Sarief
Sarief
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- Sarief
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@DocOctober said:
@Sarief said:
from experience: run whispers or just let them take the hatch. This struggle is NOT worth itAnd where are the 12 or so Perk slots that a Killer supposedly should have with all the "take this Perk for that, that Perk for this, take these two to counter this..." arguments?
In his lightborn slot
also, this is OPTION if you run the perk. If you don't then don't struggle near hatch, go to look for the surv near engines, he might have not found hatch yet. The struggle near hatch is not wortyh it.
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from experience: run whispers or just let them take the hatch. This struggle is NOT worth it
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so killer has to have softban because one of the 4 survs has garbage internet, while 3 others have green?
Or cuz he sees 4 flashlights and names "squadette 1"...
and survivor should receive ban cuz he connects and sees red that flashes green? really?
There is a reason and obviously you ignore it -
@Jack11803 said:
@SariefAnd if it isn’t too strong... then let’s put it in the game! The idea of it makes my loins burn
don't let your fantasies run wild, it's going to turn into smth terrible
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@Jack11803 said:
@Sarief said:
@Jack11803 said:
How to make wraith super viable, guide by Jack. Buff ghost speed. Increase regular speed to what cloaked speed used to be. Instant top tier.You do know that increasing his speed to 6 m/s will make him THE best killer, regardless of other changes, including lightburn without cloaking, etc?
.....YUP!
my bad, apparently it's 5.04, which does not change anything
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@Jack11803 said:
How to make wraith super viable, guide by Jack. Buff ghost speed. Increase regular speed to what cloaked speed used to be. Instant top tier.You do know that increasing his speed to 6 m/s will make him THE best killer, regardless of other changes, including lightburn without cloaking, etc?
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here, actual numbers from wiki
Default +0 % 1.0 c/s 80 seconds
Slightly +10 % 1.1 c/s 72.72 seconds
Moderately +15 % 1.15 c/s 69.56 seconds
Considerably +20 % 1.2 c/s 66.67 seconds
Tremendously +25 % 1.25 c/s 64 secondsaddition from me: doing one charge with slightly would take 0.909 seconds, you can do the math from here
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one charge is one second of doing engine (or smth) without tool
for each charge there is toolbox descreases seconds it takes to make itso 1 engine = 80 seconds without toolbox = 80 charges
with toolbox you will do 80 charges BUT in less seconds (depending on you speed modifier (moderately/considerably, etc)so doing 80 charges with moderately will do it in 75 seconds and considerably in 72 seconds
because doing 1 charge with toolbox takes not 1 second but 0.97 seconds- note: sorry, I'm too lazy to look at actual numbers. Those are made up
be careful not to waste your brown toolbox as it only has 80 charges so you have to stop before doing it completely...
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just press 2, if they want help, they will understand
If you're going for shot out, killer will hear you and you couldn't heal them anyway
people also run bond, so they see whoever around when in solo queue
If they don't care and simply run away, well....for console players: 2 on pc gives emote "come here"
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1) traps spawn into map already set.
2) setting up time INCLUDES animations for kneeling down and standing up. Addons affect the time for those animations as well.done, scariest killer in the game again
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bodyblocking has simple solution, really.
Just hit the damn survivor.
If you have iron grasp, you have enough time to hit them at least 4 times. One will be down. Maybe more.I had body blockers vs nurse with irongrasp. I downed two completely. two others were injured.
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result: past rank 15 no totem ever lasted. the end.
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No. Try playing killer if u want something new...
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buff coming up SoonTM
he's iconic because, well, he's a tough ######### killer. He's your Myers meets Jason but you could actually meet him IRL, cuz no supernatural stuff is around him.
He's scary cuz you can definetely see him as person. You can associate with him. You can be in his skin. That's why he's so badass and scary.
Of course, he's also freaking walks faster than you run.he's first killer introduced and because of great design received "canadian killer award 2016" and was the only killer for some time.
He's one who fought entity the longest, as he did not lose hope but simply did not have any and did not want to submit. Unlike other killers it took the longest for him because he defied entity until the end.
as for why not viable: he was OP and then nerfs. New killers introduced, nerfs to balance that and he got in a way of those. Traps that you can escape in 3 seconds cannot beat teleportation and instadowns. (Could you escape beartrap? It'll probably just snap you leg in two IRL)
Also, people got used to him and now simply follow him and disarm his every trap, so he becomes killer without power. -
@DocOctober said:
It is indeed possible to punish bad play on side A without also rewarding bad play on side B.But you keep insisting on situations in which one side gets rewarded, that's not the point of my discussion. I'm starting to wonder if you even understand the subject.
