Adjatha
Adjatha
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Honestly, there's a LOT of metrics that ought to be factored in, not just kills.
Like, how about Hits? Did the killer get a 0k but hit survivors 15-20 times and the survivors just kept healing back to full?
Or Hooks? Did that 4k come because all the survivors gave up on their first hook?
Or Generators completed? Are all the 1-2k games ending because survivors are just Keying out at the first sign of a real End Game?
Or average time in chase? Is the 4k coming after 10 second chases, or as the result of a grueling, 15 minute ordeal that ended with every pallet broken and 16-some Second Chance perk uses?
But hey, it's just easier to say "Freddy's killing 3 people on average, so clearly he needs a nerf"
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Petition to increase the skill ceiling on repair checks. Every successful check halves the size of the success zone for the next one. Since "Taking Skill to Play" is apparently such an important metric for survivor players.
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There's always talk of "buff solo survivors" but that fails to account for the fact that SWF teams are actively ruining the Killer experience. How about instead of buffing Solo survivors, we just nerf SWF and give the Killer +1% movespeed per person in a pre-made group. So, if there's two of you, the killer effectively has Bloodlust I. If there's 4 of you, they have Bloodlust II. And then they temporarily lose the movespeed boost whenever a survivor is on a hook and permanently lose it when one survivor has died.
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To be frank, it does not matter what rank the survivors are. You just get matched up against literally anybody. It's a total crapshoot.
4 coins and they got out with a key. Golly, do you think they were a SWF?
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@StibbityStabbity said:
I'm a red rank Survivor and I constantly get matched against brown rank Killers.
Yes, the matchmaking is bad. I honestly feel bad when that sort of thing happens, because I feel like I'm bullying a kid when I loop them for 5 gens. I can't just stop bullying them, though. I play Nea with cosmetics. The bullying must happen. They must learn. Nea demands a sacrifice.
Well, all my friends have quit playing and I rarely play more than a couple matches a week, so: mission accomplished.
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To the people who say "Oh Tricker's actually super good, you just have to get good with him":
Would you at least agree that he should be changed from "EASY" to "HARD"? The whole point of that difficulty stat is to help people get a feel for how tough it is to use the power effectively and play around the killer's innate weaknesses. Bubba revs his chainsaw and runs faster, getting 1-shot downs. He is EASY to play. Nurse moves slower than survivors and has to precisely measure out her blinks or suffer a self-inflicted pallet-stun. She is HARD to play.
Trickster moves slowly, has a power that gets shut down by more than half the loops in the game, is heavily map-dependent, requires continual hits, fades away, requires reloading, slows you down, is inaccurate and gets more inaccurate the longer you throw, and charges up a bonus power that goes away if you don't use it within 10 seconds and actually makes you WEAKER if you do.
If some people can play around ALL those weaknesses to reliably down survivors, that's great. But that is not a feat that your average person can do just by picking up and playing the character 2-3 times. That is the definition of a HARD killer. If the Devs intended Trickster to be an EASY killer, they failed spectacularly.
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@smart212 said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/N8WCI0S1LPDF/image.png
this game not fun anymore. i think I will depip so i can facing a lower or yellow & green survivor.
You think THAT'S bad; I'm yellow rank now and I still get 1-3 red rank survivors in every game. Depipping will not help, there are way too many over-experienced survivors and way too few hyper-skilled killers to challenge them.
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The recovery time on Executioner's shockwave attack has been halved on missed attacks
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About as useful as a brown/yellow offering.
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Let me go to opposite way with that and say that the Executioner SHOULD be able to place Torment Trails around the hook. It's GOOD to force the survivors to have to move slowly when doing a rescue. And at least everybody can SEE the torment trails and know that you have to crouch walk out of it
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@mynameisBlade said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2239889#Comment_2239889
I completely agree! What are the Killers that need this attention the most? I suppose a Killer like Trapper has SOME Survivor interactivity with the disarming of his traps, so not sure if you'd count that? I am curious to hear your thoughts on a Killer like Wraith or Nurse. Giving Survivors a way to interact with each Killers power seems like a neat way to spice up the game for sure!
Players disarming traps is a KIND of environmental interaction, that's true. The issue is that the Trapper player doesn't have an actual power to use beyond setting those, and his has to both place the traps manually as well as retrieve his traps from random places in the environment. If he had, say, a baseline inventory of 3 and reloaded at a locker, it would be more reasonable to say that evasion and disarming is the back and forth. But for how long it takes the killer to set all that stuff up (not to mention how few can reasonably be put in one region), it feels more like the players making sure the killer stays in their "man with stick runs after you" baseline mode. Which is why I suggested the traps resetting themselves addon as a passive: players can poink the traps to turn off the killer's bonus, but it'll come back at some mysterious point, so you must be always on your guard.
