Lemming
Lemming
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Dead by Daylight was never and has never been a horror game. It's a party game in the same vein as Mario Party with horror themed costumes.
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New Legion is pretty bad. He feels sluggish, has a bad play style for fun, and doesn't seem to have direction on his role in the game. Everything the Legion can do the Nurse can do with less draw backs but his overall power level is closer to the Wraith. There is a lot of "I could play Legion but why should I?" similar to what a lot of people feel about Leatherface.
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Let me describe my experience with MoM the day it was released. Hooked an Ash for the second time as a Wraith. I turn to leave but Bill saves Ash right in front of me and before I can cloak activating his Borrowed Time. I turn to pursue Bill but Ash body blocks me knowing he has Borrowed Time. Fine. I hit him, and off he goes so might as well chase him. I almost catch up to him but he Dead Hards through a pallet and lays it down. Thankfully it was unsafe and I hit him again in short order, downing him. I go to pick him up since he isn't the Obsession in this game, but lo and behold it's Decisive Strike and off he goes again. We reach a T-wall/T-wall jungle gym and begin to run through it. I manage to trick him with the stain and hit him again fairly quickly but MoM activates and saves him from the down. I begin to chase_again_ but generators pop and Adrenaline heals him back up to full.
This is insane. This could literally be 3/4 survivors every match with one dedicated saver running Borrowed Time. Second chance perks are not fun to play against and cripple the design and economy of the game. The above does _not_ need to stack.
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My biggest issue with the Plague's power is it doesn't encourage the survivors to cleanse on it's own. What do I mean by that? It's mechanic effects are no worse than taking No Mither and it's drawbacks can leisurely be dealt with _when the survivor wants to_. Bad at loops? Go cleanse. Good at loops? Don't bother. It also doesn't help that many of her add-ons are cross purpose with each other, buffing only one aspect of her power and the ones that buff Corrupted Purge are completely controlled by the survivor team's willingness to cleanse.
Here is what I would do to help the Plague -
Vile Purge - Infected also causes Exhaustion after being in the Broken status for 30 seconds.
Add-ons -
--- Black Incense - Survivors' Auras are revealed to you for 5 seconds when they vomit. Corrupted Purge now applies Infection.
--- Severed Toe - The Infection time on objects does not have a duration. When a survivor Cleanses themselves at a Pool of Devotion all Infection on objects is removed.
--- Limestone Seal - Slightly increases the infection time on objects. Infected Survivors cause an action speed penalty of 1.5% per a survivor.
--- Haematite Seal - Moderately increases the infection time on objects. Infected Survivors cause an action speed penalty of 3.0% per a survivor.
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Huntress is bugged due to the way servers are currently working. The server is showing the hatchet as hitting twice, leading to a one shot down. Could be anywhere on the body as the Survivor hitbox doesn't even have a head.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/445260#Comment_445260
To clarify that previous post, there's not really a situation where that would make a difference before or after the update.
If you use it to injure a Survivor and then catch up, they would get a speed boost, the time you'd need to catch up, and then your fatigue time combined to get to the next loop.
If you use it just to catch up to an already injured Survivor, they would get the time it takes you to catch up and your fatigue time combined to catch up.
If you're already in a loop, you're a silly goose and using the power objectively wrong. This wouldn't have worked before or after the update, by design.
In any of those cases, the Survivor would have plenty of time to get to the next loop, even before the update. The Legion's power is not made to catch up with and then regular hit Survivors. You would essentially just have a far more powerful version of the old Frenzy if you could.
Since the PTB has started what is the % of players who have gone to the dying state because of Deep Wounds?
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/445285#Comment_445285
We have as much variety as the players let there be.
Considering the survivor teams I normally see it's Nurse and Hillbilly.
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Good to see even with elongated healing time the four man Self Care is alive and well.
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Doubtful. Most killers are either power dependent or basic systems dependent. Killers like the Trapper, Clown, Doctor, Pig, Shape, ect deal with the game's normal mechanics and lack the mobility to cover the map and move survivors around. I sort of wish there was some sort of baseline mechanic to help those killers, like an out of chase large movement speed increase so they can actually get from point A to point B.
