ReikoMori
ReikoMori
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You're gonna get a lot of complaints as if you read the patch notes for ptb in full. Its gone a bit messy on both sides of the fence.
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The fear is justified as this came outta nowhere. Pig isn't considered to be particularly threatening and RTBs weren't causing an issue like deep wounds was. So to see it get treated the same in function is a bit crazy to me.
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@Saint_Ukraine said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/436690#Comment_436690
@Acromio Freddy feels easier to play than Trapper, at least.
He feels easier to play because his power does have a few nice things about it. One he naturally can slow down the game which makes having chances for him to do something. He gets aura reading on who ever he puts to sleep by default so he can keep track of people, but the trade offs are too high. One of his best builds involves the gimmick of using overcharge to make survivors destroy their own gen to wake up, but eventually even that gets worked through.
He's got all the weaknesses of a standard M1 killer, but lacks a lot of the benefits an average killer. He doesn't really function without using his power as its the only thing that lets him play the game. The devs decided that needed a change as it didn't reflect his character and wasn't healthy for him as gameplay.
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@EternalPhoenix said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/436858#Comment_436858
I took that into consideration too but:
- If you try to leave the area they will see you (walking is too slow, you don't have enough time to get away)
- If you hide nearby they will patrol and find you
- If you sprint away hoping to get to a safe spot before they reach your location they will see your scratchmarks
The game is built around taking risks. The killer doesn't have another object they do other than hunt and kill you. You have to take risks to survive and the game has more tools for you than think to do that. You've got 30 hours in the game that means you don't know any of the game. It will take a while to learn what you need to do properly.
- Run. Don't worry about the scractmarks you stop making them the moment you stop running and can even use them to give bad info to the killer tracking them.
- It is better to stealth away from a gen early than to try and get as much progress possible and risk getting caught.
- Start multiple gens. The more gens that are running means more distractions.
- Practice movement within the chase. Learning to path to pallets, getting fast vaults, juking, and loops.
- Early on there is nothing wrong with just sticking to working solely on gens and staying hidden. This is a game where you have to invest hundreds of hours to get a good handle on some things.
- Sometimes there is nothing you can do when in a bad spot. It's a team game and sometimes your teammates are needed for you to survive.
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Hello everyone!
Since you are new it will help you to know that it often best to run away from the gen entirely when you know a killer is coming. Killers tend to search around the gen's area once they see it has been worked on so you need to put distance between you a the gen or move to another altogether.
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@artist said:
but yeah, there are times where I don't hear billy's chainsaw or huntress windup, which is seriously annoying
Alot of that with Huntress is she doesn't do a full wind up. You only get the blade sound when she winds fully, but she can throw hatchets with out a full wind up. Getting good at doing that is how people do trick shots is you need to lob them like mortars.
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I'm against any passive aura reading that targets the killer. SWFs harm the game by being able to coordinate through voice communication. That's the power. You get to choose your teammates, coordinate your builds, and keep a constant flow of information at all points during the game. This has nothing to do with the killer. So why would passive aura reading against the killer be what you ask for? You'd need passive bond to see your teammates.
That's the problem with trying "Buff" solo survivors. You're playing the game correctly, the game is built for you as it is. The problem is that the game was not primarily designed with the level of coordination that SWF brings. You can't buff up to that as its not a game mechanics or stats issue. It's a mode of play issue.
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@PeepingPeacock said:
Make it protect against an instadown, makes sense with the ability name. More fair to the majority of killers and still makes it a good perk.
EDIT: You could have it block an instadown and if it hasnt blocked an instadown when a killer tries to mori you, it acts like a DS where it heals you, stuns them and gives you a chance to get away, then the perk gets used up. Thats not a OP perk and a bunch of people would want something like that.
Stop that. Mori require the burning of a one time use offering. They are not perks and shouldn't be involved in perk discussions.
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@ShyN3ko said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/436520#Comment_436520
0 gens = hatch spawn
Close hatch = gates powered
Yes, its a free escape
How is that free. If the hatch is close then it forces the survivor to open one of two gates. They get locked into a situation where they can't mess about. Its either get the gate open or die. They'd have to work extremely hard to as the killer knows exactly where they should be. If they aren't on a gate then they are near the gate. The free escape comes when Killers OPEN the gate for you.
