Entinaty
Entinaty
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
Gonna be honest I clicked on the thread because I thought someone was advocating for the return of saboing his traps.
Lol no just some ideas of buffing the poster boy a little.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2704343#Comment_2704343
Again, people are confusing the issue I have.
As to the question of whether CoH or Devour Hope is stronger, it's CoH. As to whether CoH or NOED is stronger, tbh, I think they are equal.
My issue came with the guy saying that being able to heal yourself was a more impactful effect than being able to instant down/mori Survivors.
I understand the point you are making and it is a good one. I did say after all that both are good in the right hands. The only thing that I am stating, however is that COH, depending on the situation, is more useful to Survivors than Devour Hope and NOED is to Killers. Just stating again that Devour Hope takes 3 tokens to even gain 1/2 of its true power and another 2 before you can freely Mori anyone. NOED is useless and a dead perk slot until towards the end of the game. The only reason I say that COH is more impactful is due to it having more uses and more life than any other Hex perk that exists because there is no limitation to it other than finding the totems to begin with, which perks also compensate for that downside, and can be used at all stages of the game. Also add in Survivor experience, skill level and coordination (the dreaded SWF lol) and it becomes even more elevated.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2703992#Comment_2703992
We are talking about which effect is more powerful.
Instant downs plus mori's or healing.
Honestly in the right hands both are very powerful but lets make sure we get the entire situation out there before so it can be fairly judged.
COH takes 15 seconds to bless a dull totem and about double that for a Hex Totem. Medkits were already considered by most to be the most useful and beneficial item in the game and healing was already a strong counter to most killer's pressure. COH catapulted that into the stratosphere the way that it currently is now. In some cases killers can no longer hit and run which was a good strategy to not only build pressure but to also allow the Killer to break off of unfavorable chases. Now with COH that is no longer possible as it allows a safety net where the Survivor can heal within seconds.
Devour Hope on the other hand, is very different as even though it is powerful and can inflict a permanent Exposed status on Survivors it can only be done after it gains 3 or more tokens. That is very different from COH in a number of ways. You have to chase, down, hook and be at least 24 meters away from the hook to even gain 1 token. This process in and of itself can take several minutes unless the killer can snowball multiple downs and hooks while being 24 meters away from any hooked Survivor long enough in that situation to get a token. Also, it can be broken before getting any real value out of it as it is lit up at the beginning of the game therefore making it easier for it to be destroyed. Even Ruin: Undying, which protects this perk somewhat, isn't strong enough to protect in a meta where Survivors are actually "doing bones" (the irony) and unless you have a map with decent spawns (Midwich, Lerys, some swamp maps) then the majority of the time it will be found eventually before the Mori aspect even becomes a threat.
NOED on the other hand, is somewhat situational and can't really be gauged as well since it only activates after the Survivors power all five generators. In other words, it only activates in most cases when the Survivors are in a position to win the entire game and acts as one last hurdle to go against. It may get some kills unfairly but in most cases it can only be used effectively is to have a build that is made around the end game, such as NOED, Undying, and No Way Out or the other Survivors are making stupid altruistic plays.
Overall I find it truly ironic that the overall Totem mechanic, which was brought in by a Killer, is getting more mileage with a Survivor perk that is honestly more useful in more situations than any other Hex perk in existence right now. In my opinion it should be brought down to size a bit without taking a total hammer to it because the only alternative would be to bring Hex perks to the same standard to actually have an even playing field but that already happened once with old Ruin: Undying and we all know what happened to it.
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True, it really should apply Torment. At the very least replace one of the worthless add ons he has to do it.
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@Beaburd said:
I know this frustration. I really do wish the developers would take a more active approach to addressing in-game issues without relying on perks band-aid fixes.
Some examples of reasonable approaches are:
To reduce the necessity of gen slowdown perks, have all survivors spawn together at the start of the game no matter what.
To reduce the effectiveness of camping, give built-in aura reading (for teammates only) when someone is hooked.
To reduce the effectiveness of tunneling, give a 3-second hit-immunity grace period once unhooked.
