Monlyth
Monlyth
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- Monlyth
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4005272#Comment_4005272
Oh my god he's serious. Dude, what are you playing that you can't get at least two kills? Like are you doing some kind of challenge mode where you play blindfolded or deafened? How is that physically possible?
Your petty insults are noted. But anyway, since apparently it's so easy to consistently get at least two kills- as Trapper, without tunneling- surely you wouldn't have any hesitation about at least showing us your match history, right?
People who have nothing to hide generally don't mind showing exactly why they're right and you're wrong.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4005251#Comment_4005251
Are you doing a bit? Like there's no way you could misunderstand something this badly.
You claim that killing Survivors as Trapper, one of the weakest Killers in the game, is easy.
You claim that you consistently get 2 kills or more in regular play without tunneling- a feat of which very few DbD players are capable. And refuse to provide proof, I might add.
You say you might be bad at the game, yet vehemently deny any notion that the only reason you're winning so much is because you're playing against bad Survivors.
You say Killers who complain about the change are simply having a skill issue, yet your main advice for Killers who are struggling is "Just don't tunnel 4Head" and "Just end chases faster 4Head".
And you're having trouble understanding why someone might be skeptical of your many outlandish claims?
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4005241#Comment_4005241
Dude, it's 2025 it's next to impossible for mmr to actually go down for killers since as long as you get two survivors killed you stay at the same level. Are you seriously saying that you can't kill someone through five gens and secure a kill during endgame? Is that so outlandish to you? Jesus Christ do you know how to play killer? Also I did not change the subject, your whole argument relies on me being in a high mmr due to me getting kills on 'bad' survivors.
You did change the subject, though. I said "You… know that losing makes your MMR go back down, right?" and you proceeded to start ranting about how apparently I need to accept that some people are much better than me.
@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4004053#Comment_4004053
Dude, it's a game. Just accept the fact that there are some people who are better than you and you will have a much better time. There's tons of people who are better than me but I don't mind.
Guess I struck a nerve.
So now you're claiming you literally never get less than 2 kills? As Trapper, no less? And without slugging or tunneling? Care to show proof of this feat, then? To my knowledge, even comp DbD players can't manage that in regular play, at least not forever.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4005191#Comment_4005191
And… when you kill survivors your mmr goes up… you are agreeing with me that I'm killing a lot of survivors. The more I kill the better opponents I get matched against. Do you want to continue this or do you feel the need to keep unintentionally admitting I'm right.
Why did you change the subject when I pointed out how losing to Survivors makes your MMR go back down again?
Almost like you know damn well you're bullshitting me.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4005116#Comment_4005116
You do understand that saying I'm not a good killer actually strengthens my argument right? That if someone who is not that good is getting regular 3 and 4 kills then there's no real need to tunnel and no real argument for why it should not be nerfed.
What part of "You are playing against bad survivors" do you not understand? Anyone can 4k against Survivors who play poorly enough.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4004053#Comment_4004053
Dude, it's a game. Just accept the fact that there are some people who are better than you and you will have a much better time. There's tons of people who are better than me but I don't mind.
Then why is it so hard for you to accept that you're not as good at Killer as you seem to think you are? Take your own advice sometime.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4004051#Comment_4004051
That's… not how mmr works. I understand if this is confusing for a new player like you but the more you kill the higher your mmr goes up and that matches you with better survivors.
You… know that losing makes your MMR go back down, right?
Okay, yeah, you're just lying at this point.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4004049#Comment_4004049
Eh, sounds like a skill issue on your part. Yeah I don't fourk every game but I'm doing fine.
As I said, if winning as Trapper isn't an uphill battle for you, you are playing bad Survivors. Which means the game's matchmaking has determined that you are bad at Killer.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4004040#Comment_4004040
I did run into it. I then left them on the ground for 90 seconds and by the time they were up two others were on hook. If your chases are long that's on you my guy.
If you're not struggling as Trapper, you are playing bad Survivors. Trapper has been left so far in the dust that most of his mains quit years ago, even those who were good enough to take him on 50+ game win streaks.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4004036#Comment_4004036
90 seconds is a long time for someone to be on the floor. Anyway trapper oddly enough was great at dealing with people using background player. Just trapped one side of the pallet and blocked the other. Had a few people run into the trap a few times. The aura reveal helped immensely.