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@LastShoe said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/435059#Comment_435059
Hex: Ruins... Just to slow a game just a little bit.
Also... whats the point of tunneling? Just use memento mori.
Hex Ruin is...Unreliable. If you put time into protecting it then it may be worthwhile. Yet killers can't really control where the hex will be so if could easily do its LOS check on spawn and decide next to a gen or out in the open, but not directly in front of the survivor is fine enough. You don't want to use moris because the game doesn't weight them the same as a hook and sacrifice. You could mori the whole team and still run the risk of depipping if you didn't get enough hits or they did most of the gens within the first 9mins of the game.
So survivors are worth more to killers alive than dead and the game can only be slowed down "Just a Little Bit". If the survivors are top notch players then you're simply not slowing the game down.
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@Raptorrotas said:
Lore:
The survivors are in a dream/nightmare like state which makes it impossible for them to act outside the game rules.
They are either compelled to not do it (dont have the impulse to try it) or simply cannot do it.
Though, the lore also states that previous survivors not only acted outside the game's rule, but found ways to bend and break them. A survivor crafted both the black lock(hatch), The golden toolboxes which then stolen and copied into inferior toolboxes we use now, and the ability to interact with the bloodweb is due to Benedict surviving long enough to understand how to bend the entity's power in his favor.
What is more interesting is that the entity doesn't take a punitive action against them for doing such things it seems. Probably because it gives the survivors more hope which it feeds on.
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You're gonna experience that a ton. You can either turn the chat off or just pay them no attention. Though, if you're playing killer you'll be trashed on no matter what you do or don't do. Don't play people's "honor" rules? Trashed. 4k them quickly? Trashed. Give them free wins? Trashed. Use off meta perks? Trashed. Play the meta? Trashed.
Point is. You can't truly feel good about anything you do in this game as killer until you stop listening to other people and stop trying to play the game in a specific way to please other. Focus on the win or just having fun.
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Even if the killer could be killed by the survivor the entity imbues everyone it takes on both sides with everlasting life. The killers would just return and survivors would still be just as trapped as they can't die permanently and can't escape the entity's realm. Also there is no way to know if survivors could take up arms against a killer. Hatchets could simply cease to be the moment a survivor tries to touch it. The tools are copies of tools that were created by another survivor. They probably can't be used to harm anyone either.
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Yesterday I was playing killer and got Grim Pantry. I'm not really in the mood to get looped by survivors so I just sort of let them do what they want. They do 4 gens by the I get one kill. Person dcs because their friend is dead leaving 2 guys. They've 3 gen'd themselves perfectly near the killer shack. They can't do the gens because I've gone into constant patrol. One wants me to chase them to a loop I know sucks for the Plague so I don't do it. He keeps trying to bait me and I don't go for it. His friend can't do a gen because every time he touches one I'm on him. After a while one of them dcs and the other insta hatches out of the game.
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@fluffybunny said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/433660#Comment_433660
I think they did that because people were complaining about the noise and how often it'd go off, right? @NuclearBurrito
That's correct, but now its sort of weird cause the cooldown is probably longer than it should be. It gives information in a way that if you don't act on it within the second then its not really reliable anymore. Maybe if the cooldown were like 10 or 8 seconds then it would be more useful info. Then again I still think its a lackluster perk to begin with. Birbs work well except to point out afk people.
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@lewfairbrother said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/428345#Comment_428345
I appreciate your comment but this shows that there's enough people who have an issue with it. Just because the devs haven't found a solution they've stopped trying?
Instead of everyone debating whether or not it's a good idea, why not brainstorm some ideas that could fix this issue and make it fun for everyone?
Even the people disagreeing with me have said they think hook camping is 'scummy'.
