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@Rickprado said:
I've been claiming for this since they added the HUD for survivor. I'm not sure if i remember correctly but one dev once said in a livestream that Kindred was quite confusing for new players and would break immersion (not their words, just what i remember). But haven't the game already broke all the immersion with the most recent changes? I don't see DBD as an horror game as soon as you reach 200 hours of gameplay.
Helping SoloQ with info (basekit Kindred, Better Together, bond) would be very nice and wouldn't affect much the balance of the game.
I mean frankly Aura's are immersion breaking because they're not well stylized with the rest of the game. Contrast it with Hook bubble.
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I don't even think they liked their own proposals either. Compare these to the grandeur with the end-game collapse and it feels way too artificial, disconnected.
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Well it was part of the deterrent for not tunneling, so presumably it was also axed.
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Been playing SWF recently.
For us turns out with unhooks the most pertinent info is: "Who's the nearest and not in chase"
We don't really call out the need for heals, as we typically stumble across one another while doing gens (or are using Dead Hard), and usually end up healing the bloke away from hook afterwards.
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Bit surprised they scrapped the anti-slug. Not how I'd have liked to implement it (EG: require the survivor to recover to 95% then crawl to and under a hook to pick themselves with a somewhat lengthy process, added time to crawl to a hook, and provides a mindgame between the two as to where the survivor may be that adds some risk), but it at least didn't seem too intrusive.
I agree with the scrap of the anti-tunnel effect. Doesn't do much against mobility Killers who can leverage speed to catchup and ignore anti-camp given the unhooked survivor it at a specified point after unhook. Having vision on the hooked survivor is enough to give you a vector to follow, as is the absence of that information and prediction of pathing.
But I think the Elusive status has a place to be fleshed out and used in Perks or moving forward.
Only thing I can think of that may still be slightly problematic is the anti-camp ramp up being multiplicative with the distance ramp up, may be a bit annoying for trap setup characters, especially on multi-floor buildings (or EG: Trapper trapping shack), but reverting the distance at least makes sense. Again, not how I'd like anti-camp to be implemented (EG: require the survivors to put in effort to relocate the unhooked survivor somehow when the unhook occurs, suppressing both survivors information from the killer for a duration afterwards, with this process being less efficient than going for a normal safe unhook)
And while I do think that the anti-tunnel reward for killers in the 9.2 iteration was cookie cutter, they could reintroduce it with selective bonuses rather than giving the killer everything at once, make it a choice for them to make based on killer and game-state.
All in all though what I don't like about the current anti-camp/anti-tunnel/anti-slug is that it's all player vs system. The survivors are doing nothing gameplay related for these effect, just sitting and waiting while stewing about this happening.
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Though... Speaking of a ubiquitous skillcheck cue icon located inside the interacted object like with the Heartbeat, a dim orangish auric cell looking brief pulse could seem thematic in the sense there's some entity involvement, at least tying in thematically. The Entity's "heartbeat" in a sense, throwing a bit of randomness into the trials.
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@Raptorrotas said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4029440#Comment_4029440
Ohh i thought you ment in the UI.
Well something visible ingame would be cool and might force survs to choose between focusing on the gen or watching out for the killer.
Cool idea.
I tend to want things to be as in-world as possible. (I love Dead Spaces UI)
Taken apart (and better described) this is what I'm suggesting:
- triggers the same time as the audio cue for the skillcheck
- emits a larger spark than the ambient sparks while repairing (smaller than an explosion)
- character's repairing animation "freezes"/stutters, as though noticing something and pausing (this also aids in visual identification)
I get that this is likely low priority given the audio cue is ubiquitous, and this is specialized to generators specifically, but it would add to immersion. (though in terms of overall usefulness, an icon indicator on the interacted object that's independent would be the easiest and quickest option to implement, so kinda pissin' in the wind with this suggestion…)
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@Raptorrotas said:
If its similiar to the visual heartbeat? Maybe
Still will not make people stop comlaining when they let go as a skillcheck started.
But there cant be a longer delay between the warning and the actual skillcheck lest the skillcheck will be easily skippable.
While placing a generic icon on the generator would be more sterile to digest, I'd prefer an effect more attached to the generator. EG: Where the ambient sparks already occur, have a larger spark and illumination indicate an upcoming skillcheck. This still tells the respective survivor they have a skillcheck coming, but is a bit more ambiguous when viewed from the corner of your eye. Or this spark could be shown only to the survivor receiving the skillcheck (much like I'd imagine a generator icon would be).
