AJStyIez
AJStyIez
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In my 6k hours I’ve never been able to stop and eat entire meals ( like 100 different dishes and snacks), travel to the other side of the house to get the front door, 💨🍃 mid-match or focus on my Twitch chat 100% ignoring the game on Killer without it all impacting the final result even if it’s only minor
As Survivor I’ve hit extended great skill check streaks with one hand eating wings, taking shots on stream or 🍃 offstream , looping good Killers while having side conversations with company and listening to music. My friend still has a clip of me falling asleep mid-match and lightly snoring on stream 😂 I gave two free hooks while afk and woke up at the hook with crows to still get the escape and a good final chase
Even in the matches I’ve dominated as Killer I still never felt the level of security I feel when playing Survivor, especially when in a SWF. On my mains, the majority of teams they throw me against (obviously ignoring the random baby teams they feed you sometimes) would have a field day with me if I tried any of the first part consistently against them since I play a lot of M1s
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ItS tOo EaRlY tO cRiTiCiZe tHiS cHaPtEr, YoU hAvE to WaiT TiL tHe NeXt OnE rElEaSeS fIRsT
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@Mr_K said:
Why is the dredge still incapable of teleporting to an unlocked locker if there is a locked one directly next to it?
Intended and survivors are too stupid to realize it. Stop locking both!
It boils my blood when I lock one and a teammate that literally watched me lock it will go do the second one right after.....
I think they sometimes assume people are trying to “share” them or something but that doesn’t even make sense, just don’t lock both lol
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While I agree that DH existing creates a frustrating dynamic as Killer, I don’t see any other way to solve the issue without either reworking exhaustion which is unfair to the niche/weak exhaustion perks or simply deleting DH which is also unfair
I just think it’s permanently doomed to be another old DS/Pain Res type perk where even if it’s not present in the lobby you still adjust your gameplay to counter it just in case its there
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DBD, one of the only games in the world where people who clearly don’t have experience on a particular role have the heaviest critiques and ideas for how said role is “supposed” to be. Amazing
According to rookies like this, there’s no good players in the world because they’ve all tunneled/slugged/camped before. It’s honestly just cringe whenever one-sided Survivors or Killers cope with their lack of skill/experience by projecting all these hypocritical standards to gatekeep others from getting credit
If I had a dollar for every time I heard a DBD rookie say “I played with ____ against ___ and __K’d without ____” I’d already have a asymm game of my own
The people who use those lines NEVER show screenshots/video because it would immediately expose them for being in baby territory
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@Bwsted said:
Like genuinely what is wrong with it, I can't think of one think that makes it worthy of being removed.
Do you really not see what is wrong with a mechanic that makes you win the chase because you've been losing?
Bloodlust 1 would still be acceptable in game, but tier 2 and 3 are obsolete and should've been removed, not buffed to be gained faster.
Also, the way bloodlust is maintaned after missing a lunge and how zoning killers build tiers while charging their power and keep it when they cancel is another testament of how badly implemented it is.
This is complaining about symptoms but not addressing the illness. If people think Bloodlust is really that poorly-implemented then those same people should be the main ones advocating for game-health over new chapters and trying to get more of these maps reworked. Not just graphical improvements like Red Forest, REAL reworks like Eyrie of Crows.
You know maps are problematic when Devs don’t even deny it, they just make jokes about it in their dev update while implementing a new feature to prevent streaks on the same map. From what I heard, they did make several tile changes in this PTB so hopefully it continues (although Cowshed has yet to be addressed, only memed about)
Have you ever tried playing the strongest map tiles in the game against top % Survivors? Even with a high-tier your mistakes can & will be rightly punished, now imagine M1s with no mobility. You can’t “mindgame” your way around a long wall gym that connects into shack that connects into another safe tile, you literally lust through it (which is nullified by getting rid of any of those pallets) or you drop chase and have to deal with it later in the match anyway
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@GentlemanFridge said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3349221#Comment_3349221
your list of aesthetics are blatantly false, and subjective.
Her face:
https://twitter.com/tiger_was_alone/status/1626935556503490561?s=20
Her wall break is quite obviously not Nemesis'. I'm sorry but this is hilariously obvious from the survivor PoV.
Her walk is too slow. It's not out of place, it's too slow, so that it looks she's gliding.
Criticism is fine, but please make it based on reality.
Make it based on reality? The reality is that 99% of people feel the same way about this chapter lol. That’s not an opinion either, look around the forums you’re on and look around the internet. Look at the literal hundreds of long term customers/players/fans stating publicly that they won’t be spending their money on this chapter for the same reasons you claim aren’t a part of reality and the thousands of people upvoting those same takes confirming their support. People sponsored by BHVR and others that make their living off of this game (With the most incentive to click-bait/hype something) even agree, that should tell you something considering they usually never go this hard on content even when it’s been mediocre in the past
The reality is that you guys come off as very salty that you’re in the minority this time around for Tools of Torment. Like I said before, I find it interesting how when a new chapter comes out nobody ever gatekeeps the positive feedback, only the negative
i see very few ever telling people “Hey, you can’t randomly claim this upcoming chapter is amazing and one of the best based off random quirks and biased fandom. Stop promoting overly-optimistic talking points and sexualizing the characters on the internet to show BHVR your support! Make it based on reality and not nitpicking”
But a lot are conveniently around to do damage control and debate with people who aren’t fans of the content though. God forbid somebody does the same exact thing as others (providing their feedback based off their own preferences combined with the consensus across all corners of the community) but it’s not blind praise, we’re expected to provide a dissertation to prove ourselves
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3349892#Comment_3349892
...They weren't responding to you...?
They were responding to me, who was responding to a user named BenOfMilam. Is that an alt of yours or something?
I didn't realize there was a whole discussion that happened afterwards, it took me straight to the bottom and I only read 2-3 comments so that's my bad for jumping the gun. I thought they were talking to me and it was confusing, I'd delete those comments but I don't think you can on here so all I can do is say sorry to Squbax for shooting first and asking second. The comment I was about to type up was towards you anyway though so I'll just type it here
I was gonna respond to your reply from yesterday saying you don't see any objective evidence that the chapter is failing, and to that I say of course you don't because you've said yourself IIRC that you enjoy playing devil's advocate. That's what it seems like you're doing here for sure, I don't know how anybody could say they don't have any evidence when this is the community's consensus already and that same community consensus is used for the majority of other DBD topics. Its funny how if a chapter drops and the feedback is 99.9% positive people will consider it a success and use that to gatekeep others from having opposing views but if the opposite happens the goalposts start shifting
Now all of a sudden everytime the community doesn't like a chapter for valid reasons "It's too early to tell guys, we have to wait until after the PTB" & "This is all subjective" - But its not subjective when everybody is creaming their pants for the most miniscule/biased reasons ever?? When people blindly praise things in DBD there's no time limit, but when people give well-thought out and fair criticism based off previous community standards its jumping the gun and frosty????
