Devil_hit11
Devil_hit11
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@DBDFreddyK said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3495887#Comment_3495887
He needed nerfs? What!? He was the worst killer in the game. F Tier back then literally stood for Freddy Tier lol.
the first thing when sadako was first release is that she is like old freddy. you finally figured out why I said that.
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it is good for countering new Buckle up+FTP but i think the issue is that these two strategies... are too situational too strong.
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@WiseTraveler said:
why should we reward players who are oblivious to changes? The issue isn't that she's too strong and uncounter. The issue is skill expression for both survivors and killers. In solo queue, it's harder for survivors to express their ability to counter condemnation. But at the same time if all survivors grab tapes survivors limit the killer's skill expression of spreading condemnation. Adding this add-on to the base kit isn't fixing this issue. Tapes need to be nerfed in one way and at the same time her ability to spread condemnation against survivors who don't hold tapes needs to be slightly lowered. This way tapes are actually somewhat dangerous.
Possible options
- passive condemnation for holding tapes for long periods
- if you get hooked or hit while holding a tape you gain more stacks
- anything that doesn't limit skill expressions for either side
if you get hooked or hit while holding a tape you gain more stacks
more stacks? it is already relatively punishing to get hit by the tape. for example if you hit by with a tape, you lose 2 stacks+each 10 second that you are not holding tape, you gain 0.75 stacks. so let say it takes 28 second to get to another TV to hold the tape and Sadako uses TP twice. you get 3.5 stacks just for that play. that part is either fine or could be too punishing. it depends how well survivor adapts to finding the tapes.I want to say it is fine but some feedback is suggesting that condemn build-up is too strong. it is something to monitor as survivors evolve towards playing against the ability in a more efficient way.
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@Blueberry said:
I enjoy that it’s such a unique match and how the round plays out compared to every other killer. Both sides are playing differently than normal. I like the polarity of her power and how there’s room for both sides to take hold of it.
Out of like 20 games today I had maybe 2 teams that actually played against it properly and respected the condemn. Most survivors I think just don’t know what they’re doing, try to ignore tapes and just do gens, get mori’d, then come screaming OP after having done zero adapting.
The teams that actually utilized her counter play made a quite close game. Well balanced.
My only complaint is how reliant she is on her Iri Tape. That should be base kit. Being able to drop into any tv is just too easy and negates any of the slow down it would’ve otherwise provided.
the thing is that iri-tape greatly buff her condemn and it makes way more challenging to remove it. after playing many games, my conclusion is that iri-tape base-kit is kinda like pre-nerf iri hatchets for her. iri-type level add-on like that usually get nerfed to avoid killers from using it to pub-stomp. I could see them putting a heavy drawback on add-on such as making it remove all condemn stacks upon insert a tape discourage usage of that add-on. Its not inherently bad to have super powerful add-on but survivor likely do not want to face extremely unfair add-on's just like killer do not want to face 4 BNP that instantly complete a generator. if sadako more buffs then it should found in other places like in the chase & stealth. if anything I am more convinced of sadako being too strong based off my opponents struggling to defeat the killer then killer needing improvements.
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@WiseTraveler said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3495761#Comment_3495761
She has a low-skill floor now because of global condemnation. A bad Sadako will just constantly tp and ignore tape holders and just wait until someone who doesn't grab a tape gets maxed condemnation. whilst a somewhat better Sadako would hunt down the tape holder. Global condemnation has watered down her power to be more simple to spread a lot more condemnation whilst also making it pretty easy to remove condemnation. Survivors have the tools to counter her easily but being that it's a solo queue it's more difficult to communicate with your teammates. She has two very polar ends of pub stomping and or being absolutely destroyed by tape-holding teams. The question is how do we make Sadako not absolutely destroy Solo Queue matches? But also make it so that tapes don't completely take away her power. Each killer should have a range of skills to beat any and all players yet her counter limits her ability to show her skill.
The question is how do we make Sadako not absolutely destroy Solo Queue matches? But also make it so that tapes don't completely take away her power. Each killer should have a range of skills to beat any and all players yet her counter limits her ability to show her skill.
that is question that I have asked myself many times with almost entire killer cast. I have no clear answer. What I will say that there is some responsible on survivor end to learn to play against the killer power/strategy before adapting to change any killer. simultaneously some responsible for killer to use ability to their best ability.
She has two very polar ends of pub stomping and or being absolutely destroyed by tape-holding teams.
that is just part of the skill cap to play against her. if you hold tapes well for long enough time then you will have an easy time escaping the killer. Likewise, if you fail to hold tapes for long enough time to complete 5 generators then the curse will overwhelm you. when sadako get destroyed by tape-holding teams, it is likely because of her weaknesses of being an m1 killer and survivor using the loops well alongside having good positioning to not get hit out in the open. if you want to buff that m1 weakness, then you have to improve her uncloaking(such as removing m/s penalty to decloak) and reworking that phase-walk invisibility. she also has undetectable but survivor can easily hear her due to ambient sounds. It is just that improving these aspects of her kit is too soon because loads of survivor struggle with condemn mechanic alone. dealing with anti-loop type mechanics and stealth is whole new level of difficulty that might be too difficult to play against even for teams that do properly counter condemn. I think skill-floor is already very high for average survivor given that average team easily falls apart to condemn alone.
buffing her against tape-holding teams would make her too strong for vast majority of survivor teams. survivors need time to learn to play against the condemn mechanic first before ever considering any changes.
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what about is overpowered? Hope is end-game perk to increase survival rate when all 5 generator are powered. MFT just happens to work with Hope to be stronger in late game.
The survivor in end game cannot hold killer hostage with speed because killer can open exit gate to start EGC. I can only see problem with haste if survivor moves faster than killer and it is before end game due to survivor creating a game hostage similar to old DBD 2016 infinities.
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@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3495761#Comment_3495761
I could literally repeat what you just said but about the 3 gen camping Skull Merchant. How is a 3 gen skull merchant not busted given it held, arguably the best survivors in the world, in a match for 55 minutes?
Takes a high skill floor to counter and a high skill ceiling for the SM to do well if their opponent plays well.
