Waffleyumboy
Waffleyumboy
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@Freki said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1544693#Comment_1544693
the perk itself has no capability of abusing itself. HOWEVER the player CAN ABUSE the effects to bully and harass another player. beyond what is normal. and you are making the case that tunneling is not an abuse, nor is camping or moris, or keys. nothing is abusable in this game... not in the slightest. Oh yea remember why they changed how long it took to start a mori action? that was because of ABUSE by the player themselves. you will notice that I did not say the perk was an abuse to be used but how it was used. At this point your whole argument breaks down and makes anything that happens in the game as long as it is working AS INTENDED not an abuse.
People that do these things are intending to be hooked, killed what so ever. and will call the killer a tunneler when they weren't. example that has been said here: player S with DS gets unhooked and when the killer doesn't go after them but the unhooker they then alter course and run into the killer's swing and go down. now this is done intentionally for various reasons including to now say they were tunneled. this is the abuse that I am talking about both in the forums here and end game chat. the fact they used DS isn't an abuse though it could be seen as such, the fact that they decided to run into the swing isn't abuse but what is the abuse is the intent behind it. This is where your agument falls flat, no one said that the perk abuses another but it was said that the perk is USED to abuse another. the key is the word USED or intent of the word used. the abuse comes from the player's actual actions or their intentions of what to do.
Using in game mechanics as intended is not harrassment. A killer who brings a mori is not a bully, neither is a team with PT and BNPs or a key. Play how you want within the rules of the game, these imaginary honor codes people come up with are simply fake and can be manipulated over time to fit people's narratives. Stick to the facts and you'll never steer yourself wrong.
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@PigMainClaudette said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1544704#Comment_1544704
She doesn't need one, and anyone who actually takes time to play her properly knows that tunnelling is hot garbage. If you want some time, I'll do some Customs for a stream and prove certain things that I have been saying on these forums.
I think that the hatred towards Pig is heavily misguided, and I have similar feelings about Wraith and the myriad of lower ranked players who use him for easy face-camps.
Good luck
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@Moundshroud said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/183021/noed-needs-to-be-removed-or-changed
Um, no? The survivors have NOT won until they successfully exit the gate. Your logic is faulty. Let me point out more fuzzy, half-baked logic. All Noed does is make you and the other suffer from the Exposed status. It means you can be downed with a single hit. There are quite a few Killers who can do that to you from the very start of the game. It is built into them. They don't even have to waste a Perk Slot. There are other Killers who have Add-ons and triggers that do the same. There is Haunted Ground that will do the SAME thing but even dirtier.
The only reason Noed FEELS wrong to you is because you foolishly get this rush of hope and then have to fight your way out. Noed is, in fact, much nicer to you than MANY of the much worse abilities. Why? You know when it happens. There is no surprise. You have the entire game to cleanse those Totems so you make sure the Killer wasted his Perk, and get bonus Objective points for doing it. Even if Noed goes off the Killer STILL has to hit you, and usually when the last generator goes up the Killer has to choose the right gate that most of you are going to run to or they simply miss you. So get over yourself, keep your rage to yourself the way an adult does. We should be dignified and humble in victory, and gracious and polite in defeat. Learn the game. You will find there are things that terrify and annoy a lot more than Noed.
Wow that's a lot of text for someone who's completely wrong. Doing bones is a waste of time, case and point. Just get out as fast as possible and noed is useless.
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@ggezbaby said:
hey, as someone who plays both sides, noed is fair.
honestly you should never assume you've "won" just because you got all the gens done. as survivor, when the last gen is done, i know that's just part 1 of the game. part 2 is the endgame part of the game. in fact, in good games, most of the match is played in endgame because the killer can finally get some momentum after how easy and quick it is for the survivors to just sit on gens while their teammates are being chased.
my advice is: if you're walking along the map looking for a gen and you come across a totem, take a few seconds to cleanse it. i promise you can take a few seconds from your routine of rushing the gens as fast as possible to cleanse a totem. there's only five.
Wow someone didn't have a copy paste answer, nice!
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Noed is fine what needs changing is solo swf gap.
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@PigMainClaudette said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543727#Comment_1543727
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543740#Comment_1543740
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1544314#Comment_1544314
That's NEWER Pig players, and the least optimal way to play her. Something that I and a lot of other Pig players are trying to discourage a LOT as it both brings us down, similar to guilt by association, and it's generally just a terrible way to play.
