Venusa
Venusa
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- Venusa
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606928#Comment_3606928
Thats only accurate if you have a truly representative sample though. Which would require you to pick out 16k random players. But nightlight isn't looking at 16k random players. Its looking at players who know it exists, and who report data to it, which is going to be a very specific, very biased subset of players.
Also are you just going to glaze over the fact that for a month if i played nothing but twins games where i 0ked every game i could single handedly take the twins kill rate from 61% below 30%?
@just_one_player said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606987#Comment_3606987
This problem is related to the sampling process and not to the sample size, a sample of 1 million matches would still be insufficient, so everything you said about sample size is still wrong, especially in stating that the sample should be proportional to the population at around 10% to be representative.
@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606326#Comment_3606326
This will never stop being funny.
What I didn't expect was that after the nerf went through we'd still have voices arguing that it wasn't a nerf.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606987#Comment_3606987
But nightlight isn't looking at 16k random players. Its looking at players who know it exists, and who report data to it, which is going to be a very specific, very biased subset of players.In this situation none of that is relevant.
We're comparing like population groups: people who used nightlight before and after the changes to MFT. Among that group we've seen MFT crater.
Is there any reason or evidence to think that this group is unique in how they've adjusted play?
Also are you just going to glaze over the fact that for a month if i played nothing but twins games where i 0ked every game i could single handedly take the twins kill rate from 61% below 25%?We're not talking about twins or speculation on if the system can be gamed doesn't mean it is being gamed. You can talk about the ability to manipulate killer data, but that is totally irrelevant to the survivor side data. Being there are four survivors in every game reported and the reporter could control at most 1 of them, all of this is a red herring.
I don't know why everyone is talking about Twins's killrate on NL when the topic is clearly Top perks which is way easier to predict. They're 2 very different things and this discussion isn't even about if NL is reliable or not because when it comes to top perks it's proven to be almost completely accurate. I literally posted screenshots of NL's accuracy as proof when it comes to top perks but @Reinami just ignored or refused to see it because it doesn't help their narrative. Nobody even claimed killrates or Killer pickrates are absolutely correct on NL. I don't understand why @Reinami created that narrative, ran with it and muddied the discussion with unrelated commentary. Thanks.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606580#Comment_3606580
I mean, this is called confirmation bias.
If you look at the perks that nightlight misses, it's not just wrong, it's very wrong.
Nightlight doesn't have self care (#6) even in the top 10, so instead of the actual pick rate of ~15%, it's somewhere less than 8.7%. That's an incredibly large miss to just toss out or ignore.
I don't understand this or I read this wrong. I'm not saying it's %100 correct, I keep saying NL was pretty accurate when it comes top picked perks which is an objective truth.
They got the general picture of the top picked perks almost completely right. Placing 8/10 and 9/10 of perks somewhere on top correctly among hundreds of perks but because they didn't get 3 perks right it's "very wrong" and completely unreliable?
edit. I just realized I kept saying "perk pickrates" on some of my comments instead of "top picked perks" by accident so now I feel kinda dumb I apologize for the typo.
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@Quizzy said:
Listen. I'm gonna ask what I wanna ask. No one is gonna stop me. I will have my shirtless gabriel one day.
Did you see his upcoming ugly sweater? It's super cute.
AND IT ISN'T ORANGE!
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Do NOT bring my grandma into this!!!
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606580#Comment_3606580
Sometimes that is going to happen. That is how statistics work. You have a population, and then you have a sampling of that population.
Sometimes, especially if you are correctly sampling your population, such as in political polls (which also aren't accurate but for different reasons) the sample will be correct. But that is assuming you have a large enough sample size to account for said population.
Now lets look back to nightlight. According to nightlight, twins has a 61.15% kill rate. But also look at how twins only is looking at 161 games played. Now, generally to get statistically relevant data, you want to have a sample of around 10% of your population. Which isn't always feasible. So you go with a margin of error and a confidence level to determine that. Now around 161, is going to give you a margin of error of around 10%.
This means that the actual kill rate for twins could be 51.15% or 71.15%. The lower the sample size, the less accurate your measurement is going to be. But that is assuming you are looking at 161 different players, which is not likely.
