Dead By Daylight Has Won
It's been almost 4 years and far too many hours, but I'm sorry to say that I'm not finding any enjoyment in DBD anymore. I realized it when I started panicking when I thought about queuing up as Killer and that when I found myself dreading playing Survivor. I have two friends who still play DBD (Survivor-only) and they'll probably get me to play with them. But I think I'm done playing on my own. For my own sanity, this is sort of my goodbye post. I'm not leaving the Forums or anything, I like a lot of you too much, but I don't think I can play the game regularly anymore.
I have....mixed feelings about the game. On the one hand, it has incredible potential. On the other, it will never ever reach that potential. The company behind the game (not saying Devs because I don't think they have any say in what actually gets worked on) has shown that they are all about monetization. This was made most clear in the NFT incident in 2021. The game has always been a revolving door of players. Until that changes (and eventually they will run out of players), there is zero incentive for the potential of this game to be realized. This can also be seen in the broken promise of 60 FPS on Xbox One and PS4. BHVR promised and it kept players playing and buying cosmetics and Chapters. That's clearly all they care about. Their absolute refusal to answer one way or the other about Console Optimization speaks volumes.
I think my biggest issue with this game is that what's fun for one side usually makes the other side feel like #########. To illustrate my point, I'll literally copy this post
538 votes and 105 comments so far on Reddit
"Concept 1: Humiliation DbD's gameplay is centered on humiliating your adversary. I would argue that every aspect of the gameplay is an act of humiliation, not competition, like you see in other games. The reward-based outcomes combined with asymmetric gameplay makes DbD uniquely painful to emotionally process both your losses AND wins. Let's look at the various aspects of gameplay:
Killer Humiliates
- Frustrates a survivor's ability to contribute to their team (social humiliation)
- Frustrates a survivor's ability to level up and earn points (reward-denial humiliation)
- Frustrates a survivor's ability to appear competent in front of their survivor peers (mild self-esteem humiliation)
Survivor Humiliates
- Frustrates a killer's ability to appear competitive and threatening in the game environment (social)
- Frustrates a killer's ability to level up and earn points (reward-denial humiliation)
- Humiliates the killer in post-game chat, something that while survivors aren't immune to, but have group social support resources to easily heal from (severe self-esteem humiliation)
Concept 2: Rollercoaster of Emotional Injury If a killer wins, but doesn't win "right" (camping, some glitch, lag, etc) they are deprived of their celebration by the survivors (survivor decides whether killers can celebrate, another humiliation). If a survivor wins, but everyone doesn't survive, the sacrificed survivor is deprived of joining in the celebration (the killer can take this opportunity to humiliate them). Through all of this, both player sides undergo extreme stress.
Killer Stress
Killers experience states of stress throughout the game: trying to find survivors, being evaded by survivors, losing track of survivors, and protecting hooks from survivor saves. Killers, at no point, have any moment of emotional peace or sense of "safety" from these states. The emotional injury ALWAYS ramps up in post-game end chat, and at the gate, where killers are ritualistically humiliated by twerking/circling/various taunts.
Survivor Stress
Survivors experience states of stress, too, with waves of calm: hiding, peacefully working on gens with their peers, being in the terror radius, evading, and being on the hook. Successful evasion and successful hides are followed by positive feelings of calm, while being chased is stressful, and being caught, hooked, and killed is a very substantial, large loss. A hooked survivor has disappointed their team, lost a huge amount of point potential, and been humiliated by the killer. Watch streamer facial expressions change when they realize they cannot be rescued and are dead, after a long match. There is pain in their face."
I've stuck with this game through thick and thin. I've watched as the 20 friends I had playing DBD dwindled to only 2. I can't keep playing a game that makes me feel worse for playing it. I don't even remember the last time I had fun playing this game. At best, it was "not horrible." I found myself talking to my remaining friends (and a party of 6 other players) about the success of DBD. Someone jokingly said they "hope it fails" and I found, rather disturbingly, that I agreed with them and so did the others. I don't know why I harbor that feeling, but it can't be good.