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Notice my suggestions reduce these issues instead of eliminating them. This is because I wanted to propose simple, easy-to-understand suggestions that are intuitive for new players and aren't entirely game-changing. I also don't want to make effects like BT or kindred entirely redundant and unnecessary, hence only giving partial effects.
Spawning all survivors together makes it easier to pressure them early game, forces time wasted running to separate gens if they split up, and can already happen in the game anyway.
Built-in aura reading for teammates when someone is hooked increases co-ordination and prevents the whole "everyone rescues" scenario, which is crippling vs face camping. Aura-reading is already built-in for survivors in need (dying/hooked), so giving it when your team is in need doesn't feel like too far of a reach.
3-second hit immunity gives your team time to co-ordinate body blocks after the unhook for the injured survivor so BT isn't as mandatory, and would pair nicely with the improved co-ordination of team auras during hooks. BT could even just be simply adjusted to start once that 3 second immunity period ends.
Very nice suggestions but I would make sure that BT also doesn't combo with free unhook save state.
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@Aurelle said:
I created 4 survivor and killer perks out of boredom. Feedback would be appreciated. :-)
SURVIVOR PERKS
Connection - You have a strong bond with others and refuse to leave them behind. After healing a survivor for one health state, both you and that survivor gain a Haste effect of 7% for 10/15/20 seconds. Your Auras will also be revealed to each other for a maximum of 128 meters.
Until The End - You know how to lift other's spirits and encourage them to keep fighting. After the last generator is completed, the perk activates. All survivors within 35 meters of you gain a 50% increase to healing, sabotaging, vaulting, and unhooking speed. Until The End lasts for a total of 80/100/120 seconds.
Close Eye - You have a keen eye and pay attention to every detail. Each time the killer kicks a generator, Close Eye activates and you gain a token, up to a maximum of 5. Each token increases your repair speed by 4%. When Close Eye activates:
- Auras of recently damaged generators are highlighted in white for 10/15/20 seconds.
- When a generator is highlighted, your repair speed is increased for 5/10/15 seconds.
Headstrong - You've learned how to hold your own in dire situations. After healing or unhooking a survivor you gain a token, up to a maximum of 4. When you are in the killer's terror radius, a token is consumed and your scratch marks and pools of blood are hidden for 6/7/8 seconds.
KILLER PERKS
Furious Hunt - You seek vengeance on those who betray you. When you are stunned or blinded by a survivor they suffer from the Exposed status effect for 10/12/14 seconds.
Hex: Deceitful - Every time a generator is completed, survivors within 26 meters of completed generator(s) will scream and reveal their location. They will also be affected by the Oblivious status effect for 40/50/60 seconds.
Fear Bringer - After hooking a survivor, all injured and dying survivors suffer from the Hemorrhage and Broken status effect for 40/50/60 seconds. For each survivor sacrificed, gain a 9% decrease in healing, sabotaging, generator repairs, and exit gate opening speed.
At The Top - You refuse to be brought down by others. Each time you hook a survivor, gain 3 tokens up to a maximum of 15. Each token increases generator regression and repair speed by 1%.
Connection: Like the perk idea as it seems to be a combination of Blood Pact and Aftercare.
Until the End: Like the idea but is similar to Leader but does make up for it by making the Survivor a boon totem basically.
Close Eye: This is too powerful to be in the game in its current state. Gives information to Survivor on top of increasing gen speeds by more than 20% for an individual each time a killer kicks a gen would mean that it would become the most powerful Survivor perk in the game as the Killer literally could do nothing to regress a gen outside of Jolt or the new Scourge hook from the Artist. Also from the way it is described you would at max levels have 20% speed on top of extra speed whenever a Killer kicks a gen, and is also could be abused with PTS, Resilience and SC.
Headstrong: Seems to be a good perk and does allow a stealthy getaway from the Killer after unhooking if they are far enough away.
Furious Hunt: Like the idea of Exposed status effect for a stun or blind but time would need to be increased. Good survivors would never really be threatened by this perk at the current time llimit. I would say at max increase to 30 seconds.
Hex: Deceitful: A bit underpowered in its current state as it is essentially a weaker Bitter Murmur. I think that since Hex Totems are finite then there needs to be consequences when they are broken. In this case I would say keep the effects but tie it to the totem being broken or blessed.
