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@Mr_K said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3939813#Comment_3939813
You're missing the social aspect. If a match end by everyone quiting then what is the point if an end? The Devs might as well kept the automatic mori system.
But there is no social aspect, because there is no more interaction at all. You're just picking people up and hooking them, allowing them to leave at that moment just saves them time and awards you the exact same rewards.
The only downside is if you want to give them hatch. Then it is unfortunate, I agree. But the hatch is never a guarantee, as a survivor you're better off going for another match than gambling hatch.
Even the post-game chat can still be completely silent if none of the four players used the abandon feature. There is nothing lost in allowing players to move on to the next game once the match is, quite literally, over.
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@Mr_K said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3939571#Comment_3939571
It's the same as saying an AI girlfriend is the same as a real one.
Lets say you're up against a strong team and they completed gens faster than you can get any hooks in. But they make a mistake and snowballs to a defeat. Say one is dead, one on the hook and another on your shoulder. Instead of unhooking the last survivor runs up to you and body blocks the hook. You down them because what else can you do. Then almost instantly all three abandon the match. Leaving you to clean up.
Let me ask you, how is this healthy for a PvP game? You don't play this game to face bots. You don't play this game to beat bots.
If you play any real world sport and the other team/player just walks away, without warning or concession, wouldn't that be poor sportmanship? Isn't that a problem?
It's the same as saying an AI girlfriend is the same as a real one.
No?!?
That is a very, VERY different scenario.
Lets say you're up against a strong team and they completed gens faster than you can get any hooks in. But they make a mistake an snow ball to a defeat. Say one is dead, one on the hook and another on your shoulder. Instead of unhooking the last survivor runs up to you and body blocks the hook. You down them because what else can you do. Then almost instantly all three abandon the match. Leaving you to clean up.
But you didn't play against bots in this scenario, you played against players and they happened to lose, it happens. By the time the abandon feature becomes an option the game is over.
There is no more gameplay except picking up survivors and hooking them. There is no difference between hooking bots and hooking people. All of the gameplay is done.
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I still want Freddy and Dredge so we can watch DBD explode while trying to mix the Dream World with Nightfall.
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@mecca said:
Killer behavior is why the abandon feature was even added.
Exactly!
If four man slugging wasn't as prominent as it was, there would be no need for the abandon feature.
@Mr_K said:
They really should put in a delay timer to give the killer a chance to hook. I've seen survivors purposely run towards me just to get down and trigger the abandon feature.
But… why? Hooking a bot and hooking a player is the exact same thing.
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I always used it, mostly out of habit.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3939141#Comment_3939141
It's either a sweaty "4 man SWF", or equally likely "this loss just proves that the game is survivor sided and anything that provides them benefit needs to be nerfed into oblivion".
Well said, my friend.
I think it is pretty funny how easily the argument that "the average survivor is bad at the game" changes to "every 4 man SWF is a depip squad". And that is with a DBD that hasn't been even remotely survivor sided in years.
What players need to understand, imho, is that DBD is more than the individual skill of a player. Every match has several factors deciding its outcome, you're not going to win every single time and that is okay. That is just how the game is.
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@CrypticGirl said:
Since they're going overkill on the go-next prevention and the anti-afk, maybe they'll go overkill on the anti-tunnel/camp/slug, too. We'll just have to see.
I sincerely hope so, especially on the anti-tunnel mechanic.
Whatever it is, I hope it deletes tunneling as a concept. Gone. Make it impossible to do.
This strategy has been causing way more harm than good for years on end.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938756#Comment_3938756
And yet some of the strongest Killers are some of the most favorite Killers to go against. E.g. Billy. Wesker as well, people only disliked Wesker because he was so common. And other Killers which are weak (Skull Merchant) or on the weaker side (Legion) are some of the most unfun Killers to go against.
Strength =/= fun.
I'll disagree with Wesker slightly, my dear friend, because it isn't due to his popularity that I genuinely hate this killer.
