A Sensitive Topic
I know there are a lot of opinions, but there's one thing I've found more toxic than ever lately. I keep running into a player who mains Leatherface and camps/tunnels any player who is a person of color (Adam, Tapp, Claudette). He wears the Claudette face, which is basically "blackface." Initially, I didn't really notice until I was playing with a friend who mains Adam- a character he thinks he will look a lot like one day. Well, this happened to him. When I tried to unhook (unwisely) we both went down, but LF hooked him again and dribbled me to get me back up.
After the game, the dude sent some weirdly hateful messages that aren't technically against the ToS, including a confederate flag and "your life didn't matter." My friend was really affected by this. I initially wasn't, but after some discussion, I'm really surprised.
I get that Leatherface wears people's faces. I get it's inclusive for Claudette to have a face as well. I get this guy is human trash and should be reported. That said, he's not breaking the rules. He's just wearing a cosmetic and sending some vaguely coded messages.
So I guess I wonder... How is this in the game in 2020? (Well, aside from that 2020 is a dumpster fire).
Comments
I've seen this conversation before, although i must say that OP has broached this with FAR more maturity and respect than most people who see fit to declare that anyone who does not agree with them must of course be racist.
The thing is, intent IS a big factor when it comes to the subject of Claudette being used as a leather face cosmetic. Of course there are nasty little cowards who will use the anonymity of the internet to spread stupid hate. I've lost count of the times someone has seen my username and decided that threats of sexual assault are clearly the order of the day. Put quite simply, those people are massive d**ks and should never be used as an example to encompass a whole community.
I'll be honest, I'm usually too busy running the heck away from leatherface to notice much about who's face he's wearing, but the act of wearing claudettes skin was never meant as an act of racism, if anything it would have been branded as racist if they hadn't included it. The intent of the devs was NEVER to be racist. The intent of MOST decent human beings who wear it is NEVER to be racist.
The kind of people who will go out of their way to be degenerate butt hats to people for playing a black character, are not going to stop simply because their accessory got taken away.
I'm not going to advise you to tell your friend to just 'ignore it', i know stuff like that hurts. What i can say is that you or anyone else affected by this, have the power over how much you let them get to you. Report them every damn time they do it, if you are in a team, send multiple reports every damn time. Include the screenshots. Don't respond to them, because what they want more than anything else is that minuscule power of knowing they upset you. Don't give it to them. That doesn't mean you shouldn't get upset at all, that stuff is reactionary, just DON'T give them the power.
Taking away the Claudette skin won't do a damn thing to people like that. Hate will find a way, but its up to the rest of us to give it the middle finger and carry on regardless.
Just my two pennies...
Oh well thank you explaining to me how someone should feel who is a different race than either of us are.
Omfg dude really? ######### are #########. Period.
Doesnt mean it's a blackface bubba.
You could target those characters with hillbilly or legion and be racist af but nobody says anything because they're not wearing a claudette face?
So sick of this argunent.
Does it come up a lot?
As people mentioned, intent is important. For all we know, this is a black skinned individual who gets off on promoting/creating racism so they can get on the forum and watch you create this topic.
Assuming your not making this all up. All I know is that I’m on ps4 and almost got my accounted deleted because I called a survivor ‘dickless loser’ just a week ago. Fairly sure they would pounce on and crush any racist remarks shared (if reported). 🤷🏻♂️
There have been a couple of conversations broaching the subject. Unfortunately the authors of said posts began shouting "White privilege" when people were not immediately demanding the Claudette face be removed, or while they tried to calmly explain, again, the meaning of intent and the backlash of leaving the skin out.
Hence some people being a bit acerbic about the subject being broached. But as i mentioned, it's clear you are trying to talk about this with a good deal more maturity than previous posts.
I'm on PS4 also. This guy is a red ranks Bubba main and if you went to his profile, you'd quickly get the drift of his intent. I don't think we're allowed to name and shame, though.
And maybe you're right that he wants people to make posts like this. My goal here is to try to understand the spectrum of the argument. I found it to be disgusting and weird, but another of my (white) friends shrugged and said it was meaningless (though he's changed his mind after seeing the profile). Either way, it's what's been on my mind since then.
I told my friend to report. No idea what's happening with Sony, but we'll see.
Who said it wasn't racist?
Yes it kinda is. And there is no such thing as cosplaying as someone's ethnicity.
If someone who is white is cosplaying a character who is black and vice versa, that is not racism. To conflate actual racist acts with it is disrespectful to those who are actual victims of racism and hate crimes. Grow up.
"You cant cosplay that person because you don't have the same skin color, regardless of intent"
Correct me if I'm wrong, but, doesn't that sound like discrimination?
Ok I understand now. I thought you meant like cosplaying as a certain race just to stereotype them and shame them.
Not as much lately but like once a month.
Someone will post
"Is this racist?"
"Racist killers"
Or even
"Leatherface Blackface is racist"
Like. I get it. Especially in this woke age of changing things. But hes leatherface. He wears peoples faces. And claudette is one of the original 4. To NOT include her for that would be racist.
You cant stop people from being racist, but having a canonically accurate "blackface" for this ONE character, doesnt make anyone using it racist.