Wraith should really have the "you can't tell how near or far the bing bongs are" addon baseline. If players are checking out all around themselves in paranoia any time the bell is run, they're applying psychological pressure everywhere on the map. Perhaps even adding little, fake 'shimmers' as if he's close by that move around randomly, so survivors are never sure when it's safe to stop hiding. Keep up the pressure of the invisible threat!
Nurse is tough. In the hands of 99% of players, she's the worst killer in the game because her power is so hard to use and her movement speed is so slow that you are forced to use it all the time. But in the hands of the 1% who put in tons of practice and got good, she's nearly unbeatable. There is no "man with stick runs after you" phase to her. It is all power all the time and if you're good, you can be practically everywhere at once. Given her whole deal, I think an interesting one might be to have the UI lie to survivors: if you're a certain distance away from your team mates, their portraits all say that they're injured. That way, you're never really sure who's in need of healing or who's just not near you.
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@mynameisBlade said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2237381#Comment_2237381
This comment doesn't have enough up votes. We need ALL of the Killers to make the match completely different. I suggested awhile back that they should take certain addons of each Killer and make them base kit, Ex: Hillbilly Chainsaw running through 1st pallet but doesn't down you if he hits you. That would make fighting him more unique. Too many killer are just... M1 focused. They don't have the flavor or effort put into them like the Killers you mentioned for sure!
Well thank you. It's easy to say "giving killers passives is like giving them free perks, so that's not fair!" but, like, it's the core theming for the game. Everybody will have a more enjoyable time if the game has more variety from one game to the next and that means changing the baseline rules for each killer
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I agree that the BBQ aura reveal should be a Bubba passive. More killers should have passive effects that help dictate the flow of the game in a way unique to them. Like how Nemesis has the passive zombies or Freddy passively puts people to sleep or Huntress has a gigantic lullaby. Just being "run around and sometimes fire a hadouken" is bad killer design.
Each killer should warp the game in some way unique to them such that the survivors are feeling their effects when when not being actively chased. Bake (a weaker) Ruin into Hag or self-setting traps into Trapper or an infection 'aura' into Plague or random patches of Torment spawn for Pyramid Head. Each game needs to feel like it's the killer's playground, not just another round of drag-and-drop "generic man with stick and stone run after you"
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When I play survivor, all the other survivors and killers are within 1-3 ranks of me. When I play killer, I get the full spectrum, from 1 to 20 (but ALWAYS at least one red rank). The system's gloated at the gills with over-experienced survivor mains who can't find enough talented killers to face and get thrown at all the low ranks willy-nilly. MMR can't come out fast enough. Far better to let the rank 1s wait for 60 minutes at a time, just as long as they stop dropping them in all the rank 20-10 lobbies.
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@Drae said:
They already said that they are going to change keys to get them into the new in-built mori system. Add this to the fact that the survivor will be able to "say no to moris" and it will become clear that killers will be able to mori survivors when keys are brought in a match by survivors. I found it pretty clear i don't see why there is so much speculation or passion behind this matter.
-Survivors get to decide if they will face a mori.
-Keys are going to be bind to the mori system.
It looks simple and clean and pretty neat imho.
I'd rather a cool killer system not be bound to the will of the survivors. Those guys have too much power in what's supposed to be an asymmetrical game already!
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@Moundshroud said:
I suspect they will follow the precedent set by Pyramid Head, where certain criteria have to be met. I would prefer if said criteria was unique to each Killer, as that would certainly be cooler. My only other thought is:
I'd like a refund for all the unused Mori Offerings still on my Killers if/when the change takes place and it is no longer an Offering. The Blood We forced me to buy a metric ton of these things, and suddenly making them invalid without compensation would be a pretty harsh blow, particularly given the price of the Ebony Memento Mori.
It would be a very fair and kind gesture to refund us the BP value or at least allow us to swap them out for other items of the matching rarity (or less) in the Blood Web one for one.
This.
Or change them to be Mega versions of Survivor Pudding or something. +300% BPs.
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@HexSweetie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2215645#Comment_2215645
You had me until the last part. Tbag is a fancy word for spamming crouch button, not worth making a whole system off of it, you can either be toxic back by nodding or just deal with it.
It's more that you're being a disrespectful troll to all these great horror icons instead of playing the game. And doing that means you really deserve to get a big, gory execution.
