Junylar
Junylar
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- Junylar
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I wonder, what is "the game's firewall" and what is the popular belief about it? If you mean the anti-cheat, then on the contrary, the popular belief is that it's next to nonexistent. But the main problem is not even the anti-cheat itself, but the fact that most of game logic is not server validated, so the game allows a lot of the most ridiculous cheats impossible in other games, such as speedhack, flying, teleporting or even making the match never end. With proper server validation most of those hacks just wouldn't work.
But the most annoying are of course so called "subtle cheaters", who only use wallhack and increase their speed by a few percent, making it not so obvious, or only using speedhack while not directly seen by the killer. They think they are subtle, but with enough experience you can easily tell when the survivor is definitely too fast with no proper reason, or when the killer somehow knows for sure where you are, even though he has no aura-reading perks and no event could lead him to you. These have always been common and still are.
In any case, reporting them is a chore, and we don't have any hope for any server validation or anti-cheat improvement in the future, since the playerbase seems quite tolerant to the cheaters issue, so while the money flows - everything is alright and other things get prioritized.
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@AngryDuodenum said:
As a killer, being stunned is just part of the gameplay mechanics. That's like getting mad about loops or anything else. When I play as killer, it never bothers me and I definitely don't then slug everyone just because my feelings got hurt about being stunned. I mean some of y'all need to grow up a bit.
As a survivor, being slugged is just part of the gameplay mechanics. That's like getting mad about hooks or anything else.
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If you spread the hooks, you will loose with 8 hooks at most and 4 escapes (and a bunch of teabags at the gates, of course). And even devs recognize that only kills and escapes matter for what is counted as a win. So if you play against a decent team, you either tunnel or loose. That's just how the game works, unfortunately.
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@MauricetheHorse said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3710824#Comment_3710824
or as @Spare_Them_Mori_Me mentioned, maybe they were going for "blind the killer" challenges. What else happened to make you assume they were there to "bully"?
The killer doesn't care whether he was blinded for a challenge or for some other reason, it doesn't make the flashlight stun, especially at pickup-animation, any less annoying. The sheer obnoxiousness of the blind mechanic is the reason why flashlights are considered BM by default. I personally don't equip such challenges and don't pick flashlights when I play survivor, and somehow there are next to no sluggers in my games.
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Just now had a couple of games where I had to switch to my slugging Wraith loadout in flashlight+firecracker lobbies. And of course the survivors were salty in the end-game chat, even though they were the exact reason why they were slugged. If you load into the game for the sole reason of bulling the killer with blinds and stuns, please, don't get surprised when the killer is not so nice to you in return.
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This mechanic is there for SWFs, especially for bully squads. As soloQ you can just ignore it.
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@HexHuntressThighs said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3710440#Comment_3710440
There is statistically not a single person who uses sole survivor, let alone doing a gen and escaping through the gate. Everyone goes for hatch.
You don't have to do gens to escape through the gates. You just wait until the killer closes the hatch and then open the gates.
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Ah, the good old hatch standoffs 2.0. Nothing has changed about them since ever. Two survivors with some gens left, so 2escapes is impossible. At least one has to die. Both survivors know it and want to be the one having a chance to escape, so it's the pure 1v1v1 at its finest, as that end scene form The Good, The Bad, The Ugly. You will see it a lot, sometimes one of the survivors sells off the teammate to the killer, so the killer kills the other one and lets the rat out. Working with the killer by definition, but nobody cares and nothing will be done even if you report the rat. Sometimes the killer slugs one survivor, and the slug starts crawling to the other one, thus giving away his position, similar result but now you can't even report the rat, and the community here defends such behavior. Sometimes the killer hooks the sold out survivor and the rat will start spamming unhook indefinitely, making it impossible to leave the trial for the victim survivor. This 1v1v1 situation is the ugliest DbD can ever get, and yet the devs don't even care about it and don't intend to change it in any way, even though people keep complaining about it for years.
@Clee said:
Why not just get on a gen, get chased, then go next?
Isn't that better than playing for a hatch escape?
