No Jason is not in need of a nerf nor OP, it's actually opposite
Saying this in a completely unbiased way. On PTS I had very little experience with Jason and actually first agreed with some players thinking "Yeah he's gonna need a nerf before launch" but after being able to play both against and as him more on the regular game no he doesn't need nerfing to please the bully SWFs.
For once in like 4 years those at BHVR actually made a killer almost perfect on its release, the perks are decent and all have good uses, though I think that Scared to Death shouldn't be a HEX perk. I also think there should be a small increase in the scrap piles on some larger or more complex maps.
But as for nerfs what the hell is it that needs to be nerfed? You mean being able to counter some of the pallet looping meta? That seems to be a goal for BHVR with some of its recent killer designs. Maybe getting a free hook spike every time he hooks a survivor is understandable, perhaps that should be made an add-on rather than base kit. And that reminds me, his add-ons some of them are surprisingly pretty good while some are of course garbage or too high of tier for what they offer.
His ability to kill survivors who have been impaled with spikes seems to have gotten some survivors mains a little heated (and not just from his mori animation) this makes him the 5th (I think) killer in the game with an ability to kill survivors, the others being Pyramid Head, Myers, The Lich/Vecna and The First. Seen some claiming that should be toned down on how he should be able to kill though none have provided a real valid reason, most reasons/excuses just being in summary his design hurts their loadouts and they don't know how to crouch or dodge. Most valid one I can sort of side with is some comparing his spike throw to The Huntress and should have a range nerf, however I still disagree and think that's just coping from some. If anything I think the ability to stick survivors to walls needs to be tuned a little to where they can be stuck to other various props and not just flat walls as I've already seen and experienced a number of incidents where survivors hit with spikes were knocked against props and items such as boxes, rocks, cars, vault points and they weren't stuck to them. If gonna get the most out of this killer's design they really should patch that so it applies to more objects than just solid walls.
If anyone killer or survivor main can provide some good arguments with proof on why Jason needs to be nerfed in any way I would like to hear them, but I don't see anything really wrong or OP with this killer and think whoever has been designing some of the killers' abilities at BHVR lately deserves credit.
Comments
Generally i just want a longer cooldown and im perfectly fine, i feel he gets barely punished for spamming power. killer main here
But what sort of cooldown you proposing? He's armed with one spike and then has to reload at a hook (which temporarily breaks it) or at a scrap pile. Referring to his main ability Omnipresent Evil? The cooldown for it is already painfully long for some situations, maybe the jumpscare range could be slightly nerfed maybe so it doesnt travel through walls or upper/lower floors but dont need a cooldown increase.
Alright…i can see that, what you just proposed could be better actually.
Maybe your voice is a minority here but i agree. I've been playing with him non-stop and against him and i've never felt that his power is too oppressive nor it is OP.
One of the biggest issue this community have is when a new killer is release people try to use old strategies against them with little to no success. I firmly believe some people are just going to pallets or windows during Omnipresent Evil and getting surprise by Jason spawning right on top of them.
Give Jason two months and everyone will treat him like the mid killer he is.
I completely agree with this. Springtrap, Henry and now Jason are very well designed killers, fun to play as and to go against. Krasue was an exception but her PTB was a mess, so i understand her release issues.
How long of a cooldown do you want?
For context, here are the cooldowns of some killer powers:
Nurse: 6 seconds
Spirit: 15 seconds
Blight: 10 seconds
Hillbilly: 0 seconds (outside of the miss cooldown i guess)
Springtrap: 0 seconds (outside of the animation for coming out i guess
Do you know how long jasons is? It's 12 seconds.
My personal Jason nerd suggestion that doesn't affect him too much is the following: No mist on totems/lockers and don't put scrap piles inside of loops.
These changes aim to make Jason more punishing while still allowing him to be A tier. Essentially the first change stops Hex: Jason as it punishes survivors for using his counterplay if the Jason uses Ruin, the part referring to lockers is because of the fact that many new players I play with and against think they can hide in lockers during his power as there is no indicator that they are revealed either fix this or add an indicator of red mist imo.
The second change is to simply stop Jason from getting extremely fast two taps on certain tiles where the Jason can get an easy hit then immediately follow up with a second spike without having to go out of his way to reload like other killers. I would prefer if these were instead Inbetween loops
Nothing too big just makes counterplay less complicated in certain scenarios and slightly more punishable
Hot take, any discussion on whether a new feature is too weak or too strong is moot as long as the core issues of the game are present.