PLEASE explain to me the historical difference between DBD criticism on day 1 of PTB and DBD criticism on day 1 of official launch? Literally every single chapter in the past 2 years has had multiple things from the PTB ignored and required multiple hotfixes to close wounds. Even beyond that, there's a mountain of evidence from all the chapters 2+ years ago to prove that "Wait til after" is not a valid argument considering things have NEVER been guaranteed to get addressed with BHVR. I don't have to name the 10+ characters this has already happened too, all I have to do is say Twins and I think you get the point
PLEASE explain the difference to me between speaking on problematic character design/balancing issues on day 1 vs day 16??? Even WITH the Knight's 2 band-aids, is his gameplay loop ANY different than it was on the PTB? No, he's still the Knight lmao. Ghostface was still Ghostface after his PTB and Trickster (the most popular comparison to SM) was still the 'bugged and undertuned but massively-oppressive to weak loopers' Trickster after he released. This whole "Guys just haven't figured it out, wait and see she's not that bad" is just gatekeeping feedback unless it aligns with yours. I'd understand if DBD was some deep intellectual strategy game where there's thousands of combinations to work with and test, but this is an asymm that has already been datamined, number-crunched and optimized for 7 years by people from all different professions and skillsets. It doesn't take people with thousands of hours played to see glaring issues with content within a small timeframe
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@squbax said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3349880#Comment_3349880
Idk man, you know some people's first language isn't english right? and my points are different from what you stated but go on, you are clearly on the right.
What you said: Even tho he is awfully wrong about her lore, her backstory is awfull, its as bland as it gets, tricker looks goffy as hell but his lore shows his psycopathic nature and his development as a seria killer, her lore has her development in one line of text which says she enjoyed killing one man with the claw(they don't even explain where the tech cane from or if she made it or anything), also they could have taked such a good approach describing hiw she enjoyed taking thr skulls of her victims and using them in their drones but they didn't, its a very lazy lore from a lot of perspectives. Also even her model is mediocre, its literally trickster.
What I said: Although Trickster has a similar gimmick, his lore was objectively WAY more fleshed out and tied WAY better into his cosmetics than this lady so far. The lore also doesn't really tie well with her name, its very bland and low-effort. She has Nea's pixie head and Trickster's exact face with very minor tweaks to both
So again, you said I'm "awfully wrong" but then your entire comment is LITERALLY agreeing with everything I said.....All you did was word it differently
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@LiveBritishReaction said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3349833#Comment_3349833
"Aesthetically, she's obviously fine."
Starting with this and I've already lost the ability to take you seriously. No, a Spy Kids villain is not aesthetically fine in DBD, let alone "obviously" fine. Her aesthetic IS trash, just objectively. It doesn't mesh with any aspect of her own self or the game she's in.
"the bedazzled mask- which, of course, fits her as a character,"
In what way? In what part of her lore would she be doing things that necessitate wearing a gas mask? Why is it studded with my 7-year-old sister's backpack's jewels? "Man, the ink from these corporate ledgers sure are making it hard to breathe. Better put on my gas mask that doesn't work because half of it is missing." Like, how does it even remotely fit her?
"What her power is meant to do is obviously fine,"
It's bland, boring, and if you buff it to be not garbage she just becomes a monster 3-gen killer. Because people adore 3-gen killers, right? And even if you did buff her, why would I play her over Hag or Trapper? On a fundamental level, they just do what she does but better. Injuring and immobilization, or teleporting instantaneously to a nearby survivor, are just objectively fundamentally stronger than "Girl check your phone!"
"A lot of PTBs have weak killers, some of them weaker than the Skull Merchant. Remember PTB Trickster?"
Because if there's one thing BHVR is known for, it's making great changes off the PTB. Also PTB Trickster was way stronger than Skull Merchant, for the record.
"As for her elements not meshing, I gotta say that this is the complaint I understand the least."
It doesn't work at all. None of this is really fleshed out in her lore. They just smashed a bunch of concepts together and tried to make it work. Where did she learn to build these drones? Why does she look the way she does? How is she a Skull Merchant? Her look doesn't reflect any facet of her personality.
"Is it a problem now for killers to have flashy names that rely more on their story/appearance than their actual power?"
No, it's a problem when neither their story, appearance, nor power reflects that, which hers doesn't. If you're gonna be called "the Skull Merchant" then it should be a huge part of who you are, how you look, or what you do in-game. It should be indicative of your character or presence. The Wraith is called the Wraith because he's a ghost. The Trapper is called the Trapper because he traps people. The Twins are called the Twins because they're a pair of twins. The Oni is called the Oni because he's an Oni. The Knight is called the Knight because he's a knight. The Skull Merchant is called the Skull Merchant because... she likes manga. If her lore is that she's a corporate overlord who uses surveillance technology to hunt, why isn't she called "the CEO" or "the Magnate" or "the Overseer" or "the Boss" or any number of better, more fitting names? Why does it have to be the name of the OC I made on DeviantArt when I was 10 years old?
"I think people are really tripped up by the background detail that she drew some visual inspiration from her father's manga, and think it's a bigger element of her concept than it actually is."
And the reason people are tripped up about that is because it's really, REALLY goofy. "I kill people because my dad's comic books told me to!"
I really feel like some people are just permanently wearing rose-colored glasses. They like DBD/BHVR so much that no matter how low the bar gets its impossible to convince them that something is bad
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@squbax said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3349008#Comment_3349008
Even tho he is awfully wrong about her lore, her backstory is awfull, its as bland as it gets, tricker looks goffy as hell but his lore shows his psycopathic nature and his development as a seria killer, her lore has her development in one line of text which says she enjoyed killing one man with the claw(they don't even explain where the tech cane from or if she made it or anything), also they could have taked such a good approach describing hiw she enjoyed taking thr skulls of her victims and using them in their drones but they didn't, its a very lazy lore from a lot of perspectives.
Also even her model is mediocre, its literally trickster.