MMR aka Escape Based Matchmaking. If you die - you lose MMR and get matched with potato teammates. Hatch does not change MMR, but the other survivor could have Sole Survivor build and escape through the gates, thus getting +MMR and he will be matched with better teammates next time. It's just how it works with the current EBMM system for soloQ players who want better teammates: Sole Survivor meta.
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@CountOfTheFog said:
Is there some officially stated reason as to why we can't see the Killer ping in the lobby?
Why can't we even see our own in the lobby like we used to be able to?
Yes, there is. The same reason why most of the game logic is still not server-validated, making the most ridiculous of cheats possible, even though any other multiplayer game since 1996 server-validates everything except for aim. The reason is the spaghetti code of DbD and lack of competence or resources to rework it.
Since earlier versions of DbD were killer-hosted, the idea of killer ping was meaningless as it would be 0 by definition. It seems it led to some kind of hard-coded limitation for killers residing until now.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3710309#Comment_3710309
Ah yes. Because Killers only slug if the evil survivors did something before.
Really, get your facts straight. Massive slugging has nothing to do with DS.
You mean the literal counter to DS has nothing to do with DS? Okay…
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It's funny how they implemented that "high ping killer" icon and were done with it. Like, now you know for sure the killer is lagging, but you still can't do anything with it, you can't even DC without penalty. That "high ping killer" indicator looks like some kind of cruel trolling by the devs, like "yup, the killer is lagging, deal with it".
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@AngryDuodenum said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3710311#Comment_3710311
Again….I haven't seen that happen and yet they still slug. Sitting here right now slugged again…not a single tea bag or anything else. Just bastard killer mains
It might not have happened in your games, but you know nothing about other games those killers had had during the last days. And some could do this as a preemptive measure, since the killer can't know in advance who has and who doesn't have DS.
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@AngryDuodenum said:
Out of all of my rounds today and yesterday, NO ONE has used DS….Also, it's a single stun….So I'm confused how this correlates to needing to slug every survivor and waste everyones time
If you had ever played against a bully squad who would abuse DS and other stun perks against you over and over again, you would've known why some killers decided to go full slugging builds after the recent DS buff.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3710299#Comment_3710299
Yeah, Slugging was non-existent before. /s
EDIT: OP even says Endgame… So trying to justify that slugging with DS is just wrong.DS was before, and it was even more horrible in the past. Throughout DbD history slugging has always been a reaction to some kind of BS survivors had: be it permanent sabo, 99 sabo, flashlight saves or DS. And now there would be an expected rise of slugging builds due to yet another buff to DS.
As for the end-game slugging, OP's team or he himself probably was teabagging the killer at every pallet, judging by how often he seems to meet such sluggers in the game (they are not that frequent even now). BM for BM.
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DS should be disabled on interaction with a locker, so that it can't be abused. BHVR is being typical BHVR having made such a ridiculous oversight. That stock BT should also remove survivor's collision, and BHVR still are not able to implement it due to the spaghetti code.
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SoloQ, with its absence of information and communication, is the intended, designed way to play survivor. Back in the day there wasn't even such thing as SWF, it was added later. And if the intended way to play were with sharing of information and communication, there would be at least a text chat in the game, or even full voice chat like in TCM. So no, SWFs actually break the intended game design, and the fact that it's so popular doesn't make it more "correct" from the game design perspective, not until they give the same communication capabilities to soloQ at least.
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This build has been tried countless times. It just doesn't work against SWFs.
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Play something else for a week, try Civilization or something, just for a refreshing change.
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@Spare_Them_Mori_Me said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3709829#Comment_3709829
I have been preaching for a long time. New players try dbd, get tunneled a few times, and move along. If this is what BHVR wants, everything is fine. (I don't think it is)
What do you suggest? The game is unwinnable for survivors in 3v1 with 2+ gens left, this is why killers who want to win tunnel the weakest link. So it's either overhaul the whole core game design to make it possible for a comeback to happen, or continue introducing more anti-tunnel mechanics easily abusable by SWF, just making the killer experience more miserable
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Teleporting is not as bad of a design problem as the constant amount of "anti-loop" powers. Yes, you couldn't come up with any way for survivors to survive other than looping, and now you make killers whose power is taking away the only mechanic survivors even have to prolong their lives, as if looping is the disease and not a symptom.