It should sync up with the audio skill-check (including any reductions in the delay EG: Huntress Lullaby).
(The hose side would spark at the hose connection to the green canister only from the skillcheck (doesn't make total sense but that plays into the entity not having complete knowledge of things).
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@scaredbubbles said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4027085#Comment_4027085
Why would I? when there are many unresolved bug reports about it? Just shows how incompetent BHVR is. It's been reported since May 2025, UNDER REVIEW. Patch 8.6.0. And there's NOT EVEN ONE FOLLOW UP ABOUT IT.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/VT6YTCOGEZ7H/image.png
Look top of the site, read it. Here's a screenshot, because you're blind.
Right, though you can add to those threads, with your own data point of experiencing the bug, possibly adding additional content for review (or agreement on said content), which bumps the thread, sends it to the top of the recent posts (the likely filter which the PR team peruses), collating related discourse into a consolidated thread, under which a response from any support will be more pertinent than responding to a thread only mentioning the bug by reference.
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Only ever played two matches against ghoul, both times hated how it locks the survivor in place while he leashes into you. (and it's not like there's any visual indication as to why your survivor is locked in place, just seems like you had packet loss and stopped moving)
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Eh. Whenever I've played survivor and had Killers that goof off from the start I've always just wanted to genrush. The game isn't usually that interesting then. I'd have preferred to be trounced and then goofed around with, so as to at the very least have some interactions with loops/hooks/healing/etc.
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Sweaty casual?
I'll play hardball until I'm in a position of control (and/or I figure I'm against greenhorn survivor(s)), then I usually goof around and let folks escape (and of course using piggies undetectable to setup jumpscares). My MMR is screwy, because of it. I've been bringing Rancor and in conjunction occasionally 2K or more with Headpops (since greenhorns will occasionally not know how to take them off), which keeps the MMR up a bit.
Not a whole lot of chases in those games though, but I'll swap to other Killers for that. Though I typically always go for 8-hooks first when possible, regardless of Killer.
I've been jaded from cuteness. As Pig I too often get boops, and it feels less sporadic, and more the survivors demand it.
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@Blueberry said:
Survivor is moved across the map and away from killer on unhook.
That easy. Now there's none of this complicated nonsense with Endurance, Elusive, and aura reading being abusable to be aggressive. It's just made unnecessary as a feature. You're put away from the killer and he has no idea where you're at. Another assym I play has this feature and it works pretty well.
I play Pyramid Head: I can leverage the farthest distance placement to my advantage, especially using gens to get a rough layout of map dimensions.
Edit: If they're also against a map wall, that also limits the routes of access for rescue.
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Killer doesn't know where the unhooked survivor will be.
(this still allows tunneling, but it prevents the Killer from being the one in primary control of the situation)
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@scaredbubbles said:
Bumping this because DEV WONT SAY POOP ABOUT THIS 'SHADOW NERF'
Have you submitted a Bug report?
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@tuttoinunavolta said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4023269#Comment_4023269
I mean, even if we don't take Chucky's couch into account, there are way too many recently added characters that clash with this theory.
Vecna has a whole detailed lobby animation in which he pulls out his book and skims through its pages, despite the book never even appearing in his matches. Considering the reverse bear traps are an integral part of Pig's kit in-game, it'd be a weird decision to take that out and keep the book. Same could be said for many survivors (Sable's mug, Jonah's tablet and so on), and killers that do stuff in the lobby that's not possible in the game (Xeno crawling down from the ceiling, Snug holding onto severed hands, Pinhead doing that angry sudden attack with multiple chains at once coming from behind him etc.)
The update that had Pig suddenly get Freddy's main menu stance also gave Leatherface and Hillbilly the straight back posture that Trapper has in the pre-game lobby, the one where the killer stares at the survivors. These ones were bugs that were eventually fixed, and I find it hard to believe the Pig Krueger main menu thing was a deliberate change that casually happened at the same time. I also agree with you about the open hand thing; right now she looks like she's still holding onto something, with her hand being slightly closed but not fully like that.
Unless they come out and explain why they changed this, to me this definitely feels like these are two bugs they can't fix atm for a reason or another (low priority, or the fix would cause other bugs maybe), so they're passing it as a deliberate change.
Mmm… all of those mentioned idle animations eventually do have the character putting the object away again.