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@GrootDude said:
@AlexAnarchy he said survivors shouldn’t always have a chance so I said should it be a 1v1? That would make survivors not have a chance.
Cote said in an interview the game's early design was as a 1v1. This was before other killers, perks, ect.
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I don't suggest any of them. Hillbilly and Nurse are all you really need.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/445226#Comment_445226
With that being the case, we're now talking about a scenario where:
- The Survivor is already injured, you don't need to hit them
- You used Feral Frenzy to catch up to them and then canceled it
The most likely situation for this is if you were using Frenzy to injure them, then caught back up before cancelling it. If this is the case, the would have gotten a speed boost from the first hit which would allow them to easily get to a pallet or window.
The only other situation is where you would for some strange reason use Frenzy to catch up to them when they're already injured and then cancel it. There's not really any sense in doing so if they're already in the open, since they have no pallet to use on you. It makes even less sense if they're already in a loop since they would be able to loop back around to the other side by the time your fatigue is over (in both scenarios).
The scenarios where this predicament is actually going to be detrimental to you are very, very slim (if not non-existent). The amount of time you're going to save by closing the gap 50% faster in loops heavily outweighs the slight amount of time you'll be fatigued.
You seem to be missing my point. Legion at his very best is a two hit killer. Being unable to down a survivor prior to the survivor reaching the next looping spot is basically the tale tell sign of subpar killers and why Killers who are a threat during the looping phase of the game are considered stronger. All the Legion's mobility means nothing for him in the looping phase as he can't down anyone during it with his power. Using his power for mobility results in a stun worse than a pallet or the NURSE. So he has all the weaknesses built in of the normal two hit killers but also lacks in the highs that are normally possible with other two hit killers such as Trapper's traps, Plague Broken, or Hag traps. It's a jack of all trades killer who fails at any individual role and doesn't stand out. He needs a niche and the current PTB version doesn't have one.
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@Watery said:
Personally, I don’t see this issue. The aura makes it easier to track the survivor you originally chased, and can be easily countered by exposed/one shot killers.
MoM’s perk is a one time thing. I don’t think it’s worth running if it only nets one extra hit.
Even if the extra hit is annoying— MoM’s drawback is too great to ignore. Similar to DS? Yes. But is there some level on counterplay? Free tracking of a survivor. As a survivor and killer main, it’s frustrating, yes— but it’s benefits are outweighed by its cons.
Heal to 99%, stop. Wait until you actually get in a chase and the killer knows where you are, heal 1%, wow what a draw back.
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@Peanits said:
While it initially makes sense to compare it directly to the live version, there's a little more to it than it seems. The fatigue exists to ensure that the Survivor can get some distance after feral frenzy ends. This is crucial, otherwise the Killer could catch up at 5.0m/s (previously ~5.28m/s), cancel frenzy, and then instantly down the Survivor. With that in mind, we can do some quick math. We'll also have to count the speed at which the Legion moves while fatigued.
(This is assuming you're not hitting the survivor and giving them a speed boost, since that would be silly. For simplicity's sake, this also assumes you are exactly where the Survivor is when you hit them, which obviously won't be the case, you won't be inside them.)
With a 1.75 second cooldown, the Survivor will gain:
(1.75 * 4) - (1.75 * 2.7) = 2.275m
With a 3 second cooldown, the Survivor now gains:
(3 * 4) - (3 * 2.7) = 3.9m
The difference:
3.9 - 2.275 = 1.625m
The Survivor is getting 1.625m more distance than they would before. Not a huge amount, but let's not write it off. The important part is how long it takes you to close that gap. (Again, for simplicity's sake, we're going to assume that you need to be directly on the Survivor to hit them. This more or less makes up for the assumption we made before.)
At 4.4m/s, you will close the 2.275m gap in:
2.275 / 0.4 ~= 5.7s
At 4.6m/s, you will close the 3.9m gap in:
3.9 / 0.6 = 6.5s
In total, you're only taking 0.8 seconds longer to catch up to the Survivor than you are in the live build. It's not a very significant amount of time, especially once you factor in the time you'll save being able to run loops at 4.6m/s.