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That's escape based matchmaking for you. If you play soloQ, you die more often than you escape, therefore your survivor MMR will always gravitate to the lower level, while as a killer, having one bad survivor in the enemy team practically gifts you a win if you care to take him out of the game early, due to how the game works.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3709381#Comment_3709381
Yeah. I remember how much money they make with Nurse and she is still busted! Oh wait…
Nurse can't be abused by just anyone as the old DS could be.
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@LeFennecFox said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3709379#Comment_3709379
It's not as simple as that it takes an insane amount of games to get below the mmr softcap once you reach it. Unless they want to throw 100's of games to bully killers for a few there is no point. This is pretending mmr even really matters in modern dbd.
Hundreds of games is an overestimation if you compare the numbers, and they can spread the "grind", like throwing soloQ games separately, when they can't get together, and then go noobstomping when they gather in discord. I'm sure that's how most of survivor mains with SWF friends play like, some maybe even unintentionally: people who play in "bully squads" have a similar mindset to those who sandbag and throw in soloQ.
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While this is surely an overreaction, the reverse is kind of true: they don't fix things that bring them money being broken. Just look at how long it took them to rework DS from its initial state. If DS were a free perk, it would've been fixed within a month since release.
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Bully squads can "derank" easily by throwing a few games in a row. Since only escapes and deaths matter for survivor mmr, there are a number of ways how they can go to the rock bottom of mmr within a few hours.
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Break line of sight with wall structures, all outdoor maps have them. Don't let her find you out in the open, otherwise dodge the hatchets.
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The funniest thing is that the existence of DC penalties while there is the bot mechanic actually makes the matter worse. Without DC penalties frustrated survivors would just DC and a bot would take their place and continue playing, but with DC penalties they just let go on the first hook, therefore the team loses one survivor completely. So it incentivizes dying over giving place to a bot. Pretty good job so far, as they say.
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It's funny how most of the repliers in the thread haven't even read what the OP has said. He means the ability to block other survivors in your survivor game, so that you will never be matched WITH them, not AGAINST them. Nobody is saying anything about "blocking someone who beat me", unless, of course, you are talking about typical soloQ 1v1v1v1v1, where your teammates are more threatening the killer and can literally beat you before the killer.
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@Batusalen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3708414#Comment_3708414
I'm a killer main, and I said multiple times that survivors need to be able to see their teammates perk loadout in the lobby and at least a Quickchat function to be able to communicate and coordinate like SWF can do. And I'm not the only one.
Personally, can't wait for BHVR to implement those so everybody can see at last that they were right: The problem with SoloQ is not a lack of information, but a general lack of game sense and cooperation. When it happens, hopefully people will be able to give feedback and devs make necessary changes without anyone saying "Won't somebody PlEaSe think of mah SoloQ!?".
Well, in order to bring soloQ closer to SWF in terms of information sharing, you would also have to implement the following:
- Basekit bond+empathy+kindred, basically make survivors see each other's auras unconditionally, since that's what SWF do by constantly updating their coordinates and status in discord.
- Whenever a singe survivor sees a killer, everyone else should have some kind of constant notification about the approximate position of the killer and what he is doing, since that's what SWF share in voice chat. Basically, in SWF if one survivor sees the killer - everyone sees him.
- Whenever a single survivor sees a trap or a totem - everyone else should get a notification about where the said trap or a totem is. Since in SWF if one survivor saw a totem - everyone saw it.
- Somehow share information about the killer's habits mid-chase, like "the killer respected", "the killer double-backed at TL", etc. Once again, SWFs have this "distributed killer profiling" out of the box.
Quick-chat is not a solution for this, because SWFs can exchange information while running or doing a gen, and a quick chat doesn't allow that. Being able to say "hey, his hex is exactly between these boxes in this part of them map!" while running from the killer is a huge advantage only SWFs have.
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The problem is, the game is being balanced only around SWF vs Killer, they never cared about soloQ experience, since devs themselves never ever play soloQ and have no idea there is an abyss between the two survivor modes.