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But in general, now that Pig can hit 4.4m/s with combat strap in crouch, probs should initiate chase.
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In PvP, if the only goal is to win, then there will always be someone(s) whose fun gets ruined when the other team wins, since they didn't win.
MMR tries to average this out so that skilled players don't hog this by grouping them together, to provide greater retention over a larger average of players.
Your argument surmounts to: the 1% are upset they experience what the 99% experience.
As killer you can also intentionally curtail your kills in matches to lower your MMR to play thematic builds, or to focus on things like jump scares and positional trickery that you can't typically do in optimized environments. My go-to is Pig/Drac and Devour/Rancor/Nemesis/Spies and faffing about getting 8 hooks till EGC (and usually taking my tithe).
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Probably given she has old "Undetectable" (likely ripped from Wraith's cloaked form) where chase cannot be started while "being sneaky". I suspect both Wraith and Pig still have their underlying old "undetectable" code with the new undetectable slapped ontop.
But yeah, as others have said, just repeatedly try to get the trap off, force the pigs hand.
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If needed they could tweak the base-time by a couple of seconds or so, but ruleset No.2 being base-kit, probably not.
It creates a disconnect for survivor player actions when trying to understand the power: The Jigsaw boxes are not highlighted, insinuating you cannot use them until they become highlighted (EG: cannot use them until they are activated, like the trap), which is not the case.
And further muddies balancing as you said: by increasing the power of other addons passively, not flatly increasing her base power.
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You assume the first survivor stays alive for 90s.
You also assume that the Killer isn't running any information perks that lets them target the initially spawning clump of survivors, engaging in chase while they're still all together.
You also make the mistake of committing to a chase early. Don't do that if it looks like it's going to be a long one, if you injure a survivor and another healthy survivor can be hit easily: go hit that healthy survivor and have the other survivor stay injured or spend time healing.
If it seems like a chased survivor is running to a safe point that will take a while to chase through, disengage and try to hop onto another survivor that's sticking to a gen, likely reducing their chase distance as you close on that generator they're committing to.
You do have to commit at times, as ping-ponging too much -especially when not getting a hit in, will drag you down, but don't lock in immediately on a single survivor unless you're a chase oriented killer.
You may have info perks, either triggered in some form from that first chase or based on gen states, giving you better clarity on what direction and whom to target on disengage.
Generally speaking though, I don't think most players are good at this.
And as SoGo mentions, why most players enjoy perks that amplify straightforward chasing.
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@tuttoinunavolta said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4023172#Comment_4023172
I mean, I would understand if that was the reason, but if that's the case they should remove Chucky's couch completely. Same thing for Sadako's well
Mmm, though the needed suspension of disbelief to think that 3rd person view Chucky is actively running around while sitting in a chair is a bit higher than thinking 1st person Pig is holding an RBT trap out of sight.
I do agree that Sadako no having a well does hurt a bit (hey, could be interesting if one TV in the match was the well, and she spawns out of it at the start, maybe play around with the well being some kind of important teleport point: EG: one that can't be turned off, gives amplifiers), though she does remain outside of it, giving some bridge to spawning without it.
@Nun_So_Vile said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4023172#Comment_4023172
I do not believe this is the reason. If so, then why not come out and say this directly rather than no news or new updates for over a year? As OP brought up too, if this was the case then why not remove Chucky's chair and Sadako's lobby animations as well? Pig is not the only one in this regard. This whole situation reeks.
Dunno, could entirely be that you're correct and it's a bug, and they want to ignore its low priority by hand-waiving it away: you'd think if the change was intentional they'd open her hand like it is in her in-game idle-state, since as it is, such a stance is only ever shown in the lobby menu, sloppy.
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@OrangeBear said:
I think it's an interesting idea but it's difficult because the nature of the game is that both sides become weaker the more the other has progressed their objective. So the benefits would either be kinda useless or limited to a point where it's not interesting.
Maybe they could make something like it work as an edition of chaos shuffle potentiallyWell, survivor is interesting in that depending on how they complete their generators, they've either made their progress harder or easier to complete: see getting gen****** - Killer: all gens are the farthest they can be from one another. Survivor: They're all as close as they can be to one another.
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I wouldn't call dynamic game balancing a modern design, but I'm not entirely against the idea.
However, I would separate these bonuses into their own category, able to be useless (and/or amplified) if used in conjunction with the Perkslot effect, you can bring the perk to ensure activation regardless of game-state, but there's greater opportunity cost in doing so, possibly might get people to slot meta perks less often.