But overall, I agree. A character being powerful doesn't mean they're unfun to play against, and vice-versa. It really depends on how the character is designed.
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June 17th, I think.
Less than two weeks until the party.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938565#Comment_3938565
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938565#Comment_3938565
It is holding the game hostage and if they gave it to survivors and not killers it shows a definite 1 sided change to the game. Balance requires that it goes to both sides of the field. Either they need to remove the go next for survivors or offer it to both sides to keep the game balanced
I don't think it is the same thing, tbh. The killer isn't helpless in these situations.
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@Abbzy said:
Wont happen, many survs would be screaming this is unfair they won and as winner they have to enjoy the moment of winning.
I doubt that would happen, tbh. There have been many discussions about this, and not once was this complaint seen. What is most often used as an argument is that killers can force the match to end, while survivors cannot.
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938359#Comment_3938359
You get a protection hit, the person you are protecting gets a half sprint burst.
Thanks friend!
I gotta say that doesn't seem even close to being an actual good perk. The way the discussion was going, I was expecting something stronger.
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@Starfury said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938358#Comment_3938358
I used to not use the candelabras, or when I did, it was to get aggro or drop them in places as waypoints for everyone. I hope they do the Lights Out event more often. The only events I've seen are 2V8 or Chaos Shuffle since the last Lights Out, and I can't be bothered to play either of those events.
Same, my friend, same.
The only reason I play 2v8 is because of the massive BP bonus for survivors. And Chaos Shuffle isn't fun, at all.
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Scrap Baby.
Genuinely one of the best designs in the franchise.
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I genuinely have no idea what this perk does.
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@francesinhalover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938351#Comment_3938351
Lights out has a heavy issue. Using candles tells the killer where you are. It's a terrible idea to even use them if you aren't focused on looping the killer.
Than you add in killers that are crazyyyyyyyy strong in the game mode.
Yeah, overall the very concept of the Candelabra item was terrible. Not only did it completely defeat the whole point of the modifier, which was to be dark, but it also made you a target.
But the first Lights Out, which had no such thing? Perfect… Well, it would be perfect if Freddy had been available, but even without him that event was really fun, I loved it!
@Starfury said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938351#Comment_3938351
I never played the first Lights Out, but the second one I did, and I enjoyed the hell out of it. Hopefully, they bring the first version back so I can try that one out. Chaos Shuffle is just one I'm never touching, it doesn't even seem remotely enjoyable to me.
Honestly, my friend, I think the first one was better because there was no Candelabra, which I think should be the whole point of the modifier: being dark.
As dark as possible.
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@francesinhalover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938001#Comment_3938001
Lmao all others outsise of 2x8 are bad too hhhahahaha
Honestly, my friend, I really liked the first Lights Out. I think it was fun, even if my favorite killer wasn't available, and it was a return to the horror aspect DBD needs.
The second Lights Out was awful though.
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I support this idea, friend!
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Honestly, I think the abandon feature is fine as it is. Haven't had any problems with it, no matter which role I was playing.
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@Pulsar said:
I simply don't like how we've moved into the Fortnite-ization era of DBD.
The game will persist, I'm sure, but it probably won't ever be the game that I loved to death again.
but it probably won't ever be the game that I loved to death again.
It feels awful, doesn't it?
I first realized this when the Realm Beyond's horrible changes were happening at full swing. And I remember that a fellow Forum member, a good friend, suggested that I took a break from the game.
But I didn't want to leave DBD, I never did. I wanted it to be the same game I truly loved.
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Iron Will my beloved <3
Love this perk.
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@FiveNightAtDwights said:
There shouldn't even be DC penalties.
Killer players are not entitled to survivors time. Those survivor players that enjoy going against 2000 wins in a row Nurses and Blight can keep playing against them but the rest of us should either get to DC and go against normal killer players or BHVR should add a killer ban system the same way other games have a hero/champion ban system.
