Dream_Whisper
Dream_Whisper
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I would prefer 4 seconds stun, and a simple power token reset, so that killers like Nurse and Blight cannot used their power immediately as they need to wait for their power to reset.
We do not need to punish slow m1 killers with no power for 10 seconds, as it would be eternity in game time. Plus SWF could exploit this by stacking DS agaisnt the killer and forcing it everytime.
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@Crowman said:
The problem is that killers lock in their choice before queue. All a "don't match with x killer" would do is strain matchmaking and create either long queue times and/or worse quality of matches.
Not to mention how certain killer choices would be more unfairly punished.
Exactly, Killer's cannot swap killers like survivors can in Lobbys. It would force killer to constantly requeue to find a match in which the Survivors did not vote again their least favorite killer to face. It would punished killers in playing killers they main and very good at, all because the survivors doesn't want to face a nurse main or any strong killer.
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No, Just No...
Imagine if such a feature exists in the game and every Survivor main or SWF would be banning Nurse, Skull Merchant, Wesker, Blight, etc. And they would forced those killer players that play those specific killers to be simple unable to play with them... It would be like lobby dodging but the survivor are the ones calling the shots....
And of course, it would affect the Kill ratio rate if specific killers are unable to play their favorite killers and be unable to play as them.
Plus, your choice to ban Clown would be unpopular among the group voting, since I doubt any Survivor main has a problem with clown over any other killers that they mostly likely hate more. So your proposal won't help anyone especially you, regardless.
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I hear alot of discussion regarding the problem with Spine Chill, is either
It punished stealth killers and makes them a worthless Stealth Killer. Or it punished any average killers for engaging in regular chases, and the spine chill users abuses the 6% extra action speed to give them a slight edge and a chance to fast vault the window or pallet faster then the killer can secure a hit.
I think stealth killers being punished isn't really a problem, as experienced killers that know how to counter this perk can simple look the opposite direction while moving towards the survivor’s direction; to fool it. It is bit sad that killers whom are supposed to be undetectable can still be somewhat revealed with lines of sight blockers and make the Survivor user have a plan to hide or get extra distance. More often then not, experienced survivors relie on the perks 2nd effect, which is the increase actions speeds to make their chase much better. That part is more broken and bit unfair for killers whom could have hit the vaulting survivor in time, but miss it due to a fraction of a second time difference speed.
As for what I would have to done to rework the perk, I would bring back one aspect and put Rework the other aspect to Spine Chill's cousin, Premonition.
Spine Chill shouldn't reveal any killers looking in their direction unless a clear line of sight is maded. And can have the increase actions speeds (like it used to)
Premonition could be reworked to be more like old spine Chill in revealing any killers under the undetectable status effect in looking in their direction, with and without line of sight cover. The perk can also reveal the killer aura, if they are within 4/6/8 meters of their location, while undetectable is in affect. Then it goes on a 30 second cooldown, before the aura reading can be trigger again.
Spine Chill would be great for any Killers, especially those with vault speed perks. And Premonition would directly counter killers with stealth based builds especially when sneaking up for ambush.
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There are different types of survivors....
You got the Competitive SWF, they are type that would have serious call outs and would easily speed run the game and ensure all survivors get out without many if not any mistakes.
You got the Bully Squads, the type that do not literally care about winning and wants to exploit the game to the point of become the power role (not the killer) and ensure the killer gets literally no fun and take away any form of power to the point that the killer DC.
You got the Meme SWF, full of casual/somewhat tryhards, but they literally make all kinds of mistakes and play for fun.
SoloQ, are literally different type of Survivors, as they can either be trying to try hard, or playing Causally; but lacking information from their teammates and solid coordination or any synergies with their perk loadout with the rest of the team; they majority are the easy victims to Killer.
Your proposal of scrapping gen rush perks means we have to reworking the entire coding, as well as increasing the time it takes to do Generators for survivors. Which for majority of players, it is never fun to watching bars take forever to do.
A much better solution for both sides, is to maybe including more objectives for survivors to do. More ways to escape or be engaging with the killer. We could used a example like TCM in which the victims can literally look for alternatives methods and different means to escape. Like for example, maybe looking around the map for a Generator part to permanent fix up part of the progress of a Gen. Or even looking for a key to the power switch or even do some ritual in the basement (a different kind of ritual) to gives Survivors the option to fight back with the killer (not with headon, flashlight, or pallets). There is a bunch of ways to give killer more time to defend gens and engaging in chase more regularly. Or give survivors more productivity stuff to do, beside working on Generators alone or distract the killer in chase..
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@ChaosWam said:
I know a lot of people defend Deja Vu, but it's true it was given an infinite amount of time to fix the 3-Gen issue until we got our proper fix.
It should go back to what it was before the change, at the very least. It wasn't a bad perk before.
I disagree, this perk was among the niche to most useless perks, that only gives information. No one even bother with it, when so any meta survivor perks offer much more benefits and viability uses, then limited time gen aura perk that only tells the gens that need to be worked on.
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@Uotsumi said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3685366#Comment_3685366
Let's restore the original perk design! It is the information of the location of the 3 generators in recent contact that fills the gap between Solo and SWF, not the 6% speed bonus.
No, this perk update is perfect fine, and it doesn't need to be reverted, not one bit.
Before that it was niche and not so well used perk. But with the additional 6% increase repairs speed when working on those Generators, this perk has a benefit worth running.
If they reverted, you and probably everyone would not even care about it anymore. Band Aid Fix or not, it is perfect fine perk that doesn't need a nerf nor a buff either; and benefit that is good for new player experience.