Am I to take this to mean you never ran into Survivors using the new anti-tunnel mechanic aggressively? Because if that's the case, I hate to break it to you, but you are playing against bad survivors. For example, it did not take long for Survivors to figure out that the "anti-tunnel" mechanic meant that a person on death hook (Or in your case, the last person you hooked) could literally just do gens in your face and the Killer can't do anything about it until 6 hooks without being punished for it.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4004028#Comment_4004028
Or I just don't tunnel.
Then why don't you explain to me how you dealt with Survivors who used the anti-tunnel mechanics aggressively to take protection hits, mess with Killer props or do gens right in front of your face? Or how you dealt with Survivors creating no-win situations with Power Struggle or Background Player thanks to the new basekit Unbreakable? How you dealt with it when you genuinely had no logical option but to tunnel or slug somebody?
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4004006#Comment_4004006
I enjoyed the killer buffs tbh, since I don't tunnel it was really easy matches for me.
You're either lying, or you're playing a top-tier Killer, or you're playing bad Survivors.
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@Foggyguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4002732#Comment_4002732
Prettymuch this, the update was like 99% fine and just needed a few minor tweaks. Unfortunately few killers are actually good at the game and rely on tunneling to pad their ego and mmr.
Tell me you don't play Killer without telling me you don't play Killer.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3746090#Comment_3746090
I will just stop talking about Iron Will since it is pointless in this Killer Echo Chamber. I will just wait a few weeks and if the Devs dont chicken out, I will have my "told you so"-phase one or two weeks after the Patch goes live, when Iron Will is only a bit more popular and Killers will have no problem with dealing with Iron Will.
Maybe you don't remember, but I do: Iron Will was everywhere before the nerf. It was right below the big four (Borrowed Time, Decisive Strike, Adrenaline, Dead Hard) in terms of its usage and strength. Being completely silent when you're injured is a MASSIVE advantage in chase.
I'm guessing you don't play Killer much and don't understand just how much the Killer relies on sound, both to find survivors who are hiding and to keep track of where they are during a chase. With no sound cues, you can often just duck into a Killer's blind spot mid-chase and just like that, you're gone.
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@NotJared said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3745982#Comment_3745982
I am beginning feel like most people commenting on this thread did not read my original post in its entirety.
Why would you ever Draw A Patrol with Carnifex? This is the specific concern I'm raising.
If he has no purpose, then why have him be a part of the kit at all?
In case something unexpected happens after you click M2 and you decide you need a patrol instead of a pallet break?
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I use Distortion because I'm not that great at chase on Survivor. But I wasn't born yesterday, I'm not gonna spend the whole game hiding behind some trees on the outskirts of the map while my teammates get slaughtered.
I play risky when the situation calls for it, when I haven't been hooked yet and need to keep the Killer's attention away from my teammates. And if the Killer chooses to ignore me, then hey, I can get an important gen done or get an unhook or heal my teammates.
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@Krazzik said:
I don't quite understand the logic here. There will still be situations where picking up the survivor is the bad move.
If a survivor goes down at a pallet and the killer knows there's flashlights, background player or suspects Flip Flop/Power Struggle, slugging is still the smart move.
I had a game where there was one survivor left, they were downed at a pallet and have been downed for a while. I'd be crazy to pick them up and risk FF/PS and them escaping, it's much smarter to wait till they bleed out.
Yes, and these are surprisingly common scenarios. If enough flashlight/pallet saves happen in one match, meaning the Survivors have made it clear they're not going to let me actually get a hook, I often say "Fine, have it your way" and leave them to bleed out.
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BT was made basekit because it was basically mandatory if the Killer was camping or tunneling someone. NOED is not mandatory by any means; it's not even in the top 10 most-used Killer perks.
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@Cecaelia said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3592773#Comment_3592773
Who cares. I do not. He will lose all his gens, lose the game to sit with 1 kill, drop mmr, and I'll never see him again. Hell, you could even add a passive of "stagnate hunt - The entity grows bored with an idle hunter, repair speed is increased by X% every X time the killer has not moved." if you're that stressed about a leatherface. But really not an issue, just do gens.
Am I talking to the same person I was 2 hours ago? How did you go from "There are 3 other players besides the hooked player. Play the game and stop standing in one spot staring vigorously at the hook, let Ada play the game." to "Really not an issue, just do gens"?
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@Cecaelia said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3592767#Comment_3592767
Seeing that insidious camping requires you to stay in one spot.......................................