Killer mains know this too, and yet they don't like to mention it, since ranting about survivors in general is beneficial for them, as it bring new and new survivor nerfs after each rant, and mentioning soloQ problems could accidentally bring a dreaded survivor buff which would also make SWFs stronger.
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Sounds like an ironic thread if anything, to be honest.
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3704477#Comment_3704477
Something like a speedhacks can't really be checked because its still possible to run absurdly fast even in normal lobbies. You're essentially writing thousands of lines of code to take in consideration every single perk in the game. Doing some thing like: Oh this person is moving at 175%. Do they have Lithe? No. Do they have Balanced Landing? No. Do they have Sprint Burst? No. Do they have Smash Hit? Yes. But now theres still that 25%! Now they need to check what else is giving them speed, which can be something absurd like: Them ALSO having Background Player, but they're under the effects of Forced Hesitation and a Clown bottle, but they ALSO so happened to be under the effects of a Refined Serum.
"Oh well just add if they run fast for too long then obviously they're cheating!" Ok so lets say the person moved .2 seconds longer than normal. The server would not only have to check everything above (which btw is just 1 example, there are thousands other scenarios related to movement speed alone) but they would also have to check for latency. Since even tho they actually moved for 5 seconds, the server saw it as 5.2 seconds.
Then you have something like being out of bounds. Then you would have things like Billy, Demo or Victor who are able to cross certain barriers to be able to go out of bounds (which btw for the twins they would have to do an additional check since the person could of switched back to charlotte) and I don't think some one should be labelled as a hacker because they were able to surf off a funny shaped rock.
Its also funny how you mention Minecraft considering their own speed and fly hack detection is so heavily flawed. A server which is slightly underperforming can see some one moving faster than they actually are, same goes if the person themselves have a poor connection to the server. I've seen the message "You moved too quickly" (or something like that) too many times just because I went onto an EU server or a server was just having a bad day.
Is it possible to do something like this? Absolutely. But it was have to do ALL of these checks constantly for every little thing in this game every tick, and theres nothing that could kill this games performance more than that.Once again, it's not that difficult if done correctly. What you described, with checking every existing perk in the game, is the spaghetti way of doing it, that would be inefficient and error-prone. The correct way of doing it would be having a single value like "sprint speed", and having different perks change it on activation. Then the check would be just against this one value, and the check for having a specific perk would be needed only upon events of activation of those perks. That would be much simpler.
Once again, look at Team Fortress 2. It's ridden with sniper bots with spin-aimbots and the anti-cheat is virtually non-existent there, but yet none of those cheaters can ever use a speedhack. Even though game mechanics also allow different speed boosts for players with specific loadouts, the servers easily validate it, and no player can go faster than he should, even if the target speed is achievable by in-game means. Demoknight can't go with his charge-speed if he is not charging, and he can't charge when he shouldn't be able to. And no hacks can change that. Also, sniper bot can never do something like shooting rockets or any other weapon they don't have, but in DbD a Ghostface can fly to the sky and start shooting endless Huntress' hatchets (literally what one famous cheater is doing regularly).
Most of other multiplayer games do these trivial checks and make such cheats impossible to implement, even though all of them have some kind of speed-boost mechanics, different loadouts or perks. DbD is not that much deeper in this regard. The more probable reason is that the DbD code is so spaghettified that it's now impossible to change the core logic without breaking the whole thing apart.
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@Shroompy said:
its really not that easy considering just how many things would have to be taken into consideration.
They would have to look at every single perk, add ons, killers, etc. and go through all of them to see how they interact with each other. They would then have to revisit the thousands of lines of code every time a new chapter releases and how they interact with the already existing content. The game would then have to constantly run this code to do checks and make sure everything is in order, which would have a very big impact on performance.
It's not that difficult, actually, if done correctly. The server is already making similar checks every tick, just add a few conditions into the checking routine, like checking coordinates and velocity against limits. Other games do this, for example, there is a good reason why in Team Fortress 2, with their abundance of cheaters, such cheats as speedhacks and flying are completely impossible. Even Minecraft servers can detect speedhacks and flyhacks with trivial measures. It's hard to find a multiplayer game nowadays where speedhack is even possible because of how trivially it is fixed by the server-side validation, it's truly a mystery why DbD still allows this in 2024.