Tbh, most times I see it, or use it, is because people hate claudette, or more acurately, blendettes. More of a "######### claudette" and less "I'm in blackface".
Plus, the only other one you can really notice is megs lipstick. They mostly look like his default. Claudette face is EASILY distinguishable.
Well then yeah, that person is an #########. But again, hes using a very specific one off example to add to his racism. Bubba himself, or the inclusion of claudette face, is not racist.
Exactly. Look at RDJ in tropic thunder. He is, by all means, in blackface. Hes a white guy, playing an Australian (iirc?), who is in blackface for the "in movie" movie. But it's not to mock black people. It's to call out how movie industries would rather blackface certain situations instead of hiring black actors. Its 100% about intent and context.
Like bubba. Hes not racist. He loves his family and everyone else is a mask.
Claudette face isnt racist. Shes one of the original 4.
A racist, using it to antagonize poc, is racist. But that person would still be a racist and do those things without bubba's face options.
I mean, at my place of employment, it's something you'd be reprimanded for...
->Tunneling Adam players
There are Adam players?
But in all seriousness, you would have to record the game and leave it up the the discretion of BHVR to know if the guy was purposefully being racist or just a Bubba playing scummy and tunneling people.
So if I have a video and the messages, do you think this is something to go to Sony with or BHVR?
indeed it is, but it's with the individual not with the cosmetic.
they could just as easily use an ebony on any killer and do the same. that's equally as racist. the cosmetic means nothing here.
the user should be reported to sony immidiately.
Report both. Why not?
Wearing Claudette's face in itself isn't racist. Wearing faces is Leatherfaces lore...but come on folks. There is an racist intent. This guy/girl will no doubt be permanently-banned.
sick what people will do.
Okay, reported on PSN. Thanks for the advice.
I never really got this argument. Black people wouldn't question why it was removed or not put it the game, because the 1st thing they would think of is blackface. I'm not trying to speak for all black people, but I wouldn't care if they removed it or never put it in. Like you said they didn't design it to be racist, but they probably did know some players would use it and act like scumbags to further the point.
I used to be one of those people who believed reports lead to nothing, but devs have proved in recent months that they take harassment and bigotry very seriously, so if you reported this person I wouldn't worry, they'll probably get what they deserve.
Not to beg the question, but has leatherface ever worn a black person's face in the films? (Not coming at him or anyone, just I don't recall it.)
As a black woman who cosplays, the complaint isn't that people who aren't black are cosplaying black characters. Its they're painting they're skin brown and then cosplaying the character. Unless it isn't a natural skin color, it's very insensitive to change your skin color just for a cosplay.
Thats what I was trying to say. But some people have to thick of a skull to understand.
Common sense. Dude wears other peoples skin. He doesn't care for skin color, he just does it. If people want to look deeper into that, or have players try and use that for a nasty frame of mind, that's on them.
No, whenever he has killed a black person he doesn't have the time to do that.
I fail to see how its racist. Thats what Leatherface does. He wears faces. I see the Claudette Bubba frequently, but thats because Claudette is the most popular survivor.
I mean I think there's a reason directors and writers and such knew it was probably best to avoid it?
So here's how I just explained it to my buddy:
Kumail Nanjiani points to a scene in Freddy vs Jason where Freddy sees Kelly Rowland's character. He remarks on her race saying, "how sweet, dark meat!" And audiences are appalled. Except, Freddy isn't a good dude. He's a serial killer, dream demon, and a pedophile. Not a role model. Racism is the least of his bad qualities. And further, Bubba (albeit warped a bit by his family) isn't going for the "role model of the year" award either. These are bad guys and not role models.
His response kind of hit me in the gut: "so, the person in real life... they're a monster too?" So yeah, we made a report on PSN. He says he didn't make an ingame report during this, but he has video and I saved mine.
I think many of you pointed out this is bad behavior by an individual. Thank you, I agree.
Im sure with everything going on now sony would probably do something if enough people reported him.
As gaming culture has gotten more diverse, people have gotten a lot more sensitive to things that really surprise me at times. The gamer word. You know what that word is, I don't need to say anything further than that. You're not going to be able to escape that, and I promise you when people are frustrated playing this game they'll say things in real life while playing that you probably wouldn't like either. LAN parties aren't a thing anymore, but frustrated gamers aren't nice gamers.
As a veteran dead by daylight player I wouldn't dream of tunneling a claudette because if she knows how to loop that's how all the gens get done and I don't win the match. You can't focus one survivor for any reason at high ranks. You just can't.
As a player that plays all characters for their teachables/dailies/etc if I'm playing a character I don't have all my perks on and you meme on me for my character's race, I'm going to flick you on the back of the head with my thumb. Unless you're a race shapeshifting chimera irl, there's no way a player can tell what race you are in real life unless you tell them. You are not your character, and it's normal to die in a match in this game (you can still pip btw) Let it roll off your coat. Don't sprinkle more salt on your salt. That's just gross.
Darker characters are harder to see and higher priority if I catch them out of position, but that's just tactics. I can see pink bald Dwight at any point, his flashlight ensures that I will know his exact location at all times. Gen Jockey Camo Claudette gets the hammer first.
"He wears the Claudette face, which is basically "blackface."
If he didn't have that option then you would be crying about non-inclusivity.