"Even tho he is awfully wrong about her lore, her backstory is awfull,"
Translation: Even though AJ is clearly wrong, he's clearly right and allow me to prove it by writing exactly what he did but with worse grammar. Your entire apply reinforces what I said
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3349108#Comment_3349108
The only slight sticking point with this take is that this isn't a bad product, though.
Like, what's actually bad about it? The killer's weak? A lot of killers have had bad PTBs, this is no exception. Some of the perks are lacklustre? They can't all be winners, and again, that's not unique. Everything else is personal taste.
Side note, there is definitely an element of expectations running amok. That's mostly the specific complaint that she isn't a cyborg/robot, though.
Off the top of my head based off the analysis we have available
Aesthetics
- Human Killer that fits the 'conventionally attractive female character with lazy cosmetic' & 'Glorified Survivor skin' tropes. Predator ripoff
- Recycled animations (Her wall break is Nemesis' for example). Her grab is janky and needs polishing
- She has Nea's pixie head and Trickster's exact face with very minor tweaks to both. Reusing assets is fine for certain things, but not when its this low-effort
- Her walking animation is more seductive than intimidating and doesn't look like it belongs in DBD... Thousands of people agree that she looks out of place and doesn't instill any sense of fear. Although Trickster has a similar gimmick, his lore was objectively WAY more fleshed out and tied WAY better into his cosmetics than this lady so far. The lore also doesn't really tie well with her name, its very bland and low-effort
- Obnoxious 1.5 second loop Terror Radius. Low effort, no personality behind it. Arguably one of the worst if not the worst in the game
- The laziest Mori in the entire game. This is embarrassing to unveil in 2023 considering the content we already had/have access to over the years
- Most of the visual effort obviously went into reworking Shelter Woods and Red Forest
Power
- M1 Killer (already a flaw in today's DBD economy)
- Her kit is several different gimmicks slapped into one. She's a jack of several trades, master of none which is literally the worst design to use for the weakest Killer archetype in the game (M1s). This once again shows how uninspired/messy the chapter comes off as. Its trying to do so much at once that it winds up doing nothing
- Just like Knight, using her power mostly for scouting/chasing is objectively worse than using it purely for area denial and excessive camping. This promotes unhealthy gameplay loops that BHVR and the community unanimously agree is not the direction they want to go in
- Will become very unenjoyable in top % lobbies due to being pigeonholed into certain strats if there aren't major tweaks made
- Her power is literally so bad that even people who enjoy her can't even deny this. We have a large pool of evidence to suggest that she won't receive the proper care before its too late. Remember when they finally listened to people about the Knight and he still maintained his place on the 'Killers that make people DC/grief and complain on the internet' list? The Knight even after his buffs hasn't had his reputation changed, what makes this any different?
Everything Else
- The Survivors were given useful perks that encourage the very things that the community/Devs claim to want to minimize (Tunneling/Camping). I've even seen you advocate against excessive tunneling/camping IIRC, so how is this not problematic?
- Two Survivors in the same chapter is double the effort for collecting perks. Having siblings is a dope concept on the surface level, but when its actually time to purchase and grind the chapter I promise you hundreds/thousands will choose not to specifically for this (not to mention the Killer herself)
- Underwhelming chapters like this take away resources/time from other much more important projects that would have a greater impact on DBD's health/longevity and player-count. Chucking out poor content just to meet quotas is usually obvious to fans and pushes more players away than they'll gain from this. Even if you personally like the new Killer, its objectively failing in several categories
Positives
- Chapter provides representation that resonates with people in the community
- Chapter provides more reworks to maps which is (or should be) one of BHVRs top 5 priorities
- Killer introduces a new interaction that doesn't involve basic skillchecks
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@AlyssaaMac said:
This is the first chapter in a while that didn't get leaked months in advance so everyone let their imaginations run wild and are mad the killer isn't what they imagined. This is the first time in a while we went almost completely blind into a ptb and the player base can't handle it because they set their expectations with no information and are blaming BHVR for it. No matter what happened with this chapter people would've been upset.
Sounds like hard copium to be completely honest. Just like you guys claim people are too negative with their expectations, some of you are way too positive most of the time and it shows. It really isn't some deep conspiracy theory as to why this Killer is getting criticized either, its pretty obvious that the chapter is just objectively flawed in about 20 different ways. You guys have to stop looking for little scapegoats every time BHVR takes an L, its okay to call a bad product bad
Its not mindless criticism from people's imagination, its already backed up with visual PTB evidence and video breakdowns of lore/aesthetic/perks and how they fit into the current game. When BHVR does something right they get endless praise for it, keep the same energy when they make a mistake then. Positivity can become toxic just like negativity when you allow it to cloud your judgment on things
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Its one of if not the worst map in the game for Killer because there’s like 4 variations and all of them have a static layout with strongly-connected tiles. Even on the games I win here I still can’t stand to play through the main building or house of Pain connected to 2-3 pallets connected to shack
When im playing high tier it’s more tolerable, but dealing with 3-4 man SWFs that know how to chain tiles while playing as Ghostface? Yikes
Meanwhile on DBD FB somebody got a decent amount of likes on a post claiming most maps in the game have actually been Killer sided 😂 Not only just recent months, historically 🤣🤣
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3347105#Comment_3347105
Not really, since the store was only added 2 years after the game came out. Feng was out for over a year at this point
If you guys are still looking for these little cherrypicked strawmans to suggest Feng hasn’t been given special treatment along with others in comparison to the rest of the cast then idk what to say. It’s pretty blatant and thousands of people acknowledged it
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3346906#Comment_3346906
Meg 102. Claudette 89. Nea 86. Dwight 85. Feng 81. She's in 5th place as I said. To me that means she's pretty far off.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/A7CR1KDHIOOL/16765158441633519698912684300037.jpg
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/UP0CCOFE72S8/20230215-215001.jpg
You realize that actually proves the point even more right? Lol. She was launched 1 year after the game released yet is still on pace to easily surpass all of the day-one characters AND still taking the spotlight away from other characters that have gone untouched for hundreds of days at a time (confirmed)
Its 2023 and only a week ago they JUST conceded the fact that they were neglecting characters and that they’ll be implementing a new cosmetic strategy. Feng treatment was 100% ridiculous and that’s why they caved to the feedback
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I don’t judge people for simply playing in a SWF, it’s objectively the least stressful niche in DBD if you break everything down into separate categories and playing with friends is completely normal. I SWF myself as a Survivor main
HOWEVER
I definitely judge the entitled/inflated-ego players in a SWF that have a consistent history of griefing everyyyyy Killer they come across and lacking self-awareness on their livestreams and social media posts.
