Dreamnomad
Dreamnomad
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It isn't fair or accurate to say that nothing has been done about camping. Survivors have base kit borrowed time, killers are punished toward pipping if they are within a certain proximity of a hooked survivor for an extended time, a number of killer perks have been introduced that incentivize killers to not camp, and a number of survivor perks have been introduced to punish camping. I don't know what more you can realistically expect. A force field around hooked survivors?
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@ByeByeQ said:
Bodyblocking other players for extended periods of time should not just be a reportable and bannable offense. It should not be possible.
If 2 or more players in are in close proximity without moving for 30 seconds, then all involved survivors lose collision and can move freely for 3 seconds. A simple solution.
It blows my mind that this game is over 6 years old and a simple fix like this hasn't been implemented.
30 seconds. 5 seconds is sufficient. There is no reason a player should be blocked longer than that in normal gameplay.
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I'm new to this particular game. What do you mean by "kill box rooms"?
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I'm in favor of making the content creator successfully beat their own dungeon before it goes live. If you know where each and every single guard and trap is and you still can't beat your own level then it's broken.
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I ran into this the other day. Gen at like 95% when survivor team mate missed skill check. I came back to the gen as soon as block off period ended and the gen was around 30%. Absolutely insane. The perk needs a time out until its fixed.
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I think if the killer snuffs out a boon at the same location 3 times then it should break the totem. Maybe even 2 times would be fair.
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You don't seem to be getting the message that a player healing themselves is intentionally weaker than altruistic healing. They nerfed medkits and circle of healing specifically for that purpose. Why would they buff self care? That would completely defeat the point.
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Great changes overall. Thanks for listening to player feedback. If I may, I'd like to suggest one additional change to pain res. With there only being 4 tokens, it feels bad if you waste a token when there isn't even a gen at 25% progress. For example, from my experience a lot of times you down the first survivor and just as you are about to hook the survivor a gen pops (likely the only gen being worked on). So you lose a token and don't get any significant gen regression. It would be nice if it only lost a token and activated if there is at least one gen with 25% or more progress.
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It's not overpowered. It hit the sweet spot of "good but not problematic". This nerf is a perfect example of BHVR not understanding their own game. They waste time and resources fixing a problem that doesn't exist when they could be focusing on things that are actually problems.
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Yeah, I won't watch videos if they are all doom and gloom and will typically click the "don't recommend channel" option.
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@Ithiria said:
Increasing the quality of items you get from chests, and adding lucky skill checks would both be good ideas. Lucky skill checks should be disabled when using hyperfocus though, along with toolbox skillchecks but that's another issue to keep hyperfocus in line.
There's a couple other things that luck could do too, these are all effects at the start of the match:
It could be interesting if there were a chance to keep your items and addons on death/escape. I would actually make the same value apply to killer too. No need to give the killer luck offerings, but this is just a bone to throw to them if we ever get an update to luck mechanics so killers don't just feel left out, as otherwise luck buffs would just be naked survivor buffs.
For a lot of events, we have specific hooks and generators that provide extra bloodpoints. Why not use those mechanics 24/7 but apply them to luck? Based on luck factor, a certain amount of generators and hooks will spawn with a special appearance and give you bonus bloodpoints if you hook on them/finish them. That might be fun, it wouldn't outmode just bringing... bloodpoint offerings, however it'd sweeten the deal to bring luck offerings/perks.
Luck should add chances to spawn extra chests, not that many if it rolls because we don't want to disincentive chest offerings, but a lil something. No more than two, I think, with a roll happening twice.
Luck could cause a chance for a wheel to be rolled at the end of the game that rewards items, certain offerings, or even extra bloodpoints. This would have to be tuned carefully to not be OP, but imagine if there were a lucky way to get stuff like firecrackers outside of events? Obviously, this is something killer can benefit from too.