The point i'm making is. Nightlight is looking at such a small small minority of games, that i don't think you should be looking to it for your stats, as it likely is going to be far less accurate.
The other example is that the samples are inherently not random and are biased. Nightlight requires self reporting, which by its nature is only looking at a specific type of player. For example, i am a nurse main. And looking at nurse, they are reporting 715 games played for a month of data there. If i play an average of 2-3 hours a night, in a month. Lets say around 13 minutes per game (and queue times and such) that means that in a given month i can play Probably around 10-15 games a night. Meaning that i could personally account for HALF of those reported games of nurse.
Now what if i played twins a killer i don't actually play and am terrible at? I could probably single handedly tank the twins kill rate on that chart by just reporting every twins game i play.
The main point here, is that probably twins doesn't have a 61% kill rate, but that a handful of dedicated twins mains who use nightlight who are really good are pumping up her numbers. These could be players that are really really good at the game and aren't representative of actual reality.
This is why nightlight is not accurate.
I'm NOT talking about killrates or Killer pickrates though? I know those are very variable too. I'm deliberately emphasizing TOP PICKED PERKS each time I speak. You can check the pictures I attached on my comment prior. "8/10" and "9/10" accuracy isn't just "sometimes that is going to happen". That's just accuracy.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606326#Comment_3606326
Firstly,
Nightlight is not a good place to go for statistics, because it is an extremely small sample size of the games that are actually played
Secondly,
Lets look at actually officially released data from a few months ago
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/ZHSW02L40K4Q/image.png
Usage rate =/= effectiveness. Of course something with a higher skill ceiling is going to have less use rate. Because for some reasonthis community thinks you always need to balance and look at "average" players. Even nightlight, which is not accurate, is showing something similar that the previously released statistics are showing. Look at all of those perks and think about it, what do the vast majority of them have in common?
- Windows of opportunity
- MFT
- Adrenaline
- Resilience
- Lithe
- Self care
- Deja Vu
- Sprint Burst
- Dead Hard
- Kindred
I'll give you a minute to think about it before i tell you the answer, but i really want you to think about it before you scroll down. Are you ready? Ok here we go...
All of these perks with the exception of Windows of Opportunity and MFT are perks that are either baseline, are are given to you on survivors for free from buying the game (or in the case of david, completing the tutorial). The 2 outliers here are MFT and Windows of Opportunity.
My explanation for WOO being there is that it is an amazing noob perk when you are new at the game and have no idea where anything is. It helps you learn maps faster and get to safety even if you aren't familiar with a map. If anything, this shows that WOO Should probably be made into a base perk that everyone gets.
What is the other outlier? MFT. Which this was before its nerf. And this shows that there is probably something wrong with MFT before the nerf. If its usage rate is SO high that it is actually beating out free perks so shortly after its release. Meaning you can't have it from shrine, you HAD to buy the DLC. This shows 2 things.
1) The singularity chapter was a financial success. Given that at least 21% of survivors owned the DLC, meaning that at minimum if DBD had a million players, they sold 168,000 copies of that DLC
2) MFT was a problem because of just how much of an outlier it was compared to all of the free non-paid perks.
You know what else those usage stats showed though? That self-care was the 6th most use survivor perk. Now, if we looked and balanced things based on usage statistics, this probably puts self-care in the "needs a nerf" range right? And i think we can all agree that currently self care is probably one of the worst perks in the game. So in short. Stop looking at usage statistics for your balance decisions. Especially from non-official sources.
Because do you know what else your "precious" nightlight shows? That
- Skull merchant is the most OP killer in the game
- Skull merchant, Twins, Onryo, Wraith, Chucky, Pyramid Head and DOCTOR all have a higher win rate than NURSE
- That all of those above killers and myers and hag have a higher win rate than BLIGHT
And if you think that doctor needs a nerf and is more OP than nurse, than i have a bridge to sell you.
It's kinda funny how you posted the official top perks BHVR themselves shared that almost completely matched the Top 10 picked perks on NL during that time but then you said NL isn't a good source for statistics... Sure there are variables and not every single number should be taken as a fact on there but top perks specifically were mostly pretty accurate with a couple of small differences.
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@Foempticol said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606428#Comment_3606428
Shouldn't they hire more employees then?