Chaser/Devout/Malicious/Gatekeeper are poor choices of words to describe the categories you want, and why you want them. You do not describe how each category should function, nor their differences. The typical categories are:
- Mobility - Traverse the map faster
- Information - Know where survivors are
- Lethality - Get survivors health-states down faster.
- Delay - Make the survivors spend more time in the Trial
Furthermore, gatekeeper (Delay) and malicious (Lethality), both contribute to the Killers overall advantage, the only skill-gap in this regard would be to pick the one your Killer is worse at (same goes for survivors, choosing the perk their build lacks, this can be pre-planned). The player(s) at advantage should lose out on the maximum number of choices instead, with the disadvantaged side gaining one, to make a statistical difference.
You never make any mention of what perks should be in the pool: a present set of base-game perks? Do newly introduced perks get added to these categories? What's the process of deciding which category a perk is in?
Overall this reeks of AI generation with little revision.
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Probably to present a consistent model.
She doesn't hold traps in-game.
Not saying it couldn't return at some point as an idle-lobby animation, but in terms of giving visual clarity to the player of what their character model looks like to other players, it makes sense.
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Still think they missed an opportunity to reward hooking by making it tied to hooks gained instead of final kill.
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Well they decided to forget that not getting a bonus is also a penalty.
The complaint that the prior bonuses were "cookie cutter" is exactly what they should want to hear, especially given that you can still choose not to target unique hooks. It felt cookie cutter since it was more efficient.
…buuut I will say that giving the player nearly every choice at once: mobility/information/regression (there were no lethality options) instead of requiring the player to choose one benefit based on build/game-state/location made it feel even moreso cookie cutter given a lack of agency to choose a benefit.
Dunno, let the player hold the hook input while hooking to open a radial menu to select the boon? Needs to be fluid and not interrupt gameplay. (Or interrupt gameplay but have enough strength to offset the interrupt).
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
Hyper mobile killers are the issue for tunneling, I don't think any amount of anti tunnel/anti camp will ever fix that
Hyper mobile killers are an issue for tunneling when they have rough knowledge of where the survivor will be. This at least makes the actual location determined by human permutation (that can leverage or forgo environmental stimulus of the Killer/Map/location - the mindgame), instead of an algorithm.
Problem with BHVR's current iteration of anti-tunneling features (with the onus on survivors), is the Killer can still see them.
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I still think at the end of the day it still provides a lot of proxy-camping advantage to go for the unhooker (which may be a good thing for variety), but I do agree with the general sentiment of: The unhooked player needs to be able to relocate themselves without the Killers knowledge, and this certainly prevents tracking on the unhooked survivor on the onset.
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@Slurp_Ramen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4021715#Comment_4021715
this point is null when in you consider most good survivors in 2v8 die anyway because both killers team up on them or they just get rolled by an insta down, being injured in 2v8 doesn’t matter nearly as much as long as you get pressure in exchange.
‘legion injures survivors and them easy targets for the other killer’Yeah? So does every other killer. Wraith (hit and runs with stealth) ghost face (same problem as wraith except he’ll expose you from a mile away and give his teammate a free down) huntress (snipes you) blight is blight is nurse nurse you get the point.
People choosing to not counter the killer then whining because they then lose to said killer and get them gutted/removed is the reason we can’t get anywhere and people will continue whatever is meta/whatever gets the best results with the least work. Killers like krasue and ghoul
Legion's Power is literally designed to chain off of survivors, the more the merrier.
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For the most part.
Overall, more bonuses for Survivor pain points and barely anything for Killers.
Camping:
- Agree on the slight trepidation of verticality.
- Overall fine with the change.
- Bonus: Killers can leverage this to "unhook" a survivors faster whom they think are being ignored by their teammates.
Tunneling:
- They need a clear cut definition of what their data shows, make a tweet about it or reddit post to clarify what those numbers actually mean. Otherwise that data is worthless. What was their hook distribution and hook order for that data?
- Did this take into account Survivors getting killed on hook as a result of not getting rescued?
- In the above scenario, was the Killer camping or not?
- I can see how survivors could probably feed into this data, with 2-3 players boneheadedly rescuing each other off hook and not waiting for their teammate with the least amount of hooks to step up. Making a tighter distribution of hook orders, but entirely as a result of the survivors action and not the Killer.