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@tubalcane said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3683244#Comment_3683244
But tunneling win is not guaranteed anymore. Not unless you are an absolutely awful survivor because of all the easy mode advantages that survivors have (and more every day everytime BHVR worries about their bottom line). 2 gens finished within a one minute chase is totally unacceptable. It's time to make the game hard for survivors again.
It can happen, it is not practical; but you can achieve a good tunneling strategy to tip the game in the killers favor.
Survivors that are inexperienced and not have one or two Survivors on any generator at all times; it is pretty easy for the killer to secure their first kill in the match if they can easily spot the survivor and they are not good looping and wasting the Killer's time while the other Survivors should be working on Generators and not hiding in the corner, in a locker, doing totems and chest or even attempting to hide near the killer for the perfect flashlight/sabotage save opportunity...
Agaisnt experienced survivors, tunneling isn't always a value strategy, unless the Survivors make several plunders and mistakes that resulted in letting one of their teammates getting eliminated too early and turning the 4v1 into a 3v1 or 2v1 or worse 1v1.
4v1 one is the key biggest advantage when it comes to Genrushing. After all, you can easily spread out and hammer as many gens within the first minute of the game, is the killer is not applying enough or any map pressure at all.
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I think it is perfect fine, and not meta defined. It just pretty much a good Noob friendly perk, with a extra incentive to not 3 gen and used this perk to their advantage, especially in solo que.
Coordinate SWF teams don't need this perk, as they can easily explore and identify the gens that needs to be work and has the most progress, especially if the killer is not there defending it. Prove Thyself is a much better and more Op gen fixing speed perk then this
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@Mooks said:
They actually stated in one of the Reddit AMAs that they have planned a rework/addon pass for survivor items iirc. Same with offerings. Though if it is still planned or another scrapped idea we don’t know..
I am hoping they do a rework... map offerings are imbalance in my opinion, and survivors items addons, especially with maps and keys are rarely understandable and beneficial.
Medkits and toolboxes are useful in survivability and rushing objective; sabotage toolboxes and flashlights are fun for sabotage the Killer's moment (only more effective in swfs), and maps and keys are only good for tracking and somewhat BP farming (with the red map?) Or solo escapes by close hatch
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@LapisInfernalis said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3684236#Comment_3684236
Still the same problem.
"A lot of effort" is just called a 4man swf or a lobby where all can chat. It's not that hard.
Therefore, no stacking. And the Sacrificial Ward should bounce if there are no map offerings as well. (same goes for map offerings if there is a ward)
In addition a Ward should also prevent any map from the offering(s) to be selected randomly. There is nothing worse than countering Eyrie of Crows with a Ward only to have it pop up randomly.....
I agreed, with the fact that using a Ward to prevent a certain map offering to come into play, yet by some stupid random fat chance you end getting the very map the offering was trying to send you. It these kind of moment, the game literally hates you and it make you rage more.
And if you do not like that proposal, how about Rework map offerings to simply Reverse your chance in going there.... You hate the eyes of crow map, used the map offering and it would be removed from the map pool.
Or better yet, just scrap map offerings all together and the wards.
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@Starrseed said:
It's rare that we aligne but I'm eith you on that one.
I'd say make the survivor loose all collision for 2 minutes. That should solve all tunneling. No killer is going to follow a survivor around for Two minutes and the whole effect cancels when the survivor starts progressing the game again aka gens totems and what not. Now make flashlight or pallet impossible to use while that effect is on and its not possible to use that effect as a weapon
Exactly, Just Scrap the stupid endurance BT Basekit after being unhooked and make the Survivor lose collision with the killer, not just hit collision but also body collision so they won't get in my way when I am chasing another survivor, especially the rescuer. Make it last a minute or more; as well as cancel early if they decided to do any form of conspicuous actions like fixing a generator, unhooking another survivor, etc. As well as Endgame. (So it cannot be exploited).
The problem with tunneling in general, is that is the most efficient way to win as Killer. Toxic we all know, but it definitely is indeed the most effective way to win if you are certain the survivor being chase doesn't last long in a chase a.k.a Their are literally the weak link or "worse survivor" on the team (swf or not). To killer, is scream free kill and easy victory when tunneling opportunity presents itself.
Of course, what would also be nice if maybe hooking other Survivors killer bugf incentives, like Mini Basekit Pop Goes the weasel per hook or something decent to reward killers with non hooking the same Survivor A.
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@LapisInfernalis said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3683285#Comment_3683285
No. Because then survivors can still always outclass any map offering the killer could use if you put all at 25%. Offerings should only be usable once per realm per match.
Then killer can have a increase chance to 50% instead, it would take alot of commitment in throwing extra map offerings on the survivor end to counter it. Plus, it would be more incentives to used the Anti map offering by the survivor to counter it.
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Map offerings. Pretty much gives one side, especially survivors sided; a straight up advantage, in being able to get their choosen map and 100% used their build at their maximum potionial and efficiency in those maps guarantee. It makes SWF with stack perk builds for that map impossible to beat, and could put the other side in a not favorable situation.(I had a game one time, in which the Survivors send me to RPD as Huntress or Hillbilly; and I simply couldn't down as effectively with the abundance of windows and strong pallets next to each other.)
I say Map Offerings should no longer give you 100% per Offering, and should give you like a increase chance to go there; like 25% per map offering; all four survivor must be able to used it together in order to go there 100%, as well as all lobby members should be able to see any offerings before the match starts. Also, Buff that map offerings canceling offering, to be able to be actually capable of canceling any map offering, regardless if all 4 players used the same Offering or not.
