NOED hate reasoning is wrong.
The biggest complaint about NOED is that it rewards killers for failing their objective.
However, protecting generators is not the killer's objective.
The killer's only goal is to prevent survivors from escaping. Protecting generators is a way to buy time towards completing the objective.
Many survivors think that when the 5th gen pops the trial is over. That is wrong. Especially in a tight match.
I will agree that in a tight match where maybe 1 or 2 people have been sacrificed and the last gen pops and it's a race to the finish, NOED popping sucks. And yes it sucks solo. And it may be needing a small change.
But, when you load in and the last gen pops within 4 minutes, you had both time to search for the totems, and game ability ti outplay the killer to find the totems.
Tl:Dr NOED doesn't reward killers for failing their objective. It allows them a final push to achieve the objective. Not gen defence, but the wholesale slaughter of baby dwights and blendettes.
Comments
back up where? in whining about noed? this perk has more counterpicks & counterplays than all survivor meta perks combined. If you, him or anyone else are incapable of using these counters, it is their problem.
Not to mention that devs are adding even more perks to help FINDING (which shouldn't be a problem for good players you guys claim to be) and destroying ALL totems.
Saying noed is problematic because in one of 100 games many coincidental things happen and you won't have any chance to deal with it is the same kind of argument as 4 man tournament SWF.
"1,9k hours" let's assume you played at least half of that time as killer which gives us 950+ hours of killer experience.
You know that you should be 3-4king almost every match with that amount of experience unless you deal with rare top survivors? It's pretty expected to win against most survivors, especially when you are playing noobstomper clown and 3rd strongest killer in the game.
2 other players, 1 is being facecamped.
and i have friends i play with, its the only time i ever play survivor anymore. there's kakashi, finn, and turbo when we team up. there's demon, sloppy, wijusa. there's boba, jackie, and jyn, the wholesome buddies who still manage to win. solves none of the problems.
no in being a killer main.
Not to mention that devs are adding even more perks to help FINDING (which shouldn't be a problem for good players you guys claim to be) and destroying ALL totems.
Solos shouldn't have to use perks, items, or add-ons to get information SWF players get for free. I've said that so much that my phone automatically types it but nobody around here ######### listens (or reads), apparently. Mother nature gave you some eyes, use them.
You are correct OP.
If the killer's objective was defending the gens the match would end with the last gen completed. Yes it is part of their emblems but its not a win requirement. You can still pip with all gens done so why some people see it as a lose is weird. It would be the same if the killer thought survivors lost because they failed an emblem even tho they escaped.
The big issue is some people think the killer has to earn or deserve the right to have Noed. Its a silly mindset. People rather say the killer failed to kill them before all the gens were done then realizing they didn't get all the totems. Noed is very easy to counter and there are so many perks and add-ons to assist with totems... Yet it is not enough.
Also people hate everything that stops them from winning in this game and if they lose it always someone or something else that is the problem. That is why the forms are filled with nerf posts and Noed is the number one culprit.
I actually like playing against NOED, but I understand what people are saying when they think it's unfair. 1.5k of my hours are put onto killer playtime, the other 500 being put onto survivor playtime.
If NOED wasn't a common perk it wouldn't be complained about as much, but here we are.
Also, Blight has counterplay, and most survivors I play against know what they're doing.
I miss the part where disbalance between solos and SWF is a problem of noed and not poor balancing of solos and SWF.
...okay...here we go again i hate doing this.
Generators take 80 seconds each at base. 80x5:400 seconds for all 5 gens.
Totems take 14 seconds each and theres 5 of them (72).
Lets say first survivor goes down in 30 seconds to bubba. START A TIMER FOR 120 SECONDS *bing* all 3 of those survivors say have 40 seconds left on their gens. 40 seconds pass: 2 gens left. Noones even done totems yet. Lets say it takes all the survivors 10 seconds to move to their next gens. Survivors almost halfway dead on hook and even if 2 people double team the one gen the other gen cannot be done before the survivor on hook dies. Last gen has 30 seconds left. Bubba downs that guy as last gen pops. Now he either hooks and facecamps him or uses his noed to get the other 2. Either way its a 2k or more. AND THIS IS GENEROUS numbers to survivors. Imagine if they had to travel to totems cleanse them and move for farther away gens.
because noed exacerbates the issues between solos and swf the best.