In short, while it is slightly weaker than before, it's not significant when you take the movement speed into consideration.
Most maps aren't corn fields. Dead Hard only provides a short amount of movement but it's often enough to reach the next looping spot. Right now Legion is lacking in mobility because of his long stun. It's gotten to the point on the ptb that I've taken to to just double stabbing the survivor with a button add on because it's faster than the stun.
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@GodDamn_Angela said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/442476#Comment_442476
Yeah. They have said as much in some of their videos as well. They don't aim for Killers to be a certain power level (like they don't aim for new killers to be equal to x killer in strength) and instead try to make them fun to play.
Which is questionable. They should aim for both tbh.
Can't say that is even accomplished half the time. The Plague for example feels slow and clunky with needless down time in between uses of power.
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@Akuma said:
So Legion got finally 4.6ms. So yea if everyone is injured or still in Deep Wound (depends) obviously i will m1 him. dafuq? You remember the thing with FF hits wont down anyone right sir?
Legion is a perfect killer to add so many map pressure. Map pressure is: hitting survivor, downing survivor, disabeling survivor, hooking survivor or sacraficing a survivor. So when I have a 16 seconds long FF of course i go for another survivor because there are still 3 survivor bored. I had some legions on the ptb and everytime the legion just chased me or only one survivor except any other were in a 16 m circle around him they just got rekt beause those elgions wasted his full potential.
I mean it's so sad that many people dont understand how to play him right. And if that's not your playstyle you still have 14 other killers. And your beloved Nurse.
And sayin "oh, player can play killer like they want" yea that's right. But this ends by cheesing, or griefing or exploiting things the developers obviously didnt wanted. Like all thos butthurt Piggis how were so exciting cheesing players in the endgame with an awful built. Hoping that they get all sacrificed by the endgame collapse. This is just one examble were playin like you want stops. And im pretty sure hitting a survivor, than catching him up, break up FF to kill him after 2 the ridiculous short stun. Or those moonwalking Legions in the live build. No one can tell me "yea if i love to play this way because it works and when it works it's obviously intended!"
You guys. I will play legion till im dead because he's soo good now, he's now my most favorite killer if the devs let pass him this way into the live build. If you dont understand him or do not like his playstyle then git gud or play another character.
What map pressure? Deep Wounds? It's a glorified Mangled, a benefit you can get from a perk and apply to any killer... Like say Nurse. Lets say you Frenzy into a chase. They jump into a locker. You now have to leave that survivor or cancel the Frenzy. A less than 2 second interaction rendered your power pointless. Then you get stunned for 4 seconds while they exit the locker and leap a window. Want to chase? Guess what, power is on a 20 second recharge that you lose if you actually catch up and them before it fully recharges. And there is usually a locker per a wall section on most maps.
Oh look, you can double tap survivors now with the button add ons to apply status effects like Broken! Only, it's 60 seconds, you had to cancel your Frenzy to start the effect and it will most likely have no impact on the game whatsoever. The Legion is hot garbage right now with the Wraith being a superior killer.
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@The_Bogeyman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/442244#Comment_442244
He was fixed. Your new Legion is now in an acceptable state.
Has to be trash to be acceptable? Oh joy. You must want Wraith nerfed as well.
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@MrDardon said:
The fact that you get a free first hit with Legion makes them better than some 115 % Killers. Trapper is the worst Killer in my opinion. He has only 6 traps but there are a few more loops than 6. Also, if you put your traps only on loops, you already lost
Clown is ######### in pressuring gens and the map but good in 1v1. Being good in 1v1 doesn't help the Clown in any way because there are 4 Survivors.
Wraith is the best of those 3. He can snowball all Survivors, juggle and pressure alot with the right addons. He has no special power in chases, but his speed burst can shorten loops or force pallets a bit.
Pig and Doc are the biggest ######### right now, not far away from Trapper.
I have to play new Legion on my own first, but I think they're still better than some other base Killers. Still, Wraith still has a reason to ######### on Legion since he is better than Frank.