There is simple reason behind it. It's because we discuss perk, which should give advantage. I see no point in taking perk that does not give advantage.
About noed:
You instead insist that it rewards bad play. Maybe, although in my eyes it punishes bad play of the other side. And has nothing to do with rewarding bad play of killer, since it's not working if killer played bad. It works ONLY if survivors played bad. Killer has little take on whether survs take down totems or not before poping last gen.I follow the discussion but you seem to forget that it's perk we discuss.
as for punishing bad play without rewarding bad play: please give example of what you have in mind. It might remove misunderstanding if I have any.
ps: no, I don't insist on situation where one get's rewarded. I don't even write it. I say that if you take advantage from one side, it gives advantage to the other. Simple logic. Nothing about rewarding or rewarding bad play of killer at that
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@only1biggs
How BL rewards bad play? -
@DocOctober said:
That's not the question.The question is how to punish bad play without also rewarding bad play.
Well, ok, that's what I asked. Omitting the rhetoric.
I can't see how you can affect one side without affecting the other. In versus game like this it's a question of balance. Since it always affects both sides.
You can't affect one side without the other.Ruin (and any other perks) would be same, it affects survivors hence it's a bonus for killer.
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@KroolTheField said:
depiping on purpose to play at low rankThat's what going to happen.
Carrot works much better
As for the topic: this is idea for game-modifications, which should not be in ranked.
Game-mod can be either weekly (brawl) or done by users, which is what shown to be good. -
Just give bonus experience depending on the rank you've played
rank 20 - 0% bonus
rank 10 - 10% bonus
rank 1 - 20% bonusor smth. It's just of the top of my head, but faster progression - more shards, rewarded. right?
upd: sorry, did not see last "at rank reset" this was for rank for current match. oops
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@DocOctober
How would you punish bad survivor play without rewarding killer?PS: I can't say it's killer bad play, because if 2 survived and powered gates, it's not bad play on killer part, it's pretty much impossible to block survivors from doing it, if they commit to it.
It does reward killer in non-direct way, so let's just skip that debatable topic -
@KroolTheField
Not really, they try it (afaik) and see how it works. Sometimes MOST of the time they deem idea NOT good and they don't say it to each idea-giver
And I understand them completelyalso, previously they were not in full control of the game, so...
I want to believe
ps: yeah, I don't hope it's going to be in the game any time soon. I'm just practicing my game-design skills by taking idea and thinking about it's good sides and down sides. This one is the one where I did not find flaws. Which means that when they try and see how it goes is when it actually will become obvious.
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He becomes friendly killer
get's tortured by SWF
becomes normal againseriously, entity would continue torture (as it does NOT stop it if they become killer, only if you are merciless) and make him do it's bidding. They will not be given role of survivor for disobeying entity, because they always try to disobey it one way or another. Not many of them like to be controlled
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@KroolTheField
I'm against hatch, unless everyone died. The idea of the hatch gets blurred if everyone just left instead of dying before last one goes for hatch.
Key is exceptionAbout extra shards item - if it's seperately born thing in the world, RNG spawn is given, but survs must know what to look for. RNG spawn + sound (like hatch and totem). 10 seconds to search/cleanse/loot. Killer MUST know where it is.
alternative is 2 out of 3 places that need to be activated, then it can be just gathered like toolbox once it's "released from seal" or smth.
about bHVR not wanting to implement this - not sure what gave you that idea.
It's implementation can be pretty simple unlike what I described (special chest + searching to get item) randomly spawned after opened gates.
From design point - adds more to objectives.
Does NOT kill emblem system, rather gives chance to fill objective category AND chance for killer to get some points.I see no problem to implement it from code OR design perspective.
Giving shards based on item in hand and removing item from hand is NOT complicated code, afaikI see every reason TO implement it, "not wanting" is not counter-argument
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@DocOctober said:
I have not said anything about either Perk being broken, so do not try to lay words into my mouth that I didn't say. I'm not going to engage in a discussion with you if that's how it'll play out.rewarding bad play.
my bad, "reward bad play" is broken in my vocabulary. But let's go with that
This is actually the other way around in case of NOED. It does not reward bad play, but rather punishes bad play from survivors.