Fear Bringer: Good perk idea. A good alternative to Dying Light in my opinion as it is a decrease to Survivor while not buffing Obsession.
At the Top: Don't give a token cap and buff effect to 2%.
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@Superyoshiegg said:
Blame the community for freaking out every single time a new perk is introduced that is actually powerful and worth swapping out a meta perk for.
See: Tenacity, Boil Over, Deliverance, Autodidact, Mettle of Man, Any Means Necessary, reworked Lucky Break, For the People, Soul Guard, reworked Built to Last, Power Struggle, Smash Hit, Blast Mine, Shadow Step, Spirit Fury, Rancor, Dragon's Grip, Starstruck, Lethal Pursuer, Eruption.
All of these have potential to be very useful perks, and I know for a fact that several of them had many complaints before they even came out about how 'strong' and 'overpowered' they would be. Some did in fact warrant nerfs (Mettle of Man comes to mind), of course.
The devs are afraid of adding new meta shaking perks for fear of the community blowing up (as usual) with allegations of "power creep" and what not.
Stop asking for nerfs on new powerful perks, and start asking for lesser used ones to be buffed instead. For example, Circle of Healing is the first (debatably) meta Survivor perk since David released with Dead Hard, which was *four and a half years ago*.
I was with you until you mentioned perks like Boil Over, Smash Hit and Eruption.
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After looking at countless videos and playing in matches against The Artist I find that the majority of complaints are simply untrue or don't have enough information to validate the complaint fully. The majority of complaints include:
The killer's range and ability to get cross map snipes: The killer's range or intel gained from a cross map crow snipe is a bit overblown in my opinion. The crows themselves can't injure across the map unless the player is very good at single crow snipes or the survivor is not actively removing the crows, which even with add-ons that make the time to remove longer don't help if the killer is on the other side of the map as she has no map mobility. Even the complaint regarding the free intel is overblown considering that there are other killers that get the same intel if not better though their own particular perks or powers. For instance, I find the Doctor's static blast more threatening while giving the same amount of intel and even more of a passive disadvantage to the survivor depending on what tier of madness they're in. Also more threatening due to the fact that they know you are at least within their terror radius if it hits you instead of possibly across the map with the ability to have illusions that can tell the killer exactly where you are if they pay enough attention.
No sound cue for her power: Simply untrue as most have pointed out on this post already. She has a map wide sound cue both when setting up the crows and firing them. Also terror radius and heartbeat are a thing so either run or hide depending on the distance of the killer while removing the crows.
Sniped after being unhooked: When facing The Artist and going for the unhook wait until they have fired their crows before unhooking and then move immediately after unhook. I find the only way to be sniped off a hook is either by a lucky shot if they predict how you would move or by staying to be healed under hook, which for me is a taboo as a survivor because it is the fastest way to be put back on that hook.
Strong Anti-Loop: I will concede that they have a strong anti-loop but not unfairly oppressive as she has already been nerfed from the PTB to no longer be able to have the little feathery balls of death act as landmines and down you if affected by crows and you run into it. At that point looping them is still possible around bigger loops but will depend on both the killer's and the survivor's skill at that point between hitting with M1 and trying to hit with a ranged attack, which slows them down. And then there is always the classic hold W method which I understand some would say is unfun but then again it is widely considered the meta for a reason. Also the only other alternative of looping the killer several times around the same loop and then pallet drop is sometimes even more unfun and even more stale.
She decimates survivors in solo queue: When does a competent killer not do that for the most part. Again the correct option is to raise the communication ability of solo queue survivors instead of lowering every killer that comes out. We need to start seeing a variety of strong killers instead of killers that come out strong and then are nerfed and relegated to the garbage pile. For example, see Pinhead.
Some things I have picked up while going against The Artist and watching others do the same:
If far enough away from the killer and near a locker then use it.
Multi level maps are not her friend, so maps like the Game, Haddonfield, Midwich, RPD and some others will still be a pain.
Split up and do gens. She may snipe someone but she can't chase everyone at once.