Been on the PTB. He brings nothing to the table that any of the other three couldn't of done expect he can vault pallets. Deep Wounds is a built in Mangled effectively but he lost most of his chase pressure for it. Wait until you Frenzy, the survivor jumps into a locker, you are forced to cancel or wait it out, suffer a 4 second stun, then over the window they go while you lose all side vision. Wraith is better than he is now, least when he uses his power they don't hear a terror radius approaching and he can down with it.
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At this point I'm starting to wonder why not just reframe the game's concept to a survival of the fittest style game, where the game ends at 3 dead survivors and whoever is left automatically escapes as the "Champion" of the match while changing the killer's goal from 4/4 to 3/3.
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All these threads popping up about how great 115% MS is and how much it is helping the Legion. Really?
If you play survivor mostly each time you try out killer it's a refreshing change of pace with new mechanics. If you play killer mostly you learn each of their glaring weaknesses. Most people don't really play killer, even at 500 hours there are many on say the steam forum who haven't hit their 1000 kill. That is 200-300 matches, not particular hard to do.
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He does nothing special that most of the rest of the Killer cast can't do. His only unique feature is that he vaults Pallets and the Nurse just flat out ignores them, with a quicker cooldown, less stun, and the same damage. Deep Wounds as a mechanic is just... Bad now. It contributes nothing to the match that say Mangled doesn't, which you can gain from a perk or add on. He is like the jack of all trades killer with a bit of tracking, a bit of delay, a bit of mobility, ect but he is inferior to any killer who excels at the role and has more importantly lost his killer fantasy in the rework process.
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@Arroz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/442482#Comment_442482
Will this be fixed?
It's Behavior, so maybe? If not now half a year down the line.
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They want the killers to have power and abilities so they get to DO THINGS. However, they can't have the killer's power DO ACTUAL THINGS that have a varying time of resolution. Hillbilly chainsawed you, the Devs know the pick up time, the average travel time, and the average save time. The Pig's Beartraps have a maximum time but since it has an element of randomness on which box will save you they want to remove it's ability to DO ACTUAL THINGS.
Honestly, if they hadn't already tested it and seen it abused I'm sort of surprised we didn't see "While hooked within the Terror Radius of the killer the progress bar stops".
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@Peanits said:
Freddy has been in the works for a few months now. All that comment says is that he's not yet in a state that we're ready to share. As mentioned in the Developer Update earlier this month, we'll be sharing more information about Freddy in May. That has not changed. We have not promised that Freddy will be playable next month, we only stated that we will have more information on him.
Did the rework involve new art assets for the character in any major way? Current Freddy is substantially visually boring.
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Not only do they not want killers to kill but killers earn 1/2 the Bloodpoints for most scoring events during the collapse. Survivors hanging around looping you and you happen to down one? Congratulations, you get screwed in Bloodpoints because of the our shiny, new, badly designed Collapse!
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Depends on what you are running. Using Buttons? They want you to hit Deepwounded targets so you get the old score generally. Not? You get less.
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Who cares? Devs will just gut it and leave it.
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@PiiFree said:
It doesn't matter if those changes are live or not.
Solely the fact that they consider that proves how little they know about their own game.
Maybe they should take a complete break from development for 2 weeks and spend the time actually playing their game and get to Rank 1. I'm sure this would help them to understand the core issues.
Until then... This will never change.
Agreed. We don't need more pointless development done going in the wrong direction. We need focused developers who know their game and what it needs on a mechanical, audio, and visual level. Right now we keep missing all three.
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@Tru3Lemon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/426111#Comment_426111
You know whats toxic killers that tunnel camp and hit you while youre on the hook
If the devs don't want people to tunnel then Unhooking should cause healthy survivors to lose a health state and give the Healthy status to the unhooked. Every design of any perks that has come out to help with "tunneling" is to create traps that the killer does not know about going into the situation. They can't make the choice to not tunnel on an educated basis so they go for the one that is percieved to be the easier down. What needs to be done instead is to make the Unhooker the easier down to encourage the killer to switch.