Unfortunately the logic that goes into trap-tunnelling is also the very logic that I use against it: You know where that survivor will be and what they're doing. Trap-tunnellers use this as an excuse of them being vulnerable and easy to pick off, where I prefer to have a slow game and say that if you have an RBT, I can write you off from the match until it's removed so I can focus on the generators more. Coincidentally it also helps me avoid DS outright, and if I run into a trapped survivor, then I slug them. Eats Unbreakable too!
One thing that I also like to do @redsopine00 to deal with good loopers is to actually just try and ambush them instead, or go for a straight hook-trade if they are coming at me. That first hit can actually really throw off survivors, since you got it so easily from them.
It's nice to hear some pigs don't tunnel, but most do, so pig will probably stay hated until her rework.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543536#Comment_1543536
Yep...
its quite clear right there in OoO perk description...
”when you and the killer look in each other’s direction, use this perk to troll them, and provide your fellow survivors information they otherwise wouldn’t have access to.”
Is alert abusable too?
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543696#Comment_1543696
Not for Legion in his current state. Legion has the same maximum stun time as Nurse. That isn't right. Either make his power worthy of such a harsh punishment or reduce the punishment for using his power.
Reducing the punishment isn't a rework...
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@Mikeasaurus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543781#Comment_1543781
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543800#Comment_1543800
Right, because purposly downing yourself unhooking someone while you have DS was of course the 'intended' way. Or when they decide to hop into a locker. Must have missed that in the Perk description.
Purposefully getting yourself caught is almost always a bad play and is always not worth the risk. These perks existing doesn't change that, there's nothing abusable about them period. You have no argument, only salty complaints.
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@Freki said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543800#Comment_1543800
honestly survivors do "abuse" the mechanics of their perks. oh hey i have ds, i'll sit on this gen for the minute it takes ds to go away, let the killer pull me off and get my ds hit. or i'll jump into a locker and let the killer pull me out to force the ds. and then they will swoop in with the last second of bt and stop a hit. all this time they stay injured... GREAT for the killer when thanataphobia is used! but sucks for your survivor friends because you could be healed otherwise but noooo gotta get that DS in. same with BT but it's not as long so it's more immediate.
this is not how they are intended to be used, the intent on DS and BT is to GET YOU OUT OF THERE. not to have you force something or do a generator with impunity. that is not in their description what so ever. Be quite honest with yourself, you want to use DS as a weapon to punish the killer only because he chased you. I have litterally hooked three people and taken the first to be pulled off the hook down and still gotten hit with a DS! how you ask? 1) down player and hook them (A has DS). 2) chase after player B who tried to swoop in with a bt save, and while downing them player A is unhooked now hook B. 3) see player D and C going to B, intercept D and hook them. 4) C still near, get C and hook them. 5) go to B, player A is there unhooking them and I down them right after. 6) pick up A and get DS'd... please tell me in all this, how the hell did I even tunnel player A? Answer: I didn't and yet in end game chat because B grabbed C and D, A finished opening the door and all got out. nice to know that DS is that much of a shield. In the end game chat player A shouts, in caps, "That's what you get for being a tunneler BISH!" I laugh and tell them I didn't tunnel, prove it... their answer? You got DS'd so you tunneled.
This shows that people think that DS is 60 seconds of KILLER CAN'T TOUCH ME or they TUNNELED ME! no it means you took advantage of DS. what was the ranks of the players? 3, 4, 6 and 7. my rank at the time? 16. I was running plague. so yea.... I banked on thana for people not getting healed or cleansed, but laughed because i was able to down a salt squad easily. Stop lying about your intentions on how to use it and stop calling tunnel when most people don't even know the definition of tunnel to use!
Perks have very little "intent" to abuse. As long as the perks are performing exactly as described, they are not being abused.
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@Demonl3y said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543800#Comment_1543800
Then tunneling and camping also doesnt exists.
Why should survivors be allowed to do and use EVERYTHING they have but Killers dont?
Lets be real, if there would be a way to ,,camp" the Killer so he cant leave the place, almost everyone who complains about it, would use it. Just because they can.
Its not about if anyone abuse something or not, its the fact that people who play like this or use certein things then proceed to complain about other things.
So many times i got called a tunnler because they blocked me with BT active.
Sure you can say they just played smart, but then Killers can also say tunneling is playing smart too, because it is.
Tunneling and camping are real and are perfectly acceptable strategies. Just like is the case with perks.
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I haven't encountered a bug in weeks.