They should hire us.π
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They do make adjustments based on PTB feedback but it is only a testing ground for changes already planned or scheduled. So every little change takes ages.
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All of Ripley's perks are so trash while Xeno got really good perks.
They had nice ideas for her perks but the limitations make them too niche or situational.
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These arguments about punishing people because they have friends is so entitled and laughable. I can't imagine seeing posts like this on any other gaming forum. How embarrassing and unhinged has this community become...
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
If you have pictures or video of the match, report the killer.
Having a match where the killer isn't downing, chasing, or hooking for an excessive amount of time is against game rules for holding the game hostage, and can be bannable.
I didn't think of reporting them because I was just glad it was over and left immediately. I usually only report for harassment or exploits but I guess you're right.
@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/399817/i-cant-wait-for-the-3-gen-solution
I hope the 3 gen solution also punishes survivors that refuse to commit to repairing generators, and are excessively pre-leaving generators or excessively hiding. Because that's often a major part of the 3 gen problem.
I'm up for any solution that helps matches not last more than 15 minutes...π
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@Raconteurminator said:
I don't think it's all your fault, but I do think it's some of your fault. That's a nasty 3-gen that, while you didn't put it there, you did commit your time and resources on all the safer gens first. Preemptively shooting down reasonable criticism as bias worth ignoring doesn't help you. It doesn't change the fact that you all had an opportunity to go for it early but didn't. I'd wager there was a nice view of it from where the free generator that people like to do first spawns, so it's not like you could have missed it.
While I can agree with some parts of your comment, this doesn't mean the game has to last 30+ mins. The Killer had every opportunity to end the game by then and you can see 2 people are already dead hook. Refusing to chase or hook survivors because your only priority is that 3-gen is absurd and indefensible.
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deadzones and pre-setup 3gens
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@albertoplus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3601112#Comment_3601112
I suppose this is the moment when i answer π¨^^^^P100 TOXIC ABUSER SPOTTED^^^^π¨ also trying to be cool or something?
Yes, i do sometimes lobby dodge when i see a P100. I assume you are saying that because i'm using some kind of cheat or-oh wait, the game itself gives you the option to dodge for a reason. Does using what the game gives to me a LoBbY DoDgEr? Is that some kind of title?
Honestly, i kinda understand some people's points tho. If i had my easy games playing against people with far less skill than me, honestly i would also want to keep being able to do that. No jokes.
What does even "P100 toxic abuser" mean? Make it make sense. I made a joke and you admitted it's true so keep dodging them lobbies maybe you'll get better at the game doing so! Anways I'll be disengaging since I don't want to muddy this discussion.
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@albertoplus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3600878#Comment_3600878
I mean, the "prestige numbers dont mean anything!!!" thing has been debunked already. On both the things I see in my own games and people that have posted actual stats.
As you said, its almost 2024. It's about time to stop with this "P100 doesnt mean skill" non-sense.
Also, why are people actually against those things like the option i did say? Everytime someone says that the prestige option should not be hidden or to be able to not play against those P100, everyone jumps onto him. If everyone knows that P100 doesnt mean anything, what harm is having it being shown in lobby or just to be able to avoid playing against them? No one would avoid those P100 right?
Ah, but people want it hidden because people actually try to avoid them. Dunno why.
ο»Ώπ¨ο»Ώ^^^^LOBBY DODGER SPOTTED^^^^π¨
@UndeddJester said:
I'd be more in favour of just hiding prestige until end game. I'd also not provide a link to player profiles until end game either.
So many more problems get solved by doing so than it causes. My months playing without seeing prestige showed me you literally lose nothing other than e-peening in lobbies, and you remove queue dodgers and backfill issues.
Absolute win. 10/10. Plz BHVR implement again.
Yeah I agree. Well said, period.
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and you STILL got a 2k against those "meta" survivor perks while playing a new Killer that was released less than a week ago also while using mostly useless perks yourself... WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT?
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@albertoplus said:
First, give me something in the options menu like "you will not be paired with survs/killers with more prestige than you most leveled up survivor/killer". I should be able to activate or deactivate that.
Then yeah, you can hide the prestige.
you're scared of prestige numbers and still think they mean something nearing 2024? haha.