As much as I would love to never see Wesker again, I don't think killer bans are a good idea, simply because the people who main the more, let's say, disliked killers, would have extremely long queue times, and that would be unhealthy for the game.
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Yeah, out of all the modifiers this one is the worst, imo. I really don't like it, just want to get the challenges done with and return to regular queue.
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@SoGo said:
It's got it's charm, but most characters are unusable.
Huggy? What is exactly special about him that warrants a full killer power?
Mommy? DbD doesn't support spiderman-esque powers, so all that's left are strechy limbs (basically a projectile)
The Doctor is already a character, a monitoring, always present killer is already in the game (Singularity)
So you're left with Catnap. He could work tho.
Yep, I agree.
CatNap is probably the only one who could work, but honestly that is okay because he is easily the best character in Poppy Playtime.
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@terumisan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3937732#Comment_3937732
spirit could huntress couldn't because of the angles the windows were at hag could if she placed traps either beforehand or during chase which then a survivor ran from that loop
Pretty sure Huntress could depending on add-ons, perks and the player's aim. Spirit and Hag had ways to deal with them, definitely.
@LockerLurk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3937578#Comment_3937578
No. I don't want to play those Killers, I want to play Dredge, Nemesis, Ghostface, Springtrap, and Sadako. This window needs to not screw those Killers over, it needs to be addressed, that Ballpit can and does sometimes spawn a God Pallet in that room. Add a breakable door nearby at least! A God Pallet should not be able to spawn into a friggin' God Window and then into some decently strong filler tiles and loops from there like this, come on now.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3937586#Comment_3937586
Why are people downvoting you? You're right. I'm a Killer Main and even I understand Survivors have to have something against me to defend themselves! I do think that these stronger windows are still lightly problematic and should be addressed though… Survivors need resources, but no loop should feel totally safe against a Killer just because they're not super mobile.
Only wish I knew, my friend. At least there is an actual discussion going on here.
As for the window, I think it is fine for the current state of the game. I understand why many of the stronger windows, such as Ironworks of Misery and many Coldwind maps, were adjusted back in the day, but since then many dash / anti-loop killers were added to the game.
And the more oppressive a killer is in chase, the more powerful survivor's resources need to be, because survivors have to have a chance, they aren't helpless prey.
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@terumisan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3937586#Comment_3937586
but that's not what happened it was so bad that they had to remove god windows from old haddonfield by just making them not spawn since 110% killers couldn't catch survivors at these loops
Haddonfield had an issue because of Balanced Landing, and even then, the 110% killers were Huntress, Hag and Spirit, all of which could handle these windows.
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I don't know, friend, it is hard to say. It really depends on how the killer plays, how the game is going, which killer it is, which map it is, and the list goes on.
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@foxofthestars said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3937586#Comment_3937586
This is 100% accurate.
Thank you, I'm glad someone sees my point here.
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Well, survivors do need to have resources, they can't be left helpless. Having stronger resources in the game is a good idea to combat the more oppressive anti-loop killers and the wave of generic dash killers.
And most players are used to handling stronger windows with M1 killers from back in the day. I think it will be fine.
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@Shroompy said:
Tricksters Combo laughs is probably one of my favorites, very satisfying to hear after landing several knives in a row.
Dredge in chase almost looks "excited" when chasing somebody as youll see its flailing around a little more.
Unknown having labored breathing in the middle of a chase.
A universal one, but every killer (except for Twins lol) released after Blight has a "walking" animation. If you only partially hold down your joystick to move forward there is a unique animation that a good chunk of killers will do.
Another universal one is most of the newer killers have smoother movement, where if they move their head slightly thats all that moves Instead of their entire body.
Springtrap actually having a human corpse inside of him and not what ever the ######### you see in FNAF 3
***THE NEXT FEW ARE REMOVED ONES***
Tricksters knives used to make a "voom" sound when flying by a Survivor. No idea when this was removed and only found out recently.