If they really wanted to stop camping they could have redesigned the gameplay so that it isn't possible or worthwhile to camp. Every action they have taken has been punitive towards the people who play killer. The puts it in the heads of all players on both sides that it is the player whose to blame for camping, but I like to hand out blame in equal measure. I have believed for a long time that the way we go about the game is flawed at its base.
Hooking survivors is the only way killers have to deal with survivors. Then there is mori kills, but they are just as contentious and carry stipulations which makes most of them inefficient. Survivors can't fight the killer so they use the game's awkward flaws to handle that for them. Killers respond with camping which is an abuse of flawed design. This could have been ended if survivors were given more agency and hooks were done away with in favor of just trying to suppress the survivors from doing an objective. If the game was designed to press both sides to have to constantly interact and more objective oriented on both sides camping would simply disappear. It couldn't work, you'd never get anything out of it and there would be no reason to attempt to do it.
The devs as far as we know are not willing to do a large change to core gameplay like that. So instead we get punitive measures taken against killers in-game. While they verbally tell us in streams and posts that camping is an acceptable strategy. That's a huge mind screw. "Its ok if you do it, but when you do it you're getting punished."
They take the same approach with bannable exploits as well. You push a hotfix to disable items that are causing massive issues, but instead you'll just say we'll ban you if you do the exploit rather than taking the exploit of the table.
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@GrootDude said:
@ReikoMori how would it be useless? Encouraging you to hunt other prey doesn’t make it useless.
You already hunt other prey. You just kill them one by one with the highest amount of efficiency. What you are wanting is a time waste before you even get to mori one person. If I am going to invest that much time I'm just going to do hooks. Especially since if I'm doing the mori anyway I was prepared to not pip. If I gotta hook everyone before I can more one person I'm just gonna go ahead and play for pip instead.
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@NuclearBurrito said:
@ReikoMori nonono. As in you have to hook all 4 survivors before your first Mori
Then its not getting used. That flies in the face of it being efficient. That would destroy all the value of Ebony mori. Cypress would be better at that point and its the worst one.
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@Tru3Lemon said:
The ultra rare mori should be at least all survivor that are hooked 1 time you can mori them
Technically it already is. You have to hook every person you mori once. There are things in the game that just result in a death. Moris aren't even guaranteed if you're playing the game competently. They are bonuses, rewards for the killer.
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No point in prestige ranking any character. Cosmetics aren't worth destroying perks addons and offerings.
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Was this intentional?
You need to understand that DS doesn't look for a "tunneling" scenario to proc from. It is just looking for you to get off the hook. Does not matter if you get pulled by a teammate or kobe.
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Mainly its so us killers can concede and move on to the next game in a timely fashion. It only took years to get to a place where people couldn't waste and extra 40 minutes of you time with nonsense immersion.
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@UltimateHit47 said:
I'm not playing as killer because gen rushing is too big of an issue. When a game is supposed to last around 15 minutes but is over in 5-10, you know you have an issue. I'm honestly just sick to death with the gen rushing and there's nothing I can do about it. I have recently started playing The Plague and I'm trying to get her Adept but it's impossible to get kills without anti-gen rush perks. And level 1 Corrupt Intervention just isn't doing it for me. Can anyone help me?
I'm also sick of the attitudes of half of the survivors that play this game. Do NOT teabag and taunt a killer who has been respectful all game, it's very rude and EXTREMELY annoying. I'm sure it doesn't bother people but when I don't camp or tunnel all game only to have the only injured person bodyblocked to the exit gates then have all 4 survivors disrespect me, it just bloody annoys me.
I don't see why the devs REFUSE to slow down the gens. Sure, they're doing this whole "Endgame Collapse", but that's not going to fix the actual problems like unbalance and gen rushing.
At the end of the day, Killers aren't powerful anymore. It's that simple.
At least with the collapse we can just force the gate open so they don't waste 20mins of our lives doing dumb stuff and farming their emblems. If you didn't get your evader points then sucks to be you. I'm going to my basement and I having a cold one.
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@Bongbingbing said:
Report them, It's a bug and their knowingly exploiting it.
Bans are being giving to people exploiting the legion add ons bug so i don't see why this wouldn't be considered for one too.