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@Soulslayer618 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543781#Comment_1543781
"how dare survivors have perks and try to use them"
which killer perks do everyone hate again? and complain about nonstop?
the difference is the survivor perks are designed as defensive perks and are being used offensively just to be toxic where as the killer perks exist for the sake of doing the killers objective
Perk abuse doesn't exist period. If you don't like how someone uses their perk, you go ahead and be salty but it's not abuse just by playing the game as intended.
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@Dustin said:
Make his power more engaging for both ends so that it isn't just Killer Chase survivor 2.0. This is also the issue I have with Wraith's power because cloak is cool and all but outside of that it doesn't do anything for him unless he's using super strong addons most of the time.
Being able to injure multiple people should be a bonus part of his power not the main part of it. There's a reason Leatherface's power was used for camping that was the main use for it before his buffs. At least he's passable now.
Legion should get a full on rework. Speed should still be his gimmick but the idea of love tapping people back and fourth is dumb. I still say the people who pushed for HIS POWER to have a penalty for missing a stab using Feral Frenzy is why he's so unfun and garbage right now. You want to know what this caused? People to just walk right behind you breathing down your neck to hit you just like what Bubba needed to do to get off a single chainsaw hit. All because people thought there should be a massive penalty. Absolutely ruined his power and made it unfun and boring for everyone.
Love tapping is their whole gimmick to give the feel of a whole team of edgy teens running around with stabby stabs.
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@xGodSendDeath said:
Missing a stab in feral frenzy is way too punishing, especially for console players who have to deal with low FPS causing them to get spun frequently. I think missing a stab should only deplete the power bar a bit, not take them out of the frenzy. Otherwise, I don't think Legion is that bad. I think they're better than Clown, Demogorgon, Pig, Trapper, Wraith at least
Demo and Trapper just need setup, they're not worse than Legion.
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Honestly I can't stand survivor nowadays. Killer is better than ever though aside from Billy's annoying new sound effects.
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They're just mad cuz they made a dumb play and got punished.
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@Mikeasaurus said:
I find most times they do it because they think you'll chase them after hitting them knowing they also have DS. I just wait out the 15 seconds then down them and eat the DS. The only time I won't is when they just try to protect the survivor that unhooked. That is fine, but when you are blatantly trying to abuse it, then bets are off.
Abuse? How dare survivors have perks and try to use them!
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@Chromeskull said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543740#Comment_1543740
So because they're hard to counter and some pig mains re tunnelers, etc people don't like them?
Not hard to counter, just annoying to run around searching boxes.
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@redsopine00 said:
Ooooooo how about a iridescent add-on where it's a angle trap but only another survivor can get you out of it if it's a normal trap you can escape but with the right add-on it plays into Amanda in the film of rigging her traps to be unwinnable
Yes that would be awesome, I always wondered why this aspect of Amanda's character was never explored in dbd.
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@Yung_Slug said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543680#Comment_1543680
Most killers have powers for that yes, but survivors have loops. The survivor has 20 seconds to get to a loop which will waste way more time than running in a straight line.
One extra chase while injured with a 10-15 second head start can actually be worth tunneling a survivor out of the game in most cases. DS only helps survivors in their most vulnerable state, which feels cheap to killers, but does wonders in terms of the perk's balance.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1542550#Comment_1542550
This ^
And because Blood Warden was indirectly buffed by EGC. If a killer goes on a slug spree during EGC and deliberately waits till the timer bar is about 3/4 depleted before doing a hook, then any remaining survivors are 100% dead unless they have a hatch key.
So survivors are much much more insistent on ensuring that every survivor is safe/bear a gate before opening to avoid that scenario.
Lol, funny how survivors presume every killer has BW, but so many don’t presume every killer has NOED and don’t do bones.
Actually many survivors do bones. In my games as killer there are at least 2 dulls broken and against swf they usually break all 5. Survivors aren't incompetent hypocrites, many of them know what they're doing and how the game works.
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@Khar said:
It only became a thing after EGC. Its basically a loophole survivors found to get around the EGC.
It's intended, not a loophole. Devs have addressed the salty complaints and made it clear that egc is there to end the game, not to give killers free pressure.
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Pigs like to tunnel and she is basically just an m1 killer in chase. Bear trap rng is annoying as well.
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@Talmeer said:
I don't see there a problem.
Delete dw, since it annoys survivors anyways and give him the abilitie back to stab multiple times in frenzy, still with all the nerfs that the Legion has today on it.
And vola - problem solved.
Not optimal, but the best old Legion mains can get and survivors whould not need to play mending simulator anymore. That's a win-win-situation for everyone.
So Legion would just be a fast m1 killer?