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@Xxjwaynexx said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3599676#Comment_3599676
You can't use pop and pain res together unless someone taps the gen and that's still not using them together meaning you can't proc pain and pop the same gen. Kind of like how you can't pop a gen that was just hit with surge. The problem with these perks arent what they do but the lack of game sense the survivors have. If you as a survivor tap a gen that was just hit with pain res and allow the killer to pop that gen then it's a survivor problem not a perk or killer problem. The last thing you want to do is take away a perk that encourages different hooks and chases.
You can definitely use them together, very effectively too. There's a reason they're the Top most picked perks and most Killers use them together. Just because they don't have the perfect synergy doesn't mean they aren't strong together.
I don't have the will to explain further since I don't feel too strongly about this discussion though but I respect your opinion.ποΈ
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@Xxjwaynexx said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3599662#Comment_3599662
Pain res and pop both require the killer to get downs to work and one can only work 4 times per match and pop can only work 12 twelve times per match just saying. What would you propose for a viable nerf or rework to both so that they remain healthy gen regess perks.
I just wanted to agree that 2 combined together can be very strong. Pain res. can erase 1 gen worth of progress remotely and you can use Pop 12~ times. I don't know why you said "only" considering that's a big number in a game like DBD where matches and chases don't last that long. Unfortunately, I don't have any "nerf" suggestions since I'm not a fan of how BHVR handles nerfs.
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Pain Res + Pop is crazy together but I ain't gonna say nothing cuz I know forum killers are going to choke me...
I can't tell you how many times you have to re-do a single gen... 1 hook and we're almost back to %0 again... Ok.
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@Foempticol said:
This post didn't age well, prestige levels are still visible in the lobby LOL
We'll get there. Them even testing hidden prestiges for a while was a big move imo. Good times... most Killers would just ready up immediately and I could play any character I want without judgment.
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@Raccoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3596775#Comment_3596775
The Mettle of Money strategy was Made for This very purpose!
oh you ATE with thissssssssπ
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Yes... It's really bad. I'm not surprised though pings have been awful for a while now.
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I'm so happy they acknowledge feedback.
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3593065#Comment_3593065
I always portrait YunJin being selfish
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/8Z5QVBAUMXO9/image.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/OSVTU0CLVTED/image.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/MII2GTQU11BC/image.png
And look at us like peasants we are
omg you're amazinggggg
yui abs' sweat water ππ
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I main Yun-Jin and people who know lore tend to assume I'm selfish... but I'm not just selfish, I'm also gorgeous. π
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Damn you kinda ate with this post ngl...π
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Anytime I don't use anonymous mode I get homophobic comments in either pre or post-game chat. I don't want to change my Steam profile or name because I like the way it is and I'm not going to censor myself or identity because of some bigots. I also share a server with the RU region and needless to say they always go out of their way to target me during or after the game. I don't play any other game that reveals my profile or name so I don't have to deal with this. So to prevent this I use the tools available to me which is to use anonymous mode.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3591188#Comment_3591188
Depends. Will you be a good survivor and loop really well?
No...π But I can press M1 really well! Is that good enough?π
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@Xernoton said:
I don't really have a go to rule for this. I just let them go when I feel like it and I can live with 4 escapes when I was beaten by pure skill. It's not like absolutely have to kill someone after the gens are done. I tend to let survivors go more often, when someone kills themself on hook / disconnects. Or when someone has proven themself in chase. As a sign of respect. There have been quite a few times when I played against survivors that were incredibly good in chase and I gave them either hatch or let them escape.
Will you let me go Xernoton?π’
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@HerInfernalMajesty said:
As my go-to rule if I see a Survivor has an event item I automatically always let them escape. I would hate for them to lose the item.
Other times when a Survivor makes a blatant mistake I will sometimes give them a small head-start or even just let them escape too.
When do you (if ever) allow Survivors to escape?
You're too sweet.βΊοΈ
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3590903#Comment_3590903
That's interesting. Again, I dont know too much about it, but thank you for the explanation, it helped.
I live in the US, so I (fortunately) never really have to deal with this since USD, Euro, and ASD have really standard prices for my region.
You're welcome! Thank you for your understanding.π
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It's weird that the Chapter prices were adjusted to use the suggested regional pricing but AC were left untouched...
