wiggle (Honestly can we just have an FOV slider already? not seeing a survivor cuz they mildly moved to a side is ridiculous)
If you hit on a lethal rush the instant it would have ended, you'll get stuck in place for a second or two after the injection animation. Try to avoid that.
Take careful note of what you can slam into and what you slide off of. The benches on haddonfield and the fences in Thomson's house have 0 collision for Blight's rush as of the posting of this comment. There are certain objects that need to be hit a certain way or in specific areas to trigger a Slam, and other objects that you will hit even if you barely see them in your FOV, like the debris in autohaven. Try to stay clear of those and don't use your power when those objects are too close together.
Really take note of how survivors run tiles. If you know exactly what they're gonna do you can rush ahead and catch them. Jungle gyms are one example, sometimes they'll vault a window mindlessly, you can slam onto the wall behind the window then hit them (doesn't work with longwall jungle gyms). Shack is another example, sometimes Shack will have objects around it that you can lethal rush off if you bait survivors into vaulting shack window.
Play without addons first and get used to it so you don't miss addons when you don't have them. It's actually impressive the amount of people who underestimate how much blight can turn even without turning addons.
Take note of how each survivor plays. If you know a survivor has dead hard, plan a rush to bait the dead hard. If a survivor spins too much and you lose track of them, try slamming onto the thing behind them and then rushing towards them, it'll be harder for them to spin twice in a row to account for an unexpected rush.
Try to chain several rushes to play with the expectation of survivors. Sometimes they'll account for you going one way, but if you chain more rushes you can trick them. This is more advanced and you need to be well aware of what survivors are doing.
Learn the timing of your rushes. You'll get a feel for it and you'll be able to maximize the distance you travel so you can be more efficient.
When chasing a survivor, ALWAYS pay attention to where they're running and visualize in your mind how to approach it with rushes. You'll get good at it the more you do it.
You'll get a feel for how to catch up to survivors in each map, but before you are entirely comfortable with it, you should try to line them up before you rush to them. It'll make your rushes more effective. By this I mean, have some line of sight so you can see where they went and where they're going before you start to rush and realize you've no idea where they went or that they went to an area here your rush would be useless.
And that's all I can think off. I hope it helps : )
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Its not up to the survivors to make the match last longer by not pumping out their objective, and its not up to the killers to cater to the survivor's happiness by trying to 3 hook everyone and give everyone a fair shot. Its entirely up to the developers to create an environment and match pacing that is conducive to both sides having a reasonable amount of fun, whatever the vision of that developers for that fun may be.
I too, have stopped judging killers for whatever action they take during matches....although moris are still a bit too much and deliberate BMing I still see as scummy. Like pretending you're gonna give hatch or exit gates only to betray and hook survivors.. I think thats in terrible taste and sadistic.
However, tunneling, camping and slugging are just sometimes completely necessary. Same with survivors blinding, hookbombing, finishing gens in your face. It's all fair game.
Play however you feel you have to to achieve your own goals for your own play session, so long as you don't cheat. Like I said, it's up to the developers to create the game experience they want players to have, not players to police themselves or others.
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He is my main now. He is the single most fun killer they have put out in my opinion.
Theres problems with him sliding on things that are 50% into your FOV and colliding with things that are less than 10% into your FOV which can be annoying and can lose you chases, but for the most part he works, and I hope these things get fixed.
Using shadowborn on him recently has made him exponencially more fun, as its harder to miss survivors and it feels youre going at the speed of light!
I do feel countering him from the survivor side is a bit easier than playing him well, but to be fair most killers are harder to play than to counter imo. He is still pretty dangerous.
I would only change 3 things on him:
1.Make his cooldown start recovering DURING the injection animation, like it does when he breaks a pallet with the rush. Theres no reason for the cooldown to just be paused.