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I would Rework towards make footstep complete silent outside of chase, as well as making it silent when going up stairs or downstairs, with the killer being unable to hear them from up a floor or below. Passive iron will, but for footsteps and only outside of chase
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@tubalcane said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/408926/genrushing-huge-problem-for-killer
Gens just get done too fast. Makes no sense how the first chase, even a short one, turns into 2 gens done.
It sort of does, because... when the killer is too busy engaging in chase with one survivor at a time; the other 3 survivors are going to do the most productive method to win; which is fix their one and only objective, the Generators. Sure, good survivor can work together and fix one or two Generators as soon as possible; but it is also very efficient to spread out and hammer as many Generators as possible if the Survivor being chase is the best player of the team and knows how to loop the killer and keep him occupied the entire time. Smart killers would learn to engage in short chases and try to end chase as soon as possible, or abandon chases and find others Survivors to find the worse player on the survivor team in the match. The worse player or "weak link" are usually the ones that are easy tunneling and free kill; and will give the killer a straight up advantage in evening the odds vs the survivor. Good coordination survivor will do everything in their power to try to protect their teammates, even sacrifice one of their hook states to let them teammates live.
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I can agree, but also disagree but agree on the priority.
Yes, SoloQ needs buffs to be just as good as SWF with the ability to communicate with 3rd party communicate. But... I don't want them to be so good that most killers will think they are dealing with competitive level SWF players/bully squads that they might tend to lobby dodge or even tunnel or play toxic all the time. I agree it can be a priority but not the number one priority.
If they are going to buff SoloQ with so much reliable communication, heck through in free voice communications. They need to take the extra step in helping any average killers to be compensate and still have a power level to handle 1v4, with faster mobility, lethality, or even decent map pressure in general.
As far as I can see it, trying to buff SoloQ to be as good as SWF seem like a pipe dream that is harder to execute then easier to say it.
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@glitchboi said:
In my opinion, being unhooked should grant Mettle of Man's form of Endurance for 7 seconds and unhooked survivors should not have collision for that duration.
I agreed with the whole no Collison aspect.... My problem with tunneling in general, stems from the fact as a killer player, I do not intentionally tunnel; yet survivors with their limited time or OTR endurance status effect after being unhook tend to run out in the open or intentionally bodyblock the killer to protect the other Survivors just so they can be hit and get a free speed boost as a result. Which is turn makes me smarter and just wait out the timer or go after the deep wound unhooked survivor since they want my my attention at that point. And when they die, they complain about being tunnel most often.
Just scrap the entire endurance status effect all together, and simple remove Collisions with the killer, no Hit collision but also no body collision either so they cannot be bodyblock the killer. This effect could last for 60 seconds, or until a conspicuous actions (like repairing a generator, or unhooked another survivor, etc.) Or Endgame happens.
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It would definitely have to be a original killer, inspired heavily by the famous legendary serial killer in the late 19 century, during industrial age London time.
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If I were to see it come clutch, it could work well with SWF whom nearly full repair all the generator and leave them at 90% progress left and then this perk when the ritual is complete can hammer all the generator simultaneously. But, with regression killer perks being so common. Especially for the fact that generator blocking perks can block any form of progress and regression from both sides, this perk can be pretty much useless when complete and leave with such a massive downside of being broken the entire time. Just a worse version of no mither.
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If you truly want to de incentives killers from tunneling, there needs to be more rewards and incentives towards chasing and hooking other Survivors. Especially those with least amount of hook states.
You can get matches in which Survivor A is the first to be hook and the rest of the survivor are playing stealthy, they go for the unhooked, and disappear from plain sight, while Survivor A is the only one that can be found. Why waste so much valuable precious time looking for hidden Survivors, when the same Survivor you just hook is a easy target and helps the killer achieve kills in the quickest way possible.
2nd, There is no reward system (besides BP) for going for different Survivors (unless you have perk build in play, like Grim Embrace and old BBQ); it is much more beneficial for the killer to secure their first killer in the fastest and most efficient way possible, by tunneling; then if you were to not tunnel and let all 4 Survivors be still alive and can genrush and make a easier escape.
Your suggestion would be bit harsh, as it would make Survivor more stronger. And in theory can be exploited, for the survivor that got unhooked to intentional bodyblock the killer and be "tunnel" for the sake of giving their teammates very massive impact in generator speeds. This would be a terrible proposal, plus, some toxic killers wouldn't even care about gens, as long as that survivor is a easy target (the weak link of the team) and make it much easier for them to secure a kill and have a 3v1 and be able to apply massive map pressure.
If I were to suggest new better changes, to discouraged or even eliminate tunneling all together. I would scrap the BT Basekit changes and replace it with no Hit/body Collison with the killer, from the unhooking survivor. The unhooked survivor can no longer be attack or harm by any of the Killer's attacks, but.... they also cannot bodyblock the killer, just to protect their teammates whom rescue them. Any form of conspicuous actions such as fixing Generators, being fully healed, rescue other teammates, being the last Survivor left, new survivor hooked afterwards, Endgame Collapse, etc. Will disable the no Collisions and make them vulnerable to attacks like normal. Before these, the effects of no collision is pretty much last for 60 seconds.
2nd: The rescuer, will be reveal to the killer for 4 seconds after they just unhooked the Survivor; to incentives finding them and punishing hiding Survivors, if the killer is close by.
3rd: If the killer gets a different hook, that is not the same Survivor. How about a Basekit Regression Buff of 5% added for every unique hook they achieved, up to a maximum of 20% (for all 4 unique survivors they hook in the match) which can be added to 5%, for a grand total of 25% for their basekit damaging. Basically, like a Pop Goes the weasel Basekit, but it incentivises the killer to hook all 4 survivors at once in order to maximize their generator regression Basekit without perks. If by chance there is too strong, we can balance it so, if the killer tunneling and eliminated one survivors too early; the stack effects reverts back to 5%. Plus, there is a 8 regression events; so they can only used this 8 times when damaging generators, with all 4 survivors still standing in the match.