No i just want you to admit its mathematically impossible for the bubba to not 2k this way. Also bubbas do this in red.
I mean, you're actually really good at missing the point of posts! I'd suggest you stay away from darts though, you may end up hitting someone behind you.
Screw it then, no second chances on both sides
Nothing to fix a survivors’ mistakes like DH, Unbreakable, BT, etc.
Same with killer: NOED, etc.
neither do I. My chases usually last a long-ass time, unless the killer is a Trapper, great Nurse, or Spirit. My feet are trap magnets and I will disarm every single one using my feet, a great Nurse is really hard to escape in a chase but it's okay because I have stealth on my side, and a Spirit is a Spirit. Doesn't change the fact that if nobody does a generator you could get chased for 10 minutes and nothing would happen.
Waste of time and energy. You cannot teach people who won't understand logic and reason. But if you don't see the true point of my posts i wish you the best of luck. If the other 2 want to entertain you some more they can be my guest.
//
I want this so damn bad
If killer is camping you simply do gens and then waste all pallets to GTFO since killer didn't eat them earlier. Even if survivor just stands still, you'd still have at least 120 seconds of sheer camping to get 4 gens done and then finish the last one while one of you distracts killer for half of a gen
Absolutely have to disagree. NOED basically is an RNG perk, as a Killer you have to hope they don't find all the totems. The best way to describe this perk would be: It rewards bad players and punishes bad players. Basically a lose-lose situation for both sides. A good coordinated team will most likely cleanse all the totems, while Solo or new players get punished for reaching the end game, even if killer played bad.
And also if protecting generators is not killer's objective, why is it listed in official Help&Tutorials section under Patrolling Generators? You as a killer should find an efficient patrol route and protect them. IMO it's an outdated perk, that is in need of rework.
Mathematical reasoning is not enough against these guys, it's like arguing with a brick wall.
I guess you're just using solo q as an excuse to justify any complaints against killer things "nerf x because poor solo potatoes can't deal with them".
As for noed, I`ll repeat the same thing - if you or anybody else is having so terrible time against noed and doesn't have friends to play with, then you either take anti-totem perks and do the WHOLE job yourself (because it should be an axiom to you in solo q that nobody else but you is doing anything) or you just FORGET about totems, rush gens and LEAVE, abandoning everyone else who's less fortunate than you (or find a hexed totem, but I guess that's never an option because you risk dying which isn't fun).
no, im doing the opposite. im complaing about killing things as proof that solos need a buff.
try again, you keep missing me and its kinda hilarious to watch
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"solos need a buff"
"lets nerf noed"
It's hilarious how you keep acting so self-righteous as if you proved anything, despite the fact that I disapproved all your so called arguments.
I've literally never said to nerf NOED in this thread, nor before, so you're not disproving my arguments at all. In fact, in a thread I made about NOED in April of 2020, which you can find here, I stated that it just highlighted the issues between solo and SWF and that I'd much rather the perk remain as-is and solos get a totem counter than the perk itself be nerfed. I also supplied different very basic reworks the perk could have, and pointed out the many flaws in each one, stating that a totem counter is the best case scenario out of them all. My view on this has not changed.
So, yeah, not really disproving me at all.
Hmm ok
Rank 15-20 problems I see. Gotchu bestie.
Found the entitled killer main. Solo needs a buff because of how difficult it is to play. Solo queue mains have it harder than killer mains and SWF mains.
People are considering to give killers buffs in all of their kits to synchronize with the solo buff, and I personally agree. Also NOED hinders solo queue tremendously.
But if you give solos that much info then killers get to weak!
//
found the entitled survivor main who thinks that playing killers for dailies makes him killer main.
All buffs solo needs is making perks like small game basekit. Not nerfing killers or killer perks.
Nerfing noed would simply make SWF even worse to deal with which in the end won't result in anything better. I'm perplexed how you can't grasp it.
Lol
you really need to get a different argument other than "lol survivor main" and putting words in people's mouths my guy
And there is nothing wrong with that. It's a Perk, not a college degree in Business Management. Nowhere is it written it needs to be earned.