Some things need to be changed that arent balanced properly.
that is just unfair map design for survivor. maps should be big enough that gen spread is not so tight and survivors should learn to play better towards 3 gen type perks. this whole shrinking of maps and the killer being forced to 3 gen is not healthy for the game in terms of fun factor. the goal of the game should be more oriented to fun. 3 gen camping is like opposite of interesting and fun gameplay.
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@Blueberry said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3495724#Comment_3495724
"that is because you do not realize you have made a mistake. soloq has many inefficiency errors."
I literally said it was "me" or "my team" making mistakes. How is that not realizing I made a mistake when I said it was me making mistakes?
So you agree about it being solo queue inefficiency errors. That's my point. It's a skill issue, not a balance one.
"if killer uses their power well and the killer power has a lot of skill-expression then killer can mitigate and sometimes entirely avoid the map design problems entirely."
Hard disagree. I feel like you think killers have way more agency than they do. Most of the killer roster, bar some exceptions, rely on survivor mistakes to win. If both sides played perfectly, killer would lose every single time. It doesn't matter how good you play as most killers, the map design is so bad on most maps that you can play perfectly and still lose if they also play it perfectly. Most the killer roster does not have the tools to counteract how bad the map design is.
Most the killer roster does not have the tools to counteract how bad the map design is.
I could say reverse for survivor. Most of survivors do not have adequate tools to avoid making mistakes.
So you agree about it being solo queue inefficiency errors. That's my point. It's a skill issue, not a balance one.
it is skill issue that conforms into a balance issue. "This will be another point we're going to disagree heavily on. Like 90% of the killer roster needs buffs of varying degrees with like 50% of them needing large buffs.". you said that over 90% of roaster needs buffs and 50% of roster needs large buffs. you cannot buff the roaster because it will be imbalanced for average survivor. those soloq inefficiency are not possible to avoid without using said perks. your just hoping on luck for those inefficiency to not occur. you have no control over it without playing SWF.
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@ChuckingWong said:
Nothing should be, and rightfully is not, balanced at the SWF level. It is a broken version of this game that a few select survivors play, and they know how busted it is.
Why do you think in tournaments, score is given based on hook stages and not just kills? And perk/item stacking is restricted? And a whole bunch of other parameters are given?
Outside of SWF the current version of Sadako, is pretty busted. You literally cannot get a gen done and have to constantly do the TV mechanic. And even if you do, you'll just get spotted eventually and slugged.
And then the non communication/non-coordination disadvantage game begins. Where everyone swarms to your body that she is currently proxy camping, lets you get up only to slug the others that are carrying tapes, while you frantically look for .... wait for it... a TV.
It just becomes a match all about the TV mechanic and nothing else. Sadako, herself doesn't even need to hook anyone, preferably so as well. Why waste the time it takes to hook someone when you can just make a "slug trap" for the non swf players.
Its something that needs to be looked at.
it is not busted. it has high skill-floor to counter and large skill-ceiling for sadako to well IF their opponent plays well. If your opponent plays bad, you do not need do well as killer to win.
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@Blueberry said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3495685#Comment_3495685
Never once have I lost a solo queue game and been like, wow I lost that from lack of tools. It was either me playing badly or my team. Solo queues issue isn't a balance one.
that is because you do not realize you have made a mistake. soloq has many inefficiency errors. killer also make inefficiency errors as well. there is famous quote by Johan Cruyff.
Football is a game of mistakes. Whoever makes the fewest mistakes wins.
that can be applied to every game. every game is a game of mistakes. the player that makes the fewest mistakes wins. what is important to note is that not every mistake is avoidable and not every game is perfectly fair in every instance. as a result, you have to win on the greatest sum of parts. this is to say that let say 10 scenerio's play out, 2 scenarios can be unfair/skewed against you but 8 scenarios can be changed. do not focus on 2 scenarios that are skewed. focus on the 8 scenario's where it was possible to change outcome.
"The core issue is map design however, so hypothetically if maps were correctly I would pull back on a lot of this, but I don't see those getting fixed as most their map reworks have been failures balance wise and they're still currently releasing brand new maps that already come out very unbalanced.".
map design is imbalanced in many instances but you need to focus on what is possible to change outcome on every map. I am not entirely sold that map balance is entirely the problem. I think it is more how killer deal with said problem. it is how killer powers lack gameplay towards survivor gameplay more so then maps being imbalanced. if killer uses their power well and the killer power has a lot of skill-expression then killer can mitigate and sometimes entirely avoid the map design problems entirely.
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@Blueberry said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3495392#Comment_3495392
"I think it's unfair to label everyone complaining as simply being bad players. Certainly some are, but the quality of an idea shouldn't come from those who argue for it, it should come from the idea itself."
That's why I said typically, not everyone. I agree it should be based on the ideas and not the people, which is what I try to always practice. I was more pointing out a correlation I noticed, not a causation. I don't feel like I've typically heard good arguments for why we should buff solo queue.
"it's currently balanced around generally decent players who don't choose to play 100% optimally all the time"
That's a fair stance and those players are close enough to the ones I was referencing that I could see a fair argument for that. I don't think our balance stances are too far apart.
"Your average SWF is not an unbeatable menace that is guaranteed to give you a miserable game"
I feel like this is a strawman many people throw at killers and like to pretend this is what most killers are saying when it's not. Most killers do not think this, they just think it's a massive unfair and unbalanced for advantage, which I would agree with.
"Regardless of exactly how skilled a player the game wants to be balanced around, they still need to push for solo and SWF being affected more equally by balance changes"
Unfortunately this feels like a near impossible task and even if it was would that be good? We already said the game isn't balanced around swf. So if were buffing both equally then swf, which already has a huge advantage, would still technically be getting even further ahead of its already existing lead. Ideally we'd want things that don't buff swf at all, but as said before, that's near impossible.
"You don't exactly lose a ton of gen time when two people go for the same save because they didn't have Kindred-- it isn't nothing, and it'd add up if it happens more than once, but I would personally say I don't think it's game-changing."
I actually disagree here, it is massive. Even one time getting off that extra survivor gave up nearly half an entire generator between running there and then back. That is huge. Now imagine if that happened more than once. That could literally be the difference between a win and loss.