In short, I can't continue to play a game that routinely makes me feel worse and I can't continue to financially support a company that throws their weight behind NFT's and demonstrates they don't care about their playerbase past their wallets.
So, DBD, this is mostly goodbye (until my friends guilt me into playing SWF with them). It's been an interesting ride.
Comments
Added you :)
Truthfully, I haven't enjoyed it for a while.
I've just been pushing myself along with the hope that it's gonna get better.
For real. Just realizing what percentages and small nuts and bolts are discussed about, turned, dialed and patched in DOTA regularly, in order to balance stuff out.
Things like CoH, DH or Ruin/Corrupt wouldn't fly over there for so long. And yet we have some long-standing problems in DBD, that constantly burn out players of both sides, and even frustrate some of the communities best and most passionate players.
I know that people like Otz are "just some streamers" to most, but this people also have a passion for the game and such insights. I bet if BHVR implemented all his "my changes for every killer" and made it a PTB it would work much better then many of the arbitrary (seaming) changes we got in the last balance patches.
The community has many great ideas, yet nearly nothing of it gets realized. Tweaking the numbers should be something that should be done much, much more regularly, like every two weeks, and then furthet tweaked. You will never achieve a such balanced game, that every perk or option sees the same kind of play, but we got So. Many. Dead. Perks right now, that aren't just useful, not even in specialized or meme builds, and that's just sad.
That's what happened to me, until I finally just decided it wasn't worth it and quit.
I've lost most of my faith that the game will get better.
Yes.
I think most people wouldn't have an issue with bad changes (like Deathslinger's) if patches didn't come out once every 2 months.
Changing 10 perks and 2 Killers a patch was fine when there were 12 Killers. It's just not going to cut it anymore. The game has grown exponentially and the patch notes should reflect that.
You did indeed, man!
It's really sad to see you go. I only got into dbd in November by buying the Strange Thing's DLC before it was gone, and I have digging this game ever since, playing it nearly every day.
And while I don't have the big picture mode of having seen the game evolve over the years, even I have encountered so many problems and felt the killers burnout. I have never encountered another game that punished you so hard for playing good, like dbd. And if you voice your concern, the empathy-less parts of the community throw shade on you, stating that this is your own fault for playing so sweaty.
A lot of the problems could (properly) tweaked by playing with some numbers, but every change comes a long at a glacial and ponderous pace, and every now and then you get comically bad nerfs for already subpar and underplayed killers like Clown or Twins. It doesn't matter if a single add-on might be a bit too strong, look at the big picture, ffs!
But back to you. I have only been part of this community for a short time, but you stood out as a vocal, knowledgeable individual and I always perked up when I saw your name in one of the responses.
Take your time to sort out your problems. It sounds like they dig deeper then just taking a hiatus from this game, but if this game doesn't give you the kind of escapism that you need right now, then look for something else, at least for the time being.
Thank you
I do understand where you are coming from because I also got attached to that game and community somehow. If that is something good or bad we will never know, however I can ensure you that many old players go through this emotional rollercoaster.
It may sound weird but just like with ppl who can get sick and tired of each other (Married couple is an best example) or a toy for child that just drops it and forgets about it, dbd is also something that will fade and be less attractive by time. This applies obviously to every game aswell.
Just take it easy, dont be too rough on yourself and play something else or just take a break from the PC/Console. Thats the best advise I can give you, wish I could do more but well I am also only human in the end.
They have won, but the cost of losing you is too great.
They win, and everybody loses...
Welcome to the retired killers club 🎉🎈
We have BBQs with chili, puddings as dessert, and we like to play "put the tail to 🐷"
🤣😂
Now jokes aside, its good for everyone to either take a break or not play for a very long time if not having fun. Im a dbd player since 2016 and after playing 2200 Hours... with the current state of the game i don't find it entertaining anymore and its mostly an stressful boring experience.