2.Refine his collisions but thats a given
3.Make him a little bit harder to be spun. Ive literally seen survivors WALK out of the way of a Blight's attack and i dont think that should be possible ever. Its not the biggest deal and I don't think it needs to be much stronger, but being able to walk out of its way is a bit too much XD
Overall awesome killer. I absolutely love him.
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The PH changes in my opinion just make him feel sluggish while addressing nothing. I stopped liking plague when they added that disgusting slowdown after she pukes on anything. And now PH has a similar thing. It just feels bad.
Being able to spam POTD is not a good thing. Now you can just do it over and over again, but none of the issues that made it so people only used it at animation locks were addressed. The main issue with this attack is that its way too telegraphed. Honestly I wouldn't have minded if the cooldown remained as it was but with a faster release time for POTD so its not as telegraphed...that would actually encourage people to use it more and use it smartly. Now we have a 115% killer that feels sluggish, still does his fake-out survivors complain so much about (imo for no good reason), and now the killer can just throw out attacks more mindlessly. And good survivors and survivors who hold W will find the changes negligible, PH will still get stomped by that. I dread to think what they will do to Deathslinger if they believe survivors complaints against him are valid, since they're basically the same as the complaints against PH...
The POP change makes it so killers have to tunnel vision using a gen, which is wonderful on a role that has to constantly focus on multiple things at the same time. Its wonderful to have stuff that requires you to go out of your way to make use of. Being able to chase and then use pop was crucial, because it allowed you to multitask. Even with 60 seconds it still can feel like you have to stop focusing on the game and focus on the one gen to use pop on. Now its more useless on more killers, especially the slower ones and for no good reason too because in general people didn't complain much about pop.
The bug with Spirit kills her against competent survivors cuz you can literally hear exactly where she is. So I guess no more stand still mindgame for Spirit, say hello to the SURVIVOR stand still mindgame, where a survivor can just stand still and spirit will have no effing clue where they've gone to, while the survivor has a directional sound queue of where she is, because its ONLY fair when a survivor does it. Lets see when that gets fixed in the next 5 years...or maybe never
The survivor perk changes are decent but nothing spectacular. I use Any Means Necessary, never really felt the cooldown it had was particularly justified, so im glad they reduced it. It'll be nicer to use now. The WGLF buff is good, it also helps counter slugging, which is a good thing. As much as I think slugging is kinda necessary cuz gens are BS, i recognize its boring and bad, so there being things to counter it is a good thing.
Surge being usable on regressing gens is cool tho. I'll say that much. It's still a pitiful amount for the cooldown that perk has, but it saves some time, i guess, and now pairs with ruin.
I dunno...I think the only thing that has me interested in this patch is the McMillan map remake because it looks nice...oh and the visual effects. Those are pretty cool and i love them... who knows...maybe the next chapter will have interesting stuff for us...maybe a hotfix will address some of the issues...
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At max range it takes almost half a second for Deathslinger's shot to reach you (0.45s) that is reactable. The closer he gets the more unlikely you are to purely react to his shot.
Pyramid head's attack, outside of animation locks is reactable while in the open. Its very hard to purely react to because its fast. Usually prediction plays a part, but it is reactable, even up close if he commits to it instead of doing an M1.
I guess you can react to Clown's bottles at that distance? Dunno what good it does but you can. Not from up close.
You can react to Hag's traps? if you run away quickly enough you can still make her waste some time or waste pallets. Unless she's predicting you to trigger a trap and tapping the teleport button. That could be too fast to react to.
You can maybe react to Doctor's shock. But you have to be pretty fast, its inconsistent.
I guess it's possible to react to Demo's shred at max distance? if possible its very inconsistent because its very fast.
You can literally walk out of the way of Blights attacks...which is sad really. I do mean this literally. I have seen survivors WALK out of the way of a Blights attack. Don't think this should be possible but it is. So at medium distance you can react to Blight's lethal rush. Up close its pretty much impossible, you have to predict he's gonna rush and move.