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The Map needs to be Reworked by name and overall map design to the "Garden of Pain" instead... This map has gone through several Reworked and is still survivors sided, especially the main house and the many infinite windows and pallets that is connected next to each other, making it impossible for any Killer's, especially m1 average killers impossible to win chase with. Trying to defend the generator in that house of pain, is pretty much not worth defending at all. Especially with how big this map is.
This map needs to be gutted down in map size, the house needs a brand new Rework, especially with Breakable Walls that actually helps the killer out. Also, there are too many weird small obstacles in the map (little bush) that have huge hit box's, which makes them unforgiving for killers that have line of sight or mobility like blight, hillbilly, Huntress, etc. And they end up accidentally bump into when they shouldn't. Too many safe pallets spawns and strong windows, there needs to be some deadzones or cut some safe and make them unsafe.
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@I_CAME said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3673208#Comment_3673208
Everyone knows the MMR in this game doesn't do anything. Please stop acting like there is a super secret high MMR where you play against nothing but god tier survivors. If this were the case then some of the more ridiculous killer win streaks would not exist. We even know from statistics that four man SWFs at high MMR die more than they escape.
In those scenarios, those types of swfs don't care about winning at all, ad their condition of winning is bullying the killer. And yes they tend to play too Aultristic and Lose significantly, when the killer is smart enough to know what they are doing.
But, if playing against swfs teams that are playing to win; yeah... they will always be be better than the killer.
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@menacing_goose said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3673701#Comment_3673701
You say they’re essential but there are quite literally people who pull off 4ks WITHOUT ANY REGRESSION let alone the regression we’re talking about so how is it not essential for them let me know that’s like saying survivor meta was essential to escape matches especially now considering killer current meta along with tunneling
You are picking the case in which those survivors are literally low rank/soloQ survivors whom are not experienced enough or do not have meta perks to utilize to win. In those Game, obviously the killer is going to win in those type of matches. Not in High MMR, or average killer games for me, when those survivors are confident and skilled players that utilized their perks and know exactly what they are doing and what needs to be done. When they have ability to communication and even make callouts to the killer location, identity, their power and perks by watching their actions and strategies; you know for certain, SWFs have a straight up extra advantage that increases their chances of survival immensely, especially if it is their goal to win in that scenario.
Also, you forgotten a most important factors as to why killer tunnel. It technically the most effective way to win, especially if the Survivor they are chasing is the "weak link" of the team. Remember, killers need to kill in order to remove one less survivor from the group, after all; the most effective way to get rid of the survivor’s ultimate advantage (which is the numbers advantage) is secure a kill as soon as possible, with any means to delay progress on Generators, if given the chance.
Understand that, survivors whom are experienced in the game, whom knows how to used meta perks effectively, know very well how very important it is to not let one of their teammates die so soon and they will do exactly everything it takes to not only delay the inevitable free kill for the killer but be efficient in completing their one and only main objectives, which are the Generators. 4 survivors vs 1 killers, 16 perks (that can be stack with meta perks) vs 4 perks, plus the killer most often is only good at engaging chase with only one survivor at a time.
You can probably take a good educated guess on what the other 3 teammates survivors should be effectively doing or what you should be doing, if one teammate is literally be chase. You or your teammates should be hammering gen repair, to increase everyone's chance for winning. If by chance, no one is barely touching the gens and you are being too Aultristic or playing "hide and seek"; you might as well be giving the killer a easy victory and palming yourself in the face. SoloQ most often, never learns this lesson the hard way, and ends up complaining in the forums or not understand that constant perk changes will never truly fix the imbalance pace of the game.
Also, one last thing.... no matter how much you complained about meta perks; there will also be brand new perks to replace them and be sour about anyway, so stop complaining about pain resonance since it got nerf significantly in the past. You want improvement to the game, start by buffing other less insignificant perks to be actually useful and propose more useful balance changes that would maybe de-incentives killers and survivors that don't need meta perks to play normally. If they truly do not like generator regressing perks, how about nerfing generator repair speed up to a extra minute of boring generator repair simulation or a much better solution, another main objective for survivors to do.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3673206#Comment_3673206
Why do people say that pain res grim dms pop is a problem like its also the norm? Running into these full meta builds against killer is about as common as running against full meta against survivors as well. Both are a problem and both should be dealt with simultaneously.
Exactly, they are "meta" because they are literally essential required killers to consent run them to have a "normal Game pace", especially if it gets sweaty for both sides in high mmr.
Playing base game killer without any of these perks, especially if your a lower/average tier killer, can be unforgiving as letting the Survivors team (swf or not) hammer down all their objectives and get away with all 4 escape or one or 2 kill, in a short period of time is more likely possible.
Generator repair time is too efficient, the when survivors split up and have only one survivor be chase by the killer the entire time, while the other 3 are splitting up on separate Genators.. For a strong teir/fast mobility killer that can end chase very quickly, or apply map pressure as fast as possible; this is not a issue; but for most killer roster, that is not possibility without slowdown/gen regression/gen blocking perks to assist them.
Same can be said for Exhaustion perks, windows of opportunity, Adrenaline, and whatever survivors meta perks that literally help increase their chances of survival as well as gen rushing the objectives and getting out as fast as possible. They all died pretty quickly without them, which is why they are most used and meta defined.