- Or a stealthy player ignoring their teammates and not taking any aggro.
- However I can also see how a Killer would leverage proxy-camping and information perks on-hook to use a survivor as bait, quickly down the rescuer, and then play off the hook moreso than patrol.
- The unhook benefits for Survivor would greatly increase the avoidance of Killer for the first hooked survivor in the above scenario until they consume them, which is good.
- I do enjoy that they're putting the onus on the Survivor.
Hook Benefits:
- Frankly, not getting the unique hook benefit is a detriment, and what should be used as the incentive to try for unique hooks, to the point that perhaps optimal gameplay would see you searching for this bonus, without any other opportunity provided by misplays of Survivors.
- This may be "cookie cutter", but this is the bloody goal of trying to shift player focus onto spreading hooks, they still can go for one survivor, but it would be less efficient, unless they misplayed (and efficiency is the name of the game in higher MMR's…)
- The problem is that BHVR betrayed their own goal of PLAYER AGENCY by giving all bonuses at once (in the last iteration), and not making the player choose which one, based on game-state and/or killer Power.
- T1 Bloodlust is rather… Pointless. Insofar as there is only one perk that currently augments it: Beast of Prey (and it actively works against a perk like Rapid Brutality). But I suspect they may be utilizing this to release Bloodlust Perks in the future, which will both target low MMR players as well as high MMR players. (Given now high MMR players have a method of reliably triggering it)
- Bloodlust doesn't help you target the next least hooked survivor. And may accidently make you run across a more recently hooked survivor.
- It only being bloodlust also works against player agency… again…
Slugging:
- In agreement. I like BHVR's approach, it addresses the niche bleed-out playstyle by making it ramp up the more slugging is used, while still allowing low ramp-up for selective slugging.
All in all, while I do like the changes, I can't help but notice that the only thing Killers got, was 15s of 5% haste on unique hook. that can't be used in chase (and will likely see moonwalking tech/camera tech to avoid triggering chase until on the survivor for the sake of efficiency)
I will welcome them, but it's a miss for Killer pain points to address tunneling.
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@BbQz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3998645#Comment_3998645
I'm sure the blight that got close to 2000 game win streak played plenty of them lol. That's what happens when you don't play easy you get wins.
cough and shows the MMR isn't working. Properly applied such a streak shouldn't be possible (assuming 4K). That it was possible is indicative of either a broken matchmaking system, broken Killer, or both.
In a competitive setting, the possibility of loss is important. Doubtful there was one in a 2,000 game win streak…
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more like 2v8 is a better testing ground for experimental features.
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Unhook Protections Update:
- 10% Haste Status Effect - Less effective against mobility/ranged Killers, mostly useful if the Killer is already Proxy camping in the first place. More effective against M1 Killers.
- Endurance status effect - Less effective against mobility/ranged Killers that can secure relatively quick follow-up hits. More effective against M1 Killers. Not a huge fan, but necessary given proxy-camping as a result of a single point where the Unhooked Survivor will be.
- Elusive - Effective against all Killers so long as line-of-sight blockers are present to be used. I like this, except that it doesn't prevent Killer Instinct from Finding players.
- Reveal the Killer's Aura within 32m - Cool to use to evade the killer if they're not running you down. Possibly decent to make it harder in chase too, though that is under the assumption that the Survivor is immediately getting tunneled.
- Immunity to Killer Instinct - Why isn't this part of Elusive? A status that exists to make the Survivor undetectable without direct LoS makes sense to have no "Killer trump card", it's asymmetrical (though usage of such a status should be deliberate and not excessive).
Hook Status Update:
- The Killer cannot see the hook's status in the HUD - This is only relevant for the Unhook portion. I do not think this is necessary.
- The Killer cannot see the Hook's Aura - I'm fine with this. Promotes spatial memory.
- No unhook notification - Punishes Killers that are not Tunneling with inaccurate information, while being irrelevant for Killers proxy-camping.
- HUD Delay - See above.
Unique Hook Bonuses:
- Overall I kinda like them. But kinda would like to see a rock/paper/scissors approach? Instead of giving Delay/Lethality+Mobility/Information, you give the Killer a choice somehow? (Perhaps also separating the mobility/lethality choice too).
Tunneling Penalties:
- I do not like how these effects are enforced by the system instead of introducing a method for survivors to try and mitigate tunneling themselves.
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An automatic system that tries to shape killer gameplay through punishing "undesirables".