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@TheStabbiNAngeL said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2215842#Comment_2215842
But for real Nemesis blows the zombies up an punches them if they're in his way,Pyramid Head should be able to bring Silent Hill with everywhere he goes to
Ostensibly, that's what the torment trails and cages are. It's just that the torment power sucks on ice and cages are so puffed up by survivors who refuses to accept that some killers might negate their beloved meta perks that it's just a bogeyman that keeps the devs from fixing PH's many, many problems.
So, the presence of Silent Hill is pretty minimal.
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@Laluzi said:
I really love the zombies! They make DBD feel like an entirely different game. The ambiance is incredible and seeing them on maps like Silent Hill and Lery's is its own brand of awesome.
Though they do seem pretty powerful just as passive survivor slowdown. I don't expect them to get much if any damage by themselves, smart survivors won't get hit, but being able to bother survivors away from gens, heals, safe loop spots, is difficult to balance.
All killers should have some kind of passive slow down, like zombies, or reverse bear traps, or alarm clocks. Please note, they should NOT be like Plague's fountains, which give a full heal and, in fact, speed up the game rather than slowing it down.
Perks as the only source of survivor slowdown is a bad design
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@TheStabbiNAngeL said:
Can Pyramid Head have two friends also ?
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/UA3RJNASJCDS/download-284-29.jpeg
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/B6A6OYYSS016/images.jpeg
Pyramid Head does not play nicely with his friends.
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So they're almost certainly going to be some variation of "hook all survivors at least once, and have at least X total hook states" or something. But what if it was something more interesting?
How about a "Building Tension" system. The killer has a meter that slowly fills up over the course of the match and when it's full, they get one use of a Mori. Things that might build that meter would be if they're stunned by a palette, blinded by a flashlight, if a survivor struggles free, when a generator pops, if they reach Bloodlust Tier 2/3, and the like. Basically, if they're getting clowned on, they gradually power up until bam: time to even the playing field by booting one of these guys right out of the match, blood-first.
A similar, but slightly different suggestion would be a "toxic" meter. Every time a survivor crouches more than once in a 5 second window, it adds to the meter. Once it's full, the killer's free to Mori to their heart's content. Teabag all you like, you'll get yours in time. Throw in the added boost that survivors who teabag inside the exit gates get a Blood Warden effect that locks them in the match with the killer.
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Lethal Pursuer needs an in-game effect, like increase the speed at which you build Bloodlust by 20-50% or something.
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Nemesis' power seems like it could be good and fun to use (assuming they didn't put a huge delay on use it or a massive movement nerf once it's out).
His perks seem like garbage, though.
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Passive 100% gen regression and/or killer gen kicks dealing 10% regression. Gens shouldn't take longer to do, but Killers should have some kind of actual regression available to reward them for chasing survivors off of generators.
Or, even better, bring back Ruin/undying and make it a game mechanic instead of perks. Give Survivors a totem counter to compensate.
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@Shirokinukatsukami said:
They aren't.
If you think maps like Shelter Woods, Wrecker's Yard, Azarov's or Midwich are survivor-sided you have another thing coming.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2204625#Comment_2204625
This was also before the glut of killer Detection and Exposed Perks. You have more than enough tools to deal with second chance perks.
Detection starts chases. Second chance perks keeps them going for 8 minutes longer than they ought to.
And when you say 'glut of exposed perks,' do you mean:
- Rancor; which works on one survivor and only after all 5 gens are done (and can be disabled if you happen to kill the obsession before the end game)
- Noed; which only works after all 5 gens are done (and can be disabled by players doing bones)
- Devour Hope; which requires at least 3 unguarded hooks (and can be disabled by players doing bones)
- or Starstruck; which relies on players trying to divebomb hooks, heedless of how unsafe the would-be rescue may be
- Or Dragon's Grip, Iron Maiden, Make Your Choice, Haunted Ground; which are all 30-60 seconds, player-initiated, and the killer has no control over when they begin, potentially making them totally pointless if the survivors have even basic looping ability or the chase target is already injured?
I kid. Of course you're talking about NOED. Nobody does bones.
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Why are a majority of maps survivor-sided? Because the stated goal of the developers is that all 5 generators get repaired and at least 2 survivors escape every game. Also, the core gameplay loop (flee, circle palettes, stun, repeat) was created before the glut of second-chance perks were created that let survivors keep running LONG past the point where they normally would've been downed and hooked. What would otherwise be more balanced maps become unbalanced when the opportunity to down somebody between tiles has been removed by auto-recharging perks that everybody takes.