Moral of the DBD meta, They are all essential and "bandfix" for the imbalance of the base game, and why many players used them, to gain a way better advantage over any other perks. It is why they are the most common used perks, as literally the other 100 perk option that are available for killer and survivors side; have minor impact and least used rates over the meta.
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@GetNToasty said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3671690#Comment_3671690
Anything to help out with the severe unbalancing of perks honestly. Yes, I would play HC mode RIGHT NOW!
Having a perkless, hardcore mode with no offerings and addons or even items; would give us a interesting results on which killer is "balanced" or lacking, as well as the pace of the game. It could lead to killer or Survivors that need to tunnel/or rush gens; or they play the hook game or farm chest/totems for items/extra bp. It could be a good way to figure out m, which killers or Survivors are struggling in balance without a specific perk/map in play.
That... and also curious to see how really "skill" and good Survivors are really are, without windows of opportunities perk
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I would be down with a hardcore, DBD mode with no perks, addons, offerings, etc.
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If it was up to me to rework her completely, I would not go for "Just revert her back to her original power" route, as they would make 3 gen defenses more convenient and problematic. I am also pretty sure the Dev do not want to go back thar route either.
What would I do instead, is make the drones functions similar to Zombies and make them hover and move in a patrol route in the map. Basically, Scrap the Skull Merchant ability to throw out drones and she can used her device to reactivate them when they are down by survivors. The Survivor can have a few methods to take them down, they can get close to a not active drone which isn't scouting and do the hack minigame. They could uses a flashlight to blind a drone scanner, if it hasn't already alert the killer that it found the Survivor already. And they could even destory a drone, and make it respawn in the map, with a cooldown. Destroying or failing to disable a drone, or being caught by the scanner can punished the Survivors with a claw trap and hindered and reveal them with killer instinct and the killer's tracking device.
Inspiration of the drones moving in a patrol pattern is inspired by the cinematic official trailer for the skull merchant reveal, in which the drones were literally moving and following the Survivors they are have discovered. We need that for the new Skull Merchant 3.0
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Easily a Survivor sided map, the Breakable Walls placement do not favor the killer one bit in in the main building or any of the houses, that is literally copycat from old Haddonfield before the rework. It is possible, to create a infinite window with that fence window and nearby 3 God pallets. The gens are spreading out, so it is easily difficult for any killer to do a 3 gen or any gen defense without a build and a plan for it. This map not only need to be shrunk down, but also they need Rework both buildings completed from scratch. The Breakable Walls is absolutely a joke, as they tend to favor the killer more if left unbroken; then the intended purpose of making loops unsafe original. Those Breakable Walls left intact, especially if the basement spawns in the school basement makes camping the school and deny any safe unhooked much more risky and favor the killer in thar aspect. Everything else about the map is survivors sided.
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I say, this is mostly a balance map; used to be more survivors favored and can still be by SWF with sabotage and flashlights builds. The map is too open and bit large, so it makes Flashlight save practically easier to do; but other times; the map has quite a few deadzones in between the main building and some of the loops. For slow/average killer, especially as Trapper; the bright map can make placing traps easily spotted too early and it is more practically to block strong windows and pallets with traps.
When swf bring hook distance offerings and sabotage builds, the hook spawns can be unforgiving and painful to get too without Agitation or any killer perks to mitigate it.
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Most of the time, I tend to deal with novice survivors and this map as killer can be pretty much in my favor, but agaisnt sweaty survivors teams and coordination bully swfs, it leans to be more in favor of the survivors, due to how strong the building can be on the top floor; not so much on the bottom. The log vault (POG log, as some survivors would call it) is very overpowered and needs a nerf of some kind. Hooks spawns can be pretty not so generous at times, and when basement spawn in main building, especially as playing as Trapper or hack; it is usually easy free kill (plus extra free kill, if the Survivors go for the very risky rescue with no means to escape.)
I love the bushes and tall grass, as it favors immersive playstyle for survivors but also killers that have very small height (chucky). The map can be bit big at times, but it is pretty balanced, compared with other larger maps like Red Forrest
Also, I love the OG shack design, as the Swamp maps are the only maps in the game that hasn't been completed overhaul yet with any past map graphic update yet. I wish it stays, if Swamp maps get updated.
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The map is pretty balanced in my opinion, it could favor killers that like 3 gen scenario; but it also pretty big so it makes some slower speed killers struggle abit to get to one side of the map to the other, especially when the survivors did a very good job at spreading the gen, instead of 3 gen themselves. The loops are balanced for both sides, there might be dead zone here and there, but their is plenty of bushes bamboo and rocks to hide behind. I wish other maps have decent line of sight breakers to hide in bushes.
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@xltechno said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3663739#Comment_3663739
Those who deny tunnels must agree with this.
The point of my proposal is this....
If you truly do not want to get tunneling and you want to get a chance to heal up, go do something productive, or at least play the game. These changes i propose to reworked how unhooking protection works, will ensure no matter what, the killer can't literally harm you for like 30/60 seconds or whatever the devs decides to make it, as there will be no hit collision at all and you are free to run away and not worry about dying anytime soon. However.... you can no longer abused the fact that your completly immune and you can exploit that immunity to protect your friends, especially if you do something dumb like fixing a generator or saving a teammate or any form of Conspicuous actions warrent thing in front of the Killer's face. Basically, used your less then a minute Saving Grace no Collison immunity to heal up and be safe from any potionial immediately "tunneling". If the Devs want to increase the timer, for the killer constantly chasing you, they could; but I rather not create a system that can be exploit by survivors to favor themselves or their teammates, and make it impossible for the killer to do exactly what they need to do to play and win the game by any means. This new mechanic is designed specifically to stop bodyblocking as a the unhooking, but also stop tunneling argument (sort of).