The Legion situation is easily doable and controllable at the player's behest. The window bug is random and uncontrollable. If works one moment then stops the next and it happens on every map at some point and on every window at some point. Somethings are just not bannable because of how widespread and uncontrollable they are. It's annoying, but survivors can't make a window broken purposely.
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Every killer is strong when they are being dominate in the trial and every killer is weak when survivors actually know how to play the game really well. The only exception is the Nurse. She strong even if the survivors are good, but she's also mechanically a pain to learn and master.
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@BigBubs said:
Should NOED require hooking all 4 at least once?
NoED already requires the killer to let survivors get to endgame and rely on dull totems still being up and if it does activate that it isn't instantly destroyed. Y'all gotta let this noed stuff go.
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@NoShinyPony said:
@ReikoMori Leader doesn't affect gen repair speed anymore.
True, but I want my team to do EVERYTHING faster. I get bored easily when survivor.
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I tried putting down killer for a while and switched to survivor. I got really bored very fast playing survivor. I have less to do and less overall challenge. Once I got used to the survivor side of chases that sort of lost its thrill for me as well. Went back to killer and was better able to understand what was happening with the games. Though, I generally just have less fun overall with the game. Playing killer is pure time management and that I can live with. I don't enjoy constantly getting talked down to or clicked at or teabagged. That is what makes killer most unenjoyable is that you can't enjoy playing the game without someone trying to get under your skin.
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You're gonna need to stop chasing someone for 2 mins. If you can't get the hit in 20-30secs just let them go and do more gen patrols. The game is sort of in a weird place right now. Base gen repair speed for a solo survivor per gen is fine, but when you add more survivors on gens and toolboxes/perks the case could be made that the game is going too fast. Killer has turned into pure time management in seconds.
Some players will say genrush isn't a thing, but as much as they don't want to admit that it is a thing it is hard to refute some of the more ridiculous clear times that exist. Ruin's not really going to last long unless you make it a point to protect it and even then you'd give up map pressure doing it. Just play the match and do what you can to get people of the floor. Though slugging won't be particularly potent it does work better to slow people down. Consider switching to more meta killers with better mobility as well.
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Prove Thyself, Bond, Leader, and Spine chill for perks. Then Commodious toolbox with wrench socket and wire spool for item and addons.
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We clearly need an anti-camping mechanic, but I feel like what a lot of people suggest is too drastic.
Your proposal has some issues that it doesn't take into account.
The first to get out of the way is that camping is seen a legitimate approach to playing the game, but it yields very low returns. Second, simply applying a hindered debuff to killers aren't going to make the leave the person hook. If you know you're just gonna get slowed down any and you already don't feel you could deal with the chase you're not gonna leave. Third, what if you see a survivor further than 20m away, but there is a survivor that is behind you that is only 16m away? The way you've written your proposal means coordinated SWFs or savvy solo survivors could potential game a killer into a camping scenario which gets them stacks.
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@Nicholas said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/428649#Comment_428649
Is it based on Lifetime matches? So if I played a grand total of 500 matches and never once disconnected, how many times could I disconnect before action was taken? I'm just trying to understand the system.
They don't give a hard threshold number, but it has been stated on the forum in another thread that it is looking at the total number of matches you've ever played. So if you've played 500 matches then you could get away with possibly as many as 90 or 100 dcs before the game or devs decide something is off. Maybe even more.
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DC penality is weighed against total amount of games played. So if someone dc's say 5% of their games purposely, but they play 15 or 20 games a session then they will never really get dinged by the system. The game is also problematic in terms of stability. You can be force dc'd while loading in or even mid game due to the game just losing its mind for a moment. So getting hit for it is going to be rare. Also the devs don't really put out metrics on negative behavior and punishments to said bad actors so it makes the issue seem that much more under handled.
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@lewfairbrother said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/425155#Comment_425155
Your comment is pretty much 'It's not the end of the world'. Well duh! I can completely appreciate that and agree, but that isn't the point. This is a forum dedicated to improving gameplay and this is definitely something that needs addressing and really isn't that hard to combat.