These are just some of the base observations that I have found after 2 days of the killer's release. Let us give it about a month or two before we try to raise the mighty banhammer against her.
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@RoaderFrost said:
So you want survivors to become even more greedy? And even injure the others! Sounds fun, but have a serious flaw. SWF can just wait out until the very end of curse timer and just pass it. It will take nearly 5 minutes to down someone with this power... and game ends in 4 minutes :)
If they become greedy that's on them. Its either self sacrifice or give into the sin of greed. Not with some of the other slow down perks in the game. Besides hat would leave one person either not doing anything or being very slow. Also the time is only 2:30 total and accumulates all of the time the survivor was marked, meaning if they get remarked or try that tactic then it will kill them eventually. Although I see your point in its counter. So how about his little twist that has never been done before as an incentive to remove. You lose 50 BP for each second that you are under its effects until it kills you.
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@Tsulan said:
Killers HAVE to be weak. Simply because the game needs 4 survivors and only 1 killer. So if killers were actually strong, then everyone would play killer and the killer queue would be unbearable.
At least this would be a logic explanation. Instead of the alternative...
Good logic but is very flawed. Survivors are needed true but the killer is also required. Without the 1 killer there is no game. Without the killers the game doesn't have anyone playing it because otherwise what would be the point. Basically put killers NEED to be strong because otherwise there is no point in playing this game to begin with.
I am interested in what you believe the alternative to be. Honestly I agree that they actually need to see over a period of time what people are complaining about when it comes to what makes killers oppressive regarding certain combinations, not annoying, not unfun, but oppressive combinations that can then be balanced appropriately and then tested before being updated.
For example, before the nerf to Cenobite it could have been something that was instituted in a safe environment under multiple combinations and additions and then tweaked before being updated. If only BHVR had the ability to allow these types of things to be tested by the players in some sort of public test build to iron these things out before updating them. We can only dream.
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@IronKnight55 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2648344#Comment_2648344
So what. A lot of killers I see use Ruin/Undying, POP, BBQ, ect. Does that mean we should nerf those perks? DH is perfect right now.
I can see the annoyance of DH but with no interaction with windows or pallets would be nerfing it into the ground. Although using Ruin, Undying, Pop and BBQ isn't really a good argument to make since the Ruin Undying combo was nerfed and is at its weakest due to new boons, Pop is laughable regression at best since it involves kicking gens and is only primarily useful on high mobility killers and BBQ has multiple counters.
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I believe that it is a fair perk in its current state. It has received several nerfs over the course of its life span already so given any more nerfs would honestly make it unusable. There is fair counterplay to the perk itself, even if somewhat hard depending on whether it is SWF or solo queue, but it does have it nonetheless.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2642557#Comment_2642557
It either doesn't activate at all and you play with three perks or it gives you way too much power.
I'd rather see it become a delayed Corrupt Intervention. "After hooking 4 Survivors, No One Escapes Death activates. You are fueled by your desire to kill and the Entity appreciates your fervor. The Entity blocks all Generators for 45 seconds. This perk can be activated once."
If you want I can add a secondary effect that would specifically take place in the End Game.
Not a good change since it is only a buffed version of Grim Embrace, a perk that already exists and coming from the newest killer, The Artist. Which is also her weakest perk. Which is saying something regarding the current issues with Hex: Pentimento.
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Predator
Your tracking abilities are now now greatly enhanced to better track those that would seek to stand against you..
The Scratch Marks left by Survivors now become footprints that remain 2/3/4 seconds longer.
Furtive Chase
You become obsessed with one Survivor.
You strike from the shadows, eliminating the hopes of the survivors one by one.
0When a Survivor rescues the Obsession from the Hook, that Survivor will become exhausted for 3/4/5 seconds.
All accumulated tokens are lost when the Obsession is sacrificed or killed.
Territorial Imperative
Unlocks potential in you Aura-reading abilities.
When you inflict damage on a Survivor, there Aura is revealed for 8/9/10 seconds.
Fired Up
The anger you feel is unbearable as you feel your prey is slipping from your grasp.
Each time a Generator is completed you gain a 5% increase in movement and all actions for 50/55/60 seconds.
Does not recharge if a Generator is completed while still under the effects of Fired Up.