Please keep the thread on topic, and keep the comments civil and respectful. NOED is a heated topic, but you can still be respectful to those who disagree with you, and not resort to belittling others and their opinions while discussing it.
i can stand still all i want, if the survivors did totems the perk will never activate.
stop trying to say the perk would "reward the killer for X" - it does NOT do that. there is nothing on that perk that rewards the killer for doing anything. whether the perk activates or not is 100% up to the survivors.
the perk is not in any form a reward, its a punishment. it is a punishment for those Survivors who failed to cleanse all Dull Totems.
lol
Kind of how i feel. If the killer is standing around letting survivors do whatever for the whole game, then NOED should be useless at that point. If the killer gets NOED value then that is the survivors fault.
The bigger issue is with those close games where survivors really don't have the time to cleanse.
Either way, NOED can be a powerful perk. But we also need to keep in mind that it is one perk that can be made completely useless before it activates.
Also, it is one of 4 perks that killers have against 16 survivor perks.
that's exactly what you're doing, funny.
NOED is considerably more vulnerable to Swiffers than solos, so nerfing NOED wouldn't hurt your chances against Swiffers nearly as much as it would hurt your chances against solos.
im really not but
To me as a biased killer player the only issue I have with NOED is it makes patrolling the exit gates easier due to the movement speed you receive. Sometimes map RNG isn't good on maps and gates spawn too close and in some situations this does put survivors in unwinnable situations where they cannot even cleanse the totem. I do understand the argument of do bones before gens etc but there's another issue with that which I'll bring up. However if I were to change NOED as a killer main I would make it so the speed bonus only applied to killers during chase. This would have two affects.
If NOED movement speed only worked in chase I feel the perk would be fine and have an obvious tell.
However the reason survivors don't like doing totems for NOED is because of the nature of NOED.
If you cleanse totems and the killer did not have NOED you just wasted a lot of time - There is no counter for how many bones are done so it's not really a conscious team effort as well - Then at the end of the game you could very well get blamed for wasting time doing bones when the killer didn't even have noed nor did they likely consider you would waste time doing totems. However if someone chooses to do bones it outright cancels the perk easily. It's all a matter of luck on what both parties choose to do with their loadouts and throughout the game. It's lacking consistency and this is what players tend to hate. They do something with expectations and it turns out to be wrong.
I feel NOED passively activating is fine however it should be clear to survivors that it's going to happen and there should be clear objectives for the survivors to go through to prevent it and there should be clear objectives for the killer to do to activate it. In this instance I'd say adding a totem counter specifically for the perk and enabling auras of dull totems for the killer would be fine. In fact I'd say removing the movement speed, giving aura reading of dull totems within a set range for killer and scaling the perk off of this and giving survivors a totem counter for this perk would be perfectly fine.
Just my two cents but I am biased.
nah, you clearly are
Excellent take on this.
ok im glad youre well aware of my motivations and everything im saying despite not being able to see your own hypocrisy, have a nice day
it should honestly be basekit, killers should feel scary when EGC starts
That's where whataboutism started.
*closes topic*
EGC isn't meant to make the killer scarier. It isn't meant to be lethal. It's in the game for once purpose and one purpose only- to ensure the game ends. It does that and it does that flawlessly.
The GAME is meant to be lethal. Every second of it.
when EGC was implemented and time and time after that, BHVR have said that the EGC isn't meant to add extra lethality. It's sole purpose is to end the game. Whether the rest of the game is lethal or not is up for debate but the EGC should not add any extra lethality without ample time for the survivors to escape- which is exactly what it does.
EGC is not meant for killers, or for survivors. It's meant as a way to end the game and to avoid hostage situations, which is why killers can open the exit doors. It's not meant to give an advantage to either side.
so why can survivors 99 the exit doors and then escape when they feel like it?
Exit gates should regress
survivors are given too much power when 99ing a gate
Even with a door 99'd the killer can still open the door - as I said, it's not about power, it's about ending the game.
We also tested a few ways with regards to regressing, none of them felt great and this decision was made to be the fairest option, and again I will emphasis, EGC is not there to help one side or the other, it's there purely to end the game, which it does very well as the killer can just open the door if need be.