Can we stop letting Survivors benefit from Killer powers?
Wraith can be light burned, Clown's yellow bottles can make Survivors faster, and now grabbing the banner/standard from the Knight gives benefits.
Wraith can be light burned, Clown's yellow bottles can make Survivors faster, and now grabbing the banner/standard from the Knight gives benefits.
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It definitely feels to me like BHVR is moving in a direction where killer powers are net neutral or even detrimental to the killers until addons are applied.
Any buff given to survivors for free is not trivial.
So you've never had to use a yellow at killer shack or something to get someone, which is what survivor mains say to do that makes Clown "OP" in chase?
The point being it shouldn't even be a possibility that it can happen. Why would we want to give THE SURVIVORS a speed boost?
Lightburn is counterplay aka a free handout for survivors to use.
Really? So only bad Clowns have accidentally given survivors the speed boost? What about needing to use 2 yellows and 2 purples at a loop, "And that will make any loop unsafe vs Clown"? There's never a risk that they get the yellow? I just don't accept the idea that the problem is the killer messing up, and not the fact that the yellow speeds up the survivors. You're blaming the player over bad game design.
Just take what you learned from the flag, and apply that to all the other killers.
Let me list it in case anyone's wondering, all the counterplay survivors are given by the killers' powers.
Trapper: Traps can be disarmed.
Wraith: Lightburn. Massive slowdown from uncloaking. Massive stun from getting stunned out of cloak. Loud approach sound.
Hillbilly: Overheat from using his power "too much." Massive stun from bumping.
Nurse: Lightburn. Big fatigue coming out of power.
Myers: Survivors can phase through him while stalking. Can max out on stalking someone.
Hag: Lightburn traps.
Leatherface: Overheat from using his power "too much." Massive tantrum from bumping.
Freddy: Abilities only work in dreamworld. Clocks/snapping awake/failed skill checks keep survivors out of dream. Slowdown from placing snares.
Pig: Headtrap key can be found in 1st box. Massive slowdown/loud roar when going into dash attack.
Clown: Yellow bottles can speed up survivors.
Spirit: Gives survivors directional phasing sound.
Legion: Big fatigue coming out of power. 5-hit down virtually impossible after someone is out.
Plague: Cleansing fountains which also all get replenished once all are used.
Ghost Face: Massive reveal hitbox, revealed behind walls, and revealed by slugged/hooked people. Hits take away stalk.
Demogorgon: Portals can be destroyed. Map-wide roars when using power.
Oni: Map-wide sounds when using power.
Deathslinger: Breaking chain. Survivors caught onto obstacles stop coming closer. Sluggish zoom-in. Ringing that plays when Deathslinger is aiming on a survivor.
Pyramid Head: Saving someone from a cage removes Tormented.
Blight: Has to bump first before attacking. Big fatigue using/coming out of power.
Twins: Victor killable from successful attacks and misses. Victor can be held hostage. Victor attack cooldown. Very slow transitions.
Trickster: Far-reaching lullaby. Knives dissolve automatically.
Nemesis: Speed boost from just infection. Sandbagging/stunnable/killable zombies. Cures in boxes. Crouching behind any obstacle completely trumps hitbox.
Pinhead: Box shown map-wide to all survivors. Teleporting to the box resets the chain hunt anyway. Big cooldown on successful hit/miss/cancellation with power. Chains instantly break on obstacles. Max 3 chains on a survivor. Bad/slow chain spawns.
Artist: Lightburn. Locker tech. Elevation. Birds' auras shown cross-map.
Onryo: Tapes take away TV for a long time + takes off 3 condemned. Loud approach sound.
Dredge: Lockable lockers. Destroyable remnant. White glow in Nightfall. Loud approach sound.
Wesker: Massive cooldown on vaulting over with/missing with/cancelling power. A ton of cures in boxes.
Knight: Hitting a survivor despawns the guard. Grabbing the banner despawns the guard and gives Haste/Endurance. Survivors can see the alert radius and spawning orb.
In addition to all this, each killer has massive counterplay, not due to their powers giving something to the survivors for free per se, but still something very obvious and exploitable.
my word choice was poor. more along the lines of "if you just didnt use your power then the survivor would be worse off"
the flag ACTIVELY BUFFS survivors, the other things are unnecessary downsides to the killer - does that make more sense? its what i was trying to say originally
and with clowns haste, while it does buff survivors - thats only if you make a mistake, you can play perfectly with knight and still give them a mini adrenaline
Im saying its very rare.
For example, I barely have anyone do locker techs with artist, or vault techs with wraith, but with bubba they really take advantage of lockers (even if it never works out for them)
I don't think it's even the burn stun, but how it prevents you from even blinking while you have the flashlight on you.
How is it different? You can play perfectly as Clown, but assuming you used your yellow bottle, they can get a speed boost from that as well.
But sadly yes, you are better off sometimes just M1ing instead of using your power, a side effect of nerfing "easy to use" killer powers.
The counter is to keep spam vaulting the same window/pallet so hes forced to uncloak. If you just keep throwing and W'ing against an invis wraith then thats just bad gameplay on the survivors part.
Light burn isn't really a problem since it's very difficult to pull off. Clown's yellow bottles giving survivors a speed boost is ridiculous though. And seeing how weak the Knight currently is with barely any buffs from the PTB, survivors don't need to benefit from his power either.
Yeah, Survivors sure needs a way to stop a power, but giving them a speedboost is dumb, why would I play a killer which helps survivors if I make a mistake. The benefits from Clown or Knights Power isnt really THAT good to justify this.
For the knight, grabbing the standard should only end the hunt early. It should not give them a haste effect. Though that is just my idea.
Or perhaps you can compensate the killer. Add a 3 second killer instinct effect to the survivor who grabbed the banner or perhaps if they grab the banner, shave like 2 seconds off the cooldown for his power.
Wraith is active camo'd practically all the time. If you can spot that and have a torch then you deserve to land a stun.he can clear so much distance and be stealthed.
If clown could self haste only himself as well as slowing only survivors then he'd be pretty insane. His power needs a downside, hasting and curing survs of intoxication is reasonable and rarely happens.
Knight, well idk what his balance will be like but survs need a way out of these chases with his followers.
Poor use of killer powers should benefit survivors. Its called a skill floor. Skill up or cry. like every game should be.
Is it possible for the game to have multiple counters
I do use the yellow bottle on shack ahead of time then throw a purple afterwards.
Otherwise, I do love when surivvor tells me that Clown OP where I respond by syaing "just pre-drop pallets! We hate those D:"
Of course not! Again, I have yet seen anyone use my yellow cloud for distance.
... because the power was misused, not because it actively buffs the other side for no sane reason. The penalty Killers usually have for misplaying is losing time or wasting resources. Not wasting resources and actively helping the other team escape.