Instead of a system that gives survivors tools to counteract "undesireable gameplay".
Let survivors on Hook choose a hook they can teleport to, show it to other survivors, and give the unhookers the option to choose which location to unhook.
Killer doesn't get information on what hook they come off of, and can still get instant information on hook states.
And remove tunneling penalties in exchange for some kind of base-kit Shoulder the burden when certain conditions are met, still taking time from survivors, but also adding time to the killer in the case the dead survivor isn't literally dead weight (which is a MMR issue)
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Luckily YOU can "fix" the system yourself.
As killer: Go for 8 Hooks and 1 Kill (I like to use Rancor and target the Obsession once the gates are powered. As Pig I may or may not get extra kills from RBT RNG and player knowledge)
As Survivor: If you get a match that you stomp the Killer, give them a freebie kill. Cinematic AND lowers your MMR.
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From what I've been hearing about this chapter and recent events… I'm simply disappointed.
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Bumping this, except I'd replace the slugged/up broken with a "mini-game" that takes a decent amount of time to perform under hook to pull oneself up.
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Still of the opinion: Can't recover while crawling (basekit), but while under hook can recover the last 5% via some kind of interactive sequence (longer than 5% recovery resetting to 95% on interrupt/cancel).
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3959471#Comment_3959471
Well, it may end up even stronger now?
Maybe. Idk.
Sadge, map tracking has been removed entirely per the discord preview.
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3959471#Comment_3959471
Well, it may end up even stronger now?
Maybe. Idk.
mmm. ThatRyanB quoted Kaethela's comment:
"Kaethelea: Currently, Deja Vu adds the marked gens to your map, if you have one. Maps are being reworked to only show things in a range, so adding things to maps doesn't happen anymore, so Deja needs to be adjusted to account for this."
ThatRyanB after quoting:
For those asking in this thread, yes, the adjustment coming to Deja Vu is related to its (often lesser-known) Map effect. This is because the effects op Map items are being adjusted with this update.
So I'm assuming that Perks that used to add auras to maps no longer will do so. But yeah, maybe, idk.
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Exhaustion basekit on RBT serves just to tunnel RBT'ed survivors out harder.
Merciless skillchecks and longer search timers basekit are just excuses to get kills with little involvement and placement of a single trap while you're also probably running scream perks/search interrupt perks and slowdown addons. No thank you.
If you want more gen slowdown that isn't gained from one or two survivors being out of commission (playing with hats) in the repair/rescue/chase gameplay loop you have perks available to use.
I'm indifferent on not being able to take a trap off in one search (as it is, the first survivor chased getting it off in one go does hamper her early-game stalling), so I wouldn't say no.
I'd like her to get some chase music, ye.
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Oh, well there goes my team scout build… (Detective's Hunch/Map/Crystal Bead)
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@GlamourousLeviathan said:
Pyramid's changes feel more like a huge nerf overall. Being slower while charging your power really hurts since ideally you have to wait for survivors to be locked in animation to use the punishment of the damned and survivors tend to bait it out once you start charging. But the thing that really hurts is the added endurance to his kit. The cage's whole point is making survivors tunnel free, hence why good survivors prefer to go down rather than step into the trail. This is what makes Pyramid so good, and the fact that it now gives the basekit BT effect basically blows up the killer's ankles. It is kinda still worth it for negating DS and OTR but the range buffs does not compensate it since the add-ons already do their job on that.
Clown's changes don't feel either like a nerf or a buff. The change the focus from the purple bottles to the yellow bottles, which feels weird since you're supposed to use them in conjunction and the purple bottle's hindering isn't that great to begin with. I think this will just centralize his playstyle around the add-ons that buff the speed up even further.
Knights changes are just a nerf. You should never use Carnifex to chase survivors to begin with. Instead, you should save it for when you are chasing them yourself to break pallets quicker. Assassin and Jailer are the chasers, so the fact that their banner spawns quicker is basically all banners spawning quicker since Carni functions different from them. The patrol length and the drawing speed are decent tho.
Finally, for Pig they have been trying this for years. Buffing the dash and ignoring/nerfing the bear traps to pander to survivors who can't deal with macro mechanics. It has never worked, and I don't see why it would work now. The main asset of her kit is the RBTs, so leaving them as a second thought (and you know, making jigsaw boxes auras invisible for her) while buffing the ambush is like breaking a professional runner's legs and saying "oh so you have a really strong arm now, therefore you can play basketball just fine". No one plays pig because of the dash, otherwise they would play Chucky.