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@Tru3Lemon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/439656#Comment_439656
I do like the boost points it give more bp i dont know whats the problem with that since killer get alot more bp than survivor and with bbq its like having double BP event and the end game dosent mean that needs to be on killers favor they did put it so survivors dont staying near exit door forever but i do think that 3 minutes its alot maybe 2 minutes its ok
Killers also need to buy their addons. If after a match it gave out a brown, green, and yellow random addon for just playing I don't think I would complain. Losing blood points for something you can't really control with most killers does not feel good to play.
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Don't forget survivors earn more bp during the collapse while killers earn less.
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@KillermainBTWm8 said:
Gutting of legion was bad but then you add pig then you take into account MoM it doesn't personally affect me that much for some reason but it still is bad game design does the Freddy rework even exist it's like the freddy rework is a dangling piece of hope that they just dangle in front of us just to make sure we stay but in reality never give it. Their lack of communication recently has also been upsetting bugs taking soooooo long to fix. You could say well Endgame collapse was a buff but I am at the point where I think it might actually have just been a setup so they could nerf endgame perks like remember me and pig then say it's because it would have been too OP. The thing about endgame too is it threatens survivors to be less altruistic over altruism happens a ton during the endgame and can reward you with a boat load of kills. Then we have the RBT nerf where it is as useless as deep wound because it's timer doesn't click down as long as your in the terror radius lmao. I am about to go back to F13 it may be dead now but I have enough friends to fill private matches. Way more fun too.
Not really. Survivors earn double for most actions during the collapse. It's a blood point blowout for them there. It also halves most killer rewards. You get punished in blood points for the survivors doing generators. It's so bad.
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Like the Plague notes.
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@Trikset said:
Nobody that ever possessed a position of power over another ever released it willingly.
But as thermo dynamics and entropy are hard wired into the fundamental building blocks of the universe there is sadly no escape from the harsh inevitability that is change.
The best way to combat this? The only thing that in a round about way is immune to this unbending law of physics? Change. Be malleable enough to go with the tides of destruction and re-creation and you'll pull through.
Unless you hit a black hole.
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New Legion is as bad as I thought it would be.
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Why go through all this effort when all that was needed was a concede button? The game is actually worse for the effort. Behavior, what the hell?
- Ground during End Game Collapse now actively hides scratch marks.
- Pig's power is completely worthless during the Collapse for no good reason. It's not like the jigsaw boxes magically turned off.
- Remember Me was nerfed while exit gate opening speeds was buffed. Why? Leave Remember Me at it's old duration and buff Wake Up instead of improving exit gates in general.
- Legion was taken out back and shot. Again, for no good reason. It's like every step Behavior takes it's four back. Definitely not a cut once, measure twice company.
- Actively continuing the play as a Killer during the End Game Collapse has everything punish you for your actions. Down a survivor? Slower timer. Hook a survivor? Slower timer. Close the Hatch? Start the Gates. It feels like now that not only do you have to deal with a team of survivors but the world itself is out to get you. WHY? It's the survivor team that should be feeling that at this point and _want to leave the map_. The system actively allows them to not. And people are going to quickly catch on that the End Game Collapse just isn't worth it and not close the hatch. You made something less desirable than the hatch stand off. Congratulations.
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I don't get the nerfs to the Pig. What is wrong with asking the survivors to go find the key? At the end game there are more jigsaw boxes than 3 generators to get to that point. Especially if you are going to stop the trap within terror radius. It's like Behavior doesn't really want the survivors to interact with the killer's power unless that power puts them into the dying state. Why?
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Bad changes all around.
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@Coriander said:
I'm still in that "stick to the gen, hide from the killer" phase of DBD. I like doing gens. I like the sounds, the animations, and while I understand many of you are really sick of it, you do have to keep an eye out for the killer, some of whom can approach without noise or visual models. Unless you know that it's a killer who cannot stealth OR that the killer is chasing someone else, you're never safe.
I'm sick and tired of the Wiggle/Struggle mechanics, especially when they're tiring and wearing my equipment. I don't want to add more things like that, especially to something you're stuck on for minutes per game, like generators. I'll take second objectives like gathering parts over more mini-games.
