What's the point of the Nurse?
Everyone DCs or suicide when Nurse is killer. I'm iridescent 3 and every game, someone just runs up to her, drops their item and follows her until she kills them. Is she this broken? I struggle juking her but I try to have fun with it. Does no body want to work to win anymore?
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For real, ever since nurse was re-enable I've been getting nurses in 70% of my games. She's different yea, but it gets boring seeing god nurses 6 games in a row. And that's aside from survivors dcing/suiciding in other games. Makes me not wanna play sometimes. ;-;
I don't know why people keep bringing up good or god Nurse players as if that matters in the slightest bit. There are good and god survivors, and all data proves they perform evenly against each other when actually matched up that way. Matchmaking putting good or god players against worse players does not mean something is overpowered.
If the player knows how to play the nurse, you cannot do anything. Also, some build are really broken with her.
Scourge + agittion
Starstruck + agitation
Starstruck + make your choice
etc...
Fun fact, there are players that also know how to play against the Nurse on an equal level. And actual evidence proves that said even match ups lead to ~2K average for the Nurse.
Come on now I escaped at least half the time against nurses and I only play Survivor drunk as #########, and without any meta perks aside from Kindred. Even when I do die to one I never feel like I had no chance, in fact generally I can point to exactly what I did wrong, and again, while drunk as #########.
Also starstruck only works if you're stupid enough to hang around the killer while they're carrying somebody.
If all of my time playing solo Survivor has taught me any one lesson, it's that people really like trying to make survivor sound a lot more difficult than it actually is. I'm not amazing. I don't study or practice. I pour myself a whiskey, pick survivor, and have a wonderful night. Frankly the biggest threat to solo survivors in this game is other survivors. I've lost far more games due to having teammates that don't know how to work as a team unless they're on a headset than I have to Killers who are so good that the outcome was inevitable.
I doubt it. People are throwing because they don't like the challenge.
Look at ANY complaint thread; the 'unfun' killers are always the ones who have a higher than 50% win rate. They are basing their fun on winning, not on enjoying the game itself.
So losing = unfun = nerf them.
I see more DCs aga8nst Pinhead and Legion than I do Nurse.
I got two people trying to argue with me - i apologize for saying that you accused me of straw-manning, it was PlaysByShady that did this, not you. An honest mistake.
I think we got off on the wrong foot and are having two different discussions about different things. Miscommunication.
II think we can all agree that - regardless of hypothetical, paper, or practice - The Nurse has the greatest POTENTIAL to down survivors if her power is used flawlessly.
This is the point I'm going towards, and it's the crux of what I was saying in correlation to satisfactory play.
There is no killer in the game, as of yet, who can reliably begin and punctuate 4 chases - 8 hits - on survivors in different locations within the course of 80 seconds.
And accomplishing these feats as the Nurse is a simple point and click. Binary. Get the hit or not.
Killers such as Blight, Demogorgon, Huntress, Cannibal, Hag, these killers CAN accomplish this. But in these circumstances, they are using their powers, there's anticipation and skill, and - moreover- there's time between abilities.
Nurse is, by far, the killer with the greatest mobility and pressure against survivors. I think we can all agree on that. She is capable of extremely lethal blinks and circumvents many aspects of gameplay that survivors otherwise could use to their advantage. This is not a debate, it's just the truth of her power.
I am not saying that she is outright more viable than other killers. I am not saying that other killers cannot get downs in such circumstances, nor am I saying that she is easy - or impossible to play against.
I am, however, saying that she is very strong - and the feast or famine nature of her playstyle mixed with the binary nature of her ability makes it less than an accomplishment to use than other killers in contrast.
Getting 5 back-to-back Huntress Hatchets takes skill and is a grand feat. Landing that long distance hatchet to predict a dead-hard is euphoric.
Perfectly timing a doctor blast to pacify a survivor to prevent them from dropping a pallet and securing a short chase is incredibly satisfying.
Using the Cannibal's chainsaw to catch up to a sprint-burst, and hitting them with the very tip of the final swing as they approach a vault - that is satisfying.