If you do implement a bunch of luck changes, I actually think that manipulating unhook odds should be removed. I think it's really badly designed and unfair. If you don't stack luck offering/perks it's basically useless outside of endgame. If you do, it's very obnoxious for the killer. I'd buff slippery meat in this case to get you try to unhook yourself 4 times without losing hook progress if we can't change it to an entirely different effect. This would be annoying, but I think the odds are poor enough that it wouldn't be oppressive like 4 stacked jars and up the antes can be (where the odds are so good that slippery meat is mostly unnecessary.)
The ideas I listed would be a global luck value thing, which would require reworking how luck is calculated into a global value and a per-survivor value, used for different things. If there's a reason BHVR has only ever nerfed luck, it's probably that buffing it while not being unfair to the killer is pretty difficult. I don't think my suggestions or even lucky skill checks altogether would make luck "good," but I think it might make it fun and worth using for casual play.
I like where your head is at. There are certainly other possible applications of luck.
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@Mooks said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3386457#Comment_3386457
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3386568#Comment_3386568
i am talking about skillchecks that might appear once you get off of a gen - the warning just starts after letting go or are completely missing and the gen explodes without you being able to hit the skillcheck. Some streamer (maybe Otz?) made a video on this I think and concluded the probability is around 7 % anytime you let go off a gen.
Oh, I always just figured that had to do with latency. My internet connection isn't the best.
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@Emeal said:
Luck should be used to increase self unhook chance and loot quality chance for sure.
That's the thing. If you ask a new player "what does luck do?" they would probably assume it has to do with what you get from chests. In most video games luck is associated with critical hits and finding rare loot. It's so counter-intuitive for it to only be based on your chance to un-hook yourself.
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@Mooks said:
No to the stun duration - that seems unbalanced and unfair for the killer.
yes to the other stuff.
also, if these annoying phantom skillchecks are supposed to actually be a feature and here to stay then luck should decrease their probability (which currently is around 7 % according to some streamer?)
Base level of luck for survivors is 4% I believe. I'm not sure what you are referring to with "phantom skill checks". As far as the crit stun, I'm not talking about anything absurd. Just slightly longer. If the stun isn't longer then having blurred vision and no audio for the duration of the stun would work. Just something. Also, these various features of luck don't have to be on a linear scale. They could do a bell curve for pallet stun so it can't be abused.
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I think whatever the killer chooses is the right choice. Personally, I hook the survivor for the first hook and then down but don't hook once the player is unhooked. If the player ever returns, cool, if they don't then too bad.
Edit: I should add that I don't play like a tryhard for the remaining survivors. It's not their fault they got saddled with a bad team mate. I won't necessarily turn it into a farming game, but I'll let them get safe unhooks and heals and occasionally break chases.
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I agree. Just because a perk is used frequently doesn't mean it is overpowered or unhealthy for the game. It's like they can't accept or understand when they get something right. If it's not broke then don't fix it.
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The drum I have beating for years now is they need to add alternative game modes. They need to be careful in the way this is done as you don't want to splinter the playerbase. But if they introduced new game modes and rotated them regularly it would add entirely new game experiences. And the thing is, there are plenty of ways to do this that wouldn't take very much in the way of game developer effort. How much time would it take to make a few changes to the game interface and then make a game mode called "turbo" (or whatever) then increase base movement speed for both killer and survivor by 50%? It wouldn't matter if it wasn't a balanced experience. It would just be fun and different. Then after 2 weeks or a month or whatever, switch it out with another game mode.
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3384974#Comment_3384974
She did have time to recover between her first and 2nd hook as she was able to get fully healed. Between her 2nd and 3rd time getting downed I can see she didn't have much time as she was cleansing totem and I interrupted that. But that still not tunneling as I chased others and hooked between those downs. And I left her on the ground when I noticed it was same survivor I had hooked 2 times.