If there were no Dead Hard, Unbreakable, Decisive Strike, Deliverance, etc, maps would feel a lot less like a mountain to climb every game.
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This is why they WANTED to give each killer their own matchmaking rating, so you could try to learn new killers without getting ground to dust under red rank SWFs all day long. It's why they took out the ability to swap killers in queue.
And then they didn't put it in the game but left the inability to swap killers in queue.
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Plague's barf is the most frustrating part of playing her. The reason for this was explained in the 4th Anniversary loading tooltips. In essence, her barf LOOKS like a flamethrower, but it WORKS like a semi-automatic.
What appears to be an unbroken wave that should infect anything it touches is actually a series of chunks, with loads of space between them. If a survivor is touched by a chunk, they get infected. If not, they don't. This means that a survivor can run back and forth through your puke and never get infected if they dodge every chunk (which is very much possible).
In playing her, this is incredibly frustrating, as we can't SEE the chunks, and the particle effects hide it. So, it seems to bug out, when in fact it's working as intended. If they're going to give her a visual rework, they really ought to make her puke in visible chunks, so it doesn't appear that the game is bugged. Or, you know, change the core ability so it works like a flamethrower so the effect matches the visual.
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If the killer is going for the person who unhooked you instead of you, the person who was just hooked, that probably means they are trying not to tunnel you. If you body block to stop that, you are inviting them to tunnel you. Play as you like, but be aware of the consequences of abusing your meta perk.
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Killer Perk:
"Relentless"
[Using your killer's powers does not slow your movement speed. This perk deactivates after 2/3/4 generators have been completed.]
The point of the perk is to give killers a strong early game boost by eliminating the slowdown that nearly every killer has while using their powers. This includes things like Executioner's barbed wire trails, Doctor's shock, Myers' stalking, Trickster's knives, Huntress' throwing axes, (now) Freddy's pool placement, etc etc.
Killers are at their weakest at the start of a match, and giving them just that little extra move speed buff to hopefully wrap up early chases a little bit faster and reduce the number of times players can just loop a killer until all the gens pop. Because killers are (usually) at their strongest on the final stage of the game, the power shuts off, making them slower and once more easier to loop around right when the survivors need it the most.
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Because survivors say they want alternate objectives to give the game greater depth, but the second one goes into the game (and at the cost of 2 killer perk slots), they complain endlessly until it goes away.
Which is why you will be holding M1 on a generator from now until the end times.
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I can't tell if this person is the most persistent troll on this forum, or just the worst survivor player in the game.
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@Mary_Saotome said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2129158#Comment_2129158
I have over 300 ebonies on nurse. If you save up, you def can use them all the time.
2,100,000 BPs. That's gotta sting.
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Change the text on Ebony Mori to the old text for Ivory Mori (kill one survivor after one hook). It has a big impact on the game, but it's a one-shot item that costs a ton, so you really can't afford to use them all the time.
Or lock it until all survivors have been hooked once before you can get your one kill. That way you aren't just chasing the first guy right off the hook.
Or, you could revert them all to one-hook, but require that the mori be performed inside the killer shack, so you can't just drop somebody anywhere.
Or change it so that it only works on one hook, but only if the survivor in question has completed a generator's worth of repairs.
Or revert it to the old way but give it a very difficult skill check to activate or else the survivor heals one state and takes off running.
Or revert it but make it unusable if there are any Healthy survivors in a medium Radius, so brave teams can 'protect' their team mates by putting themselves in danger.
Or revert it, but make it only usable if the survivor is "Exhausted" as a punishment for the extremely powerful Exhaustion perks every survivor always runs.
Or revert it but it only functions if there are at least 3 SWF players in your game (the offering is not consumed if it's mostly Solos).
Or revert it, but make being Mori'd grants the victim a hefty BP bonus (say, 4000 or something) because cool kills are the whole point of slasher movies in the first place, and victims gotta get paid.
There's lots of ways. At the end of the day, if you want the Mori to have an impact on the game, you have to keep its actual hook requirements low. If you're downing a survivor 3 times, your high cost, one-use offering is doing less for you than a brown BP offering and that's an awful waste of points.
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"Twitch Streamer who literally gets paid to play the game for thousands of hours says Killer role too easy; flummoxed by failings in others."
This person is like when OhTofu was complaining that Bloodlust ought to be removed from the game. Gee, is DbD too easy for you guys? Maybe try to picture what it might be like playing the game without a financial reward for mastering every aspect of it? Or, at the very least, spare us the self-aggrandizing humble brags and possibly consider that some game elements aren't especially well designed for the vast majority of players.