You know the ones that individually aren’t even great at the game but they’re still boosted by their teammates? Carry these players long enough and they start walking around like gods-gift and arguing with people way better than them because they think they’re responsible for all of their teams success. When they come to SoloQ or have to SWF with people on their actual skill level they get exposed fast and that’s when they go to the internet to spread ridiculous talking points
I talk my ish too, but the difference is I always give credit where it’s due and I understand humility because I play both sides at a high level historically. If I’m in a meta-stacked SWF with my P100 friends I’m not going to spin in circles at the exit gate or make fun of a low-tier M1 Killer for losing to us, I’m going to immediately run out the gate and act like anybody else that’s accustomed to being good at something or going on winning streaks
“Act like you’ve been there before”
Some people will stack the deck as far in their favor as humanly possible and still project hypocritical rules/criticism onto the Killers who are simply adapting to what the entitled players are putting them against. You don’t get to bring a Garden of Joy map offering, 4 syringe medkits, Hyperfocus/Prove/DH/CoH and then complain about anything
unfortunately, that DBD player archetype seems to be the most vocal and the most coddled by others in the community. The sad part is this isn’t just random dorito-fingered teenagers trolling after school, this comes from grown adults 5–15 years older than me (I’m 26) publicly on YouTube/Twitch/Twitter/Reddit.
Theres literally a circle-jerk created by this archetype every single day and it’s quite sad
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Ehh.. I’m barely seeing any type of $ competition to Feng from the most popular Survivors let alone a Killer that hasn’t come out yet and already has largely negative feedback
In case you want to know what people are saying about her design so far, here’s a small example. They aren’t really liking it. Based off everything I’m reading, Most people are more interested in the new Survivor skins/perks
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3334341#Comment_3334341
I think you need to go back and read the developer updates to read how the rates work. They can explain it better than I. There is a reason why they want killer to be at 60%. I know it sounds unfair because the mind is thinking "50/50 is equal" but you have to remember this is a 4v1 and not equal on both sides. if it was 50/50 killers are at a disadvantage.
No point in talking to biased and illogical people like that Gandor person ^
Their minds are made up long before you even engage with them, its just talking to a brick wall
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Charlotte doesn’t approve of these gambreaking bugs or this guys Linux jokes
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I love getting sent to any version of Springwood against competent Survivors... Chainable loops on every corner of the map, strong pallets and a cringe main building that somehow exists while there's already 1 funhouse and 1 house of pain on opposite ends of the map. Went against a P35/P70/P100 team on Badham last night and the 2 that survived made sure to stare my Ghostface down at the exit gate... 9/12 Hooks with Ghostie isn't bad at all especially vs a meta SWF on a Survivor-sided map, still got 'flexed' on though lmao
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Hes not my main but I like playing as Blight and making fun plays like this one from last night
https://youtu.be/UqVdr00YAfQ -
@StarLost said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3331485#Comment_3331485
Eh...
On one hand, boy do I disagree with the OP.
On the other hand, vetos/bans aren't something uncommon in PvP games. I don't think it would work in DbD, but I've heard worse ideas.
Today.
The idea itself isn’t the worst, it’s the disingenuous people advocating for it knowing they just wanna cherry-pick competition out of spite.
Today alone I’ve made 8 people kill themselves on hook as Blight and I’m playing with 0 slowdown and speed addons, but at least it’s not Aclh ring or compound. I’m also playing fairly clean so I don’t understand
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Some of you honestly don't belong in PvP games and it shows on the forums, YT comments, DBD Twitter and Reddit. Just because you're new to or bad at the genre doesn't mean the entire landscape should be changed to suit your needs
If we left it up to some people in this thread then half of the Killer roster would be deleted and the other half would be blacklisted with the exception of the worst M1 Killers since they're bullyable and take little experience to loop
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Watch "Twins Hawkins" on Streamable.Watch "Nurse On Hawkinz" on Streamable.
IDC what anybody says, I wish the map was back in the game even if it wasn't my favorite. I only have a few old memories recorded from there unfortunately
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Why is there so much Eruption copium? Its not THE most broken thing in the game by any means but its usage rate and the long duration debuff creates a predictable/frustrating gameplay loop especially when you're already having to/expected to compensate for any and all deficiencies your teammates might have. Its okay to use Eruption especially with how efficient GOOD Survivors are on gens, but there's no need to do damage control for it and pretend like its all white noise
It reminds me of when DH was still E for distance and people said it was a 'Skill issue' and 'entitlement' if Killers weren't jumping in joy after seeing it 3-4 times in every single lobby
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@Hensen2100 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3328446#Comment_3328446
Wild take. You know you can pre-emptively draw the path through a window in an area you expect survivors to be at, right? Say you get discordance at a gen, and that gen is near a jungle gym. So at 30-40m away (depending on your addons) you drop the orb and fly it through the window and onto the gen. Then they are chased by a guard and the window is blocked. It is not that hard?
Same with you thinking him camping the basement is bad. I actually think that's crazy considering he is the only killer who can stand at the top of the stairs and still effectively pressure gens. Game awareness is a thing, you don't have to draw the path when a survivor is right there primed to save.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3328436#Comment_3328436
Every single M1 killer who has to hit survivors twice can trivially be basement dove. Key difference with Knight is he can basically take 1 survivor out the game, so even with the entire team alive he can still make a basement save only a trade even if they play it well. While pressuring gens at the same time. Bubba can stand at the top of the stairs and kill people but he can't pressure gens so he is on a fixed timeframe to camp people to death in
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3328513#Comment_3328513
There is almost nothing skillful about survivor, like at all, in comparison to killer. By design 75% of your gameplay is holding M1. And not even holding M1 anymore, it's more like 75% of your gameplay is AFKing and hitting spacebar every now and then.