So I chased hooked and downed and killed whole team meantime she was on the ground and then hooked her. But instead she blaming me she could blamed her team for not having time to recover she would have reasonable time to recover if her teammates could lasted better in chase and also healed her while she was slugged on the ground. Im pretty sure renato felt tunneled as well as I only hooked one survivor between his hooks and he didn't even get healed once or have time to recover and he was first to die. I thin I just tunneled whole team as no-one really had time to recover.
Okay, that gives more context. By just about any standard that can't be considered tunneling. If she got on a totem after being unhooked then it isn't tunneling. Not that you really need to lose any sleep even if you did tunnel. It's not against the rules to tunnel. But if you are the type that tries to play "honorably" then you can consider yourself cleansed of any tunneling sins.
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@TheWheelOfCheese said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3384974#Comment_3384974
It has a widely-accepted definition, survivors just frequently misuse it to make the other player feel bad about winning.
Tunneling originated as a shortened version of "having tunnel vision" which means to focus one survivor exclusively and ignore everyone else.
That's it. It's that simple.
It has never meant "not giving someone a reasonable chance to recover." Ever.
Oh so you are the supreme decision maker on word definitions? Glad to finally meet you. That's not how it works friend. It doesn't actually even matter how a word originates. Words are actually defined from their usage. Whatever the commonly agreed upon usage is what the word means. Let's take the word "literally" as an example. Literally comes from the Latin word "littera" which means "letter" so "by the letter". So literally meant by the letter or the exact meaning of the word. But it was misused so frequently that the definition of the word itself changed.
in a literal sense or manner: such as; in a way that uses the ordinary or primary meaning of a term or expression; —used to emphasize the truth and accuracy of a statement or description… See the full definitionNotice definition 2. So even going by your definition of "tunnel vision", that doesn't make anything I said untrue. If the killer has "tunnel vision" for you that means they aren't giving you a chance to recover.
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a covered passageway; specifically : a horizontal passageway through or under an obstruction; a subterranean gallery (as in a mine); burrow… See the full definition
Tunneling as it is referred to amongst the DBD community doesn't have an actual definition. It is a term used without a commonly agreed upon definition. Therefore it means different things to different people. From a survivors perspective, tunneling happens when they are hooked and after being unhooked they don't have a reasonable opportunity to recover. From a killers perspective, tunneling is only when you down and hook a survivor who was just unhooked. From the narrative you just told then from your perspective as killer it wasn't tunneling because you didn't hook the survivor and gave her a chance to recover, from the survivors perspective they were tunneled because they didn't have a reasonable chance to recover. Both perspectives are valid.
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I don't see the problem with NOED. Once the perk is active, the totem aura is revealed to you. So unless the killer can hook a survivor right next to the totem then it shouldn't be all that hard to deal with. Even if that is the case then the remaining survivors can just opt to leave netting the killer one extra kill. How is that any different from Rancor? I don't even see it being played very often. Lets save the nerf hammer for things that are actually problematic.
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Do whatever you want, but don't you think you should at least play a few games after the update before coming to any conclusions? Honestly, I'm not particularly looking forward to this update, especially when playing as a survivor but I'll at least try it before passing judgement.
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3382519#Comment_3382519
Too many players are slaves to the meta, on both sides.
Survivors entirely reliant on Dead Hard and CoH, who can't function without them, and killers entirely reliant on meta slowdown perks and can't function without them. This patch should be a wake up call to all of them.
I don't have a problem with shaking up the meta. But I do take issue with change just for the sake of change. Pain Res, Overcharge, and Call of Brine feels like that type of change. None of them were actually all that problematic. Killers will just run whatever other perk that slows down the game instead. Are we going to just always nerf whatever gen slow down perk is most popular every couple patches? Is Corrupt Intervention, Jolt, Hex: Pentimento on the chopping block next (or whatever the top 3 killer perks that interact with generators are played next)?