Getting a flick with the Oni's demon charge on an unsuspecting survivor, satisfying as hell.
Bouncing around and using glides and flicks to outwit a survivor as Blight is satisfying.
Tricking a survivor into a trap as the Trapper is satisfying.
Timing your chainsaw turn perfectly to instantly down a survivor in a tight loop as Hillbilly is incredibly rewarding.
Outwitting an opponent with Night Shroud as Ghostface is satisfying
Deducing a survivor's location from the environment and sounds to exit your phase with a deadly lunge as the Spirit is satisfying.
Pointing at the survivor and blinking on top of them. Eh.
Some people say FPS games are boring because it's 'just clicking on heads' . Nurse is similar in that way.
Sure, it may require skill to do reliably, there is a bit of anticipation.
But if you land on top of a survivor that doesn't have dead hard, you get the hit/grab. It's just that simple.
Nemesis requires timing and positioning, Blight needs to be deliberate with rushes, but blinking with the nurse is... cheap.
It always feels like I didn't earn it. I didn't need to predict the arc and velocity of a hatchet, i didn't skewer and reel a survivor, i didn't time my Hillbilly dash or cleverly cut off survivors with a Cenobite chain. I just... clicked myself over to them. Sometimes I don't do it right. But that's it.
it's almost as if the Huntress had hatchets with no parabolic arc or change in velocity - always straight all the time, and the hatchets went through walls. The time held determines the distance traveled. The skill becomes binary. Cover doesn't matter, location doesn't really matter. All that matters is if the Ghost Huntress misses or not. It's completely binary. If she is aware of your location, she can place a ghost hatchet where you are and injure you from a considerable distance away. In this silly example, hopefully you can understand when I mean there is a lack of satisfaction from a 'cheap' aspect. if Huntress hatchets worked this way - going through walls, floors, roofs, and all terrain - being perfectly accurate to the pointed location. Huntress would have an ability that was binary. it would be skill based, because you'd have to slightly lead targets.; But so long as you know where people are, you can hit them. The power - in this case - is a perfect power, but it is up to the user to miss and mess up. Huntress would be a LOT less satisfying to play like this, because in this case there is no legitimate skill to knowing her arcs and charge times - hitboxes - and having precision to thread obstacles with her power. You just point towards an enemy and let it go. It hits - or it misses. Binary.
Highly potent, extremely dangerous, circumvents the conventional style of play, and is nearly inescapable if executed in all of is beautiful simplicity.
But it's a human power. And humans are flawed, humans make mistakes, humans misjudge things.
She is not held back from her ability, she is held back from her humanity - and the ability to make critical mistakes.
This is the point I'm making.
NOT that she's unstoppable. NOT that she's broken. NOT that she can get hits in the open when other killers cannot. NOT that I hate her oooh I hate her or anything like that.
Her power is SIMPLE and it is almost PERFECT. It basically cannot, by its own merit, fail.
It is a binary power. You either used it right, or you didn't use it right.
If you used it right, they are dead. If you didn't use it right, enjoy the fatigue.
Her ability isn't a complex mechanic or countered effect. It doesn't require anticipation or setup, it cannot be stopped by conventional means. It is a button.
It brings me no pleasure knowing that pressing a button correctly alone wins me the game. That there are no mind-games and only 'the button' - nothing else matters - and this is boring. And Ii believe there are many others on both sides who feel the same way.
We can disagree on many things. But Ii hope we do not have to disagree on the viability of the Nurse or the simplicity of her ability.
'The Nurse has the greatest POTENTIAL to down survivors if her power is used flawlessly.'
I mean...That's how all Killer powers should work? They should require Killer skill over Survivor mistakes, because if a Killer power set requires Survivors to make mistakes instead; That Killer literally cannot win against skilled players who make little to no mistakes.
I agree with all of that except where you are taking survivor agency out of the equation. What you are in effect stating is that every time I got away from a nurse blink, it's completely because they messed up, and I just don't buy that for a second. I could be reading that wrong, I've had a very long day
Yes.
. . .
This was a declarative statement. I'm glad you agree!
You are misunderstanding my friend. I'm sorry about your long day
This is not a discussion on how easy or viable her ability is.