The thing you trying to combat is an issue that the devs have already addressed multiple times, but still ultimately decided that it is an acceptable strategy even if the person getting camped is not having fun dealing with it. What do you want me to say other than just move on? I've played the game on and off for nearly 3 years while watching them add then remove things to deal with camping. Usually when they go with a harder solution survivors find weird and interesting ways to abuse it to their advantage. Point loss is one of the few things that have the least amount of abuse issues.
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@tresbandeiras said:
I had The best game of my life . I made 8000/8000/8000/7000 and still I did not get Adept Plague . It doesn't make Sense to me. Max points but no Adept because I did not get two pips. Sorry but I really don't get the point. Someone please explain me!
Bloodpoints don't mean anything towards you Emblem points. The game is only concerned if you get your emblem score high enough which is between 12-16 points to double pip. So you need to maximize playing towards the emblem score rather than the bloodpoints.
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If the killer closes the hatch, THAT activates and things go ridiculous for survivors.
If you're last one left and you don't find the hatch first you should have no chance. At some point you just lose.
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@TheAcidProcess said:
I feel like this is the same cause as many DBD issues, at least I experience personally. I can't get genuinely mad about a lot of things that go wrong in DBD because it just comes with playing online and being a delay, but I agree it can be incredibly frustrating. As of late I've been downed a lot attempting to toss a pallet that didn't register or something of the sort.
My biggest pet peeve in-game is attempting to leave a generator at the same time the game registers a skill check so the generator backfires (I frequently move between generators to keep the killer focusing elsewhere). I guess it could be a feature that the odds of backfire increase when walking away from a generator, but I always assumed it was ping and my device didn't register the skill check earlier so if the cause is my own fault I apologize for weighing in my complaint haha.
@TheAcidProcess The issue with generators is that when you choose to stop repairing is their is a specific timing to which you have to let go if you want to avoid skill checks. It is better to not let go on a skill check if you have no real reason to as if you miss the timing by a fraction it will blow the gen. Also the way that the skill check prompt moves is affected by Vsync. If you have not turned that off its going to slide to a stop after you've hit space or let go. Turn off vsync to have it move closer to real time and that makes things better in general.
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@Tru3Lemon said:
They probably dont give information cuz some killers tunnel and they could also be toxic by knowing information about it
You can tunnel without it and tunnelling is a strategy of play that they've said is perfectly legitimate even though they find new and amazing ways to try and pressure people not to do it.
The weird distribution of information in the game is something that should be looked at. Hex mechanics in general need an overhaul as fixing the spawns with a line of sight check didn't really solve any issues. Right now survivors have more information in the long term than the killer without having to give up anything in return such as perk slots or items. I would prefer it not be that way. I'd prefer if killers had slightly more information that the survivors in certain areas. Like why do killers not know which hex totem is which? They are the ones making the things they should know.
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@Kurisataru said:
If killer tiers continue to exist I believe that survivor perks should be in tiers as well and killer perks should have little to no hierarchy.
survivor perks are tiered. There is a constant list of meta perks for both survivors and killers.
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Wait about three weeks and the Legion issue will sort itself out. Morbid jokes aside Legion preys on people who waste time with more complex strategies of looping. We don't respect loops, but if you run in a straight line and keep putting things in the way. mainly vaults you can get away. One thing to remember is that Legion can't vault forever we will eventually be forced to stopped. Pallet stuns are high risk, but they work really well against us. You can try juking around objects like tires and trees as well. Avoid working in groups and if you are hit with frenzy try to run as far away from you friends as possible as it keeps us from increasing the time we can spend in frenzy.
Mend as soon as you can as the less time your wounded the more difficult you are to killer. If we're really sticking to you then draw the chase out as possible. If the chase breaks start mending at that moment rather than waste wound time trying to find a spot to hide.