"By which I mean- it won't make your average opponents actually better than your average opponents now, but it would raise the floor of how below average they can be, if that makes sense?"
I can see what you're saying and that's a fair point. I just see it inadvertently buffing many who are already over the balance line and pushing them further. If we could somehow hypothetically make it where it really was only the dead bottom then I could see that as being okay, even though I do still think it's just giving buffs to people that are losing because of skill and just giving them artificial wins they didn't necessarily deserve. That's a big hypothetical scenario though that I don't see as actually being achievable is the problem. How do we buff the bottom without buffing the others that don't need it?
"Regarding killer balancing, too, we're kind of at the point where there's not much that killers need in terms of sweeping basekit buffs"
This will be another point we're going to disagree heavily on. Like 90% of the killer roster needs buffs of varying degrees with like 50% of them needing large buffs. The core issue is map design however, so hypothetically if maps were correctly I would pull back on a lot of this, but I don't see those getting fixed as most their map reworks have been failures balance wise and they're still currently releasing brand new maps that already come out very unbalanced.
"but I think people overlook that kind of thing in a sort of, one-for-one "they got something we should get something" kind of attitude, which I think is a little narrow-minded."
People do this that's true, but this isn't where I'm coming from at all with my thoughts.
I do still think it's just giving buffs to people that are losing because of skill and just giving them artificial wins they didn't necessarily deserve.
I think this is opposite problem. soloq are acquiring losses out of their control because they do not have the tools to avoid making mistakes.
The biggest advantage of swf isn't info, it's guaranteed good players
Just because your a swf does not suddenly make you a good player. what SWF does is give you the TOOLS to become a good player. If you use said tools correctly then you greatly benefit from being a SWF. you have greater chance to escape and greater chance to win.
Kindred does not make you instantly win. Its simply tool to make you play better by avoiding mistakes specifically this type of mistake:
I actually disagree here, it is massive. Even one time getting off that extra survivor gave up nearly half an entire generator between running there and then back. That is huge. Now imagine if that happened more than once. That could literally be the difference between a win and loss.
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@Matukas said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491928#Comment_3491928
I pretty much exclusively play her as killer so...
After having played her quite a bit, I still disagree. There is absolutely no reason to hook in nearly any game but there are plenty of reasons to slug, especially after downing a tape carrier.
what about if people run lockers before you m1 them with a tape? I think you will have to down them an excessive amount of times before you can condemn anyone. that is just my opinion.
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@DaddyMyers_Mori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3495036#Comment_3495036
If you are bad that it will always be challenging.
But just decent players would get into top level SWF (current).
Hardest part is to have correct call outs, usually use clock system. Most players don't/can't do it.
Global bond would make it so easy for survivors.
-never bring killer to other survivors unless you want to.
-always know where to go for bodyblock
-easy spreading on gens
-always know who goes for unhook
You would want to take hardest thing survivors need to learn and make it basekit perk...
these are basic gameplay actions. those action are all parts of playing survivor well. there should not be a mandatory perk to play survivor well. I am not sure what this would be comparable to on killer side. Its like saying killer should need to run brutal strength to unlock the ability to break pallets.
I know it would make a lot of perks redundant and not very good but it would be healthy change for solo survivor. you would have all basic tools to play survivor well.
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@JustAnotherNewbie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3495083#Comment_3495083
They should just rework the perk honestly. Or just make it be a counter to stealth killers only (as in you only get an indication for a killer that has no terror radius or something) for players who are too afraid of them and would rather waste a perk slot for that. But currently I am not sure it's that effective against stealth killers.
I highly doubt most players would rather swap Adrenaline, MfT, WoO, some exhaustion perk, Inner Healing, Distortion etc. for a perk that is noob friendly against a very small set of killers.
sure but there is a difference between a perk hard-countering killer power and helping against killer power.
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@JustAnotherNewbie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3495065#Comment_3495065
A lot of perks hard counter certain killers or strategies. Slug heavy playstyle is countered by Unbreakable etc. Hexes are countered by totem perks, but how often do you get use out of those? 1 out of 10 games?
Plus, the strong thing about old Spine Chill was the safety distance it provided, so now even if it counts stealth killers, is it useful enough to give you time to move to a safe tile/pallet? That's the question I think.
original spine chill with no LOS was extremely strong for countering stealth. it had no cooldown and it even gave 6% vaulting speed. current spine chill might be too weak.
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@DaddyMyers_Mori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3495025#Comment_3495025
That would be a little bit broken for survivors. There is no way to balance around that.
It would make everything so easy.
i do not agree. escaping killer can still be challenging.
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still think global bond would be more encompassing of a change. .
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
Machine Learning + Trial of Torment
Trial of Torment recently got buffed. Here is it's new effect:
- Upon kicking a Generator, you gain the Undetectable status. The Undetectable status only goes away when the Generator stops regressing. The Aura of the Generator is highlighted yellow.
- Removed the condition where a Survivor losing a health state deactivated the perk.
Trial of Torment basically constantly pings the location of a Generator for Survivors, and since you have constant Undetectable, they are forced to stop the Generator from regressing to get rid of it.
It will always guarantee that you get value from Machine Learning since you will always have the opportunity to kick the same Generator twice.
its too easy to counter and the setup does not meet rewards. you can just pop multiples gens at same time, so if your not running deadlock, you risk getting no use out of the perk. furthermore, without any information for what gens to kick, it is hard to predict the gen that will get done, which leaves you stuck using tinkerer. the perk is meme-tier and there is no saving it in its current design.
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@Blueberry said:
You said it was overall good that she’s now better against bad players and worse against experienced players essentially. This seems like bad design. It’s like saying she’s better against solos and worse against swf, when what we want is the complete opposite of that. We want her worse against bad solos and better against good swf.
Hypothetically here: I feel like if a killers design is “well they’re really good if the survivors play stupid” isn’t a design we want.