If they decide not take safety measures and instead rush head-first into dangerous zone, they get punished by NOED. They can counter play it, so if they don't - they get punished by it.
It can be argued in case of 4 survivors still alive that it can turnaround game. Perk is still active if 2 already dead and last two do gens before totems are finished.
This then becomes a win-more? nope, it's still punishment for survivors.
It IS indirect, via killer hand.DS has no such argument. Hence why I say it's broken. Note, that it is me who says it.
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@rezmax said:
Of course he is right! Killer perk countering survivor perk, ok then which survivor perk blocks for example aura reading of bbq or nurse calling huh?Sole survivor
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I'm going to agree but only partially
Perks that decide that can do turnaround on game are OK if they have counter play:
NOED can activate only after gates are powered.
Remove the totems OR totem after powering gates = perk is out of gameI use NOED on Wraith, since I simply don't have better perks yet and I can say it only faces play 1 out 5 games. Even then it rarely bring me a kill.
DS has no counter play and is used 4 times in a game. It is broken.
Pretty sure you have counterarguments so let's hear it. I'm up for discussion if you show me how exactly it's broken when it does have a counterplay
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in one of benedict records:
"it's more than pure strength. The entity gives power to him" -
@TG_Cid_Orlandu
nope, those would be one-time use items.
It looks pretty balanced, unless you can think of scenario where it's not.
can you? -
the hatch open for last survivor on 3 escaping via gates is basically programming bug
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so they added 30x3 = 90 seconds to hooks
making it 360 seconds for 3 people and 480 seconds to almost kill them, but leave them with 1 hook to kill each
and gens can be done 80 x3, 80x2, 20= 180 secondsyou can't be serious it's not a ######### up on designers part
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If you need a reason, that is not to break "immersion"
Designers did a pretty good job with their references and keeping it in very atmospheric way.
This would just break immersion of the game from you. You know that -
well, than how bout "antidote" which cures blindness, hemorrage, slowdown debuff(forgot name) and prevents status effects from taking action for 20-30 seconds -_-
seems legit, if its medpack addon -
@Buily09
Your math is wrong, it's 75% recovery increase. 2.1 normal stun -> 1.2 stun -> 43% stun reduction.
basically designer should have 1.2/2.1 but instead had 2.1/1.2 -> 1.75 -> 75% recovery increase....with 43% reduction it's more like 6.21 -> 3.54. DS has 4 seconds, which gives enough time to get away, and if there is pallet in between, you can see how broken this perk would be.
But the most broken part is not that. It's the fact that it can be used together with dead hard. They're both manually triggerable, plus there is passive on this perk. It makes it OP for the small disadvantage it has.
Yes, during chase the exhastion is higher, but with this much time to get away, you can go into crouch hide until killer close enough, effectively recovering exhasted state.
Also, remember there is perk that takes 20% away from exhastion. Although not meta, you have to account for it.new values make it a little bit less, but still you have to account for all situations described above
It's not that the values are not OK, they're actually more or less ok, it's that there is small downside to using perk that is so effective when used right.On the other note: not everyone has enduring, but, well, same can be said about this perk
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@Jack11803
You don't see?
If you stun killer, you have 4+ seconds of stun with this perk. In that time you can runaway so far, and hide. After that he breaks pallet and there is no way for killer to find you. It's guaranteed escape. SB can't do that.the speed I'm refering to is distance gained, compared to killer. SB gives you 4.2 meters distance, when killer is chasing you. This perk... it automatically wins the chase.
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pop goes the weasel
I love the design, it's perfect and makes you immediately leave hook for nearest gen
I love how they implemented the most brilliant anti-camping design and no one noticed -
@Jack11803 said:
@SariefBy addressed I mean nerfed.
I know. Not going to happen. They're actually balanced. It's game time that is not balanced (4 minutes to do ALL gens AND open gates. really?) Chases are supposed to be long and hard. If There was need to buy more time, more techniques like breaking LoS, hiding after pallet stun, etc. would be used.
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@Jack11803
That one is much more annoying, since it's a win-more perk. If you already won the chase (by palleting killer), you stun him for 4 more seconds, which is even bigger than sprint burst, while you run away (with double sprint burst speed), plus you lose killer.