Overwhelming Presence
Your presence alone inspires great fear.
Survivors within your Terror Radius suffer from inefficiency. When using an Item it has the ability to become unusable for 8/9/10 seconds at a percentage rate of 40/45/50 %.
These are just some off the top of my head. Trying to balance them to be viable without being too strong but let me know what you think.
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@ManOMaker said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631702#Comment_2631702
Although he is pretty weak I’d say he’s the most accurate portrayal of a licensed killer in my opinion so he doesn’t need to go.
Accurate portrayal but needs to be updated for the modern day considering its been years since he came out.
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I would say that old Mikey needs a tuning at this point. Either that or taken out back behind the woodshed.
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@Labrac said:
They probably know how weak stealth killers are in this game. The only decent one is Ghostie and he gets neutered very easily by some teams and maps. Wraith is kind of good but NOT because of his stealth.
Very true I just wish there were some feasible way to implement stealth mechanics or have a stealthy killer that is actually lethal. There are ways to do that without breaking the game currently.
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@H3xB0rr0w3dT1m3 said:
In all honesty no. From the looks of it this killer is just Pyramid Head with extra steps.
I would say better than Pyramid Head honestly due to being able to damage through walls at a far greater distance and actually have some information gathering that is more effective.
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@Huge_Bush said:
One can argue that Mr Cowboy was designed around stealth, but yea, it would be nice to have another actual Mr Sneaky killer. It's probably just really difficult to come up with a power for stealth that won't just be another rehash of "stare at the survivor" and activate your power.
Deathslinger was stealthy but not anymore since they increased his TR and it would be nice to reward a bit of an alternative playstyle for survivors as well with perks that give benefits for not being in the killer's proximity.
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@GoshJosh said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2629434#Comment_2629434
“Can you please either remove reveal altogether on ghost face.” That is the first sentence and their real ask.
Wraith has to cloak and uncloak for undetectable/to attack. GF is much quieter and not limited by the Wailing Bell. Pig has to ambush or come out of crouch. No other stealth killer compares to GF for me really.
True about that first part. But still other stealth killers can go into an undetectable mode and do it far easier and better. In the case of Wraith you can pretty much be standing next to the hook being still and not be seen in most cases. Also has access to an Iri that removes warning bell noise while also having access to add-ons that give him a faster uncloak and increase their already buffed mobility while in cloak while not having a cooldown, unlike Ghostface that has a now slightly buffed cooldown but is still over 20 seconds long at base. With you on the Pig though as she gives too many audio cues even while not using Ambush to come out of stealth.
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@GoshJosh said:
Heck no. Not without some other way to do it at least. The power isn't meant to be free Insidious with mobility around a hooked or downed survivor. GF is the only killer with the ability to go undetectable and attack on demand. That's something that needs serious counterplay. Revealing is usually more broken from the survivor side than it is for him.
How are you proposing he be removable from Night Shroud, if not revealing or him attacking?
To be fair the OP only said while not down or on hook. The normal way to reveal him still works and would honestly open up some more gameplay options with him in the first place. Obviously people will point out that it would buff camping but honestly almost any stealth killer can do that anyway.
EX: A killer with free Insidious with mobility-Wraith.
Edit-EX: Killer with ability to go undetectable and attack on demand-Wraith.
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Would be nice for a spicy combo with Retribution or Plaything
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- Boon totems and Hex totems should be at least equal in strength but boon totems are far and away superior. They can be used an infinite amount of times and cannot be countered except by taking time either from chase or finding other survivors to stop them. At best if this mechanic was going to be implemented hex totems should have been buffed to compensate. For example, like DeadHardly said earlier to give the option to either bless or cleanse, which should have been something that was thought about in the design process.
- If a totem is blessed that contains a Hex then the Hex should be returned after removing the blessing.
- Actually had a perk that could somewhat counter this mechanic (Thrill of the Hunt) gutted and removed the only part of the perk (ironically also a Hex) that gave cause to anyone wanting to run it in the first place. Why remove the notification aspect of it. It doesn't matter if it takes more time if the killer doesn't know you are doing it anyway,
- Doesn't matter if they are loud if you can't either get to them or would just waste time doing so.