I don’t think we want killers that rely on survivors playing bad to win.
remember what I said. a strong killer dominates bad players first before it poses a threat to experienced players. this is why it is difficult to balance killers because if you make killer good at base-kit for good players, it is imbalanced for most players but balanced for the top. vice versa, if you make killer bad at base-kit, then the killer has add-on variety problem and the killer will under-perform vs good players because it is being balanced around weaker players. so in the end, you have to choose one side. most games choose to balance around good players but they also keep in mind to not balance too far to the top so that it is somewhat enjoyable experienced to the middle-level player.
@OnryosTapeRentals said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3494066#Comment_3494066
It’s like saying she’s better against solos and worse against swf, when what we want is the complete opposite of that.
That would be the ideal, yes. But that will never be true. It's just not possible to have a killer that is better against SWF than solo queue. Balacing killers with this in mind is tricky:
- Make them strong and you can compete with SWF no problem but solo queue never stands a change.
- Make them weak and solo queue can compete fairly but the killer now stands no chance against SWF.
In an ideal world, solo survivors and SWF are on equal footing. But in reality, they aren't and never will be.
“well they’re really good if the survivors play stupid” isn’t a design we want.
Once again -- in theory -- I agree with you. But this just isn't how DbD actually plays out. Most of the killer roster rely on survivors messing up or being uncoordinated:
- If one member of a solo queue team cleanses their sickness against a Plague, they're putting the rest of their sick teammates in immense danger from Corrupt Purge.
- If solo queue teams all waste time running to solve the Lament Configuration, or none of them opt to solve it, then the game is thrown.
- If your solo queue teammates fail to split up against Legion and keep letting them chain Feral Slashes, then The Legion is able to apply incredible amounts of pressure.
- If a solo queue teammate lets Oni get an early hit, then the rest of the team gets screwed over.
- If a solo queue teammate lets Myers stalk, then the next person found is going to get instantly downed.
- etc.
If survivors always played with perfect coordination, then killers could be rebalanced to be much stronger and not reliant on survivor mistakes. But most survivors don't play perfectly and never will, so they have to be slighltly weaker against those actual coordinated teams to give the rest of the playerbase a fighting chance.
the 3 good players and 1 bad player is because of lax matchmaking. awhile back they did something where the mmr has lower soft-cap to make matches a bit less competitive because playing weaker killer with strict matchmaking is too unfun for killer. Sadako is in realm of being good for high-level so she does not need that lax-matchmaking. that's kinda case for a lot of stronger killers. they're fine being in strict environment. that is why some people have at some point suggest something like casual que and competitive que. i think for survivor, that is kinda silly but for killer, I think it might be good idea that some killer have more lax matchmaking while stronger killer face better players. that whole thing is weird problem.
soloq tends to have just some information/coordinate issues, otherwise playing survivor is a lot of fun. sometimes you get weaker teammates but it is overall ok.
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The Design Problem
Therein lies the problem at the heart of the Tantrum mechanic: it actively hinders what he is intended to do. He should be chasing survivors around objects as a strength, but his weakness actively prohibits that; one cut too close, and you're self-stunned for eternity; 5 seconds plus 1 second per charge spent up to a staggering 8 seconds. Cut it too safe, and you cannot catch up even with optimal add-ons. Problematically, that "sweet spot" is hard to identify, as objects' collision box can sometimes far exceed what they appear to be.
this is not design problem. this is actual skill-cap. I know a lot of people like to say that billy is hardest killer in the game but compare bubba curving to billy. bubba in my opinion has way deeper skill-ceiling in curving because you need optimize curving to do well with bubba. with billy, you just need get the curve but once you get the curve. that's kinda it for billy. you make a guess to go inwards or outwards and the gameplay ends there. bubba is all about time optimization. this is why he has one of worst kill-rates in the game at top 5% mmr because using his ability is like nurse-level hard. bubba can also use his chainsaw to counter hold-w but that goes even deeper into his chainsaw play.
so I disagree with this post. his only issue in my opinion is add-on dependency. you really depend on yellow chili or purple chili to play bubba. his 2nd add-on is usually iri flesh or beast marks or primor blub. so if there is any buff, the buff would be making purple chili base-kit and changing those add-on to do something else. i would not call it an issue because newer players might complain about bubba if it was base-kit due to the unlimited instant down potencial of the killer kinda like old billy. it might be too oppressive. at the same time, his skill-ceiling is somewhat high that novice bubba player might not be good enough to optimize his chainsaw such that he hits the survivor at every opportune moment. so it might balance out but it could also be very oppressive similar to old instant saw billy.
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@Blueberry said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3494793#Comment_3494793
I actually tend to see most people play Pig wrong which is where I believe feeling like the traps are just passive power/kills comes from. I actually think Pig has a higher skill cap than most people do since I feel she has a strong macro gameplay when done correctly. Essentially you’re trying to chase while juggling gens and pressuring them off boxes to buy yourself head pop time. This is why I stack addons to increase search time. Not only do the boxes take longer which is more time but it gives me more time to interrupt and reset the entire search.
I don’t typically run info perks on her so it’s a lot of game knowledge and understanding where each survivor is probably at or heading and reading their thought process.
I actually end up getting a significant amount of head pops this way and a lot of hooks from survivors that start panicking on the trap timer and make bad plays. Lots of players also don’t expect the addons and pressure when estimating how much time they need when freezing gens first before traps, catches them off guard.
Pigs real power is the traps forcing temporary early 1v3s and 1v2s by temporary getting people off the gens and giving you time to pressure and chase.
I do however think Sadakos condemn seems a little better than it actually will be atm because people are used to just pumping gens and ignoring her tapes. IE they are respecting the condemn and it can quickly spiral. As long as they actively focus on keep their condemn down from the start it’s usually not an issue, most just don’t. Survivors don’t like having to adapt and change. I’ve personally had no issues with it on survivor in solo queue.
Pigs real power is the traps forcing temporary early 1v3s and 1v2s by temporary getting people off the gens and giving you time to pressure and chase.
that is correct. her real power is slowdown incapacitation of reverse bear traps.
I actually end up getting a significant amount of head pops this way and a lot of hooks from survivors that start panicking on the trap timer and make bad plays
sure. that is typical bad plays from teammates poping gens at bad times. it is because people disrespect her reverse bear traps so they get their teammate killed with the mori.