Huntress would stop humming when in the middle of a chase and instead breathe really heavily. This would be more beneficial nowadays due to there being more Undetectable perks, and Beast of Prey actually gives Undetectable now as well instead of just hiding the red stain. The only downside to this is you cant hear the full lullaby where she starts laughing towards the end of it, but I think the small detail is worth it.
Some killers (similar to the default one) had unique chase music to their own POV. Myers, Doctor, Demogorgon and Oni. Oni truly is a shame since it was a completely different theme from the Survivor POV. There was a bug back when the Twins released that made it so chase music wouldnt fade away after a chase ended and instead it would just end abruptly. When they fixed that bug they removed the unique chase music from these 4.
Ghost Face when in stealth used to have this sound of what sounded like distorted police sirens and screams. This how ever was removed since it made it harder for him to sneak up on Survivors.
Myers had a "close to tier up" audio stinger that would play to the Survivor who was being stalked and he was close to tiering up. This was again removed since it hindered his stealth ability.
Speaking of removed content, one of my favorites were the entries that each new killer would get, potentially written by Benedict Baker. They are all available on the wiki to be read and I think Spirit was the last killer to receive one. Freddy's is particularly interesting:
"This place plays tricks on your mind…constantly I question whether I dream or if I am awake. This most recent horrid ghoul seems to bridge that gap – between the states of being awake or asleep. I saw him hunting another poor soul, someone who was not as lucky as me. A man with a hat and a claw clad hand, a scarred man of sorts. He spotted me and what actually happened next is still a mystery to me. Dreams took over, and I was sure to die. But I woke up. Not like in the manner where I awake at the campfire, but instead I just woke up…inside this wretched forest, with memories of nightmares within. I am now afraid to sleep, but also to stay awake."
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3937382#Comment_3937382
My only point here is that a general idea that the 2019 DBD was widely praised is something that existed.Sure. I think that's a very common thing and is in no way unique to DbD. Take long running series like Call of Duty, its not unusual to find people whose 'best' version of the game was in the past.
And that's not even limited to video games. It's a common joke that musicians will have fans who will insist the earlier stuff was better ('you should have been here in the early days'), or long running shows like SNL fans usually have their 'golden' version of the show.
My only point with all of that, is that change is necessary for entertainment forms to have a chance at thriving. Video games, music, television, either update and change, or decline. Some people, inevitably, won't like the changes (for a variety of possible reasons). It sucks when you're on that side of the equation, but everyone ends up there sooner or later.
Some people, inevitably, won't like the changes (for a variety of possible reasons). It sucks when you're on that side of the equation, but everyone ends up there sooner or later.
Wish I could leave this side of the equation and return to a point where I actually like and agree with the direction the game is heading. Haven't been there since 2019, and it gets exhausting after a while.
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@NarkoTri1er said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3933309#Comment_3933309
the actual translation: matchmaking in this game is atrocious to the point where stats are absolutely irrelevant for balance talks. Good killer player will have enormously high killrate even after passing soft MMR cap, good survivor team will have enormously high escape rate even after passing soft MMR cap. Even with these stats being irrelevant, Blight and Nurse are the strongest killers in dbd tho, but how does Freddy manage to be killer with highest killrate even after passing soft cap at all?
how does Freddy manage to be killer with highest killrate even after passing soft cap at all?
Recently changed, having both mobility and a teleport, being rarely picked and usually only by those who have been playing for a long time and lack of experience from the modern survivor side when it comes to facing him.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3937286#Comment_3937286
Worth reading it, I'd say. You can see both a general idea and differing opinions.But the differing opinions is kind of the key issue.
I'm not denying that some players preferred a prior version of the game. But there are a few core problems with the argument
1: If that version of the game had just been the static version for the last 4 to 6 years (wherever you are drawing the line), would the players have stayed? I find that argument to be almost impossible, the player count would have inevitably dropped.