Sprint burst has downside of activating on run. This one activates only when used. It does not hinder you in other ways. Heck, it can be used together with Dead Hard.
Sprint burst gains you 4.2 meters advantage in straight chase, or 6-10 seconds. This one gives you much more. -
@Jack11803 said:
@Sarief said:
idea is goodI don't know why survivors need buffs though. They're easy mod anyway
As long as pallet looping is addressed, I’m fine with new items for survivor. They don’t NEED to help a chase. Like the blanket suggestion in another thread, it could help hiding or deception.
Drugs is good idea for medkit "addons"
as for loops... not going to happen, "chase" is core component of the game (along with other 3 which nobody cares about). They can change it to something else, but it will stay for sure. Pallets are not a problem, the problem is that the time given to survivors is so much that 1-2 survivors can win you game without you doing anything but gens. Before that changes bufs are not needed
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@Jack11803 How in the world the pallet perk is niche?
want me to count for you? 2.1 seconds + 3 seconds * 1.2 (20% endurance reduction) = 6.12 seconds of stun. woops. Add breaking pallet, chasing surv to next loop + loop. His exhastion is recovered for sure.That's Sprint Burst on steroids and killer rage ingniter in one bottle. Enduring would be MUST on all killers (even on freaking nurse)
FoP is... OP. Killer can't mind game you anymore and this means that after 4 seconds (17 meters) you run off with sprint burst into other direction. Over powered for no disadvantage. Like I said, breaks TR at core.
third one is tricky, since you actually need item or perk to use it. Otherwise it's dead weight.
That's why I said It's closer to balanced than others. It's "upgrade" perk, not standalone and I was missing those since starting game. The values do need correcting or appropriate "minus" has to be applied.
You must remember that you still can do 99% hook destroy, which means you can use it to mind game killer into thinking you've set the trap, while you didn't.
Killers already have anti-perk for this (hangman). So that's why I'm more inclined to say this one is more interesting than others. -
idea is good
I don't know why survivors need buffs though. They're easy mod anyway
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1) does not go with his lore
2) why this values for penalties? what's the point in buffing healing speed?
3) nerf?
4) Not according to his lore. Plus you are fully healhy and killer has NOED. You can't interact with gates. You die?
5) skillchecks are not for that.
6) badfreddy is bad for his vision debuff and 7 seconds sleeping. Otherwise his power is good. Maybe a little less skillchecks, but that can be overcome with addons so ok. it's 7 seconds that killing him
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@Jack11803 said:
@SariefI’m ALREADY ON THEIR ASS when the aura ends.
2 conditions: direct route and 40-46 meters, otherwise you need speed addons or you'll lose the guy or he can stealth. Or you just bump into smth and rip
And nurse has such a big fatigue you can do squats under her nose, run away and hide and she won't find you for a minute...but let's discuss perks that are here
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@Jack11803 said:
BBQ breaks "unknown location" to "possibly known location.
Although it's cheat-like ability on some characters (and average on other killers, be honest) it still does have counter play, as cheezy as it sounds:
1) be within 40 meters
2) change direction
3) go stealth
4) not sure how lone survivor works on this, but hey, in theory it should workPlus it's other downside that you MUST leave hook to "search" (with possibilty to not find) next chase victim.
It's high on the curve but not utterly unbalanced. It's counter perk is the one that let's all survs see each other and see killer near hook (forgot name).
Not a case with first perk
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The balance curve is bad for those. Ofc, compared to current perks
1) it causes exhastion, but does it trigger with exhastion? looks like it does. Also, 40+2+4 is enough to reach next loop and increases time to win in chases.
Basically win-more perk.2) true sight also has 4 seconds, but only when pallet is broken. See how of the curve it is?
Won't work on freddy, since he's invisible. Breaks Wraith, since he's TR is exposed when lockers/gen/pallet.
But, most importantly, breaks TR as his purpose is to cause fear by you NOT knowing direction of killer.
The strength to break core mechanic comes without disadvantage. It's way too of the curve3) This one is closer to balance and play, still not very good for simple reason: there is no counter-play, it's essentially cheat, no downsides. Way of the curve..
hope you're up for constructive criticizm
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Just give ppl tools to mod the game and BAM, you can do all that and more