I do however think Sadakos condemn seems a little better than it actually will be atm because people are used to just pumping gens and ignoring her tapes. IE they are respecting the condemn and it can quickly spiral. As long as they actively focus on keep their condemn down from the start it’s usually not an issue, most just don’t.
it is early days. you need time to adapt so that the player learns how to play against the power.
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my point is that ambush dash and stealth is lack luster to not make jigsaw searches too strong. at the same time, many people rate pig as D-tier bottom tier killer, so perhaps there is misconception and different desire for what they want the killer to be good at. I would say sadako fills a niche for player that like the idea of building-up a mori. perhaps people have that similar expectation for pig but the killer fails to meet their expectation so they just rate her as plain terrible. I am not saying she is good or anything where she just defeats everyone but she is not that bad. my thought are that player expectation is mismatch with the killer and maybe that should be improved.
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@Blueberry said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3494773#Comment_3494773
I've changed my mind on the Sadako changes some since my last posts about it. I actually do think her Condemn is significantly better now, maybe too good. That said, they have her in such a sorry state to where she's utter trash in every other aspect that makes a good killer good. So it's basically like the only thing she has going for her. If they were to tone it down she would need significant changes in other areas again to compensate.
As far as Pig is concerned she is just too simple to add much complexity without doing lots of fundamental changes to her entirely. Of which I don't think they'd do. Pigs actually my highest win rate killer too ironically for how bad she is. I typically play average-bad killers though, not much of the top tiers. Pigs main issues are her crouch and ambush being pretty trash. I'm actually happy where her traps are.
I'm actually happy where her traps are.
the problem is that i think a lot of player dislike how pig-trap mori you. many player will often state that being mori's by a trap feels cheap. kinda how you got bad luck on reverse bear trap requiring 4 searches and other cheese strategies such as moon-walking survivors with a trap.
I just question whether that is fun for the survivor and how that could be improved. At the same time, some pig player have always stated that pig lacks control over the mori and it just feels like a super-powerful passive. the only way you can activately use pig's power at base-kit is for tunneling. For example, you reverse bear trap a survivor, they get hooked, you take another chase. as you chase, the survivor goes to pig boxes to remove their reverse trap then you show up in crouch form stealth and down them. it is like indirect form of tunneling similar to pyramid head's cage mechanic which is very very direct form of tunnelimg.
Pigs main issues are her crouch and ambush being pretty trash.
I think reason why her crouch and ambush is trash is because her reverse bear traps are powerful tunneling tools. that is why she moves slow in crouch because the ability to chain-hook a survivor without a chase is kinda like indirect mori's. that last sentence is good summary of the pig. a killer with indirect mori's. her chase is also weak because when pig gets reverse bear trap on you, you are playing at massive disadvantage. stronger anti-loop means that pig can confirm her reverse bear traps while a weak chase means that a skilled survivor can loop her for 5 gens, therefore deny her ability to use reverse bear traps.
the bad ambush also mitigates her perk variety so you do not just stack 4 gen slowdowns on top 4 reverse bear traps. it incentives you to use chase perks.
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That said, they have her in such a sorry state to where she's utter trash in every other aspect that makes a good killer good. So it's basically like the only thing she has going for her. If they were to tone it down she would need significant changes in other areas again to compensate.
I think that is just part of the balance. when you have more stable foundation for a killer, you can do something called power-shifting. power-shifting is when you weaken 1 aspect of a character in video game but you re-balance another aspect of the character such that character is more rounded. now you have to question? is it good for a character to be well-rounded. Sometimes a character that is less well-rounded is perceived more fair when it is less rounded. so not all character benefit from being well-rounded. sometime being less rounded is good. of course this is completely subjective opinion. Just think about like league of legend glass-cannon assassins vs the bruiser with well-rounded stats. one person might say that 1 shotting is imbalanced and the well-rounded character is better while one may argue that being well-rounded means you have no weaknesses therefore your too good at everything.
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@Blueberry said:
As far as the condemned is concerned it actually feels more skillful to me.
indeed. you know, this rework makes me feel like pig boxes should play closer to sadako. i wonder how this could be achieved for pig. I guess we would need to think outside box for pig to feel this good. maybe pig could play like mori-based doctor with skill-checks. Just something that flew past my mind.
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@Maelstrom808 said:
It's a tough one to balance. I think my initial approach would be:
- A single stack upon being hit while holding a tape.
- Tapes aren't destroyed on hit, but are destroyed on being downed. This with the above encourages committed chases, but destroying the tape on down still blocks the whole thing where they just keep picking you up and downing you with a tape to max your condemn like it was on PTB.
- If you hook within 30 seconds of downing the survivor that was downed with a tape, all other survivors gain a stack. Hopefully this will encourage hooking instead of slugging.
- Possibly reduce teleport stacks from .75 to .5
- You can take a tape from any TV whether it is on or off. If it is on, it will turn off.
- You can insert a tape into any TV whether it is on or off, but inserting it into a TV that is off, will turn it back on. This and the previous addresses the issue where Survivors can have an almost impossible time grabbing and returning tapes to cleanse Corruption, but it can also give Sadako more teleports in addition to possibly giving the survivors position away if the killer is paying attention.
- Revert Reiko's Watch nerf (because thar was dumb)
- Lose her **** lullaby
That's my initial take on it. I played all day yesterday, and the only matches I lost were the ones where I had the survivors all on death hook with 4-5 gens to go and decided to let them all go because it was already over and every other game was a second 3-4ks and I try not to let my MMR get too out of hand.
Sadako was the killer that got me playing DBD, and I've never felt like playing for Condemned Survivors was her main goal. It was always to be a slowdown - "waste some time on this or else". I'd like it to remain so, but be smoother to employ than before. Her chase is pretty bad so imo, the goal should be to keep survivors out of chase occupied and off of gens so she has the time she needs to get downs.
* high mobility
* heavy slowdown mechanic that is very punishing if ignored
* weak chase potential
- Tapes aren't destroyed on hit, but are destroyed on being downed.
that used to be the case in the PTB. she was too weak. your enforcing an m1 killer to pursue and down survivors in game where loops are not favourable for killer. she is not designed to be a chasing monster. you would have to buff her chase for that to work. she is fine where she is at unless the goal is to make her an S-tier killer.