A survivor can outsmart a nurse. A survivor can juke, spin, and duck a nurse - giving them the slip. Yes.
My point is not her perfection, it is not how strong she is, it is of how BORING she is within the context of her power's eloquence.
If I was the nurse playing against you, and you gave me the slip - I feel bad.
If I was the nurse playing against you, and I hit you - I feel bored.
If you were the nurse playing against me, and I gave you the slip - I feel bad.
If you were the nurse playing against me, and you hit me - I feel bored.
That is my point.
Not that getting hits is easy, not that survivors cannot outplay a Nurse, nor that there isn't an exchange between the killer and the survivor. Simply that she is unsatisfying.
That the simplicity of her ability and the perfection of its design makes her, fundamentally, completely boring when used correctly - and completely frustrating when used incorrectly.
Ok, that just sounds like you aren't enjoying the game as much, that sucks.
Thats a fact, people who don't acknowledge that and think its "all about positioning" are just facing bad nurses.
Just not the Nurse.
I find her to be poorly designed. But this is only my opinion.
Regardless of how I feel and what experiences I may have, I am glad that you can find joy where I, sadly, cannot.
The fact is sadly nurse is fair and balanced in term of objective statistics.
she seems way more OP than she did last year or so, did she get a buff i didnt see? I stopped playing for like most of half of 2021
I just played against 2 and we couldnt do a single gen, i remember having a blast running a nurse, but now it seems impossible, what changed?
When they fixed Nurse recently, Nurse's Blinks no longer reset their recharge progress when you blink. Previously, you could blink with 1.9 blinks, and end up with 0 at the end of your single blink. Now, blinking only consumes the 1, and the 0.9 will immediately refill upon fatigue. They pause while charging a blink, but you don't lose blink recharge progress.
It's because a lot of survivors refuse to solve the box before chain hunt activates then they get salty that solving the box is difficult
People won't be satisfied until the killers are not allowed to down a survivor and have to basically be a standing dummy
Pale Rose is the one of the worst maps I think no one really wants to play atp
I don't usually give up against a nurse. I do roll my eyes and say 'here we go again' knowing someone on my team or multiple people on my team are going to rage and d/c/put themselves on hook to get out faster.
I always try against them. Some people just hate certain killers or the mechanics of a killer and being caught regardless of being a good looper.
Also - if you come up against a god nurse, there really isn't much you can do. Ones that never miss, that always measure the distance perfectly, etc. But those are rare and the players that are that good on nurse know how problematic and oppressive she can be so they don't play her constantly.
That map and shelter Woods (mostly shelter Woods) have this problem of being horrible for both sides somehow. Most killers have to trudge their fat cankles just to try and create pressure on the large nap and the area is basically dead zone for survivors with looping
I kid you not, that map can somehow spawn less than 10 pallets. It's depressing tbh
You aren't wrong tbh. Gideon Meat Plant is already guilty of this sort of thing and it's disheartening to play that map.
Huntress also makes people pay at pallets. Trickster can also to a certain extent.
But to say 'they clearly want an easy 4k' if they bring in certain addons or perks, that's just laughable. Nothing is easy about her. A few screw ups or bad reads can make or break a game depending on the team. And be honest, what perks and items are you usually bringing in when you go up against a Nurse and end up just giving up? I don't use slowdown perks on her, but I understand if some do.
I just think people give up way too easily and don't want to do anything different. They want to run every single killer the exact same way and that's just not how it's done. You'd think at this point, people would stop camping pallets against Nurse and Huntress, but nope, just keep on camping those pallets. And then they rage quit when they get downed. Because it's the killer's fault they offered themselves up on a silver platter.
Stuff like that is a joke. I get being overwhelmed by a really good killer, but that can happen with any killer in the right hands.
In fact the range addons have actualy an hidden effect that is bond to the code and that is seemly not on purpose ... IT MAKES THE BLINKING SPEED PROPORTIONNAL TO THE RANGE INCREASE AND IS CLEARLY OP, but nurse isn't that eazy to fix and is quite annoying to code in my opinion ... So yeah range addons are busted... For now they are even stronger than the recharge addons... so just don't try it it is really too strong if you are good with her.