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I've always pushed the idea of keys only letting the holder escape and having a 7 second hatch opening animation so they can't jump into hatch in your face.
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@AvisDeene said:
No, Keys should be changed to only allow the key holder to escape and they shouldn't be able to find them in a chest. Moris should be reworked, become base-kit and allow you to only kill a survivor on death hook. To make it a little less powerful, maybe have a 2-3 second window to where Survivors can have a small chance to blind you with a flashlight and cancel the mori.
Basekit moris but no keys in chests? Nice bias.
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@Bullettimegod said:
Moris literally skip a hook state. Instead of removing, i vote killers have to hook everyone at least once before moris can activate. So it rewards even better play from survs.
Agreed, it adds counterplay while still having them be game changers.
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1m at tier 1, 1.5m at tier 2, 2m at tier 3
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Balancing is always possible.
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@Aneurysm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543686#Comment_1543686
You can want DS deleted if you like. You can want the stun buffed to half an hour if you like. I never criticised anyone for having different opinions, only for using contradictory arguments to support said opinions - so stop attacking straw.
People don't have contradictory arguments, different people have different arguments.
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Sounds cool
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@voorheesgt said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543280#Comment_1543280
Wow 😳. Survivors just want the matches spoon fed to them.
While doing this rework they should rework NOED to instantly sacrifice all who worked on the final gen😃... Or change blood warden to speed up the end game collapse dramatically every time someone t bags at the exit... Just for anti toxic trolling.
See how strange it sounds when we ask for killer perks buffs on the same level of these ridiculous DS suggestions...
Devs, can we just put in a mode where a giant potato rolls around them map while survivors work on gens? Just make sure the potato still gets stunned by flashlights, lockers and pallets. You know, so it won't be boring for survivors.
In my comments I'm asking for added restrictions to DS bro...just read please.
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@Aneurysm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543444#Comment_1543444
Yes but people say it's not an anti-tunnelling perk, which the devs have agreed with, so that makes sense. They also go on to say it only affects tunnelers. Both things can't be true.
They don't go on to say that...different people have different opinions like I just said...
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@Yung_Slug said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543617#Comment_1543617
Okay, assume you pick up someone with DS and the other 3 survivors are each on a generator. You are a 115% killer and the survivor runs in a straight line.
You are stunned for 5 seconds. The survivor gains 20m of distance. You begin chase, and take about 30 seconds to catch up. Downing them again and picking them back up takes about 5 more seconds. By then 3 survivors have completed half of their generators.
DS only gives about 15m of distance because of the animation. 15÷.6=25 so yeah it's almost 25 seconds in a straight line. This is one time use and only in some situations. Most killers have powers which make the time even less. Is this invincibility?
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@MyersRulz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543589#Comment_1543589
Im not name calling, as i said i do think he has some good ideas here, but the ones that are focused on to the killer side seem way to harsh compared to the surivor side thats all. So its hard to take him seriously when he proposes a 30 second stun when you know that is enough time to 50% at least 2 gens.
That's perfectly fine. Thank you for your constructive input.
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@Freki said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543551#Comment_1543551
30 second stun? that's a balanced thing? you know what that means? if the doors are powered and someone is unhooked the killer can only go into a corner and wait for the players to leave because oh that tunneling thing... oh yea 30 seconds? 12 seconds????? what the hell??? there is nothing that is a benefit for killers. here is my rebuttal for this:
DS: nerf to 30 second time out, rank 1 gives 2 second stun. rank 2 gives 3 second stun, rank 3 gives 4 second stun.
NOED: remove from hex status, back to original mode.
REMOVE KEYS all but the broken key. on the map there are 2 locations you can get the parts needed to complete the key, and it only works for the character that uses it.
Mori: make that base kit with 2nd hook requirement. add general perk to bring it back to after 1st hook.
HOW ABOUT THEM APPLES? lol if you couldn't tell i'm being very sarcastic, but the OP is very off balance here and you are incorrect it is not balanced changes what so ever.
You don't have to attack op just cause you think one of the changes had too many flaws. Calmly discuss how these are design flaws and perhaps how to fix them. This is a discussion, not a post review.
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@Yung_Slug said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543562#Comment_1543562
I'm trying to explain why doing totems should disable OP's version of DS. Say you have Devour Hope with let's say 3 stacks. The person with DS finds it. They start working on it. You stop them. You can't pick them up because they have DS and you "tunneled" them. They pick themselves back up with Soul Guard. They get back on it. You go back to them and down them. Eventually, another survivor might try to heal the slug and will also see the hex totem. The only real way to stop this is it sit by the hex and keep downing the DS guy, which will result in a loss because everyone else did gens.