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3494663#Comment_3494663
The way her current power works, you just hit people carrying a Video Tape and instantly move on. You dont down them unless necessary.
My issue with this is since there is no reason to hook Survivors, and hardly a reason to even down a Survivor, the Sadako is not progressing the game via hooks, it is disadvantageous to do so.
I also think the current Sadako is just far too punishing for Survivors, and again, a single mistake can lose the match for the entire team. With SoloQ (and the lack of information that comes from it), I think is can be nearly impossible win against Sadako.
As I mentioned before, my main concern is now how strong/weak Sadako exactly is, but moreso that I am concerned that Sadako WILL get nerfed because her Killrates are just far too high at the moment.
I also think the current Sadako is just far too punishing for Survivors, and again, a single mistake can lose the match for the entire team. With SoloQ (and the lack of information that comes from it), I think is can be nearly impossible win against Sadako.
that is exactly the point of the condemn ability. the whole point of mori's is to kill people faster then normal hooking/camping/slugging. your suppose to be punished for your poor position and poor looping plays. you get less chances to make mistakes. that is why her chase potencial+stealth potencial has to remain weak because strong chase with stealth + mori can be too strong.
I think is can be nearly impossible win against Sadako.
I highly doubt that.
Sadako WILL get nerfed because her Killrates are just far too high at the moment.
too high because your opponent plays poorly and makes too many mistakes? killer should only become weaker if they are too strong when the survivor plays nearly perfectly/well enough and still loses. not because the killer plays well and survivor plays poorly. your suppose to be rewarded as killer if you play better then your opponent. that's the problem that a lot of people have with weak killers, you know the killer between B-C-D tiers. the killer could be better player but survivor can win even when they make a lot of misplays so people dislike playing those weaker killers and only play good killer, aka Wesker, you know, where your skill matters as killer.
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I think the issue with Sadako entirely relies on Video Tapes giving 2 stacks of Condemned upon being hit. Nothing exactly is encouraging the Sadako to progress the game via hooking a Survivor. The previous version of Sadako (from the PTB) gain 1 stack of Condemned upon being Injured and 1 stack of Condemned upon being hooked.
your not really suppose to be hooking survivors or downing survivors. your suppose to be building condemn to instant-mori survivors. this was still case before changes. it is just that her base-kit condemn build up was ineffective that you needed to use ring drawing slugging to get any meaningful condemn build-up as TV were random at best. she was not slugging because she wanted to bleed you out or anything. she was just playing into her condemn build-up mechanic. now she is no longer reliant on that type of condemn build-up that people considered "unfun" but identity of building condemn to mori people remains the same. condemn is just slightly modified for survivors enjoyment.
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i don't rate devour. I also think that people that do not use haunted ground with devour are using devour hope wrong. undying/devour is not that great. devour hope is racing perk. you want to race hooks as fast as possible. I have played games with haunted devour hope where I would win in like 2 minutes with haunted devour hope. there have been games where i spawn into the map, the survivor is cleansing totem, haunted ground pops and i down 3 survivors. within like 2 minutes, I am already on like 3 stack devour and I easily win the game with 5 stack devour in record time. its too much of win-more perk where your just rolling dices on survivor generator efficiency and totem spawns. I just consider it more of newbie-stomp type perk. If your opponent is really bad at gens efficiency and totems are not atrocious then devour hope will do something but in my experience, half of the games where devour hope does something are games that you would won with other more consistent perks.
Killer do use devour hope more now but that is because most of killer perks are like... chronically underwhelming so much so that gambling for killer is superior then 90% of killer perks in term of ability to win better survivor players.
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@DaddyMyers_Mori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3494495#Comment_3494495
It depended on map and killer, but it was possible for sure.
Ignoring oblivious status effect is way easier than ignoring old ruin tho.
Current ruin wastes more time if you search for it than actual regression, it's kinda pathetic. It's somewhat viable only on Skully and Plague imo.
i'd say ruin is only good on legion with fuming tape for 200% regression. maybe knight if you use ruin+survellance to summon guards at gens, I honestly do not think ruin is that bad perk of a perk because you can stack it with jolt/pain res for decent gen delay but it is ultimately hex perk with low reward. that is to say that your better off using another perk with higher reward. this can be said for virtually all hex perks except plaything/penti & noed. those two hex perk are legit and consistent perks that I do run on some killers. the rest I would consider gimmicks or newbie stomp perks.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3494504#Comment_3494504
I'm pretty confident that they have mandated limitations to what they can just decide to do in terms of not just art, but functional portrayal. The devs most likely has a fairly generous runway to be creative, but not a complete free pass.
na you can do anything. only thing is that most licensed eventually require a renewal so you want to avoid bad rep.
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end game movement speed is no one escapes death. I think I would transfer the gameafoot passive that switch obsession to this perk and remove obesssion stimulation of gameafoot. it would make both perks way better.
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@Blueberry said:
Most of us are hoping for buffs actually.
If people play badly it will make her look better than she is.
i doubt buffs. at least we won't get content creators saying that she is worst killer in the game. hopefully she just stays the same.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3494460#Comment_3494460
https://youtu.be/e7u6v3pc5Dc?t=210
A section of this video goes into just some of the issues with the Freddy license. It should already be queued up to the right timestamp, but Freddy's part starts a 3:30.
I can't find the specific posts where the devs have talked about how they generally get to work with licensed content as the search function for the forums isn't great, but @GoodBoyKaru seems to understand the general mechanics at work in regards to contracts as I know they've answered similar questions in the past.
yes that video is about art work. when you buy a license, your buying the rights to artwork for profit reasons. there is nothing in that in regards to dbd killer gameplay. this is like talking about whether you want to buy original Mona Lisa or copyrighted version of it. The original art of anything is always more expensive then any non-original art. you can make freddy fly in dbd but that would be silly interpretation of freddy. art /= dbd gameplay. art and dbd gameplay are two different things. this should be basic understanding.
in conclusion, freddy is bad because community and devs. not because of license holders.
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@DaddyMyers_Mori said:
Yeah, Pentimento + Plaything is nowhere near close Ruin Undying. You can ignore it.