I mean yeah the game has many issues however its pretty balanced compared to past versions. In the end I think its good to get feedback on new features while they're still in the devs mind, rather than someone forgetting to put a key mechanic into the perks/powers wording that was then added later once they've realized.
Why are we throwing racist and homophobic slurs around because of a video game, it cannot be that deep..
its a great day for the forums isnt it eh?
If he gets any nerfs, I personally think he'd just need a maybe 5-10 second longer cooldown on omnipresent and maybe shorten the haste, but thats about it cause whilst his teleport is strong (counterplay is easy for this as well) he still has the same problems other ranged killers do, like power becoming nigh useless the second you're at a highwall.
You're comparing him to the strongest killers in the game as though that's how all killers should be but, aside ftom Springtrap, they're also killers that do only one thing. Compare him to other killers that have more going on, especially ranged ones with traversal.
Henry's Undergate has a 35s cooldown, he can be seen and heard while in it and he remains 4.4 with no free haste and no KI.
Vecna's fly has a 20s cooldown, flight of the damned is 30s, dispelling sphere is 30s, mage hand is 35s.
Unknown has a teleportat cooldown of 40s and its locations are much less available, as well as dispellable.
Dracula only has a 3.5s shape-shifting cooldown but the bats are very loud, very visible, and can only perceive scratchmarks and sounds.
OE puts all of these traversal abilities to shame and has a much smaller cooldown as well as infinite duration, free info, and no way to know where he is if there's no grass on the map.
Also, Sprintrap's axe takes 10 or more seconds to recall. He can't just grab another and keep tossing them. Comparing him to Springtrap in any way except to show that Springtrap has been power crept is just wild.
I don't find it to be balanced at all. The cheesiest stuff is still in the game, unchanged. All we've lost along the way is fun and autonomy. Stronger Killers enforce cheese, which amplifies how unfun the experience is. So it's pointless, in my opinion.
You're talking against a wall sadly, at the same time I'm at a 34 games winstreak by now with hatchescapes so I don't know. He will probably get a nerf to his movement I assume, but I hope they let his spikes alone, because they are great :D
That's a reasonable and fair nerf. But like man other people on this forum want to heavy nerf him they wanna remove his haste, all OE info he gets, make his spear more punishing in getting and throwing like their trying to skull merchant him be more fair and reasonable people sheesh.
Jason has terrible game design. I don't feel like writing much because the developers don't care about it, either. The power creep is insane, and I'm honestly tired of people trying to defend every new overpowered slop killer that comes out.
I don’t think the devs are incompetent or that they don’t care. I think Jason is exactly where he needs to be from a marketing perspective right now.
He sells the DLC, creates hype, and keeps people talking. From a gameplay perspective, I fully expect him to get the usual treatment in the next month or two. Whether people here defend him loudly or not, I don’t think that is going to change anything. His adjustments are coming.
Jason should be the pivot point in which all killers are balanced, and if you think jason is a problem then those other killers need nerfs too. You don't get to say "you are comparing him to the best killers" yes, i am, if those killers aren't getting nerfed then why are we nerfing a killer that is worse than them?
Blight just got nerfs and he's getting more. People have wanted Nurse nerfs forever and it may happen, but these two aren't the same as Jason. They both take time to learn and are unmanageable for many. They also only have singular abilities. Jason (and Ghoul) are easy mode, Nurse and Blight aren't.
If every killer is A+ or S than the game is unplayable. You do have to have enough people willing to sign up to be stomped every match. There are only so many masochists. I'd never play survivor again if this happened, and you might not finding winning all your matches boring, but I would, and so would many others.
Some people do like simple killers, and some people like skill-based ones. Not everyone wants their mains to be braindead like Ghoul and spam city like Jason, or to be 5 killers bundled into one. I certainly don't want my preferred killers to be buffed into the sky because one ptw killer was released.
This is how I felt during the ptb. It was pointless to resist. The fanboying and desire for easy wins dominated the conversation.
I play both killer and survivor and I agree that Jason is in a good spot power wise. But I think there are a few things that could use some adjustment:
Yea these adjustments would technically be "nerfs", but the purpose isn't to nerf Jason. Just pointing out interactions that feel strange from a gameplay perspective. When I first encountered them, my first reaction was "that looks like a bug". If these are intended, I think there's still room to make them feel more intuitive and natural