I played one game with the two range addons and got a 4 k at 5 gens with an endgame build ... and win quite easily the other games...
Agreed, happens to any killer I play. Even if I'm playing someone like clown or trapper, people still suicide on hook.
let's keep it real
I'm not a good killer at all, I'm ok.ish, I have plenty of games where I can't get even a 2k.
So I tried to play nurse and... I can't remember the last time I didn't have a 4k playing her.
I find her so broken that I don't really like playing her and the fact that I manage to kill everyone, even missing tons of blinks, I can't really defend her like some people here are doing.
Maybe it's because I don't know how to play against her? Maybe I never found a survivor who didn't know either? I don't what's wrong, but if I can 4k with nurse, anyone can.
That's a matchmaking issue, not a balance issue. She consistently performs evenly ~(2K average) when against people who are equally good.
Nurse is just another band-aid to pretend this game is balanced. Lets make a killer who ignores most of the core mechanics of the game and pretend everything is fine. Meanwhile if you play a basic m1, doesn't matter if you have 9000 thousand hours of experience, you get a ######### map and decent m1 lovers who just spread out, play safe and buttfuk gens and you can't stand a chance. Great design 👍️
I mean, a quick search on youtube for nurse gameplay from "pros" says the oposite, tho.
It's the one thing I don't understand about these MMR complaints. These content creators keep complaining about sweaty games, but then you go look their content and there's almost always 4k games. I won't name names, but I was at twitch these days watching this steamer getting 4k's left and right, every single game, he would only lose to hatch sometimes and I was really surprised when I saw him complaining about MMR these days on twitter.
What's the thing there?
The point of the Nurse is to remind yourself what a well-designed, balanced killer plays like before going back to awful M1 killers.
I mean, and I am an awful nurse
that one got hatch
You do realize there are very few good players right? BHVR addressed this themselves in the Q&A stream. There are not enough of them on in any region at any given moment to consistently give them even-skill matches. So the game puts them with lower skill players, so their queues don't take hours. Watching actual organized matches (competitive and non-competitive KYF) proves it. Also content creators can have stupid takes.
so, what's with the big wave of mmr complain?
If there's so few good players, why seems like everyone on social media says mmr is awful and how their games are sweaty and unballanced, and SWF this SWF that?
I don't get it.
Too few good player = too much bad players = most of the games should be easy
Right?
People complain about anything and everything.
The way people say it, seems like every game is awful hard with these awful SWF teams, and try hards this and that. I don't get that.
i support dc's/suicides against nurse. game was so much more fun without this constantly-gasping-for-air killer. i mean damn, look at her new meta perks, floods of rage/MYC, who the hell wants to play against that?
I guarantee that Nurse mains aren't going to be missed very much 😂
She will when survivors can’t find matches.
nurse mains have trouble with memory? there was an entire month when nurse got kicked out of the game, and finding survivor matches were quite easy and actually fun. but okay man, keep telling yourself that, been hearing that same old statement since 2017 😉
So you are a typical survivor main who complain about killer meta and plays dead hard, bt, ds and prove yourself ?
Or are you just not living in the same world as me ?
Because I find those perks so frequently that I vent my anger by try harding on nurse or blight....
Just to kill more since all survivor are killable in 3 hits ...
For me the only way to resond to the topic is by saying that the nurse is the strongest and 2nd hardest to master killer now and is desined to be lacking nothing and being the limit to the strenght of the killers as she should always be the number one.
sorry for triple post ...
That’s not what the player count says. It has dropped off a cliff in the last few months. And yes, finding matches was was easy because BHVR has (proabably) lowered the threshold for MMR, leading to horribly balanced matches. Then again, most of you survivor mains just want to stomp and bully killers, so I am sure it’s fine by you.
Because, Nurses aren't the ones dcing and sding at the start of the match. She has to be busted for people to exhibit this behavior. I want ppl to try but most people just quit.
For the same reason that Killers DC when they see a map offering they don’t like or friends playing together and claim it is broken.