2: What level of the enjoyment is not from the game design, but how people played (i.e. the game feeling new and fresh)? The level of efficiency, of techs, doesn't seem to have been as common back then. Inevitably that would have changed over time as well, and likely more quickly without the game changing up.
Like I enjoyed the game the most when I first really got into it, 2022, but that's because it was still new and fresh.
3: These threads tend to be self selecting. I usually ignore threads like this because jumping in and saying 'guys, I played the game a few times back then, and I hated the game' (which is true, I played the game around release, and then a little more around 2019, and both times didn't see what people saw in it and gave up on it pretty quickly). But even within those threads you have differing opinions, making the argument that there is a clear majority self defeating.
1: If that version of the game had just been the static version for the last 4 to 6 years (wherever you are drawing the line), would the players have stayed?
I would have, that much I can tell you.
But I think it has less to do with wanting a static game and more of a disagreement with how things change and how the game was handled.
2: What level of the enjoyment is not from the game design, but how people played (i.e. the game feeling new and fresh)?
Well, I cannot speak for everyone, but I can speak for myself: it is the game's design I miss.
To me, it really does not matter if my opponents have a couple of techs memorized. What matters is that I'll have Old Freddy to play and I'll face them with older perks on a older map. What matters, to me in particular, is having the things I liked be available.
3: These threads tend to be self selecting. I usually ignore threads like this because jumping in and saying 'guys, I played the game a few times back then, and I hated the game' (which is true, I played the game around release, and then a little more around 2019, and both times didn't see what people saw in it and gave up on it pretty quickly).
Not sure about this one. We could make a count, but that would take too long.
My only point here is that a general idea that the 2019 DBD was widely praised is something that existed.
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@I_Cant_Loop said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3936594#Comment_3936594
I have seen all the killers that you just mentioned pretty recently.
Honestly haven't seen Knight in a long time.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3936864#Comment_3936864
A few responses:
First, your assertion that because dbd has changed it up they've "retained" players is wrong. Looking on steam charts, dbd has not had a lasting standing increase in average monthly player count (that hasn't lasted more than a month for DLC releases) since the start of the pandemic back in 2020.This confuses retention and growth.
Retention - we have no idea how many players are being retained vs players leaving and being replaced, but the player count numbers having remaining in a stable 30k to 40k range for the last five years.
Growth - The numbers have trickled slightly upwards over that time, which I'll cover a little more later.
Second, I don't disagree with your point about different games having different lifespans, but is your assumption working on the fact that you think people should be playing the same game every single day?What?
We're talking about overall player numbers. I literally have no idea where you're going here.
Third, like I said, dbd has not had any significant growth since 2020.'Significant' is incredibly subjective. Games almost always lose players over their lifespans, games that are growing at all are an extreme minority. I'm sure there are a few other examples, but games running on ~10 year old engines that have any level of player growth are all live service or MMO style games. The fact that DbD is experiencing growth at any level is rather remarkable.
My point about skyrim is that it has not had a content update in almost 12 years, yet is still sees numbers comparable to dbd, showing that you don't need a constant stream of DLC updates to have good player numbers.Skyrim is one of the biggest, most successful games of all time. Just 'be a Skyrim' is not practical advice.
It also ignores the larger point I made that Skyrim, like the vast majority of games, has seen its players numbers significantly decline over time without those updates. Skyrim has retained approximately about 10% of its player base compared to its height, but its height was about 10 times the size of DbD's current average.
Fourth, that's correct, but around 2019/2020 is the point in which the majority of people agree would be an ideal middle ground to return to - before dbd starting going majorly downhill.Majority seems subjective. Every time posts like this come up there are many people I see replying in the comments that the game is in a generally better state than its ever been.
Majority seems subjective
Like I said, there was a general idea. Obviously there will always be disagreements, but what @Valuetown said is absolutely correct.