So, let me get this straight: You want facecamping Bubba back? Because that's what's going to happen if you don't mind having Insidious be an option for camping again.
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@Cecaelia said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3592765#Comment_3592765
if they want to sit in 1 place and lose all their gens then go off, I guess.
Who said anything about staying in one place? I'm saying that if the Killer hooks someone in the middle of the map, leaves the hook, and then hears a noise notification or something on the other side of the map, there's now a massive invisible bubble smack dab in the middle of the map that the Killer is forbidden from passing through.
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@Cecaelia said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3592754#Comment_3592754
Not every killer has the same terror radius size, for one.
The anti camp bar stops filling when another survivor is present. Hence why you see the threads with the "does the anti camp work erm its not working for me" with people explaining that their friends running the killer around the hook makes it stop. I can also attest that it does not fill when the other survivors are playing monkey around the hook. The only time it isn't present is when the exit gates are powered.
Maybe a 3rd of the newer maps that are stupidly small, but its not a 3rd of the average map. The killer merely has to hold WASD and walk to another survivor, legit 0 excuse with the way there's an aura reading perk for killers for every situation.
No seriously, there's 0 excuse why you can't find another survivor.
- Beginning of the game
- Hitting a gen
- Opening a locker
- hooking a survivor
- gen completed
- exit gate powered.
Why are we struggling to find people again?
If you're basing it on the actual terror radius, then say hello to the return of Insidious camping. And heck, that change would barely help against a camping Huntress; her actual terror radius is only 20 meters.
The average map is 9,282 square meters in size. If you don't believe me, look it up. So if a Survivor is hooked in the middle, over 1/3rd of the map is now off-limits to the Killer unless they know a Survivor is in there.
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@Cecaelia said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3592731#Comment_3592731
How do you use something aggressively that cannot progress if the survivor is nearby? If a killer is chasing someone within terror range of the hook, then a survivor is nearby which means the bar does not fill, same way if a survivor runs a killer around the hook currently. The only thing that changes is huntress standing there with her arm raised outside of the AFC now is punished instead of her just lobbing an iri hatchet at someone when they try to save while standing there for the whole hook stage.
I just had a death slinger just sit next to someone just outside of the AFC aiming his gun at their body. The result is exactly the same as if he facecamped them. It makes no sense. Its just face camping with some extra steps.
Also side note: gens used to take 60s, now they take 90. Back in the day if the killer just stood there like a dumb dog like they do in 2023, they would have lost all the gens and only killed the 1. Nostalgia moment, but my killers back in the day actually hooked people and booked it across the map to stop gens. Now they just stand at hooks and go "if I can't camp this one person to death then I will loooose the game," and then act surprised when 4 gens are popped all at once. Or you see them camp the hook and then tunnel the same guy to death leaving 3 healty survivors to beat out gens, and then go "omg, all the gens are done so fast!" Yeah because you have 0 pressure, no one else needs to heal, no one else needs to move, no one else needs to do anything but hold M1 and hit spacebar.
Well, for one thing, the anti-camp bar never stops filling completely, even if a Survivor is present.
More importantly, if the anti-camp radius is 32m wide, then suddenly the Killer's movement is very restricted if- god forbid- they hook a Survivor in the middle of the map. If the Killer has to avoid that whole area just to avoid filling the camp bar, a Survivor can easily take advantage of that by sitting on the opposite side of the anti-camp zone, knowing that the Killer has to go the long way around. Or they can hide inside the anti-camp zone, knowing that the Killer can't risk looking for them there.
The Terror Radius is big. Really big. At any given time, it covers 3,217 square meters- that's almost a third of most maps. So if you create an area that size in the middle of the map where the Killer isn't allowed to enter unless a Survivor is also present, they're gonna start having trouble with navigation.
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@Cecaelia said:
I just don't understand. People cry when people kill themselves on first hook, but at the same time we're unironically going "them killing themself first hook is bad but me camping them to death from 1st hook is okay." The results in both situations are exactly the same. Behavior just needs to man up and make it just anti-camp, and increase it to "if the hook is within terror radius the bar progresses." There are 3 other players besides the hooked player. Play the game and stop standing in one spot staring vigorously at the hook, let Ada play the game.
The issue with that change is that Survivors may start using it aggressively. 32m is a pretty huge distance, so a Killer who's not even trying to camp may end up filling the bar.