Come to think of it, healing another survivor should definitely disable it as well so you don't have an invincible medic running around.
Your problem is assuming DS makes you invincible. A temporary availability of a 5 second stun is not invincibility, and thinking it is can cause you to straight up lose games as killer. As killer, no matter what you think, you are in control and the survivors are at your mercy.
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@ChiTenshi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543595#Comment_1543595
But it’s a start. The chase system can be sorted out later (with many other aspects of the game that need fixing).
True
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@MyersRulz said:
@Waffleyumboy Plus it says it only deactivates if you are picked up outside the killer terror radius, imagine bodyblocking infinitely because you keep getting back inside the killer terror radius.
The killer can interrupt the pick up but yeah this looks like another oversight.
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That sounds good, but the chase system is too inconsistent imo.
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@MyersRulz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543570#Comment_1543570
But we cant since he didnt put that as a deactivation method so yeah easily abused as i said.
One small oversight isn't an indicator of bias. OP probably didn't have anybody to bounce this off of which is why it's so unpolished. If you really want to work with others to make good changes to dbd, now's the time for doing that, not for name calling.
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@Bullettimegod said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543551#Comment_1543551
Lmfao what? Ds nerf? Yep 30 second stun = ds nerf? Basekit moris only on death hook? Yet you claiming im biased?
You'd have to be biased to say that op is biased for nerfing killers more when they did nothing of the sort. Yes it is a ds nerf because it literally only activates if the killer has their nose attached to the survivor at all times.
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@MyersRulz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543556#Comment_1543556
Yeah because there is not such a thing as body blocking....
The unhooked survivor can still get hit right? Even then with all these restrictions we can assume that ATM deactivates when the surv takes a protection hit(because literally everything deactivates it) so bodyblocking is not just not a problem, but also favorable for the killer as it allows them to tunnel.
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@Yung_Slug said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543502#Comment_1543502
Okay but if a survivor has this version of DS (and totems don't disable it) and Soul Guard you literally cannot stop them from breaking your hex without throwing the game.
Sorry I don't follow...
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@MyersRulz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543534#Comment_1543534
I did read all of it, in high level plays survivors will obviously take advantage of this by chasing the killer knowing that they have full immunity making it just a time waster for the killer, it just sound incredibly broken.
Survivors can't waste the killer's time, nothing's forcing the killer to tunnel. If the survivors want to run around doing nothing until ATM wears off, the killer should be glad.
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@Bullettimegod said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543530#Comment_1543530
Not biased at all. Look at it. Noed nerf. Mori removed. Keys still in game. Endgame where a door is 50% a locked closet? 30 second stun to a killer, or if missed skill check gives 15 sec stun? Yet you called me bias? Okay. Lol
Look at it. DS nerfed, keys nerfed, basekit mori, swf nerfed, and killers buffed. They purposefully balanced the changes out so killer biased people wouldn't complain, and yet you're still here because you don't want equality, you want things to go your way. How about instead of calling bias you instead check your own bias and address the post as if you were looking to make the game better overall, instead of just for you.
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@RizeAki said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/182894/whats-up-with-all-these-genrushers
It’s not gen rushing you just aren’t pushing them off gens
they have nothing else to be doing but gens if you are chasing someone
gen rush gets thrown around way too much same as tunneling, camping, and slugging
Real issue is the fact the game has no other major objective and it allows survivors to spawn separate and on top of gens good change would be the pregame and for survivors to always spawn together and no where near gens
Set pregame spawns would mean killers don't have to patrol at game start, but I think that patrolling should stay because it's a core piece of killer gameplay.
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@MeltingPenguins said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1543524#Comment_1543524
Oh, I rather meant 'exploit' in the sense of 'not using it as intended to gain an unfair advantage'
As far as I know all of her perks work exactly how they say they do.
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@MyersRulz said:
Yeah man you have a couple of good ideas in here, the totem indicator and the doc changes (this one is kind of broken though but it sounds cool) for example.
But to be honest you lost me with the 30 seconds stun to punish tunneling, even 5 seconds is already too much, 15 seconds stun for new ds (given how meta it already is), 20 seconds immunity in a locker... Sorry man you just sound way too survivor biased to take you seriously.
You didn't even read the restrictions they put on the ATM, it basically only activates if the killer literally just follows the survivor straight off the hook. They are not survivor biased at all, but I see now where your bias lies. I agree 30 seconds is pretty dumb, 5 seconds is enough even with the added restrictions.