Tunneling will always exist, when you have three lives, and you a hook or two away from death. Another proposal they can do, is a thing called Hook Counterz in which all 4 survivors have 12 hook states all together and no matter what, one survivor can be hook as many times as they want and not die; yet by doing so, they wasting valuable hooks and making it easier for their team to be easy kill in the Endgame. It would be very rewarding for killers that are so good at ending chase ans securing many hooks in a short period of time, that it makes possible to literally kill survivor whom haven't or barely got hook in the entire match. Basically, tunneling would be a bad strategy, unless the Survivor is the worse player and are making it easier for the killer to take away so many hooks in such a short notice.
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@hinney said:
The other part of it would be to remove collision for survivors so they can't body block and hit tank.
I can't tell you the amount of times I try to not tunnel and have someone that just got unhooked body block me from chasing their healthy ally.
We have all these perks to incentivize killers to not tunnel - things like the reworked Pain Res, the old BBQ and Chili (why in the world would they change that?), the reworked Grim Embrace, etc.
All the anti-tunnel perks on the survivor side are repurposed into "I can purposefully get in the way of the killer with my second chance perk" and then they complain about tunneling.
It's never going to be balanced unless we get the mentality changed in the community, or unless they make wildly radical changes to perks or base mechanics to prevent or greatly punish unfavorable playstyles. Neither of which is ever going to happen.
Exactly.... Survivors would scream and whine about being tunnel, yet they instead abused their limited time Endurance protection and bodyblock the killer when they are focused on trying to take out the injured or rescuer whom is vulnerable and possibly a free kill, especially during Endgame. They should just simply scrap Endurance Status effect all together and make it so that Survivor gets no Hit/body Collison at all for like 30 or so seconds, and make them vulnerable to hits and bodyblocking as soon as the time expires or if they did any conspicuous actions like taping a generator/rescue a teammate off hook.
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@SuperCop said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3656914#Comment_3656914
I'm sorry but the part where you said killers normally slug for e reason isn't true. Now, *you* may play that way but there are killers who go out of the way to slug whole team either for easy 4k, or worse, to watch everyone bleed out. It's not ok.
There are also reasons for those actions to happen...
Either the killer is trying to secure adept Achievement, as you need a 4k to achieve that, and can be easily done when everyone is grouping up and getting down one by one. (That is a Survivor's biggest blunder/mistake, especially it is common by SWF whom tend to play very Aultristic and cocky with going for flashlights saves 90% of the time)
Or the worse case scenario, in which they achieve achieve the all 4 survivors being slugged and the killer simple refused to pick them up. When that stuff happens, the killer might be toxic or more then likely was having a bad day and just refused to pick you because those survivors must have messed with them intentionally or not.
Again, just because not a few bad sport killers play like this, doesn't mean not all killers want to intentionally leave everyone on the ground, because they can. There are other factors to consider, like maybe you or other Survivors pissed off the Killer to the point of being toxic and commit such action, or maybe he is playing adept Achievement/desiring for a 4k. Or the perfect scenario, when there are two survivors left in the trial and the killer leaves one slug to find the other for a 4 k. The slug survivors manage to crawl so far away, to a obscure part of the map; that once the killer finally down and hook the last Survivor, they cannot find the other Survivor and then end up bled out to death.
If I were ask for one massive quality of life improvement for killers, to de incentives killers into slugging for the 4k and pick them up. Give the killer basekit Deerstalker, so they can easily find the survivors on the ground and incentives them to hook them. They could also do a BP bonus, if they attempted to hook them within 60 seconds after being down.
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@Sandt1985 said:
..........So, basicly you want the start of the game to be like the Texas Chainsaw Massacre game?
Why not just go play that then?
Exactly... Dead By Daylight is it's own game and doesn't need a Texas Chainsaw Massacre the game overall or gamemode.
I would Prefers survivors spawning next to Exit gates (Instead of spawning randomly apart, across the map Right next to Genators, if possible), and killer always spawn across the map away from the Survivors so they have to go actively search for them or do trap preping. But everything else is fine.
2 Genators to fix is too easy victory for survivors or it can create a scenario in which the killer would literally camp the two only Genators and win.
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@elderwitcher96 said:
Now that Huntress is getting some changes I think devs should look into a change for Iridescent Head add-on.
My suggestion is instead of downing with one hatchet, now hatchets take one health state like before with the caveat that you can carry all your hatchets and use add-ons that give more.
The main effect would be that once you down a survivor with a hatchet ,they get reloaded without going to a locker, rewarding players with good aim.
Now depending on how many hatchets they give her after the ptb there probably should be a certain limit to them, but that's dependant on what changes make it to the live version imo.
I rather they give it the Deathslinger treatment, in which the Iridescent head can only instant down Survivors from more then 16 meters away. 24 meters is a great distance away, to reward skill Huntress players, and cannot be exploit by bad players whom aims to hit survivors up closes. It also indirectly nerf camping with this addon, as Huntress, as the Huntress needs to land perfect align hit from a distance.
I replaced the other Huntress Iridescent addon (the one that allows you to move at normal killer movements speed without Hachets available) and make that effect basekit. And created a new effect, in which Huntress can throw a hachet and if they land a successful hit they regain one hachet everytime, so they would not need to reload as much, if they're aim is perfect.
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I agree, despite being not a new player myself. New players need more general perks, especially for killer some additional Regression/slowdown based perks. And Survivors, some useful generic perks.
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@radiantHero23 said:
The only reason of why i dont want map offerings to go is scratched mirror Myers.