I don't see why every character needs you to ooze skill to play them
Idk why you're criticizing Survivor gameplay just because I said the truth about the Knight lol. He's the lord of influencing W-Key gameplay and if you really enjoyed playing Killer then I don't see how you think that's a W. I'm pretty sure most players on both sides across all skill brackets would agree he needs more work
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As a competent Killer I can say that Solo Q Survivors needed this for a long time and its 1000% deserved. Anybody deeply opposed to it is being biased unfortunately. While I understand that the game's foundation was designed for limited Survivor information and agree that certain past decisions were bad, the 4th wall was kinda shattered the moment they dropped the OG SWF... There are too many puzzle pieces on both sides to turn back now so I think its in the best interest of both sides to welcome this change + any smaller QoL adjustments for any Killers negatively impacted by it (mainly lower tiers)
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A little disappointed that you betrayed Ghostie for Pig with that username tbh 😬
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I'm in a constant battle where I shift between leveling my Ace/Ghostface for periods of time and then I'll occasionally start spoiling whatever other Survivors/Killers I feel like stacking event items and addons on at the time. Idk if anybody is doing something similar, but honestly I might just ping pong back and forth until I eventually get both to 100 with others getting some love too. I play both sides often and don't feel like hard-committing all my BP to one or the other especially for someone that doesn't plan on grinding DBD as much as before
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Eruption can definitely be changed in a healthy way without nuking it like Ruin. I don't see how anybody that has played Solo Q in the past 4 months can tell me that the perk is perfectly fine as is and that they can consistently rely only on their instinct and awareness to counter it when you always have question marks for teammates regardless of your MMR. Doing it is one thing, but doing it every single proc every single match though? Highly doubt it. I understand why people use it and I've used it myself, but it 100% should get this change
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@Monlyth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3328802#Comment_3328802
Did I not present a viable change that works for all levels of play? Spasmodic Breath basekit. Maybe the numbers would need to be adjusted, but it would make Nurse feel a lot more "fair" to play against, even if her power still ignores most of the game's mechanics. Because much like Oni or Legion, the fact that half the time, you're just playing against a normal M1 Killer makes it a lot more bearable when they do something crazy that you had no real way to avoid.
Nurse is unique in just how little works against her. Pallets? Blink. Windows? Blink. Walls? Blink. Hold W? Blink. Everything Survivors could normally do against a Killer will barely slow a Nurse down. Similar to why pre-rework Legion was so despised, despite them being absolute garbage.
Again, please point out where I showed disinterest in balancing the game for both sides, so I can correct that. I want the game to be fun for both sides, because if Survivors are satisfied with the way the game plays, then Killer queue times will be shorter. And if Killer is fun to play, then, well, I'll have more fun.
Its not a personal attack on you so apologies if I was putting you in the crosshair, its just the culmination of 5+ years on the same topic. I've been here for every variation of Nurse and the most busted stuff for both Survivor and the rest of the Killer roster - I've seen and heard every possible opinion from both sides on the major DBD topics and its just history repeating itself. The changes we received were universally agreed upon regardless of individual's preferred roles, most people were perfectly fine with getting the Nurse changed again and the second they realized she's still S tier they have been perpetuating the feedback-loop all over
I understand fully that she is 120/100 compared to Trapper's 25/100 and Blights 100/100 and I've never disagreed that the gap exists and its too wide. The difference between my stance and perhaps yours and others is that I've historically proposed that her and any Blight-level characters stay around 100/100 while others are brought closer to that point and Survivors are unified in the form of QoL features such as the recent SoloQ HUD additions. I feel like other players don't agree or understand how this makes sense and they instead propose that she goes from 120/100 immediately to 75/100 or lower AND then we still buff Survivors as a whole and weaker Killers. I will ALWAYS stand against that particular perspective because its selfish and overdramatic in me and other's opinions due to the flipside
The DBD community over the years has routinely claimed that certain things need to be left alone or treated with extra caution because they want to prioritize the majority (Survivors outnumber Killers both in-game and IRL). The problem here is that the majority/minority have never fluctuated or swapped places in DBD, its always been the same structure simply due to the asymmetrical nature. For every Killer-exclusive player in the world there are dozens of Survivors. With that being said, If we're ALWAYS prioritizing the majority then how can we then consider the foundation of this topic to be "Balance" and "fairness"??
Its a slippery slope and when you give an inch, people will ALWAYS take a mile and that's why I'm so harshly against it. I'm a Survivor main myself and although several thousand of my hours have gone to Killer my first love will always be Survivor and everything involved in it. I guess I can consider it a weird variation of 'tough love'. I love Survivor so much in DBD that I find it offensive when Devs cater TOO much to us, not everybody is doodoo or in need of training wheels
At what point do the community and Devs draw a line in the sand and say people simply have to adapt to the Nurse's gameplay loop? Is it when she gets a 4th patch and Spasmodic Breath is basekit or is it when she has Spasmodic Breath basekit AND shes banned from using aura reading perks? You see where I'm going with this? At some point people have to accept the fact that her power is simply meant to be played differently as and against. I recall many Oni OP complaints too and I have no doubt that if she operated more like him it still wouldn't change the community's perception. I legitimately believe people will not be satisfied until she is just removed from the game or D/C tier
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@itsPina said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3327603#Comment_3327603
GOOD BUSINESS AND GREED ARE THE SAME THING JESUS CHRIST
CORPORATIONS ARE NOT ON YOUR SIDE
THEY DO NOT CARE ABOUT YOU
CARE ABOUT YOURSELF. YOU ARE A CONSUMER, YOU SHOULD WANT YOUR CONSUMPTION TO BE CHEAPER NOT MORE EXPENSIVE. YOU ARE SHOOTING YOURSELF IN THE FOOT ALONG WITH EVERYONE ELSE.
TYSM - I don't understand what's confusing about this and I tried to touch on that earlier when I said "If you don't ridicule ridiculous things, it leaves room for them to grow into bigger problems". I must live in a different galaxy or something because I don't see how that's not obvious especially in terms of consumerism in games. It legit baffles me that people have no valid points or justification for the bad business practices other than "Some suit and ties from corporate wants this because they're making extra cash, They should continue getting as much as they can lol hurr-durr it makes sense stop complaining"
... Like bruh, how are they simping for the corporations when they're not even a part of them and reaping the benefits??? At the end of the day they're still viewed as a consumer just like us so trying to ride in a company's backpack is nothing more than just embarrassing themselves tbh. If they're not touching the profits themselves then there's no reason to celebrate it and flex it on others
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@Little_Kitten said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3328722#Comment_3328722
"Nurse could be trash-tier for all the good it would do, honestly. She's just not fun to play against."
Here we go.
The incessant complaints against the nurse were never intended to highlight any hypothetical imbalance or "over-power".
These complaints are only a reflection of the selfishness of a certain number of players who can't stand the fact that a killer poses a bit more of a problem for them than a silly M1 killer they can loop in Shack.