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2594008#Comment_2594008
Lol y'all killers are so funny, I actually think camping is fine especially at end game but someone makes a joke and killers immediately just have to start defending why someone would camp, actually funny imo that you need to justify it so badly.
And yea videos would have been cool but I don't go into games expecting camps and because I think camping is fine I usually only screenshot because it's funny.
Good job guys you got tilted by some screenshots and went into defence mode 🤠🥰
Funny that I am assumed as a killer main and sympathizer when I was only asking questions about logic and wanted honest answers based off of the screen shots that you provided. Funny how not only am I accused of defending people but also assumed to be tilted. We all know what is said about those that assume. I just honestly want to know what situations would make camping a problem without with arguments for and against that are logical.
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@Seanzu said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/WS6IYL7BN8HJ/deadbydaylight-win64-shipping-25-10-1635153464.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/BQISBIH3YSK2/deadbydaylight-win64-shipping-21-10-1634830429.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/UIO47XHDII31/deadbydaylight-win64-shipping-21-10-1634830617.png
You're telling me you don't find this fun? :P
I don't think they can do anything against it tbh.
- This is why the first rule of thumb is video and not screenshots as it does more to show us how the game really went.
- Know when to hold them and when to fold them. Rescuing against Bubba is suicide and sometimes sacrifices must be made.
- Before anyone tries to call me a killer sympathizer look at the situation with logic and explain if the killer would have been able to even get a kill otherwise.
- Are we stating that camping at any level or time is bad? What about EGC when there is literally nothing else to do and a great way to get more points from hits or potential trades?
- If you state that even at EGC that camping is bad then why stay and reward the killer with more points instead of just getting out and leaving them with their one kill?
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Good point, will think about something else for it.
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While camping in some instances is very abusive and overall promotes a style of play that isn't fun this option would not only be abused but would target even those that don't camp. This option, in my opinion, isn't the way to go about fixing the issue as it would only promote more unsafe ways to rescue people from hooks. The best way for people to not camp would be to give them an incentive that is more rewarding than camping, not penalizing killers by disabling their powers.
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Both ideas have great merit and should be implemented as soon as possible. Current gen regression is atrocious at the moment and the mathematics back that up in favor of survivors. It takes about 80 seconds for 1 survivor to complete a generator but base regression of a generation from 99% to 0% takes about 320 seconds, which is 4x the difference. Which basically makes it so that it isn't worth kicking the gen at all unless you have pop and even then it only regresses 25% at one time. It would 1 survivor only about 20 seconds to recover that regression and it is the best on kick regression overall in the game. Ruin itself has better regression but of course that comes with the risk of it being destroyed and in most cases clogging a killer's build with more regression perks in the inevitability that it is destroyed. If base regression was at least increased with a general 5%-10% regression with generator tapping brought under control it could lead to other fun perk combination outside of the standard 2-3 slowdown/regression perks for at least some of the player base.
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@TragicSolitude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2529081#Comment_2529081
To be fair, the devs could have at least updated the hatch when they nerfed moris. Okay, maybe the key nerf needed some extra time for animations or something, but the hatch should've just been a numbers change. I'm happy they changed the hatch, but I think for a lot of people it's more of an "about time" reaction than a "yay! let's party!" reaction. The survivors got to have the party reaction when moris were suddenly nerfed.
Exactly. This is something that should have been implemented either with the mori change or soon after. After all, it took several months and the only thing they did was a key animation and hatch spawn change. I'm glad that they finally implemented the change overall as it is more balanced now but things like this (along with several other things over the years) is why the development team at BHVR somewhat get negative criticism.
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Its funny that the survivor that is coming in with the boon totem mechanic is getting more use out of the totems than what Hag (the killer behind the totem mechanic) would ever be able to get.
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I wish the so-called "unfun" wasn't a reason for things to either get buffed or nerfed as it is too generic and can literally apply to anything based on a person's subjectivity. Some things I agree with but I would use a better description instead of it being "unfun". Also it would be better to have everything that is either competitive or slightly strong on both sides labeled as unfun because it then gets nerfed into the groud. Or things that were fine being completely gutted (i.e. Hillbilly).