Otherwise, the offerings can absolutely go in my opinion. They hold immense power and are most of the time completely unfair.
Agreed, besides some fun types of builds for specific killers, map offerings need to be scrap or Rework complete differently. Maybe since it is stack by the Survivors side, the Survivors only get a 25% increase chance per map offering they used, so they all need all 4 map offerings can be played just for the killer to overwrite it with the map cancel offering.
Also, maybe killer biased but, maybe the killer should be allowed to view all survivors offerings in lobby screen, so they have time to set it up. It would make the canceled map offerings more worthwhile when you have a minute long feedback of what the Survivors are bringing, in advance.
If not everyone agrees with this, I am more down with simple removing Map Offerings permanently, since they can straight up gives any sides, especially survivors more often a straight up advantage, when bringing a specific build.
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Slugging is fine the way it is. Killer don't normally slug, unless certain scenarios and situations call for it.
Like for example, I chase Survivor A. Down them, and happen to spot Survivor B with a flashlights trying to be sneaky with their saves. That is perfect reasonable situation, in which slugging is fine as it is not safe to pick up, especially if they are out in the open or if the down Survivor is on top of a pallet.
Another scenario, that most Survivors tend to complain alot about, rare but does happen frequently if the Killer encounter a bully squad or coordinate swfs. The Survivor are grouping up and literally waiting or tempting to find every opportunity to flashlight blind, pallet save, or even lockers stun with Head On. In these types of situations, Attempting to pickup and hook a Survivor is very difficult and pretty much impossible and just feeding Survivor's cocky ego of bullying the killer by any means for a "good time~"
Of course, the killer is a solo player and has no teammates to fall back to and has the power to do whatever is absolutely necessary to win; even if it means playing "unfairly" and toxic to survivors in order to keep them down & keep them at bay; to ensure they can pick them up safely and have a regular match. Rarely would a killer be interested in going for a 4k slug fest kill and have everyone bleed on the ground intentionally, unless no hooks are even close by.
By nerfing Slugging, and making Unbreakable basekit (literally the best recovery perk in the game), like we had in that one PTB testing which showcase how very disastrous this change maded to the game. It made Bully squads and all recovery base perks ridiculous OP and made pick up and hooking nearly impossible. You have Survivors stacking Boil Over, Flip-Flop, Power Struggle, Unbreakable, etc. And literally intentionally getting slug in conventional pallet spawns or open areas like dead dog sallon, basically making themselves easy to get saved by their fellow teammates or do it themselves by dropping pallet with power struggle or getting off with boil over and flip Flop. Basically, killers cannot hook as many Survivors and are more likely forced to bleed them out more or relie on the 4k slug mori system that was implemented in the PTB to win. It made some killers that relie on their power to slug like Oni, Twins, etc. Horrible to play.
You can try to create new ideas to counter Slugging all you want, but it not a easy task considering that it is necessary evil tactic the Killer players need, as a method to apply map pressure in the game. And if by chance, the devs do have a good plan to nerf slugging, they absolutely need to nerf Generators repair speeds or do something huge to give killer map pressure without boring Survivors bleeding on the ground half the time.
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As much as I would love a system that rewards free DC to players whom need to quit to avoid cheaters, or unexpected Glitches or exploits or even game crashes. I am however against this, as it makes trolls or unsatisfied/toxic players more freedom to ruins matches even more for the other players in the matches; which in turn makes the entire playing experience miserable for both sides. So NO, no free DCs, not until the day the Developers have created a new system to detect the difference between good and bad players and make it so that killing yourself on hook intentionally just to avoid the DC penalty is punishable.
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I agree, it would be nice if this perk straight up reveal any Survivor entering the Killer's basement and last for as long as they remain in the basement (unless they hide in a locker) , and lingers for like 1/2/3 seconds after they leave it, with no cooldown.
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I am on the opinion, thar this perk is only strong for two aspects, and needs nerfs on those aspects... everything else is perfect fine and balanced.
One aspect, it completely counter Freddy's power by automatically wake up, which is bit counters the fact that the Devs want to remove any perks that allow you to counter any Killer's powers, like they did with Old Small Game perk which allows you to detect, and completely disable Trapper's traps for free. (It makes Trapper hard to play, as survivors back then can literally destory Trapper's traps and be unable to used them for like 3 minutes). They should remove that aspect and give Freddy players a quality of life improvement.
2.) This is a minor nerf proposal, but it make playing agaisnt a SWF running all 4 stacks of Adrenaline maybe less obnoxious. I do find the fact this perk when you and your Team is easily able to coordinate gen rushing and completing all 5 gens very obnoxious, especially when you are on the hook. I proposal the following changes and new effects to make it balance.
As soon as the last Generator is completed, the perk will grant the following effects, depending on your status.
*If you are healthy and not exhausted, you can a movement speed boost for 150% for 3 seconds (like normal)
*If you are injured and not exhausted, you gain a health state but no movement speed boost.
*If you are dying state, you gain health state back to injured state and no speed boost.
*If you are exhausted by any means, expect in the dying state; you are recovering from exhausted completed.
*If you are on the hook and get off, you gain increased movement speed for 150% movement speed for 3 seconds but no health state. Endurance stack lingers after getting off hook by any means.
These new perk changes to Adrenaline will limits the all the benefits and make it very situational and make it synergies with exhaustion perk in check.