These same players would simply like DbD to be full of killers that they can loop without worrying, so that they can finish the game congratulating each other, and feeling like they are good.
Except that the problem these players have is that the naughty nurse asks them to be better, which is a problem for some who prefer to wallow in their hypocrisy and laziness.
The nurse doesn't have her range addons anymore.
She doesn't have her recharge addons anymore.
She can no longer one-shot.
She can't use Jolt, K.O., Franklin, etc.
Her back-blink addon has become completely useless.
And you still dare to come and cry about her?
Actually, that's good, because you're just proving that you're just bad.
Hypocritical and bad at the game.
Unable to want to improve, preferring to come crying on the forum, very judiciously evading any questions or remarks that bring these facts to light.
Evade what?
Oh, I don't know, but every time someone asks you to have the COURAGE to show how you play against her, strangely, no one does? Well then? What are you afraid of? Isn't that strange?
"Once you've got the muscle memory down, you're free to terrorize the enemy team and there's not much they can do"
Again, thank you, because it shows that you don't know what you are talking about.
Like many other players, you reduce KNOWING how to play the nurse to UNDERSTANDING how she works.
As I have always said, after a few games, any player will have understood HOW the nurse works.
But to be able to put that into practice against good, even very good teams, that's another matter.
But after all, since you are so sure of yourself, show us ... I would be very curious to see your results against the most monstrous survivors of DbD (or even against very good survivors, because I think that from your words, it would be more than enough to put you in trouble).
Thank you, this is exactly what I just tried to illustrate with my last 2 replies to them. People have all these harsh opinions for Nurse, but ask them to present VIABLE changes that work for ALL levels of play and they stay quiet scratching their head until they eventually ignore the question or move the goalpost
Ask them why their perspective should be validated and they'll tell you "She literally breaks the game". Uhh, we can sit here and point out 1-2 things about almost every Killer on the roster that "bReAk" the game in the form of addons or kits but they conveniently have no issue with that at all. You know why? Because even with those mechanics in place they can still maintain a positive W/L ratio against those Killers regardless of who's playing them
The Nurse hatemongering saga is a microcosm of what we see a lot in real life these days. People do all this preaching/advocating for 'balance' and 'equality' but based off their own words, actions and attitude you can easily tell its not really about either of those two things. A lot of these players that come to Nurse threads to recite the same 1-3 arguments using selfishness and bias under the guise of 'fairness for the majority'. If they truly cared about balance they would seek it and speak on it across all aspects of DBD but a lot of them don't. They don't care if Nurse is actually balanced or not, they just care whether or not they can loop her consistently the way they can with the rest of the roster. No matter how many nerfs she receives and how impactful they are they won't stop complaining until the answer to that question is overwhelmingly yes with minimal effort on their part
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@Monlyth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3328653#Comment_3328653
1) I dunno where you've been, but people have been demanding way more than a slap on the wrist or a "compromise" for Nurse, and they've been doing so for years. Nurse has been through plenty of slaps on the wrist before, and the complaints continued unabated. And why wouldn't they? What made her S-tier or unfun to play against has never been changed.
Nurse could be trash-tier for all the good it would do, honestly. She's just not fun to play against. Much like pre-rework Legion, her power effectively removes all agency from the Survivor playing against her.
2) It really doesn't take a top percentile player to make Nurse oppressive, though. Once you've got the muscle memory down, you're free to terrorize the enemy team and there's not much they can do, aside from stepping up their macro play. Otherwise, Nurse would be a rarity in high MMR.
Yeah, a good Nurse and a good SWF are both oppressive. Especially if that 1-5k-hour SWF brings great items and is going up against a Killer that isn't S-tier. Big surprise, when one side brings out the most broken, unfun tools available and the other side doesn't, the game becomes a frustrating chore for the opposing side.
Wow, you actually supported both of my points while expanding on your own! Its as if I've seen this same conversation play out for the past 5+ years and know exactly how it goes already
I've been here maining Survivor and playing against/as the Nurse players you're speaking about. You literally just supported my stance with this one: People have been demanding for Nurse to have her entire basekit gutted or removed from the game entirely for years and what exactly does that achieve? BHVR and content creators have asked people publicly for the same amount of years to give suggestions and people have. The universal responses to Nurse have been:
A - Remove exposed status synergy or alter most or all of the problematic addons since you can't really take away her blinks without defeating the purpose of her existence. Buff SoloQ and other tiers to close the gap at the top-end
B - Gut her kit, Give her a brand new power that doesn't "break the game", Delete her from the game or
Insert other vague and unrealistic suggestions that don't make senseYou guys have been saying changes like the ones we got are a 'slap on the Wrist' yet in the past 6 years none of you have EVER presented more viable changes across all levels of play than the ones mentioned above that were universally compromised upon. Exactly like I said, there's only two camps of people... A & B ^^^^^ I'm going to take it that you fall under B, the crowd that will literally not be satisfied unless they make it so that the Nurse can only blink twice per 60 seconds and never through walls and floors (aka a clone of the bottom half of the roster)
Also, It doesn't take a professional comp Nurse to cause people trouble (Correct, I agree with you), just like it doesn't take a Hen's-level SWF to wreak havoc on more than half of the Killer roster either. A LOT of you conveniently leave that second part out though which was exactly my point. They both create the same exact feedback-loop yet one is demonized while the other is downplayed with excuses and hyperbole. You don't need a tournament trophy from BotB/DBDLeague and a map-callout cheat-sheet from Hens in order to be an efficient SWF that plays at a good level in public lobbies. If one is universally accepted as 'nature of the beast' then why is the other not? Deep down people know the answer to that, they don't always say it out loud though
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On paper he's clearly better, but the gameplay loop and the main points of criticism for him weren't addressed so to me it nullifies the changes and he might as well just be considered the same
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@Monlyth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3328544#Comment_3328544
"Nerfs that the majority of both sides agreed upon". A fine example of what often happens when you try to please everyone with a compromise: You end up pleasing no one.
What is this "You guys" you're using? You think I'm a Survivor main? You haven't seen my threads complaining about Dead Hard or suggesting Killer buffs to discourage tunneling, I take it.
I complain about Nurse because bad game design is bad game design, regardless of whether or not it's on my team. Nurse is a relic of a time when the devs gave practically no consideration at all to balance or counterplay when designing a new mechanic.
And I bring up comp players because the main argument to defend Nurse is that you just need to "git gud" if you don't like playing against her or die to her. Well, comp players have gotten gud in every sense of the term, and you'll find plenty of them echoing the same sentiment as everyone else.