I wanted to find some threads as examples, but the search feature here is pretty bad. Here is a little one I've found:
@FlameGNG said:
So i've played dbd since 2017 and ive taken a little break every now and then (after legion got released for obvious reasons :p) and now. I dont enjoy the game anymore killers have been so hard buffed that every match is a loss if you play soloQ. Teammates run the killer for 10 max 20 sec and DC or just suicides on hook its unplayable unless ur a 3 or 4 man swf or sometimes on rare occasions when you do get decent teammates. Almost half my matches are DCs or suicides on first hook. + There are also a sh*t ton of camping and tunneling like before but whatever :P
Do you guys find the game more enjoyable now or did you like it more a few years earlier? (both killer and survivor)
Worth reading it, I'd say. You can see both a general idea and differing opinions.
@Valuetown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3937204#Comment_3937204
I would expect for someone who is lecturing me on "subjective" points to not retort with subjective points of their own, and wrong data to boot.
Your first contradiction is that you say dbd's numbers have remained stable, but then the next paragraph you say they have had growth. Those are mutually exclusive. You cannot have stable numbers and also growth. Stable means no change. It's one or the other. Second: June 2020, dbd had 40k players. May 2025, dbd has 42k players, while the previous 7 months had values in the low 30s. How can you with a straight face say that that's growth? It's not growth. That 2k difference is DLC tourists oscillating the player numbers by a couple thousand before they leave. Sure, significant is a subjective word, but I'd assume that significant meant any number above 5%, which dbd's numbers are not.
You are completely missing the point of my skyrim example. I never said that a game's player count wouldn't naturally fall off after its release, my point was that if you have a good gameplay loop, you will retain players, extra props to skyrim for having numbers comparable to dbd while being a 14 year old game and being a single player experience. Skyrim's original success is irrelevant. For a game that has existed for 4 console generations, 30k-40k players after almost 14 years is a miracle. Just because skyrim was the most successful game in 2011 doesn't mean that translates to it having a very active player base 14 years later.
Your last sentence is a flat out denial of the community sentiment. Ask anyone on the forums who played before the pandemic. They'll tell you 99 out of 100 times 2019-2020 was peak dbd. You can have a personal disagreement with that, but that's how the majority feels.
Ask anyone on the forums who played before the pandemic. They'll tell you 99 out of 100 times 2019-2020 was peak dbd.
As a 2018 player myself, I confirm this.
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@Abbzy said:
Survivors tend to do this more than killers, seeing this from year 2017 when Ochido was very popular dbd content creator.
That is only because every match of DBD has 4 survivors and 1 killer, so you're more likely to encounter a toxic survivor instead of a toxic killer.
If the game was 4v4, you'd see both in equal measure.
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Honestly, they really shouldn't have done this whole "quest system".
The tomes were perfectly fine as they were, there was really no reason to further destroy DBD's identity, which has been suffering since the map reworks.
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I think the first Lights Out was better, tbh, the candelabras defeated the whole point of the modifiers.
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Ah, one of my favorite small details is that you can see Freddy's claw marks on the walls if you're playing in one of the Badham maps. Always thought it was a nice detail for my favorite chapter.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3936690#Comment_3936690
I'll jump in. I agree with most of what Shroompy said, but will add on my own:
Let's go back to the original claim
I don't know where people get this idea that games need to "change it up" in order to retain their players. They really don't, especially if it's an asymmetrical game like dbd. If your game loop is good, people will play it. "Live service" is a fancy way of saying DLC is the primary revenue stream. You don't need DLC to enjoy a game for what it is. A game like Skyrim is going on 14 years old, and it has comparable player numbers to dbd. If you need the game to change in order to like it, you didn't like the game in the first place.A couple of issues:
1: At its height, Skyrim had 287,411 players on Steam. The release of the special edition saw a height of 69,777 players.