Overall, changes that feel that come from someone who doesn't play the game. So no news in here.
I like Spies from the Shadows. If it triggers in an area where survivors have no reason to be in, it's probably a survivor running to a box/using a box.
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@snowyhans said:
I also think slowing down his movement speed discourages drawing paths significantly, and have the vague feeling executioner players already don't care to draw paths.
I just feel like while the change successfully targets the problem of the executioner's zoning ability it also significantly damages his unique ability to corrupt the trail grounds, and I find this very sad. I just wonder if there could be some kind of elegant condition where Rites of Judgement is only slowed in or around chases, allowing the executioner to draw trails as he does now.
We'll need to see how they change his addons, but longer lasting Judgement Trails (don't yet know how much longer) could mean Judgement Trail pre-placement could be used as a kind of Trap/Hazard to push survivors off certain loops.
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I used to play PH a lot (Now Pig/Drac). One of the safest methods to play him was to use Rites in a loop to force a hit at an animation lock or zone into M1. Kinda felt a bit boring, so hopefully some of that zoning is being offloaded onto more persistent Judgement Trails and a Hinder addon (although I'd much prefer a small Hinder being base-kit when running across Judgement Trails, useful to "Trap" certain loops).
I also never really bothered to pre-place Judgement Trails before as they fell-off too quickly for my taste.
Don't know how much addons are going to help him going forward (can't wait to read the patch notes), but I would agree with no addons it does seem like he's going to be made more difficult.
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@Marzipan210 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3959348#Comment_3959348
An issue here though is that a killer running 4 slowdowns or playing a high tier killer can potentially snowball early like that whereas survivors can potentially get lots of gen progress quickly regardless of what perks the killer has or even who they are playing but obviously lower tier killers who aren't running meta suffer more.
You can pretty much always bounce back but it would be false to say that a killer not being able to secure a down within a reasonable amount of time in the early game can put them at a severe disadvantage that is almost unavoidable on certain maps and when playing as certain killers.
Of course I think the solution is to buff the ######### out of every killer C tier and below in one big "we're sorry" patchAnother issue when relying on slowdown Perks, is that if you don't trigger them readily then you get steamrolled (as your MMR adjusts you to face players capable of working with those Perks).
It's the Pig dilemma: Can't leverage your hat slowdown well if it's difficult to place them to begin with. I'm going to be interested in the changelist to her Power/addons.
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@theblimp said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3959092#Comment_3959092
But it is impossible to 3 gen, the devs made sure of that with nerfing all regression and limiting the amount of times gens can be regressed
It's technically impossible to hold a 3-gen indefinitely. It doesn't invalidate the reduced patrol zone and emergent dead-zones as you consolidate chases in that area.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3959065#Comment_3959065
I know a few people seem to disagree with this take but you're mostly correct?
The one part I disagree with is a survivor going down quickly IS objectively bad for the survivor team because the Killer now has an insanely easy target that could win them the game if they decide to hard tunnel.
But the parts i do agree with:
If you chase a survivor and the first thing they do is immediately waste all the pallets without even trying to loop you on them - next thing you know you've got survivors going down insanely quickly because of the huge deadzone. I've had many games where someone uses shack at 5 gens when they honestly didn't need to and it cost us later in the match.
Survivors who can use minimal resources and waste a lot of time are the ones who lose you games as Killer.
Yeah, my take works under the assumption that as Killer you're also taking into account when you should drop chase too (such as very long window loops, or if the survivor is dragging you away from a good future 3-gen). Which is probably where a lot of the downvotes are coming from, as if you're not forcing the survivor to use resources you don't create those dead-zones to get easier downs later.
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@Mandy said:
The anti-face camp is not going to prevent camping, preventing player agency is never the intention with any system - it's giving counterplay to something. You're getting face camped and the bar is going up, you will be able to get off the hook….which if the killer was face-camping previously you couldn't have done without a trade, now you don't need to trade with the survivor on the hook.
If a killer wants to camp a survivor they can of course do so - we are not removing that, what we're doing is trying to give the survivors tools to counter it - so you can unhook yourself, take chase etc. If the killer is camping, the other survivors should be doing generators, making the killer effectively lose the match.
If the Tool is entirely reliant on the Killer input, it's not really a Survivor tool, is it? Just a Killer Punishment.