I used to have neck pain, and it was because of DBD.. but not for playing long hours session because i only have 2200 hours in 6 years which is not much.. but because the game tenses your nerves a lot even if you play only 1 or 2 hours a day. So i recommend all to prioritize their health. I know that i won't play again until serious changes are made to the game but for the ones that are stubborn, if you are not having a good time anymore, just don't play or take a break, your body and mind will be thankful.
People want their game to be fun, if it isn't fun, they're gonna say something about it because they care. You're just negative
You too <3
I'll still play. I wanted to be honest, so I gave the honest answer. My friends play and I got them into the game, so I can't very well abandon them to it now.
I'll probably check out the Ring chapter, but I'm not going to be buying it myself.
I dunno, I'm nothing special, but thank you C3.
Hope things get better on your end, Pulsar. Just wanted to chime in and say that for 1 - you've definitely made the forums a better place in general. You are what I would perceive as a voice of reason in the middle of... usually a lot of unreasonable voices, to put it nicely. Major props for going to bat for console peoples
And for 2 - I can definitely sympathize with how you feel, on all those points. I've been playing on and off since 2018 but stopped playing halfway through the latest halloween event. I still lurk around the forums a bit because I can't help myself, but I'm feeling pretty great about my decision to stop playing. At this point, it's not even that I dislike the game, it's that I have absolutely zero faith that bhvr is either capable or willing to do the right thing on a lot of issues. I'm really looking forward to checking out some of these new asym multiplayer games to see if they'll scratch the same kind of itch
Anyways, I wish you well friend
First off, thank you.
Secondly, I'd like to try some of those games. Unfortunately, most of them are PC-only.
Yeah, that is a bit of a bummer that most are PC only. I will probably try hooking my laptop up to my tv and playing with a controller for VHS, but hopefully that eventually makes its way to console if it does well enough. Ash vs Evil Dead game should be out on console to begin with, although I get the feeling that's going to be delayed a bit longer
Right now, as far as console asym alternatives to DBD, there's not much beyond comp stomping in Evolve or White Noise 2. Although those can both be fun for a little bit here and there. I really could not get into the Predator game at all, for whatever reason
I played Evolve when it first came out, never could get into it.
I think VHS said they want to make sure their game works well on PC and runs well on Console before they release it. That seems pretty good to me.
I'm getting through Far Cry 3 and AC: Black Flag rn. After that, I might play Skyrim for the first time.
Do you always wonder, Pulsar, why the developers from BHVR didn't respond to your megathread?
I must be fair.
Mandy frequently checks in and has gotten several issues fixed, some temporarily some permanently.
I was really late to the party with Evolve, picked it up a year or 2 ago. I had some fun with it but it definitely takes some getting used to
Yep, it does sound like hellbent eventually plans to go to console when the time is right. I do really appreciate that they seem to be dedicating a lot more focus on quality rather than getting it out the door right away. Fingers crossed that it does well
Nice, I've not played those first 2 games but heard they were both really good. Ah #########, Skyrim is really easy to dump an absurd amount of hours into - I think you'll have fun with that. I still come back to it every once in awhile. I enjoy that you can set it to the hardest difficulty, then still make it through the game using nothing but fisticuffs, if you play all your cards right. Nothing manlier than literally punching a dragon to death
You are special. 💛
This is where I am with this game as well. I did just enough challenges to get the rift done and I didn't enjoy playing the game for the most part.
Thank you <3
I hear REsistance is a very nice this time of year. Or all time of year.
Don't cut yourself short, you've contributed greatly to the community, and many of us appreciate it. I am glad you're choosing to stay around on the forums. Many of us, myself included would miss you. Sorry the game isn't as fun anymore. I hope it gets better soon.