Simply put, Skyrim has only retained a fraction of their players. If DbD stopped 'changing it up', they would retain some players certainly, but not nearly the amount that currently play the game.
2: The games are radically different genres. Different genres have different lifespans. As an example, X-Com 2 released the same year as DbD and right now ~5k people are playing it. Does that make it a bad game? No, X-Com 2 was awesome, worth multiple plays, but not something to play consistently for years.
3: DbD hasn't just retained their players by changing it up, they grown over the years.
4: Even people who are clamoring for an older version usually want a version somewhere along the line (i.e. not the OG) - such as claiming 2019, or 2020, or 2021 was the best year. Basically everyone wants some of what BHVR changed up, just not everything.
Even people who are clamoring for an older version usually want a version somewhere along the line (i.e. not the OG) - such as claiming 2019, or 2020, or 2021 was the best year.
A couple years ago, 2019 DBD was generally agreed by the community here to be the best DBD had ever been.
Sure, not every single Forum member agreed with this, but there was a general idea that it was a good time to be playing the game.
Personally, I agree only if it is before Freddy's rework. Anything after that isn't worth it. DBD isn't worth it without him.
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@AlreadyTracer said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3936593#Comment_3936593
I see you're still on here! This is Qrow, btw. Good to see you
Good to see you too, old friend! How are you?
And yes, I think I'll be here for quite some time! And always carrying the Old Freddy torch, of course!
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It is already on the roadmap, thankfully.
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3936572#Comment_3936572
A classic mode to revisit old mechanics I would 100% be down, but to just go back to that for a bit... Im sorry but it wouldnt be nearly as good as youd think. We can see this with Overwatch Classic. Theyve done several itterations of this and while it wasnt a 1/1 recreation it was still pretty damn close, and it kinda gets old pretty quick.
For me it would be perfect, friend.
I played all of the OW Classic events and they were, by far, the most fun I had with Overwatch since they made the change from the original game to OW 2.
The only scenario where it wouldn't be as good as I think, my friend, is if Old Freddy was not available. Then it wouldn't be fun, I agree.
But if he was? Ha, I wouldn't even think of playing anything else.
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3936430#Comment_3936430
I'd gladly go back to 2020 dbd when moris were more powerful, there was no base kit borrowed time, the HUD didn't show survivor actions, etc. if that meant I wasn't going up against blight, nurse, blight, wesker, kaneki, huntress, blight, knight, skull merchant running the most broken builds on the planet, (1950 blight win streak btw) and proxy camping, running back to hook, and slugging weren't in every match.
See the thing is, people had the exact same complaint of constantly going against Nurse and Spirit back then, who were even stronger, Billy was also up there until he got nerfed, and then he was replaced with Blight shortly after. Build diversity in the higher ranks were almost non existent since the more gimmicky perks you have nowadays were even worst than they are now. Slugging was also very much prevalent since the only real way to combat it was Unbreakable, and you couldnt tell if someone just decided to give up and not recover until you ran up to them. People killing themselves on hooks and DCs were even more prevalent than they are now because there was no penalty of doing so other than losing pips, which no one gave a ######### about since BP rewards werent a thing yet. Not to mention cheaters were also a much bigger issue back then.
Power simplicity is something that I can agree with, how ever for a game to stay alive it does need new ways to keep old players and more complex powers mean it takes longer to learn. This is a problem that every live service game that adds new characters regularly suffers from and I cant think of a solution for it.
I do have problems with modern day DbD dont get me wrong, the last midchapter is probably the worst thing theyve ever done to this game and that's something Ill stick by for the rest of time. That being said, DbD's soul is its community, and the game headed in its direction (for the most part) as a direct response from us. A LOT of the things we asked for back then are now in the game, but even then... its still doesnt feel the same, it doesnt have that same spark.