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
Regional Pricing can be really tricky for games, I hope BHVR can fix this but I dont know much about pricing games on Steam so Idk what is/isnt possible.
For a very long time DBD was already using regional pricing for different regions both for Chapters and Auric Cells purchases. There was a big Steam change that required devs to manually adjust their prices to "suggested/regional" pricing and if they didn't Steam would automatically reflect the original price. Thankfully DBD updated the Store prices to reflect the suggested regional prices but I'm assuming they didn't check the AC costs so it's just the standard USD value for LATAM and MENA which makes it very expensive for some regions. That's how I could sum this situation up.π
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I also made a suggestion about this. I'm from MENA.
A regional pricing is being used on Steam Store for Chapters but with Auric Cells they dropped the suggested regional pricing used prior to the Steam currency change and it's just the original USD value now. This creates a big gap between Chapter vs. AC costs. You could purchase almost 3 Chapters instead of a single outfit (1100 AC) in my currency right now and they cost the same which doesn't make sense. I want to keep supporting the game but AC is very unrealistic for my region to purchase on Steam atm.
I hope they really consider this.
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Phew! We survived another season. Don't let them know how broken and problematic CS is.π
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Hopefully visible prestiges go away with the upcoming Player Cards feature and people can choose to show their prestiges on those cards if they really wish to.
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@MrsGhostface said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3588696#Comment_3588696
Times have changed, but I feel like this is the experience now. Recently came back from a few month break and was suprised at the lack of Claudettes. Thalita is very common for me to run into
Thalita slays though I get it π
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Chucky is full of hug-techs so I'm not sure at this point...
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Are you asking for a 3-in-1 Survivor Nerf Bundle or a Dying Light Buff?
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Hmm... I have a hard time believing Claudette would be less popular than Yui and Thalita?
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@clowninabout said:
Can we see the survivors ping too in that case? I've seen many survivors rubber banding all over the place with very high ping.
You already can. If the survivor has a high ping there's a red bar next to their name even in lobby before the game starts and in-game.
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Yeah. I don't understand why Survivors' high ping are available for other survivors and killers to see in the lobby with a red indicator but the most crucial one which is the Killer's ping isn't showed until you load into the game and realize you're screwed.π€·
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The only thing I notice is terrible ping LOL...
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Everybody says they would love to have different game modes but I can't stop imagining the amount of chaos and backlash it would create on here with everybody complaining and crying about how Killer/Survivor sided it is.
I mean we just had the Void Event where they tried to implement something new and fun that was like a mini-game mode and the amount of "This event sucks! It's not fair! Survivors/Killers use void to their advantage! Unacceptable!" discussions were crazy.
So I totally get why they would be scared to create something like a new game mode on Core game.
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Because competitive people think if they don't get a 4k at 5gens they've lost miserably.
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@BlueRose said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3587201#Comment_3587201
Oh please this whole community is a us vs them augment. Every single day I see the same stuff on both sides I just decided to join since there no point in fighting against these arguments anymore. We all favor one side over the other and DBD will never be a truly balanced game. I just write my opinions down and leave them. Ppl can agree or disagree with them all they want, it honestly doesn't matter to me bc at the end of the day my life doesn't revolve around what faceless strangers on a Internet forum think of me or my opinions.
I can't speak for all killers but I can for certain say I never complain about Lithe, SB, WOO, Resistance, or adrenaline. I think the only two perks I ever really hated and complained about are old DH and MFT. That's it nothing else. I may make few comments about other survivor perks but I never went on and on about them. Take WOO I never thought it's a op perk it only really helps newer and average players in chase. Nothing wrong with this perk and honestly I don't mind seeing it in every single match. Adrenaline is annoying but honestly I never play for the end game in DBD anymore especially since hope and MfT has made end game more miserable but I still don't think Adrenaline needs to be nerfed.
The reality is that every single normal player usually picks a side they enjoy more in this game and they favor that side. This why I say DBD at end of the day will always be a us vs them game. It not like other games where both sides have the same choices in characters, powers and items. DBD is a role based 4v1 game and it will always be survivor mains vs killer mains.
I never said you personally complained about those specific perks though. I simply said your comment was unfair and one-sided since both sides ask for "what's the next nerf" constantly and gave some examples. That's all.π
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I choose not to see it therefore it doesn't exist.π