Again, you just proved exactly what me and many others have been saying for so long. Allow me to point out how
A) "A fine example of what often happens when you try to please everyone with a compromise: You end up pleasing no one."
That's an extremely interesting point considering the fact that the whole foundation of the Nurse drama is that people were mad BHVR didn't wanna "please everyone with a compromise" for a lengthy amount of time.. But now all of a sudden when they finally did it its still not enough. That just reinforces what was already obvious years ago: Some people will never co-sign any change to Nurse regardless of how legit it is unless she just fell from S tier to B-D tier over-night. They don't solely have an issue with her because "she's a step above everybody else", they have an issue with her simply because her power is something they just don't want to play against even if it was nerfed another 5 times straight. As long as she can blink and remove some agency from the Survivors people will cry foul because they can't camp safe pallets and use mediocre pathing against her like they can for others
Sidenote) "What is this "You guys" you're using? You think I'm a Survivor main? You haven't seen my threads complaining about Dead Hard or suggesting Killer buffs to discourage tunneling, I take it."
"You guys" describes anybody that is still using the same talking Anti-Nurse talking points in 2023 that have been rebuttal'd since 2018 era of DBD. It doesn't matter which side they main, they all sound the same on this topic See B) for details on this
B) Comp player's have gotten gud in every sense of the term, and you'll find plenty of them echoing the same sentiment as everybody else
They've never said anything more than what should already be common sense for any grown adult that's played DBD between 2016-2022: The top percentile players can make her feel too oppressive.. You know exactly how the best Survivors in the world make SWF too oppressive for anybody that isn't a comp hug-teching/moonrushing Blight or 8k hour comp Nurse. The overwhelming majority of DBD players echo the "You can't change all Survivors' gameplay just based off the top %, what about the casuals and and the regular people that aren't aiming to play at that level 24/7? Games should be balanced for the majority" sentiment
They somehow abandon that same logic when it comes to whatever they've grown a hatred for (Nurse in this case). Sorry, but your average Prestige 5 public Nurse that the majority of people will come across are not lacking counter-play in any shape or fashion. If they are, PLEASE explain to everyone why an average 1-5k hour SWF is not viewed in the same light as Hen's SWF then. Either Nurse and SWF are both too much across the entire board or they're both fine for the majority and problematic at the top-end. You can't have your cake and eat it too, which one is it?
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@Jay_K said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3328483#Comment_3328483
LMAO. really people it doesnt matter. It really is as simple as this. you want cosmetics buy them. you don't want cosmetics don't buy them. you don't like that this game has limited time cosmetics then im sure you can find another game to play. Or how about you never buy another cosmetic and don't give BHVR any more of your hard earned cash if you feel that strongly about it. I personally will continue to support BHVR because DBD is still a very fun game and if i wanna spend on cosmetics I will and i don't give a damn if those cosmetics are perminant or limited time because at the end of the day it doesn't actually matter.
While your at it please walk into your local super market and protest that you can't buy seasonal items all year round.
Jay out
Oh that's F'in adorable 😂 The classic "Oh, you have a very valid piece feedback that I don't have any comeback for? Just leave the game and deal with it". Cringe, go away shill. You spend more time replying about how it doesn't matter then proving it doesn't matter by ignoring the thread
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@Monlyth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3328120#Comment_3328120
Really? Because comp players would disagree. Hens said so in his latest video, against a Nurse who knows what she's doing, there's just about nothing you can do. All you can really do is die far away from any generators that are being worked on.
All of her "counterplay" is so heavily tilted in her favor that it barely helps against an experienced Nurse.
Lol its 2023 and people are still doing mental gymnastics to hatemonger Nurse even after she's received the nerfs that the majority of both sides agreed upon....
Its hilarious how still to this day people will say SWF and top-end Survivor gameplay is fine to go against because "Its very rare to go against a coordinated SWF (It literally isn't though) and the majority don't play at that level" but want Nurse completely gutted only because the top-end Killers can dominate with her. I said this on the forum last year and its crazy that it turned out to be true.. You guys never wanted fair Nurse nerfs or a rework, you guys just want her either removed from the game entirely or given a completely different power that makes her uniform with the other bullyable Killers in the middle of the pack. Comp players have also said that old Spirit was fine and that the game is historically Survivor-sided at the top, I don't recall many people quoting them on those topics though. If anything, comp players have been historically shamed/ignored by most Survivors because their views on the game contradict each-other
Whenever comp players have said something that benefits Killer they're just "comp players in a non-comp game, who cares what they think? Their style doesn't apply to public lobbies" but the second they say something that average Survivors can relate to they're all of a sudden the voice for the entire community
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@Marik1987 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3327326#Comment_3327326
Because she dont give a sht about every rule in the game. Blight or Spirit, the other two S-Tiers, have to play around the mechanics. I would say without their best addons, they would not be S-Tier. Spirit without MDR and Cherry Blossom for.example is far weaker than with tharm, same for Blight with Comp 33 and Alch Ring. Nurse however dont need addons, she ignores every mechanic anyway.
Bruh.... Just say you've never invested the time to play her during and after the last PTB
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In terms of kit design, the Knight is by far the worst in DBD history (only other valid answer is OG Legion). He highlights the most boring aspects of the game for both roles simultaneously and nothing changed in terms of the community's perception of him. Like I said on ScottJund's video last night he's nothing more than a pseudo-RTS gimmick for people that wanna feel clever with the guards. There's nothing clever or skillful about his kit though, you literally just drop a guard down one lane and pinch the other with the Knight or you just hold W which a 10 year old can also do. Both players hold W until the Survivor reaches a deadzone or a safe corner tile where they still get hit no matter what. Knight fans will act as if people are just missing an undiscovered skill-ceiling for him, but the reality is that there is none. I've tried every credible build combo on him, I nearly completed the grandmaster adept challenge on him, I've looped sweaty players using him since the PTB, There's just little to no skill expression for either player when the Knight is involved
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@Jay_K said:
How is limited timed cosmetics greed? Its just good business. Basicly saying ok we are done with this wave that is now out lets start on new cosmetics. Now yeah i get that having the old cosmetics always around won't take much but when does that stop. 3 years down the line when Feng has 500+ cosmetic sets with all avaliable at the same time? its overwhelming especially to new players who are coming into the game.