I do still remember those times (especially 2018) fondly as I probably enjoyed the game the most at that point, even if my PC was a literal dorito that could only run the game at 20fps (15 if it was Doctor lol) but thats because the players and community were so much different back then. If I could go back in time to relive those moments I would, but would I want to go back to 2018/2020 DbD with the modern day mindset? Absolutely not.
If I could go back in time to relive those moments I would, but would I want to go back to 2018/2020 DbD with the modern day mindset? Absolutely not.
Not up for the challenge, friend?
I certainly am, if given the chance. Anything for Old Freddy.
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@LockerLurk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3936236#Comment_3936236
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3936247#Comment_3936247
To be fair, you're not really supposed to be able to outlast a chase with a Killer or win a chase against Killer as Survivor. Any Killer. The Killer is supposed to inevitably win chases if they stick it out; the challenge is to waste their time so your team achieves their goals as a result of you doing that chase and catching their interest. Smart Killers do not take chases with Survivors that are difficult to catch to start with, because a smart Killer knows that their time will be wasted and they could pressure better elsewhere. Especially if the Killer is an M1 Killer.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3936249#Comment_3936249
Let me rephrase that, what I meant to say was that in the past, VERY OLD maps were changed to remove things like infinites, which was also why Bloodlust was added. And some maps even after that, prior to rebalancing, were still quite nasty for Killers that had to deal with collision and Killers that lacked strong chase abilities. The rebalancing was supposed to fix this but failed at it, now nobody's having fun.
It is true many of the current maps simply don't feel good, especially certain realms, from either side of the game. I don't think anyone either side likes current Red Forest, I don't know any Killers who like either of the Eyrie maps, and I don't see many Survivors who like Haddonfield. There has to be a middle ground, Looping should be effective but it also can't be so trivially easy that it's as simple as running from pallet to pallet. If this is problematic for older Killers like say, Pig, then simply buff those Killers . I know the "REEE NO MORE HASTE!!!!" people will hate me for this, but if the only solution is Haste? Add the Haste. If the maps are balanced but not fair for some Killers, make the Killers have more capability around the new tiles, don't keep nerfing more maps - because that just makes it trivial for those with stronger chase powers.
Kill rates shouldn't be predicated on how well a Killer does in a map, but escape rates also should not be determined by how easily Survivors can use a map. There has to be some common ground somewhere.
Ah, I see.
Honestly, I think by the time we reached early 2019 there was no more issues with the maps, save for Haddonfield with Balanced Landing, but even the 3.7.0 map adjustments were good enough. After that we eventually reached the big map reworks, and I think that is when things went downhill.
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@Yggleif said:
I miss chest builds being viable when keys were better but otherwise I'm torn.
On one hand you literally can't afford to run goofy build anymore and the meta feels more forced on people but on the other you don't feel like you get flat out screwed as much by things like NOED or Dead Hard.
I suppose it comes down to preference. Do you like the low lows and high highs of old DBD or do you want a more evened out experience of current DBD? My worry about present DBD is it probably is more fair overall but I wonder if that makes it get stale quicker despite the growing roster?
That is an interesting point, my friend, and I may add a little something:
It comes down to preference… to a certain extent. Because if you prefer the highs and lows (mostly highs though) of Old DBD… well, tough luck, you're stuck with the modern game until BHVR decides to release a classic modifier, if they decide to do so.
Personally, I think the early 2019 DBD before Freddy's rework was the peak of Dead by Daylight, I wouldn't hesitate to return to it if I could. Problem is, I can't. No one can.
If you like the Old DBD, and many people do, there isn't much you can really do about it. I don't think an effort was ever done to preserve some of its aspects or, at least, allow custom games to replicate the old game. You're stuck with videos, screenshots and memory, which leads to valid arguments and points being dismissed as "nostalgia", even when you remember it very clearly and have a deep understanding of how things used to be.
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Poor Knight.
He is one of my favorite killers in the game but it seems he never really works properly.
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This would fit Springtrap's mori, I agree, but I think there are restrictions regarding dismemberment in video-games.