Rebind wiggle to the scroll on the mouse. Save the buttons.
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@AlexAnarchy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/434632#Comment_434632
You mean that tournament where they lost against the russian team who later on admitted to lagswitching in order too win but the devs stll let them win?
This is kinda something the entire community from when that tournament happened knows unless ofc your someone who's purposefully not knowing in order to fit your argument.
I think they are referring to the tourney where Marth reached the hatch before the survivor and thought he had won by the tourney's rules. He hit the survivor, she took the hatch, and then suddenly the rules were changed to force a loss on Marth's team.
You know, the official one that Behavior had a hand in.
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I'd argue at least 1/4 is pretty toxic.
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Honestly, dropping pallets early is good in the Spirit Fury/Enduring Meta.
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I could for 2000 dollars. So many other games out there. Or hobbies.
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@lordkaz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/435911#Comment_435911
Without a doubt, I expect people will play Pig in the PTB. People want to see how the End Game Collapse works with using her traps at the end with an end-game build.
I highly suspect the traps won't work.
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If you haven't seen the survivor hit boxes yet, think of it like a pole roughly as wide as an open trapper beartrap centered on the butt of your survivor. Hands and Head normally go through the hit box while it extends about half a bear trap behind the survivor.
Edit - Found it. Notice how the hit box is taller than Meg?
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Ignore the post game chat. It's pointless bravado 90% of the time from someone upset at the turn out. Use whatever perk you want, not like the survivors aren't, and play to win.
For dealing with SWF, normally they are highly committed to saving each other. They will swarm you to try to keep you away from their teammate or to prevent you from hooking him and will generally be aggressive in saving each other. Abuse this knowledge. Walk about 6-7 seconds from the hook and do a circle around the backside of the terrain facing toward the hook. Anyone waiting to save will be there. As a Hag you are really good at defensive plays as well as punishing primary looping spots. This means map knowledge is highly important for you and will come with time.
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If they want Deep Wounds to elongate a match have it work like this. Stabbing someone causes Deep Wounds as proposed by the listed changes except for...
Deep Wounds no longer has any timer. Instead, it acts as a state that must be healed before a Survivor can enter the Healthy state again. You can remove Deep Wounds _only_ by being healed by another survivor, 10 second action.
Why this? It forces survivors to group up which feeds into the Legion's tracking and his power. It hurts many current meta perks and eats more of the Survivor's time _than the killers_ which might mean a Killer would actually catch and release with the above power.
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Parts of the map being blocked off to create an increasingly smaller area to run/hide.
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@Dreamnomad said:
I was parsing some of the data from: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1qsLHWKqxw1jZB2Mrrffrb_IuuNXqHwhyEwQGbJPPAAk/edit#gid=0
It's a relatively small sample size, but in terms of which killers performed the best, these are the results:
Myers: 3 kills 3 escapes 6 games total 50% kill rate
Pig: 3 kills 3 escapes 6 games total 50% kill rate
Billy: 2 kills 3 escapes 5 games total 40% kill rate
Nurse: 4 kills 7 escapes 11 games total 36% kill rate
Huntress: 3 kills 8 escapes 11 games total 27% kill rate
Spirit: 1 kills 5 escapes 6 games total 20% kill rate
Lol, guess Myers and Pig are top tier =p
Makes sense. Nurse, Huntress and Spirit require a certain skill set to use well and not everyone is going to have that. Seems in line with what the devs gave us on the Killer stats last year, with Nurse curving upward through the ranks along with Huntress. Spirit hadn't been released at that time.
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@lasombra1979 said:
You get insulted, racist comments made to you, report them and be done with it. The support team is good at their jobs and those who behave in that manner are dealt with. I do understand where you are coming from, as I get deal with a ton of homophobic bs and my wife gets tons of misogynistic garbage sent her way. I just report it and move on. I would not feel better about playing a game if I got an alert that someone I reported was banned.
We don't normally see the action of the ban, therefore we don't know if our complaints are being taken seriously. Allowing people to get a bit of feedback makes that person more trusting of the system.