BHVR won't turn around on the limited cosmetics because its good to rotate things in the shop to entice spending. this doesnt make the company greedy it makes the company smart as they arn't creating this game out of the goodness of their heart they are doing it to make money and this is a great incentive to get a boost to income. The more income they get the better licence deals they can strike and the more money they can put back into the game.
It is no different to "limited time deals" that are only avaliable for a set period of time and once its gone its gone.
I wonder how many people who complain about these limited cosmetics actually want to pay out for the cosmetics in the first place. or if your just hoping they get very cheap or are just waiting for them to go to irry shards meaning free?
If your not willing to pay for a cosmetic thats fine but at the end of the day its a cosmetic. doesnt matter if you own it or not and it doesnt matter if the cosmetics are avaliable for 1 week or 1 year. There is NO Fear of Missing Out because everyone has the oportunity to buy the cosmetic during that set period. If your unable to then that isnt at fault of behaviour because they are not limiting who can buy the items just saying that they are only on the store for a set period of time. and even if you do miss out you can just get them next year.
“It’s fine everybody, some corporate whale none of us have ever met in our life before makes an extra 3% in revenue and 1% in profit per quarter with this predatory method so it’s obviously the best route to take”
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3327374#Comment_3327374
I'm not shilling for anyone. I'm just tired of the petulant whining over a non issue. Yearly cosmetics are hardly something to get worked up about.
Just because you don't care about this particular topic doesn't mean it isn't an issue (Newsflash, it objectively is).. You're coming off as a conformist. Its a terribly selfish and bad business practice for this specific game to have period. You say you're not shilling yet you're here complaining that people are speaking up about this BLATANT greed that wasn't as common before. People like you are exactly why companies gradually get bolder and less scared of backlash, because they know you guys will do free damage control on their behalf and try to convince people 'iTs nOt ThAt SeRiOuS' no matter how bad something obviously is
For a game with a very low % of new players coming in and a community dominated by long-term customers that have already dished out hundreds & thousands on licensed content + cosmetics, Its extremely bold and disrespectful to continuously increase the frequency of FOMO and other shady decisions with their MTX. This isn't Activision or Call of Duty, BHVR doesn't have the clout to piss off their 30-40k players that they average
When people speak with their wallets and gather around to give feedback I guarantee you BHVR sees or hears it very clearly and they start tightening up. How do you think the last three monumental patches (5.2, 6.1 & 6.5) came to be? Because people spoke with their wallets and left the game or stopped spending as much $ when they weren't enjoying the direction the game was going in. They read/listen to/watch the community even though they sometimes act as if they don't
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I don't think there should be any Killer response-patches for several months. Believe me when I tell you I actively deal with the struggle on both roles, I just think there needs to be an adaptation period for everyone. I'm not mad at all because
A) I SoloQ and a heavy load was just lifted off my back with the new HUD even though its not perfect
B) I play M1/Low tier Killers above the MMR softcap with sweats and prestige 60-100 SWFs. This update will allow players/BHVR to once again see the discrepancy between someone like Ghostface and Nurse which will lead (hopefully) to more adjustments at the bottom end. The gap needs to be closed a bit and the top end still needs some adjustments
C) Bottom-bracket Survivors are being given more tools which is a double-edged sword that will probably impact the way Survivor balance changes are handled in the future. Less people will be able to use SoloQ as copium for their own poor gameplay. (SoloQ IS obviously harder, but there's a LOT of players that are respectfully bad at Survivor pretending that its the ONLY reason they suffer and that Killer is by far 'OP'.) Hopefully these players get catered to less and this is the start of the next era of DBD
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@Gamall said:
63% kill rate and still demand for buffs
You still don't understand how %'s and the stats work? Lol
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@thrawn3054 said:
Who cares? No seriously why does anyone care? So many people act like they are being robbed by limited time cosmetics. If fomo is actually effecting anybody they need to grow up already.
There's no point in shilling for BHVR over FOMO (An area where they're clearly in the wrong, not the players)... They're not going to give you a cut of the $ for defending them lol. When ridiculous things aren't ridiculed and spoken about it leaves room for it to grow into bigger problems.
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For Killer: Anti-Healing build + Hit & Run heavy playstyle
Against good teams you kinda make yourself a meme because gen + healing efficiency will win that war, but when you're in SoloQ with 3 pacifiers on your team its cringe because you already know how its going to play out even if you yourself are not struggling with it. Teammates will either snowball due to forcing risky saves while injured or spend way too much time healing instead of pressuring gens
For Survivor: Boil Over + Obnoxious map offering. Its not even that the combo/players are too hard to counter, its just cringe watching somebody trying way too hard to force value with the predictable 'W key into obvious deadzone/multi-level tile' over and over. Half of them complain anyway when the Killer responds by slugging or ignoring them
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@ThirdHealthEstate said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3327272#Comment_3327272
Yeah well, Nurse is not the best Killer in the game. She is hard to use, even if you master the Killer it comes to a cost to your sanity.
I wish they made other Killers strong. But the point of the Killer is to entertain, to be a clown, free labour for BHVR so that they keep the Survivor player base happy and buying skins. If anyone thinks otherwise it's pure delusion.
Surviving means nothing in this game, escaping is the default.
Nurse is very clearly the best Killer in the game and that hasn't changed in the past 5 years. Anybody else that ever got too close (with the exception of Blight) has been nerfed down 1-4 tiers
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@HoodedWildKard said:
Problem is game has been around for 6 years. The skill curve is crazy bad for newer players, ESPECIALLY survivor. Mmr will still put newish players against people who've been playing since release.
Plus the fact that anyone with a functioning brain stem can play killer effectively. Versus survivor where you need a lot of knowledge and skill to effectively run a killer in chase long enough to be useful.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3325549#Comment_3325549
Doesn't help we have toxic ppl like this ^^
Who go out of their way try and humiliate new players who are frustrated with getting repeatedly sacrificed each round. Probably because they are killer mains who hit their skill ceiling by bullying solo q games and now can't compete with sweaty swfs at high mmr.
This only applies to the baby brackets. Low-MMR Survivor is hard but Low-MMR Killer is easy, High-MMR Survivor is easier and High-MMR Killer is harder. I don't really think you've played long enough if you think Survivor is the only role that requires 'skill' and knowledge
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So the ONLY reason the perk is problematic is because one niche scenario where the Killer gets good RNG? Its already a dead perk and even for the people that occasionally run endgame builds it normally gets cleansed before an insurmountable amount of snowballing is done. Its 2023, NOED shouldn't even be a topic