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@wydyadoit said:
I haven’t looked at the updates tbh. Been too busy working and taking care of private matters.
ive said this before - deadhard should be a one time use perk like decisive strike not an exhaustion perk. If you use it and you’re hit then you become injured and broken, but not downed. If you don’t get hit then you can use it again. Basically an alternative to mettle of man. Or whatever. Yes it would destroy the perk, but people hate it as it is so it doesn’t matter.
now… if dbd matches became slower and more tactical then that’s another story. But with how fast games are and how many get out of jail free cards a good team can have there needs to be a limiter.
the rest idk. I’ll have to look into what they’re changing.
You can read about the changes here:
This article was created from a community discussion. The Tools of Torment Mid-Chapter Update is quickly approaching, so that can only mean one thing: It’s time for another Developer Update! In this series of posts, we cover some of the biggest changes and additions making their way to the game. In this edition, we’ll dive… -
Inner Strength, Autodidact, Bite the Bullet, Botany Knowledge, Renewal, and We'll Make It will all have increased value/usage after the next patch. I also have a sneaking suspicion that smart survivors will start running more perks and attempt to play sneaky gameplay to avoid getting hit in the first place. So stuff like spine chill will increase. Alternatively, I could see players just adapting to always being injured and never bothering with healing.
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Are we entering the era of Autodidact? I think they went a little overboard with the healing changes. Hopefully they will reconsider a few things.
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Pain Res nerf was really not needed.
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@Crowman said:
It would be cool, but it would lead to a problem of some survivors being objectively better picks than other survivors. And I don't think the devs want to create a meta for survivors. They've already talked about how they plan to normalize survivor volume.
2 things. A meta already exists. A full meta build would still be objectively stronger than any one survivors 3 default perks + bonus.
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Can't please everyone. I would recommend minimizing chat box. Rarely does anything good come from it. Just play however you feel is fun.
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Distressing - I wish they would combine Distressing and Unnerving Presence into one perk.
Dark Devotion - I wish they would drop the obsession requirement and just put it on like an 60 second timer.
Dissolution - I've never bothered with it but I don't think it would hurt to increase the time to like 4 or 5 seconds.
Furtive Chase - The only thing good about this perk is its ability to switch obsessions which can be nice for certain killer challenges or some meme builds like pairing it with Make Your Choice and Nemesis. They should double the range bonus for each token to 8 meters.
Overwhelming Presence - This one is just horrible when compared to Franklin's Demise. They could triple the penalty to 300% depletion rate when in terror radius and I would still choose Franklin's Demise over it. I think survivors just shouldn't be able to use items when in your terror radius and then add a lesser effect for the rank levels like 50/75/100% bonus bloodpoints toward something. Then it would be about equal quality to Franklin's Demise.
Septic Touch - Just need to add oblivious status effect as well and then it'd be good.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371311#Comment_3371311
If those Killer strats are not illegal why do Survivors feel justified to use death threats against killers who do?
What kind of answer are you hoping for here? How am I supposed to answer how other players justify their own actions? But let's just go ahead and play along here. Whatever survivors say doesn't mean killers have to listen. But if you know that your playstyle is going to upset the opposing team then you should expect angry comments. Just minimize your chat box post game and ignore/block any form of communication they might have with you. They can just cry, scream, curse, and threaten an empty room with no ears all they want. Boom. Problem solved. Just play the game the way you want.
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Literally NO killer strat is "illegal". What are you even talking about?? You want to camp? Nothing stopping you. You want to tunnel? Nothing stopping you. You want to slug? Nothing stopping you. You want to 3 gen? Nothing stopping you. None of these are reportable offenses. Unless you are hacking or using 3rd party software or you are preventing the game from progressing for an extended time (IE body blocking someone w/o hitting them) then you are pretty much free to play the game however you like. It's no secret the developers don't particularly like certain killer playstyles like camping/tunneling/slugging so they give survivors some options to combat those playstyle, but they haven't actually done anything to stop killers from doing it.
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Of all the things to cry foul on, this isn't one of them. If you aren't carrying a survivor to a far away hook then you'll easily be able to get the survivor hooked even if you hit a survivor or two on the way. There are also killer perks to counter this if it really bothers you.