If you want my suggestion for a change: If the Killer downs a Survivor within the anti-camp range, then the anti-camp bar fills instantly. So if a Survivor gets even remotely close to the hook, then one way or another, their teammate is getting off.
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@Evan_ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3591981#Comment_3591981
You ran Oni around the hook. That effectively halts the AFC buildup, and was considered a terrible thing to do even before the introduction of the feature.
The solution is either luring him away from the hook so someone else can save, or trading hooks while two others do gens.
By the way - Blood Fury lasts 46 seconds, that's 14 seconds shorter than a hook state. You could also unhook after it runs out.
Luring him away from the hook operates under the false assumption that the Oni is willing to be lured away, and is not simply waiting for someone to commit.
You think I don't know Blood Fury's duration? Don't you think I would have waited it out if that was an option? Having only a 14-second window where you can actually get a save is pretty unforgiving in solo queue, since you can only guess as to where your teammates are or what they're going to do, and you may end up having to be the one to go for a save, despite the fact that you're on the other side of the map (And in that scenario, it's physically impossible for you to reach the hook in 14 seconds anyway).
So, we're right back where we started. You're faced with the same problem as before as a Survivor, with the same counterplay as before. Not much has changed. Heck, I even just ran into a camping Bubba.
For the actual problem to be properly addressed, there needs to be some play solo Survivors can consistently make to break the camp and at least get a hook trade. And if there isn't one, I think we can safely say the anti-camp feature is an abject failure at its stated goal of giving Survivors an actual opportunity to get the save.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3592010#Comment_3592010
So what? Myers can just enter without punishment as soon as the survivor runs in, you are not getting the unhook regardless... And for Oni it is once again about is power in general and not the feature itself...
I have pulled off duo saves quite a few times with Randoms in soloq, it is really not that hard, what makes it hard is players having no clue what they are doing, so it's a skill issue by definition.
If you can't get within 16 meters of the hook without being spotted, you probably made a mistake. And even if you didn't, it's much more reasonable to expect one Survivor to lead the Killer away from the hook while another actually goes for the save, instead of having a Killer who can instantly dash straight to the hook and essentially cover every possible angle of approach. In the latter case, both Survivors have to go in at the exact same time, or they're dead.
Plenty of people made both of those arguments in defense of pre-nerf facecamping. They weren't good arguments then, they're not now.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3591986#Comment_3591986
Generally speaking it does that, you have more distance between killer and hook and can bodyblock the killer a bit to get the unhook... However if there is a t3 Myers or Oni in his power or whatever sitting next to the hook, how are you ever supposed to get the unhook? This has nothing to do with the camping itself but with the insta down power being active...
The feature creates opportunities, think of it this way 3 survivors come swarming in, two block the killer 1 unhook... This scenario is what the feature creates, because you cannot start of as close to the hook as killer anymore without getting punished by the feature.
Myers at least has to walk 16 meters before he can get you. But if the Survivor is hooked out in the open, then even if the Oni doesn't spot you before you get within 16 meters of the hook, he's so fast he can still down you before you get the unhook.
Aside from Bubba, you could still counter facecamping Killers by sending more than one Survivor to swarm the hook. Which is a level of coordination that tends to range from extremely difficult to impossible for solo Survivors, hence the complaints. So if your only suggestion is to send multiple Survivors, then once again, we're right back where we started, just with a different coat of paint.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3591976#Comment_3591976
OK, but they never promised that did they? Against most killers a 1 for 1 with only a single survivor is possible fairly easy, on other you need to be more coordinated and do a duo safe... But you will get the unhook if you do it properly, unless you get a Bubba or a Trickster or sth like that that will just down everyone in the time you unhooked...
Stop calling it facecamping for clarity sake, because facecamping is gone. I think there is only a hand full of killers that can prevent the unhook...
Well then, let's read the developer update that introduced the anti-camping system:
"This new mechanic is intended to address the most egregious camping scenarios, discouraging Killers from standing too close to a hooked Survivor for an extended period and creating opportunities for the other Survivors to make the save."
And if we look at that last bit, it would seem we still have a problem. Other Survivors do not, in fact, have the opportunity to make the save in this scenario. And this isn't a case of the Survivors making a silly, obvious mistake like going for a save while injured, this is a no-win scenario for the Survivor, which requires sending multiple Survivors if they want to actually get the unhook, same as before.