Thank you <3
i think that's were a lot of the problems and toxicity with this game root - being competitive in Dbd. I'm also competitive, right now i'm even playing in a tournament, but what i learned over time (and what i could see from comparing it to other games i played) is that this game isn't meant to be competitive or played solely to win, there is just too much imbalance even at it's core. There is so much RNG and power abuse from each side and people seem to like it like some strange masochistic urge. I'm not good at taking losses but Dbd makes it worse by giving me the feeling i get humiliated and that the other side often times didn't deserve to win, they just "wanted it more" and brought the better perks and items and add ons. I know that's not always true but this is the feeling many people get i think.
Honestly i'm reading stuff like this since i joined Dbd over 2 years ago. People quitting Dbd and making a thread about it exists since i joined the forums and i don't see anything special right now. I don't mind it and i get why people want to talk about it when it was a big part of their life.
But I remember when Ruin + Old Undying was a thing and everyone said survivors gonna leave and the game is dying. I remember when old Spirit and cheap Freddy was a thing, when maps got adjusted and later reworked for the first time and people said the game will die. The amount of times killer mains said "the game will die, all killers are leaving" in the past 2 years isn't even countable, like literally every chapter there was something people argued about. The arguments just get repeated every time. I remember there even were graphs and charts about steam players leaving like 1 year ago or so, turns out it was just a phase.
Yea the game lost some players recently but it's still on the level of 2020 and nearly on the level of the time afterwards. Maybe the spike in last summer was just a boost by RE fans who then left after realizing this game isn't even close to RE in terms of gameplay. Maybe its just a natural thing, when you're making changes to some 6 year old game which people got already bored of a bit, and the changes aren't that healthy (SBMM), then it's normal some players leave.
I'm in no way defending this game or BHVRs decisions but i would be careful with assumptions that this game is dying, i mean it could be but there were also many times were it came back stronger
My thing is that when there were player count concerns in the past, there was almost always a hype license around the corner and no competition on the horizon.
However, this time is different. Resident Evil was a huge failure, from a player retention point of view. We lost pretty much every player we gained during the Resident Evil chapter. Same with Hellraiser.
The Ring, especially the Japanese version of the Ring, is not really hype. It's cool, don't get me wrong, but it's nothing truly special to most people. I'm pretty sure most people think that Sadako is the Japanese knock-off of Samara, not the other way around.
Likewise, there's also some BIG games on the horizon. VHS is having their open beta, I think. The Texas Chainsaw Massacre game is floating around as well as the Evil Dead game. Additionally, out of market games like Elden Ring are going to eviscerate the games viewership on Twitch with many of the top content creators going to play it for a considerable amount of time.
In short, DBD needs an extremely hype chapter for anniversary to stop the bleeding, let alone recover these numbers.
Been around since the beginning. The game was a couple of times near the exitus. For example, Leatherface was rushed out (he had almost identical addons like Billy, despite being played completely different), because the a Lullaby in the Dark Chapter turned the playerstats upside down. David King was released with WGLF, which gave a 200% bloodpoint bonus back then. No one wanted to play killer, because as survivor you could easily earn more than double than what the killer earned. Also, everyone would farm the teammates, and after 4 stacks just give up. Survivor queues reached 40+ minutes back then. So they had to rush out Bubba with BBQ, so killers would have an equivalent in bloodpoint gain.
Later on the famous:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvRMd7aQ5v4&ab_channel=DeadByDaylightArchivesCaused an outrage in the community.
As @Pulsar said, the RE Chapter and Hellraiser chapters were a huge failure for different reasons. We had very little player retention from those. Hellraiser will now get his voice lines back and i guess that the devs are working on something about the RE Chapter, in order to fix things. Since there are no big franchises on the horizon, and the competition is building up. Behavior has to step up their game.
Inalidating someones lived experience/emotions just because you don't understand it isn't helpful. Ask them to clarify etc. Your comment comes off hella dismissive