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If you want to sneak around the map, why don't you just play wraith?
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I'm fine with anything that dissuades camping as a playstyle. Buff all the perks that punish camping.
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All I would ever ask of a killer is to not camp or tunnel. Outside of that, knock yourself out. I rarely get upset at what the killer does. But I'm almost always mad at what the other survivors in solo queue hell do. The list of things they do that make me upset is very very long.
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I don't think it's as complicated as you are making it sound. They do their best to dissuade killers from camping. The end. Like is a hatchet force field supposed to be deployed around hooked survivors? Is an EMP bomb supposed to go off if Billy or Bubba are nearby with a chainsaw? If Trapper or Hag were released today then they probably wouldn't be able to put traps near hooked survivors but they've been grandfathered in. Plus those two can use all the help they can get and their powers can be worked around.
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@TigerSnake said:
I still don’t think her 3 gen is as strong as people make it out to be, but designing a killer with only the power to guard things and nothing to help in chase is objectively flawed.
I don't necessarily think that is true. There is more than one way to win a chase. This is a killer that has a lot of add ons that can fundamentally change her playstyle. And playing zone control isn't "wrong". It might not be for everyone. But there are 30 other killers to choose from that might fit your preferred playstyle.
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Well for me, I just don't like losing items when I die. If I don't bring an item then I can't lose it. Some challenges require using certain items so I like to save for those challenges.
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I don't know. It might be too good with no restrictions. At least it isn't a hex perk. Maybe lose the obsession restriction and just go 40 sec cooldown. That would be fair.
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I would barely notice. I rarely play any of those. Especially Nurse and Blight.
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It never ceases to amaze me. The sheer imagination some people have to come up with problems that don't even exist.
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't they make changes to knight during his mid-chapter patch? You might not like or agree with them, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen.
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My thought is it sounds like you answered your own question.
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The only thing I want to see with Myers is once a survivor is fully stalked, they should slowly regress the amount of stalk on them to like a maximum regression of 70% total stalked. Like every 10 seconds they lose 1% stalk so after 5 minutes they will be at 70% stalked. I think that would be perfectly fair. Always feels bad once someone is fully stalked and you can't stalk them any more for the rest of the game.
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Looking at this thread, I'm rather surprised by all the love for Save the Best for Last. Not a bad perk by any means, but I don't see many killers running it.
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@Phasmamain said:
Always run lethal on Pinhead to find box easily
I didn't know you could see the boxes aura with this. Very cool. Are there any other perks that reveal the boxes aura?
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I have a hard time picturing myself playing a stealth killer without Nurse's Calling. And if I'm running nurse's calling then I typically use sloppy butcher with it. I just love catching survivors in some corner of the map healing.
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I would argue that you actually want there to be a range limit on Superior Anatomy. Larger than 8 meters, but if there is no range limit then a survivor vaulting on the other side of the map could accidentally trigger your cooldown when you don't want it. Alternatively, it could screw a survivor over who is in a chase and doesn't even vault a window but someone on the other side of the map triggers it and the killer gets an unfair window vault. 16 to 20 meters should be fair. I would even be good with a shorter cool down like 20 to 25 seconds.
I don't know about the Terminus change. It is clearly intended to be a late game perk. Changing it so it is effective throughout the game could be problematic. It would really be unfair to survivors who are healing and are at 90% healed when a gen pops only to have broken for 30 seconds. Why should they be punished for something that they didn't do wrong?
I think Awakened Awareness is fine as is, but I don't really see a problem with your change either.
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My recommendation would be to turn off or minimize post game chat. I simply don't care to communicate with players after a game is over. And I genuinely don't care what other players do in the game itself other than survivors sabotaging their own team. I find that frustrating as a killer or survivor. Survivors DC'ing or killing self on hook are scumbags. But it isn't worth trying to talk to them about their bad behavior. It's not like you'll get them to change. But yeah, just play the game however is fun for you. That is the entire point of a video game in the first place.