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@Evan_ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3591966#Comment_3591966
If only the outcome matters and not the result, you won't feel comfortable until the killer can still kill you.
Proxy-camping has much more counterplay compared to facecamping. Go discover and master the methods!
Did you not read my first post? I just presented a scenario where getting an unhook was effectively impossible. I asked for a solution and you give me empty words.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3591969#Comment_3591969
They already had the same method before, nothing changed... But yeah true, but behavior never intended to get rid of camping all together, and they achieved what they wanted to, face camping being gone, so how exactly could you expect more? They communicated perfectly well what they wanted to do and did it?
I expect the actual problem to be solved? A Killer could be using their power to camp from the other side of the map, for all it matters. The actual problem with facecamping is that the Survivor can't get the unhook, not even a hook trade. Everything else is just aesthetics.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3591966#Comment_3591966
Well that's your opinion, it achieved it's purpose, facecamping is gone.
Only on paper. In practice, people just found a different method to do the exact same thing. People didn't hate facecamping because the Killer was literally staring you in the face, they hated facecamping because you can't unhook against a facecamping Killer.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3591953#Comment_3591953
It is not an anti camp mechanic, as I stated before, all it is supposed to prevent is the killer standing right besides your hook. That's what facecamping is and that it prevents...
Again, who cares? It's cold comfort for me and my dead teammate. The method doesn't matter if the outcome is the same. If Survivors can't even get a hook trade, we're back to square one.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3591941#Comment_3591941
It is anti face camp, not anti camp... Big difference.
What's the point of an anti-camp mechanic if you still can't actually get the save? Proxy camping I don't mind, provided it's still possible to get the save before you go down.
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@Annso_x said:
The timer pauses when a survivor is around the hook, so running the killer around it is counterproductive.
In other words, there's no play I can make that will result in a successful unhook, unless the Oni screws up. The Oni can just charge in and instadown me as soon as he sees me going for the unhook. Sounds to me like that element of the anti-camp needs to be toned down at the very least.
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@Dreamnomad said:
Playing as demogorgon, I don't like that traveling through the tunnels makes a global audio. I think that largely defeats the purpose him being stealthy when he comes out of the tunnels.
It would also make him extremely difficult to keep track of. Most stealth Killers have largely-predictable movement, so even if you can't hear the Terror Radius, you can still get a rough idea of where they might be based on where they were last seen. But without the global audio cue, a Demogorgon could be almost anywhere and you'd have no way to tell if no one saw him go into a portal.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3583436#Comment_3583436
No, you just think your arguments infallible. You’re full of yourself. Have a good night! :)
Meh. When you've seen one snappy, thought-terminating cliché, you've seen them all.
Look, I'm trying to get you to make a good argument here. You've come up with some actual good points in defense of Blight, and basekit, he's probably fine. Or at least as fine as a top-tier character can be.
But to make a good argument, you have to leave room for the possibility that you're wrong, that you've misjudged the other person in some way, that the other person knows something you don't. Your claims have to be falsifiable, and backed up by evidence. Though this usually doesn't happen in reality (Humans are far too biased for that), a good-faith debate is, on paper, about two people working together to determine the truth of a matter, not simply trying to defend their preordained conclusions with any argument they can think of, no matter how flimsy, until the end of time.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3583414#Comment_3583414
I wouldn’t even waste your time lmao. You’ll get nothing but fallacy filled conversation.
Suddenly it's not enough for you to disagree with me; now my ideas have to be beneath consideration.
Guess I was making a little too much sense back there and now you have to find some other way to defend your pride.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3583365#Comment_3583365
Love how you say not to twist words but then turn around and continue to twist mine. I’m done with this conversation, it’s going nowhere.
Exactly how did I twist your words? Your very first post in this thread was unsolicited advice-giving. You didn't ask why the OP has a problem with Blight or what specifically they were having trouble with or how often they escape against Blight or how good they are as a player. You immediately told them, and I quote, "Learn some skills and counterplay against him". Despite knowing next to nothing about the OP, you assumed it was a skill issue.
But fine, don't engage with people who call you out when you make a bad argument. I suppose you'll just have to continue to wonder why people don't listen to you.
@Ink_Eyes said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3583390#Comment_3583390
It's literally a pvp game, it will always be us vs them when it comes to balancing the game, every side wants strong perks without getting nerfed and the other side wants the same, that's why we have discussion boards like this.