Nothing in the game currently on killer side is even close to Ruin Undying or even Ruin Pop.
you could ignore ruin undying. you just needed generator efficiency and solid looping. Most of the games during that time, I would escape them with ruin being up the entire game where I was using prove thyself. this was back when nobody was using prove thyself and then it eventually became meta which is amusing. best counter to hex totem is just doing gens fast before totems affect gameplay in my opinion.
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i doubt it. Myer's has instant-kill mori's and his kill-rate is nominal. the thing is that myer's add-on are not base-kit so what keeps him nominal might be that not every myer's use instant kills but Sadako's mori is base-kit and is part of her entire identity.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3493634#Comment_3493634
They don't need consent for minor changes, but any major change that would affect the presentation of killer the definitely do need consent. It's the reason why he doesn't have any cosmetics and reworking his power would classify as a major change. The devs can't just do whatever they want with licensed characters in terms of powers as should they do something that could be considered as negatively representing the license or damaging to the brand not only do you risk getting the licensed pulled entirely you could end up getting sued. Even if you don't get sued you're definitely going to have a lot of doors closed to you since movie studios and horror film makers are fairly close knit groups.
They can give him buffs, nerfs, and addon passes which are things he definitely needs in the short term. Like a total rework though seems unlikely unfortunately.
They don't need consent for minor changes, but any major change that would affect the presentation of killer the definitely do need consent.
i doubt that. I think when you buy art assets, you are open to creating your vision/version of the interpretation of the character. you do not need consent. dbd licenses its own gameplay. you can even rework demogorgon. there would be no point though because nobody can buy it. You need license to sell the artwork. that is what copyright is. selling someone else work as your own for profit. I suppose it is little bit more complicated then that so you have to read law but that is the basic idea.
going back to freddy topic, I think they just have not found an engaging gameplay loop for the killer player to play freddy and engaging loop to play as survivor. a summary of current freddy is that the character is boring. he is not interesting to play and he is not interesting to vs. A lot of licensed killer generally have unique gameplay. Freddy just missed the mark a bit. I think that is why people miss his old version because his old version was more unique. A killer that moves normal speed with unlimited wall-hacks? wow no killer has that. freddy was cooler to play against as survivor and more interesting to play then current version of just teleport to gens.
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@Crowman said:
It's because her non-condemn focus build is much weaker and her condemn focus build is much stronger. She also still has the issue where her threat is largely tied to an Iri Addon. The difference in survivors being able to pick up a tape and place it in any tv vs having to run across the map to place it is huge.
Didn't really solve the issues, just changed them around.
non-condemn build is still stronger because her base-kit for condemn has been improved compared to old base-kit. the people complaining about sadako have not learned how to properly counter her. I think iri add-on dependency is mostly vs top 0.1% survivors.
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@SirCracken said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3493615#Comment_3493615
Your entire comment is complete nonsense that I'm not going to engage with since you've ignored all of my points.
How about you show some gameplay, even a clip running at 30 FPS with a watermark will do, and you can tell me exactly what is happening in the game that is so "nuanced".
what points. you have no points.
Spam teleports until someone picks up a tape.
Intercept and hit them before they can dispose of their tape thanks to Mother's Comb revealing where they are. And Iridescent Video Tape forcing them to run to the furthest TV.
Go back to teleporting until that survivor is fully condemned. Then kill them.
If your referring to these points. these points are a joke. When everyone holds tape, spamming teleport is 0 condemn. Sadako is m1 killer with weak chase. you can loop sadako like any conventional m1 killer. The longer survivor loops without getting hit. the more time your team has to do generators. The 4th point I do not understand what you mean by teleporting until survivor is condemned. the survivor will take another tape and continue to stay immune to teleport's.
There is no nuance.
You want to have a tape at all times because it's the only way to stop yourself from being condemned. Sadako cannot be everywhere at once. So the threat of being condemned if she hits you is significantly less than the getting condemned every 10 seconds no matter where you are.
Your last point is this non-sense which is that there is no nuance to the gameplay. I said the nuance of the gameplay is managing risks of holding a tape. when you have no stacks as survivor, you only have to worry about not getting hit with the tape because your not in danger of dying. When you have stacks, you take tapes and deposit them in televisions without sadako intercepting you. you do that through stealth.
I did not bother address any of your post because it made little sense.
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@Phyrqc said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3493285#Comment_3493285
That is not an "M1 killer"problem. All special attacks are affected all the same besides Wesker's.
what are you talking about? If I am playing plague and I have corrupt purge when I down someone. someone using FTP+Buckle up in front of me is just going get hit by corrupt purge. proc endurance and then immediately die 10 seconds later. I don't care as m2 killer about that combo. this could be said for a lot of killers.
this is combo that affects weak killers that have weak m1 chase like freddy, trapper etc.
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I already know when my opponent is running faster. a big skill in killer is knowing how much distance you cover in x time and how long it takes for you to reach the survivor. this post sounds like a skill issue.
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@ReikoMori said:
There are a lot of reasons why he's so bad, but most can be boiled down to the license holder seems uninterested in signing off anymore major updates to him.
His lack of voicelines is partly due to coming to game back when no one had voice lines and partly due to the specific Fredboi we got being the one from the cruddy remake rather than original 80's films.
Freddy's had a bad time in terms of power design since day one. His original power was more inline with what you would expect from Fredboi, but it existed in this weird place where it was extremely weak, but extremely strong in one particular way. His original power was to pull survivors into the Dream World and survivors in the dream world were subjected to all these passive effects that just made doing anything take a long time. Combined with the perks of the time Fredboi could draw games out for very very long periods. On the other side of the coin though he was designed to be faithful to his status as dream demon and could not interact with any survivor who wasn't asleep. He effectively didn't exist for survivors who were awake to the point he couldn't attack them and they could literal walk through him. So effectively his power was hit you with a laser pointer to make you go to sleep so he could then play a normal game of dbd or a Forever Fredboi game of dbd.