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Looping is a time a one sided time waster which is my only gripe outside of double pallets, infinites, and broken window issues. You can say that survivors who engage in a minutes long looping chase lose a great deal of scoring opportunities, but in the grand scheme of things that won't result in them being at risk of losing the game. I am a person who thinks certain actions should have equally negative effects on both sides of the game in a lot of regards. Some people say scratchmarks are the issue, but honestly scratch marks can me a killer up more than looping as they appear in a very scattershot manner. Sometimes they bleed through walls and I've played again players who've become very adept at just making a huge mess with scratches and then stealthing away which causes information they do give to be less than useful.
THe best thing you can do as killer is just let most people go if they are at something that looks like a huge time waster as right now survivors need their chaser emblem so they will come to you eventually. Though sometimes as killer you get stuck in your own head and feel that if you let this potential down go then you're not gonna build momentum. The sunk cost fallacy that comes out is really damaging. Also a bulk of the killers can't really do anything about loops naturally so it can be an uphill battle.
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My first killer was Myers and my first survivor was Laurie. I played them when they came out.
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Quite often I find new myself being chased the entire match (tunneled!) and not by choice.
On the other end of the spectrum I can kill 3 survivors and still only get a silver devout emblem. The whole system is just weird.
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@Peanits said:
It will be on the PTB first. If it is necessary, they could always be changed. It's worth noting a few things, though:
- Although the speed is lower, Feral Frenzy is longer. Overall, you'll be able to much much further than you could before which will make it easier to hit multiple survivors.
- Using Feral Frenzy against an already injured Survivor wouldn't be a good idea in the first place, since all it would accomplish is applying Deep Wounds to them.
- If you miss an attack, your power will not be depleted, it will only cancel. For example, if you have 75% of your charge left, you will start recharging from that point. It does not go back down to zero just because you missed.
Thanks for the clarity, we could have used that several hours ago and this mess wouldn't be as bad. Doesn't make this feel any better mentally, but massive change never does.
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The current slate of changes are particularly contentious and in some places seem like punitive punishments for the long term use of what was a tactic that could be used on any killer with the exception of the Deep Wounds interaction which could have been corrected with an adjustment to how Deep Wounds and chases worked with each other. Would it have not been better to give Legion a new power that was more worthwhile for both sides to deal with than such a huge drawback of strength and utility?
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@No_Cluie_Louis said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/424267#Comment_424267
Why don't they just not play Legion then. He's already incredibly boring to play, due to the incredible lack of mindgames involved. You just tunnel someone until their bar is down to nothing
That's not the only way to play Legion, but most people who call the killer boring don't think of any other ways to use the power.
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Not to mention even if it did work, which it won't, players would just do what they do now. Dc when they see Legion, but considering the rework that they've just dropped notes for Legion is just supposed to be another "For Fun" killer.
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@Croquedead said:
I wouldn’t say it’s 100% useless, but it turns Legion into an M1 killer and we all know what happens to those...
We start running NoED and devour soap and hoping for the best.
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I just read the changes. That's ridiculous. Deep Wounds is useless now and Feral Frenzy is a worse Yamaoka's Haunting. Thanks for making Legion an average M1 killer though? Cause that is what he is now.
When you fix a problem it is best to fix it without going to an extreme over correct. The track and chase oriented killer can no longer chase or track for crap. Deep wounds pauses in terror radius even if you're not in a chase and you've increased the terror radius so now if you frenzy, on paper, you've wasted your time. Less speed, gimped tracking, and if you miss a single attack in frenzy you burn out instantly. I'm gonna hold my full judgment till a ptb comes, but this just looks terrible on paper. Feels like I'm getting screwed over for things that I didn't even do.
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@BBQnDemogorgon said:
@ReikoMori Didn't kill the game in 2016 so that's a bit of an exaggeration.
In 2016 the game had only ever existed in that fashion and the game did almost die back then. Do it again now when people are much more aware of the fact was a dumb idea. People will vanish off to other 4v1 games since more exist now. Look at what exists in the game now with perks, items, and addons. Perma breaking hooks would be a garbage fire for both sides. Survivors would be absolutely a pain to each other and the killer. Time wasted on hook sabo across the map and players getting turned into snails would grind the game to a halt. For killers I'd expect to see a mass exodus or dc plague worse than what we have now. I'm not going back to dealing with no hooks.