And how exactly do you figure that being dishonest is going to help your case? Made for This is getting nerfed, Trickster is getting buffed, and Garden of Joy/Mother's Dwelling/Temple of Purgation are all getting changed in the next patch to make them more Killer-friendly; acting like the devs are playing favorites with survivors is just an insult to people's intelligence.
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@Ink_Eyes said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3578591#Comment_3578591
Amazing how some survivor players can't deal with a perk or add on that makes the killer somewhat good, they just want it instantly nerfed, but killer mains had to deal with dead hard and other perks for years without a nerf...
Oh goody, "Us vs. Them". Yeah, that's constructive.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3583297#Comment_3583297
I am not saying blight is above criticism. I am saying accepting criticism must be done carefully.
For instance, if a player made all the mistakes you just listed and came to cry for nerfs on knight, I would not hold their criticisms valid. The answer to their issues are already there, they just either haven’t found them or are refusing to look for them and would rather cry for nerfs.
This is the point I’m trying to make. If you disagree, then we just have to agree to disagree.
And yet you immediately assume the worst of people complaining about Blight. When this thread opened up, you didn't think "Hey, another thread complaining about Blight. Well, maybe this guy knows something I don't", you immediately jumped to "They must be bad at the game".
There's nothing to indicate that the OP doesn't already know what counterplay Blight has. And yet you accused them, without evidence, of not knowing how to counter Blight. And furthermore, you've refused to elaborate on what counterplay Blight even has. You demand a standard of rational discourse that you don't hold yourself to.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3583285#Comment_3583285
I derive my opinion on this based on the thousands of hours I have on blight. I have gone against survivors who truly know counterplay, and they are able to reallyyy give me a run for my money.
But they are RARE. It’s absolutely astounding the amount of people who still just try to hold W, or just sit in a pallet while I set up for a hug tech. This is why I’m talking about learning counterplay, because the vast majority of players DON’T know it. This mentally of “I’m just gonna quit until they nerf it” is not going to do any good.
What happens when addons get changed and you still get spit on by blight because you never considered the fact that it’s not only addons, but your lack of game knowledge on blight. Same thing applies to the hug tech (although I consider it basekit at this point.
And I have run into many Survivors who don't know how to window-vault while being chased by a Guard, or who pass up an obvious opportunity to grab the flag, or who drop a pallet at exactly the wrong time, or stay at a loop when they had a perfectly good opportunity to chain to another.
Does that mean the character I play is above criticism? That his design is flawless and above reproach? Of course not.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3583277#Comment_3583277
Answer the question.
You can counterplay a Blight, sure, but counterplay can only take you so far.
Do you honestly think everyone who has a problem with Blight just doesn't know how to play the game, and that's the only reason anyone could possibly have an issue with him?
Because I can tell you right now, I have no such delusions about Knight.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3583256#Comment_3583256
So you’re telling me there’s zero counterplay?
That isn't what I said. Stop twisting people's words.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3583209#Comment_3583209
What I said is valid. How can you expect to learn to counter a killer if you give up against them every single time?
Is that what we want to do in this game? Anytime there’s a concept, killer, gameplay, that we don’t know how to play as / against, we just give up and complain until it’s nerfed?
Do you understand what a bad faith argument is?… I’m definitely not arguing in bad faith.
That question suffers from the false premise that there's anything substantial TO learn about countering Blight. The Blight's been in the game for over three years now; if beating him was just a matter of finding the right counterplay, people would have found it a long time ago.
There's only so long you can insist that everyone who has a problem with a character just hasn't learned how to play against him before people notice that the counterplay you've been promising people will discover any day now doesn't seem to be happening.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3583196#Comment_3583196
Where did I say “skill issue”? Not sure how you come to that conclusion because I’m suggesting to try and improve gameplay instead of just quitting and complaining.
Also, there’s really nothing funny. Some of you have a weird obsession about avatars and names, as if they determine credibility or correctness. Strange behavior.
"Learn some skills and counterplay against him"? Just because it's phrased a little differently doesn't mean you weren't making a "skill issue" argument. Arguing in bad faith doesn't help your case.
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@MrPenguin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3581808#Comment_3581808
I mean yeah it makes sense that the character that scales with how good the player is, gets better as the players do. Going off of the fact that "balanced" in this game is a 60% kill rate (according to the devs), according to those stats he was just fine.