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I would Buff the stats (except for vault speed), instead of bringing back the ability for the survivor to find killer looking in their direction behind cover, as it make it obnoxious for stealth killer trying to get a sneaky play. Make it more effective agaisnt non stealthy killers looking in their direction, and Rework Premonition to be more anti stealth killer, of Spine Chill
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Even if it is a priority, I feel like it is not a very important priority, especially compared to the reason for folks to Depip purposely. They do it to get pair in matchmaking servers with the most inexperienced killers for a easy GG match; despite the fact that current matchmaking system is design to make that impossible and that piping doesn't matter besides BP gain every month.
If you want players to be engaging and less incentives to depip; you can simple gives players the ability to DC without penalties (which will never happen nor will it be a healthy change), you could offer more BP time spend in the match and less on wanting to rage quit or kill themselves on hook. Or simply, deal with it; as some players are simply ignorant solo players whom don't care if they are not having fun and don't want to play with sportsmanship or team work involved, nor even care if they are depiping or not.
Like I said, it not a important priority to fix; but rather a effect cause by imbalance matchmaking and lack ot incentives to play and have fun.
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@Smoe said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3628931#Comment_3628931
An option that let's us switch between the following would be nice.
- Hearing no voicelines at all
- Only hearing your own Survivor's voicelines
- You hearing all Survivor's voicelines
I would love that as a option
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@GannTM said:
I don’t think some of you understand why COH before was too strong. It wasn’t the self heal speed necessarily, it was the fact that the perk benefits the whole team. All four survivors having access to this made it stupid.
Exactly; the healing speed were never the problem to begin with.... it was the fact that Survivor with just one single (Old) CoH perk on the team (SwF or not) can literally bring a powerful 5th perk slot for all survivors in the match and give the amazing ability to Self-Care without any negative penalties. Stack that with the medkits pre-nerf/self healing before the nerf; and survivors can literally get away with healing more efficiently and faster then if they get a teammate to come over to them and come heal them up.
Plus, the hidden benefit with the ability for every Survivor in the match with COH having the self care attribute; is that it literally made survivors more efficient in doing Generators, as they is no reason/incentives to heal your teammates and give the killer more time to apply map pressure (without that time sink into Straight up Aultristic Healing each other). Healing speeds or not, the ability to self care in general for all survivors in the match, just by one survivor alone bring this old boon perk on their loadout is too much of a Straight up advantage. It made SWF a nightmare to play agaisnt as killer, and it made solo que more bearable enough to simple not get kill easier. It also completely made "Hit and Run" play styles for killer invalidate and more useless, as if injured survivor gets away and runs to the boon COH to heal up; that is alot of time waste and the killer gets no value in that long chase. It also incentives killers to tunnel even more and camp; especially suspected Boon Survivor players; just so they can eliminate this perk from that match; or secure a kill in the most toxic and efficient way possible.
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@Optx said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622695#Comment_3622695
Edited the post. I agree, there are exceptions.
Trust me, I don't really encounter as much toxic by killer unless they are really having a bad day and had play too many killers games and lose too many times to a bully squads/swf/experience Survivors abuse maps and stacking meta perks to give themselves too much of a advantage to make their life miserable enough to commit to slugging until they bleed out intentionally. Normally killers don't do that when they don't get much BP, Joy in entertainment/killing, out of intentionally slugging to death. I don't play that way when I have a bad day, I simply swap killers or go play another game; or try a meme build or go for a specific challenge to grind for.
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If by chance I am making survivors bleed out intentionally, as killer; more often then not... they forced me into that predicament and abused bad map designs. I had a game in which I play the new alien map as Chucky, and I had a squad whom was abusing sabotage /can't hook me builds for every Survivor in that team. They were not caring about winning but more on teabags and making it impossible for me to hook everyone, especially with how bad the hook spawns in that map particular; in which they used purple hook distance offerings and how they can nearly shut down any hook potentially. It not exactly easy for me to hook everyone in time without them getting off with power struggle, boil over, that perk that allows a fellow teammate to get off faster, etx. So yes had to play different and pretty much slugg most of the time until they were out of unbreakable and I was lucky enough to hook kill two survivors while the rest bleed out for being slug too long and that the closet hooks were to far apart foe me to successful eliminate them. I could have been the generous Killer and risk the Survivors breaking free; but I was simply trying to win a adept challenge then, so I simply couldn't risk it.
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@Rudjohns said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618212#Comment_3618212
I think you are missing the points
5k hours players need to tunnel?
No body needs to tunnel, if you are playing Causal. The only real reason tunneling is common, is because it is exactly the best way to win the game, as killer. There is a quite a few reasons people tunnel, but the most acceptable is that it makes it easier for them to win, regardless of the amount of map pressure and gens are done.
Survivor have couple of things to take advantage of, in a more experience and high level play; which the number advantage (4v1) and that they can split up and hammer down generator, while one of them is busy "distracting" and being chased by the killer for a extended period of time. But of course, there is always bound to be a "weak link" of the group and will eventually be down multiple times and be inevitable kill, just to shrink the number advantage and give the killer the time and pressure they need, just to ensure maximum kill victory.
If you are a casual player, whom enjoys the game and do not care about sweats and having fun; tunneling isn't necessary to win because you dont care about that kind of win. But many folks whom play killer whom resort to tunneling, doesn't do it, because they have a grudge agaisnt a certain player whom piss them off in game or they need to do archive challenges or adept Achievements; they do it just so they can ensure victory.
As far as I am aware of the state of the game as I am concerned; playing "toxic" like tunneling, camping, and even Genrushing and stunning with Flashlights and abusing strong loops/bad map designs; makes it easier for one side to win and make the other suffer with a embarrassing defeat. That is asymmetrical game in a Nutshell, not everyone wins or loses all the time.
Of course, I want tunneling to be deincentives while making it much more fair for killers that play Causal and not be overwhelmed how strong survivors can be agaisnt them.