His current power is a rework of his old one in that he can now just play normally, but when survivors go to sleep they have to deal with either his dream snares or his dream pallets should you use the addon that gives you the pallets. He's objectively better than he was before if you're just talking about stats and players' ability to understand how to play with and against him, but he's still not anywhere near being good and is quite bland. Another rework would be needed, but changing powers on licensed characters requires the devs to run the changes by the rights holders for consent most likely.
Another rework would be needed, but changing powers on licensed characters requires the devs to run the changes by the rights holders for consent most likely.
i do not think they need any consent to change a character. a license is what you pay for in terms of art assets. art asset are badham preschool look, the freddy model. the hat, the freddy face, the stripped jersey.
Freddy kinda weak because they have not found a good fibe for his character. in his old iteration, he was more about being dream demon that puts people to sleep and then he plays the role of a nightmare that just appears out of nowhere. they were going for like stealth m1 killer type that can read your mind with wall-hacks. to get out of the dream, you had to fail skill-checks which provided 4vs1 game delay and his dream world had huge action speed decreases. in reboot version, they removed his game delay, stealth and wall-hacks and replace it with dream snares and fake pallets. the game-delay was put into his add-on but many players dislike his game delay and his dream snares so they just nuked his kit into oblivion. Now he has no identity. Clown pink bottle is more versatile version of his snares and many other killer exceed his chasing capacities. his generator teleport is worse then other killer with mobility options. he becomes weaker as trial progresses since there are less generators to teleport as they are completed by the survivor. His dream world has no passive effect and functionally does nothing other than hinder his ability to use snares/pallets. All his add-on functionally are very bad. According to Reddit Q&A, he is on the list for changes.
he needs another rework.
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@SirCracken said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3493582#Comment_3493582
There is no nuance.
You want to have a tape at all times because it's the only way to stop yourself from being condemned. Sadako cannot be everywhere at once. So the threat of being condemned if she hits you is significantly less than the getting condemned every 10 seconds no matter where you are.
There's nothing interesting to learn here. It's a binary choice that you either know to make, or you don't.
taking tape is not nuance but learning to manage risk of the tape is nuance. survivors want to avoid getting hit by the m1 when holding a tape. there is looping nuance to the kit. when survivors pick-up tapes and they want to get rid of the condemn stacks. they need to play stealthy to avoid detection to sneakily put tapes into the TV. In old version of sadako, survivor's condemn stacks would increase as they held tapes. this means that the longer you take to hold-tape, the more you were punished. once 7 stacks occurs, the killer receives killer instinct notification of your location. this punished you for stealth. now you are rewarded for careful and meticulous gameplay when removing condemn using the tapes. there is a lot of nuance for survivor to play vs ability just as much as there is for the killer to optimize the ability to mori survivors.
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@SirCracken said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3493574#Comment_3493574
The solution for Onryo being stronger on certain maps isn't to remove all nuance from her power. That just makes her less interesting to play on every map rather than a select few.
there is still nuance. it is different nuance. condemn kills are easy because survivor have not adapted to the changes. it always takes longer for survivor to adapt playing against the killer then it takes killer to optimize a strategy. the killer is always playing one killer. the survivor has to play against 32 possible killers. learning to play against 32 killers takes a lot longer then learning one killer.
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@SirCracken said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3493491#Comment_3493491
There's nothing fair or earned about mindless hitting the teleport button every 10 seconds.
Before you had to actually decide which TV has worth teleporting to since survivors would only get condemned within 16 meters of the teleport. Now that it's map-wide there's no reason not to teleport as often as possible.
How could you possibly argue against this change? It ruins the skill expression of the character.
yes this had big problem which was that maps that were small and had double floor such as Gideon's meat packing plant were way stronger for her while big maps were struggle.
Map dependency for a killer is not good. the changes addresses that. She is less map dependant as a result of the changes.
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@VaporLion said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3493063#Comment_3493063
yea but thats a good thing because it allows for counterplay.
why would ever use this perk that has counter-play instead of 99% Sprint burst which is more reliable and works in chases? counter-play is facing a wall or downing nearby survivors. There is also Lightborn for immunity to blinds.
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@Dream_Whisper said:
It is the same problem, as Autodidact; in which you are trying to heal a teammate and farm skillchecks with slow healing. But, your 2nd teammate, the Claudette of the team, brings a purple medkit and a healing focus build and literally heal your teammates in less then 8 seconds and you get no skill checks at all... there needs to be more map wide perk notification to let your teammates know know that a specific perk is in play. Similar to how Prove Thyself or any team oriented perks, I think Autodidact and few other perks should inform your teammates that you are using it, especially in solo queue where you cannot tell your teammates on what you are using.
claudette carrying the team.
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@mikewelk said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/E02VIDOD05CQ/zrzut-ekranu-2023-07-25-213228.png
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3493491#Comment_3493491
Yes lots of counter-play. I cannot counter Onryos that teleport to every available TV in a small map. I got fully condemned with zero hook states as I ran around trying to find any TV that wasn't disabled.
oh boy. Is this buffed wraith 2.0? new players dying at 5 gens.... so therefore wraith over-performing. /shrug.
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@ScytheIX said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3493483#Comment_3493483
It's a strategy, yes. But if the TV get's turned off constantly whenever it respawns, there is 0 counterplay to it. That's what I'm getting at.
You can get rid of Demo's portals. You can disable Hag's traps. If Sadako tps on cooldown, you can't pull out the tape.
It's like playing favorites. And I'm not a fan of that. If you want to defend it, fine by me. I still see it as the wrong way to go about.
you can rid of tv's by turning them off. your teammate should turn it off before unhooking you. proxy camping is legit strategy.
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@SirCracken said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3493470#Comment_3493470
I couldn't agree more. What were they thinking?
I disagree. the survivor has fair counter-play in looping the killer. Sadako's mori feel more earned now because they're more about capitalizing on survivors positioning errors and looping.
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@ScytheIX said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3493449#Comment_3493449
How do you take the tape when you are on the hook, and she keeps teleporting to it on cooldown?
that is strategy. some people use killer to teleport back to the hook such as demogorgon territorial imperative+make your choice or Hag Mint rag.
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@Blueberry said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3493184#Comment_3493184
Yup that's the problem.
currently i am winning with sadako quicker then previous sadako but this could also because my opponents are not playing well.