"You're not rewarded because you start to face better players" is true for every killer and the game in general. It's true for killer players as well, including Blight. They get better and get stronger survivors in their games. But facing better players because you got better is not a punishment, it's balancing. That's literally what MMR is supposed to be doing. Your "reward" is moving up in the skill brackets and over more players.
I guess if you just don't want to be better/good at the game then you shouldn't but if you don't want to get good at the game you shouldn't complain when better players beat you.
You're choosing to stay not good enough to ever compete vs trying to be able to compete because you got better. When people want advice they're usually looking to improve to the point they can get over the problem if possible, not drop their skill bracket down to where the problem doesn't exist. Although I suppose technically that is a solution.
Blight doesn't get to a point where he's consistently defeating survivors better than him. He starts mid/weak, slowly gets better as they climb, and at the top he's on even ground with the other good survivors. Again, select add-on disclaimer (SAOD). So if they're beating you and they don't have busted add-ons, then they just played better.
No you can't "outskill" him to the point you'll win most of your games like most killers, but you shouldn't be able to. The killer can be good at the game as well and that should also matter. It should come down to who plays better in that match, which is exactly where he is (SAOD).
It feels like you just want a "solution" for Blight where you do X and will win most your games regardless of the Blights skill/effort. But where does that leave the person playing the killer? Most of the roster is already like that and we should be working to reduce the number not increase it.
Which if that's what you're advocating for, intentional or not, we're going to have to agree to disagree.
"Select add-on disclaimer" kinda undermines your whole point, doesn't it? Blight only gives you a remotely fair fight if he's holding back.
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Well, OP, in the interest of being constructive, here's how you and your friends win games as a team:
Good players are always looking for something to do. When in doubt, do gens. Outside of emergencies (2+ Survivors down), you should almost always have at least one Survivor doing gens. No matter how well your team members are running the Killer, if you don't have at least one Survivor on gens, you are not winning.
When one of your team members gets hooked, sending someone to unhook ASAP is a priority unless the Killer is camping or hard tunneling.
If the Killer is proxy camping and you can't get close enough to unhook safely or hook trade, send two Survivors to unhook. If they both go in at the same time, the Killer simply can't stop the unhook outside of a few specific powers.
Other than that, is there something specific you and your team are having trouble with?
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Rapid Brutality comes with a major downside of losing Bloodlust, and Batteries Included is niche at best, requiring you to go to very specific parts of the map that you'd ordinarily have no reason to go.
And what almost every other Haste perk has in common is that it's a temporary speed boost, often requiring very specific conditions to be met as well. MfT was neither temporary nor conditional; it was almost impossible to have a match where it DOESN'T provide a speed boost for multiple minutes at least.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3581621#Comment_3581621
Dude I wouldn’t even continue the conversation. You have made excellent points and counter arguments that they continue to ignore and flip. Some people aren’t worth debating with on here.
They will refuse to listen to anything that doesn’t agree with their opinion.
But I applaud you for your comments. You made some very good points here, even though you were met with fallacy filled responses.
Have you considered that your arguments are simply not correct? A bad argument can't convince you on its own merits, no matter how many times you repeat it.
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@MrPenguin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3581576#Comment_3581576
I'm sorry, but what do you want then?
As the survivors get better the killers dont?
Good survivors already roll the vast majority of the killer roster. Do you want it to be the whole thing?
Yes Blight gets better as skill increases, so the other side should have to also play better to compete. He gets stronger as survivors get stronger. Outside of add-ons he does not reach a level where skilled survivors can't resonably win.
This just sounds like its circling back to "Why cant mid survivors beat a good blight". Which they shouldn't, since he's playing better.
Do you just want them deleted?
According to BHVR's stats, Blight's killrate goes up in high MMR, not down. From 57% to 61%.
If you want to lose less often against Blight, the optimal move is to NOT get good.
You're simply not rewarded for playing well against Blight. Your reward is to face him and lose to him more often, not less.
Nurse and Blight are the Meta Knights of DbD; sure, you can beat an "average" Meta Knight who hasn't really learned to use the character to the fullest, but only to a point. The characters are consistently at the top of the tier list because after a point, you simply CAN'T outskill them anymore. The "git gud" argument falls apart almost immediately with a character that thrives specifically in an environment where people have gotten gud.