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Between more grass, way brighter environments, map palette color changes, and all the map reworks, scratch marks are dang near invisible even in wide open fields. They were made back when the game was super dark on every level and they have not held up to the new "let's install flood lights at the carnival" or "Let's tromp around snow that miraculously leaves no footprints," or "let's just play Dead by Daylight in the actual daylight" maps. Those things should be glowing like the frickin' sun, even without Predator.
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I like everything about him except actually playing him.
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How 'bout turning all those vault points on the fences into breakable vaults? It's exactly as survivor-sided to begin with, but after the killer's smashed some stuff apart, it becomes far less loopable. But only, and I can't stress this enough, if it is REMOVING vault spots from the map, not adding extras to it. Breakable walls are only good when they are an exchange for the killer's time by shutting down a strong survivor loop. When there are breakable walls that actually reward survivors for the killer breaking them, that's a failure of the map design.
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It's funny: Nurse is rated "Hard" because she's incredibly difficult to do anything with when you're new, but wildly OP when you're really good with her. Trickster is rated "Easy" because he's supposed to be simple to pick up and play, without a huge learning curve.
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@lob said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2118634#Comment_2118634
then again imagine nemesis a nemesis a killing machine get pallet stunned and blinded at every pallet
You mean like how Pyramid Head, a creature that has a giant metal helmet with no eyes whatsoever, gets blinded? Yeah, it's a treat.
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Hatches and keys let survivors side-step the end of the match; the phase where killers are typically at their strongest, because the active area survivors want to be is so much smaller.
Shouldn't there be an offering killers can use that side-steps the beginning of the match, where killers are at their weakest? Like, some or all the survivors start exposed, or survivor auras are revealed to the killer for a bit at the start, or the killer has a speed buff until the first gen is completed or the first survivor is downed, or something like that?
I suppose Moris were the equivalent, letting you knock out one or more players faster than usual, skipping a portion of the early/mid game. Green moris were certainly more fair, limiting your impact to just the one person, but they all got nerfed to pointlessness, so there's that. I wonder if the hatch/keys will ever get nerfed in a similar, scorched earth style?
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Red Ranks are almost always the ones name calling in end game, teabagging at every palette, flashlight clicking, whining about unfair killer perks, refusing to escape until the killer comes over to watch them, and dead hards out the exit gate to deny the final hit.
Something about playing the game long enough to reach red rank makes people into jack holes.
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The funny part is that Freddy's slowdown addons only work if everybody stays asleep. Which is to say: just staying on generators the whole time. If they wake themselves up with botched skill checks, clapping, or alarm clocks, Freddy's slowdown addons don't do anything. But asking survivors to do anything other than sit on generators forever is apparently totally unreasonable. Heaven forbid there be literally anything else to do in the game than holding M1. If you ask me, EVERY killer should have some kind of baked-in slowdown that asks survivors to either occasionally do a side task, or eat extra time on gens if they want to ignore killer mechanics.
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To say nothing of Ebony Mori. One by one, the most expensive killer toys are becoming their worst items. Maybe they'll do us all a favor and just drop 'em to 1,000 bp, where they now belong.
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@hiken said:
Freddy B tier? What?. Freddy is easily A tier, and top of A tier... he has everything in his kit, he is not weak in any aspect at the very least he may be average in one aspect and very strong in the rest.. he is strong, and very hard to go against if using tinkerer + ruin.
OhTofu's list is for Good killers vs Good Survivors. Freddy's only B tier because Good survivors don't get caught with their pants down and know how to counter play Freddy's tricks rather than just hold M1 blissfully until the killer pops up on top of them. Freddy's very punishing against bad players and guess what the majority of Survivors are?
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I would've been fine with everything else, but slowing down to use your power FEELS BAD. Freddy not slowing to lay traps was the hope that other guys, like Plague or Executioner might some day be able to use their powers at normal speed. With that being nerfed, those hopes are gone forever. Feels bad.
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If they're going to keep increasing light levels on these stages, I sure hope they fix scratch marks. Those things were created when the game was dark on every single stage. With all this ambient light, you can't see a friggin' thing. Survivors are going to be impossible to track.
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Meta perk becomes even better: News at 11
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Very bright maps make tracking by survivor scratches EXTREMELY difficult. They were awful on old Ormond, they're awful on Dead Dog, they're awful on new Crotus Prenn, and they're going to be impossible on new Corn. They have to tune up the neon on those things or this game's gonna have half its maps be ultimate stealth zones for all survivors
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The Hook counter ought to be on a perk too. Adding UI boosts to Survivors is bad design and just helps encourage everyone spamming the same four meta perks.