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@BradQuackson said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3188147#Comment_3188147
Thank you, yes, happens whenever they know you are playing for the day. These people have literal schedules and they know when you are playing by the way you get comments on your profile and things like it.
Not really, a simple script that automatically DDoS'es every address in the cheater's "blacklist" say once every 15 minutes would suffice. It's as trivial as you can imagine.
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@Madjura said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3188089#Comment_3188089
I definitely believe that all survivors brought party streamers and then decided to
ddos youcommit a literal crime that you can go to prison for, because reasons.Fixed that for you.
What's more likely: That someone decides to commit a crime they could literally go to prison for because they got upset in a video game or that your internet connection is just bad and temporarily died?
🦆🦂
Not every country even has laws against DDoS, and even then it's barely possible to prove. Try finding any real court case about a gamer whose PC has been DDoSed. And this vulnerability where cheaters can easily get your IP address on steam version has been known for several weeks so far.
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@[Deleted User] said:
I definitely believe that all survivors brought party streamers and then decided to ddos you, because reasons.
Your tone is incredibly sarcastic in basically everything that you write, so I’m calling bait.
He is not being DDoSed by those specific survivors, but by a cheater he had had a game with before and who got his IP address through a vulnerability on steam version of the game. It's been an issue for about a month, and BHVR continues to ignore it.
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Sounds like a skill issue
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Wesker is OP and literally p2w, if anything he should be nerfed, not buffed, and nerfed hard to that
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@WipeIncGamingYT said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/346037/point-out-the-facecamper
You do not even know, that facecamping is not possible. Facecamping was an issue in 2016 and got fixed.
Onryo can still do it the old way due to a bug
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You were probably DDoS'ed by a cheater. There is an ongoing issue with steam with vulnerability allowing cheaters to get your IP address, which they can then use to DDoS you, thus making you lose your connection and disconnect from the game. So if you are on steam, I would suggest you taking a break from the game until the devs do something about it.
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They will ONLY look at soloQ if enough players uninstall and playerbase drops by a significant amount.
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BHVR never admit or undo their mistakes. Never. This is why we still have RPD in the game. They are prepared to spend countless resources on "decorative reworks" and damage control, only not to admit their mistakes. The same goes for MMR, this system is unchanged since release because the moment the devs try to change it, they will have to admit they screwed up, which they do everything to avoid.
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What do you mean killer queues are exceeding 10 minutes, they implemented queue incentives which must've fixed the problem! Now you can get 10k bloodpoints instead of 5k for being left on the hook in soloQ!
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I guess the devs will only notice the issue after the playerbase drops hard enough, on its own or after players getting tired of being repeatedly DDoS'ed to 72-hour matchmaking bans. I mean, they only noticed issues with DS and DH after the playerbase started going to the rock bottom. Right now they are too busy coming up with new cosmetics and insane archive challenges.
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@Kirahie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3178419#Comment_3178419
I just now had my first suicide on hook as wesker. I was running multiple yellow perks and nothing oppressive (and no slowdown).
They killed themselves because I downed them.
Maybe don't ######### on hook?
Wesker is an OP killer and is clearly part of P2W.
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Can you guys fix the game so that soloQ does not feel so frustrating we have to suicide on hook?
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@burt0r said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3177552#Comment_3177552
But what do you expect them to do against players that behave like jerks and a-holes?
Make each solo survivor strong enough to battle the killer on their own?
Give out free DC passes?
What's the endgame here in this thread?
Something must be done with SWF. Something must be done with the report system. Something must be done with unhook animation spam. Something must be done with being unable to hide your aura from teammates who try to lead the killer to you in end-game. Something must be done with survivor collisions. Maybe something even should be done with automatically detecting situations where the killer stands near survivors, looks at them and does not attack them, with some sever punishments for this "idle behavior" to hinder killer-survivor cooperation.