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@ReikoMori said:
By design we are not playing the same game. Killer and Survivor don't have the same toolset, game approach, win condition, or even the same underlying reasons to play.
When anything changes in the game one side is going to have a different response to it. The playerbase is also vast and varied in skill, game knowledge, and balance. Killers tend to focus on the competitive aspects of the game more heavily as you're the solo power role and as much as people hate to admit it when you play killer the only thing to care about is wins and losses. Changes that benefit killers often translate into perceived mechanical hurdles that may not have a direct consistent counter.
Survivors tend to focus on what feels better or more fun to deal with in regards to them. Now there are a lot of competitive survivors, but it is the easier roll to learn and you have overall less stress due to the option of teaming up with friends. Changes that benefit survivors often are just a flat negative to the killer's gameplay experience as it either involves taking away an advantageous tool or flattening out the general difficulty a killer can impose on survivors
This game's also been out 5 years and generally speaking it is more common for new killers to ship with a lot more limitations or gates on their power than in the past. Most major QoL changes tend to be more helpful to survivors than killers due to how the game has changed in terms of under the hood things like switching from p2p to dedicated server. I'm not going to say there is blatant bias or even unconscious bias because I don't feel that's the case most of the time. It's just that system changes will usually always be more beneficial to the side that doesn't require a ton of individual work. Every killer is fairly unique and takes more work and considerations. Killer changes are often more impactful, but only in relation to that specific killer.
Then there is the fact that as a collective we are probably have too much reliance on one side facilitating the other side's fun. DBD isn't a terribly interactive game in terms of what you're asked to do other than interact with your opposition. Playing Killer is fun until every game turns into a mental strain and survivor quits being fun after you've started rushing gens by default or gotten really good at running the killer. A lot of the excitement bleeds off, but at least one side has teammates to goof around with sometimes.
That is a refreshing perspective to have.
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@PanicSquid said:
Nobody likes their favorite toy being nerfed. People complained when Undying was changed, they complained when DS was changed, they complained when Freddy was changed, they complained when Ruin was changed. People like to come here to complain, it doesn't mean that the changes aren't good for a healthier game as a whole.
Agree 100%.
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@KayTwoAyy said:
I think the rift exists for several reason...
With regards to an outcry whenever changes are made, I think it mostly has to do with the natural disparity between nerfing/buffing Killers vs nerfing/buffing survivors.
Virtually any change made to survivors & their perks effects ALL survivors across the board. Whereas, any change made to killers & their perks is only going to effect one specific killer, or the small few who actually use said perk to some success.
Thus, whenever a QoL patch takes place, the Killers feel like not enough was done, because only a few Killers were addressed. Whilst the Survivors feel like their whole world was turned upside down.
A very interesting take on it. I do think that it does happen to killers as well considering the perks also get affected and are also run through all killers as well. What I would warn against is BHVR not showing to take both sides into consideration. For example, the Spirit change, while deserved gives a bit too much information to the survivor IMO at present. Directional audio is fine but visual as well but not addressing what could be done to utilize the downside of the power (the player's sight) was a bad move on their part. It seemingly tips the balance from one extreme to the other when I believe that it should have been more of a rework than just these simple changes.
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@meatisadelicacy said:
The game has never been easier for killers. End Game Collapse. Hatch. Toolboxes and add ons, destroyed. DS, destroyed. Object, destroyed. Medkits and add ons, nerfed. Balanced Landing, nerfed. Small Game, nerfed. Losing add ons for no reason to punish survivors? Check!
I have died way more because of keys than I've ever been saved, but it would hurt a killer's ego to admit they only got a kill because survivors leave or let people die on purpose so they can get hatch. It goes both ways.
The game is way easier for new killers than survivors, and if you think catering only to new players is something unique to DBD, try playing any other game that exists. There is no such thing as gen rushing. It's the killer's job to stop survivors from winning.
This update gives killers a Trapper buff and a Spirit nerf, along with add on improvements for NINE KILLERS. And it looks like three total perks for survivors got some improvements. But yup. The devs hate killer. Poor babies.
An interesting take on it to say the least.
I don't get how EGC influences one side or the other as at the point either one side or the other is losing at that moment.
Hatch is now more favorable for survivors due to the addition of hatch offerings and no being able to grab them out of it.
Toolboxes needed to be hit as their previous strength led to unfair gen times considering it only takes about 80 seconds solo to do one and a litter over half of that with 2 people.
Old DS was pretty much unfair as it allowed at
a 60 second invincibility in which the killer couldn't interact with the survivor and would allow them to make plays that without it they would either not make or be punished for it, and can still give invincibility by just jumping into a locker or just run with UB.
OOO before rework was basically unfair regarding survivors able to communicate where the killer was at all times without drawback and could basically be done from across the map. Scary to think about with open-handed and no cooldown. Also new OOO allows for you to know if the killer is running aura reading perks.
Can't say I have any information regarding Medkits being hit in anyway but please list examples, if possible.
Balanced Landing was buffed from letting you move at 150% after activation from 2 to 3 seconds and shortened cooldown at max tier to 40 seconds from the original 60. The only "nerf" was where it was updated to not allow the stagger resistance when exhausted, which makes sense as it would be too powerful otherwise and thus cooldown would be for nothing.
Explain how Small Game is in anyway a nerf considering it's recent updates to keep track of totems and tracking ability. Along with other related perks like Detective's Hunch or Counterforce.
Also explain what add-ons are being lost for no reason to punish survivors.
Last but not least regarding keys they tend to either swing games massively in .favor by shortening the game or get the key bearer tunneled, camped or Franklined.
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It doesn't seem to be that bad all things considered. It would work great for some killers and for some it would not work as well which is the same for most perks. Honestly I think that the sheer terror of having a Mikey walking around at Tier 3 with basically 0 terror radius quite interesting. It would be a better style than infinite tombstone anyway. Even with that it still takes up 2 perk slots between M&A and Furtive Chase and would only really help killers that mostly get countered by Spine Chill anyway.
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It's hard to say whether QOL changes would be enough to fix some of the overall problems that she has in the current meta today without at least somewhat of a rework. Her starting ability is too slow, easily avoidable and doesn't provide any pressure to survivors that just don't care about cleansing. Add to that the issue that others bring up about getting her corrupt purge from fountains that are in most cases on the outside of the map and thus away from the main action when they are needed most. In my opinion the only way that I can see the issue being addressed would be to remove the "middle man" as they say altogether as a requirement to get her main power. Give her the ability to use corrupt purge as basekit but with restrictions. For example, how about making the corrupt purge be something that could be built up per level of infection per survivor. The buildup to corrupt purge would then become faster and last longer per survivor infected. Thus gives her faster pressure overall and actually gives survivors a reason to fear becoming and staying infected. The pools of devotion themselves can still be used as healing for survivors not only from being infected but also offers temporary immunity from sickness (say around 60 seconds maximum). Only other thing I could think off in addition to that would be the general fixes such as faster puke speed and hitbox issues. Also remove the ability to be knocked out of it by being stunned.
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Creative Killer Perk-Hex: Corrupt Quagmire.
The entity becomes is angered when its victims work to escape its grasp. When a generator is completed all survivors in the trial lose 10% movement speed for 10/15/20 seconds. Any survivor that cleanses the totem will suffer from Exposed for 50/55/60 seconds.
This is what I believe would make a good Hex perk that isn't overpowered and what I believe all Hex perks should be. A game altering state for the survivor if left up too long but with a risk if it is cleansed since it removes 1 perk from the killer for the remainder of the trial.
Creative Survivor Perk-Fortune's Favorite
You have always felt that you have a bit more luck than others. You start the trial with 3 tokens. When a hit would put you into the dying state you have a 40/45/50 percent chance to get the Endurance status effect. One token is consumed with activation of Endurance status effect through perk activation. If a survivor is on their second hook state they will have a 50% chance to fight off the Entity and escape the hook. Escape during second hook state will consume all remaining tokens.
A solid perk for survivors that can interact with the second hook state since usually happens except pressing buttons to fight off the Entity, teammate saving you or dying in your eventual defeat by the Entity.